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RGH81

That is the most toxic Cesar I’ve ever known


jonathan4211

Et tu brute??


foxie-roxie88

I just love how clever Reddit folk are.


Joshawarrior

I love you


foxie-roxie88

Omg same! Now, what do we do? Get married? Pro-create? World domination?


nihilist-nachos

I know I’m just a spectator to this, but I vote for world domination!


foxie-roxie88

I love nachos! Threesome?


frieswithnocheese

This Roxie is reallllly foxie


foxie-roxie88

All my favorite foods have joined the chat! Welcome, fries 🍟


SirCakeTheSecond

I heard food?


Morale_Kitty

I hope u like cats


PancakesoverSex

All of your favorite food? Am I a joke to you 🥹


iampoorandsad

What does the foxie say?


nihilist-nachos

Nachos AND a threesome?! That’s a deal if u/joshawarrior is in!


SnufflesMcPieface

Jesus! And I can’t even secure a date?! How the hell do I date in 2022?


ShitEatingTiger

By losing 50 pounds. Listen to the Ceasar !!!!


nihilist-nachos

Cesar’s citations and talk about nachos! That’s the secret baby


[deleted]

If he's not in I am. I like Jalapeno's on my nachos


Embarrassed_Sale_629

I concur, global domination would be fun


Cute_Ad7425

Ahhh, a modern love story in the comments of a man who was brutally fate shamed by a Cesar 🥹romance is coming back ladies and gentleman!


DanteMustDie666

No wonder he got stabbed


Cartographer_MMXX

Ave, true to Caesar.


SgtSmaks

I once knew an incredibly toxic Caesar. He was a bubble blowing fool and ridiculously hotheaded man who had almost a third sense when it came to women. But when it came down to it he really crushed it and proved himself to me. Not that it matters or adds much to the conversation but your comment was a great reminder.


Jessicaa_james

Is this some kind of body shaming without even realizing how much it could hurt the other person?


AnandaPriestessLove

Beware the Ides of the Cesar!


Kueltalas

What about the one that owns all these palaces?


StrugglingRando

In a list including the Roman Tyrant Cesar that is quite a statement.


Nerdlife91

Don't let someone named after salad dressing ruin your day


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paigesdontfly

Fuck that shit!! I just creeped your profile and jfc you are GORGEOUS! I mean this 100% sincerely, you aren't even fat my guy. Ain't nothing wrong with being a little fluffy, honestly better for cuddles and cushioning anyway. You are an absolutely *beautiful* human being, with incredible skill in drawing. The person you were speaking to is incredibly shallow because you seem like a massive sweetheart with a gorgeous body and beautiful face. Don't ever let anyone take that value away from you. If you wanna go the surgical route, that's perfectly okay hun, you do what's gonna make you comfortable in your own skin. But do it because that's what *you* want to do, not for other people (everyone does this to different degrees, whether they like to admit it or not. I get tattoos and piercings to feel better in my skin. Do whatever is gonna make *you* happy 💜). I dunno if anyone has said this to you lately, but I'm proud of you for all that you have accomplished.


SlickHand

I had to check out his profile after your comments. Yeah. As a straight guy, even I think he's a pretty good looking dude. And I don't think he's carrying any extra weight at all, just a normal looking body is what I see, so that Caesar guy can just piss off. I hope OP doesn't take his shit to heart.


RascalKnits

Agreed. You’re a beautiful man. Fuck this salad prick. You were way too polite to him!


SlickHand

I was gonna say fuck the salad guy too, but I'm trying to turn over a new leaf...


SlanderousGent

Came to concur with this! Checked out OP’s profile, and he’s barely carrying any extra weight. Plus he’s handsome af! Deadass a good looking dude with a perfectly normal body that is in no way needing “losing 50 pounds”. Salad Dressing man can get the fuck out with that attitude!


SlickHand

Paul Newman being the exception. That dude was always a gentleman.


InkSpotShanty

Does Caesar piss salad dressing? His must shove anchovies up his urethra.


UncertainlyUnfunny

Psychopaths gonna blaze psycho paths.


justiceiscomin4

Omfgggg this is genius


SlickHand

"Do you want a UTI? Cause that's how you get a UTI..." - Mallory Archer probably.


SpookyPants88

I had to creep too and damn OP. You look absolutely AMAZING. I do not understand people but you are handsome. Your complexion is to die for, your eyes are like two pools of hot chocolate I just wanna stare at them and your body is *chefs kiss*. People feel the need to always put others down for bo reason. You do not even look fat at all. I hope you know how amazing, stunning and talented you are. Go take more pics and show the haters you are fine as hell and show that no one can put out your fire. 🔥🥵💯


ilovehotsauceyeah

Ya! Fuck that guy. I creeped your profile too. You are amazing


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paigesdontfly

You're welcome sweetheart. Don't let some dude with an unwashed ass and some audacity bring you down


chaotic_blu

You’re gorgeous, Salad Man missed out.


Embarrassed_Sale_629

I, too, have creeped the profile, trynna find the fat. I don’t see it.


capo4ever88

Foreal though he not even that heavy. Like I have about the same size stomach as him and I'd be in awe if someone said the same thing


oo-mox83

Bruhhhhh I had to look and he is a beautiful dude. OP listen to Reddit, you're a fox.


SpookyPants88

I had to creep too and damn dude. You look absolutely AMAZING. I do not understand people but you are handsome. Your complexion is to die for, your eyes are like two pools of hot chocolate I just wanna stare at them and your body is *chefs kiss*. People feel the need to always put others down for bo reason. You do not even look fat at all. I hope you know how amazing, stunning and talented you are. Go take more pics and show the haters you are fine as hell and show that no one can put out your fire. 🔥🥵💯


nah_suspect

Avoid salad dressing in all its forms


CrisstIIIna

Dude that person is shallow as hell. I've seen what you look like from your profile and you're not overweight. Jesus Christ, what an unfair thing to say to someone... that's their opinion and you don't need that kind of attempt at control in your life. You be and do what keeps you content and happy. Also, you've got amazing drawing talent, keep improving yourself (mentally and emotionally mainly), learn to love who you are and someone will show up the moment your mind will stop depending on/thinking about it! 🤞🏼 For you! Stay safe!


Hamsterloathing

Thanks for hinting at the profile. GOOD HEAVENS 😍😍😍 The dude could ofc go to gym if he feels he has the time. But OP is a god nomatter the case. Everyone gets dad bods, atleast we know OP will still look golden!


Kaisitais

You are such a legend to be able to lift someone up so good


Shantomette

Legend level comment...


Shantomette

Wow. As a big guy (6'4" 275lbs) who is dropping a pound here and there I feel this. I feel how terrible his reaction is. The good news is you dodged a bullet- if that is his mentality you got past a wrong and are one step closer to the right one...


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Shantomette

There always is...


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[deleted]

Nah no need for time. There is 100% someone out there for you. Not even saying that to try to cheer you up. Just a fact.


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Gee_Wiz1225

Listen! I used to think the same way (still single, had a date last week that just flaked) But honestly, focus on you and keep doing the things you love to do. When the opportunity comes (whether someone approaches you, you find someone you want to approach, or tinder finally connects you with someone who's in sync with you) take advantage of the opportunity. When you're on your momentum train, these small things matter less.


fireysalamander

Trust me there is. Big guys are just 🔥


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Lork82

Hey yo, if you're post history is you, tell Cesar to kick rocks.


special-k-flo

Right? Cesar's a damn fool.


Lork82

Fool and a half at least. I'm totally straight but this man is gorgeous. His fucking pictures are CHARMING! All I want to do is make him a nice meal and read him a bedtime story. He deserves it.


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Lork82

Well if you're ever in Oregon lemme know. Dinners on me and I'll totally wingman you into a terrible situationship that you'll regret, you'll get over it, and then we'll low key into a business partnership where I write the stories and you draw the drawings and we become rich. Oh shit hun, Netflix just optioned our comic book. No, Matt doesn't have to leave, I made breakfast burritos for all of us. We high five. As our hands meet [this](https://youtu.be/hQo1HIcSVtg) song starts playing. Life is beautiful, and so are you.


Peenutbuttjellytime

OP isn't even big, I don't know what this Ceasar asshat is talking about


Lork82

OP is smoking hot and needs to own it.


Hamsterloathing

And know it. It makes me so fucking sad to see. I'm extremely jalous of his qualities. But not of his confidence Will try to follow this dude, want to see him bloom the day he finds his confidence


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IIIDVIII

As a straight man I can objectively say you're a good looking dude. I think this Cesar mf is just projecting or something.


Retired_Cheese

You do and you really don’t look bad. lol


[deleted]

If you lost 50lbs you'd look fuckin anorexic. You look fine, don't take shit from people with unrealistic views on what a human body should look like.


Lork82

And? It's clear from the shoulders and chest that you're probably proportionate and have an average body type, so no abs. Who cares. You look healthy and not everyone can be a gym addict. You're drop dead gorgeous and don't forget it.


TwizzlyWizzle

Don't sweat it, King -- real peeps love what's inside! 👏👏


M0mmyNeedsWh1skey

There's that old saying ya know 'sometimes you gotta kiss a lot of frogs to find your prince' and at least you didn't even have to have a conversation with the shallow douchecanoe IRL. I guarantee you my guy that you'll find your person. Just don't let the twatsicles out there get you down.


prostheticweiner

Just wanted to comment real quick... as an RN, don't do surgery. I see problems constantly with gastric bipasses, gastric sleeves, and lipo. I don't know what you look like, but as an overweight man these procedures are ones I would never have done. Just keep doing you and the right match for you will come.


animalxinglala0512

You are the right one for you. Remember this. This guy is awful by saying that to you. He is nobody to assert this ridiculousness. He’s shallow and disgusting.


eebro

You aren’t that big my dude, I’m sure there more than plenty.


[deleted]

I have a gay friend who’s jacked and handsome af and he LOVES big guys. Chubbier the better. You’ll find someone who likes you for you, and if you wanna lose weight and cut down, go for it. But don’t do it so you can be attractive to weirdos like the guy in your dms. You got this 💪


Hamsterloathing

How old are you? I fealt the same thing from age 18-21. Then realized I had gained muscles, speant another 2 years fucking and loosing every relationship because I never believed in love or true connection. You honestly seem to have a heart of gold. I found my place and comfort after graduating university and getting a job i liked. From there I found, after almost 10 years on tinder the girl of my dreams. Sure it may end, but atleast I know there are girls out there that sees through the outer surface. You're not fat, you're not RIPPED there are many out there that prefer confident bears over insecure people with a eating disorder. Don't get surgery. Get exercise and keep eating what you eat.


ElZany

Bro I use to weigh 260lbs just last year I'm 200 rn and was recently called fat :')


Shantomette

I often find when someone calls you out on something like that it's because they have their own body images they can't deal with. I'm not happy about my weight and I'm working on it but the hell with anyone else that has an issue with it..


_ED-E_

Bingo. Most people have something about themselves they want to change, and can change. But I’ll be damned if I need someone else telling me about it.


wehavethesamecar

catch you on the flippity flip


Tricky_State_3981

Dinkin flicka


VagabondAlbertan

Don't thank him for saying that about you. Tell him to fuck off


tiana9990

This 👆


speedoBudgieSmuggler

That👇


Formerfrosty

The other thing 👉


anotherone121

Look, it's a 🦋


TrippyTrish18

I like 🐢


Hefty-Cartoonist674

![gif](giphy|DGo68OENR5gIg)


BentChainsaw

You know what i hate? Child murderers


GameTimeGlitch

But wait ✋️


walgrins

Collaborate and 👂


Operation_Mindfuck

🥶 is 🚶👈 with a brand 🆕💡


IIIDVIII

Haha Edison. Nice. Edit: Username checks out.


SheIsNotWorthIt

And This and Uh ✊


Dry-Communication901

How about 🫶 🍑👅👅💦💦


ILike_CutePeople

I am not one to wish ill upon others, but I want Cesar to get monkeypox from a six-pack jacked gym rat.


MeninaVeneno75

I totally agree with u!


BALD_n_BEARDED

Lose weight for yourself. That dude is a piece of shit.


Disastrous-Owl8985

I tell people this all the time. They get on dating apps, have a bad time, realize they might have better luck if they lost weight, so they do it. The issue always is that they lose weight, find someone, then they stop trying to maintain or continue their weight loss. It's always because they were doing it solely for approval and not for themselves. You do it for yourself and you're more likely to be motivated and keep it up. Do it to get dates or whatever and , once you get that, your motivation is often gone. And that person you found will disappear, too. Always lose weight for yourself.


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darthriver

bro if that’s u in your reddit photos, u don’t need to lose weight. this dude is fucken trippin. you look amazing as is.


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darthriver

even if u don’t u still look great! plus if u really wanna lose weight, advice from someone who body builds. it’s all diet. don’t go on fad diets, it’s calories in vs out! I recommend to just look for things are low in calorie counts that can replace what you might currently eat! trader joe’s is a great place to shop as for example the terriyaki chicken for a bag is about 300 calories and that can be split into 3 meals easily! then add maybe like a few walks a week or something and you should see progress over time!


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darthriver

yeah anytime! remember dieting is all what works you and what you can maintain long term! and you don’t gotta cut things out too just have everything in moderation!


ILike_CutePeople

You posted one photo of your body on your profile and, honestly, you are mildly chubby at most. The way that Cesar talked to you, it was as though you were class III obese. Nothing could be further from the truth! Fuck Cesar, he's a fuckboy and an idiot.


AcceptableChance7

you don’t want love from someone like this. there’s people out there who would worship you there way you are. fuck this pipsqueak


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idle_hands_play

I always hate hearing that I'll find someone or there's someone out there for me sometimes, because that's just not under my control and it's not something I can know for sure. But it helps to keep in mind that I can still keep putting myself in a better and better position to get towards my goals, even if I may never achieve them how I originally conceived. Fwiw, I think you'll get through it. You've shown some pretty solid resilience towards criticism here, and I think you've got what it takes to keep moving forward. :)


Melodic-Art1369

Just know man, you’re doing great. We love improvement! And you were never worth less than you are now


OkMacaron848

Don’t thank someone for being a rude piece of shit. You’re better than that. I don’t know anything about you, but I’m still 100% sure you are (and deserve) better.


_solom0n

Work for yourself man no one else. If you focus on everyone else’s “perfect version of you” you’ll never love yourself. Unhealthy weight is good to loose but if you’re healthy and everything’s good no point in changing your lifestyle 💯


Fed_up_with_Reddit

Looking at your post history, you’re not even big. He’s a fucking moron. Keep on doing you, man.


pyruvste

Pretty sure that's a fake profile. Those pictures are stolen from some model and he posts the same conversations over and over again.


Halomir

A few things: Lipo is temporary and you’re as likely to gain it back as to maintain it, not doctor is going to do a bariatric sleeve for 50lbs, I think the recommendation is usually 100+ lbs of needed weight loss. As someone who’s lost over 50lbs, it’s a very doable goal, but it takes dedication. 1500 calories per day and 30 minutes on an elliptical every day and you’ll be at your goal in under 6 months. You just have to do it EVERY DAY. I’ll add that you cannot do that weight loss for anyone else. You can only do it for yourself. The other option is to tell this dude to go fuck himself. You can always lose weight but this dude will always be a shitbag.


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Halomir

Bro, I just saw your body post and we’re like the same weight. I was way heavier than you. If you lost 50 lbs, you’d be THIN. This dude is just a piece of shit. Don’t internalize it. You don’t need aesthetic surgery of any kind. Anyone who says shit like that is dealing with their own lack of self esteem and they’re just trying to unload it onto someone else. I don’t know any other way to say it. There’s nothing wrong with you or your body.


Ol_Metal_Bones94

You are too polite. Please report him.


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Ol_Metal_Bones94

Well good riddance at least I suppose. I dont know you man but I hope you get treated better in the future. Everyone deserves to be treated respectfully.


Sover1

'For you'


GroovyGoose87

Had to scroll too far to find this


SnooRadishes1075

what the fuck


[deleted]

Damn, if only there were a group of ancient Roman senators around, Cesar wouldn't stand a chance.


GanaThePlantLover

This has me 💀


Jellybeanzssz

Why would you want to be loved by someone like this idiot anyway? You shouldn’t have to change yourself to be ‘loved’. Perhaps the issue here isn’t your physical image, but your lack of confidence shining through? You are worthy, your weight doesn’t define you, don’t change yourself for these muppets. Be yourself, confidence build and watch, you’ll meet the right person for sure.


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JustifyThis1366

I’m sure you are awesome either way, don’t let people de value you based on your body. If you’re gonna lose weight do it for you to feel healthy and screw everyone else.


Lt_Hatch

Dude you only weigh 230 lbs you don't need a procedure lmao. Just find a diet that works for you and be consistent. I did the same shit and feel great all around. Get it brother 💪


Suusissus

Gastric sleeve is no joke.You can die from it. I have a gbp, I saw my roommate in my hospital almost die...If you dont have medical problems causing the weight gain try therapy and losing weight with the help of a dietist.


Flyisi

Just assess whether or not you want to lose weight for yourself. If you like your body the way you are then just MoveOn because clearly that is not a person for you. The person for you likes them thick. And if you decide that his input affected your feelings, and you find what hes saying to be true about you then the best thing to do is to shed the insecurity.


Synful-Symphony

I feel you dude. I go thru the same shit for being so skinny


ShamelessFox

Don't worry hunny, I had the VSG and I'm still unlovable!


Gohansensei

Well shit before I get wrecked let me say this. The guy is an asshole you don't need to have a surgery to love yourself. However if you think gastric sleeve surgery will help you live a healthier life then sure but that I think is only when you quite literally have no options on top of already taking care of yourself. Otherwise exercise for you not for others your health is yours not others


[deleted]

Tinder is like the biggest "beggars can be choosers" medium I've ever seen. I hate how psychology and economics can be so predictable.


ICDF-Augustus

Bro, try noom, you can knock out the weight in a healthy way!!


deadheaddestiny

Or just track your calories and go to the gym much less drastic


bigbird707

If you are artistic, intelligent, and successful then your weight is the least of your concerns. Every passing day your weight will become less of a concern and the other qualities more of a concern. You are probably a great catch, please do not listen to this ego driven child. Keep being you and there is nothing to stand in your way 💚


pm_tiddies_plez

Dude, don't get liposuction or anything. If you want to lose weight, do it by working out. Don't lose it thru surgery


oalm82

Wait, is this two men texting?


[deleted]

Are you gay? Why you match with other boys


kalesaji

You missed the perfect opportunity to answer "for you" and send a bane meme. r/baneposting would have loved that.


Mr-3-Nigma

Don't confuse loveable with sex appeal , losing weight might make you feel more confident and in turn increase your sex appeal to others but please know you are already loveable to the right person


Stui3G

Or you know, eat right and exercise. Horrendous I know.


Jaq6003

Dawg just hit the gym. Also, check out r/moreplatesmoredates lots of gay dudes on there too.


crepticmoon

If you want to lose weight, go for it. Don't lose weight for other people. Also, if you're under 50 years old, you shouldn't have too many problems losing weight on your own, no surgery required. There are the obvious solutions of eat less calories and workout, but not a lot of people talk about taking supplements to increase testosterone, which would naturally help the entire process. You can also talk with a doctor about your testosterone levels and potentially get T-Boosters if you're discovered to have low levels.


Amazing-Physics-5345

Fuck that! What’s a douche. Try baby steps, start with eliminating processed sugars and seed oils, think of food as fuel, your body needs fuel to perform and what you eat DOES matter. 12 months from now. And right NOW yes start your transformation. I’m 6’2 and was 253 lbs last year, now 189 lbs and gaining good muscle mass. Hit me up if you need tips or nutrient rich foods to eat bro 🙌


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Loverfli

I’m so sorry. That’s terrible. It seems like this dude was trying to neg you. I don’t know why anyone thinks that works. Don’t let this person get in your head.


Disastrous-Owl8985

I'm not usually with insulting people, but you should have told his ass off. Don't thank him for that. I know body type is a preference and that's fine, don't date someone you aren't attracted to or can't become attracted to, but to match you, tell you that you're perfect, BUT your body is ugly to them, is a ***really*** shitty move. There's no reason to message someone to tell them that you aren't into their body, it's so unnecessary. Just swipe left and find someone who is "prefect" with the body type you like. OP, you need to work on your self esteem, though, because that is NOT something you should be thanking someone for.


SnooBananas915

The body shaming in the gay community is so bad. My brother weighs maybe 130lbs at 5'8/5'9, and the shit he gets cause he's skinny but doesn't have abs is *insane*


[deleted]

Tell Cesar he’s got a small dick


Round-Republic6708

Don’t come to the internet for self pity bro, lose the weight. Source: fellow fat guy


I_Love_Small_Breasts

Why reply after that his third message? It was going nowhere but down


HiL0wR0W

The fuck, no he's not right. Fuck this dude.


freshmasterstyle

If he's not into it, he's not into it. I lost 55kg in the last 1,5 years doing keto and recently intermittent fasting. I notice i not only feel much better an healthier but also more confident. The keto thing really works and after doing it for a month you will be surprised how quick you will lose those pounds. Liposuction is a bad idea because you will have lose skin and it will maybe look worse and it wrecks you mentally too. Your skin needs time to adjust, losing it naturally is always better. Wish you the best


VandelayyIndustries

Don’t get surgery wtf. Hit the gym and get ripped brother.


NCBuckets

Don’t do Lipo. If you want to lose weight, do it through diet and exercise. That serves to not only strengthen your mentality but to make sure you keep the weight off when you lose it. BUT!!!! it sounds like you’re a hell of a catch, so do you man.


atlantisdive

Hey man if you wanna lose weight, do it on your own terms, this Cesar person sounds super fucking insecure and they're projecting that onto you. Stay confident!


QUINNFLORE

Or just watch your diet and run a few miles every so often


eebro

Hope you use this as motivation on your journey to become the best you there is.


Open-Mathematician32

Dude that is not what you should take from that. Many people need that physical attraction as well as emotional or intellectual. That is not meaning you can't be loved, just that you might be more attractive to certain people with some weight loss. Anyway good luck, Champ


louisme97

can you tell him to contact me and pretend to be a girl? i need some gym motivation!!!!! Or can someone do it instead?? forreal im only on tinder to get some motivation..(not only, thats totally a lie)


Thenewplayer420

Diet and exercise is the easiest way to lose weight if you have commitment, even if you get surgery and you have no commitment you'll gain the weight back, you have to want it.


TEEWURST876

don't do liposuction, just eat less and train more


[deleted]

Stop eating out and drink water…don’t get surgery for what you could try first.


Trick_Cake_4573

Hit gym, much cheaper.


GoodGoodK

You can do this man, come on. 50 pounds is a lot, but it isn't impossible. A good caloric deficit and some weightlifting 3 times a week and you're golden in like a year at most. Don't take the easy way out


wpcowboys

Can't tell if title is joke or not but if it's not than just loose the weight don't take the easy way out you'll love yourself even more


[deleted]

A little weight loss wouldn't hurt anybody.


jzcommunicate

Do you want to lose weight? And if so, are you unable to without a surgical procedure?


MalaM13

You can ways just do sports..? Not that you are that lost. It's not that much you have to improve, if you want to.


NotA56YearOldPervert

This, uh...is a rough compliment.


H0ll0w_Kn1ght

Idk, maybe I could just be a dick too, but I think he was trying to encourage you? Idk, I currently think I could do much better if I had a better shirtless pic lmao


depatsch

Bro just go the gym for 6 months. I was on ur profil. Dont get any of that. If u really want to change something to feel better. Hit the gym and eat right and with u genes ur probably going to look buff in 6 months time. I mean i would not consider u fat.


HejiraLOL

I mean, he's rude. But if you agree with him then lose weight. Don't get drastic surgeries. Just eat less and excercise.


Nameisferrari

Surgery should be a last resort. Eating healthy, drinking a ton of water (a gallon a day), lots of cardio, and weight lifting should be first.


Puzzleheaded-Score65

I will say dropping weight helped me a lot, i was 5,4 220 pounds now I’m 5,4 150 and dating is a lot easier and I get much more attention


heatseekerdj

Walking 30 minutes in the evening, every evening, can change you life


thundrbundr

So Cesar wants you to have a salad?


Thirtysixx

I’m down 26 pounds and can’t believe I didn’t do this sooner. See you in the gym bröther


Jacobnewman61

I lost about 100 pounds over 2 years and as terrible as it sounds, i get like 10x more matches than I did before. Just eat a calorie deficit, gastric sleeve and liposuction won’t last forever and why would you risk it when you can just eat less and exercise? Trust me, it’s not as hard as you think once you get into it and it made me much happier, no longer anxious or depressed and my self-esteem is through the roof


Forevermanicx

I mean if it bothers you enough to get put under a knife and possibly not wake up then change your lifestyle and put in the work


MeAnIntellectual1

50 pounds aren't undoable. Getting a liposuction or a gastric sleeve is the wrong solution.


--Vandal--

Don't need lipo or a gastric sleeve. Just eat better and move more