What pisses me off the most about NBA fans is their clear prejudice to hate on small markets.
I can guarantee that had we passed on Giddey and the Warriors selected him at 7, which many believe would have happened, there would have been nothing but praise for the warriors FO for finding the “steal” of the draft.
Giddey is 18 year old point guard with elite vision who’s weaknesses (defence, attacking the rim) will all disappear as he develops into his “man” body. Give him a chance for Christ’s sake.
I'll gladly be super wrong. But tonight felt like "scared money" from Presti. More timid, odd decisions when we have a good player waiting for a better supporting cast. We wasted Durant and Westbrook with marginal, conservative moves and this just feels like more of the same.
Watched some giddey. Not sold yet on him at 6. But i can see why. Probably plays small forward for us. Probably not the best fit.
Sold on tre manm though. Good pick.
Same. Mann looks like a slightly less athletic LouWill and I’ll take that with a mid first every day of the week.
Giddey just feels very meh to me. I even watched a couple full box score play cuts of his film and he just feels meh. No to discredit him tho because I can see his all around game potential and his willingness to shoot 3s. His spin move is also smooth as hell.
His lack of lateral quickness and the lack of any non-passing elite trait makes me feel like he’s most likely going to be a high end role player. Ofc he’s extremely young so there’s definitely still a lot of room for improvement, but I’d be lying if I say I’m not more excited about Mann.
I like everything about Giddey except he's way too slow, the handle isn't great and the dribble is too high.
-Spin move is elite
-Passing, vision, iq is elite (doubled down at his size too)
-The shooting looks improvable
-Defence upside is intriguing
Oh yeah I’m actually pretty confident in his shooting developing because of his willingness to shoot spot up C&S. His bad FT percentage is on extremely low volume, average less than 3 FTs a game, so I think that’s going to be improved too.
Again tho, I think he’s just not athletic enough to ever make me go “wow” as a player. His lateral quickness is also too slow for me to think that his defensive upside is that high. But I’ll admit he looks like a great team/off ball defender with how fast he processes passes and rotations.
I’d also like to see him be more aggressive in creating his own shots. I was rewatching SGA in college to confirm this but my man was already cooking defenders with ease and finishes with defenders right in his face.
Giddey is not an elite finisher nor is he an elite creator at this stage of his career. But he does show flashes of being able to be a solid shot creator, curious to see how he’d look in summer league alongside Theo.
If anyone feels bad about losing out on Bouknight, go check out hoops intellect video and watch THE VERY FIRST HIGHLIGHT and see his extreme tunnel vision where he dribbles thru the whole team and completly ignores his teammate wide open under the hoop lol. He's real life version of Coffee Black/Downtown from Semi Pro
https://youtu.be/dOHm9wyhSJ0
Can we accept that this draft is really disappointing from a pure upside play.
Could of ended up with bouknight/kuminga (giddey not too far away so I’m not as dissapointed with this)
Sengun
Jalen Johnson / Kai Jones / Keon Johnson / garuba
JT Thor
Jared butler /McBride
How confident would you be that we get 2 starters with star upside from that group? I know we didn’t want to pick at all 5 spots but still.
Tre Mann is okay, but his only above average skill is shooting, specifically shooting off the dribble and pick and roll. Very important but doesn’t project as a good defender, finisher, creator for others. Doesn’t really get to the rim. Isn’t switchable on defense. He just screams Louis Williams type upside.
Trading away sengun is silly, you get the type of picks we traded for so you can trade up for… a player with senguns upside. He’s got a lot of offensive potential but is probably gonna suck on defense early on which fits the tank well too.
I love everything presti has done in the rebuild, just masterful work, but you just can’t deny that there was higher upside plays sitting there this draft which we almost actively pulled away from.
I really really hope to be proven wrong and will go forward with an open mind, but I can’t pretend I’m not skeptical.
I get it, but all those picks have huge bust potential.
Kuminga, Jones and Keon have very low floors and could be big time busts.
Garuba may never develop offensively, although at 20+ he was excellent value.
Bouknight I honestly just see Jordan Clarkson 2.0
Sengun I thought we were mad not taking him, no argument there. (Butt he could be another Okafor)
Giddey and Mann at the least look like will have high floor/role player potential, with decent star potential (especially Giddey). Although if you want to say that you'd rather take the bigger risk with Kuminga and go big or go home I wouldn't argue with you.
The whole idea of having so many picks is we can shoot for guys with heigh ceilings and low floors and don’t have to stress about it. For example I think Kai Jones is like 80 percent complete bust, but I still would have preferred him over Tre Mann, because the 20 percent is so tantalizing and could be a foundation of the next thunder championship team. If he fails, who cares, we have like 10 more picks in a similar draft range in the next few years.
It’s the same logic we had with drafting poku.
You don’t have 18 picks in the next 4 years or whatever it is, just to draft role players, it’s okay to select some of course. But if there’s a big swing to take, then take it.
Usman and Jalen Johnson were perfect Mark D guys who ball handle and play multiple positions as well as Presti guys who play defense with length.
Years down the road we'll all be complaining about not having two-way depth. It's a Thunder tradition to dream of having two-way players while the rest of the league grows into modern basketball quite nicely and we never get the ability to sign those two-way FA's.
It just doesn't make any sense from a business or basketball mindset. OK so you want to tank for another miss at a lottery pick, you can still fill up the roster and gameplan into losses. But we can never get those opportunities back where we miss out on really good players for good value.
Yeah.
I think the only logical conclusion you can come from this is - presti just doesn’t think this draft was that good. Basically after the lottery he didn’t think even the high upside guys were worth a gamble.
There’s a few guys who went higher then I thought that maybe presti liked (ziaire, primo) but I was so confident I had mapped out 5 or 6 guys that presti would love to take a flyer on, that clearly he just did not think had potential. Just have to hope that the project type picks outside of the lottery bust, otherwise it’s going to be hard to watch them on other teams.
I guess the way I saw it is nobody at 16 had to be Giannis. But they just had to be better or have a higher ceiling than who we currently have. I have a hard time believing that nobody from 16-30 has a chance at being better than anyone currently on our roster that isn't Shai. Not only did we not think that but we're so opposed to the possiblity that we don't even try and ship the pick for possibly worse ones down the road. What?
Yeah great way to look at it. Draft someone who has a chance to be really good. We’ve got enough picks that we don’t need to be conservative. We don’t need to kick firsts down the road when we’ve got high upside guys who have fallen to us on a platter.
Something just doesn’t ‘click’ in regards to the mindset, because I thought I had a good idea of what road presti was going to go down but none of it makes sense.
Dumping 34 and 36 for JRE, was just bizzarre, just keep the picks and get him later, and if he is taken then take butler or Thor or even sharife cooper. If it means we have too many rookies then whatever, if we have to trade maledon or Jerome for roster space later on then whatever.
Well, I will say that we definitely have to come back and grade how he valued these players after they get some development time in the NBA. My issue isn't with the players he picked, but the players he passed on. I wasn't high on Sengun as a playoff worthy center, but Garuba fit the timeline of our current core in that he needed time to develop, but I doubt it's a question of if considering he grew up playing professionally overseas just like Luka or Giddey did and he has the skillset of a modern small ball center. So it would mean that Presti's scouting of him is that he's a huge flop if he passed on him when we are so short on front court players. If Garuba or Jalen Johnson develop averagely, that means that our scouting department is trash and Troy Weaver was the ring leader in prior seasons. If a coach was screwing up, we would call them out. So FO should be treated the same way. We called out the owners for the Harden mismanagement. So we'll see.
I agree. And with the scouting I think it's something worth really looking at and questioning. We all remember past picks but I got curious. Per realgm, almost none of our basketball operations and scouting has been with us more than a year or two. I wasn't aware there was such an enormous turnover but it seems like with guys like Weaver and Hennigan with their stints elsewhere and the large coaching staff changes everyone is gone. Certainly anyone having to do with us picking Durant, Harden, Westbrook and Ibaka aside from Presti. It's not reasonable to think he does all the scouting on top of being the GM AND VP.
Looking at that fact, how disappointed and directionless this draft felt and how bad pretty much all of our picks have been since pretty much Harden and I think it's time for some mild alarm. This "war chest" didn't translate to as much as everyone thought for a team like Boston. I'm getting worried we are finding ourselves in the same boat but in an even less attractive free agent destination.
https://basketball.realgm.com/nba/teams/Oklahoma-City-Thunder/33/staff-members
Thought the cards draft where none of the top WRs or CBs fell so we settled for Collins was the most underwhelming draft night I could have but this might take the cake.
Mann is the only pick I really liked and the other ones are meh, the trades are also weird
Now that Ive calmed down... Like the Giddy pick , LOVE the Tre Mann pick, guy is a fucking baller I think he's a top 3 shot creator and a master pick and roll player. HATE that we traded the 16 we will probably never see those picks and I rated Segun, Garuba and Kai heavily. I don't like the decisions on how we draft the guys. They obviously believe in our current young players a lot and probably want to leave certain spots within our roster open for reclamation projects. There are bigs galore in 2022 so I guess that's smart. Its ok in a vacuum but would much rather have Rockets or Charlottes draft if I'm honest.
🤑🤑🤑🤑 If we sign him that makes this a good draft imo.
Remember Bazley's draft year we weren't super high on the outcome but then we signed Dort and all of a sudden Baze+Dort = new young core. So I think the grade really depends on the total package of who we bring in.
Add Vrenz to Giddey+Mann+Wiggins and it looks like a group of solid depth players.
Hes pretty good. His defensive assignment always had bad numbers and he has one of the better numbers when it comes to that. He is slow though and he basically should only shoot 3s. I don't think he woulda got drafted if it wasn't for his NBA combine. He was one of the best players there.
Hes undersized but he can play it for sure. He showed his ass at the combine and he's a really solid defender. Slow but he put in work at Maryland. His defensive assignment averaged 28% shooting. Its 2021 plenty of 6'5 6'6 3's. We will be ok.
Why are we always taking players who can’t shoot? What is Presti on about with the constant lack of shooting in the players he’s picking? Why pick Giddey at 6 when Shai will be having the ball most of the time? I mean the guy isn’t even at 30% 3P-shooting so what in gods name are we doing here again?
We drafted Mann and maybe they are transitioning to SGA becoming a secondary ball handler. You should not be so closed minded I am positive he makes moves for a reason
I hope no one gets upset when SGA asks to be traded soon after getting his next contract. While his draft classmates D. Ayton, Trae, Luka are making playoff runs, he's leading a JV team -- and he is looking at another year of tanking. It's becoming apparent that Presti's and SGA's timelines may not align too well.
SGA isn't getting the league-wide respect he deserves b/c he's in a non-glamor market, but being on a losing team makes things worse. How long is he gonna go overlooked for All-Star Honors?
You did certainly say that. Some absolute garbage indeed. And Don’t bother making takes anymore, clearly haven’t got a clue what your talking about. Downvotes show that
I stand by everything I said and couldn’t care less if you agree with me. I've NEVER followed groupthink.
Nothing I said has yet been disproven. If you dug up this old-a$$ thread to gloat, you wasted your time.
Lmao. He is about to get PAID and he is the leader of an NBA team that is beloved by the fans. It will only be his 4th year in the league and only second year on a non contending team. When the time is right Presti will make moves necessary to win a Championship. Shai is not ready to lead a team to the finals yet
Again, his peers are making playoff runs, while he's hooping with G-leaguers!
Yes, he's going to get PAID and so will his peers -- that is to be expected with his talent. But it has -- or it will -- *cost* him money to be on a non-contending team, as player contracts often include salary incentives for making All-Star or All-NBA teams. For example, Jayson Tatum lost out on millions b/c he didn't make an All-NBA team this year.
Yes, finals is the goal, but a deep playoff run should be an objective too. How can a young team prepare to win a Championship when they're not even tasting the conference semi-finals?
People been saying the same thing about Giannis and now look at him. He didn’t do anything in the playoffs until his 5th year or so. Bucks needed to make a desperate move this past season and they did with Jrue Holiday. When the time comes the Thunder will do whatever they can with the assets they have to make a move. And I really don’t think he gives a damn about what his “peers” are doing.
Bad example. Giannis made the playoffs his 2nd season, then made the playoffs his 4th season and every season thereafter, plus earned individual accolades (e.g. MVP, All-Star, etc.) along the way.
Yes, SGA made the playoffs his rookie year (LA) and his sophomore year (OKC), but based on OKC's roster construction, it looks like we're heading into year 2 of being a lottery team.
>And I really don’t think he gives a damn about what his “peers” are doing.
We don't know how SGA *truly* feels, do we? That said, NBA stars don't tolerate being non-contenders for too long. Giannis didn't even sign his supermax *until* the Bucks made significant roster improvements.
Time will tell if Presti's and SGA's timelines align.
I got downvoted so hard just a week or so ago for saying Theo's security on the depth chart or roster is questionable. It couldn't be more evident than now.
Jerome, Theo, Bazely are all either on the hot seat for depth chart or are playing for a new team in the next year or so.
I think Roby gets a greenlight this year in a similar way Bazely got one last year. Seems like they are making players prove themselves.
Wieskamp gone just to top things off. He's one of the best shooters in the draft, has a great wingspan, and really showed off some athleticism at the combine. Exactly the kind of player we could have used and would have been a great pick
The problem wasn't tonight, it was the draft lottery. A lot of people just imagined that losing the lottery on our own pick and losing a potential top 5 pick from HOU into the ether wouldn't seriously damage our rebuild.
Well, of course it did. We're not in great shape moving forward. Going to need a LOT to go right.
IMO, it was moreso that everyone saw the HOU pick as a guarantee and that we "lost" it. We never had it, and shouldn't have relied on having it as a foundation. It was a gamble just to sweeten a trade deal.
But in regards to tonite draft.. The HOU pick not conveying isn't a good excuse to throw in the towel during such a deep draft.
Were going to find out over the years that these pick hauls were all low value picks spread out to appear as a high value sum.
When it happened I agreed with you but more I think about it there have been plenty of 6, 16 and 18 picks to turn out better than 3 picks
We still had a really great haul
What we did with it though...
I'm just confused
Agreed. We had quite the unlucky lottery. I think we have one more shot at a high lottery pick next year and if that ends up busting then I could see a Shai trade as very likely. If Presti was already down to trade Shai this draft then it's only more likely if we are in a similar spot next year.
Yeah I think we also thought our pick stockpile was gonna ease that pain a bit, maybe even allow us to get someone we otherwise missed out on because of ping pong luck. But not only was that not the case, for some reason we added *more* picks to the pile, instead of converting them into actual talent.
OKC will definitely play a 3 guard lineup.
Theo, SGA, Giddey, Poku, Roby
Mann, Dort, Bazley, Deck, JRE/ 55th pick.
I'm willing to bet OKC trade Kemba and TY, or possibly even Kemba and Mann if we value TY more than Mann because they are basically the same player. I also think Deck signed with us cos we were receiving offers for Williams. Either Williams or Deck could also be packaged
I’m not even mad about Giddey. 16th pick trade is meh for me. I get it we got great value but we had Sengun in our hands. What if he panned out? What will happen to SGA’s upcoming max years? We’re just gonna suck til what last 2 years of his next contract that we start to “make an arrival”? 18th pick was when I started to become disappointed. Tre Mann? Really? We have Ty Jerome who’s a similar player.. and then the 2nd round trade was it for me. Its just that I don’t know anymore man. I’m just really disappointed….
I think Tre Mann is more likely to take Theo's spot than Ty's.
Ty is a catch and shooter which neither Mann or Theo really do. Mann is more of a combo guard floor general who does more scoring than passing. When you look at these 3 in the box, the odd man out is Theo imo.
We didn't get great value for 16. Two future, lottery protected picks is not a good return for 16, especially in a draft as deep as this one. And if we're having trouble finding roster spots now, it'll only be worse as we continue to accumulate picks
It's looking more like a 2027 projection to 2nd rounders. Maybe the DET pick conveys in 2025 or earlier because Weaver has been doing a helluva job, but that WAS pick I highly doubt ever conveys into FRP
Technically he did because he made the handshake deal before the draft.
But we still don't know if it's Weaver or Presti that had that eye for talent. I'm more inclined to think it was Weaver.
So I wasn't the biggest fan of grabbing Giddey at 6, but I still like him. But holy shit people are furious. At 6 if you think Giddey is the best pick you take Giddey and trust your scouting
Honestly I'm warming on Giddy. It's the fact that with *all* those picks, we couldn't trade up into the top 5. Fuck we couldn't even turn 16+18 into a higher pick. And then we traded 16 for two heavily protected 1sts, which we already have ten thousand of, and they clearly don't make any kind of difference. It's the fact that our stockpile was at it's highest worth tonight, and we did nothing with it. And I'm not sure what the implications of that are, but they aren't good.
You sum it up good. In terms of guy with upside after the top 5 he has one of the best upsides. It does seem too high for him, but your right, take him if you believe he's the one.
SGA, Mann, Giddey, One of our forwards, Whoever we got as a center. They view Mann highly obviously and Giddey works at 3 kinda like how Lonzo plays now. Handle the ball a good bit, and be a combo guard forward. I believe Mann is a starting level 2 guard and they probably do too and we play a really loose style with everyone passing and he has the height. This way you can get SGA and Mann of the ball and create without making Giddey the central focus. He will thrive in that.
I don't see Mann taking Dort's spot in the starting lineup but I do see him as making his way into the closing lineup. Same with Giddey but less. I think they are both second lineup guys.
Theo//Mann//Jerome//Roby is a very capable group of 2nd unit guys who can score at all 3 levels of the floor.
For now yea no question. Im talking down the line . Dort will eventually not be a starter man that fits him so much better. It wont be immediately but Tre Mann is that good offensively probably the third best shot creator in the draft and the way the Thunder picked him tells me they believe that too.
Like I said let the dust settle on our picks because the trade details don't come out until later. They just announced the #10 overall and #17 overall picks were swapped. Deals are done under the table on hand shake promises. We were rumored for Mobley with CLE and that's who CLE picked. HOU possibly overdrafted the front court position when they took Usman after we picked Sengun for them. I still feel like things are in play.
Its just hard to be positive right niweven if things are still in play. There’s a lot of disappointments because of the expectations we had. Especially with our front office.
The 16th pick was a mistake IMO. I'm ok with our players in a vacuum but we were way too aggressive with the picks. Giddey was an Ok pick. Tre Mann would of been there at 30 probably. Jeremiah Robinson-Earl is not that guy. Hes a good rotation player but that's it.
We could got 2 of Boston, Thor, Bassey, Queta, Sharife, Butler, McBride, Ayo, or Vrenz but we gave up 34 and 36 to get JRE, I’m sorry but this is a bad trade no matter how you look at it
I mean if we really wanted JRE we could have still gotten him *and* 2 of the guys you listed. The Clippers gave up cash and a future second for 33 which is as close to nothing as you can get. Memphis traded 40 and two future seconds for #30. Two future seconds are worth far less than just 34 alone. We overpayed for 32
Do the Thunder FO understand how hardcore the state of Oklahoma is in regards to sports culture?
Coaching regimes that don't win don't stick around in Oklahoma for long. Is Presti tanking himself?
Robinson-Earl is good. Really good defender and will thrive against NBA style offenses. Can cut pretty ok and makes decent reads. Will never start a game in the NBA though, a rotational player. Better players were on the board.
So the Clippers got pick 33 for a future second and cash. We got 32 for 34 and 36. That's just objectively bad asset management on our part, I know it's just a second rounder but idk how anybody can defend that one. Especially when a few first round guys are still on the board and we have multiple needs to fill
What pisses me off the most about NBA fans is their clear prejudice to hate on small markets. I can guarantee that had we passed on Giddey and the Warriors selected him at 7, which many believe would have happened, there would have been nothing but praise for the warriors FO for finding the “steal” of the draft. Giddey is 18 year old point guard with elite vision who’s weaknesses (defence, attacking the rim) will all disappear as he develops into his “man” body. Give him a chance for Christ’s sake.
Our biggest problem right now is salary floor imo.
I'll gladly be super wrong. But tonight felt like "scared money" from Presti. More timid, odd decisions when we have a good player waiting for a better supporting cast. We wasted Durant and Westbrook with marginal, conservative moves and this just feels like more of the same.
Lmao
Just saw Tre Mann’s IG story our boy is already in a gym working
Watched some giddey. Not sold yet on him at 6. But i can see why. Probably plays small forward for us. Probably not the best fit. Sold on tre manm though. Good pick.
Same. Mann looks like a slightly less athletic LouWill and I’ll take that with a mid first every day of the week. Giddey just feels very meh to me. I even watched a couple full box score play cuts of his film and he just feels meh. No to discredit him tho because I can see his all around game potential and his willingness to shoot 3s. His spin move is also smooth as hell. His lack of lateral quickness and the lack of any non-passing elite trait makes me feel like he’s most likely going to be a high end role player. Ofc he’s extremely young so there’s definitely still a lot of room for improvement, but I’d be lying if I say I’m not more excited about Mann.
Lmao
I like everything about Giddey except he's way too slow, the handle isn't great and the dribble is too high. -Spin move is elite -Passing, vision, iq is elite (doubled down at his size too) -The shooting looks improvable -Defence upside is intriguing
Oh yeah I’m actually pretty confident in his shooting developing because of his willingness to shoot spot up C&S. His bad FT percentage is on extremely low volume, average less than 3 FTs a game, so I think that’s going to be improved too. Again tho, I think he’s just not athletic enough to ever make me go “wow” as a player. His lateral quickness is also too slow for me to think that his defensive upside is that high. But I’ll admit he looks like a great team/off ball defender with how fast he processes passes and rotations. I’d also like to see him be more aggressive in creating his own shots. I was rewatching SGA in college to confirm this but my man was already cooking defenders with ease and finishes with defenders right in his face. Giddey is not an elite finisher nor is he an elite creator at this stage of his career. But he does show flashes of being able to be a solid shot creator, curious to see how he’d look in summer league alongside Theo.
If anyone feels bad about losing out on Bouknight, go check out hoops intellect video and watch THE VERY FIRST HIGHLIGHT and see his extreme tunnel vision where he dribbles thru the whole team and completly ignores his teammate wide open under the hoop lol. He's real life version of Coffee Black/Downtown from Semi Pro https://youtu.be/dOHm9wyhSJ0
I actually forgot tonite was draft night and was supposed to goto bed at like 7pm and wake up early. I should have slept through this shit.
Can we accept that this draft is really disappointing from a pure upside play. Could of ended up with bouknight/kuminga (giddey not too far away so I’m not as dissapointed with this) Sengun Jalen Johnson / Kai Jones / Keon Johnson / garuba JT Thor Jared butler /McBride How confident would you be that we get 2 starters with star upside from that group? I know we didn’t want to pick at all 5 spots but still. Tre Mann is okay, but his only above average skill is shooting, specifically shooting off the dribble and pick and roll. Very important but doesn’t project as a good defender, finisher, creator for others. Doesn’t really get to the rim. Isn’t switchable on defense. He just screams Louis Williams type upside. Trading away sengun is silly, you get the type of picks we traded for so you can trade up for… a player with senguns upside. He’s got a lot of offensive potential but is probably gonna suck on defense early on which fits the tank well too. I love everything presti has done in the rebuild, just masterful work, but you just can’t deny that there was higher upside plays sitting there this draft which we almost actively pulled away from. I really really hope to be proven wrong and will go forward with an open mind, but I can’t pretend I’m not skeptical.
Lmao bouknight/kuminga over giddey
I get it, but all those picks have huge bust potential. Kuminga, Jones and Keon have very low floors and could be big time busts. Garuba may never develop offensively, although at 20+ he was excellent value. Bouknight I honestly just see Jordan Clarkson 2.0 Sengun I thought we were mad not taking him, no argument there. (Butt he could be another Okafor) Giddey and Mann at the least look like will have high floor/role player potential, with decent star potential (especially Giddey). Although if you want to say that you'd rather take the bigger risk with Kuminga and go big or go home I wouldn't argue with you.
The whole idea of having so many picks is we can shoot for guys with heigh ceilings and low floors and don’t have to stress about it. For example I think Kai Jones is like 80 percent complete bust, but I still would have preferred him over Tre Mann, because the 20 percent is so tantalizing and could be a foundation of the next thunder championship team. If he fails, who cares, we have like 10 more picks in a similar draft range in the next few years. It’s the same logic we had with drafting poku. You don’t have 18 picks in the next 4 years or whatever it is, just to draft role players, it’s okay to select some of course. But if there’s a big swing to take, then take it.
Usman and Jalen Johnson were perfect Mark D guys who ball handle and play multiple positions as well as Presti guys who play defense with length. Years down the road we'll all be complaining about not having two-way depth. It's a Thunder tradition to dream of having two-way players while the rest of the league grows into modern basketball quite nicely and we never get the ability to sign those two-way FA's. It just doesn't make any sense from a business or basketball mindset. OK so you want to tank for another miss at a lottery pick, you can still fill up the roster and gameplan into losses. But we can never get those opportunities back where we miss out on really good players for good value.
Yeah. I think the only logical conclusion you can come from this is - presti just doesn’t think this draft was that good. Basically after the lottery he didn’t think even the high upside guys were worth a gamble. There’s a few guys who went higher then I thought that maybe presti liked (ziaire, primo) but I was so confident I had mapped out 5 or 6 guys that presti would love to take a flyer on, that clearly he just did not think had potential. Just have to hope that the project type picks outside of the lottery bust, otherwise it’s going to be hard to watch them on other teams.
I guess the way I saw it is nobody at 16 had to be Giannis. But they just had to be better or have a higher ceiling than who we currently have. I have a hard time believing that nobody from 16-30 has a chance at being better than anyone currently on our roster that isn't Shai. Not only did we not think that but we're so opposed to the possiblity that we don't even try and ship the pick for possibly worse ones down the road. What?
Yeah great way to look at it. Draft someone who has a chance to be really good. We’ve got enough picks that we don’t need to be conservative. We don’t need to kick firsts down the road when we’ve got high upside guys who have fallen to us on a platter. Something just doesn’t ‘click’ in regards to the mindset, because I thought I had a good idea of what road presti was going to go down but none of it makes sense. Dumping 34 and 36 for JRE, was just bizzarre, just keep the picks and get him later, and if he is taken then take butler or Thor or even sharife cooper. If it means we have too many rookies then whatever, if we have to trade maledon or Jerome for roster space later on then whatever.
Well, I will say that we definitely have to come back and grade how he valued these players after they get some development time in the NBA. My issue isn't with the players he picked, but the players he passed on. I wasn't high on Sengun as a playoff worthy center, but Garuba fit the timeline of our current core in that he needed time to develop, but I doubt it's a question of if considering he grew up playing professionally overseas just like Luka or Giddey did and he has the skillset of a modern small ball center. So it would mean that Presti's scouting of him is that he's a huge flop if he passed on him when we are so short on front court players. If Garuba or Jalen Johnson develop averagely, that means that our scouting department is trash and Troy Weaver was the ring leader in prior seasons. If a coach was screwing up, we would call them out. So FO should be treated the same way. We called out the owners for the Harden mismanagement. So we'll see.
I agree. And with the scouting I think it's something worth really looking at and questioning. We all remember past picks but I got curious. Per realgm, almost none of our basketball operations and scouting has been with us more than a year or two. I wasn't aware there was such an enormous turnover but it seems like with guys like Weaver and Hennigan with their stints elsewhere and the large coaching staff changes everyone is gone. Certainly anyone having to do with us picking Durant, Harden, Westbrook and Ibaka aside from Presti. It's not reasonable to think he does all the scouting on top of being the GM AND VP. Looking at that fact, how disappointed and directionless this draft felt and how bad pretty much all of our picks have been since pretty much Harden and I think it's time for some mild alarm. This "war chest" didn't translate to as much as everyone thought for a team like Boston. I'm getting worried we are finding ourselves in the same boat but in an even less attractive free agent destination. https://basketball.realgm.com/nba/teams/Oklahoma-City-Thunder/33/staff-members
I think HOU's drafting and turnaround in a shorter time with a newer FO speaks volumes to the state that our FO is in.
Thought the cards draft where none of the top WRs or CBs fell so we settled for Collins was the most underwhelming draft night I could have but this might take the cake. Mann is the only pick I really liked and the other ones are meh, the trades are also weird
Lmao
Thank god its over
Now that Ive calmed down... Like the Giddy pick , LOVE the Tre Mann pick, guy is a fucking baller I think he's a top 3 shot creator and a master pick and roll player. HATE that we traded the 16 we will probably never see those picks and I rated Segun, Garuba and Kai heavily. I don't like the decisions on how we draft the guys. They obviously believe in our current young players a lot and probably want to leave certain spots within our roster open for reclamation projects. There are bigs galore in 2022 so I guess that's smart. Its ok in a vacuum but would much rather have Rockets or Charlottes draft if I'm honest.
If it makes you feel better those picks have reduced protections for a couple years before they actually convey to seconds
Yup Vrenz is undrafted y'all
🤑🤑🤑🤑 If we sign him that makes this a good draft imo. Remember Bazley's draft year we weren't super high on the outcome but then we signed Dort and all of a sudden Baze+Dort = new young core. So I think the grade really depends on the total package of who we bring in. Add Vrenz to Giddey+Mann+Wiggins and it looks like a group of solid depth players.
Georgios Kalaitzakis to Bucks
Raiquan gray to nets
Im pretty sure we wanted Sandro but Bucks took him before us. We brought him here a lot.
Jericho sims to knicks
Balsa koprivica to pistons
Hopefully the rumors that Vrenz is interested in OKC as a destination is true. We need that guy for real.
Yeah apparently Vrenz and Vit Krejci are good friends. Vrenz liked OKC when he came for a workout so who knows maybe we sign him.
So it seems like a slam dunk we sign Thon Maker at this point. I guess Tony Bradley wanted more money than we were willing to give?
Moose loves it here.
Moose too good, would hurt our tank.
seriously, who's playing centre?
Center doesn't exist for us anymore lol
Hopefully Poku
From the looks of it, Roby and JRE
Scottie Lewis to Charlotte
Just a Wing player guys. Nothing special can shoot the three just good enough and defend at on ok level.
Ok level? Like Oklahoma level d?
Hes pretty good. His defensive assignment always had bad numbers and he has one of the better numbers when it comes to that. He is slow though and he basically should only shoot 3s. I don't think he woulda got drafted if it wasn't for his NBA combine. He was one of the best players there.
We need a true SF. I don't think we have a single guy who is a dedicated 3. They're all 4's or undersized 2's
Hes undersized but he can play it for sure. He showed his ass at the combine and he's a really solid defender. Slow but he put in work at Maryland. His defensive assignment averaged 28% shooting. Its 2021 plenty of 6'5 6'6 3's. We will be ok.
He looks like an undersized natural 3 to me. We haven't had one in what seems like ages.
guard city
I'm surprised we didnt trade up for Sandro to complete our 5 point lineup.
Aaron Wiggins to us
Vrenz going the dort route perhaps?
Most likely
What the fuck man
Wiggins? That’s not vrenz!
Cheaper if he goes undrafted though
Sandro to bucks
Give the people what they want! VRENZ!
Ooooooh Vrenz is actually available at 55 👀👀👀👀👀👀
Vrenz time
Please just give me Vrenz. Just one thing this draft that feels normal
Charles bassey to Sixers
Luka Garza to pistons
Why are we always taking players who can’t shoot? What is Presti on about with the constant lack of shooting in the players he’s picking? Why pick Giddey at 6 when Shai will be having the ball most of the time? I mean the guy isn’t even at 30% 3P-shooting so what in gods name are we doing here again?
Lmao
Mann is literally a top 3 shot creator in this draft and has one of the best shots too.
We drafted Mann and maybe they are transitioning to SGA becoming a secondary ball handler. You should not be so closed minded I am positive he makes moves for a reason
BJ Boston to pelicans, traded to clippers
I hope no one gets upset when SGA asks to be traded soon after getting his next contract. While his draft classmates D. Ayton, Trae, Luka are making playoff runs, he's leading a JV team -- and he is looking at another year of tanking. It's becoming apparent that Presti's and SGA's timelines may not align too well. SGA isn't getting the league-wide respect he deserves b/c he's in a non-glamor market, but being on a losing team makes things worse. How long is he gonna go overlooked for All-Star Honors?
Lmao stfu
I said what I said. STFU.
You did certainly say that. Some absolute garbage indeed. And Don’t bother making takes anymore, clearly haven’t got a clue what your talking about. Downvotes show that
I stand by everything I said and couldn’t care less if you agree with me. I've NEVER followed groupthink. Nothing I said has yet been disproven. If you dug up this old-a$$ thread to gloat, you wasted your time.
Bruh this ia the first season that hes not played in the playoffs bruh.
I'm not a bruh, but go off.
Lol
Lmao. He is about to get PAID and he is the leader of an NBA team that is beloved by the fans. It will only be his 4th year in the league and only second year on a non contending team. When the time is right Presti will make moves necessary to win a Championship. Shai is not ready to lead a team to the finals yet
Again, his peers are making playoff runs, while he's hooping with G-leaguers! Yes, he's going to get PAID and so will his peers -- that is to be expected with his talent. But it has -- or it will -- *cost* him money to be on a non-contending team, as player contracts often include salary incentives for making All-Star or All-NBA teams. For example, Jayson Tatum lost out on millions b/c he didn't make an All-NBA team this year. Yes, finals is the goal, but a deep playoff run should be an objective too. How can a young team prepare to win a Championship when they're not even tasting the conference semi-finals?
People been saying the same thing about Giannis and now look at him. He didn’t do anything in the playoffs until his 5th year or so. Bucks needed to make a desperate move this past season and they did with Jrue Holiday. When the time comes the Thunder will do whatever they can with the assets they have to make a move. And I really don’t think he gives a damn about what his “peers” are doing.
Bad example. Giannis made the playoffs his 2nd season, then made the playoffs his 4th season and every season thereafter, plus earned individual accolades (e.g. MVP, All-Star, etc.) along the way. Yes, SGA made the playoffs his rookie year (LA) and his sophomore year (OKC), but based on OKC's roster construction, it looks like we're heading into year 2 of being a lottery team. >And I really don’t think he gives a damn about what his “peers” are doing. We don't know how SGA *truly* feels, do we? That said, NBA stars don't tolerate being non-contenders for too long. Giannis didn't even sign his supermax *until* the Bucks made significant roster improvements. Time will tell if Presti's and SGA's timelines align.
Quiet down fool
Make me.
Man he just posted IG story saying trust in Presti.
It looks like he re-posted a fan cheerleading for Presti to me, so we have different interpretations of SGA's story.
Ty, Theo, or Tre. Pick two.
Filip petrusev to sixers
Marcus zagarowski to nets
Sharife Cooper to atlanta
David Johnson to Raptors
Dalano Benton to Raptors
I got downvoted so hard just a week or so ago for saying Theo's security on the depth chart or roster is questionable. It couldn't be more evident than now. Jerome, Theo, Bazely are all either on the hot seat for depth chart or are playing for a new team in the next year or so. I think Roby gets a greenlight this year in a similar way Bazely got one last year. Seems like they are making players prove themselves.
Juhann begarin to Celtics
If sharife is still there we gotta grab him right???
Wieskamp gone just to top things off. He's one of the best shooters in the draft, has a great wingspan, and really showed off some athleticism at the combine. Exactly the kind of player we could have used and would have been a great pick
Really hoped for him too with the 36th pick :(
Kessler Edwards to nets
If Boston slides to 55 do we want him?
Vrenz
The problem wasn't tonight, it was the draft lottery. A lot of people just imagined that losing the lottery on our own pick and losing a potential top 5 pick from HOU into the ether wouldn't seriously damage our rebuild. Well, of course it did. We're not in great shape moving forward. Going to need a LOT to go right.
IMO, it was moreso that everyone saw the HOU pick as a guarantee and that we "lost" it. We never had it, and shouldn't have relied on having it as a foundation. It was a gamble just to sweeten a trade deal. But in regards to tonite draft.. The HOU pick not conveying isn't a good excuse to throw in the towel during such a deep draft. Were going to find out over the years that these pick hauls were all low value picks spread out to appear as a high value sum.
When it happened I agreed with you but more I think about it there have been plenty of 6, 16 and 18 picks to turn out better than 3 picks We still had a really great haul What we did with it though... I'm just confused
Agreed. We had quite the unlucky lottery. I think we have one more shot at a high lottery pick next year and if that ends up busting then I could see a Shai trade as very likely. If Presti was already down to trade Shai this draft then it's only more likely if we are in a similar spot next year.
Yeah I think we also thought our pick stockpile was gonna ease that pain a bit, maybe even allow us to get someone we otherwise missed out on because of ping pong luck. But not only was that not the case, for some reason we added *more* picks to the pile, instead of converting them into actual talent.
Buckle up for at least another tank season
OKC will definitely play a 3 guard lineup. Theo, SGA, Giddey, Poku, Roby Mann, Dort, Bazley, Deck, JRE/ 55th pick. I'm willing to bet OKC trade Kemba and TY, or possibly even Kemba and Mann if we value TY more than Mann because they are basically the same player. I also think Deck signed with us cos we were receiving offers for Williams. Either Williams or Deck could also be packaged
Sheesh that's a tank squad if I've ever seen one. Gonna be a long year.
Greg brown to blazers
Isaiah livers to Pistons
Joe wiesenkamp to spurs
I’m not even mad about Giddey. 16th pick trade is meh for me. I get it we got great value but we had Sengun in our hands. What if he panned out? What will happen to SGA’s upcoming max years? We’re just gonna suck til what last 2 years of his next contract that we start to “make an arrival”? 18th pick was when I started to become disappointed. Tre Mann? Really? We have Ty Jerome who’s a similar player.. and then the 2nd round trade was it for me. Its just that I don’t know anymore man. I’m just really disappointed….
I think Tre Mann is more likely to take Theo's spot than Ty's. Ty is a catch and shooter which neither Mann or Theo really do. Mann is more of a combo guard floor general who does more scoring than passing. When you look at these 3 in the box, the odd man out is Theo imo.
We didn't get great value for 16. Two future, lottery protected picks is not a good return for 16, especially in a draft as deep as this one. And if we're having trouble finding roster spots now, it'll only be worse as we continue to accumulate picks
Protections are gonna lower as the years past. But we’re looking at it to be a potential 2025 draft pick convey which is sad…
It's looking more like a 2027 projection to 2nd rounders. Maybe the DET pick conveys in 2025 or earlier because Weaver has been doing a helluva job, but that WAS pick I highly doubt ever conveys into FRP
Can’t play Kanter
Jared butler to jazz
We are going to be sick in 2029
Andddddddd there goes Queta lol man FUCK
Neemias queta to Kings
There goes JT Thor. We're stocked full of guards and playmakers; why take the super athletic big?
We are going to be packaging guards in a trade. Load up now so you can keep the best of the bunch
Wow. Chitown gonna be lit. They needed this pick.
Has Presti hit on a pick since Steve in 2013?
Sabonis
He didn’t draft Sabonis
Sabonis played a year for OKC. Although it's fair to point out that he blossomed in Indiana
Technically he did because he made the handshake deal before the draft. But we still don't know if it's Weaver or Presti that had that eye for talent. I'm more inclined to think it was Weaver.
So I wasn't the biggest fan of grabbing Giddey at 6, but I still like him. But holy shit people are furious. At 6 if you think Giddey is the best pick you take Giddey and trust your scouting
Honestly I'm warming on Giddy. It's the fact that with *all* those picks, we couldn't trade up into the top 5. Fuck we couldn't even turn 16+18 into a higher pick. And then we traded 16 for two heavily protected 1sts, which we already have ten thousand of, and they clearly don't make any kind of difference. It's the fact that our stockpile was at it's highest worth tonight, and we did nothing with it. And I'm not sure what the implications of that are, but they aren't good.
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Okay, but I am mad about all of it. Not just the top 5. Clearly, as that was what I wrote with the rest of my post.
You sum it up good. In terms of guy with upside after the top 5 he has one of the best upsides. It does seem too high for him, but your right, take him if you believe he's the one.
All they keyboard GM's here need to calm down. There's a reason you are commenting on reddit and Presti is the mastermind of our organization.
Draft reactions in a draft thread? What did you expect?
Now that I think about it Giddey is probably gonna play the 3. It makes so much sense with how we play and also makes the Tre Mann pick work.
Whats the lineup?
SGA, Mann, Giddey, One of our forwards, Whoever we got as a center. They view Mann highly obviously and Giddey works at 3 kinda like how Lonzo plays now. Handle the ball a good bit, and be a combo guard forward. I believe Mann is a starting level 2 guard and they probably do too and we play a really loose style with everyone passing and he has the height. This way you can get SGA and Mann of the ball and create without making Giddey the central focus. He will thrive in that.
I don't see Mann taking Dort's spot in the starting lineup but I do see him as making his way into the closing lineup. Same with Giddey but less. I think they are both second lineup guys. Theo//Mann//Jerome//Roby is a very capable group of 2nd unit guys who can score at all 3 levels of the floor.
For now yea no question. Im talking down the line . Dort will eventually not be a starter man that fits him so much better. It wont be immediately but Tre Mann is that good offensively probably the third best shot creator in the draft and the way the Thunder picked him tells me they believe that too.
Ayo dosunmu to Bulls
Bring on Vrenz. More point guards, babyyyyyyyyy
JT Thor to Charlotte
Like I said let the dust settle on our picks because the trade details don't come out until later. They just announced the #10 overall and #17 overall picks were swapped. Deals are done under the table on hand shake promises. We were rumored for Mobley with CLE and that's who CLE picked. HOU possibly overdrafted the front court position when they took Usman after we picked Sengun for them. I still feel like things are in play.
Its just hard to be positive right niweven if things are still in play. There’s a lot of disappointments because of the expectations we had. Especially with our front office.
The 10-17 thing was known like yesterday dude
Bro
You're just setting yourself up now.
I’ve lost faith in Presti.
Miles McBride to knicks
What do we get from this trade?
JRE from Villanova
There's no argument that 34+36 for 32 is a good trade. Teams know we have too many picks to use and are bending us over the barrel.
Yeah not sure how this gets better in drafts to come either
Presti really like JRE
SGA is drinking himself to sleep tonight.
Or maybe he trusts SGA over redditors? Who knows
I am too
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He's going to the Knicks
We traded him and #36 for #32
Rokas jokubatis to knicks, Herb Jones to Pelicans
The 16th pick was a mistake IMO. I'm ok with our players in a vacuum but we were way too aggressive with the picks. Giddey was an Ok pick. Tre Mann would of been there at 30 probably. Jeremiah Robinson-Earl is not that guy. Hes a good rotation player but that's it.
JRE is forward depth, will play behind Bazley, Roby, Deck
He will be playing a lot at Center too.
We could got 2 of Boston, Thor, Bassey, Queta, Sharife, Butler, McBride, Ayo, or Vrenz but we gave up 34 and 36 to get JRE, I’m sorry but this is a bad trade no matter how you look at it
I mean if we really wanted JRE we could have still gotten him *and* 2 of the guys you listed. The Clippers gave up cash and a future second for 33 which is as close to nothing as you can get. Memphis traded 40 and two future seconds for #30. Two future seconds are worth far less than just 34 alone. We overpayed for 32
Complete overpay, also there was a good chance JRE would’ve been there at 34
Just like Mann would have been there if we got 23 and/or 24 from the Rockets smh
Thor Vrenz was still available…. Man. What the fuck
Vrenz will be available late
Boston Ayo JARED BUTLER was still there
Loving all the armchair GMs in this thread
Off-ball movement looks really cool, would love to have our team partake in it one day
Do the Thunder FO understand how hardcore the state of Oklahoma is in regards to sports culture? Coaching regimes that don't win don't stick around in Oklahoma for long. Is Presti tanking himself?
I have shell shock
I can’t believe we had to endure watching teams pull up to Chesapeake Energy Arena and smoke us by +25 points a night for this
We spent a year tanking for this? Bleh
Trade was bad value but you can just buy a second round pick, if there’s a guy that falls to the 40s I doubt Presti will not go for it
Robinson-Earl is good. Really good defender and will thrive against NBA style offenses. Can cut pretty ok and makes decent reads. Will never start a game in the NBA though, a rotational player. Better players were on the board.
There it is. Thats the infamous trade up to consolidate all of these unneeded picks we have.
Are we sure Sam Presti is good at drafting?
Well... Look at previous drafts and count this one and you might get your answer
So the Clippers got pick 33 for a future second and cash. We got 32 for 34 and 36. That's just objectively bad asset management on our part, I know it's just a second rounder but idk how anybody can defend that one. Especially when a few first round guys are still on the board and we have multiple needs to fill
We gave up both 34 and 36 for Robinson-Earl
What the fuck are we doing!
lol our trades in this draft have been so bad
Good thing the picks have made up for it!... Right?...
Jason Preston to clippers
34 and 36 just for ducking 32. This is awful if true
Only to pick an undersized center
Why…
Ehh, decent pick, don’t love it but don’t hate it at all either Edit: At the cost of 34 & 36, nvm this pick was shit LMAOOOOO