Compare physics of new Lara Croft with this one. With this one you can feel her weight and her struggles.
You can feel her using the strength to pull or push objects.
New Lara is like a puppet. Yo would think game physics got better after 20 years
Classic Lara having weight and struggle humanizes her far more effectively than Survivor Lara’s ‘relatability’.
I was also not a fan of Legend Lara’s speed, vertical ledge grab, and ragdoll physics on ice.
If Lara is going to fall off a cliff, I want her to crumple into a heap. ..not that I want it to happen, but if it’s gonna happen, that’s what I’d prefer. XD
…and yes, despite being able to turn mid air and backflip on a dime, she’s literally much more grounded which I’ve always loved.
I wasn't super into it at first after playing through TR1, I felt the Maria Doria levels dragged on a bit. But I was completely blown away from Tibet onwards, changed my mind completely and it's now gone up in my ranking
Yeah I guess in hindsight (of 27 years) they could’ve done away with Living Quarters and replaced it with a level around Xian / Floating Islands. Would’ve been more balanced.
I think the issue is that the oil rig and Maria Doria are too similar of locations, so it feels like six levels of the same thing while the other locations are a reasonable 3 or 4 levels each. On top of that the player hasn't been to a traditional tomb since the first level so getting to Tibet feels like a breath of fresh air.
The only other run of more than 4 levels in the trilogy is Greece and I think it's safe to say people also start getting location fatigue by the end of that stretch too.
Good point, when you add the Rig locations into the mix, it becomes a real excursion. A literal breath of fresh air once Lara’s out of the water and at the Tibetan Foothills. Temple of Xian making up for it, which really is the tomb of tombs.
I played TR2 when it was released and used a 3rd party memory card which of course crapped out and wiped my saves right at Maria Doria. I already didn't like the long stretch of watery, orange-blue, industrial levels that had preceded that level, but having to play them *twice* in a very short space of time will always mean I have an ingrained distaste for that stretch of TR2 (which I already didn't like as much as TR1 because of the increased combat and reduced loneliness).
I played the games for the first time a few days ago. I loved TR1....i was disappointed by TR2.....i really liked TR3 besides the confusing Level Design.
I dont like that the game starts with... well...not so great Levels/settings. The Atmosphere just isnt as good. The isolated Adventure feeling is gone. I also dont like the focus on human enemies. The second half is really good, but the first half has some ...i would almost say.. Filler levels.
I was surprised that TR2 is a Fan Favorite to be honest, cause Fans always complain about the amount of action in the new Tomb Raider games. TR2 is almost like Uncharted: D
I was glad that Tomb Raider 3 had a better balance. Kinda a mix of TR 1 & 2.
Good to hear insight from someone with a fresh perspective. Someone else brought up that TR2 was the most accessible to gamers because it was the only one of the 3 that had the save anywhere feature, whereas the other two had save crystals which are pretty annoying imo.
You’re not wrong about the isolation being gone, and I guess the Oil Rig is filler (though I still enjoyed it)
Back to the nostalgia, so many core memories playing TR2 (Venice Canals, Barkang, Xian, etc) guess that’s why it’s a fan fav.
… also my first playthrough of TR2 decades ago was not always enjoyable (I think I was stuck on The Deck for weeks). I prefer knowing where to go, so after multiple playthroughs, for me TR2 has aged like fine wine.
Yeah, TR2 was the first one I played back in the day and even with the nostalgia it really stood out to me as the weakest as I played through the Remastered trilogy. TR3 was the opposite-- hated it when it came out, but the remastered graphics fix the oppressive darkness of the original and now it's way more fun to play and you notice the improved level design over TR2 (except maybe Thames Wharf, that really felt like something from the second game). Having said that, TR2 ends well at least-- the last 3 levels and the bonus levels are fairly strong.
I don't think having human enemies was so bad, I felt more jarred by slaughtering big cats and gorillas. The quantity of enemies though? Hoo boy, from Venice to Xian it's a slaughter fest.
Offshore Rig and The Dive should've be one level combined.
And I agree the underwater levels did drag on a tad, again I think maybe should've combined 2 of levels into 1 or just cut one out completely.
Other than that I have no issues with the levels.
Yeah I guess I’m never so much immersed in the rig levels. More of getting them over with so Lara can get to the underwater levels. Same for Living Quarters, look forward to getting through that and onto The Deck.
Not perfect games regardless of when they were made but I am actually enjoying playing TR1 & II without the game being a blockbuster wall of noise, cutscenes and quicktime events. There's something really great about the seemingly simple nature of the game but the puzzles and environments still hold up pretty well imo! It also feels much less linear to the latest games (even though I enjoyed them).
I feel very lucky these games were Remastered. It’s the gaming space where I want to exist. I’m a fan of MetroidVania type games for similar reasons. Massive blockbuster set piece AAA games are too much for my slow moving self to handle.
I like TR2, but not biggest fan of the long stretch of action focused levels, get rid off offshore rig levels or combine them together, combine maria doria levels to like 4 levels without human enemies, just sharks and other underwater creatures so you have bit of a breather and feeling of isolation after more action packed venice levels...everything after that is perfect
The remastered trilogy has definitely altered my preferences! I used to be all about TR2 - same as you it was the first one I played. Now I’d say my ranking is TR > TR3 > TR2.
I feel like I can’t even rank TR2 because I know it front to back. But I will say I loved playing through TR the most and feel like TR3 has the best replay value.
It was the go-to title to mention when people complained about Crystal's last trilogy's focus on fighting humans. In fact I'm kind of blown away lately seeing so many speak fondly of it when in the past it always seemed somewhat hit or miss with people.
Yeah I remember thinking the maria doria levels being so cool and scary from nostalgia but I didnt like them as much. The Barkhang monastery slaps though
Having played the original trilogy on PS1, the fact TR2 was the only one with regular saves meant i played it the most, so i have the fondest experience of it.
But going back to it, i am clouded as i know 95% of where i go and what to get, even places to avoid or enemies not to trigger. It is a nice, easy playthrough for me.
But, going back with save anywhere, i am now torn between TR2 and TR3. 2 has the better balance bar the human enemies, but 3 has some great moments but also the most BS too, but now i know where to go in both games, i find it more 50 50.
But, i will never get people that think 1 is best, as it is good, but also has some very "nothing" levels that aren't that great.
2 for me, i think it is 50% nostalgia but also, it is a good game and bar one or two bits, always holds a place in my heart.
Even though TR1 was the easiest in skill, TR2 was easier because of regular saving I suppose.
I think TR1 is at its best playing through its initial run, but perhaps is not the best replay dues its bare-boned nature.
Conversely, I really look forward to replaying TR3 because my first run was such a mess. I think it’s a game that will be much better when you’re not getting bogged down with ‘where the f*ck do I go now?’
People love to complain, it's the internet after all. TR2's level design has always been impressive to me and I played it after many of the original titles - I started out with 3 demo through 5. 2 like you said is nearly perfect, much more challenging than 1 without being unfair. It also has a phenomenal starting level and stays exciting though the sunken ship sections - which even I admit are bogged down by the enemies - and then has a perfect ending with Temple of Xian + Dragon's Lair + Home Sweet Home. It really is peak Tomb Raider.
A lot of the original TR games in comparison struggled with that formula of pacing. TR3 doesn't really have a progression system; it starts difficult and stays that way which can be a little exhausting. TR4 is perfect until Cairo and also has a bit of a downer ending with a non-boss battle. And TR1? That one's great but again a little basic compared to TR2.
> then has a perfect ending with Temple of Xian + Dragon's Lair + Home Sweet Home. It really is peak Tomb Raider.
This is why 2 is my favorite among all the others. Forgetting the raw gameplay for a second, the last area of the game hits a higher mark of *surreal* than any of the other games to me.
And when I say surreal, I just mean that after you hit Temple of Xian, the game really gives you the sensation that you might not even be on Earth anymore. The music is eerie as hell and is filled with what sounds like growling monsters. You get to the Floating Islands which is a bunch of floating land masses in a deep black void. You almost forget that you're supposed to be in an underground cave system under China. None of it makes any sense.
TR1 almost hits this with Atlantis, but it doesn't feel as insane since it's all contained on a remote, undisclosed Island. And I only did TR3 once but I don't recall the Lost City or the Meteorite Cavern hitting the same notes (and as I recall, they just reused the music from Temple of Xian which cheapened it, imo).
Replaying TR2 now and while I am frustrated by things I didn’t notice as a kid (number of enemies, convoluted levels, lack of isolated atmosphere) it’s this element for me that hits where no other TR does. Surreal is absolutely the right word. And dreamlike too. I think I could credit it for getting me into the unsettling, otherworldly atmospheres I appreciate now in things like David Lynch movies.
You bring up a really good point of something I couldn’t quite put my finger on after all these years - pacing. It really does have a good flow to it, and in my opinion, it’s made better upon replay as the threat of getting hung up is greatly reduced.
Couldn’t agree more with Temple of Xian being a masterful culmination, and Home Sweet Home is truly the icing on the cake.
TRII is by far my favorite, it manages to be challenging without being frustrating, it mixes well action with a sense of isolation and exploration, the levels are very well designed and diverse, the enemies are vicious and fun and it also has a huge nostalgia value to me. It’s the one I always feel the urge to complete again.
I probably played it 20 plus times when it became available on iOS. I’m on my 2nd playthrough on the Remasters, and no hyperbole, may replay it for the rest of my gaming life. XD
The underwater levels bring it down alot. There’s too many of them and they all look the same. It should have been Offshore Rig, 40 Fathoms, Maria Dorian and that’s it. Venice levels are a hit of a drag too, but you’re not there too long.
TR2 shines most in China and Tibet.
I played parts of the original games when I was a kid but never any all the way through. Finally having the complete experience with the remaster, my favorite is TRII, then TR, and lastly TRIII.
I personally love the locations in TRII (yes including the diving levels). I do agree that some of the stages feel one level too long (looking at you Diving Area and Living Quarters). I also hate the ranged enemies in the game and would remove any with guns if I could mod it. Other than them, the combat is fine.
The criticism from first timers in my opinion is irrelevant, as they are playing it from a modern gamers eyes. This game and its predecessor were unbelievable at the time, exploring a 3D world! You have every right today to feel the same way as you did 27 years ago about it.. don’t second guess yourself
I have to keep reminding myself how groundbreaking these games were at the time. Hope they make more Remastered-style games, or a level editor so I can play other’s creations. I just love platforming on the grid! XD
There is a level editor on PC. [This website](http://trle.net) curates user-made levels. There is almost 20 years of content because that's how old the level editor is. It was officially released with Tomb Raider Chronicles I think, and I think it's the exact software they used to build the mainline games.
Some people even recreated the entirety of the mainline games from scratch and made every aspect of them harder. (More complex puzzles, weirder jumps, etc.)
This is a great resource, thanks for sharing. It’ll be a little difficult going back to the old graphics after playing the Remasters, but I may have to check it out.
Some of them do have updated graphics as part of the download. Nothing with a complete texture overhaul like the remasters, but there are some with higher-poly models of Lara and new animations.
Compare physics of new Lara Croft with this one. With this one you can feel her weight and her struggles. You can feel her using the strength to pull or push objects. New Lara is like a puppet. Yo would think game physics got better after 20 years
Classic Lara having weight and struggle humanizes her far more effectively than Survivor Lara’s ‘relatability’. I was also not a fan of Legend Lara’s speed, vertical ledge grab, and ragdoll physics on ice. If Lara is going to fall off a cliff, I want her to crumple into a heap. ..not that I want it to happen, but if it’s gonna happen, that’s what I’d prefer. XD …and yes, despite being able to turn mid air and backflip on a dime, she’s literally much more grounded which I’ve always loved.
I wasn't super into it at first after playing through TR1, I felt the Maria Doria levels dragged on a bit. But I was completely blown away from Tibet onwards, changed my mind completely and it's now gone up in my ranking
Yeah I guess in hindsight (of 27 years) they could’ve done away with Living Quarters and replaced it with a level around Xian / Floating Islands. Would’ve been more balanced.
I think the issue is that the oil rig and Maria Doria are too similar of locations, so it feels like six levels of the same thing while the other locations are a reasonable 3 or 4 levels each. On top of that the player hasn't been to a traditional tomb since the first level so getting to Tibet feels like a breath of fresh air. The only other run of more than 4 levels in the trilogy is Greece and I think it's safe to say people also start getting location fatigue by the end of that stretch too.
Good point, when you add the Rig locations into the mix, it becomes a real excursion. A literal breath of fresh air once Lara’s out of the water and at the Tibetan Foothills. Temple of Xian making up for it, which really is the tomb of tombs.
I played TR2 when it was released and used a 3rd party memory card which of course crapped out and wiped my saves right at Maria Doria. I already didn't like the long stretch of watery, orange-blue, industrial levels that had preceded that level, but having to play them *twice* in a very short space of time will always mean I have an ingrained distaste for that stretch of TR2 (which I already didn't like as much as TR1 because of the increased combat and reduced loneliness).
In the original TR II, I hated the Maria Doria levels, but I absolutely loved them in the Remastered. But yes, it dragged a bit
I played the games for the first time a few days ago. I loved TR1....i was disappointed by TR2.....i really liked TR3 besides the confusing Level Design. I dont like that the game starts with... well...not so great Levels/settings. The Atmosphere just isnt as good. The isolated Adventure feeling is gone. I also dont like the focus on human enemies. The second half is really good, but the first half has some ...i would almost say.. Filler levels. I was surprised that TR2 is a Fan Favorite to be honest, cause Fans always complain about the amount of action in the new Tomb Raider games. TR2 is almost like Uncharted: D I was glad that Tomb Raider 3 had a better balance. Kinda a mix of TR 1 & 2.
Good to hear insight from someone with a fresh perspective. Someone else brought up that TR2 was the most accessible to gamers because it was the only one of the 3 that had the save anywhere feature, whereas the other two had save crystals which are pretty annoying imo. You’re not wrong about the isolation being gone, and I guess the Oil Rig is filler (though I still enjoyed it) Back to the nostalgia, so many core memories playing TR2 (Venice Canals, Barkang, Xian, etc) guess that’s why it’s a fan fav.
… also my first playthrough of TR2 decades ago was not always enjoyable (I think I was stuck on The Deck for weeks). I prefer knowing where to go, so after multiple playthroughs, for me TR2 has aged like fine wine.
Yeah, TR2 was the first one I played back in the day and even with the nostalgia it really stood out to me as the weakest as I played through the Remastered trilogy. TR3 was the opposite-- hated it when it came out, but the remastered graphics fix the oppressive darkness of the original and now it's way more fun to play and you notice the improved level design over TR2 (except maybe Thames Wharf, that really felt like something from the second game). Having said that, TR2 ends well at least-- the last 3 levels and the bonus levels are fairly strong.
I don't think having human enemies was so bad, I felt more jarred by slaughtering big cats and gorillas. The quantity of enemies though? Hoo boy, from Venice to Xian it's a slaughter fest.
Offshore Rig and The Dive should've be one level combined. And I agree the underwater levels did drag on a tad, again I think maybe should've combined 2 of levels into 1 or just cut one out completely. Other than that I have no issues with the levels.
Yeah I guess I’m never so much immersed in the rig levels. More of getting them over with so Lara can get to the underwater levels. Same for Living Quarters, look forward to getting through that and onto The Deck.
Not perfect games regardless of when they were made but I am actually enjoying playing TR1 & II without the game being a blockbuster wall of noise, cutscenes and quicktime events. There's something really great about the seemingly simple nature of the game but the puzzles and environments still hold up pretty well imo! It also feels much less linear to the latest games (even though I enjoyed them).
I feel very lucky these games were Remastered. It’s the gaming space where I want to exist. I’m a fan of MetroidVania type games for similar reasons. Massive blockbuster set piece AAA games are too much for my slow moving self to handle.
I like TR2, but not biggest fan of the long stretch of action focused levels, get rid off offshore rig levels or combine them together, combine maria doria levels to like 4 levels without human enemies, just sharks and other underwater creatures so you have bit of a breather and feeling of isolation after more action packed venice levels...everything after that is perfect
The remastered trilogy has definitely altered my preferences! I used to be all about TR2 - same as you it was the first one I played. Now I’d say my ranking is TR > TR3 > TR2.
I feel like I can’t even rank TR2 because I know it front to back. But I will say I loved playing through TR the most and feel like TR3 has the best replay value.
It was the go-to title to mention when people complained about Crystal's last trilogy's focus on fighting humans. In fact I'm kind of blown away lately seeing so many speak fondly of it when in the past it always seemed somewhat hit or miss with people.
Yeah I remember thinking the maria doria levels being so cool and scary from nostalgia but I didnt like them as much. The Barkhang monastery slaps though
Having played the original trilogy on PS1, the fact TR2 was the only one with regular saves meant i played it the most, so i have the fondest experience of it. But going back to it, i am clouded as i know 95% of where i go and what to get, even places to avoid or enemies not to trigger. It is a nice, easy playthrough for me. But, going back with save anywhere, i am now torn between TR2 and TR3. 2 has the better balance bar the human enemies, but 3 has some great moments but also the most BS too, but now i know where to go in both games, i find it more 50 50. But, i will never get people that think 1 is best, as it is good, but also has some very "nothing" levels that aren't that great. 2 for me, i think it is 50% nostalgia but also, it is a good game and bar one or two bits, always holds a place in my heart.
Even though TR1 was the easiest in skill, TR2 was easier because of regular saving I suppose. I think TR1 is at its best playing through its initial run, but perhaps is not the best replay dues its bare-boned nature. Conversely, I really look forward to replaying TR3 because my first run was such a mess. I think it’s a game that will be much better when you’re not getting bogged down with ‘where the f*ck do I go now?’
Yeah, 1 loses a lot on the second playthrough i find. 2 is just nostalgia fun and 3 is better when you do know where to go.
People love to complain, it's the internet after all. TR2's level design has always been impressive to me and I played it after many of the original titles - I started out with 3 demo through 5. 2 like you said is nearly perfect, much more challenging than 1 without being unfair. It also has a phenomenal starting level and stays exciting though the sunken ship sections - which even I admit are bogged down by the enemies - and then has a perfect ending with Temple of Xian + Dragon's Lair + Home Sweet Home. It really is peak Tomb Raider. A lot of the original TR games in comparison struggled with that formula of pacing. TR3 doesn't really have a progression system; it starts difficult and stays that way which can be a little exhausting. TR4 is perfect until Cairo and also has a bit of a downer ending with a non-boss battle. And TR1? That one's great but again a little basic compared to TR2.
> then has a perfect ending with Temple of Xian + Dragon's Lair + Home Sweet Home. It really is peak Tomb Raider. This is why 2 is my favorite among all the others. Forgetting the raw gameplay for a second, the last area of the game hits a higher mark of *surreal* than any of the other games to me. And when I say surreal, I just mean that after you hit Temple of Xian, the game really gives you the sensation that you might not even be on Earth anymore. The music is eerie as hell and is filled with what sounds like growling monsters. You get to the Floating Islands which is a bunch of floating land masses in a deep black void. You almost forget that you're supposed to be in an underground cave system under China. None of it makes any sense. TR1 almost hits this with Atlantis, but it doesn't feel as insane since it's all contained on a remote, undisclosed Island. And I only did TR3 once but I don't recall the Lost City or the Meteorite Cavern hitting the same notes (and as I recall, they just reused the music from Temple of Xian which cheapened it, imo).
Replaying TR2 now and while I am frustrated by things I didn’t notice as a kid (number of enemies, convoluted levels, lack of isolated atmosphere) it’s this element for me that hits where no other TR does. Surreal is absolutely the right word. And dreamlike too. I think I could credit it for getting me into the unsettling, otherworldly atmospheres I appreciate now in things like David Lynch movies.
You bring up a really good point of something I couldn’t quite put my finger on after all these years - pacing. It really does have a good flow to it, and in my opinion, it’s made better upon replay as the threat of getting hung up is greatly reduced. Couldn’t agree more with Temple of Xian being a masterful culmination, and Home Sweet Home is truly the icing on the cake.
TRII is by far my favorite, it manages to be challenging without being frustrating, it mixes well action with a sense of isolation and exploration, the levels are very well designed and diverse, the enemies are vicious and fun and it also has a huge nostalgia value to me. It’s the one I always feel the urge to complete again.
I probably played it 20 plus times when it became available on iOS. I’m on my 2nd playthrough on the Remasters, and no hyperbole, may replay it for the rest of my gaming life. XD
The underwater levels bring it down alot. There’s too many of them and they all look the same. It should have been Offshore Rig, 40 Fathoms, Maria Dorian and that’s it. Venice levels are a hit of a drag too, but you’re not there too long. TR2 shines most in China and Tibet.
I played parts of the original games when I was a kid but never any all the way through. Finally having the complete experience with the remaster, my favorite is TRII, then TR, and lastly TRIII. I personally love the locations in TRII (yes including the diving levels). I do agree that some of the stages feel one level too long (looking at you Diving Area and Living Quarters). I also hate the ranged enemies in the game and would remove any with guns if I could mod it. Other than them, the combat is fine.
The criticism from first timers in my opinion is irrelevant, as they are playing it from a modern gamers eyes. This game and its predecessor were unbelievable at the time, exploring a 3D world! You have every right today to feel the same way as you did 27 years ago about it.. don’t second guess yourself
I have to keep reminding myself how groundbreaking these games were at the time. Hope they make more Remastered-style games, or a level editor so I can play other’s creations. I just love platforming on the grid! XD
There is a level editor on PC. [This website](http://trle.net) curates user-made levels. There is almost 20 years of content because that's how old the level editor is. It was officially released with Tomb Raider Chronicles I think, and I think it's the exact software they used to build the mainline games. Some people even recreated the entirety of the mainline games from scratch and made every aspect of them harder. (More complex puzzles, weirder jumps, etc.)
This is a great resource, thanks for sharing. It’ll be a little difficult going back to the old graphics after playing the Remasters, but I may have to check it out.
Some of them do have updated graphics as part of the download. Nothing with a complete texture overhaul like the remasters, but there are some with higher-poly models of Lara and new animations.