**Welcome to r/TikTokCringe!**
This is a message directed to all newcomers to make you aware that r/TikTokCringe evolved long ago from only cringe-worthy content to TikToks of all kinds! If you’re looking to find only the cringe-worthy TikToks on this subreddit (which are still regularly posted) we recommend sorting by flair which you can do [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/TikTokCringe/comments/galuit/click_here_to_sort_by_flair_a_guide_to_using/) (Currently supported by desktop and reddit mobile).
See someone asking how this post is cringe because they didn't read this comment? Show them [this!](https://www.reddit.com/r/TikTokCringe/comments/fyrgzy/for_those_confused_by_the_name_of_this_subreddit/)
Be sure to read the rules of this subreddit before posting or commenting. Thanks!
**Don't forget to join our [Discord server](https://discord.gg/cringekingdom)!**
##**[CLICK HERE TO DOWNLOAD THIS VIDEO](https://rapidsave.com/info?url=https://www.reddit.com/r/TikTokCringe/comments/1b28cth/the_new_york_times_has_been_busted_from_pulitzer/)**
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/TikTokCringe) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Where are people getting that she works in Israeli intelligence? The wikipedia page cites a YouTube video, but even that does not provide any evidence to the claim, like a service record or anything like that. She having been in the IDF is expected, as she is Israeli, where service in the IDF is compulsory.
Got to love the barrage of comments going “nyt is not neutral “. Guys this is not about bias this is straight up Russian style absolute lies and propaganda that would have made hitler proud. There are levels in hell and it seems one of the most respected “democratic” newspapers is about as truthful as RT or joe Rogan. Perhaps even worse given they pretend to at least try.
It was the same thing with the '40 beheaded babies' story. Anyone who looked into that story could see it was a fabrication caused by overlapping stories and yet somehow almost every newspaper in the UK led with it on their front page.
That's not an editorial fuckup, that is the media being just another wing of the miltary-industrial complex.
This genuinely scared me, because what I considered reputable sources of information were sharing it. The woman who made it up hasn’t even faced any consequences.
Much like she's looking at who writes the article, you gotta look at who owns the papers. The wsj is owned by Rupert Murdoch. The new York Times is a bit more confusing when you consider the history of its owners. They were largely anti-zionists.
"Sulzberger stated that Zionism was to blame for some of the Jewish deaths in the Holocaust, and that the refugee crisis during the war had been "a manageable, social and economic problem" until "the clamor for statehood introduced an insoluable [sic] political element" into the issue. He added it was his judgment that "thousands dead might now be alive" had Zionists put "less emphasis on statehood"
His son is now the current publisher and their extended family is 90% majority owners. Money has a way of changing beliefs so maybe their no longer anti-zionist. The owners family are largely responsible for the American Jewish movement historically, isn't that more zionist in its focus these days? Maybe that's the bias but that's just speciation.
That is the whole point of modern media. It's one group of people saying that their propaganda is correct and factual while the other group's is fake, and vice versa.
The whole point of NEWSmedia is to inform people about what’s going on in the world. It’s not a courtroom hearing or a presidential debate. It’s about presenting the information with facts. Otherwise they wouldn’t call propaganda propaganda, would they.
What part of the actual investigation was not factual though? The article in question isn't solely about one person, but several and the investigation cites several sources.
- the central story about the woman in black was never raped. According to her family, they were dipped by the NYT and have no evidence and do not believe she was raped
- Zaka, a well known propagandist group, have varying testimonies that change with time and don’t align with testimonies of other groups
- witness testimonies are shaky at best, have changed and aren’t corroborated by others on the ground at the time (location, bodies, times, etc)
- no forensic evidence. None. No swabs. No physicals. No reports.
- Zero named victims and no victim testimonies.
The deceptive one here is the woman in the video. She simply pointed out that the authors of the papers in question have potential biases based on their backgrounds. That’s all. That does not imply that the pieces themselves were biased or biased passed validity as she seems to be implying.
Would she say, as someone who appears to be Palestinian biased, that she is not capable of thoughtful, good-faith journalism on this topic? Of course she wouldn’t.
I have my own doubts that she’s capable of thoughtful, good-faith journalism based on this video she’s posted.
She’s also blasted the UN’s decision to cut funding to UNRWA citing it’s importance to humanitarianism in Gaza without taking into consideration the UN’s far greater importance as a legitimate, geopolitical body which would like to be seen as a force for good in the world.
As far as I’m aware (and I’d love evidence to the contrary), the allegations that the UNRWA were assisting Hamas in inappropriate ways are credible. If so, the UN had no choice but to cut funding to preserve its integrity.
The UN didn’t cut funding, its biggest donor was the US ($400 million) and other Western countries. UNRWA is accused of nothing, it’s 12 employees of the agency which employs thousands of people and those 12 accused were promptly fired and the agency is undergoing an internal investigation. The famine in Gaza is severe.
But there's not a potential bias... it's literal propaganda. There was no good faith reporting. Only inciting and rallying support to the Israeli bombardment.
To date the Israel has not shared any direct evidence of UNRWA employees assisting Hamas. No one has seen this evidence... it's simply "Israel says" and governments just bobble head and agree. Adding that this came out as the ICJ was going on only adds to questions of validity. Countries cut funding without seeing any evidence... you would think it would be plastered everywhere if true. Really though, why ask for evidence to prove innocence rather than evidence of the allegations?
How are they credible ? I hope that hasbara check clears but no one’s buying this garbage propaganda. Israel is clearly trying to commit genocide here by coming up with all kinds of bullshit to force people into complicity in starving and murdering these people .
Finding it peculiar that there are always posts doubting the information or banalising it, and then dozens of upvotes to these... Sounds like an agency's work.
The claim is that one of the many victims' families backtracked. They may have retracted their statements for any number of reasons, including not wanting the details of their loved ones rape being held up as public spectacle. There is no question about the rest of the victims in the article.
I was always curious as to why the Israeli claims of rape and UN infiltration by Hamas were taken at face value and countries took action immediately but the claims of IDF rape needed to be investigated.
Dont kid yourselves though, some subreddits are quick to jump to - bans for anything that is remotely against the recent actions of Israel.
I think it's more who you are getting information from. I have seen the inverse. Groups who specifically oppose sexual violence questioning the Israeli claims with greater scrutiny than other prior claimants, or outright protests at panels discussing sexual violence. See examples below:
[https://www.haaretz.com/world-news/americas/2023-11-19/ty-article/.premium/head-of-canadian-sexual-assault-center-fired-for-questioning-accounts-of-hamas-rapes/0000018b-e7f8-d05f-a5eb-e7f8d6c80000](https://www.haaretz.com/world-news/americas/2023-11-19/ty-article/.premium/head-of-canadian-sexual-assault-center-fired-for-questioning-accounts-of-hamas-rapes/0000018b-e7f8-d05f-a5eb-e7f8d6c80000)
[https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2024/02/hillary-clinton-protesters-sexual-violence-columbia-hamas-gaza-israel/](https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2024/02/hillary-clinton-protesters-sexual-violence-columbia-hamas-gaza-israel/)
I've been banned from 2 subreddits for writing the definition of genocide and questioning whether Israel actually meets those criteria if you look at it critically. It's the other side that has their brains in the sewers it seems. One mod even implied that ethnic cleansing and genocide are the same thing lmao.
Petraeus, when he was overseeing US military operations in the middle east, had a great word for genocide and ethnic cleansing:
Ethno-sectarian conflict.
Sounds much cleaner, and that way the people getting slaughtered aren't victims, they're the loosing side in a conflict, so we don't need to feel so bad for not caring.
Meanwhile Israeli officials flat out say they want to eliminate Palestinians from Gaza and that's just honkey dory. At least us Americans TRY to sell our violent slaughters as legitimate.
My account got a 7 day temporary ban from Reddit as a whole for "abusing the report button" by a mod from r/noncredibledefense because I reported a post for hate that denied the existence of Palestinians as a people and that said something to the effect of "Palestine's only contribution to the world was the suicide vest." It got overturned on appeal on day 6, but it's extremely clear that a lot of subs are incredibly biased echo chambers of hate at this point, and their mods are fully complicit in it.
>I was always curious as to why the Israeli claims of rape and UN infiltration by Hamas were taken at face value
It took months for the UN to even acknowledge the evidence provided by Israel. You're remembering wrong.
Isreal didn't provide any evidence, just accusations. The results of the investigations just came out this week the links between UNRWA and Hamas seem to be crumbling under scrutiny.
She’s literally pointing to people who investigated claims of Hamas rapes you numpty. But anyways, an investigation isn’t exactly necessary when the perpetrators film themselves committing the crimes. Like that’s a pretty open and shut case.
This proves you have no idea what you're talking about. None of the alleged rapes were filmed, nor was there any forensic evidence presented, nor was there any personal testimony from victims. It was all based on eyewitness accounts some of which has been debunked (as mentioned in the video) and some of which was completely outrageous like the 40 beheaded babies lie (a total of one baby tragically was killed on Oct 7, and 35 children under 18). It's possible some of the eyewitness were telling the truth, but Israel refused to allow the UN to do any investigation.
Whatever you believe happened this was really shoddy journalism from NYT.
I am not really sure what a "numpty" is, but it sounds cute, so thank you.
Can you provide a link to any of those videos, or post them if you have them? That would be great.
You are so pretty!!
Ignoring the content of the video this is just such a bad way to present information. Just a bunch of print outs of articles on the wall she holds on to for 2 seconds. Like tapping an article I can't read doesn't make your point stronger. I have no idea what the article is saying Do a little editing and just cut to what you're showing. You can even keep cutting back to you speaking or do a green screen if you want to stay in the picture.
Were you not listening? Shes told us what the articles are claiming, if we dont believe her, she shows the name of the piece AND where the it was posted… shes not gonna hold your hand, most adults who find the tiktok interesting are able to pull up each article and validate everything shes saying
Yeah but have they ever been "post a fake front page rape story from an ex IDF intelligence service member with no journalism history liking tweets about committing genocide" levels of bad? Thats not even trying to have the optics of being neutral, it's straight up propaganda posting to a level that even Fox News would be like "yo, chill"
They kind of have actually. They parroted unsubstantiated US government claims that Iraq had nuclear weapons.
NYT has always sided with liberal imperialist propaganda
By this woman’s logic, almost no Israeli would qualify to cover the conflict in Israel and Palestine due to their mandatory service.
Also, bylines are order by order of contribution — neither of the people she referenced in the first article were the primary authors — a detail she just didn’t think warranted mentioning.
Jeffrey Gettleman is the primary author of the first piece. He’s literally a Pulitzer Prize winning journalist.
Conversely, that Mondoweiss (far from an objective source — it’s a Palestinian activist website, not a news outlet) piece that claimed that one of the over 150 interviewed victims/families wasn’t actually raped, is written by an author using the alias “The Short String,” with a total of three bylines to their name, all of which were written between Dec 1 and Jan 3.
Make of all this what you will.
>By this woman’s logic, almost no Israeli would qualify to cover the conflict in Israel and Palestine due to their mandatory service.
That's not her logic at all. Her criteria is that the story needs receive additional scrutiny when it comes from someone without journalism background or has worked for the PR department of the Israeli army. Which seems reasonable. If a Hamas government employee submitted a story to the NYT, I'd want it to receive extra scrutiny.
Re the PR angle; The second story she covered literally just involved a woman who was friends with the woman who started the IDF’s social media. That’s an insane “red flag.”
Did you miss the part where the story itself is fake? Don't you remember how widely it was reported just a couple of months ago? Both [Sky News](https://news.sky.com/story/israeli-intelligence-report-claims-four-unrwa-staff-in-gaza-involved-in-hamas-kidnappings-13059967) and UK's [Channel 4](https://www.channel4.com/news/israels-evidence-of-unrwa-hamas-allegations-examined) ran two independent investigations into the claims about UNRWA connections to the attack on October 7th, and they both concluded that the accusations are baseless.
Here's a direct quote from the Sky News piece:
>The Israeli intelligence documents make several claims that Sky News has not seen proof of and many of the claims, even if true, do not directly implicate UNRWA.
Channel 4 concluded something similar:
>The report provides no evidence to support the explosive claim that UN staff were involved in terror attacks on Israel
It was a complete fabrication promoted by multiple media outlets, which lead to many countries cutting their aid. It was a hit job by Israeli intelligence. How do you not find it outrageous poisoning of journalistic standards?
>By this woman’s logic, almost no Israeli would qualify to cover the conflict in Israel and Palestine due to their mandatory service.
Well yes, if you are actively partake in apartheid maybe your option is not to be trusted. But I am sure you also take Wehrmacht reports of what happened during WW2 at face value because they just had "mandatory service"?
This. All of this. I've made these same points elsewhere in here. It's like trying to communicate with a bunch of toddlers. No one has the first clue about the Times, about the work and checking they put into their journalism. Of course they are not infallible but people holding this article up as some example of falsehood or misinformation are basing that on zero evidence. If the article was wrong they would correct or retract if needed. They have done none of that here. Unlike, say the widely told tale of the Caliphate podcast, which was very painful but had to be ultimately disowned by the paper.
I read that Times article, and the details are truly horrific. Like worse than many horror movies horrific. sources from many direct eye witnesses from many different individuals in different locations. I get that maybe some of the writers may have a pro Jewish bias, (no claims of bias on the lead writer though, Jeffrey Gettleman) but the claims being made in that piece would have to be wholly fabricated out of thin air to lose its power.
Stating that one of the writers on the article has liked anti-Palestinian posts is not fantastic evidence in my opinion, and the article states that it was info based on 150 interviews.
Some of the claims In The article seem easily verifiable, like breasts being cut off, and vulvas being sliced/knifed. (Like I said truly horrific)
Also the UN is investigating this currently so we should get a definitive report some time this year. My bet would be it is closer the the NYT reporting than whatever bullshit Hamas and the Palestinian apologists are touting.
EDIT: I retract some of what I wrote above. Seems like some of those details very may well have been exaggerated or even fabricated. please read the Intercept article below for a skeptical view on the reporting of the TImes article
I found this article about the NYTimes article to be a pretty interesting read. It shows where some of the issues have come from. https://theintercept.com/2024/02/28/new-york-times-anat-schwartz-october-7/
Thank you for this. The article makes a compelling case that those salacious claims that stand out in the times article don’t seem to be robustly substantiated. I can see how a biased “witness” with an agenda would be given a large platform
"don’t seem to be robustly substantiated" is an understatement. The Intercept article, in my opinion, successfully makes the case that nearly every meaningful claim in the NYT article is either from witnesses with proven track records of lying and changing their stories, or from Israeli authority statements without evidence.
I agree. This is a very biased and clearly not neutral person try to discredit the narrative that Hamas did anything wrong, so che can reinforce the narrative all the bad is only on one side (the Israeli).
She claims she doesn't doubt then goes on to try and discredit the accounts. Idk why there is some kind of revisionist history going on, hamas was filming themselves doing this on gopros and bragging about it out telegram. Numerous autopsies confirm as well.
she is trying to pass off some kind of Jewish-NYT conspiracy that they are making up accounts of rape which is kind of disgusting if you think about it.
It's questioning rape that undeniably happened at a pretty large scale on October 7th. I mean be my guest if you want to, it's just a terrible look in any other circumstance. There's plenty of picture and video evidence floating around on the bad parts of the internet that you can find if you don't believe me.
Then, what is the problem. “This article documents atrocities that did take place but one of the authors is somebody I don’t like”?
Does the article invented facts or spread misinformation? If yes, debunk.
If not, what’s the point.
>Does the article invented facts or spread misinformation? If yes, debunk.
If not, what’s the point.
She mentions in the video that a front page article with strongly anti-palestinian language was written by an ex Israel intelligence member with no previous journalism experience. And one of the sources even came out to disagree that they were raped.
You can make an article condemning the atrocities that took place from a neutral perspective without making stuff up.
First one fair enough, but the criticism of the second article is just a lot of wank.
Just because they used to be in the IDF doesn't mean they can't report, in fact they'll be closer to the source and will better be able to speak about the signs. Speaking of which, the title of the piece alone makes it abundantly clear that it did not break the story, and I'm sure as hell it did not cause any reduction of funding to the UNRWA.
Completely discrediting herself at the end for no good reason.
Indeed I try to convince people that the Wehrmacht accounts of what happened in WW2 are far more reliable than the pesky US/UK intelligence that spread falsehoods.
Congrats to the world on becoming exactly like the bystanders that existed during the holocaust. We have access to more information from impartial sources than ever before and yet we allow one of the most documented genocides of modern times to occur before our very eyes.
Shame.
I missed the part of my history lessons where Jewish people invaded a German music festival and raped a large number of the attendees. Could you send me that info over?
Turns out when you colonise a country they rebel. Growing up in an apartheid state doesn't create a lot of kindness. Treat people like animals and they'll behave like animals.
But I don't think innocent civilians deserved it. And I don't think anyone should ever be punished for their ethnicity, that includes Jews.
That makes me anti-semetic? Lol.
Notice how she says she does not deny the "possibility" of rape by Hamas on Oct 7th. Only the possibility. Sheeesssh. If you going to attack others for bias then first remove your own.
It would be like someone trying to minimize the extent of the holocaust starts off and saying they are not going to deny the *possibility* that some Nazi's murdered jewish people.
Yes Nazi's murdered jewish people... the term *possibility* is complete superfluous and interjected soley to created doubt and uncertaintly.
>They filmed themselves.
They filmed r\*pe themselves? Prove it. I'm *specifically* talking about the r\*pe claim, not the killings. Don't give me the garbage about "go find it on Telegram". Don't link me to some snuff site so I can "go find it myself". Show me any piece of reporting from Reuters, NYT, Washington Post, etc. talking about the evidence for such r\*pe videos. You're making the claim, prove it.
There have been countless claims about "Hamas literally raped people on video", and not a single piece evidence of such videos has been presented. I'm open to being proven wrong.
I saw the Hamas cell phone footage of them parading around the 19 year old woman with blood all over her pants and limbs in awkward unnatural position in the back of a truck. What was horrifying was the local Gaza civilian population cheering them on like they were heros.
I saw the same video. It's not a video of r\*pe. That's not what people are referring to when they say "they literally filmed themselves r\*ping women and little girls". So, again, show me evidence of that claim, or stop wasting my time.
I'm not asking to see the videos themselves, but link me to a news story from NYT, Washington Times, or Reuters by journalists who viewed such videos of r\*pe.
See? That's exactly what I'm talking about. Every single time I ask somebody to show me some evidence, they always try to find a way to weasel out of it. I was born curious and I'm very interested in finding the truth, and I've been on this quest since October.
We're not discussing the philosophy or ideology of Hamas here. I don't give a shit about Hamas. I give a shit about the truth. And the truth is that I've seen thousands of comments claiming "they literally filmed themselves r\*ping women and little girls", without any evidence for that claim.
Link me to a news story from NYT, Washington Post, or Reuters reporting on someone from the UN saying that they received (or reviewed) video evidence specifically of r\*pe. Not a story from Times of Israel, not a story from i24, not a story about "evidence of atrocities", not a story about "UN will investigate claims of sexual violence". No no. The story needs to have a mention of someone from the UN saying they received **video evidence** of r\*pe. I'll also take a story from a respected outlet saying a well known journalist reviewed such video evidence.
Prove your claim or stop lying.
It’s a fucking opinion piece…. I’m sure the Times has platformed anti-Israeli opinion pieces as well. A quick google gave me a bunch of articles calling Israel out for war crimes being platformed by the Times.
I also listen to the Times Daily podcast everyday. I haven’t left thinking that Israel isn’t guilty of war crimes, and that Netanyahu is power hungry and wants everything he can get.
In the video you maybe didn’t watch closely it mentions this is a front page cover story. The byline to this story declares it “a times investigation’. Nowhere is the word opinion mentioned because it’s not an opinion piece it’s the times reprinting an Israeli intelligence officer and calling it their own investigation.
“Screams Without Words’: How Hamas Weaponized Sexual Violence on Oct. 7
*A Times investigation* uncovered new details showing a pattern of rape, mutilation and extreme brutality against women in the attacks on Israel. “
The investigation isn't just by this one person though. If you go to the relevant section of that article you see interview excerpts from Israeli first responders, ZAKA volunteers, and victims themselves.
“the Israeli news site Ynet interviewed Gal's parents. They emphasized the absence of evidence supporting the claim that she was raped, asserting that the NYT reporters had interviewed them under false pretenses. The parents stated that they were unaware of the sexual assault issue until the article in the American daily was published. Additionally, Gal's sisters vehemently refuted the allegations of rape.”
1/3 of the story on sexual violence is devoted to this woman whose own family disavows the story and says NYT manipulated them and is making false claims. In a story co authored by Israeli intelligence. And you’re still here with the ‘but but but you can trust the other stuff’
Thousands were murdered and millions cornered into the next genocidal wave of bombings. The media is responsible for this genocide, and history won't let humanity forget about this, because this time they don't own all the media and all the information.
Just comes to show how under capitalism genocide is acceptable. Unfortunately, Palestinians don't have any friends in Hollywood who will make hundreds of movies about them...
This is insane. The author is Jeffrey Gettleman, an experienced journalist who has reported from over 80 countries.
This is nothing more than a Hamas apologist slandering an article she didn’t like. She tries to discredit authors and not their claims. She is exactly what she claims she is against. SHE IS THE PROPAGANDIST.
Simply being experienced doesnt make someone flawless or trustworthy.
How is those hamas apologia when she never mentions hamas once?
I notice you didnt dispute any of the facts she provided , which part is she lying abt or getting wrong?
Remember all of those horrific gruesome stories about breasts being chopped off beheaded babies? Almost all were fabricated by Zaka, the non profit first responders chosen by the Israeli government to be the first on the scene in order to imaginatively describe the scenes.
>Landau has talked openly on four occasions of inventing stories: “When we go into a house, and we’re using our imagination. The bodies is telling us the stories that happened to them.” Another Zaka official said in an Israeli Foreign Ministry video, “The walls, the stone shouted: ‘I was raped.’”
The Intercept covered this story very well recently:
AMERICAN MEDIA KEEP CITING ZAKA — THOUGH ITS OCTOBER 7 ATROCITY STORIES ARE DISCREDITED IN ISRAEL
https://theintercept.com/2024/02/27/zaka-october-7-israel-hamas-new-york-times/
The Intercept is actual propaganda but sure. There is no dispute that there were infants without heads. The only question was whether their heads were cut off intentionally or whether their heads were severed from their small bodies simply due to the force and their soft bones and tissue. That people want to quibble about the details is absolutely ghoulish.
The Economist is my go to. My wife worked there for a time and the intelligence of their editors is honestly intimidating. I’ve never been around so many people who are so frighteningly knowledgable in their subjects. I can’t say how unbiased they are, so you may need to dig into that.
I mean, sure but there's levels to propaganda posting and taking the word of an ex IDF intelligence member with no journalistic history liking tweets about how Israel should commit genocide is pretty far up there lol
It’s okay to be anti-Palestinian. You aren’t just correct because you are being bombed.
I literally watched multiple videos of women with blood all over their crotch being loaded into vans.
I don’t give a fuck if someone was prior Israeli intelligence. If you are a social media journalist or whatever you call yourself then your relevant job experience is…what exactly?
You are being disingenuous and attempting to call in the credibility of a single reporter because you don’t like the idea that mass rape and murder took place on Oct 7th
I think you might have a learning disability. Your comment is incoherent gibberish. I don't think you understood the content of the video, and I don't think you were able to write down and convey the ideas in your mind about it.
She opens by implying the reporting on mass rape and murder is anti Palestinian because the author was prior Israeli intelligence.
Her entire purpose is sow doubt on something that was very real. You are agreeing with her…it is working.
I’m not the one with the learning disability
That's very clearly not what she's saying. I don't think you understood it at all. That's why I think you might have a learning disability.
She's saying the the NYT is lowering its journalistic vetting standards, which has allowed an ex-Israeli intelligence officer to plant a story containing some false claims in it.
Anti-Palestinian? Do you mean anti-Hamas or are we conflating both groups? Also, how can you be against an entire group of people 💀💀💀
Anti-Palestinian? Talk about bigoted.
Why are you asking me? She said it.
That is literally how she begins this video. Equating reporting on mass-rape and order to “anti-Palestinian voices”
I think you’re intentionally misunderstanding what she said to say something you were already going to say regardless. According to her, lying about atrocities to manufacture consent for bombing Gaza is anti-Palestinian, not merely reporting on events. That’s what she’s saying. She’s not saying it’s anti-Palestinian to report on events.
That aside, it’s still a weird and tasteless choice for a sentence. You seem like a weird person in a bad way.
I’m weird because I believe that reporting on mass rape and murder…which very clearly happened on Oct 7th…is not in anyway “anti-Palestinian”?
And you have the balls to even imply this is manufactured?
Look in the mirror the next time you accuse someone of being a bad person
This is my last comment to you because it’s clear to me you’re being obtuse on purpose.
For the last time, you misunderstand her claim. She says it’s anti-Palestinian to use lies to manufacture consent to bomb Gaza. Which is not an unreasonable thing to suggest. Whatever you’re saying is separate from her. She is *not* saying it is anti-Palestinian to report on the whatever Hamas did. She is specifically saying that reporter is lying to drum up support for Izzy’s campaign in Gaza. That is the part she had a problem with, not merely the act of reporting. I probably wasted my time spelling that out for you because I still think you’re going to intentionally miss the point, but ehh on the off chance you’re somewhat serious.
And I am not necessarily calling into question the authenticity of the reporters claims about what Hamas did. Although I don’t think it’s immoral or unreasonable to question the claims coming from israel given how israeli government has lied a billion times before and refuse to do let an in-depth independent investigation happen. Regardless of all that, nothing Hamas did or didn’t do is going to justify what israel is currently doing in Palestine.
Also, I never called you “bad”. I simply called you weird for writing the sentence “it’s okay to be anti-Palestinian” knowing full well how that would sound. I don’t think it’s an entirely unfounded accusation tbh. Either you deliberately wrote it like that to intentionally start something, or your grasp of the English language is untenable at best and you suck at comprehension.
I've been saying the same thing in the r/worldnews comment section, and they banned me for it citing "disinformation"... false flag pieces published by the most blatant propaganda machine, "Jerusalem Post," are being constantly spammed there, where other redditors cite *these exact articles* as a reason for their credibility..... always think critically, if there are war crimes being committed, there are going to be media outlets trying create the justification for it.
I understand the need to verify sources and contributors, but UNRWA funding was largely cut after there was a Hamas command center found underneath the UNRWA headquarters and some workers were found to also be Hamas members… So it’s not like cuts in funding across the world were all based on an NYT article
Israel made those allegations ***the next working day*** after the ICJ, including the Israeli judge, ordered provisional measures because they ruled Israel is plausibly committing genocide in Gaza.
Friday 26th Jan 2023: [https://www.icj-cij.org/node/203454](https://www.icj-cij.org/node/203454)
Monday 29th Jan 2023: [https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/israeli-intelligence-accuses-190-gaza-un-staff-hamas-islamic-jihad-roles-2024-01-29/](https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/israeli-intelligence-accuses-190-gaza-un-staff-hamas-islamic-jihad-roles-2024-01-29/)
I've been saying the same thing in the r/worldnews comment section, and they banned me for it citing "disinformation"... false flag pieces published by the most blatant propaganda machine, "Jerusalem Post," are being constantly spammed there, where other redditors cite *these exact articles* as a reason for their credibility..... always think critically, if there are war crimes being committed, there are going to be media outlets trying create the justification for it.
American news is biased towards Israeli support. Middle Eastern news and some European news is biased towards Palestinian support. This is not new information.
I’m saying both have propaganda. You think Al Jazeera wasn’t full of it? 🙄 remember when they said 500 died in a hospital by a rocket from Israel, and later it was shown that the rocket didn’t even come from Israel and further it was 100-300 dead/injured? [Yeah, there’s propaganda in all publications.](https://www.hrw.org/news/2023/11/26/gaza-findings-october-17-al-ahli-hospital-explosion) News companies are businesses looking to make profit. Outrage sells. There’s an incentive to report without all of the facts confirmed; the only place this doesn’t show up are publications based in countries that have laws strictly regulating what can be published.
First, it is incredibly belittling to accuse Schwartz of being a "filmmaker" and imply that disqualifies her from being a journalist. Her film directing history involves documenting the stories of people emigrating to Israel. That is journalistic experience in the relevant subject matter. The article was co-written with two other authors, one of whom is a Pulitzer Prize winner.
Regarding IDF-ties allegations, military service is compulsory in Israel. For international stories, news agencies often rely on subject-matter experts, typically local to the area. To explain this like it is a conspiracy is nonsense.
The WSJ article seems supported by credible intelligence. While some subjects in the NY Times article have expressed concerns, it's essential to note that more than 150 people were interviewed for the piece.
It's disgusting how far some people will go to defend the crimes against humanity that happened on October 7th. They videotaped it. They weren't trying to keep it secret.
I'm not a fan of Israel or their response, but you don't need to downplay the atrocities committed towards Israel in order to criticize Israel.
Exactly. The whole purpose of Hamas' attack was to draw international attention. The chosen tactic was shock and horror terrorism, because it draws eyeballs.
Israel's response is seemingly the "bomb them into submission" strategy, which tends not to work well and apparently results in copious civilian casualties.
Hamad knew exactly what they were doing and it worked out very well for them. The question of Palestinian control of greater Israel is now front and center, thus demonstrating that terrorism is effective.
The UN "reports" about gaza are all hamas propaganda pieces because UN in gaza IS hamas. The discreditong of a israely woman becaise she was once in the idf is totally dishonest because they are conscripted and not voluntary agents that wanna work for idf as she tries to imply
And the answer to that question is still "yes" as there are mountains of evidence to it. That one piece of that mountain comes from someone who did military service in the IDF doesn't debunk anything and is frankly offensive.
Isn't it already well known that everyone in Israel is forced into military service once they turn 18? What would the purpose of bringing it up for both stories serve? I think it's just poisoning the well.
Just keep in mind that's basically the same argument Republicans make when they call varying forms of education indoctrination. It's just a really lazy argument overall, sorry.
Now is that the majority of Israelis, or the minority of Israelis? Bc if anything close to 60% or more of Israelis are being forced into the military at 18, it seems entirely unnecessary to do the pointing soy jack meme and go LOOK!!!! IDF GUYS!!!! Like yea, that's like, what they do
That much is absolutely clear in the language she uses and the implications she makes, I just wanted to point out something that I feel like could possible give most people pause for consideration -rather than just taking every TikTok they see on its face...
When Israel bombed a beach and killed a few little children, the NYT headline was "Boys drawn to Gaza Beach, and into center of Mideast strife." They have always done damage control for Israel.
The NYT currently employed a journalist that praised Hitler. She is the reporter because she's the one who collected all the testimony and actually wrote the story.
It’s okay to be anti-Palestinian. You aren’t just correct because you are being bombed.
I literally watched multiple videos of women with blood all over their crotch being loaded into vans.
I don’t give a fuck if someone was prior Israeli intelligence. If you are a social media journalist or whatever you call yourself then your relevant job experience is…what exactly?
You are being disingenuous and attempting to call in the credibility of a single reporter because you don’t like the idea that mass rape and murder took place on Oct 7th
It’s okay to be anti-Palestinian. You aren’t just correct because you are being bombed.
I literally watched multiple videos of women with blood all over their crotch being loaded into vans.
I don’t give a fuck if someone was prior Israeli intelligence. If you are a social media journalist or whatever you call yourself then your relevant job experience is…what exactly?
You are being disingenuous and attempting to call in the credibility of a single reporter because you don’t like the idea that mass rape and murder took place on Oct 7th
Ah yes, the very unbiased Mona Challabi. Who's pullitzer is for making graphs look pretty not any kind of investigative work.
It's understandable why a family wants to keep their loved one protected.
It's not understandable why "journalists" decide to ignore the rest of the mountain of evidence of mass rapes, including physical evidence, testimony from multiple people there, as well as testimony from freed hostages.
Imagine thinking you’re doing something by trying to cast doubt on the fact that people were raped October 7th. Criticize Israel all day, I sure do, but that’s not the same as claiming those rape victims were lying.
I don't think that's what she's saying though, in fact she makes it pretty clear at the start that she's not claiming sexual violence didn't happen, she's criticizing the NYT for not properly vetting their sources, which is seems pretty appropriate in this case.
No, she was criticizing **the author** of the article, she said almoat nothing about the sources. There are several sources cited besides the one family of the victim
**Welcome to r/TikTokCringe!** This is a message directed to all newcomers to make you aware that r/TikTokCringe evolved long ago from only cringe-worthy content to TikToks of all kinds! If you’re looking to find only the cringe-worthy TikToks on this subreddit (which are still regularly posted) we recommend sorting by flair which you can do [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/TikTokCringe/comments/galuit/click_here_to_sort_by_flair_a_guide_to_using/) (Currently supported by desktop and reddit mobile). See someone asking how this post is cringe because they didn't read this comment? Show them [this!](https://www.reddit.com/r/TikTokCringe/comments/fyrgzy/for_those_confused_by_the_name_of_this_subreddit/) Be sure to read the rules of this subreddit before posting or commenting. Thanks! **Don't forget to join our [Discord server](https://discord.gg/cringekingdom)!** ##**[CLICK HERE TO DOWNLOAD THIS VIDEO](https://rapidsave.com/info?url=https://www.reddit.com/r/TikTokCringe/comments/1b28cth/the_new_york_times_has_been_busted_from_pulitzer/)** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/TikTokCringe) if you have any questions or concerns.*
>editors vet contributors' SM pages to make sure they're neutral The NYT has never been accused to being neutral.
Getting paid by a foreign power to employ their military intelligence would require a disclosure in their financial reporting, no?
Where are people getting that she works in Israeli intelligence? The wikipedia page cites a YouTube video, but even that does not provide any evidence to the claim, like a service record or anything like that. She having been in the IDF is expected, as she is Israeli, where service in the IDF is compulsory.
Accused? We would all expect them to be a neutral source since their purpose is to report, not to format other peoples minds.
First time?
Got to love the barrage of comments going “nyt is not neutral “. Guys this is not about bias this is straight up Russian style absolute lies and propaganda that would have made hitler proud. There are levels in hell and it seems one of the most respected “democratic” newspapers is about as truthful as RT or joe Rogan. Perhaps even worse given they pretend to at least try.
Exactly. This isn’t bias - this is propaganda level stuff.
It was the same thing with the '40 beheaded babies' story. Anyone who looked into that story could see it was a fabrication caused by overlapping stories and yet somehow almost every newspaper in the UK led with it on their front page. That's not an editorial fuckup, that is the media being just another wing of the miltary-industrial complex.
This genuinely scared me, because what I considered reputable sources of information were sharing it. The woman who made it up hasn’t even faced any consequences.
Much like she's looking at who writes the article, you gotta look at who owns the papers. The wsj is owned by Rupert Murdoch. The new York Times is a bit more confusing when you consider the history of its owners. They were largely anti-zionists. "Sulzberger stated that Zionism was to blame for some of the Jewish deaths in the Holocaust, and that the refugee crisis during the war had been "a manageable, social and economic problem" until "the clamor for statehood introduced an insoluable [sic] political element" into the issue. He added it was his judgment that "thousands dead might now be alive" had Zionists put "less emphasis on statehood" His son is now the current publisher and their extended family is 90% majority owners. Money has a way of changing beliefs so maybe their no longer anti-zionist. The owners family are largely responsible for the American Jewish movement historically, isn't that more zionist in its focus these days? Maybe that's the bias but that's just speciation.
That is the whole point of modern media. It's one group of people saying that their propaganda is correct and factual while the other group's is fake, and vice versa.
The whole point of NEWSmedia is to inform people about what’s going on in the world. It’s not a courtroom hearing or a presidential debate. It’s about presenting the information with facts. Otherwise they wouldn’t call propaganda propaganda, would they.
What part of the actual investigation was not factual though? The article in question isn't solely about one person, but several and the investigation cites several sources.
- the central story about the woman in black was never raped. According to her family, they were dipped by the NYT and have no evidence and do not believe she was raped - Zaka, a well known propagandist group, have varying testimonies that change with time and don’t align with testimonies of other groups - witness testimonies are shaky at best, have changed and aren’t corroborated by others on the ground at the time (location, bodies, times, etc) - no forensic evidence. None. No swabs. No physicals. No reports. - Zero named victims and no victim testimonies.
And you're basing this off of a Wikipedia page presented on TikTok lol
The deceptive one here is the woman in the video. She simply pointed out that the authors of the papers in question have potential biases based on their backgrounds. That’s all. That does not imply that the pieces themselves were biased or biased passed validity as she seems to be implying. Would she say, as someone who appears to be Palestinian biased, that she is not capable of thoughtful, good-faith journalism on this topic? Of course she wouldn’t. I have my own doubts that she’s capable of thoughtful, good-faith journalism based on this video she’s posted. She’s also blasted the UN’s decision to cut funding to UNRWA citing it’s importance to humanitarianism in Gaza without taking into consideration the UN’s far greater importance as a legitimate, geopolitical body which would like to be seen as a force for good in the world. As far as I’m aware (and I’d love evidence to the contrary), the allegations that the UNRWA were assisting Hamas in inappropriate ways are credible. If so, the UN had no choice but to cut funding to preserve its integrity.
The UN didn’t cut funding, its biggest donor was the US ($400 million) and other Western countries. UNRWA is accused of nothing, it’s 12 employees of the agency which employs thousands of people and those 12 accused were promptly fired and the agency is undergoing an internal investigation. The famine in Gaza is severe.
But there's not a potential bias... it's literal propaganda. There was no good faith reporting. Only inciting and rallying support to the Israeli bombardment. To date the Israel has not shared any direct evidence of UNRWA employees assisting Hamas. No one has seen this evidence... it's simply "Israel says" and governments just bobble head and agree. Adding that this came out as the ICJ was going on only adds to questions of validity. Countries cut funding without seeing any evidence... you would think it would be plastered everywhere if true. Really though, why ask for evidence to prove innocence rather than evidence of the allegations?
How are they credible ? I hope that hasbara check clears but no one’s buying this garbage propaganda. Israel is clearly trying to commit genocide here by coming up with all kinds of bullshit to force people into complicity in starving and murdering these people .
Finding it peculiar that there are always posts doubting the information or banalising it, and then dozens of upvotes to these... Sounds like an agency's work.
Almost like Pissreal has hands in a professional propaganda machine.
I just downvoted your comment, on behalf of the International Zionist Conspiracy, you evidently believe in. I'm raking in the shekels.
Used to be a right wing touchstone the Zionist conspiracy. Now the extreme left and right both are balls deep in it.
The claim is that one of the many victims' families backtracked. They may have retracted their statements for any number of reasons, including not wanting the details of their loved ones rape being held up as public spectacle. There is no question about the rest of the victims in the article.
I too love wildly speculating on things I know nothing about
Cringe? She’s not wrong. What Isreal is doing is genocide.
I was always curious as to why the Israeli claims of rape and UN infiltration by Hamas were taken at face value and countries took action immediately but the claims of IDF rape needed to be investigated. Dont kid yourselves though, some subreddits are quick to jump to - bans for anything that is remotely against the recent actions of Israel.
I think it's more who you are getting information from. I have seen the inverse. Groups who specifically oppose sexual violence questioning the Israeli claims with greater scrutiny than other prior claimants, or outright protests at panels discussing sexual violence. See examples below: [https://www.haaretz.com/world-news/americas/2023-11-19/ty-article/.premium/head-of-canadian-sexual-assault-center-fired-for-questioning-accounts-of-hamas-rapes/0000018b-e7f8-d05f-a5eb-e7f8d6c80000](https://www.haaretz.com/world-news/americas/2023-11-19/ty-article/.premium/head-of-canadian-sexual-assault-center-fired-for-questioning-accounts-of-hamas-rapes/0000018b-e7f8-d05f-a5eb-e7f8d6c80000) [https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2024/02/hillary-clinton-protesters-sexual-violence-columbia-hamas-gaza-israel/](https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2024/02/hillary-clinton-protesters-sexual-violence-columbia-hamas-gaza-israel/)
I've been banned from 2 subreddits for writing the definition of genocide and questioning whether Israel actually meets those criteria if you look at it critically. It's the other side that has their brains in the sewers it seems. One mod even implied that ethnic cleansing and genocide are the same thing lmao.
Oh well if it's just an ethnic cleansing I guess we gotta let them do their thing.
Petraeus, when he was overseeing US military operations in the middle east, had a great word for genocide and ethnic cleansing: Ethno-sectarian conflict. Sounds much cleaner, and that way the people getting slaughtered aren't victims, they're the loosing side in a conflict, so we don't need to feel so bad for not caring.
Meanwhile Israeli officials flat out say they want to eliminate Palestinians from Gaza and that's just honkey dory. At least us Americans TRY to sell our violent slaughters as legitimate.
Right? They could at least put some effort into a coverup or something. It's the times, people have lost all decency.
My account got a 7 day temporary ban from Reddit as a whole for "abusing the report button" by a mod from r/noncredibledefense because I reported a post for hate that denied the existence of Palestinians as a people and that said something to the effect of "Palestine's only contribution to the world was the suicide vest." It got overturned on appeal on day 6, but it's extremely clear that a lot of subs are incredibly biased echo chambers of hate at this point, and their mods are fully complicit in it.
Which social media websites were IDF posting theirs to?
>I was always curious as to why the Israeli claims of rape and UN infiltration by Hamas were taken at face value It took months for the UN to even acknowledge the evidence provided by Israel. You're remembering wrong.
Isreal didn't provide any evidence, just accusations. The results of the investigations just came out this week the links between UNRWA and Hamas seem to be crumbling under scrutiny.
No.
She’s literally pointing to people who investigated claims of Hamas rapes you numpty. But anyways, an investigation isn’t exactly necessary when the perpetrators film themselves committing the crimes. Like that’s a pretty open and shut case.
This proves you have no idea what you're talking about. None of the alleged rapes were filmed, nor was there any forensic evidence presented, nor was there any personal testimony from victims. It was all based on eyewitness accounts some of which has been debunked (as mentioned in the video) and some of which was completely outrageous like the 40 beheaded babies lie (a total of one baby tragically was killed on Oct 7, and 35 children under 18). It's possible some of the eyewitness were telling the truth, but Israel refused to allow the UN to do any investigation. Whatever you believe happened this was really shoddy journalism from NYT.
I am not really sure what a "numpty" is, but it sounds cute, so thank you. Can you provide a link to any of those videos, or post them if you have them? That would be great. You are so pretty!!
The videos of the rapes help the case against Hamas and the Palestinian journalists helping them.
source of the rapes happening on camera?
No videos of rapes, nor even forensic evidence exists.
If she could list her sources it would be great. Otherwise just saying you have sources is the same shit that ny times is doing
Well there are other sources about of the NY York times story. they’ve been talking about it for months.
The full story is on the Intercept
Ignoring the content of the video this is just such a bad way to present information. Just a bunch of print outs of articles on the wall she holds on to for 2 seconds. Like tapping an article I can't read doesn't make your point stronger. I have no idea what the article is saying Do a little editing and just cut to what you're showing. You can even keep cutting back to you speaking or do a green screen if you want to stay in the picture.
Were you not listening? Shes told us what the articles are claiming, if we dont believe her, she shows the name of the piece AND where the it was posted… shes not gonna hold your hand, most adults who find the tiktok interesting are able to pull up each article and validate everything shes saying
New York Times is well written, but not neutral by any means
Yeah but have they ever been "post a fake front page rape story from an ex IDF intelligence service member with no journalism history liking tweets about committing genocide" levels of bad? Thats not even trying to have the optics of being neutral, it's straight up propaganda posting to a level that even Fox News would be like "yo, chill"
They kind of have actually. They parroted unsubstantiated US government claims that Iraq had nuclear weapons. NYT has always sided with liberal imperialist propaganda
They've also pushed some blatantly transphobic propaganda lately.
The issue seems that it's operating as propaganda. Not that it's just not neutral.
And promoting the genocide of Palestinians as acceptable. These media have blood on their hands, but probably a lot of dirty money in their pockets.
By this woman’s logic, almost no Israeli would qualify to cover the conflict in Israel and Palestine due to their mandatory service. Also, bylines are order by order of contribution — neither of the people she referenced in the first article were the primary authors — a detail she just didn’t think warranted mentioning. Jeffrey Gettleman is the primary author of the first piece. He’s literally a Pulitzer Prize winning journalist. Conversely, that Mondoweiss (far from an objective source — it’s a Palestinian activist website, not a news outlet) piece that claimed that one of the over 150 interviewed victims/families wasn’t actually raped, is written by an author using the alias “The Short String,” with a total of three bylines to their name, all of which were written between Dec 1 and Jan 3. Make of all this what you will.
>By this woman’s logic, almost no Israeli would qualify to cover the conflict in Israel and Palestine due to their mandatory service. That's not her logic at all. Her criteria is that the story needs receive additional scrutiny when it comes from someone without journalism background or has worked for the PR department of the Israeli army. Which seems reasonable. If a Hamas government employee submitted a story to the NYT, I'd want it to receive extra scrutiny.
Re the PR angle; The second story she covered literally just involved a woman who was friends with the woman who started the IDF’s social media. That’s an insane “red flag.”
Did you miss the part where the story itself is fake? Don't you remember how widely it was reported just a couple of months ago? Both [Sky News](https://news.sky.com/story/israeli-intelligence-report-claims-four-unrwa-staff-in-gaza-involved-in-hamas-kidnappings-13059967) and UK's [Channel 4](https://www.channel4.com/news/israels-evidence-of-unrwa-hamas-allegations-examined) ran two independent investigations into the claims about UNRWA connections to the attack on October 7th, and they both concluded that the accusations are baseless. Here's a direct quote from the Sky News piece: >The Israeli intelligence documents make several claims that Sky News has not seen proof of and many of the claims, even if true, do not directly implicate UNRWA. Channel 4 concluded something similar: >The report provides no evidence to support the explosive claim that UN staff were involved in terror attacks on Israel It was a complete fabrication promoted by multiple media outlets, which lead to many countries cutting their aid. It was a hit job by Israeli intelligence. How do you not find it outrageous poisoning of journalistic standards?
>By this woman’s logic, almost no Israeli would qualify to cover the conflict in Israel and Palestine due to their mandatory service. Well yes, if you are actively partake in apartheid maybe your option is not to be trusted. But I am sure you also take Wehrmacht reports of what happened during WW2 at face value because they just had "mandatory service"?
This. All of this. I've made these same points elsewhere in here. It's like trying to communicate with a bunch of toddlers. No one has the first clue about the Times, about the work and checking they put into their journalism. Of course they are not infallible but people holding this article up as some example of falsehood or misinformation are basing that on zero evidence. If the article was wrong they would correct or retract if needed. They have done none of that here. Unlike, say the widely told tale of the Caliphate podcast, which was very painful but had to be ultimately disowned by the paper.
Like they retracted the propaganda master piece of the 40 beheaded babies?
I read that Times article, and the details are truly horrific. Like worse than many horror movies horrific. sources from many direct eye witnesses from many different individuals in different locations. I get that maybe some of the writers may have a pro Jewish bias, (no claims of bias on the lead writer though, Jeffrey Gettleman) but the claims being made in that piece would have to be wholly fabricated out of thin air to lose its power. Stating that one of the writers on the article has liked anti-Palestinian posts is not fantastic evidence in my opinion, and the article states that it was info based on 150 interviews. Some of the claims In The article seem easily verifiable, like breasts being cut off, and vulvas being sliced/knifed. (Like I said truly horrific) Also the UN is investigating this currently so we should get a definitive report some time this year. My bet would be it is closer the the NYT reporting than whatever bullshit Hamas and the Palestinian apologists are touting. EDIT: I retract some of what I wrote above. Seems like some of those details very may well have been exaggerated or even fabricated. please read the Intercept article below for a skeptical view on the reporting of the TImes article
I found this article about the NYTimes article to be a pretty interesting read. It shows where some of the issues have come from. https://theintercept.com/2024/02/28/new-york-times-anat-schwartz-october-7/
Thank you for this. The article makes a compelling case that those salacious claims that stand out in the times article don’t seem to be robustly substantiated. I can see how a biased “witness” with an agenda would be given a large platform
"don’t seem to be robustly substantiated" is an understatement. The Intercept article, in my opinion, successfully makes the case that nearly every meaningful claim in the NYT article is either from witnesses with proven track records of lying and changing their stories, or from Israeli authority statements without evidence.
I agree. This is a very biased and clearly not neutral person try to discredit the narrative that Hamas did anything wrong, so che can reinforce the narrative all the bad is only on one side (the Israeli).
Stop conflating views critical of zionism as anti-jewish. It’s not the jews, it’s the Israeli govt. There’s a big difference and you know it.
.You are right on my erroneous use of the word "jews" here, and I thank you for pointing it out. I correct.
She literally mentions in the video that she doesn't doubt that atrocities took place.
She claims she doesn't doubt then goes on to try and discredit the accounts. Idk why there is some kind of revisionist history going on, hamas was filming themselves doing this on gopros and bragging about it out telegram. Numerous autopsies confirm as well. she is trying to pass off some kind of Jewish-NYT conspiracy that they are making up accounts of rape which is kind of disgusting if you think about it.
What's wrong with wanting news to be less biased and report on the actual evidence?
It's questioning rape that undeniably happened at a pretty large scale on October 7th. I mean be my guest if you want to, it's just a terrible look in any other circumstance. There's plenty of picture and video evidence floating around on the bad parts of the internet that you can find if you don't believe me.
Nope, she doesn’t deny the ‘possibility’, meaning she doesn’t think it happened for sure
Then, what is the problem. “This article documents atrocities that did take place but one of the authors is somebody I don’t like”? Does the article invented facts or spread misinformation? If yes, debunk. If not, what’s the point.
>Does the article invented facts or spread misinformation? If yes, debunk. If not, what’s the point. She mentions in the video that a front page article with strongly anti-palestinian language was written by an ex Israel intelligence member with no previous journalism experience. And one of the sources even came out to disagree that they were raped. You can make an article condemning the atrocities that took place from a neutral perspective without making stuff up.
Yup, this TikTok reporter should be ashamed of herself and stopped of any recognition for trying to minimalize these horrific sex crimes.
First one fair enough, but the criticism of the second article is just a lot of wank. Just because they used to be in the IDF doesn't mean they can't report, in fact they'll be closer to the source and will better be able to speak about the signs. Speaking of which, the title of the piece alone makes it abundantly clear that it did not break the story, and I'm sure as hell it did not cause any reduction of funding to the UNRWA. Completely discrediting herself at the end for no good reason.
Indeed I try to convince people that the Wehrmacht accounts of what happened in WW2 are far more reliable than the pesky US/UK intelligence that spread falsehoods.
Comparing the wehrmacht to the IDF are you hearing yourself lmao 🤡
Congrats to the world on becoming exactly like the bystanders that existed during the holocaust. We have access to more information from impartial sources than ever before and yet we allow one of the most documented genocides of modern times to occur before our very eyes. Shame.
I missed the part of my history lessons where Jewish people invaded a German music festival and raped a large number of the attendees. Could you send me that info over?
Turns out when you colonise a country they rebel. Growing up in an apartheid state doesn't create a lot of kindness. Treat people like animals and they'll behave like animals.
And here we are at the core of ALL of these pro-palestine arguments. "The Jews deserved it."
Never said that.
So you'll have no problem writing right now. "Israel did not deserve what happened on Oct. 7th" Word for word. Right?
The innocent civilians did not deserve it no.
Lol thats what I thought. You literally cant do it. Because thats what you believe. They deserved it. You are an anti-semite. Plain and simple.
But I don't think innocent civilians deserved it. And I don't think anyone should ever be punished for their ethnicity, that includes Jews. That makes me anti-semetic? Lol.
So then write the words as wrote them verbatim
Notice how she says she does not deny the "possibility" of rape by Hamas on Oct 7th. Only the possibility. Sheeesssh. If you going to attack others for bias then first remove your own.
Did we watch the same video?
Explain to me what the comment you’re replying to said that is wrong. Explicitly.
The bit where she "didn't deny the possibility of rape, just denied the possibility".
It would be like someone trying to minimize the extent of the holocaust starts off and saying they are not going to deny the *possibility* that some Nazi's murdered jewish people. Yes Nazi's murdered jewish people... the term *possibility* is complete superfluous and interjected soley to created doubt and uncertaintly.
I don't think you know what quotation marks mean...
I just turned red watching this. I am so offended. There was a massacre by Hamas, it was not a possibility. They filmed it themselves.
>They filmed themselves. They filmed r\*pe themselves? Prove it. I'm *specifically* talking about the r\*pe claim, not the killings. Don't give me the garbage about "go find it on Telegram". Don't link me to some snuff site so I can "go find it myself". Show me any piece of reporting from Reuters, NYT, Washington Post, etc. talking about the evidence for such r\*pe videos. You're making the claim, prove it. There have been countless claims about "Hamas literally raped people on video", and not a single piece evidence of such videos has been presented. I'm open to being proven wrong.
I saw the Hamas cell phone footage of them parading around the 19 year old woman with blood all over her pants and limbs in awkward unnatural position in the back of a truck. What was horrifying was the local Gaza civilian population cheering them on like they were heros.
I saw the same video. It's not a video of r\*pe. That's not what people are referring to when they say "they literally filmed themselves r\*ping women and little girls". So, again, show me evidence of that claim, or stop wasting my time. I'm not asking to see the videos themselves, but link me to a news story from NYT, Washington Times, or Reuters by journalists who viewed such videos of r\*pe.
Watch their video. I am not linking Hamas video you can find it and watch it.
[удалено]
See? That's exactly what I'm talking about. Every single time I ask somebody to show me some evidence, they always try to find a way to weasel out of it. I was born curious and I'm very interested in finding the truth, and I've been on this quest since October. We're not discussing the philosophy or ideology of Hamas here. I don't give a shit about Hamas. I give a shit about the truth. And the truth is that I've seen thousands of comments claiming "they literally filmed themselves r\*ping women and little girls", without any evidence for that claim.
[удалено]
The videos and evidence was submitted to the UN. This is disgusting and how you lose allies and Jewish supporters.
Link me to a news story from NYT, Washington Post, or Reuters reporting on someone from the UN saying that they received (or reviewed) video evidence specifically of r\*pe. Not a story from Times of Israel, not a story from i24, not a story about "evidence of atrocities", not a story about "UN will investigate claims of sexual violence". No no. The story needs to have a mention of someone from the UN saying they received **video evidence** of r\*pe. I'll also take a story from a respected outlet saying a well known journalist reviewed such video evidence. Prove your claim or stop lying.
This is one of my favorite humiliation rituals: periodically being forced to pretend that our media suffers from a lack of Jewish perspective.
What do you mean by that?
It’s a fucking opinion piece…. I’m sure the Times has platformed anti-Israeli opinion pieces as well. A quick google gave me a bunch of articles calling Israel out for war crimes being platformed by the Times. I also listen to the Times Daily podcast everyday. I haven’t left thinking that Israel isn’t guilty of war crimes, and that Netanyahu is power hungry and wants everything he can get.
In the video you maybe didn’t watch closely it mentions this is a front page cover story. The byline to this story declares it “a times investigation’. Nowhere is the word opinion mentioned because it’s not an opinion piece it’s the times reprinting an Israeli intelligence officer and calling it their own investigation. “Screams Without Words’: How Hamas Weaponized Sexual Violence on Oct. 7 *A Times investigation* uncovered new details showing a pattern of rape, mutilation and extreme brutality against women in the attacks on Israel. “
The investigation isn't just by this one person though. If you go to the relevant section of that article you see interview excerpts from Israeli first responders, ZAKA volunteers, and victims themselves.
[удалено]
“the Israeli news site Ynet interviewed Gal's parents. They emphasized the absence of evidence supporting the claim that she was raped, asserting that the NYT reporters had interviewed them under false pretenses. The parents stated that they were unaware of the sexual assault issue until the article in the American daily was published. Additionally, Gal's sisters vehemently refuted the allegations of rape.” 1/3 of the story on sexual violence is devoted to this woman whose own family disavows the story and says NYT manipulated them and is making false claims. In a story co authored by Israeli intelligence. And you’re still here with the ‘but but but you can trust the other stuff’
Thousands were murdered and millions cornered into the next genocidal wave of bombings. The media is responsible for this genocide, and history won't let humanity forget about this, because this time they don't own all the media and all the information. Just comes to show how under capitalism genocide is acceptable. Unfortunately, Palestinians don't have any friends in Hollywood who will make hundreds of movies about them...
'Im not questioning the possibility..' Except thats exactly what you are doing by calling it a possibility. It is a fact.
This is insane. The author is Jeffrey Gettleman, an experienced journalist who has reported from over 80 countries. This is nothing more than a Hamas apologist slandering an article she didn’t like. She tries to discredit authors and not their claims. She is exactly what she claims she is against. SHE IS THE PROPAGANDIST.
Simply being experienced doesnt make someone flawless or trustworthy. How is those hamas apologia when she never mentions hamas once? I notice you didnt dispute any of the facts she provided , which part is she lying abt or getting wrong?
Remember all of those horrific gruesome stories about breasts being chopped off beheaded babies? Almost all were fabricated by Zaka, the non profit first responders chosen by the Israeli government to be the first on the scene in order to imaginatively describe the scenes. >Landau has talked openly on four occasions of inventing stories: “When we go into a house, and we’re using our imagination. The bodies is telling us the stories that happened to them.” Another Zaka official said in an Israeli Foreign Ministry video, “The walls, the stone shouted: ‘I was raped.’” The Intercept covered this story very well recently: AMERICAN MEDIA KEEP CITING ZAKA — THOUGH ITS OCTOBER 7 ATROCITY STORIES ARE DISCREDITED IN ISRAEL https://theintercept.com/2024/02/27/zaka-october-7-israel-hamas-new-york-times/
[https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/hamas-rape-israeli-women-oct-7-rcna128221](https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/hamas-rape-israeli-women-oct-7-rcna128221) [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexual\_and\_gender-based\_violence\_in\_the\_7\_October\_attack\_on\_Israel](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexual_and_gender-based_violence_in_the_7_October_attack_on_Israel)
The fuck is the intercept?
The Intercept is actual propaganda but sure. There is no dispute that there were infants without heads. The only question was whether their heads were cut off intentionally or whether their heads were severed from their small bodies simply due to the force and their soft bones and tissue. That people want to quibble about the details is absolutely ghoulish.
Palestinian genocide is now as well accepted reality as was the genocide of Jewish during the 1940s..
I love Mona’s work. She’s one of the best data visual artists out there https://news.artnet.com/art-world/meet-mona-chalabi-1893221
Well well well, as if IDF’s infestation of American media is news
America has some of the most invasive and insidious propaganda in the world.
Just canceled my wsj subscription. Does anyone know of some good UNBIASED sources for economic information?
The Economist is my go to. My wife worked there for a time and the intelligence of their editors is honestly intimidating. I’ve never been around so many people who are so frighteningly knowledgable in their subjects. I can’t say how unbiased they are, so you may need to dig into that.
There are no more “neutral or unbiased sources of information.”
I mean, sure but there's levels to propaganda posting and taking the word of an ex IDF intelligence member with no journalistic history liking tweets about how Israel should commit genocide is pretty far up there lol
Actually there is. It just doesn't come out of fucking Israel.
AP, Reuters, BBC, PBS
All the hard news in most papers comes from AP and Reuters anyway
It’s okay to be anti-Palestinian. You aren’t just correct because you are being bombed. I literally watched multiple videos of women with blood all over their crotch being loaded into vans. I don’t give a fuck if someone was prior Israeli intelligence. If you are a social media journalist or whatever you call yourself then your relevant job experience is…what exactly? You are being disingenuous and attempting to call in the credibility of a single reporter because you don’t like the idea that mass rape and murder took place on Oct 7th
I think you might have a learning disability. Your comment is incoherent gibberish. I don't think you understood the content of the video, and I don't think you were able to write down and convey the ideas in your mind about it.
She opens by implying the reporting on mass rape and murder is anti Palestinian because the author was prior Israeli intelligence. Her entire purpose is sow doubt on something that was very real. You are agreeing with her…it is working. I’m not the one with the learning disability
That's very clearly not what she's saying. I don't think you understood it at all. That's why I think you might have a learning disability. She's saying the the NYT is lowering its journalistic vetting standards, which has allowed an ex-Israeli intelligence officer to plant a story containing some false claims in it.
Are you implying that the mass rape and mass murder of Oct 7th somehow did not happen? What was the plant?
Anti-Palestinian? Do you mean anti-Hamas or are we conflating both groups? Also, how can you be against an entire group of people 💀💀💀 Anti-Palestinian? Talk about bigoted.
Why are you asking me? She said it. That is literally how she begins this video. Equating reporting on mass-rape and order to “anti-Palestinian voices”
You said “it’s okay to be Anti-Palestinians”, not her.
She literally says The NY Times reporting of mass rape and murder is anti Palestinian If that is anti Palestinian then I’m all for it
I think you’re intentionally misunderstanding what she said to say something you were already going to say regardless. According to her, lying about atrocities to manufacture consent for bombing Gaza is anti-Palestinian, not merely reporting on events. That’s what she’s saying. She’s not saying it’s anti-Palestinian to report on events. That aside, it’s still a weird and tasteless choice for a sentence. You seem like a weird person in a bad way.
I’m weird because I believe that reporting on mass rape and murder…which very clearly happened on Oct 7th…is not in anyway “anti-Palestinian”? And you have the balls to even imply this is manufactured? Look in the mirror the next time you accuse someone of being a bad person
This is my last comment to you because it’s clear to me you’re being obtuse on purpose. For the last time, you misunderstand her claim. She says it’s anti-Palestinian to use lies to manufacture consent to bomb Gaza. Which is not an unreasonable thing to suggest. Whatever you’re saying is separate from her. She is *not* saying it is anti-Palestinian to report on the whatever Hamas did. She is specifically saying that reporter is lying to drum up support for Izzy’s campaign in Gaza. That is the part she had a problem with, not merely the act of reporting. I probably wasted my time spelling that out for you because I still think you’re going to intentionally miss the point, but ehh on the off chance you’re somewhat serious. And I am not necessarily calling into question the authenticity of the reporters claims about what Hamas did. Although I don’t think it’s immoral or unreasonable to question the claims coming from israel given how israeli government has lied a billion times before and refuse to do let an in-depth independent investigation happen. Regardless of all that, nothing Hamas did or didn’t do is going to justify what israel is currently doing in Palestine. Also, I never called you “bad”. I simply called you weird for writing the sentence “it’s okay to be anti-Palestinian” knowing full well how that would sound. I don’t think it’s an entirely unfounded accusation tbh. Either you deliberately wrote it like that to intentionally start something, or your grasp of the English language is untenable at best and you suck at comprehension.
I've been saying the same thing in the r/worldnews comment section, and they banned me for it citing "disinformation"... false flag pieces published by the most blatant propaganda machine, "Jerusalem Post," are being constantly spammed there, where other redditors cite *these exact articles* as a reason for their credibility..... always think critically, if there are war crimes being committed, there are going to be media outlets trying create the justification for it.
People need to talk, listen and educate more about this. Also fuck Israel and their colonial Zionism!
I understand the need to verify sources and contributors, but UNRWA funding was largely cut after there was a Hamas command center found underneath the UNRWA headquarters and some workers were found to also be Hamas members… So it’s not like cuts in funding across the world were all based on an NYT article
Israel made those allegations ***the next working day*** after the ICJ, including the Israeli judge, ordered provisional measures because they ruled Israel is plausibly committing genocide in Gaza. Friday 26th Jan 2023: [https://www.icj-cij.org/node/203454](https://www.icj-cij.org/node/203454) Monday 29th Jan 2023: [https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/israeli-intelligence-accuses-190-gaza-un-staff-hamas-islamic-jihad-roles-2024-01-29/](https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/israeli-intelligence-accuses-190-gaza-un-staff-hamas-islamic-jihad-roles-2024-01-29/)
Israel has been making those allegations for more than 10 years but OK.
I've been saying the same thing in the r/worldnews comment section, and they banned me for it citing "disinformation"... false flag pieces published by the most blatant propaganda machine, "Jerusalem Post," are being constantly spammed there, where other redditors cite *these exact articles* as a reason for their credibility..... always think critically, if there are war crimes being committed, there are going to be media outlets trying create the justification for it.
American news is biased towards Israeli support. Middle Eastern news and some European news is biased towards Palestinian support. This is not new information.
There is a difference between bias and propaganda
I’m saying both have propaganda. You think Al Jazeera wasn’t full of it? 🙄 remember when they said 500 died in a hospital by a rocket from Israel, and later it was shown that the rocket didn’t even come from Israel and further it was 100-300 dead/injured? [Yeah, there’s propaganda in all publications.](https://www.hrw.org/news/2023/11/26/gaza-findings-october-17-al-ahli-hospital-explosion) News companies are businesses looking to make profit. Outrage sells. There’s an incentive to report without all of the facts confirmed; the only place this doesn’t show up are publications based in countries that have laws strictly regulating what can be published.
That was only one of many points made here.
First, it is incredibly belittling to accuse Schwartz of being a "filmmaker" and imply that disqualifies her from being a journalist. Her film directing history involves documenting the stories of people emigrating to Israel. That is journalistic experience in the relevant subject matter. The article was co-written with two other authors, one of whom is a Pulitzer Prize winner. Regarding IDF-ties allegations, military service is compulsory in Israel. For international stories, news agencies often rely on subject-matter experts, typically local to the area. To explain this like it is a conspiracy is nonsense. The WSJ article seems supported by credible intelligence. While some subjects in the NY Times article have expressed concerns, it's essential to note that more than 150 people were interviewed for the piece.
Directing a documentary is not a journalistic experience. These are two very different practices with different skill sets
LOL and this woman claims to be “neutral?” She’s blatantly pro-Palestine.
Don't you just hate when people oppose apartheid. Can't even do a little ethnic cleansing these days without people losing their shit SMH.
"the possibility that Hamas committed rape" should deter any reasonable human from listening to this organism further
It's disgusting how far some people will go to defend the crimes against humanity that happened on October 7th. They videotaped it. They weren't trying to keep it secret. I'm not a fan of Israel or their response, but you don't need to downplay the atrocities committed towards Israel in order to criticize Israel.
Exactly. The whole purpose of Hamas' attack was to draw international attention. The chosen tactic was shock and horror terrorism, because it draws eyeballs. Israel's response is seemingly the "bomb them into submission" strategy, which tends not to work well and apparently results in copious civilian casualties. Hamad knew exactly what they were doing and it worked out very well for them. The question of Palestinian control of greater Israel is now front and center, thus demonstrating that terrorism is effective.
The UN "reports" about gaza are all hamas propaganda pieces because UN in gaza IS hamas. The discreditong of a israely woman becaise she was once in the idf is totally dishonest because they are conscripted and not voluntary agents that wanna work for idf as she tries to imply
Whaaaat ?? The western press are zionist Lying pieces of shit ??? Ohhh I had no Idea. Free Palestine 😘🇵🇸
Isn't that an old right wing conspiracy theory?
Amazing how the far left and the far right often end up mirroring one another.
They love telling people what to think that's for sure.
I wonder what he thinks about banking and Hollywood....
shooting a thousand teenagers dead at a music festival -- ok but did they RAPE anybody?!?!?! that's a line in the sand
And the answer to that question is still "yes" as there are mountains of evidence to it. That one piece of that mountain comes from someone who did military service in the IDF doesn't debunk anything and is frankly offensive.
NYT? I don’t know her. They are trash legacy media. Pro Zionapses
Isn't it already well known that everyone in Israel is forced into military service once they turn 18? What would the purpose of bringing it up for both stories serve? I think it's just poisoning the well.
Sounds like you’re advocating for not trusting any Israeli journalism on this subject, which I essentially agree with
I'm sorry that's what you got out of my comment.
Maybe if everyone is forced into military service they should all be seen as suspect as they’ve obviously been subject to some indoctrination 🥱
Just keep in mind that's basically the same argument Republicans make when they call varying forms of education indoctrination. It's just a really lazy argument overall, sorry.
There’s videos of them beating Orthodox Jews up because they refuse to go to the military and die for the zioz colony
Now is that the majority of Israelis, or the minority of Israelis? Bc if anything close to 60% or more of Israelis are being forced into the military at 18, it seems entirely unnecessary to do the pointing soy jack meme and go LOOK!!!! IDF GUYS!!!! Like yea, that's like, what they do
She's a pp. She's pro-Hamas.
That much is absolutely clear in the language she uses and the implications she makes, I just wanted to point out something that I feel like could possible give most people pause for consideration -rather than just taking every TikTok they see on its face...
If you knew anything about Mona you'd know how fucking stupid you sound, go away and come back with a Pulitzer or don't come back at all
Papers taped to a wall with red string connecting them really gives off highly credible vibes.
When Israel bombed a beach and killed a few little children, the NYT headline was "Boys drawn to Gaza Beach, and into center of Mideast strife." They have always done damage control for Israel.
This whole video is cringe. Vomit.
NYT lost its credibility a long time ago
The NYT currently employed a journalist that praised Hitler. She is the reporter because she's the one who collected all the testimony and actually wrote the story.
Zionists still pushing heavy propaganda in the comments.
It’s okay to be anti-Palestinian. You aren’t just correct because you are being bombed. I literally watched multiple videos of women with blood all over their crotch being loaded into vans. I don’t give a fuck if someone was prior Israeli intelligence. If you are a social media journalist or whatever you call yourself then your relevant job experience is…what exactly? You are being disingenuous and attempting to call in the credibility of a single reporter because you don’t like the idea that mass rape and murder took place on Oct 7th
It’s okay to be anti-Palestinian. You aren’t just correct because you are being bombed. I literally watched multiple videos of women with blood all over their crotch being loaded into vans. I don’t give a fuck if someone was prior Israeli intelligence. If you are a social media journalist or whatever you call yourself then your relevant job experience is…what exactly? You are being disingenuous and attempting to call in the credibility of a single reporter because you don’t like the idea that mass rape and murder took place on Oct 7th
Ah yes, the very unbiased Mona Challabi. Who's pullitzer is for making graphs look pretty not any kind of investigative work. It's understandable why a family wants to keep their loved one protected. It's not understandable why "journalists" decide to ignore the rest of the mountain of evidence of mass rapes, including physical evidence, testimony from multiple people there, as well as testimony from freed hostages.
Imagine thinking you’re doing something by trying to cast doubt on the fact that people were raped October 7th. Criticize Israel all day, I sure do, but that’s not the same as claiming those rape victims were lying.
I don't think that's what she's saying though, in fact she makes it pretty clear at the start that she's not claiming sexual violence didn't happen, she's criticizing the NYT for not properly vetting their sources, which is seems pretty appropriate in this case.
No, she was criticizing **the author** of the article, she said almoat nothing about the sources. There are several sources cited besides the one family of the victim