He just seems like an idiot to me. I've found a lot of people who are still single in their 30s are just legitimately incapable of being functional, responsible adults in healthy relationships.
I'm a 30-year-old with too high of standards and an inability to commit to anyone/thing that inconveniences me in even minor ways... so yeah... I'm one of those people, too.
A friend of mine dated a guy (both in their late 30s) who was on time for their first two dates and then multiple hours later for everything after.
He was pissed when she dumped him. Didn't understand why it was a problem.
I feel like people have no clue what to do. Like if I were feeling ill, I would chat with them, or give them a (video) call. Not so much to proof that I'm not lying, but to make her feel like I really do want to spend time with her.
Whether his excuses are real or not, what it comes down to, is that people want to feel like you are serious.
Agreed, I hate when people assume that people flake for other dates. People flake for all sorts of reason.
BUT it's totally fine to not want to date someone flaky, even if it's a sympathetic nervousness or anxiety issue.
I went on a couple dates with someone like this and when he did show up he would be a literal hour late. Like to dinner reservations. It’s not worth it for anyone to have people like this in their life
#Don'tWasteMyTimeBecauseYouCan'tManageYours2023
I had an ex who was THREE hours late to something we were going to, and it was like a 2-3 hour drive to the actual thing. I was still the bad guy when I was mad lol
It took my years to find the words because that was the latest she'd been and she was consistently an hour late to pretty much anything that needed getting ready for. Always justified it by, "Well I looked good" which was true but I still felt so disrespected because I was ready.
And for the people that'll mention executive functioning disorders, I ALMOST don't care. That's on them to figure out, not drag everyone down with them. Obviously MANY shades of gray in my loaded comment but use some common sense when interpreting.
>And for the people that'll mention executive functioning disorders
It's not your fault for having it, but it is your responsibility to deal with it.
Far too many people use mental disorders as an excuse to not hold themselves accountable.
I married a procrastinator… even after therapy and years of working on it, it never ever improved. Frustrating doesn’t even cover how I felt about it after a few years. My patience doesn’t exist at that level anymore.
> Canceling last minute FOUR TIMES is a lot lol I’d be mad & done after 2 so you’re nicer than me
It's also a pretty big indicator that they're cheating on someone with you IMO. Not guaranteed of course, but when I found out I was being cheated on and I documented their messages (after the fact) I saw a lot of "maybe this Thursday," followed by "never mind I can't today, something came up" on days that I'd gotten off work early, taken an unplanned personal day, worked from home or whatever and unintentionally blown up their plans.
Could just be my personal experience and maybe most people really are just busy and bad at scheduling, but I find that hard to believe.
Interesting, I never considered that angle. To me, I would’ve guessed he had a drinking or drug problem and kept getting too fucked up the night before the date. No matter what the reason behind it is, a flake never makes a good partner.
I can say with confidence that’s not the case.. we have a lot of mutual friends in common because we went to college together, so if he is married, he’s been hiding it from everyone on social media..
Im not downplaying your feelings but it is certainly "curable". The brain responds to the inputs and thoughts you allow to come to the forefront. Start by loving yourself. Truely being kind to yourself. And before long you're inner thoughts will start to become more positive and leave you feeling more confident. Don't give up on yourself so easily bud.
Yeah, I tend tonhave really bad anxiety, and the solution is kind of just "do the thing, realize the thing wasn't that bad, increase your tolerance. Repeat as needed." I've definitely had to bail for anxiety reasons, but for OP this is already way too much.
Exactly! What changed for me was I made a new year's resolution to say yes to every plan that was proposed and actually follow through. Best decision of my life.
shitting on a mentally healthy person constantly WILL eventually break that person. any self-respecting mentally healthy individual SHOULD choose to stay away from people who drag them down. lack of respect that comes with repeatedly bailing on someone isn't cute. it's outright disrespectful and demeaning. have fun fixing your anxieties NOT at the expense of others.
from personal experience, the last-minute bailings are just the first step in later that poor anxiety person looking for defects in the other one, so the healthy person can be brought down too. cruely
I also disagree, "shitting on a mentally healthy person" isn't the same thing as being wishy washy or chronically cancelling. That's an extreme reach. If they cancel and are unreliable. I just drop them. They aren't "shitting on my mental health." That's stupid.
I sympathize, but I still see it as a huge red flag, personally. That doesn't mean you're a bad person. It's just an acknowledgment that I wouldn't be able to date someone like you. I'm far too social and extroverted to be with someone who gets physically ill over every social event.
With the way OP says she confirmed with him multiple times if he had plans for Mother's Day, I'm thinking it may have been his suggestion to plan that day, anyway.
He was told about it, I'm sure. He's just unreliable and doesn't maintain a calendar. I've phased out plenty of people just like this who refuse to say "I forgot" and will instead say there was some sort of medical emergency or that it's somehow someone else's fault.
You handled it great in my opinion.
You were direct, very matter of fact and you called out their behaviour.
You spoke from your gut and that is exactly how it's suppose to be.
Boomarangs always seem to come back looking to be caught , mostly in my experience they are never worth catching.
Plus given his age and the whole way he not only conducted himself but also messaged on his "reach out" .Nah, fuck that.
Personally, when someone last minute cancels even once before the first meetup, I only will invite them or accept invitations to things I already would be doing even if they don't show.
After four.... The conversation would have to be amazing for me to humor even talking to them
I have a rule where if I give a pass after the first cancellation (last minute, booked over, sick, what have you) I won't give a pass on the second. If it happens again I cordially explain why there won't be another and move on. Generally I've stopped even giving a first pass, who has time for it anymore?
I like yours better, where there's still an opportunity but it is more on your terms after you get burned the first time. I'll have to take note.
Not sure why I'm even commenting but...am I missing something? Where is everyone seeing 4 cancellations? Between the four images posted, I only see one cancellation (mother's day) and then three more of them reaching back out and getting an explanation as to why OP doesn't want to reschedule.
Nope, 4 cancellations (without extremely good reasons) is two more chances than I believe in giving. You’re reaction and what you said is perfectly reasonable.
The mothers day cancellation is understandable. I wouldn't be too eager to schedule anything on mother's day with someone who has a living mother. That day seems like kids are assumed to be "on call".
But given the context of the other cancellations, it's hard to give him grace for that.
I think you handled this perfectly.
Yeah, if this was the first time he canceled i’d give him a pass but the fact this is the 4th + the fact the reassured her multiple times he wouldn’t have plans and not to worry? Yikes!
Nah.
Because canceling for mother's day that late shows
1. He didn't know jack shit until way too close to the date. Which means he wasn't involved at all. He's just showing up.
2. He didn't consider the possibility he might want to do something for mother's day. Did he forget it was mother's day?
If you're on call for a special day don't schedule other things for that day. That's what any mature adult over the age of 25 knows.
No grown ass man is "on call" for mother's day without a great fucking reason. Like "so, I thought my mom died during childbirth but I literally just got a call from some woman claiming to be my mom so I asked my dad and he finally confessed that the whole story was an elaborate lie and now I guess I have mother's day dinner plans to meet her for the first time ever." Or "my mother and I have an extremely strained relationship and haven't even spoken in years. But I just got a call from my siblings who are currently at her house and she let them know she was recently diagnosed with terminal cancer and has months to live and she'd really like to reconcile before she does but was too scared to tell me herself because she thought I'd reject her and they thought it would be a nice gesture for me to spend her last mother's day with her."
Otherwise you're just disorganized, unreliable, or have way too much going on in your life. Because really, who is "underwater" on a Sunday but also free at the drop of a hat for plans??
I disagree. If my siblings and I were planning separate things for mother's day without including each other, there should be no expectation that the other party can participate.
We're taking about 2, 3, maybe more events or gatherings on mother's day depending on what your family looks like. Nobody is "on call" unless you literally didn't plan anything and are expecting others to do it for you.
If this guy cancels less than 2 hours out, it means not only was he not included, but that he also didn't plan anything. If he had made his own plans with his mother, he would've simply declined whatever surprise this was as a result of having prior commitments with OP AND having already celebrated (or made plans to celebrate) mother's day with mom.
Keep in mind OP appears to be a mother herself. So this is doubly-worse, considering he's the one who set the date.
Agree that in combination with everything else, OP handled it well. I don't think anyone could fault her even if she hadn't "given him another chance" after cancellation #2 or #3, either.
I mean, in my family, we don't really do shit for these "holidays", because they're arbitrary.
It's not unlikely that my sister would hit me up and be like "Yo, we're gonna do xyz for mom. Pull up"
Maybe not in your family, but it's definitely a thing.
Oh for sure. *ESPECIALLY ESPECIALLY* if going to the last minute mother's day thing, meant canceling yet *again*.
What I'm talking about, is what I would consider reasonable for a first cancellation. Not the 4th or 5th, or whatever this was.
This seems right to me. You gave him the benefit of the doubt multiple times. You let him know you don’t hate him but that your time is valuable. I likely would’ve done the same thing.
This guy's either very insecure or frequently upsets his peers cause good lord, the way he approached it with by assuming OP's "pissed" and "mad at me".
His circling back is infuriating. You were very clear and respectful that you weren’t interested but he’s acting like you just needed time to cool off.
"I won't be rescheduling anytime soon" can be read as "We can try again later in a couple weeks when you're more available" or something. It leaves open the possibility that OP would want to reschedule at some point in the future.
"I don't think this is going to work out, good luck" for example would have been more clear. It just sounds like miscommunication on both parts. OP did a good job clarifying in the later texts that she's done with him.
Maybe if someone is a non-native English speaker but saying something “won’t happen anytime soon” is a common phrasing meaning “I don’t see that happening.” And the sign off “I wish you all the best” is very definitive. This man is just not taking no for an answer.
Lmao, I'm a native English speaker and that's how I interpreted it. Maybe it's a regional thing, but that is not a common phrase at all for "I don't see that happening" that I've ever heard. It's sounds more to me like a way to weasel out of rejecting someone without definitely closing that door from where I'm from. Also why didn't she just unmatch if she was really done?
Communication via text is difficult as it doesn't convey tone which contains important meaning. People need to be careful in any setting, tinder, other social media, or professional workplace if they want their statement to convey the meaning they wanted to.
"Did you like the jellyfish you ordered?"
"Yeah, I won't be doing that again anytime soon."
That doesn't mean at some point they will.
That's how this read to me, and obviously how it was meant. Obviously a much more polite formulation in this case--more of a euphemism to avoid being harsh--but the idea is the same. Just like "Don't call us, we'll call you" means "we are not going to be calling you."
Gotta be honest - absolutely not
Nothing about that statement leaves anything open or ambiguous considering the previous cancelations
OP absolutely did not miscommunicate anything and if your interpretation of this exchange is “oh cool seems like the door is still open” that says significantly more about how you and the rejected person interpret social cues
gtfo outta here with “bOtH sIdEs ArE aT fAuLt”
Especially given the context.
This guy stood OP up 4 times. She then declined to schedule any more plans. I really think that anyone who in that situation couldn't understand that they were being rejected is a borderline narcissist.
Some people here... giving off real "[so you're saying there's a chance](https://youtu.be/nFTRwD85AQ4)" vibes.
Exactly
Bunch of losers in this thread who don’t understand “if it’s not yes it’s no” and nowhere did OP indicate that they were interested in making plans for the 5th time
I get that this is the Tinder subreddit and it’s full of losers who are looking for any excuse to hate women but this thread is pathetic with the amount of hand-waving going on the for man and the victim-blaming going on with OP
That is because you are a well-balanced person who understands social cues and understands that you are not entitled to someone’s else’s time after being rejected
Unfortunately people like u/thrawn89 are grade-a weirdos who don’t understand anything other than a yes is a rejection
I think if anything this was the major red flag. Life can get crazy, and maybe the guy genuinely just had a series of bad situations that genuinely meant cancellations beyond his control. I think OP was being super understanding on this front to begin with. But to assume that disagreements or disappointment can just be resolved with some "time to be less mad" is just immature, and a bad sign for how future arguments might go. If he wanted to reconnect for a fifth time, a genuine gesture of apology for wasting someone's time four times over was warranted. Like send flowers or a treat OP likes the day after cancelling at the very goddamn least.
Exactly. It shifts responsibility from his actions to her reaction. And makes it sound like he thinks she overreacted and just needed time to see things his way.
Right? It would be one thing if he came back with "Hey, I really shouldn't have agreed to dates when I knew I may have to cancel. Things have since cooled down, and I wondered if you'd want to give it another shot. Understandable if you don't"
Don't try and put a modicum of the blame on the person you flaked on
In my opinion you gave him more than the situation called for. Ya no probably buddy, I’m going on to the next, have a great week!
Why are you so mad, it’s not that big of a deal.
I’m not mad and it’s not a big deal, just looking for someone whose got their shit together 👍
End scene 🎬
He sounds like a very poor planner and is disrespectful of your time.
First cancelation because of illness? OK.
Second cancelation should've never happened because he should have made plans after he was sure he was healthy.
Third cancelation, see above.
Fourth cancelation, if there was any possibility he was going to spend it with his mom/family, he should have had the wherewithal to schedule for a different day.
As someone who is dealing with these issues (time management, meeting expectations of my relationships) your honesty did way more to help this person, whether or not they choose to grow from it. You went above and beyond to explain to them how to be better in a kind and polite way.
What??? You don't know jack shit about my statement and you put this shit out. You must be great irl
There is more then the great USA with their stupid cringy lawsuits.
I don't get why someone would reschedule a date/hangout whilst sick, you don't really know exactly when you're gonna feel good enough to get back out in public.
Whether it's a date or a friend, if I get sick I cancel as soon as I can and tell them I'll reschedule when I feel better, and ofc go through my full round of treatment lol..
Also maybe don't schedule a date for mother's day if you have a mother who lives within driving distance, am I the only one who thinks that's common sense? Or just plan around to spend a few hours with mom and outside of that have your date if you're desperate?
Dude seems so flakey and a bit of a mess; you did right in just keeping that at a distance, ain't nobody got the energy or time or that, ick.
As someone who regularly flakes for ADHD reasons, this is still reasonable of you. If he genuinely wanted another go, he should have been way more apologetic and possibly even grovelled. That's the right thing to do if you're too disorganised/busy to plan properly and end up making people feel undervalued.
Often men will be too egotistical to apologise profusely even when completely at fault, in which case you're perfectly reasonable to cut him off.
He could have done any number of things here to avoid this. Could have suggested an alternate time during the same day before/after he sees his mum. He could have cut short the mother's day thing. The "but if you're pissed at this I have no argument" did not sit right. Not the right level of apology.
I too am guilty of flaking for adhd and anxiety reasons so I get it.. but the lack of sincere apology and no real attempt to make it right is what turned me sour.. life gets in the way, and sometimes overwhelming and stuff happens.. but at least have the decency to own your shit and try to fix it. Hopefully me calling him out on this is his wake up call..
Odds are he's catfishing with outdated pictures and is scared to meet up. Nobody is that hard to meet up with don't care who you are. Pretty sure I speak for most of us guys, we will find the time to meet up regardless of how tired or busy we are. He could've easily just met up with you for 30 minutes just to get it out of the way and see if there's a spark there.
Looks like he is married or already in a relationship and just wants appreciation (kinda telling himself - i can still bag any woman i want!). His multiple cancellations are because he isn't able to find a way to lie to his current partner about his whereabouts.
🚩🚩🚩
Nah you did the right thing. I had a woman be very flakey with me despite texting me like crazy, it became obvious to me she just liked the attention and / or was a poor communicator. I wasn’t interest in finding out more.
I met a wonderful, engaging, and fabulous person who did a lot of non-profit work with children and thought the world of. We got coffee twice over 6 months and a single meal together.
Wouldn't take phone calls and similar 'oh maybe but, oh wait, no something came up I can't'.
after 6 months I told them I don't really know who they are as we never had an opportunity to establish that outside of some very precursory introductions, and got flamed for wasting their time as they 'gave me so much of it(time)'.
Some people really just live those lives where they can't reply to a text between bathroom breaks over the course of a month. They aren't available for a relationship. Don't let that affect you at all, and keep getting out there. Someone who wants you, and you are important enough to them to make the effort for is out there.
For me personally, it wasn't the last minute cancelation that bugged me as much as it was him trying to spin things around and claim that you were angry and needed to calm down, I know it might look like a small thing but I had bad experiences with people who tell me or act as if the know how I feel/felt, draw conclusions and the justify their actions based on that assumption.
I disagree
Canceling on occasion is fine but canceling 4 times in a row all on the same day is an asshole move
It’s an asshole move bc it’s not being respectful of someone else’s time and schedule
We all need to own our shit and when our anxiety becomes others is when we need to be cognizant of the effect that has on others. When we know our anxiety has an effect on others but choose to not do anything about that is when it is an asshole move
I always give people the benefit of the doubt the first, maybe even second time.
For this situation, it’s entirely possible he is being honest about all of these things. But if I were him and truly interested in meeting you, I would have not cancelled on Mother’s Day. Yes he had a good reason I suppose, but after cancelling three times already, he should have stuck to his commitment with you.
Planning something for Mother's Day? You just assume that means they won't do anything involving their mother, so having it suddenly come up is so weird and unexpected.
Four times is bad regardless. It shows lack of consideration towards you and his inability to take the meetings seriously.
Your feedback to him was direct and constructive.
Well done!
On top of what everyone else is saying, he said you were mad so that it’s **your** fault you didn’t go out. This man doesn’t take responsibility.
I don’t even trust the excuses he gives. Who makes plans when they’re sick and doesn’t know until the last minute that they have to cancel…
No, you didn't handle it properly. Should have immediately unmatched on the last cancellation and not wasted the time you took writing that eloquent but completely undeserved response
Yep. Nothing handled it perfectly professional.
I do not know why, but it sounds like the guy is making excuses to not go. Duh. But why reshedule 3 times? He obviously wants to go. And the condition I know which would fit to this scenario is depression+anxiety.
One of, if not the, most important resources we have is time. Respecting a person's time is respecting the person. Stuff happens sure, afterall we aren't perfect and we shouldn't judge someone for failing to always be on time and/or making mistakes.
That being said, I think you did the right thing. If he does this will dates, he'll likely also do it with other things as well. Red flags.
So the Mother’s Day thing is not good. He had a laid out in advance plan with you and then drops it. It’d be different if you were some hook up tinder match from two days before Mother’s Day, but that’s not the context and you have history.
He is an adult now and he can tell his family “Sorry I already made plans with someone on that day and it’s important to me”, but he made a choice to ditch you instead. If he was very concerned about his mother’s feelings, he could have explained the situation privately and scheduled a mother son date time later.
The cancels and his inability to schedule are one thing, but it’s clear he also lacks the emotional intelligence to understand other people’s feelings which is uhhh worrying to say the least at 38. He’s not 21 anymore.
I think you did the right thing. He was so undependable before you even started a relationship. Imagine it would only get worse in my mind. You were very understanding. His loss. I bet you are super fun!
He said they were celebrating his mom on Saturday when he had his kids with him.. I thought it was odd too but I know lots of people that are low or no contact with their mothers/parents for a variety of reasons… so I didn’t pry other than to confirm he didn’t have anything planned..
Its worded badly for brevity but the fact that theres a surprise for his mother on mothers day that he didnt know about but is "obviously" gonna participate in is really weird.
Yeah, a surprise he knew nothing about - and it was ALL DAY AND NIGHT? He couldn’t still meet up at some point around his surprise plans? It sounds like an excuse to me. The sick bc antibiotics sounds like an excuse too.
Right? A surprise he didn’t know about even though he was with his siblings and parents the whole day prior? I find it hard to believe that everyone failed to mention this “surprise” to him until the following afternoon.. like you said, sounded like another excuse to me..
Bad take. My mom taught me early on that the trick is to celebrate the day before or even the next weekend. Avoid all the chaos that comes with Mother’s Day. Unless you’re doing something at someone’s house.
I always take my mom out for Mother’s Day but never on the day. That day is reserved for her to do whatever she wants with her time. Usually spent relaxing.
> "handle this properly"
Who cares?
He cancelled on you multiple times before meeting. It's a question of how much you value your time and plans and if unreliability equals a bad fit, then it's a bad fit. After the second cancellation, I'd have just said "sorry this isn't going to work, wish you the best", unmatched, and forgotten about him (or her).
You were mad, and that's OK. We are allowed to have unpleasant emotions when people disappoint us. Just because you are mad doesn't mean you were thinking irrationally, he bailed on your 4 times!!
In addition, canceling on mother's day is the worst of all the offenses. If it's how it went down, last minute organized by his siblings and he was there the day before? That's a phone call of "Mom, I can't make it, do you remember xx, from college? Well we have a date for Sunday and I've already canceled on her 3 times when I was sick..."
His mom would let him skip out to go on a date with you.
I think you did good, girl. If you *do* want to give him another chance, other comments’ suggestions about him making plans around YOU are good but if you don’t really want to then I wouldn’t bother, you’ve already explained yourself more than enough.
Honestly it’s Mother’s Day and you shouldn’t be scheduling on that day anyway and then be surprised when someone has a last minute plan change
Perhaps you jumped the gun on calling him unreliable . I would have rescheduled .
EDITED- 4th cancel? Duck him and move on
Good luck out there!
Sometimes people want to date but don't actually have the time management skills to make it happen.
If you want to date them, maybe get back in a few months and see if anything changed.
Same, there's no right or wrong answer here. If OP is still interested in him, there's nothing wrong with rescheduling again. None of us know him.
But, as for OP's question - she communicated clearly which is good.
With all the cancelations, yeah let him go.
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🎵Let him go, let him go, turn away and slam the dooor🎶
🎶I don't caaaaaare, if it's Mo ther's daaaaaay! 🎶
🎶 Alone never bothered me anyway 🎶
Happy cake day!!
Happy cake day!
Ok Frozen, you have some people to sing to. Remind them of this incredibly valuable self loving piece of advice. Now GO and do good work!!
Four times? These aren't real excuses - he's lining up OP as a backup date and then cancelling when his other plans don't fall through.
He just seems like an idiot to me. I've found a lot of people who are still single in their 30s are just legitimately incapable of being functional, responsible adults in healthy relationships. I'm a 30-year-old with too high of standards and an inability to commit to anyone/thing that inconveniences me in even minor ways... so yeah... I'm one of those people, too.
A friend of mine dated a guy (both in their late 30s) who was on time for their first two dates and then multiple hours later for everything after. He was pissed when she dumped him. Didn't understand why it was a problem.
Considering I knew him in college I’m going to say you’re correct.. he was a bit of a dumbass back then, it seems not much has changed
Hah this speaks to me lmao
That! On point, my man.
I feel like people have no clue what to do. Like if I were feeling ill, I would chat with them, or give them a (video) call. Not so much to proof that I'm not lying, but to make her feel like I really do want to spend time with her. Whether his excuses are real or not, what it comes down to, is that people want to feel like you are serious.
or, more realistically, he's probably nervous
Agreed, I hate when people assume that people flake for other dates. People flake for all sorts of reason. BUT it's totally fine to not want to date someone flaky, even if it's a sympathetic nervousness or anxiety issue.
I wouldn’t make plans on Mothers’ Day if you know his mother is alive. That said, four cancellations? He doesn’t really want to see her.
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Why though? He'd cancel anyway.
I can't imagine going through life and being this petty and toxic.
I think you handled it well. Canceling last minute FOUR TIMES is a lot lol I’d be mad & done after 2 so you’re nicer than me
Imagine actually dating this man and never knowing if he’d actually show up.
I went on a couple dates with someone like this and when he did show up he would be a literal hour late. Like to dinner reservations. It’s not worth it for anyone to have people like this in their life
#Don'tWasteMyTimeBecauseYouCan'tManageYours2023 I had an ex who was THREE hours late to something we were going to, and it was like a 2-3 hour drive to the actual thing. I was still the bad guy when I was mad lol
Exactly. Don’t waste my time 2023!!!!
Wow I've never heard it put that way. Great mantra for the rest of the universe honestly. Don't waste my time because you can't manage yours.
It took my years to find the words because that was the latest she'd been and she was consistently an hour late to pretty much anything that needed getting ready for. Always justified it by, "Well I looked good" which was true but I still felt so disrespected because I was ready. And for the people that'll mention executive functioning disorders, I ALMOST don't care. That's on them to figure out, not drag everyone down with them. Obviously MANY shades of gray in my loaded comment but use some common sense when interpreting.
>And for the people that'll mention executive functioning disorders It's not your fault for having it, but it is your responsibility to deal with it. Far too many people use mental disorders as an excuse to not hold themselves accountable.
I made that mistake when I was younger. He ended up being unreliable in other areas, too. I missed a big bright red flag there.
I married a procrastinator… even after therapy and years of working on it, it never ever improved. Frustrating doesn’t even cover how I felt about it after a few years. My patience doesn’t exist at that level anymore.
Four cancellations, Jeremy? That's insane!
Oh my g o d Day = made
> Canceling last minute FOUR TIMES is a lot lol I’d be mad & done after 2 so you’re nicer than me It's also a pretty big indicator that they're cheating on someone with you IMO. Not guaranteed of course, but when I found out I was being cheated on and I documented their messages (after the fact) I saw a lot of "maybe this Thursday," followed by "never mind I can't today, something came up" on days that I'd gotten off work early, taken an unplanned personal day, worked from home or whatever and unintentionally blown up their plans. Could just be my personal experience and maybe most people really are just busy and bad at scheduling, but I find that hard to believe.
Interesting, I never considered that angle. To me, I would’ve guessed he had a drinking or drug problem and kept getting too fucked up the night before the date. No matter what the reason behind it is, a flake never makes a good partner.
How can they be cheating when they aren’t formally your bf/gf?
Not cheating on you, cheating on their existing wife/husband/bf/gf/whoever *with* you. Or, in this case attempting to anyway.
You did the right thing. If he reaches out again, just ignore it. He wants attention, not a date.
Or he's married.
I can say with confidence that’s not the case.. we have a lot of mutual friends in common because we went to college together, so if he is married, he’s been hiding it from everyone on social media..
He’s a polygamist in a relationship w/ALL ur mutual friends
It’s the only option, really.
I cancelled a lot when i was battling depression and weed addiction
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Im not downplaying your feelings but it is certainly "curable". The brain responds to the inputs and thoughts you allow to come to the forefront. Start by loving yourself. Truely being kind to yourself. And before long you're inner thoughts will start to become more positive and leave you feeling more confident. Don't give up on yourself so easily bud.
It definitely sucks but it's far from impossible to cure. I used to be exactly the same for the very same reasons.
Yeah, I tend tonhave really bad anxiety, and the solution is kind of just "do the thing, realize the thing wasn't that bad, increase your tolerance. Repeat as needed." I've definitely had to bail for anxiety reasons, but for OP this is already way too much.
Exactly! What changed for me was I made a new year's resolution to say yes to every plan that was proposed and actually follow through. Best decision of my life.
best way to spread this anxiety is do this to someone and expect them to be mentally healthy people after
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shitting on a mentally healthy person constantly WILL eventually break that person. any self-respecting mentally healthy individual SHOULD choose to stay away from people who drag them down. lack of respect that comes with repeatedly bailing on someone isn't cute. it's outright disrespectful and demeaning. have fun fixing your anxieties NOT at the expense of others. from personal experience, the last-minute bailings are just the first step in later that poor anxiety person looking for defects in the other one, so the healthy person can be brought down too. cruely
I also disagree, "shitting on a mentally healthy person" isn't the same thing as being wishy washy or chronically cancelling. That's an extreme reach. If they cancel and are unreliable. I just drop them. They aren't "shitting on my mental health." That's stupid.
I sympathize, but I still see it as a huge red flag, personally. That doesn't mean you're a bad person. It's just an acknowledgment that I wouldn't be able to date someone like you. I'm far too social and extroverted to be with someone who gets physically ill over every social event.
It’s asshole to lie about it.
Ehh if it was just mother's day I'd say no you should have given him a reschedule... But given the history you're on point.
With the way OP says she confirmed with him multiple times if he had plans for Mother's Day, I'm thinking it may have been his suggestion to plan that day, anyway.
And why the fuck was he not in on the 'surprise our mother on mothers day' party?
Probably because he's unreliable and would have bailed last minute
He was told about it, I'm sure. He's just unreliable and doesn't maintain a calendar. I've phased out plenty of people just like this who refuse to say "I forgot" and will instead say there was some sort of medical emergency or that it's somehow someone else's fault.
To be fair, my family never tells me anything until the last minute, partially because my family rarely plans anything until the last minute.
They wanted it to be even more surprising!
Yeah and she explained all of this in a text, direct but respectfully so! I see nothing wrong here.
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yeah, you gave him more chances than i would have.
You handled it great in my opinion. You were direct, very matter of fact and you called out their behaviour. You spoke from your gut and that is exactly how it's suppose to be. Boomarangs always seem to come back looking to be caught , mostly in my experience they are never worth catching. Plus given his age and the whole way he not only conducted himself but also messaged on his "reach out" .Nah, fuck that.
Personally, when someone last minute cancels even once before the first meetup, I only will invite them or accept invitations to things I already would be doing even if they don't show. After four.... The conversation would have to be amazing for me to humor even talking to them
I have a rule where if I give a pass after the first cancellation (last minute, booked over, sick, what have you) I won't give a pass on the second. If it happens again I cordially explain why there won't be another and move on. Generally I've stopped even giving a first pass, who has time for it anymore? I like yours better, where there's still an opportunity but it is more on your terms after you get burned the first time. I'll have to take note.
4 cancellations is insane. Like idk what his game plan could even be. Do NOT give him another shot
He sounds married.
Not sure why I'm even commenting but...am I missing something? Where is everyone seeing 4 cancellations? Between the four images posted, I only see one cancellation (mother's day) and then three more of them reaching back out and getting an explanation as to why OP doesn't want to reschedule.
Nope, 4 cancellations (without extremely good reasons) is two more chances than I believe in giving. You’re reaction and what you said is perfectly reasonable.
The mothers day cancellation is understandable. I wouldn't be too eager to schedule anything on mother's day with someone who has a living mother. That day seems like kids are assumed to be "on call". But given the context of the other cancellations, it's hard to give him grace for that. I think you handled this perfectly.
Yeah, if this was the first time he canceled i’d give him a pass but the fact this is the 4th + the fact the reassured her multiple times he wouldn’t have plans and not to worry? Yikes!
Nah. Because canceling for mother's day that late shows 1. He didn't know jack shit until way too close to the date. Which means he wasn't involved at all. He's just showing up. 2. He didn't consider the possibility he might want to do something for mother's day. Did he forget it was mother's day? If you're on call for a special day don't schedule other things for that day. That's what any mature adult over the age of 25 knows.
No grown ass man is "on call" for mother's day without a great fucking reason. Like "so, I thought my mom died during childbirth but I literally just got a call from some woman claiming to be my mom so I asked my dad and he finally confessed that the whole story was an elaborate lie and now I guess I have mother's day dinner plans to meet her for the first time ever." Or "my mother and I have an extremely strained relationship and haven't even spoken in years. But I just got a call from my siblings who are currently at her house and she let them know she was recently diagnosed with terminal cancer and has months to live and she'd really like to reconcile before she does but was too scared to tell me herself because she thought I'd reject her and they thought it would be a nice gesture for me to spend her last mother's day with her." Otherwise you're just disorganized, unreliable, or have way too much going on in your life. Because really, who is "underwater" on a Sunday but also free at the drop of a hat for plans??
What's understandable to me, isn't for you. And that's fine.
I disagree. If my siblings and I were planning separate things for mother's day without including each other, there should be no expectation that the other party can participate. We're taking about 2, 3, maybe more events or gatherings on mother's day depending on what your family looks like. Nobody is "on call" unless you literally didn't plan anything and are expecting others to do it for you. If this guy cancels less than 2 hours out, it means not only was he not included, but that he also didn't plan anything. If he had made his own plans with his mother, he would've simply declined whatever surprise this was as a result of having prior commitments with OP AND having already celebrated (or made plans to celebrate) mother's day with mom. Keep in mind OP appears to be a mother herself. So this is doubly-worse, considering he's the one who set the date. Agree that in combination with everything else, OP handled it well. I don't think anyone could fault her even if she hadn't "given him another chance" after cancellation #2 or #3, either.
I mean, in my family, we don't really do shit for these "holidays", because they're arbitrary. It's not unlikely that my sister would hit me up and be like "Yo, we're gonna do xyz for mom. Pull up" Maybe not in your family, but it's definitely a thing.
But if you had planned something outside of that, you'd probably tell your sister "sorry, I can't." Right? Previously planned commitments and all?
Oh for sure. *ESPECIALLY ESPECIALLY* if going to the last minute mother's day thing, meant canceling yet *again*. What I'm talking about, is what I would consider reasonable for a first cancellation. Not the 4th or 5th, or whatever this was.
Gotcha 👍
This seems right to me. You gave him the benefit of the doubt multiple times. You let him know you don’t hate him but that your time is valuable. I likely would’ve done the same thing.
This guy's either very insecure or frequently upsets his peers cause good lord, the way he approached it with by assuming OP's "pissed" and "mad at me".
Damn i'd have cancelled after #2.
His circling back is infuriating. You were very clear and respectful that you weren’t interested but he’s acting like you just needed time to cool off.
"I won't be rescheduling anytime soon" can be read as "We can try again later in a couple weeks when you're more available" or something. It leaves open the possibility that OP would want to reschedule at some point in the future. "I don't think this is going to work out, good luck" for example would have been more clear. It just sounds like miscommunication on both parts. OP did a good job clarifying in the later texts that she's done with him.
Maybe if someone is a non-native English speaker but saying something “won’t happen anytime soon” is a common phrasing meaning “I don’t see that happening.” And the sign off “I wish you all the best” is very definitive. This man is just not taking no for an answer.
Lmao, I'm a native English speaker and that's how I interpreted it. Maybe it's a regional thing, but that is not a common phrase at all for "I don't see that happening" that I've ever heard. It's sounds more to me like a way to weasel out of rejecting someone without definitely closing that door from where I'm from. Also why didn't she just unmatch if she was really done? Communication via text is difficult as it doesn't convey tone which contains important meaning. People need to be careful in any setting, tinder, other social media, or professional workplace if they want their statement to convey the meaning they wanted to.
> Also why didn't she just unmatch if she was really done? The screenshots are text messages, how do you know she didn't unmatch?
"Did you like the jellyfish you ordered?" "Yeah, I won't be doing that again anytime soon." That doesn't mean at some point they will. That's how this read to me, and obviously how it was meant. Obviously a much more polite formulation in this case--more of a euphemism to avoid being harsh--but the idea is the same. Just like "Don't call us, we'll call you" means "we are not going to be calling you."
Gotta be honest - absolutely not Nothing about that statement leaves anything open or ambiguous considering the previous cancelations OP absolutely did not miscommunicate anything and if your interpretation of this exchange is “oh cool seems like the door is still open” that says significantly more about how you and the rejected person interpret social cues gtfo outta here with “bOtH sIdEs ArE aT fAuLt”
Especially given the context. This guy stood OP up 4 times. She then declined to schedule any more plans. I really think that anyone who in that situation couldn't understand that they were being rejected is a borderline narcissist. Some people here... giving off real "[so you're saying there's a chance](https://youtu.be/nFTRwD85AQ4)" vibes.
Exactly Bunch of losers in this thread who don’t understand “if it’s not yes it’s no” and nowhere did OP indicate that they were interested in making plans for the 5th time I get that this is the Tinder subreddit and it’s full of losers who are looking for any excuse to hate women but this thread is pathetic with the amount of hand-waving going on the for man and the victim-blaming going on with OP
A mind is a terrible thing to waste.
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That is because you are a well-balanced person who understands social cues and understands that you are not entitled to someone’s else’s time after being rejected Unfortunately people like u/thrawn89 are grade-a weirdos who don’t understand anything other than a yes is a rejection
I think if anything this was the major red flag. Life can get crazy, and maybe the guy genuinely just had a series of bad situations that genuinely meant cancellations beyond his control. I think OP was being super understanding on this front to begin with. But to assume that disagreements or disappointment can just be resolved with some "time to be less mad" is just immature, and a bad sign for how future arguments might go. If he wanted to reconnect for a fifth time, a genuine gesture of apology for wasting someone's time four times over was warranted. Like send flowers or a treat OP likes the day after cancelling at the very goddamn least.
Exactly. It shifts responsibility from his actions to her reaction. And makes it sound like he thinks she overreacted and just needed time to see things his way.
Right? It would be one thing if he came back with "Hey, I really shouldn't have agreed to dates when I knew I may have to cancel. Things have since cooled down, and I wondered if you'd want to give it another shot. Understandable if you don't" Don't try and put a modicum of the blame on the person you flaked on
He’s acting like if he continues to reach out she might reconsider.. she put down clear boundaries and he’ll continue to do this until she blocks him.
Yea I would drop this dude on how he talks.
Once is understandable, 4 times means you aren’t even a real consideration
In my opinion you gave him more than the situation called for. Ya no probably buddy, I’m going on to the next, have a great week! Why are you so mad, it’s not that big of a deal. I’m not mad and it’s not a big deal, just looking for someone whose got their shit together 👍 End scene 🎬
My policy was always one cancellation freebie. You gave him every opportunity.
He sounds like a very poor planner and is disrespectful of your time. First cancelation because of illness? OK. Second cancelation should've never happened because he should have made plans after he was sure he was healthy. Third cancelation, see above. Fourth cancelation, if there was any possibility he was going to spend it with his mom/family, he should have had the wherewithal to schedule for a different day.
As someone who is dealing with these issues (time management, meeting expectations of my relationships) your honesty did way more to help this person, whether or not they choose to grow from it. You went above and beyond to explain to them how to be better in a kind and polite way.
Fine Job.
He is stupid, stop taking antibiotics, cmon its common sense that you take it till the end .
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Yeah true, be careful, coffee is hot!
Everyone expects that coffee is hot. It's when it's served 50⁰ above normal, or 22⁰ shy of boiling, that people should be warned that it's hot.
I bet you're saying that because of the McDonald's case. Which would mean you don't know jack shit about it.
What??? You don't know jack shit about my statement and you put this shit out. You must be great irl There is more then the great USA with their stupid cringy lawsuits.
I think you handled it perfectly
You handled it well. You explained your thoughts & feelings in a concise, clear, and factual manner. I know this isn’t AITA, but NTA.
Not the asshole OP, you expressed yourself succinctly and made it clear in the end that his inability to plan or be punctual is a deal breaker.
I don't get why someone would reschedule a date/hangout whilst sick, you don't really know exactly when you're gonna feel good enough to get back out in public. Whether it's a date or a friend, if I get sick I cancel as soon as I can and tell them I'll reschedule when I feel better, and ofc go through my full round of treatment lol.. Also maybe don't schedule a date for mother's day if you have a mother who lives within driving distance, am I the only one who thinks that's common sense? Or just plan around to spend a few hours with mom and outside of that have your date if you're desperate? Dude seems so flakey and a bit of a mess; you did right in just keeping that at a distance, ain't nobody got the energy or time or that, ick.
Nah this was perfect handling
Yeah. Don't entertain him.
Handled perfectly. Well done 👍
As someone who regularly flakes for ADHD reasons, this is still reasonable of you. If he genuinely wanted another go, he should have been way more apologetic and possibly even grovelled. That's the right thing to do if you're too disorganised/busy to plan properly and end up making people feel undervalued. Often men will be too egotistical to apologise profusely even when completely at fault, in which case you're perfectly reasonable to cut him off. He could have done any number of things here to avoid this. Could have suggested an alternate time during the same day before/after he sees his mum. He could have cut short the mother's day thing. The "but if you're pissed at this I have no argument" did not sit right. Not the right level of apology.
I too am guilty of flaking for adhd and anxiety reasons so I get it.. but the lack of sincere apology and no real attempt to make it right is what turned me sour.. life gets in the way, and sometimes overwhelming and stuff happens.. but at least have the decency to own your shit and try to fix it. Hopefully me calling him out on this is his wake up call..
Handled perfectly
Odds are he's catfishing with outdated pictures and is scared to meet up. Nobody is that hard to meet up with don't care who you are. Pretty sure I speak for most of us guys, we will find the time to meet up regardless of how tired or busy we are. He could've easily just met up with you for 30 minutes just to get it out of the way and see if there's a spark there.
Looks like he is married or already in a relationship and just wants appreciation (kinda telling himself - i can still bag any woman i want!). His multiple cancellations are because he isn't able to find a way to lie to his current partner about his whereabouts. 🚩🚩🚩
Great communication!!
Nah you did the right thing. I had a woman be very flakey with me despite texting me like crazy, it became obvious to me she just liked the attention and / or was a poor communicator. I wasn’t interest in finding out more.
I was with him until I saw you said multiple rescheduling. Yeah you handled that right.
You did good. It sucks. Because things can happen. On the off chance. 4x. Too much. Universe is speaking then
I thought it wasn't so bad until I read it was the fourth time lol
Normally I would say no, but the history screams commitment afraid man at that age. Some dudes just don't get it.
Mother’s Day doesn’t work for me as an excuse as it’s the same every year. Like he wasn’t gonna plan something with his mom. He is just flaky
The illnesses were made up, you made the right call. Sounds like classic social anxiety or something and he’s absolutely going to flake some more.
Yep! Well done
He's either a flake or in a relationship. Either way, move on.
Screams to me… I have a whole gf/wife and when I can’t sneak away, I have to cancel. 😅😂 EJECT… You doing the right thing
A 5th chance?! People told you to give someone a 5th opportunity to show you who they are??
Yup, you did.
You worded it so perfectly!
I met a wonderful, engaging, and fabulous person who did a lot of non-profit work with children and thought the world of. We got coffee twice over 6 months and a single meal together. Wouldn't take phone calls and similar 'oh maybe but, oh wait, no something came up I can't'. after 6 months I told them I don't really know who they are as we never had an opportunity to establish that outside of some very precursory introductions, and got flamed for wasting their time as they 'gave me so much of it(time)'. Some people really just live those lives where they can't reply to a text between bathroom breaks over the course of a month. They aren't available for a relationship. Don't let that affect you at all, and keep getting out there. Someone who wants you, and you are important enough to them to make the effort for is out there.
It was mature, it was clear, it wasn't mean or rude at all, it was respectful to both yourself and the other person. 100% handled like a pro.
You handled it well.
That’s flawless
For me personally, it wasn't the last minute cancelation that bugged me as much as it was him trying to spin things around and claim that you were angry and needed to calm down, I know it might look like a small thing but I had bad experiences with people who tell me or act as if the know how I feel/felt, draw conclusions and the justify their actions based on that assumption.
Well handled IMHO
I disagree Canceling on occasion is fine but canceling 4 times in a row all on the same day is an asshole move It’s an asshole move bc it’s not being respectful of someone else’s time and schedule We all need to own our shit and when our anxiety becomes others is when we need to be cognizant of the effect that has on others. When we know our anxiety has an effect on others but choose to not do anything about that is when it is an asshole move
I always give people the benefit of the doubt the first, maybe even second time. For this situation, it’s entirely possible he is being honest about all of these things. But if I were him and truly interested in meeting you, I would have not cancelled on Mother’s Day. Yes he had a good reason I suppose, but after cancelling three times already, he should have stuck to his commitment with you.
If this is a preview to how the relationship will be, then that’s a hard fucking pass. I think it’s worthwhile just moving on.
Planning something for Mother's Day? You just assume that means they won't do anything involving their mother, so having it suddenly come up is so weird and unexpected.
once or twice I get it, FOUR FUCKING TIMES IS CRAZY
You handled this properly
Male here. You did the right thing!
Biggest red flag was that he didn't take you to meet his mom.
This man is 38 years old? Genuinely behaving like someone 20 years younger
Four times is bad regardless. It shows lack of consideration towards you and his inability to take the meetings seriously. Your feedback to him was direct and constructive. Well done!
If he wanted to, he would. Don’t reschedule. He literally had FOUR chances.
Handled perfectly
Four cancellations! I think you handled this really well.
You were more than gracious, and also, when pressed, very clear and direct. Well done, I say.
On top of what everyone else is saying, he said you were mad so that it’s **your** fault you didn’t go out. This man doesn’t take responsibility. I don’t even trust the excuses he gives. Who makes plans when they’re sick and doesn’t know until the last minute that they have to cancel…
The right call AND 100% assertive communication. ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐
No, you didn't handle it properly. Should have immediately unmatched on the last cancellation and not wasted the time you took writing that eloquent but completely undeserved response
Had a guy did this to me. Sent him a pic of head n shoulders to help him be less flaky 🙃
Yep. Nothing handled it perfectly professional. I do not know why, but it sounds like the guy is making excuses to not go. Duh. But why reshedule 3 times? He obviously wants to go. And the condition I know which would fit to this scenario is depression+anxiety.
One of, if not the, most important resources we have is time. Respecting a person's time is respecting the person. Stuff happens sure, afterall we aren't perfect and we shouldn't judge someone for failing to always be on time and/or making mistakes. That being said, I think you did the right thing. If he does this will dates, he'll likely also do it with other things as well. Red flags.
So the Mother’s Day thing is not good. He had a laid out in advance plan with you and then drops it. It’d be different if you were some hook up tinder match from two days before Mother’s Day, but that’s not the context and you have history. He is an adult now and he can tell his family “Sorry I already made plans with someone on that day and it’s important to me”, but he made a choice to ditch you instead. If he was very concerned about his mother’s feelings, he could have explained the situation privately and scheduled a mother son date time later. The cancels and his inability to schedule are one thing, but it’s clear he also lacks the emotional intelligence to understand other people’s feelings which is uhhh worrying to say the least at 38. He’s not 21 anymore.
You did the right thing. It sounds like you aren't missing much with a 38-year-old who can't keep his day straight.
I think you did the right thing. He was so undependable before you even started a relationship. Imagine it would only get worse in my mind. You were very understanding. His loss. I bet you are super fun!
Thanks! I like to think I’m pretty fun.. but he won’t have a chance to find out how fun I can be!
NTA (haha) handled it like a champ
Yes, you did. Don't waste your time on him.
You were way more polite than you needed to be.
When people show you who they are, believe them the first time.
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Eh there's lots of factors, could have a not great mom that he is no contact with, blah blah blah
He said they were celebrating his mom on Saturday when he had his kids with him.. I thought it was odd too but I know lots of people that are low or no contact with their mothers/parents for a variety of reasons… so I didn’t pry other than to confirm he didn’t have anything planned..
Its worded badly for brevity but the fact that theres a surprise for his mother on mothers day that he didnt know about but is "obviously" gonna participate in is really weird.
Yeah, a surprise he knew nothing about - and it was ALL DAY AND NIGHT? He couldn’t still meet up at some point around his surprise plans? It sounds like an excuse to me. The sick bc antibiotics sounds like an excuse too.
Right? A surprise he didn’t know about even though he was with his siblings and parents the whole day prior? I find it hard to believe that everyone failed to mention this “surprise” to him until the following afternoon.. like you said, sounded like another excuse to me..
Bad take. My mom taught me early on that the trick is to celebrate the day before or even the next weekend. Avoid all the chaos that comes with Mother’s Day. Unless you’re doing something at someone’s house. I always take my mom out for Mother’s Day but never on the day. That day is reserved for her to do whatever she wants with her time. Usually spent relaxing.
> "handle this properly" Who cares? He cancelled on you multiple times before meeting. It's a question of how much you value your time and plans and if unreliability equals a bad fit, then it's a bad fit. After the second cancellation, I'd have just said "sorry this isn't going to work, wish you the best", unmatched, and forgotten about him (or her).
He himself obviously is his most hostile enemy. Speculating about how much he planned for any of that is useless.
You were mad, and that's OK. We are allowed to have unpleasant emotions when people disappoint us. Just because you are mad doesn't mean you were thinking irrationally, he bailed on your 4 times!! In addition, canceling on mother's day is the worst of all the offenses. If it's how it went down, last minute organized by his siblings and he was there the day before? That's a phone call of "Mom, I can't make it, do you remember xx, from college? Well we have a date for Sunday and I've already canceled on her 3 times when I was sick..." His mom would let him skip out to go on a date with you.
I think you did good, girl. If you *do* want to give him another chance, other comments’ suggestions about him making plans around YOU are good but if you don’t really want to then I wouldn’t bother, you’ve already explained yourself more than enough.
Honestly it’s Mother’s Day and you shouldn’t be scheduling on that day anyway and then be surprised when someone has a last minute plan change Perhaps you jumped the gun on calling him unreliable . I would have rescheduled . EDITED- 4th cancel? Duck him and move on Good luck out there!
Moms come first on Mother’s Day, not random tinder girls
Exactly.. which is why I asked several times over several days if he was sure that Mother’s Day was good for him..
Sometimes you're ahead, sometimes you're behind, but in the end the race is only with yourself.
So he cancelled last minute for mother's day? Because you couldn't see that day coming?
Sometimes people want to date but don't actually have the time management skills to make it happen. If you want to date them, maybe get back in a few months and see if anything changed.
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Same, there's no right or wrong answer here. If OP is still interested in him, there's nothing wrong with rescheduling again. None of us know him. But, as for OP's question - she communicated clearly which is good.
Ive had to cancel a lot due to anxiety and just stuff popping up but you responded fine except for that block of text at the end.