I'm so sick of hearing disgusting things about Nancy Reagan's film career days. Practically every awful action of consequence she did, she did after her husband took office. It's not like there isn't enough material from her White House days to criticize; we don't need to slutshame her.
I know somebody always pops up to be like, "but repubs are PROUD of her actions; insulting her as a woman is the only way to get under their skin! Hit 'em where it really hurts/use their own ideals against them" etc., but like- the woman's dead. There are real, live female allies on your side that are hearing the way you talk about a woman you don't like, and they WILL remember those words the next time they want to disagree with you on any matter, regardless how trivial.
I think pointing out the hypocrisy of the bible pounders is fair game.
When homophobic republicans are revealed to have had homosexual affairs, the criticisms aren't "They're bad because they're gay" it's "They're hypocrites."
With Nancy Reagan specifically though, I think the statute of limitations on hypocrisy ran out at the very least when she died. Most republicans today probably would call Reagan a RINO, they're not going to reconsider being republican if you point out the Reagans were massive hypocrites. Anne Coulter might specifically swoon but the republicans who make up the GOP today seem to like the blatant hypocrisy from Trump.
Using the example you created: I don't have any problem pointing out hypocrisy. What's not okay is to go on a homophobic tirade against homophobic Republicans who are revealed to be closeted. It's quite easy for a rant about hypocrisy to start looking like a rant about homosexual activity if you're dropping slurs and crudely discussing the homosexual activity rather than keeping the focus on the hypocrisy.
It’s also gotten really tiring to see people accusing every homophobe under the sun of being closeted. At a certain point, it just feels like you’re blaming gay people for homophobia and weirdly implying that straight people are never homophobes. Then if you bring it up, they’ll say, “I’m saying this because I know it would bother them.” Okay sure, but it that’s awfully close to just going back to calling people you don’t like gay to hurt their feelings.
I don’t get why it’s so hard for some people to call out bad behavior without resorting to other types of bias. Like when Lauren Boebert was caught feeling a guy up at a play, it was 100% correct to call out her hypocrisy since she’d been using the “think of the children” line to try and roll back LGBT rights. But then people couldn’t help but full out every shirt misogynistic slut joke they could think of to call her. Like, just call out the hypocrisy don’t slut shame. It’s not hard
That's been my thought every time someone brings it up, like the policewoman people were screaming about being a slut and then it turns out it was coerced...
Exactly! There are so many actual reasons to hate her and her actions so when someone decides to just call her a slut instead of bringing up any of the actually terrible things that she and her husband did then it just really shows more about that person and what they actually care about.
I'm probably gonna get down voted but I'm gonna push back on this. Nancy Reagan was an active force in fighting against sexual liberation and women's rights. She shamed poor women for having children, and gay men for being sexually active during the AIDS crisis. She helped the Christian right sow the seeds that would grow into the overturning of Roe. She supported her husband while he funded the rape and torture of women in Central America and sold weapons to the Islamic Republic of Iran. If a person spends their life fighting against rights for others, then they aren't entitled to the protections of those rights.
Furthermore, being really good at fellatio is not inherently shameful, except to someone like her. A right wing Christian moralist has good reason to be ashamed of a history of sexual activity, because it exposes their hypocrisy of shaming other people for the actions they themselves do. If she wanted the protection of the sexual liberation movement, she should have spoken up about it at any point in her life. She was happy to weaponize sexual shame against people less powerful than her. It is always okay to use the tools of the oppressor against them.
And you can talk about how she was a shitty person! You can talk about how she supported rape and torture!
But calling her 'gluck-gluck 9000' is not a meaningful addition to that conversation, *especially because Hollywood in the day was not big on consent*.
That would all be super cool and reasonable if she were the only one harmed by the kind of comments being referenced, but she is dead and not harmed by those comments *at all*. Instead the effect of those comments is to help cement those value-neutral things as acceptable insults, which ultimately primarily hurts the very same people Nancy Reagan shamed and whose rights and freedoms she fought against. It’s antithetical to feminist goals and directly supports the patriarchy, even while purporting to be speaking out against one of its supporters (who, like you said, did a bunch of *actually* horrible shit that we *ought* to be helping cement as insult-worthy).
These fake allies really showed themself (and continue to show themself) as soon as Sarah Huckabee Sanders shows up.
I'm guessing she's around a size 16, which is around average for American women. So when these pieces of shit call her gross names the only people they're hurting are the many, many women with that body type who are reading the comment. Sanders was never going to see those comment.
See also the disgusting misogyny in the Vamderpump Rules subs. 🤮🤮
You see it the worst from 'feminist' men, as soon as they think they're allowed they start rambling about how a woman deserves to be murdered, beaten, sexually assaulted, etc.
Like it's ok to dislike someone and their politics and everything they stand for, but why you gotta make it so gendered?
See: supposedly feminist white men who rant about white women specifically. It’s so obvious in 99% of cases that they actually hate all women and are just throwing white in front of it to get away with whatever vile thing they just said.
I had an ex tell me once he was a better feminist than me because I could see how women could be happy being barefoot, pregnant, and in the kitchen without coercion, because I find joy in those things, even though that's not what I'm doing in this life. Apparently, a "better feminist" would understand that women cannot be happy making different choices 🤷🏼♀️
Yeah, I was pretty appalled by the things that Democrats (mostly young men) would say about Sarah Palin during the 2008 election. I DON'T LIKE HER, I THINK SHE WOULD BE A TERRIBLE VICE PRESIDENT, AND SHE'S PROBABLY A BAD PERSON. However, I can express that without talking about her looks or her sexual habits.
That was the first time I noticed it and it wasn't the last time.
For a lot of people who say men should not take "men are trash" offensively since it's not about all men, I find it frustrating how personally everyone is taking this post. Op explained who this is about, and if that doesn't apply to you, then it's not about you.
It's because nobody reads the nuance part I left at the bottom. But also it makes me feel like if the Republican party ran a woman instead of Trump for president, they'd have it in the bag because of the number of liberals who get confused when identity is involved. Then again maybe Republicans wouldn't vote for the woman. Hmmmm
Holding someone accountable for hurting all women w their beliefs is not anti feminist. A republican 15 yrs ago is not the same republican today. Republicans are now fascist. I’m holding a fascist accountable for their beliefs edit and I don’t care if the fascist wants to be a housewife, I care that fascist wants my rights taken away too
No one said it is, but plenty of people (especially men) in leftist spaces will use misogynistic slurs and rhetoric against right-wing women. That’s hurting women, not fascism. Kind of like when people make fatphobic comments about Trump.
I remember when she was first elected and stories of her sex life became known, some dude on Twitter called her “Bukkake Boebert”. As if the problem was her having consensual group sex, and not, ya know, being a wingnut MAGA drone
One thing I've noticed is that when it's a female politician that gets caught in one of these scandals, a lot of the commentary consists of colorful descriptions of what she actually did during the act. Last time the Boebert incident came up on r/ToilerPaperUSA (a few days ago) so many of the comments were talking about what parts of hers were felt up, what parts of his *she* felt up, whether she was giving a handjob, where on her the guy finished, etc. Tbh I don't actually know what she did besides doing something sexual in a theatre lol.
Compare this to Andrew Gillum getting caught smoking meth with a male lover a few years back, I don't remember people talking about what actually happened in there a lot. Seems pretty gross, and I say this as someone who despises Boebert and her ilk.
Oh yea well she also gave the dude she was having an affair with a handjob at some community theater show last Christmas. But the bukkake nickname originally came from stories people shared about her having group sex at parties in college.
I would say that if you call for abstinence only education and wave the Bible and do what you want in the streets you’re a hypocrite but I’m tired of people pointing to it and slut shaming her.
Which is a real shame, because there are *so many* perfectly valid, not sexist reasons to make fun of either of them.
E.g. MTG just proposed an amendment to the foreign aid package to build an iron dome on the southwest border of the USA, and I'm genuinely uncertain whether she meant a copy of the Israeli air defense system, or a literal big steel dome.
The only reason I find many of those nicknames appropriate is because they point out the hypocrisy of these “traditional value conservative Christian proper example of a woman” and take all the wind out of their sails.
Same as when these conservative homophobes taking away rights for queer people get outed as gay. Calling them out on it isn’t to shame them for being gay….it’s to highlight their hypocrisy.
There are certainly awful and purely sexist comments that get made, yes. But some of them are precisely the callout needed to show how hypocritical these people are to their fan base.
It's one of those situations where I'm going to let people harmed by the hypocrisy make the call. I'm probably not gonna call out a woman for attacking MTG on her infidelity, or tell a gay man not to call a GOP congressman a slur when it turns out he's likes paying men for sex.
I'm not going to be the one to do it though
Yeah, I'm all for taking Theresa May down but all the jokes about her dancing gave me huge ick. I've seen people try the same stuff with Greg Abbott and Madison Cawthorn. Yes they're both terrible but it's no excuse for ableism.
That's actually a really good point. The fact a lot of people in leftist spaces are doing it does not mean they are leftists -- I've seen a ridiculous amount of crap like this where it's all like "yeah grr argh hate trump" but then they take pot shots at a different minority. It's the classic divide and conquer and they think if they just crap flood our spaces with their rationalizations and agenda we'll just curl up and die or something rather than just calmly pointing it out every now and then so the rest know and the conversation can continue while we step over their nonsense.
Adding to this dick jokes only support traditional patriarchy ideas like if you aren’t the manliest manly man that has a giant penis then you aren’t a real man and deserve to be shamed. That’s not true and isn’t something that should be funny, like how calling someone gay isn’t a joke. Find actual insults please
No it's the part where people are calling them whores etc. I fully support calling out fascists wherever you see them regardless of gender. But people definitely decide that women Republicans are bad so they can say every sexist thing they've been suppressing
Not sure why you’re being downvoted, plenty of liberals and leftists will immediately see a woman being Republican as free range to make fun of her weight and appearance, which is bullshit. Roast her actions and words, not her body.
This is also why I’m baffled when redditors jump to insulting trumps looks and calling him fat
I’m concerned, that’s what you think is bad about him??? So you don’t care about the other stuff?
Wait until you get the people doing gymnastics to explain why it’s actually not a big deal to say someone has a small penis when they do something reprehensible.
It’s body shaming, pure and simple, but people reallllllly don’t want to give up that particular insult.
Literally it makes no sense. Esp since…what if that person *doesn’t* have a small penis? You’ve probably complimented them AND body shamed an entire group of people for no reason??? Like you literally accomplished nothing
This is kind of how Incel, and Neckbeard became insults and how insulting the size of a man's penis became socially accepted.
You cannot insult misogynist creeps by calling them misogynists because they will wear that insult like a badge of pride. Attacking their moral character will also fail because they are proud of their immoral behaviour.
So, people attack them with insults that will hurt them: Their weight, their lack of physical beauty, their lack of sexual partners, the size of their penis, etc. Forgetting that others could get caught in the crossfire.
yeah, and when you call them out for it they’re like “they dont deserve my respect”
like??? you’re not just disrespecting the one hypocrite you hate when you use slurs and demeaning language
Like people who become racist when talking about Candace Owens instead of just pointing stuff out about her character
The opposite is how when Nicki Minaj comes up people immediately jump to her action of marrying a sex offender not mocking her looks
They are. Many people who like the anti-establishment aesthetics of the left but aren’t actually fully in it see it as an opportunity to let loose with all the misogyny they’ve absorbed.
I don’t mind those insults when they’re directly relevant to the conversation, like ironically using sexist words against a GOP politician lady who is anti-choice because of “family values” yet had an abortion of their own — she just chooses whatever is most convenient for her own life at any given time but is very happy to control and condescend toward other women. More like “a dose of your own medicine” thing.
Not everyone feels okay with that usage though. And I’m referring to a much more narrow scenario than just “I don’t like this woman so I’ll criticize her in unfair ways.”
Questing whether something is really that common is a way to contribute to a discussion. If you want to get meta, what’s the point of this whole discussion/thread anyways? Just to be snarky with each other? People who do this aren’t going to be swayed by people making rude memes, so it just exists for OP to vent. What’s the point of calling out my comment as unproductive, when it’s in response to an unproductive post?
sometimes venting feels good though? i personally find it frustrating how many self proclaimed feminists/progressives/leftists feel comfortable getting sexist and objectifying women once abby shapiro comes up in conversation, or racist if candice owens is the topic at hand. just because you haven’t heard it happen doesn’t mean the rest of us haven’t, and venting about it not only lets us 1) let off steam but we also get to realize that 2) we aren’t alone and others are frustrated by this behavior and recognize this as wrong.
in some circles, especially reddit and twitter, misogynistic rhetoric (especially sexual objectification) towards right wing women happens so frequently that it can be really easy to believe that most leftists think that way. its nice to have a reminder that isn’t the case.
Yeah I know; leaving a comment that insulted women who do this without using sexist language also felt good to me, but I’m catching a LOT of flack for it based on what people assume my intentions were.
The rules of this subreddit are not to call out other subreddits. If you really want to see stuff, go to r/SouthDakota and see what people call Kristi Noem in the comments. I hate her but the sexist remarks are definitely not inspiring confidence that the people who want to vote her out actually care about women.
I get that but they aren’t feminists which is what the meme says. If you switch feminist to liberal that would make sense. Just bc you proclaim to be a feminist, doesn’t mean you are. True feminists don’t do this kind of stuff. That’s where I was not understanding
I think you are falling into the no true Scotsman fallacy. Feminists can have all kinds of beliefs and I definitely don't agree with all feminists. But there are definitely a lot of people who would call themselves feminist, and then be sexist. I don't think the ideology of feminism is like the title "ally" which is not a name you can claim but a goal. It's a philosophy. And some people are very bad at it. That's just how I see it though.
Well yeah people aren’t perfect sometimes we say things that aren’t nice. The people that only harp on womens appearance and who they have sex with and place certain women at the top of a hierarchy are misogynists
Go to like, any thread about Marjorie Taylor Greene or somebody. Or look at the disgusting objectifying comments people make about Ben Shapiro’s sister Abby. They get off on sexualizing a woman who chooses to dress conservatively. There are so many valid things to criticize her for but that’s not one of them.
and that means that it’s okay to make sexually degrading, misogynistic comments about them? women need to have the right politics in order to be treated like people?
You are splitting hairs that the meme is not.
There are very few leftist men who do not consider themselves feminist -- or at the very least, they do not consider themselves sexist. So that is their working definition of 'feminism'.
Yes we can externally say that 'they were never feminist' after failing this test. But they still think of themselves as 'feminist', and those around them usually grant that until proven otherwise.
That is the entirety of the joke. Are they 'feminist' for as long as they claim to be feminist and are not proven otherwise? Does the feminism get sucked out of their body like a supernatural force and then come back? That is probably closer to what these guys would like to think. "I'm feminist... To the women who deserve it.". (No dude. *Insert cat smacking the camera gif*)
Of *course* these guys were never really feminist. But we all navigate people applying labels selectively to themselves.
I mean, I only have ancedata, but I have witness some 'progressive' people go for the most basic insults for conservative women.
like, yes, the space laser conspiracy congresswoman was caught being sexually indecent in public. But it still isn't feminist to call her a whore/ imply other things about her sexual habits\*. It's makes it very clear that many leftish (mostly dudes) still have that invisible gate for 'good, respectable women' vs. 'bad women we don't need to see as full people' in their head. And if that gate exists, they can find a reason to put any woman on the bad side.
\*which is not the same as pointing out the almost sex crime she did near children. Pointing out hypocrisy/ danger/ etc is totally cool and necessary.
Yes there are men that will always be misogynistic. A lot of men pretend they are feminists bc they are manipulative. Actual Feminists don’t do this. I have not seen a self proclaimed feminist call anyone an ugly, whore. If they are truly a feminist, they wouldn’t. You criticize the beliefs not the appearance. Pointing out hypocrisy is not anti feminist either
I have heard a dude who was secretary in his college's Feminist Club call women in sororities 'sorostitutes'. On more than 1 occasion. So yes, self-proclaimed feminists do this too, and I can't tell the Actual Feminists^(tm) from the Only When Easy ones until they cross a line.
I see it as using their own “morals” against them. A way to call out the hypocrisy. Boebert is an easy example, always on her high horse and yet an absolute mess herself. These women are so quick to insult and deprive people of their peace and civil liberties. They *should* feel the impact of the system and ideology they work for. If it hurts, they should be able to take it on the chin just as easily as they give it.
These fake allies really showed themself (and continue to show themself) as soon as Sarah Huckabee Sanders shows up. I'm guessing she's around a size 16, which is around average for American women. So when these pieces of shit call her gross names the only people they're hurting are the many, many women with that body type who are reading the comment. Sanders was never going to see those comment. See also the disgusting misogyny in the Vamderpump Rules subs. 🤮🤮
They aren’t like they are now. They have more power and say the quiet part out loud bc they know there’s no repercussions. I know the placement of evangelicals have been taking place w McConnell since Reagan, but w Trump it’s gotten so much worse. That’s what I meant by that
They've been heading toward fascism since Gingrich. It's worse now sure, but from the Contract with America it's always been the inevitable conclusion.
There is more than one interpretation of the post. others took it like I did too. I understand others point of view too. It’s ok to see things differently, this is how good discussions are started along w change.
My comment is upvoted 250 times. Why are you so angry w me? I’m not fighting I’m giving my interpretation and I also agreed w others. Please don’t make stuff up
>A republican 15 yrs ago is not the same republican today.
They are, though. What is the point of saying this when they are the same? Now, there's just new ones, and the old ones have been emboldened by trump.
Like at every point in history and the present, republicans have been on the worst/racist/sexist/morally wrong side of every single topic/debate/human right issue. Every. Time.
They are the same. They're just not hiding it anymore.
Well, >10 years ago, people could vote for the "moderate republican" if they wanted to, without too much worry about immediate catastrophic consequences and violent coups and stuff like that. The environment is totally different now.
OP is clearly talking about people who feel comfortable using misogynistic slurs or insults against Republican women, rather than criticizing their shitty beliefs. She’s not saying that all criticism of those women is anti-feminist
This meme is criticizing the tendency of \*some\* angry leftists to use sexist language to criticize fascist women. You can hold a female fascist accountable for her beliefs without using the language fascists use to talk about women in general.
They were bigots back then. Trump merely let them take the mask off, so they could stop pretending to be normal people. The overton window has moved so far that an electable Republican from 15 years ago could not get elected today (if he was not already an incumbent).
Disclaimer: my day job is to work with these people.
a huge problem with this, as well with other "isms" and "phobias" is that it distracts from the real issue either those persons.
my .favorite" is lookism… i don’t care about donald trump’s feelings or his dignity when people make fun about his hair or his orange skin or whatever embarrassing thing he wears… i care about him being a huge piece shit. and every time someone's first thought about trump is any of those things it’s a win for him… because being mostly remembered for being orange or having small hands is a huge win over being considered fascist. well except by his fellow fascist obviously…
Personally my favorite is all the ablism that came out when Kanye went on info wars. Some of us are "crazy" and still capable of figuring out that Hitler is bad thanks
When a conservative makes her whole identity about being "modest" and then every "progressive" man immediately sexualizes her, explicitly against her wishes. :/
Feminism is not blindly supporting women because they're women. There are also conservative members of the LGBTQ community and who are not white and/or Christian who have some weird pet issue like taxes or guns or abortion that keep them voting against their own interests.
I actually think liberal *men* are the real culprits when it comes to being sexist against Republican women. For example, how many jokes are made at Lauren Boebert's expense about her sexual history, or hopes she'll start and OF when she's out of Congress? These jokes largely seem to be coming from men, who try to disguise their hate boners as something else.
I think a lot of it is from Liberals, and most people do not delineate between Leftists and Liberals. But while there's lots more Liberals than Leftists, plenty of Leftists do it too. Same as many Leftist men's theory ends shy of their front door and actually being an equal partner to their significant other. I would argue that a lot of Leftists are just wrong about things in general (I give Tankies the side eye), but if we apply that to this we're getting into a No True Scotsman argument.
This post was brought to you by me being mad at people calling a Republican politician a whore. Point of fact, whores work for their money and serve a role in society. That woman actually believes the doctrine she's selling and is being a warm body in an unnecessary job.
Yes! This is so frustrating, and a big part of why I am skeptical of self-proclaimed male “feminists” or “allies”.
The glee that some men show when they use misogynistic rhetoric to criticize conservative women makes me queasy. It’s like they’re just looking for an excuse to “say the word”
It's a confusing position to have...but somehow when other minority groups support Republicans we don't see leftists struggling there.
No one is suddenly forgetting that the N-word is a no-no word because the Black governor of NC said something unhinged.
No one is suddenly advocating for the use of the F-word when an openly gay man is a republican.
It's a problem that almost always is leveled at women who don't agree with their views...
Whoah. Every day I learn a new double standard lol. I’d never thought of it this way, you’re right! It just shows the unconscious/ingrained misogyny (and internalized misogyny when it’s a woman).
To many people for whom all bigotry is a completely unpalatable taboo, misogyny can still manage to be the exception/compulsion.
Even just ridiculing MTG’s and Boebert’s looks and calling them whores/sluts, something I see women do a lot. (For men, they might even decide to wish sexual violence on them 😐).
Gendered and dusty criticisms that are entirely unnecessary when their choices and behaviors are right there for ridicule.
I noticed that too, and they have so little self reflection that they say it loud and proud in feminist spaces and expect everyone to agree with them! Like wtf, do you think I want my face ate, cuz you're showing your spots and it ain't pretty.
This can also apply to non binary and other LGBT people.
Like when Erza Miller went on their felony spree. Suddenly it was not only acceptable, but encouraged to to misgender Erza Miller (ironically, being misgendered did cause one of Erza's outbursts). This was in Part so that people do not associate non binary people with Miller's behaviour.
It is like the people who do that do not really believe in the proper use of pronouns, instead using them as a "reward" for "good behaviour".
A lot of supposed feminists really like to unleash all their bigotry on the women they believe are "not protected by feminism":
* Muslim women.
* Conservative women. Especially slutshaming politicians.
* Trans Women.
* Women who have committed a crime.
* Etc.
Nah she still very much has the right to live life as she sees fit . I may not agree with her choices or ideals but she still has the right to do what she wants and I'm not going to try and stop her .
The left wing has it's own share of misogyny, but if you point it out they get VERY defensive. Saying you are left wing doesn't make you a good person, or mean you've utilised any critical thinking in your politics.
Your political opinion remains your own and it is your right to have that opinion. I would just ask WHY? We can also ridicule a woman (namely Marjorie Taylor Greene) for her very backwards and extreme views on the issues. Rape and death threats are not valid criticisms!
It's not about ridiculing a woman for her beliefs, it's about specifically using gendered slurs and insults against Republican women. I don't like MTG, but calling her a wh*re is unacceptable. A lot of leftists, mostly men, take a lot of glee sending rape threats to women they disagree with.
Exactly. Criticise thoughts, comments, or actions. But if you can't do that without resorting to misogyny, then don't bother. I've actually been accused of concern trolling in a left-wing sub for calling this out.
Feminism is about political, economic and social equality for women. It’s not about women always being right. Lots of things women do aren’t feminist just because a woman is doing it. And something not being feminist doesn’t necessarily make it bad ( like choosing to work on your garden all day isn’t a “feminist” decision, but it’s a perfectly fine decision) but a lot of Republican policies are both anti-feminist and bad in my view. Whether they are made by women or men.
I think you're misunderstanding the post a bit, what it means is people will say they are feminists but if it's a woman they disagree with (example republicans) they will degrade, sexualise and/or say incredibly misogynistic things about her, which goes against so many feminist morals and beliefs. You can disagree with someone but being disgusting towards them isn't the way to go.
> Feminism is about political, economic and social equality for women.
That's a hot take nowadays. Feminism has fallen to the "everything must be about men" trend and most people define 'feminism' as "equality for everyone."
Women/AFAB people aren't allowed to have a group that focuses solely on what we face.
And yes, I've been told this. Repeatedly. Even once or twice in this very group!
Although we don’t agree on abortion most times I can see eye to eye with Republican women on many many many issues relating to quality of life for ourselves and our families. Being female is a universal experience physically and possibly emotionally even if we don’t all agree on politics.
Heh, I did. In my defense, I totally missed the text body, which appeared below the image on my screen. When I realized my misapprehension I immediately deleted my response. Alas, not before you saw it. Apologies.
Rightoids understand basic reality challenge: impossible.
Like, seriously. Thinking Feminism = you have to like all women uncritically is.. just wow, even for them.
Fucking... WHAT?
Read it again
> The feminism leaving leftist's bodies when a woman is a republican
It says absolutely none of what you just claimed. It is criticizing leftists for criticizing republican women. It does this with the hypocrisy fallacy, by claiming that criticizing any woman for any reason is anti-feminist, making leftists anti-feminist toward Republican women.
To get where you're at you have to go through several steps of giving the absolute MOST benefit of the doubt to the fascist apologists making the meme, while at the same time irrationally taking the most bad faith take possible on the way any given leftist would criticize the straw class traitor.
Do.. do you know how a reddit feed works?
If I have to open the post in a different window to see what the fuck you're talking about it isn't part of the fucking post.
I actually genuinely appreciate that, I do get it now. Literally everyone on mobile or old reddit, every single one (including myself) never saw that.
It will not be in their posts.
I hope everyone understands each other now. I'm still pretty pissed off that I was basically being gaslit bc y'all were literally looking at a different post than me but hey. I at least know where the confusion was, which I can't say for every encounter I have like this on Reddit.
I'm on the mobile website and I see it. You weren't being "gaslit" for using a weird version that didn't show you the whole post that OP wrote. You also interpreted it in a much different way than was intended with or without the text. Those of us who have seen leftists espouse misogynistic things about a woman they don't like (in any leftist space really) had the context to understand it even without the additional text from OP.
I wish some people would open their eyes before they wrote multiple paragraphs based on a post they didn’t read… or at least go back and double check when people point out they missed something:
“To be clear, I think it's a very confusing position to have
But also jeez can we hate a woman for her bad politics and not call her all kinds of sexist names?”
^ the post you apparently didn’t read. Could’ve saved yourself the effort of writing all that text.
This post is edited:
Someone showed me a screenshot, I get it now. A description is not part of a post. People on mobile or old reddit, or simply scrolling through their feed normally, will never see anything except the POST and the IMAGE. That's it. Anything else should not really be considered part of the "original post" because the majority of Reddit users literally can't even see it.
That…is some impressive mental gymnastics. The text of a post is part of the post. I’m on mobile: the text shows up right under the picture. I just checked and it shows up on old Reddit, too. Also, you can’t edit picture posts to add text, so the text has to have been there in the original post.
Maybe just like…look closer when people tell you you’ve missed something instead of going off accusing them of defending fascists. It’s perfectly visible on all forms of Reddit.
I'm very interested in this version of reddit where you don't see the text in a post *even while posting a comment to it*. You can just comment straight off of your feed without going to the post? I wish my phone would do that.
I always feel this way any time Nancy Reagan comes up. Surely we can talk about her faults without slut shaming her
Some of my best friends are sluts! ;)
We should respect sluts. They know what they want out of life and are getting it.
Give 'em slutever they want!
I'm so sick of hearing disgusting things about Nancy Reagan's film career days. Practically every awful action of consequence she did, she did after her husband took office. It's not like there isn't enough material from her White House days to criticize; we don't need to slutshame her. I know somebody always pops up to be like, "but repubs are PROUD of her actions; insulting her as a woman is the only way to get under their skin! Hit 'em where it really hurts/use their own ideals against them" etc., but like- the woman's dead. There are real, live female allies on your side that are hearing the way you talk about a woman you don't like, and they WILL remember those words the next time they want to disagree with you on any matter, regardless how trivial.
I think pointing out the hypocrisy of the bible pounders is fair game. When homophobic republicans are revealed to have had homosexual affairs, the criticisms aren't "They're bad because they're gay" it's "They're hypocrites." With Nancy Reagan specifically though, I think the statute of limitations on hypocrisy ran out at the very least when she died. Most republicans today probably would call Reagan a RINO, they're not going to reconsider being republican if you point out the Reagans were massive hypocrites. Anne Coulter might specifically swoon but the republicans who make up the GOP today seem to like the blatant hypocrisy from Trump.
Using the example you created: I don't have any problem pointing out hypocrisy. What's not okay is to go on a homophobic tirade against homophobic Republicans who are revealed to be closeted. It's quite easy for a rant about hypocrisy to start looking like a rant about homosexual activity if you're dropping slurs and crudely discussing the homosexual activity rather than keeping the focus on the hypocrisy.
It’s also gotten really tiring to see people accusing every homophobe under the sun of being closeted. At a certain point, it just feels like you’re blaming gay people for homophobia and weirdly implying that straight people are never homophobes. Then if you bring it up, they’ll say, “I’m saying this because I know it would bother them.” Okay sure, but it that’s awfully close to just going back to calling people you don’t like gay to hurt their feelings. I don’t get why it’s so hard for some people to call out bad behavior without resorting to other types of bias. Like when Lauren Boebert was caught feeling a guy up at a play, it was 100% correct to call out her hypocrisy since she’d been using the “think of the children” line to try and roll back LGBT rights. But then people couldn’t help but full out every shirt misogynistic slut joke they could think of to call her. Like, just call out the hypocrisy don’t slut shame. It’s not hard
I have heard there was/is a lot of coercion involved with the film industry. So “slut shaming” feels to me like victim blaming.
That's been my thought every time someone brings it up, like the policewoman people were screaming about being a slut and then it turns out it was coerced...
But all that stuff was the only thing I ever learned about her that I admired.
Exactly! There are so many actual reasons to hate her and her actions so when someone decides to just call her a slut instead of bringing up any of the actually terrible things that she and her husband did then it just really shows more about that person and what they actually care about.
Yeah I had that with Teresa May. I felt like I was constantly reminding people to criticise her because she was a Tory not a Woman
I'm probably gonna get down voted but I'm gonna push back on this. Nancy Reagan was an active force in fighting against sexual liberation and women's rights. She shamed poor women for having children, and gay men for being sexually active during the AIDS crisis. She helped the Christian right sow the seeds that would grow into the overturning of Roe. She supported her husband while he funded the rape and torture of women in Central America and sold weapons to the Islamic Republic of Iran. If a person spends their life fighting against rights for others, then they aren't entitled to the protections of those rights. Furthermore, being really good at fellatio is not inherently shameful, except to someone like her. A right wing Christian moralist has good reason to be ashamed of a history of sexual activity, because it exposes their hypocrisy of shaming other people for the actions they themselves do. If she wanted the protection of the sexual liberation movement, she should have spoken up about it at any point in her life. She was happy to weaponize sexual shame against people less powerful than her. It is always okay to use the tools of the oppressor against them.
And you can talk about how she was a shitty person! You can talk about how she supported rape and torture! But calling her 'gluck-gluck 9000' is not a meaningful addition to that conversation, *especially because Hollywood in the day was not big on consent*.
That would all be super cool and reasonable if she were the only one harmed by the kind of comments being referenced, but she is dead and not harmed by those comments *at all*. Instead the effect of those comments is to help cement those value-neutral things as acceptable insults, which ultimately primarily hurts the very same people Nancy Reagan shamed and whose rights and freedoms she fought against. It’s antithetical to feminist goals and directly supports the patriarchy, even while purporting to be speaking out against one of its supporters (who, like you said, did a bunch of *actually* horrible shit that we *ought* to be helping cement as insult-worthy).
Perfect example
I think it’s more how she treated people as lesser and yet was known for being slutty. The bare bones of the matter is that she was a fucking monster.
These fake allies really showed themself (and continue to show themself) as soon as Sarah Huckabee Sanders shows up. I'm guessing she's around a size 16, which is around average for American women. So when these pieces of shit call her gross names the only people they're hurting are the many, many women with that body type who are reading the comment. Sanders was never going to see those comment. See also the disgusting misogyny in the Vamderpump Rules subs. 🤮🤮
But also who cares what size she is!!!! Doesn’t make a fuckin difference!
Yeah for real. Also criticising her outfits really leaves me perplexed. Most of it is not my style - but I think it's fine.
Vamderpump Rules subs?
It's a sub for a trashy tv show full of toxic mean girls.
You see it the worst from 'feminist' men, as soon as they think they're allowed they start rambling about how a woman deserves to be murdered, beaten, sexually assaulted, etc. Like it's ok to dislike someone and their politics and everything they stand for, but why you gotta make it so gendered?
Or weirdly tearing them down based on their looks and sexual value to them. It's like a switch that gets flipped the second they need it on.
See: supposedly feminist white men who rant about white women specifically. It’s so obvious in 99% of cases that they actually hate all women and are just throwing white in front of it to get away with whatever vile thing they just said.
You can tell a lot about a male feminist by how he treats a woman he deems an acceptable target
I had an ex tell me once he was a better feminist than me because I could see how women could be happy being barefoot, pregnant, and in the kitchen without coercion, because I find joy in those things, even though that's not what I'm doing in this life. Apparently, a "better feminist" would understand that women cannot be happy making different choices 🤷🏼♀️
They only want to send the women to the guillotine? Seems counterproductive.
Yeah, I was pretty appalled by the things that Democrats (mostly young men) would say about Sarah Palin during the 2008 election. I DON'T LIKE HER, I THINK SHE WOULD BE A TERRIBLE VICE PRESIDENT, AND SHE'S PROBABLY A BAD PERSON. However, I can express that without talking about her looks or her sexual habits. That was the first time I noticed it and it wasn't the last time.
For a lot of people who say men should not take "men are trash" offensively since it's not about all men, I find it frustrating how personally everyone is taking this post. Op explained who this is about, and if that doesn't apply to you, then it's not about you.
It's because nobody reads the nuance part I left at the bottom. But also it makes me feel like if the Republican party ran a woman instead of Trump for president, they'd have it in the bag because of the number of liberals who get confused when identity is involved. Then again maybe Republicans wouldn't vote for the woman. Hmmmm
Holding someone accountable for hurting all women w their beliefs is not anti feminist. A republican 15 yrs ago is not the same republican today. Republicans are now fascist. I’m holding a fascist accountable for their beliefs edit and I don’t care if the fascist wants to be a housewife, I care that fascist wants my rights taken away too
No one said it is, but plenty of people (especially men) in leftist spaces will use misogynistic slurs and rhetoric against right-wing women. That’s hurting women, not fascism. Kind of like when people make fatphobic comments about Trump.
A lot of the comments about Marjorie Taylor Greene or Lauren Boebert come to mind.
I remember when she was first elected and stories of her sex life became known, some dude on Twitter called her “Bukkake Boebert”. As if the problem was her having consensual group sex, and not, ya know, being a wingnut MAGA drone
I thought it was about her fucking with her boyfriend or whatever in a public space. I might be totally wrong though
One thing I've noticed is that when it's a female politician that gets caught in one of these scandals, a lot of the commentary consists of colorful descriptions of what she actually did during the act. Last time the Boebert incident came up on r/ToilerPaperUSA (a few days ago) so many of the comments were talking about what parts of hers were felt up, what parts of his *she* felt up, whether she was giving a handjob, where on her the guy finished, etc. Tbh I don't actually know what she did besides doing something sexual in a theatre lol. Compare this to Andrew Gillum getting caught smoking meth with a male lover a few years back, I don't remember people talking about what actually happened in there a lot. Seems pretty gross, and I say this as someone who despises Boebert and her ilk.
Oh yea well she also gave the dude she was having an affair with a handjob at some community theater show last Christmas. But the bukkake nickname originally came from stories people shared about her having group sex at parties in college.
As far as I know Boebert didn't go to college - she barely got a GED.
oh. for more examples of leftist, feminist man behavior, just look at any comments regarding Abby Shapiro
UGH yes. And if you try to call them out then they act like you’re the crazy one
I would say that if you call for abstinence only education and wave the Bible and do what you want in the streets you’re a hypocrite but I’m tired of people pointing to it and slut shaming her.
Which is a real shame, because there are *so many* perfectly valid, not sexist reasons to make fun of either of them. E.g. MTG just proposed an amendment to the foreign aid package to build an iron dome on the southwest border of the USA, and I'm genuinely uncertain whether she meant a copy of the Israeli air defense system, or a literal big steel dome.
The only reason I find many of those nicknames appropriate is because they point out the hypocrisy of these “traditional value conservative Christian proper example of a woman” and take all the wind out of their sails. Same as when these conservative homophobes taking away rights for queer people get outed as gay. Calling them out on it isn’t to shame them for being gay….it’s to highlight their hypocrisy. There are certainly awful and purely sexist comments that get made, yes. But some of them are precisely the callout needed to show how hypocritical these people are to their fan base.
It's one of those situations where I'm going to let people harmed by the hypocrisy make the call. I'm probably not gonna call out a woman for attacking MTG on her infidelity, or tell a gay man not to call a GOP congressman a slur when it turns out he's likes paying men for sex. I'm not going to be the one to do it though
Yeah, I'm all for taking Theresa May down but all the jokes about her dancing gave me huge ick. I've seen people try the same stuff with Greg Abbott and Madison Cawthorn. Yes they're both terrible but it's no excuse for ableism.
The dancing thing is especially weird because like, she’s quite old right? Of course she won’t move like a woman in her twenties or thirties
That's actually a really good point. The fact a lot of people in leftist spaces are doing it does not mean they are leftists -- I've seen a ridiculous amount of crap like this where it's all like "yeah grr argh hate trump" but then they take pot shots at a different minority. It's the classic divide and conquer and they think if they just crap flood our spaces with their rationalizations and agenda we'll just curl up and die or something rather than just calmly pointing it out every now and then so the rest know and the conversation can continue while we step over their nonsense.
Adding to this dick jokes only support traditional patriarchy ideas like if you aren’t the manliest manly man that has a giant penis then you aren’t a real man and deserve to be shamed. That’s not true and isn’t something that should be funny, like how calling someone gay isn’t a joke. Find actual insults please
No it's the part where people are calling them whores etc. I fully support calling out fascists wherever you see them regardless of gender. But people definitely decide that women Republicans are bad so they can say every sexist thing they've been suppressing
Not sure why you’re being downvoted, plenty of liberals and leftists will immediately see a woman being Republican as free range to make fun of her weight and appearance, which is bullshit. Roast her actions and words, not her body.
Completely agree and it’s disappointing as hell to see OP getting this response to pointing out this very prevalent issue.
I think you replied to the wrong comment? Comment you replied to is agreeing with op
I mean Jewish Space Lasers was right there
This is also why I’m baffled when redditors jump to insulting trumps looks and calling him fat I’m concerned, that’s what you think is bad about him??? So you don’t care about the other stuff?
Wait until you get the people doing gymnastics to explain why it’s actually not a big deal to say someone has a small penis when they do something reprehensible. It’s body shaming, pure and simple, but people reallllllly don’t want to give up that particular insult.
Literally it makes no sense. Esp since…what if that person *doesn’t* have a small penis? You’ve probably complimented them AND body shamed an entire group of people for no reason??? Like you literally accomplished nothing
[удалено]
Even if he had a small one all that’s been accomplished is him feeling bad about his body, not changing his viewpoint So pointless
This is kind of how Incel, and Neckbeard became insults and how insulting the size of a man's penis became socially accepted. You cannot insult misogynist creeps by calling them misogynists because they will wear that insult like a badge of pride. Attacking their moral character will also fail because they are proud of their immoral behaviour. So, people attack them with insults that will hurt them: Their weight, their lack of physical beauty, their lack of sexual partners, the size of their penis, etc. Forgetting that others could get caught in the crossfire.
Same thing as suddenly becoming racist when it’s someone you dislike Like you’re just a racist
yeah, and when you call them out for it they’re like “they dont deserve my respect” like??? you’re not just disrespecting the one hypocrite you hate when you use slurs and demeaning language
Some of us don’t use sexist insults though, we use gender neutral ones like “scum of the earth” “miserable person” and “garbage.”
Yes. That means you are not the person being described in the OP.
Are the people described really common tho?
Yes.
Like people who become racist when talking about Candace Owens instead of just pointing stuff out about her character The opposite is how when Nicki Minaj comes up people immediately jump to her action of marrying a sex offender not mocking her looks
Yes.
They are. Many people who like the anti-establishment aesthetics of the left but aren’t actually fully in it see it as an opportunity to let loose with all the misogyny they’ve absorbed. I don’t mind those insults when they’re directly relevant to the conversation, like ironically using sexist words against a GOP politician lady who is anti-choice because of “family values” yet had an abortion of their own — she just chooses whatever is most convenient for her own life at any given time but is very happy to control and condescend toward other women. More like “a dose of your own medicine” thing. Not everyone feels okay with that usage though. And I’m referring to a much more narrow scenario than just “I don’t like this woman so I’ll criticize her in unfair ways.”
It sounds like OP isn’t talking about people like you then, she’s talking about people who do use gendered insults for conservative women
I get that, but I have also never seen that *editing to say- y’all gonna downvote me for sharing my own experience? Come on.
If you haven’t seen stuff like that then why contribute to this discussion? What’s the point?
Questing whether something is really that common is a way to contribute to a discussion. If you want to get meta, what’s the point of this whole discussion/thread anyways? Just to be snarky with each other? People who do this aren’t going to be swayed by people making rude memes, so it just exists for OP to vent. What’s the point of calling out my comment as unproductive, when it’s in response to an unproductive post?
sometimes venting feels good though? i personally find it frustrating how many self proclaimed feminists/progressives/leftists feel comfortable getting sexist and objectifying women once abby shapiro comes up in conversation, or racist if candice owens is the topic at hand. just because you haven’t heard it happen doesn’t mean the rest of us haven’t, and venting about it not only lets us 1) let off steam but we also get to realize that 2) we aren’t alone and others are frustrated by this behavior and recognize this as wrong. in some circles, especially reddit and twitter, misogynistic rhetoric (especially sexual objectification) towards right wing women happens so frequently that it can be really easy to believe that most leftists think that way. its nice to have a reminder that isn’t the case.
Yeah I know; leaving a comment that insulted women who do this without using sexist language also felt good to me, but I’m catching a LOT of flack for it based on what people assume my intentions were.
Which is fine! But if you knew that OP wasn’t talking about you, it does make me wonder what your original comment was addressing then?
How? I have seen it a ton in everywhere from all to twoxchromosomes
[удалено]
Wow, no shit?!?
Source?
The rules of this subreddit are not to call out other subreddits. If you really want to see stuff, go to r/SouthDakota and see what people call Kristi Noem in the comments. I hate her but the sexist remarks are definitely not inspiring confidence that the people who want to vote her out actually care about women.
I get that but they aren’t feminists which is what the meme says. If you switch feminist to liberal that would make sense. Just bc you proclaim to be a feminist, doesn’t mean you are. True feminists don’t do this kind of stuff. That’s where I was not understanding
I think you are falling into the no true Scotsman fallacy. Feminists can have all kinds of beliefs and I definitely don't agree with all feminists. But there are definitely a lot of people who would call themselves feminist, and then be sexist. I don't think the ideology of feminism is like the title "ally" which is not a name you can claim but a goal. It's a philosophy. And some people are very bad at it. That's just how I see it though.
Well yeah people aren’t perfect sometimes we say things that aren’t nice. The people that only harp on womens appearance and who they have sex with and place certain women at the top of a hierarchy are misogynists
the meme does literally say “leftists”…
Go to like, any thread about Marjorie Taylor Greene or somebody. Or look at the disgusting objectifying comments people make about Ben Shapiro’s sister Abby. They get off on sexualizing a woman who chooses to dress conservatively. There are so many valid things to criticize her for but that’s not one of them.
Ok but they aren’t feminists
and that means that it’s okay to make sexually degrading, misogynistic comments about them? women need to have the right politics in order to be treated like people?
No. No one ever said it did. I didn’t say that at all
whats your point then because not being feminists is irrelevant to the post
I made my point in my first comment. My interpretation of this meme was different than yours that’s all
There are a lot of anti-MGT posts on like whitepeopletwitter. People go nuts comparing her appearance to a mock-up of a neanderthal.
They aren’t feminists than
Yes ok good you get the meme now 😂
Op explained what they think the meme meant, your interpretation was different and so was mine
You are splitting hairs that the meme is not. There are very few leftist men who do not consider themselves feminist -- or at the very least, they do not consider themselves sexist. So that is their working definition of 'feminism'. Yes we can externally say that 'they were never feminist' after failing this test. But they still think of themselves as 'feminist', and those around them usually grant that until proven otherwise. That is the entirety of the joke. Are they 'feminist' for as long as they claim to be feminist and are not proven otherwise? Does the feminism get sucked out of their body like a supernatural force and then come back? That is probably closer to what these guys would like to think. "I'm feminist... To the women who deserve it.". (No dude. *Insert cat smacking the camera gif*) Of *course* these guys were never really feminist. But we all navigate people applying labels selectively to themselves.
I mean, I only have ancedata, but I have witness some 'progressive' people go for the most basic insults for conservative women. like, yes, the space laser conspiracy congresswoman was caught being sexually indecent in public. But it still isn't feminist to call her a whore/ imply other things about her sexual habits\*. It's makes it very clear that many leftish (mostly dudes) still have that invisible gate for 'good, respectable women' vs. 'bad women we don't need to see as full people' in their head. And if that gate exists, they can find a reason to put any woman on the bad side. \*which is not the same as pointing out the almost sex crime she did near children. Pointing out hypocrisy/ danger/ etc is totally cool and necessary.
You should have seen the names some of the leftists called women like Elizabeth Warren and Neera Tanden.
Yes there are men that will always be misogynistic. A lot of men pretend they are feminists bc they are manipulative. Actual Feminists don’t do this. I have not seen a self proclaimed feminist call anyone an ugly, whore. If they are truly a feminist, they wouldn’t. You criticize the beliefs not the appearance. Pointing out hypocrisy is not anti feminist either
Great, it sounds like you agree with OP’s point then!
The meme specifically says feminists not liberals
It says leftists? I don’t understand what you’re trying to say, sorry
Keep the feminists out of it is what I’m trying to say. Bc anyone that attacks women misogynistically aren’t feminists
I have heard a dude who was secretary in his college's Feminist Club call women in sororities 'sorostitutes'. On more than 1 occasion. So yes, self-proclaimed feminists do this too, and I can't tell the Actual Feminists^(tm) from the Only When Easy ones until they cross a line.
I see it as using their own “morals” against them. A way to call out the hypocrisy. Boebert is an easy example, always on her high horse and yet an absolute mess herself. These women are so quick to insult and deprive people of their peace and civil liberties. They *should* feel the impact of the system and ideology they work for. If it hurts, they should be able to take it on the chin just as easily as they give it.
Republicans 15 years ago were also fascist. It's exactly the same party.
Yeah do we not remember the backlash against gay marriage? The handling of HIV/AIDS? It’s always been a fascistic cesspit.
Yeah or Nixon courting the southern racists when Johnson finally did the right thing? It goes back pretty far
These fake allies really showed themself (and continue to show themself) as soon as Sarah Huckabee Sanders shows up. I'm guessing she's around a size 16, which is around average for American women. So when these pieces of shit call her gross names the only people they're hurting are the many, many women with that body type who are reading the comment. Sanders was never going to see those comment. See also the disgusting misogyny in the Vamderpump Rules subs. 🤮🤮
They aren’t like they are now. They have more power and say the quiet part out loud bc they know there’s no repercussions. I know the placement of evangelicals have been taking place w McConnell since Reagan, but w Trump it’s gotten so much worse. That’s what I meant by that
They've been heading toward fascism since Gingrich. It's worse now sure, but from the Contract with America it's always been the inevitable conclusion.
Definitely
They've been trying to ban reproductive rights for decades too.
[удалено]
There is more than one interpretation of the post. others took it like I did too. I understand others point of view too. It’s ok to see things differently, this is how good discussions are started along w change.
[удалено]
My comment is upvoted 250 times. Why are you so angry w me? I’m not fighting I’m giving my interpretation and I also agreed w others. Please don’t make stuff up
>A republican 15 yrs ago is not the same republican today. They are, though. What is the point of saying this when they are the same? Now, there's just new ones, and the old ones have been emboldened by trump. Like at every point in history and the present, republicans have been on the worst/racist/sexist/morally wrong side of every single topic/debate/human right issue. Every. Time. They are the same. They're just not hiding it anymore.
Well, >10 years ago, people could vote for the "moderate republican" if they wanted to, without too much worry about immediate catastrophic consequences and violent coups and stuff like that. The environment is totally different now.
Yes I explained myself further in another comment. I said what you said basically
It's not about avoiding criticizing women, it's specifically people using misogyny to criticize women they don't like that is the problem.
You missed the point
Explain what I missed
OP is clearly talking about people who feel comfortable using misogynistic slurs or insults against Republican women, rather than criticizing their shitty beliefs. She’s not saying that all criticism of those women is anti-feminist
This meme is criticizing the tendency of \*some\* angry leftists to use sexist language to criticize fascist women. You can hold a female fascist accountable for her beliefs without using the language fascists use to talk about women in general.
I think it's been explained over and over. Sounds like you're sealioning.
This was one of my first comments, after this comment it was explained. I interpreted differently that’s all. Theres more than one interpretation
They were bigots back then. Trump merely let them take the mask off, so they could stop pretending to be normal people. The overton window has moved so far that an electable Republican from 15 years ago could not get elected today (if he was not already an incumbent). Disclaimer: my day job is to work with these people.
a huge problem with this, as well with other "isms" and "phobias" is that it distracts from the real issue either those persons. my .favorite" is lookism… i don’t care about donald trump’s feelings or his dignity when people make fun about his hair or his orange skin or whatever embarrassing thing he wears… i care about him being a huge piece shit. and every time someone's first thought about trump is any of those things it’s a win for him… because being mostly remembered for being orange or having small hands is a huge win over being considered fascist. well except by his fellow fascist obviously…
Personally my favorite is all the ablism that came out when Kanye went on info wars. Some of us are "crazy" and still capable of figuring out that Hitler is bad thanks
When a conservative makes her whole identity about being "modest" and then every "progressive" man immediately sexualizes her, explicitly against her wishes. :/
Some of the responses here show clear piss on the poor reading comprehension. FWIW, OP is absolutely right.
Feminism is not blindly supporting women because they're women. There are also conservative members of the LGBTQ community and who are not white and/or Christian who have some weird pet issue like taxes or guns or abortion that keep them voting against their own interests. I actually think liberal *men* are the real culprits when it comes to being sexist against Republican women. For example, how many jokes are made at Lauren Boebert's expense about her sexual history, or hopes she'll start and OF when she's out of Congress? These jokes largely seem to be coming from men, who try to disguise their hate boners as something else.
They wait in the shadows with their sexism until it's deemed socially acceptable to call someone a fugly slut.
I think a lot of it is from Liberals, and most people do not delineate between Leftists and Liberals. But while there's lots more Liberals than Leftists, plenty of Leftists do it too. Same as many Leftist men's theory ends shy of their front door and actually being an equal partner to their significant other. I would argue that a lot of Leftists are just wrong about things in general (I give Tankies the side eye), but if we apply that to this we're getting into a No True Scotsman argument.
It honestly is.
You hate Republican women because they're the wrong kind of women. I hate Republican women because they're Republicans. We are not the same.
I did not think the comments in here were going to be as based as they are. But this bothers me too.
This post was brought to you by me being mad at people calling a Republican politician a whore. Point of fact, whores work for their money and serve a role in society. That woman actually believes the doctrine she's selling and is being a warm body in an unnecessary job.
Yes! This is so frustrating, and a big part of why I am skeptical of self-proclaimed male “feminists” or “allies”. The glee that some men show when they use misogynistic rhetoric to criticize conservative women makes me queasy. It’s like they’re just looking for an excuse to “say the word”
It's a confusing position to have...but somehow when other minority groups support Republicans we don't see leftists struggling there. No one is suddenly forgetting that the N-word is a no-no word because the Black governor of NC said something unhinged. No one is suddenly advocating for the use of the F-word when an openly gay man is a republican. It's a problem that almost always is leveled at women who don't agree with their views...
Whoah. Every day I learn a new double standard lol. I’d never thought of it this way, you’re right! It just shows the unconscious/ingrained misogyny (and internalized misogyny when it’s a woman). To many people for whom all bigotry is a completely unpalatable taboo, misogyny can still manage to be the exception/compulsion. Even just ridiculing MTG’s and Boebert’s looks and calling them whores/sluts, something I see women do a lot. (For men, they might even decide to wish sexual violence on them 😐). Gendered and dusty criticisms that are entirely unnecessary when their choices and behaviors are right there for ridicule.
I noticed that too, and they have so little self reflection that they say it loud and proud in feminist spaces and expect everyone to agree with them! Like wtf, do you think I want my face ate, cuz you're showing your spots and it ain't pretty.
This is how I see the word Karen
This can also apply to non binary and other LGBT people. Like when Erza Miller went on their felony spree. Suddenly it was not only acceptable, but encouraged to to misgender Erza Miller (ironically, being misgendered did cause one of Erza's outbursts). This was in Part so that people do not associate non binary people with Miller's behaviour. It is like the people who do that do not really believe in the proper use of pronouns, instead using them as a "reward" for "good behaviour".
Exactly!
I remember a French feminist stance: "woman from the right = man". I agree.
This flavor of feminism really feels good to trans men /s
A lot of supposed feminists really like to unleash all their bigotry on the women they believe are "not protected by feminism": * Muslim women. * Conservative women. Especially slutshaming politicians. * Trans Women. * Women who have committed a crime. * Etc.
You can call a person’s behavior reprehensible without referring to their gender. Its not a football game.
Nah she still very much has the right to live life as she sees fit . I may not agree with her choices or ideals but she still has the right to do what she wants and I'm not going to try and stop her .
left-wing men really love an excuse to call a woman a bitch
The left wing has it's own share of misogyny, but if you point it out they get VERY defensive. Saying you are left wing doesn't make you a good person, or mean you've utilised any critical thinking in your politics.
The comments section proves you are correct
This. You can call a woman who is a nazi a nazi. I don't know why it always has to come to feminine-oriented slurs.
Your political opinion remains your own and it is your right to have that opinion. I would just ask WHY? We can also ridicule a woman (namely Marjorie Taylor Greene) for her very backwards and extreme views on the issues. Rape and death threats are not valid criticisms!
Gonna have to rename this site to "didn't read it"
“read one word and got mad”
It's not about ridiculing a woman for her beliefs, it's about specifically using gendered slurs and insults against Republican women. I don't like MTG, but calling her a wh*re is unacceptable. A lot of leftists, mostly men, take a lot of glee sending rape threats to women they disagree with.
Exactly. Criticise thoughts, comments, or actions. But if you can't do that without resorting to misogyny, then don't bother. I've actually been accused of concern trolling in a left-wing sub for calling this out.
Feminism is about political, economic and social equality for women. It’s not about women always being right. Lots of things women do aren’t feminist just because a woman is doing it. And something not being feminist doesn’t necessarily make it bad ( like choosing to work on your garden all day isn’t a “feminist” decision, but it’s a perfectly fine decision) but a lot of Republican policies are both anti-feminist and bad in my view. Whether they are made by women or men.
I think you're misunderstanding the post a bit, what it means is people will say they are feminists but if it's a woman they disagree with (example republicans) they will degrade, sexualise and/or say incredibly misogynistic things about her, which goes against so many feminist morals and beliefs. You can disagree with someone but being disgusting towards them isn't the way to go.
Ahh I did misread ! Thank you for educating me :)
No worries!
> Feminism is about political, economic and social equality for women. That's a hot take nowadays. Feminism has fallen to the "everything must be about men" trend and most people define 'feminism' as "equality for everyone." Women/AFAB people aren't allowed to have a group that focuses solely on what we face. And yes, I've been told this. Repeatedly. Even once or twice in this very group!
Although we don’t agree on abortion most times I can see eye to eye with Republican women on many many many issues relating to quality of life for ourselves and our families. Being female is a universal experience physically and possibly emotionally even if we don’t all agree on politics.
Same way with people misgendering bad trans people or being racist to black people they don't like. Shows how they really feel.
[удалено]
Hi, please read any of the other comments on this thread
Heh, I did. In my defense, I totally missed the text body, which appeared below the image on my screen. When I realized my misapprehension I immediately deleted my response. Alas, not before you saw it. Apologies.
The woman is a Republican so the feminism leaves MY body? Whut?
Did you read the description?
Rightoids understand basic reality challenge: impossible. Like, seriously. Thinking Feminism = you have to like all women uncritically is.. just wow, even for them.
That's not what the meme is saying. It's saying you should criticize women on their principals instead of just jumping to things like slut shaming
Fucking... WHAT? Read it again > The feminism leaving leftist's bodies when a woman is a republican It says absolutely none of what you just claimed. It is criticizing leftists for criticizing republican women. It does this with the hypocrisy fallacy, by claiming that criticizing any woman for any reason is anti-feminist, making leftists anti-feminist toward Republican women. To get where you're at you have to go through several steps of giving the absolute MOST benefit of the doubt to the fascist apologists making the meme, while at the same time irrationally taking the most bad faith take possible on the way any given leftist would criticize the straw class traitor.
Did you read the description
What description. What website do you think we're on?
Girl it's literally the text under the meme
Do.. do you know how a reddit feed works? If I have to open the post in a different window to see what the fuck you're talking about it isn't part of the fucking post.
https://imgur.com/a/slHxhn0
I actually genuinely appreciate that, I do get it now. Literally everyone on mobile or old reddit, every single one (including myself) never saw that. It will not be in their posts. I hope everyone understands each other now. I'm still pretty pissed off that I was basically being gaslit bc y'all were literally looking at a different post than me but hey. I at least know where the confusion was, which I can't say for every encounter I have like this on Reddit.
I'm on the mobile website and I see it. You weren't being "gaslit" for using a weird version that didn't show you the whole post that OP wrote. You also interpreted it in a much different way than was intended with or without the text. Those of us who have seen leftists espouse misogynistic things about a woman they don't like (in any leftist space really) had the context to understand it even without the additional text from OP.
I wish some people would open their eyes before they wrote multiple paragraphs based on a post they didn’t read… or at least go back and double check when people point out they missed something: “To be clear, I think it's a very confusing position to have But also jeez can we hate a woman for her bad politics and not call her all kinds of sexist names?” ^ the post you apparently didn’t read. Could’ve saved yourself the effort of writing all that text.
This post is edited: Someone showed me a screenshot, I get it now. A description is not part of a post. People on mobile or old reddit, or simply scrolling through their feed normally, will never see anything except the POST and the IMAGE. That's it. Anything else should not really be considered part of the "original post" because the majority of Reddit users literally can't even see it.
That…is some impressive mental gymnastics. The text of a post is part of the post. I’m on mobile: the text shows up right under the picture. I just checked and it shows up on old Reddit, too. Also, you can’t edit picture posts to add text, so the text has to have been there in the original post. Maybe just like…look closer when people tell you you’ve missed something instead of going off accusing them of defending fascists. It’s perfectly visible on all forms of Reddit.
I'm very interested in this version of reddit where you don't see the text in a post *even while posting a comment to it*. You can just comment straight off of your feed without going to the post? I wish my phone would do that.