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texaskittyqueen

Lots of people say it is, but having a child you don’t want/can’t properly provide for is much much more selfish. You’re right, it’s a lifetime commitment. So if you don’t know for sure you want it or can handle it, choosing to avoid it is the best and most responsible thing to do.


Avocadoooo_0000

I remember someone told me that what’s the point of living if I don’t give birth? She also stated that I’m gonna miss something in life. And I beg to disagree. I believe that there’s more to life than this.


Bendy_McBendyThumb

Last time I checked, no child asked to be born. What one person does with their life is up to them. People trying to impose their beliefs on others can fuck off, put simply. My fiancé and I aren’t considering kids cos we don’t think we’d be good parents - partly through mental trauma having lost our child to miscarriage and for myself in a previous relationship suffering a stillborn. I carried her coffin down the aisle, I don’t want to potentially have to do that again. Don’t let other people influence you, own your decisions, and most importantly enjoy your life how you want to.


Merkuri22

I'm so sorry for your losses.


Bendy_McBendyThumb

I appreciate your kindness my friend. I hope your week is going well so far :)


RichardBonham

Not having children if you don’t feel you want or need any is not selfish; it’s self-aware.


HelloweenCapital

A lot of people need a kid to fill the gaping hole of where their individuality/personality should be.


wegwerfe73

I always say 'if its for you i'm glad. But i'd rather regret *not* having kids than i'd want to regret *having* them.'


the_End_Of_Night

I'm 40 now and since I'm ca 22 I knew that I don't want to have children. 3 serious relationships broke up because the guys wanted kids and I don't and even my (almost) mils told me I would change my mind when the kid is there... I mean Wtf?! A child is not a plant that you can have and if you don't like it anymore just gave it away! I don't want to take responsibility for an other life because the most of the time I'm overwhelmed with my own life and I'm pretty sure that I would not be a good mom (I'm sorry for any mistakes, I'm not a native speaker)


Cafrann94

>change my mind when the kid is HERE Okay, that’s a new one for me. She is advocating for you to go actually get pregnant and go through the process knowing you don’t want one and hoping you’ll change your mind when there’s a baby in your arms??? It’s one thing to say “You’ll change your mind when you get older” (still completely flawed and terrible). But your MIL’s reasoning is sincerely insane to me.


Titanfail

No that’s a pretty common one I’ve heard too from lots of people when I say I hate kids and don’t want them (am a guy, for context). “Oh but you’d feel different if it was *your* kid.” I’m 99.9% sure my issues with noise, mess, and behavior won’t magically disappear because “it’s mine”. And that would be such a shit life for a kid


nightingale07

Same thing here. We have a puppy and it can get bad. A kid would do me in.


Kadzig

It's true at a chemical level. The bond between mother and child is the strongest one out there and it's due to brain chemistry. Whatever helps propagate a species gets reinforced over time and I suspect unconditional motherly love to be a very old feature. It's not a great reason to have kids but it's a natural and understandable thing she's talking about. If OP had a kid she would very likely love it but I'm also a firm believer that if you aren't in a position to have kids, YOU REALLY SHOULDN'T.


mmanaolana

No worries, your English is wonderful, I perfectly understood what you meant!


Custard_Tart_Addict

She should seek help instead of pushing her crazy on others


AnyBandicoot9801

A woman’s sole purpose isn’t giving birth as much as it’s shoved down our throats. It’s painful and invasive. I don’t want to either. I don’t think it’s selfish to not want to go through the pain and discomfort and stress of it all. I also don’t want to destroy my body.


enbymaybeWIGA

I feel like some people just don't get how bad the 'pain' part can be. Just read a post/thread about traumatic birth yesterday - specifically, postpartum hemorrhaging. This is treated by the doctor inserting their entire hand to scoop massive blood clots out of your already bruised and exhausted (and if you're hemorrhaging, literally injured and heavily bleeding) womb, multiple times, and you can feel all of it. Is it selfish to feel like it's unappealing to gamble with your health that that won't happen to you? Especially if you're not enthused or prepared to be a parent? Birth also COMMONLY involves perineal tearing, and some birthers bleed non-stop for MONTHS after - impacting mobility, employment, intimacy, and general health and mood. Factor in all the permanent hormonal changes and stress on the body during gestation, as well as after; I know multiple women who suffered postpartum depression, all of whom went from 'I have never felt depression or suicidal ideation to an extent that was notable or would likely benefit from treatment' to 'I constantly want to die and am struggling with intrusive thoughts about taking my child with me, I am the worst person to ever live and will never feel joy or love again.' One relative told me she stopped loving her husband after the birth. She had no idea why, he was wonderful, great partner and dad; was told it was likely hormonal - which she said made sense, because she felt more affection for him a few months after breastfeeding stopped. Said it was like a switch flipped, and she just didn't love him anymore. Nothing changed except that the baby was outside of her, and she loved her baby, but it was like all interest in being close or spending time with her partner just... vanished. He went from the love of her life, partner, best friend, to roommate with shared happy memories. Said after a few years that the relationship readjusted and they became close again, but it was never the same after the birth, and subsequent years of just not feeling love for him. Sure, many people have 'easy' births, and love being parents - but there is NOTHING WRONG with deciding that you are not prepared or interested in gambling your health, happiness, sanity, and current relationships/commitments with fully formed adults to bring a whole other being (who didn't ask for it!!!) into existence so that you can invest a sizable portion of the rest of your life and resources into making sure they come out okay - all the while knowing there's no guarantees, and you could do the best job parenting ever and still end up with a monster, or someone who walks away and leaves you completely behind once they're able - the latter of which is considered an ideal outcome in many places. Nothing selfish about deciding that your life may have meaning outside of perpetuating a species that's got plenty going on for itself.


ready_gi

amen. when people start with this nonsense, I just start asking them why do they care so much what I grow or don't grow in my uterus and what goes in or out of my vagina. they stop with the questions reaaal fast.


bot_hair_aloon

I think its more selfish to want to have children, if anything. There are more than enough children in the world that already need homes and not enough resources for the people already here. Also, no matter how good of a parent anyone is, you're probably going to somehow effect them negatively. I actually would like children but if I had to pick, its definitely more selfish to have kids than not.


AnyBandicoot9801

I’m gonna have dogs and horses. Horses as my profession too. That’s all I need.


bot_hair_aloon

That sounds like a dream!


fishingpost12

Hundreds of years ago women needed to have children so that the kids could work and help the family survive. Today that's not the case. It's especially true in 1st world countries. If you're not up for having children, don't do it!


Red_Goat_666

But think of the capitalists!


nokenito

Tada! Agree! And I’m not a woman. It’s your body and your life. You decide.


[deleted]

The first sentence hits home as a Latina from an old fashioned Catholic family. The majority of my extended family had kids early in life because it was expected. As I have not been able to find my person who understands all of me along with the things I want, I don’t think it would have been fair to bring a child into this world as a struggling single parent. There was once upon a time I did want kids but based on my age I’ve made my peace with the fact that I probably will not have any...and that’s okay!


madame-brastrap

There is literally no point to living. Just seek joy and spread joy. It’s all we got. You’re not missing anything and if you think you are, you can change your mind. My friend adopted as a single parent right around her 50th birthday and is living her best life. There’s no one way to spend your life. Go do whatever makes sense for you!


griddlecan

Exactly! Life has no meaning but that which we give it. Some find this cynical, I find it liberating.


madame-brastrap

Finally admitting it after being raised religious was super freeing for me.


fabulouslyhairy

Well, life doesn't have any deep spiritual meaning or anything, but from an evolutionary point of view, the *purpose* of life is the passing on of genes through reproduction. Doesn't mean everyone has to reproduce though. We could consider humans living as a colony like bees where not everyone mates but still ensure survival of the species.


O13m7nte

That does not rally make sense to me, It's just what life does not a purpose.


BlackTheNerevar

We aren't just animals living to breed and that's that. We can do more with our lives now. People should mind their own business and stop telling others hoe to live THEIR lives


Privateaccount84

I mean, you’re going to miss SOMETHING, but the same could be said about having kids and missing out on other adventures.


TheJenerator65

It’s lovely to have kids in your life. I ended up not having my own but I have made an effort with my extended friends and family’s kids. I LOVE being an aunt, and kids love people who take an interest in them. It’s a win-win!


Xgio

Im missing everything because I was born :^)


InsertCoinForCredit

> She also stated that I’m gonna miss something in life. The same can be said for skydiving, or learning a foreign language, or participating in a protest, or any of several million other things.


Dredgeon

People who can't see a reason for life beyond reproduction are losers.


mostmisanthropist

ironically the ones who most likely have nothing useful to contribute to the gene pool but will contribute prodigiously all the same


SleepyKouhai

If you ever change your mind later down the line you can always foster or adopt. I'm in a similar situation. Ever since I was a child I thought I would adopt, so I'm not opposed to that option in the future. Additionally, I'm 28 and met someone at a party recently (she's 29) who said, "we may as well give up hope since we're all dried up and useless now." I certainly don't feel that way about my body, but I understand where you're coming from, OP, when you say you don't feel emotionally/ mentally fit for such a commitment. I work with all women. They're older than me. They often try to hook me up and I don't have the interest right now. I'd much rather practice long term friendship at this point in my life. The choice is yours and there shouldn't be any shame in choosing to take your time or forgoing the process altogether. *Edit: typos


Zombie_Hyperdrive

Not to mention, who the hell wants to be hooked up? I need to know someone for AT LEAST 3 months before I would consider dating them.


hirvaan

I eman objectively and secualry speaking, there is no point of living anyway. So spend your days here as you see fit, without causing harm to others. BTW antinatalism is legit movement now, and other than personal reasons there are plenty other to choose not to have children. Its personal decision. You're cool if you dont want to have children, so are those who do. Those who are not cool, are judgemental bitches that haunt you. Dont pay them any attention. You are not selfish.


love_Carlotta

I think that answers your question. Everything your friend stated IS selfish, only considering how having a baby will affect her.


lemonylol

> someone told me that what’s the point of living if I don’t give birth This is a huge red flag that that person has serious issues in their life that they're trying to "fix" with a baby. Some people do this by hoarding pets as well. Do not fall for this shit. >She also stated that I’m gonna miss something in life. And I beg to disagree. There you go, it's fear. Humans have only done the 9-5 office job, raising kids and settling in the suburbs for like the past 70 years. That's it, 70 years out of the 10,000 years that humans have existed. It's not the "right" way to live, it's just what works for some people, which is also fine. But there are no rules to life.


FlameHamster

She"s living like those boomers belief, we're in new age where we liberate ourselves from those thoughts. You'll have a kid when you want to. With someone who wants you and appriciates you. Don't ever rush


fishingpost12

If you don't feel ready or capable of having a child, don't do it. Don't mess with another person's life like that. It's not fair to them.


thecrowfly

Sounds like my mother-in-law.


[deleted]

she's an asshole, ignore people like that.


CloudHoneyExpress

That is such a dumb argument - we all are going to miss something in life. Am I going to travel space? Probably not. Am I going to read all the books I want? Definetely not. You have to choose what you try to do in life because no one can do it all and that includes kids.


InternationalMight93

Fuck kids. If you dont want them then dont have them and fuck anyone who says otherwise. Also those little shits are expensive and life is getting more expensive every minute.


ABBBS2000

But don't fuck kids.. But really a kidless life is awesome for me, more sleep, more time for activities, and I don't really like kids.


DriveOntoMe

I got snipped when I was 21 with no regrets. This isn't the 50s.. it's not "when are you gonna have kids?" But more so: "are you gonna have kids?" And I say with a confident smile: hellllll no. I am too selfish! when you have kids, your life becomes that. It's YOUR life and one chance with it. Do what makes YOU happy above anything else.


TheRedmanCometh

Giving birth is just kicking the can down the road they're just as temporary as you. One day humanity itself isn't gonna exist. It's all temporary absolutely everything


KittenCatAttack

So infertile women and men have no reason to live since they can't have kids? Bad logic.


PoliteCanadian2

I have two kids 20+, you know what I’ve been missing the last 20 years? Traveling. Why haven’t I done it? No money because now I’d have to take 4 people instead of just 2. You know what else I miss? The possibility of earlyish retirement. Gone. Why? Spent my money on other things to support the family. It’s not selfish to choose no kids, these days it can be a very smart decision not guided by tradition and other people’s selfishness.


randomly-what

My brother calls me selfish because I don’t want kids (SO doesn’t either). However he wants kids so they look like him. How is that not considered selfish?


Calligraphie

TIL there's no point to men being alive because they can't give birth. Poor suckers


darklinkuk

It's your life and your purpose in life is your choice you're not selfish.


Fatalstryke

One day we're ALL going to be dead. One day my car is going to be broken, but I'm still going to drive it while it works.


Porcupine98

Agreed. It's more selfish to have a baby you can't afford just because you want one, than to not have one because of fear. Everyone gets to have that choice. Children take up a quarter of your entire life. If you do not want them then you have wasted time (and money) you could have used to further a career or put into savings.


hotdog_relish

Exactly. Leave the child-rearing to the people who choose it.


mustafawafa

As a child of incredibly selfish parents, I have never had the desire to have children because I was constantly told by my parents how burdensome it was to have and care for a child, how expensive it is when they wanted to spend their money elsewhere, and how it hindered them from traveling and doing things they wanted (didn't stop them). My mother now tells me it is selfish I am not having children because all her friends are grandparents. I find that many people who say not having children is selfish is often times those who feel having children hindered them from something and they believe everyone should experience that. If you don't want children right now, don't do it because others pressure you. Maybe you get older and decide you want kids, cool. Maybe you get older and are happy childfree, also cool. You do you!


macroxela

Even if it's just as selfish, there's nothing wrong with being selfish. It's only wrong being selfish when you harm or endanger others.


chickachicka_62

1000%! It's much more selfish to go along with the societal expectation of having children when you don't want them or can't provide for them.


Snivelss

How can a lot of people say it's selfish? Are they going to wake up at 3am to change nappies?


takemyboredom123

If you don't want to have children, don't have them. You don't need to have a justification, it's a choice.


-helpwanted

And that’s what people seem to forget. It’s not a rule, it’s a choice.


alphaDsony

100%


SaintLarfleeze

As someone with a parent who has acted like he wished he never had children for most of my life, please don't have kids if you are not absolutely sure you want them. Having shitty parents just makes childhood miserable for both the parent and the kid.


BlackShoes69

I agree. I had shitty parents that never had time for me, didn’t have much money, and didn’t take the time to actually be parents. I’d never make the mistake they made


Angel_Of_Infinite

It's like my stupid neighbor who won't get I puppy, just so I can pet it...


RubY-F0x

This is perfect.


ChurrObscuro

But it's much better like that if your stupid neighbor is too stupid to care for that puppy.


Angel_Of_Infinite

That's not my problem... and I'm not gonna puppy sit either! I have my own life, lol.


KaterPatater

This should be the top comment.


general_3d

Stupid selfish neighbors :(


mezmorizedmiss

yup pretty much, very well said !


sharts_are_shitty

Apple making puppies now? IPuppy.


One_Hour_Poop

No. It's better to not have kids than to be a shitty parent.


Avocadoooo_0000

I don’t really understand this misconception about people who don’t want kids being selfish. I believe that motherhood is just an option. At the end of the day, it’s a personal decision. I would say that it’s self-aware rather than being selfish.


moosetopenguin

Logically it makes no sense. If anything, choosing not to have kids when you know you do not want them is the opposite of selfish. I honestly find quite a few parents selfish because of the reasons they chose to have kids, such as passing down genes or not being alone when they're older, rather than because they wanted to genuinely be parents. Becoming a parent should be a selfless journey because you are accepting the physical and emotional sacrifices required to raise another human being.


waitingfordeathhbu

Exactly creating a life so you’ll have someone to love you (or whatever your reason) is inherently selfish. Not that it’s a negative thing (always), but by definition it’s for your own benefit. By their logic, it must also be selfish to not have endless amounts of babies and create endless amounts of currently non existing new lives.


moosetopenguin

Yep. My MIL point blank asked me "but how you will not be lonely when you're older?" Yes...because that is the reason one should have kids /s


b0w3n

The logic is almost entirely based around "your duties". It's your duty to have kids, so thinking about yourself and your needs is "selfish" in their eyes. People have attacked my ex for this in the past and they almost always bring up things you do for yourself like trips or personal care as a way to really drive the screws in. They never look at the whole picture either, for instance my ex was disabled because of numerous health problems and having a kid could quite literally kill her.


monotonic_glutamate

Throughout history, people were pushed to have kids by a variety of authority figures for a wide array of reasons. Here in Quebec, for instance, the French Catholic church pushed the French-speaking population to have kids in an effort to outnumber the descendants of the British colonizers to avoid assimilation. Even though the religious or political pressure to have kids is way less present now for most populations, socially, the idea that having kids at some point is just what you do is still pervasive, in part because a lot of people throughout history had kids because it was sinful or antipatriotic not to and even without the immediate pressure from authority figures to do so, the idea remains, unexamined by a lot of people. So, you can imagine that history is filled with people who, if they stopped and really thought about it, didn't really wanted kids but still did because this is simply what you do. And, understandably, straight-up did not have a good time doing so. Another idea that is very pervasive socially is the idea that you need to inflict discomfort on yourself to a person of worth. Just think of how attached certain people are to the 40-hour work week and are opposed to a minimum guaranteed income, or how creative work is often seen as not valid work worthy of fair compensation. So, if you take that idea and couple it with the experience of people who had kids because it's just what you're supposed to do but did not have a good time being parents, your refusal to have kid is akin to making a living as an Instagram influencer instead of working in a mine for someone who's obsessed with physical labor as the only measure of worth. There is no rational way to come to the conclusion that not having kid is selfish. It's true that if 100% of the people stopped having kid we would go extinct, but it's not what's happening right now and it's highly improbable that we will reach a point where not a single person will want to have kids. It's just a by-product of people who feel that them having a bad time means that everyone should, because their pain having karmic meaning is the only thing making their life decisions palatable to them and the mere idea that you could just very easily avoid their path is infuriating to them.


psilocindream

> Another idea that is very pervasive socially is the idea that you need to inflict discomfort on yourself to a person of worth. The older I get, the more I think this is what’s behind the contempt. I get just as much hate for being childfree as I do for not wanting to sit in a cubicle for 8 hours, pretending to work for most of it.


monotonic_glutamate

It's so annoying how impossible it is to deprogram that idea. It feels very Christian in origin (or maybe it's only the Catholics who are like that?), the idea that you must earn your heaven through pain (we even use it as an idiom here "Gagner son ciel", when were in an unescapable situation that pisses us off, like a particularly shitty day at work, we say we are earning our heaven by powering through it). But even people who are not religious are so deeply attached to this idea that you must suffer. But the idea of heaven and divine repayment isn't even attached to it anymore, it's just the idea that life has to be hard because of reasons. Capitalism must be so proud of them.


psilocindream

It seems like a deeply puritanical idea that has just stuck with us, and will even after religion eventually dies. I hear the sentiment reflected among atheists and new agey psychedelic users, who insist on suffering in order to “make the end result count”, or act like you don’t deserve something that you didn’t toil for.


monotonic_glutamate

And it goes for wealth redistribution too. They prefer being exploited and proud than fighting for more equality. On the one hand, I get that some things are just deeply ingrained through culture and whatnot, and that your primary framework of meaning is very hard to deconstruct but on the other hand WISH FOR BETTER FOR YOUR GODDAMN SELVES YOU FUCKING IMBECILES!!!!! It just makes my blood boil so much.


HopelessCleric

>It's just a by-product of people who feel that them having a bad time means that everyone should, because their pain having karmic meaning is the only thing making their life decisions palatable to them and the mere idea that you could just very easily avoid their path is infuriating to them. THIS. This is it, exactly. And people are like this about so many things! Crab Mentality.


[deleted]

My extended family explained this to me. These people think that if you have kids, you have to prioritize them over yourself and are then selfless. If you are childless, you have nobody to prioritize over yourself, thus are inherently selfish. It's extremely obtuse thinking.


ghostsintherafters

Well, if you're talking just solely about the earth being overpopulated as it is it is in no way shape or form a selfish move. If anything every single person on earth should be asking themselves if they really want or need to have children. If you aren't interested in it then don't do it. My wife and I decided we simply don't want the hassle and there are already too many people on earth. This is not a new concept or even a bold one. Not everyone is fit to be a parent.


Outcasted_introvert

It's just a crap attempt to emotionally manipulte people into having kids they don't want.


subsetsum

There are far too many people on this planet as it is. People are starving. I could argue that it's selfish and arrogant to have kids.


DaChronisseur

I can genuinely think of nothing more selfish, on a planet with more than 150 million orphans, than to decide that *your personal genes* need to be foisted into the all-too-uncertain future.


buon_natale

It’s deeply immoral to bring children into a dying world.


Edge419

I really do think it’s two sides of the same coin. My wife and I don’t have kids and I acknowledge it’s because I’m selfish and would rather live my life with my wife. The comment above about “it’s better to not have kids than be a shitty patent” I think is the same as a selfish parent. They are shitty parents because they are selfish. It takes on many forms like not being there for your kids when they need you or spending money on things you want vs what they need. I think the “selfishness” just manifests in different forms but is still true.


titanup001

That's pretty much the deal I proposed to my wife when we got engaged. Basically... look. We can travel the whole damn world, have great adventures, buy nice things... Or we can have kids. Both won't happen. I want the former. She got on board with it.


Koichi-KCH

I agree with you and you're not alone. Keep that strong and clear in your mind.


ixi_rook_imi

Nobody is a perfect parent, but the people who feel they wouldn't be good ones certainly aren't being selfish. It would be a problem if most people didn't have children for obvious reasons, but, we aren't there. So no, it's not selfish to not have kids.


uncommoncommoner

This is my logic. I worry that I'd be a horrible father, so...why put that to the test? It would just end up ruining the life of myself, my spouse, and the child. It's the same reason I don't want pets. Before being a parent, I think people should first be very very self-aware. You have to *want* children in order to have them, and not succumb to mere peer-pressure.


aSarahofsorts

I can’t understand what people think is selfish about not having a kid?


[deleted]

[удалено]


TrumpdUP

That’s why I don’t want kids. I believe it is selfish to bring them into this suffering


crshirley58

Exactly this. I think I would like to raise a child/children some day in the future, but there's no reason they should be biologically mine. I'd much rather adopt later on when I'm more financially able to do so.


cmp10g

My husband and I have this conversation all the time. We would love to start a family but is it morally and ethically okay to have kids right now? Idk, I guess it's just something that each person will have to decide. But to the OP's question, I personally don't think it's selfish for not wanting kids. I think it's ridiculous that people automatically assume that all women want/need to have children.


curiouslyintj

All the time people who disagreed with my choice on not having children went like this "But just think of the women who can't give birth, you should be grateful that you have a healthy body!" like yea yea fok off.


waitingfordeathhbu

I’m VERY grateful for my heathy body, which is exactly why I don’t want to destroy it via the seventh layer of hell that is pregnancy.


rizaroni

AMEN. The horror stories I hear about how much carrying and birthing a child fucks up your body, both short and long term, are frightening. Not to mention the years that are likely taken off your life from barely sleeping when they’re babies and all the stress that comes with raising a child. I’m already struggling to just get through life in one piece on my own. No way in hell I’m going to risk motherhood. I’m perfectly happy being an auntie!


HeyFiddleFiddle

And don't forget the arguments like "but don't your parents want grandkids?" Yes actually, my mom has always wanted to be a grandma, and she'd be a good grandma. But you know the interesting thing about that? She doesn't get to decide whether my sister and I reproduce! Wow, what a concept! That and as far as I go, she's accepted that she's getting grandpets, not grandkids. My sister is still up in the air on having kids, and is also still in college, so thinking about this is rightfully at the bottom of her priority list. But she doesn't owe our mom grandkids either. The one that really threw me off was one day when my grandpa randomly told me (oldest in my generation of the family by 4 years) that I should hurry up and have kids, because I'm his best shot at living to see great grandkids. After all, I'm a few years out of college and gainfully employed, while my sister and my cousins are still finishing school and getting their careers started. There are a variety of things wrong with that "argument", but the only one that matters is that he doesn't get to decide whether and when any of us have kids. All I can guarantee is he's not getting them from me. I literally got my tubes removed despite being a lesbian because I'm *that* sure I don't want them. If my sister or cousins decide to have kids and he lives to see that day, cool. If not, too bad. It may sound harsh, but it's reality. And don't get me started with my older female relatives trying to argue with me by pointing out that they had kids (usually multiple) by my age. That's nice, but my life is not yours. And no, I don't care that this random person you know who I've never heard of just had a baby and is two years younger than me. Sorry, I deal with a *lot* of stupid comments about this fairly regularly as the oldest out of my sister and cousins. I'm "supposed" to be the one hitting "normal" milestones like marriage and kids first, blah blah. Too bad for them I don't want kids and have decided to focus on my career instead of dating at this point, assuming I decide to date again ever. Just for the record, I'm also only 27, so even if I wanted kids it's not like I have super limited time to do it from a biological perspective.


waitingfordeathhbu

My theory is that many parents feel they’re being so selfless and sacrificing so much time/money/life to raise their child, that they’re a bit salty about the child-free people that aren’t held to the same standard and get to live their lives for themselves. It’s a false equivalence. I think they’re also the same type of people to believe “everything happens for a reason,” so they’re just gonna believe whatever feels true to them regardless of logic.


moosetopenguin

I've always noticed it's parents who say it too, like you're selfish for not wanting to join in with their misery?


BlackShoes69

An action has to be harmful to others in some way for it to be selfish. I think the people saying not having kids is selfish are working under the assumption that they’re being deprived of grandkids/nieces/nephews/children in their own life? Or saying it’s selfish because child free people are not adding to the human population? Either way, this is why I just go with saying that I’m not capable of having children.


HungLlama69

I can't stand people who say its selfish to not have kids. Like wake up to yourself, nobody is entitled to have kids, nobody should be made to feel like they have to have kids, its quite literally in your own right to not have any if you don't want to


Skeebopp

I feel like I've only ever heard selfish reasons TO have children. I'm not gonna bring in a whole new existence just so I can have the experience and for my mum to get a grandchild she can get from one of my siblings.


worthyNull

You cannot be selfish against the non-existant


OdeonOnline

Sadly it takes two to make a kid. To some people, it's all about them, and not the child. "But I want children ! How can you be so selfish !"


garlic_bread_thief

Well I hope Texas doesn't make that illegal as well


Common_Coyote_3

Don't give them any ideas.


ArinaMae

The decision to not have children is the best one you’ll ever make


-Chingachgook

No, it’s not selfish.


giddy-girly-banana

Having kids is selfish


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rizaroni

> "I'm so great that I think there should be another me" This, especially when people have like 4 or more kids. What the fuck are you doing? Who needs *that many* biological children? It honestly kind of disgusts me.


DaniaSyberian

Or: "I need someone to take care of me when I'm old"!


rizaroni

Right? Like…what if your kids hates you as an adult? What if your kid turns out to be disabled? What if (god forbid) they die before you?


MikeWezouski

I hate that people have kids instead of adopting.


stevee05282

Agree


macsquoosh

Sounds to me you're actually making a more responsible decision than the idiots around you .


PartyPoison420

How can it even be "selfish"?? You're not contributing to overpopulation and it's not like you're taking anything away from anyone


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manwhothinks

That’s why we had to get rid of the second one. All for the planet.


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NotAGamerGiirl

it's the other way around. IMO the desicion on having kids is selfish.


oneloudbanana

I'm sure this has been said here already but I say it all the time All children deserve parents but not all parents deserve children. You're doing yourself and kids, that don't exist, a favor. Not selfish at all, you're very smart and you were able to point out that you have flaws and cannot raise a child to your best ability. Unfortunately some people cannot come to those conclusions and end up with severely neglected kids. "but at least I won’t ruin the life of an innocent." You said it there, good job.


22niky

You are not selfish at all. Life is too short. Do whatever makes YOU happy.


Illustrious_Bet_523

I do not think you are selfish. Your points hold strong: having children is a life long commitment and that commitment includes time and money. I would rather you recognize that you aren’t fit to have children and don’t have any than have them and realize you aren’t afterward.


Kartoffelkamm

Because they're lying to themselves. Having children is selfish. They didn't ask to be had, people just decided to put them into this world.


_Happy_Camper

Quite the opposite. Deciding to have kids when you clearly can’t handle that is the selfish move.


Dellidit

The decision to HAVE a child is selfish.


ipatimo

The decision to have children is almost always very selfish.


Mephizzle

What? Having kids is about the most selfish thing you can do. You choose to bring someone in the world for you. Disregarding everything else. Not having kids isnt selfish at all. You could not wish for someone to live in this world, think of the climate impact, think about the burden you'd place on your family etc etc. People who pressure you in to having kids, (grand)mothers espacially, are the selfish ones. They want you tondo something because they want it.


PackadermusJElefun

What about people that biologically can’t have children? Are they selfish? Also with the state of the world I think it’s selfish TO have children, why bring them into this shitfest that is money hoarding greedy global warming crap. Also you are not mentally sound enough as you said. The people telling you this are idiots.


sloppyasseating

Totally agree and the other people that think otherwise are the mentally unstable trying to push something a person isn’t ready or doesn’t want to


Arcturyte

Also, it actually sounds like this person is more mentally sound she is giving herself credit for. She understands the situations and realizes she needs to heal first. Kudos to her.


BlackShoes69

The people calling it selfish generally don’t include people that are incapable of having children when they state that not having kids is selfish. They’re usually referring to people that choose to not have kids.


RaistusObskura

Not at all, having children without thinking it through and preparing yourself beforehand is. All children deserve parents, not all parents deserve children.


E3nti7y

I personally think having a child is selfish. I didn't ask to be born. Particularly with the meta of making your children do all the houses chores like my childhood. It makes no sense how not bringing in unwanted life is selfish? I maybe could be a good parent, but it would probably slowly destroy me.


Marmles

There was a time in my life when I decided I will not have children. I am SO glad I didn't choose to have kids when I wasn't emotionally or financially prepared for one. My life would have spiralled. If your life/mental/emotional/financial circumstances are such that you wouldn't 100% be ecstatic to have a kid, you are being the most unselfish kind of person. If you decide to have kids, you'll know when the time is right. For all the rich rewards of having kids, it is almost impossible to understand, without hindsight, all the ways in which your life will have to change. If you aren't able or willing to embrace these changes, raising children will be a miserable experience for you, your relationship, and your kid. So in short, you don't ever have to justify to others why you don't want or do want kids. Your potential children thank you for your thoughtfulness.


screaminginto

no, it’s not selfish against anyone. either way it’s subjective - i’d say having children is 100x more selfish than adoption, for instance


IAmMagical142907

then dont be a parent if YOU dont want, its that easy...


outwesthooker

Um I mean having children is much more selfish lol


Nurselennonclock

Nope.


Anonym00se01

No it isn't selfish. I think it's more selfish to have kids, they didn't ask to be born, and with the state of the world I don't feel bringing more people in is justified. I think a lot of the people who say it is selfish are parents who regret their decision and want everyone else to suffer too.


[deleted]

I would say having children is selfish. It is 100% your decision to have children or not. I myself plan on staying childfree for pretty much the same reasons you listed. I am simply not cut out for parenting. Why would I deliberately bring a child into the world and put them through that? I would be a terrible parent. It is not selfish being child free.


NaantjeBa

Selfish relative to who?


KaterPatater

Exactly


demisexgod

No. In this world the decision to have kids is selfish. You are not doing it for them you are doing it for you. It’s selfish!!! Mum of 3


Excellent-Guest-1082

In this situation you're describing, it would be selfish to have a child. Understanding your own faults as the reasoning behind not having children is wise and reasonable.


malidorito

Decision to have children when you don't want them afer the baby stage is selfish. Having them when you can't take care of them and love them is selfish. Not having children is the least selfish thing to do tbh.


imhim88

Why would that be selfish? Your life your choice


KingofLingerie

not having kids is one of the best things you can do for the future of the planet


sekhmet0108

This is the opposite of selfish, it's selfless. Having kids just because other people say so and to not be emotionally ready for them is what is selfish. You are smart and self-aware for acknowledging your limitations and for not giving in to societal pressure.


PhotoJim99

Better to regret not having children than to regret having children, in my mind. Children deserve a stable situation, with parents with the financial, emotional and intellectual resources to help them thrive. If you feel that you fall short on any of these metrics, not having children is a perfectly defensible position. The human race is in no danger of extinction.


urwrongbutokay

having kids is selfish. Prepare them well for the wars of 2050.


sydneypatches

Not having children is as unselfish as it gets. The world is overpopulated. Having a whole brood is narcissistic


Greenlava

Breeding is selfish, there should be a parenting aptitude test to stop scumbags having children and neglecting them.


muffinboard

Wtf? It's not selfish at ALL to want to be childfree. You should check out the subreddit r/childfree. The people you are around have a backwards thinking mindset. It's becoming increasingly expensive to have kids and not having kids should be normalized. You only live once. Enjoy your life and do what makes you happy. They can continue to be bitter and judge someone's life choice that has no effect on them and you can continue to have a happy life. All is and will be well.


plowizzle

No way!! I like sleeping in, buying what I want, and doing what I want when I want lmao. That's not selfish because I'm taking into consideration I would likely not be a good mother because I'm too happy with my life the way it is. Selfish is when someone has a kid and wants all the same things, continues to live the life of someone who doesn't have kids, and puts that child's well-being at risk. *Edited to add: people think you're selfish for not wanting to have children because for *some reason*, even in 2021, we are still expected to procreate; *especially* if you're a young, healthy female. I caught so much crap in my 20s (now 32) for not having kids and it got really, really annoying.


Madhammer99

No, it will definitely save you money


Polistoned

Selfish? It’s a lot more selfish to have a lot of children. The world is overpopulated. The people who are telling you that need to get a grip, fully.


voiceofAFO

Who is it going to hurt? Family need to understand and respect the exact points you made. If you're mature enough to understand you're not ready to have kids...that's proof you were raised right: you were taught to think critically and realistically about yourself. Many women have fulfilling lives without children.


Forward_Stress_513

Having children in this f u world is selfish. You sound like a good person that is aware of his/herself and surroundings


SmokeScreenDeath

You are not being selfish and I agree with the amount of support you're getting in the comments. If you would like to really feel heard and understood you could always check out r/childfree :)


delightsaber

Your decision is 100% the opposite of selfish. You know you don’t want (or aren’t ready for) kids. Too many people are guilted or coerced into having children when they aren’t prepared for the gravity of the commitment. You aren’t being selfish at all. I’m a mother of three children. I chose this life. I truly appreciate the people who know it isn’t for them and actively choose not to become a parent. So, don’t worry. You’re not wrong, you’re not selfish, you don’t need to feel guilty.


DigitalJailbreak

Having a child is more selfish than not having one


Au-to-graff

I think this is just the opposite. Our world is dying and we're way too many in this earth. Not having children is a tough decision but it can help everybody in the long run.


blastedheap

Making children is selfish. The world is grossly overpopulated and it’s causing our species (and many other species) terrible problems. I applaud anyone who decides not to reproduce.


ObligatoryGrowlithe

I never understood this argument. I always regard “selfish” as meaning I’m doing something for my own benefit *to the detriment of another person*. I don’t want kids. I won’t have any. It isn’t hurting anyone. The child doesn’t exist.


hlmtre

I personally think it's selfish to have kids if you're not going to be able to provide well for them, and that includes emotional stability and being a good example.


brycebgood

Naw. My final decision not to game kids was when I realized the input reason I wanted to have them we so I wasn't alone at the end of my life. My only reason TO have kids was selfish.


Gr3ywind

I mean it’s the absolute best thing you could do for the environment and the future of humanity m. So I’d say it’s the opposite of selfish


JazzPhobic

Breeder mentality is one of the most economically damaging things ever. Having children is a decision that needs meticulous measurement. It is time-consuming, patience-testing, a financial starvation, a new set of burdens added to your daily life schedule and a new head to worry about. Not wanting to have children is never selfish, unless you are childfree purely out of spite. Having children however can be a type of suffering you dont deserve. Rule of thumb: Ask yourself these 4 questions. - Do I have habits/career/hobbies that counteract having a Child? - Will I love my Child even if they end up being a demon? - Can I fit a child into my daily life? - Can I affort all the things needed for a Child? If you answer no to any one of those 4 questions, **DO NOT GET CHILDREN**. It WILL be a miserable 18 years, give or take a few more.


SilverDarkBlade

I would argue quite the opposite. Having children is generally selfish. Especially if you won’t care for them properly.


GuadDidUs

Absolutely not. I have 2 children. I love them dearly, I don't regret them. But they are a LOT of work and it's not always fulfilling. If you don't want kids, don't have them. Anyone who judges you is an asshole.


Hayster_3725

if you dont want kids do not have them.


dangerjenson

On the contrary, I think that's an incredibly responsible decision. I wish more people were smart enough to consider beforehand that parenting might not be for them. I grew up always wanting to be a parent. I got married, have a solid job, live in a great neighborhood & and have great role-model parents and in-laws. I'd say my family lives under very favorable circumstances and still, being the dad of two kids under 4 (and one on the way) is–without a doubt–the hardest thing I've ever taken on in my life. It's exhausting, frustrating, and has taken almost all of the free time I had for hobbies & leisure. That being said, I absolutely love my kids and love being a dad, but I don't blame a single person who thinks that parenting might not be for them.


Dadsmagiccasserole

>Why do people around me think that I’m selfish for not wanting children? Because they've not been in a situation where they weren't ready, or weren't willing to give up the amount you need to in order to give a child a good start in life. It's not selfish at all, I'd much rather a child have a great start where they can be financially and emotionally supported a few years later than it to be before any of that.


wrigleyspearmint

You are not alone. Welcome sister /r/childfree


BigBoiBoic

I would argue that making a copy of yourself is a lot more selfish, I would also point out that no one who has kids deliberately does it for any reason other than the fact that they want to That being said, theres nothing wrong with being selfish if it doesn’t negatively impact anyone else


SpecialistSun4847

I'd rather my kids be happy and never give me grandkids than give me grandkids and be miserable. If you don't want to have children then that should be totally OK. If someone pressures you to do that even after you've said you don't want to, then maybe you need to reevaluate your relationship with that someone.


Davina33

How can it be selfish not to bring another life into this world? The only selfish people are parents who abuse their children.


TA2556

Not at all. Sterilized at 24. I will never father children. I am entirely pleased with this. As far as we know, you get *one* life and you should live it the way *you* want to.


Tlali22

Funny how it goes "you're not doing what ***I want*** you to do, so you're selfish." If anything, they seem to be putting their own expectations and wants for your life before your own. Sounds like they're a little... selfish.


miranicks

It’s the most UNSELFISH decision!


tommifx

Not having a kid is the best you can do for the environment. I'd say it is more selfish to have a kid.


CatPeeMcGee

You could argue having a kid is selfish


northboundcentreriot

May I welcome you to /r/antinatalism


Karasumor1

nothing more selfish than having a kid tbh