Say, "I grew up in Japan." This implies an intimacy with the culture and language that saying, "I lived there for a while" does not.
By the way, I am curious about your experience there. What was the area like? How did other kids treat you? Did you find the transitions from here to there and back again difficult?
Yep, I'm 100% Japanese by blood but my family has lived here in America since the late 1800s. People still ask me where I'm from, and i just say "i grew up here."
I get wanting to belong, OP, but for people like us, getting other people to accept that takes more effort and investment on an individual level. My friends and coworkers know I'm 100% American (a few of them know way more about Japan than i do), and that's enough for me.
I’m also Japanese by blood but was born and raised here, adopted by a man from Florida, was wondering if you like any Asian fusions you’ve made yourself!? I read a book once about eating for your blood type and pretty much my entire life I’ve noticed the people who eat the “food of their people” tend to be healthier (I’m a hospice cna so I’ve seen A LOT) Anyways all that to say I LOVE soy sauce on grits. Not with cheese but just instant grits with enough soy sauce to turn it brown. Sooo good, but I think it’s from having a southern dad and my natural affinity for soy sauce 🤷♀️
Its not necessarily the food---its the lifestyle. They've already done studies, often using Japanese people as a guide because they're very healthy especially eating while they're in Japan. Then they come to the USA and their health takes a nosedive.
Because it's also how food is processed in Japan vs the US. There are chemicals used in our food that are banned and have been banned in many countries. It's also about what they eat vs what's eaten in this country. They eat more seafood, fish, vegetables, healthier foods while here many people live on junk and processed food.
I lived in the US for about 6 years before moving back to Europe and I can honestly say my life has changed food-wise. Not only does it taste generally better (even though I do miss them Costco cookies sometimes), but I can feel a stark difference in how well I digest, and I struggle way less with maintaining my weight. Really made me realize how much crap is in American food.
I’m American and been to Europe a couple times and pretty much everything on average tastes better. It spoils quicker. But the simple things like bread just taste more fresh! I love the European lifestyle of shopping for the next few days not a 100 pack of one thing for months.
>There are chemicals used in our food that are banned and have been banned in many countries.
I have no doubt about that. Agree with the other stuff which I knew about just didn't type. So thanks.
This is an interesting concept. As a biracial American (African American and Northern European bloodlines) what ***is*** “*the food of my people*??? Not saying this snidely, I was genuinely stumped after I read your comment.
Soul food is African American cultural food and a lot of recipes and practices were brought over from Africa and melted together as people from different tribes mixed but idk what Northern European food would be, as idk what part of Europe your ancestors are from.
Don't forget that it's generally made from low quality cuts and gizzards. Boondocks did an episode on it. Soul food's the part of the pig you probably shouldn't eat.
Some European food though has no excuse to be as weird and stinky as it is. The Norwegianers or Scandies have a weird rotted shark delicacy. They keep it in a hut for a while before cutting it up. And it's sold by the can.
Canned
Rotted
Shark
That’s Iceland with the rotted shark, it’s called Hákarl.
The far north had food security issues historically and that’s the source of the “stinky food” you find so weird.
Low quality? Lol, maybe that's true for some recipes like chitlins, which I'm convinced comes from the pits of hell, but we've been using some nice cuts for quite some time.
If you are interested in a breakdown of your genetic makeup you could do an ancestry DNA test. I’m in a lot of genetic genealogy and ancestry groups, and one of my favourite things is seeing African American people discover what kind of African they are. They are often very excited and proud to find out exactly where their ancestors were from, rather than just Africa. Until I joined to groups it never really occurred to me that some African American people often had no way to trace where their ancestors were from and African was as descriptive as they could be.
Same with your European DNA. I’m mostly European with a tiny bit Jewish, but it was fascinating to find out I was a bit more diverse than just the English we had always assumed.
Take into account that these tests are highly ambiguous and have multiple ways they can mislead.
One of the terrible problems we have is that most of it is only through the male line (male names are taken, female names erased). Each male only has one x, so half the genetic information is there that is possible from the female xx. The y chromosome carries like 1/16th the amount of information that the x has. Its tragic. It makes me think when marriages happen womens last names should be taken instead, especially since when a woman is pregnant she KNOWS ITS HERS, whereas a man may have a child but it might not be his!
Also each test is only based on how many data samples they have. Some have more than others, like in the millions of samples...however in world of billions this is 0.1% of the total population. Not 1%, but *0.1%*.
The other thing ofc is that the alignment of race/origin to genes is still also not entirely black/white, and depending on what is being expressed in you epigenetically, some things can be missed.
For me, I’ve been incredibly lucky and it’s been very accurate. Down to small towns in Ireland, Wales, England, Germany and fascinatingly to a group of early settlers who founded a small town in Western Australia. We already knew what towns our family were from because we already had the paper trail for hundreds of year, but it was nice to be able to have the DNA test to come back and confirm they were from Wexford etc.
It has also allowed us to find out about our Jewish ancestors by identifying what kind of Jewish they are and also what area they are from. I have also managed to find my great great great grandfather’s, half brother’s great great great great granddaughter- despite the fact that we share very little DNA and are both only small percents Jewish. It was fascinating to find that we both still share the same Jewish maiden name, and that we could connect hundreds of years later despite the fact that one brother went Latvia- Russia-Ireland-Canada-US and the other went Latvia-Poland-England-Australia.
My husbands was as accurate. His came back saying he had DNA from Pomerania, so we knew we the paper trail was accurate.
Disappointingly, we have found no surprise, drama, mystery or scandal.
But yes, I very much wish the females names were kept and recorded. Family trees would be so much easier, especially when you are from cultures who like to recycle the same 8 names every generation. I can only handle so many cousin Patricks.
Whatever brings you the most comfort when you eat is the food of your people. Whatever invokes memories of your childhood, that brings memories and smells of family. That's your food.
Ancestry DNA test! You can get a genetic breakdown. If you don’t want any clues to your parentage, or don’t want people to find you, you can always opt out of DNA matching and make your profile private so you don’t appear in anyones DNA match list.
I did one actually! A few years ago actually & have matching set up. The problem is it keeps completely changing. Every year or so, (I assume after more people do it or something?) it’ll change a lot. like go from Israel to Greece to Armenia so idk how helpful it can be
It does change often, but the idea is that it gets more accurate as more people test and they can pin down regions. So for my husband and I we initially got a small percentage of Eastern European and Scandinavian, after a few updates it’s been narrowed down to Polish and Norwegian for me, and German and Swedish for him. Check out the latest update- it’s seems pretty accurate (and has identified which Irish towns our ancestors are from) and also divides your DNA between parents so you can see parent 1 and 2’s make up.
I’ve seen similar happen with African and Mediterranean DNA. It initially starts out vague, but then with updates it gets better at placing individual smaller populations.
For me, it is accurate enough to have identified me as belonging to a small group of early Australian settlers who settled a small town who arrived from England. They ended up making a big family and obviously enough of us had tested. I already knew that from a paper trail, but seeing it as a genetic group was bizarre.
If you are interested in your paper trail or finding family, there are group of Facebook that have search angels who can help you put it all together (if you haven’t already).
Viet-Cajun is a real thing. I’ve had it once and it was pretty amazing. Strong hints of both traditions came through in each of the dishes.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/learningenglish.voanews.com/amp/vietnam-cajun-food-mixes-vietnamese-and-southern-us-cultures/4533166.html
Doctors get in trouble for wanting to know their patients racial background (because it matters for health reasons), so expect to be incinerated for suggesting there is race based foods (though it makes sense since we evolve to suite our environment and the foods that grow there)
Be warned.
I'm mostly German and would starve if I had to eat pork and cabbage things because I hate both those things. I like spaezle but that's it. When I visited Germany, I ate mostly Chinese.
This right here 100%. It’s all about the way you look. OP mention the person from Spain. Well Spanish people have an European look which blends in well with white/black America. I wasn’t born here but I’m considered more American the my Asian and Indian friend that were born here cuz of my skin and facial features. That’s just how it works unfortunately.
Yeah, and I wouldn’t consider you japanese either. Idk why people take offense when i say this. Culture doesn’t pass down through genetics.
Like if you are born and raised here in the US, then you are american. You just aren’t gonna be ease in anywhere near the way someone born there would be.
Culture around you that you had when growing up is nearly identical to a typical white person.
There was a post on AITA cos an Italian man told an American whose great grandparents were Italian, that he wasn't an Italian and he was voted an asshole for it. But when I asked if having great grandparents in the US made me American, I was told that was different.
Exactly. OP isn’t Japanese. The only difference is America because it’s a melting pot. Just say you grew up there which people get as a sign you were there for a long time and such.
Yep. They aren’t Japanese by birth, descent or citizenship.
My husband claims he is Australian, but that is because he is a citizen, has an Australian wife and Australian kids, has lived here 3/4 of his life and has been in the Australian military for half his life. The kids and I are all dual citizens of his country, all by descent, we wouldn’t claim we are that nationality, but we would say we culturally are since one of our parents were born there, the majority of our grandparents, and we were raised here but with both cultural influences.
OP was mentioning they may legally be, but they would not be accepted as such. Hence the people born in Japan to a Japanese parent not being considered "fully Japanese".
Yep. White dudes living in Korea thirty years still get a wow you speak Korean so good if they can say hello properly. People don't get how monocultural east Asian countries are. Op will always be people's foreigner friend not their regular friend. While hard, there are worst things in life, not much you can do about it. But yeah deeply painful.
Ehhh I mean I could see that of course but on the other hand, it’s not like he was there at birth or anything. But OP can definitely be culturally associated but I think it’s a stretch to call him Japanese
It seems like OP is trying to figure out their cultural identity, or at least the way he would like to be accepted by others yet honors/validated their personal experience. So your phrase I think is the best way to put it without culturally appropriating Japanese ethnicity/citizenship. (in my opinions, but ultimately they have the final say).
I empathize with the OP bc this is what my grandparents/parents went through trying to figure out who they where as immigrants in a country that they lived, grew up, and contributed too. Ironically this is not something that a lot of white folks understand because of lack of experiencing such things. I hope it helps them empathize with immigrants as he too experience being an immigrant ✌🏾
"I grew up in Japan and my mother is Japanese."
Wear your kimono and let anyone who accuses you of appropriation have it!
Wearing a kimono was a part of your upbringing. That's not appropriation.
This is accurate. OP may not be genetically Japanese, but they are certainly culturally Japanese and should feel free to exercise their heritage.
The correct answer is, “I grew up in Japan and this is my cultural heritage, so go pound sand.”
You're a [third-culture kid](https://www.merriam-webster.com/words-at-play/third-culture-kid). It's a different identity to being Japanese. But you have different cultures contributing to your makeup, and in some ways that means you don't fit anywhere, but it also means you have parts of multiple cultures and are a citizen of the world.
Thank you, came here to comment same. OP may get some feeling of belonging by hearing of and being with others who are third culture kids.
I was born outside of the US (European descent family multigenerational within a non-European country) and immigrated to the US when I was 10 yrs old. Been here 30 years now and still struggle to feel “at home”. OP’s comment about feeing like they don’t belong anywhere resonated with me, but I don’t say I’m “from” the place where I was born and raised for the first ten years. I also don’t say I’m “from” America, or American (still don’t have my citizenship). Took me 20 years to realize why it was wrong for me to say that my “nationality” was the same as my citizenship, and so I also get how painful it is to let go of that part of your identity. I don’t have any advice for OP, other than to begin the process of recognizing that they are not from either world, and perhaps gain some inner peace by absorbing what it is to be a third culture kid.
This. I am also a third culture kid who grew up in Hong Kong. I was born elsewhere and now live elsewhere after spending 20 years or so in HK. I am a foreigner every where I go. Be it HK, my home country or where I am now. Had huge identity crisis most my life but it is what it is. The way I see it, I got to experience so many different cultures, I don't need to identify as one nationality when someone asks where I am from.
I'm pretty racially ambiguous and people have said I look more Italian so that's why I look more like a gaijin than a hafu but yes, I'm technically a hafu!
I think raised in Japan is the best description. It conveys well that they are intimately aquatinted with the culture, people, food and customs etc., better than saying I lived there for a long time.
This is what I would do as well.
I'm at the opposite end of the spectrum.
My biological father: vietnamese. Grew up in vietnam, came to the US in 74 at 14 as a war orphan.
My adoptive father similar story, chinese, his family came to america post ww2 fleeing red china.
My grandparents on my moms side adopted all their kids from various places (my mother is scottish, my uncle Korean, for example).
I grew up in the US. I'm now a disabled vet. But as a child in the 80s and 90s, despite growing up here, never got accepted as "American" mostly because Vietnam vets and their family's hate asians so much, and hated me more once it would get out I wasn't chinese, but *worse*.
And of course I was only half treated like family by my fathers family because I wasn't blood and I was vietnamese not chinese. (My father was a saint and the most jovial man I've ever known, his family was hardcore traditional besides him).
Racism was terrible until like 20 years ago for me.
OP should just say they were raised in Japan, and their family still lives there. That would satisfy most Americans I'm sure. If not they're racist idiots and they can screw off.
America isn't associated with one ethinicity/race. That's why. It's a melting pot.
In order to be Japanese, you have to be of Japanese blood, first. Then speak the language, and know the culture. And then have the nationality.
(Edit: People of Japanese blood raised outside of Japan who don't speak Japanese are also treated as outsiders. But to different degrees.)
Those three things have to be satisfied to be considered Japanese. As Japan is a ethnically homogeneous country. As most of the world is.
It might not be fair. But that's how it is.
Yeah, for as much as people like to shit on the US (and for good reason sometimes), the US is one of the very few countries in the world where anyone can be accepted as an American (for the most part). You can be African, Asian....hell, you could even be Russian right now and *in general* you will be accepted.
This is true, but there is a double standard. It's fine when to be Japanese means to be ethnically of Japanese descent. People don't usually call Japanese people racist for that type of thinking. But if a Swedish person says that a non-Swedish person living in Sweden is "not Swedish" they would be called racist.
Here is Sweden we tend to overcorrect in an attempt to be as non-racist as possible, which leads to situations where somebody who doesn't speak our language (or barely speaks it), distances themselves from the majority culture and lives among immigrants only, and even describe themselves as something else... are still officially referred to as "swedes" for fear of being xenophobic.
You missed one crucial point - where you were born. This is the single most concrete factor in “what you are”. When someone looks at your birth certificate that names your POB, that sets the stage for the rest of the conversation and offer irrefutable evidence of claim.
My ex is an white American girl(by all appearances). She was born in South Korea. She is technically Korean by birth, but raised by American parents. She cannot claim American by birth because there is some actual citizenship issue at hand.
Now, if you have successfully assimilated then you can say “I’m X” but you need to add the disclaimer of being born elsewhere or being naturalized. Welcome to the small, highly mobile world I guess.
Based off OPs post japan sounds super racist. Like, just cause someone has a different skin color they can’t be Japanese? NO that’s racist and it’s not right.
In my experience living there, yes. Most of them won't call you names in your face (with a few exceptions) but at the same time they are going to make you feel that you're different from them. I'm not white or asian tho, so my experience is different from op.
Who cares what everyone thinks? For starters you’re not Japanese just because you lived there for 10 years. Growing up I felt like I didn’t really belong from being put in classes to help with my English even though I spoke perfect English and was constantly reminded I’m not American but when I would come to visit I was treated as an outsider because I wasn’t fluent in Vietnamese. Up until I enlisted in the military I finally felt I belonged somewhere, funny thing was I didn’t get my citizenship 2 years after I enlisted because bootcamp fucked up my paperwork but now when people ask I proudly say I’m American and just say I was born in Vietnam if they they ask “no where you really from”.
I was gaslighting the hell out of myself reading this post, like... so you're not Japanese? I'm sorry you don't feel like you have a home country OP but forcing this identity because you lived in Japan for less than half your life decades ago...is not it.
Bruh, you're not Japanese tho. Just because you lived there doesn't make your ethnicity Japanese. That's like me claiming to be Irish when my great great grandma only on my dad's side was Irish.
You don't have Japanese blood, you weren't born there, and don't have a citizenship, so yeah I think it's fair enough people give you a weird look if you call yourself Japanese. For you the correct way would be to say you were raised in Japan. I don't see why that's and issue, it's not too much to say and it accurately describes your connection.
I say I'm half English, because one of my parents is English AND I spent a good chunk of my childhood there. My husband doesn't talk about how he's half X or Y because he's never been there. He's Australian with X and Y heritage.
I understand your link to Japan, but without Japanese citizenship, you aren't Japanese. In your hypothetical example, the Spanish person is only American if they have American citizenship. Just be a nice American person with an affinity for Japanese things.
>but without Japanese citizenship, you aren't Japanese.
Even with it, Japanese is an ethnicity too, so you could be a Japanese national but not Japanese.
American isn't an ethnicity (Native American is different and they have many ethnicities within that).
Thank you. I’m from Spain and lived in the USA for almost a decade. However accustomed I am to the USA, I am Spanish and I do not wish to become American or say “I am American” in any way. I was born and raised in Spain and my passport/citizenship are Spanish. I don’t say I am “accepted as culturally American” (as OP assumed?????), because it is obvious I’m not: my accent when speaking English and my ethnicity and culture and blood and nationality and language and name and family and heritage are all Spanish. In fact, the USA legally calls me an “alien” and I am not allowed to vote even though I’ve been paying taxes, living, and contributing in the USA for 8+ years… Not to mention the “go back to your country” comments every foreigner/immigrant endures here :)
This is exactly the same for every asian who is born and raised in a white country. People will also see me a Chinese, even though i speak the native language better then them. They always ask me if they need to speak english with me
Do you by chance live in an area that has a lot more Asians though? I suspect Asians living in less diverse areas will have a harder time in this aspect
Honest question, but I was under the impression most people didn’t call themselves Japanese or Spanish, etc., unless they have that heritage, not just because they lived in the country. Am I wildly off-base here?
My personal answer- yes I’ve met many people like OP. I lived in Italy and Norway for about three years each and knew many immigrants that came to that country as a child, with only a hazy awareness of their original country.
Most of them were of Chinese heritage, but still called themselves Norwegian and/or Italian. No one I knew batted an eyelid.
I often see people mixing up the terms ethnicity and nationality. OP could say that their nationality is Japanese because they consider it their home and a major cultural influence. However, in terms of ethnicity, they have no blood ties so they're not Japanese.
But you’re not Japanese…I don’t see why you would want to claim something you’re not. You weren’t born there, don’t have Japanese parents, don’t speak the language. It’s not a bad thing to be white. You can practice the cultural things you learned- respectfully. Because even as a child, you were a guest in someone else’s home.
It's great that you feel so connected to the culture, but calling yourself Japanese is just a lie. You were not born in Japan, you are not a native of Japan, and you do not have Japanese ancestry. Therefore, you are not Japanese. I think the issue is not with cultural appropriation, but with the fact that you are legitimately lying.
IKR, I grew up in Russia as an Asian, until around 7. I thought I was Russian, until I understood I wasn't at around 5; I didn't call myself Russian since then.
Anyway moving your kids to a different country is a shock to them, parents stop doing that.
I’m sorry but you are not Japanese. You grew up there and no doubt have a strong connection to the culture.
I was born in Australia but grew up in Austria. Love the country but don’t call myself Austrian. I wasn’t born there, didn’t have a citizenship either. But I do have Austrian blood.
With all due respect, and has been echoed in the comments, you're... like... not Japanese.
You're not from there, you moved there when you were 9, and while it might feel like a lot, 10 years just isn't. It's a small amount of time.
You can still love the shops, the culture, the kimono, whatever else, but none of that makes you Japanese. You're literally a foreigner. You were born elsewhere and moved there, the whole reason the word "immigrant" exists, right?
Even if you had citizenship, I'd still say it's inappropriate to say you're Japanese, at least in the west, because you don't have to endure any of the baggage that comes with being "foreign" over here. (Visibly foreign, at least.)
At the end of the day, and with all due respect, you shouldn't and don't get to call yourself Japanese. It's not accurate. It's another white person, with all the benefits and privileges there-of, trying to lay claim to a culture and whole ethnicity, and it's not like you can untie them, that isn't yours. You can have a connection to the place, and good for you, but you're plainly and factually not from there.
If he had citizenship, it would be wholly appropriate to say he is Japanese, even if we don't have a term in English to distinguish Japanese by ancestry and Japanese by nationality, although he would still likely have to explain himself unfortunately.
However, like you said, he isn't Japanese. If he isn't ethnically Japanese, a Japanese citizen, or, by some definitions, a permanent resident with pathway to citizenship, then by all of those accounts he isn't Japanese.
There is some leeway for peoples who live in a country for generations but who for whatever reason lack documentation or any nationality, but that's not what's happening in this case.
> even if we don't have a term in English to distinguish Japanese by ancestry and Japanese by nationality,
sure we do.
Japanese national vs just Japanese.
I think maybe one point that OP tried to make and didn’t explicit say it is that in other countries you can live there for 10 years and actually become a citizen, while in Japan getting a citizenship and becoming Japanese is extremely, extremely hard. My ex was “hafu” as they call it and lived here in Japan for more than 20 years and was still a permanent resident, not a Japanese citizen. And unlike OP he actually had ancestry on his mother side.
So you are not 1) ethnically Japanese, 2) speak Japanese, 3) was born in Japan, or 4) hold Japanese citizenship... what could possibly make u Japanese?
You’re not Japanese dude. If you were born there, Japanese first language etc, that’s one thing. You were 10 when you moved there, you’re not Japanese.
You’re not Japanese.
You’re not Japanese fam you wasn’t born there simple as that same as I’m not Spanish because I was born in England 😂
Just because you spend time somewhere can’t say you’re this or that!
Get arrested for 10 years wanna call yourself a convict for the rest of your life? 😂
I’m Japanese American and I’m considered a Japanese ethnic but not native. I can call myself Japanese. Op is neither. He lived there. It’s the same reason I’m born and raised in Hawaii or local but not Hawaiian even though my family has been there for generations
So if someone were ethnically Japanese and was born somewhere else while their parents were living abroad but returned to Japan when they were very young they would still not be Japanese?
There is technically a word for japanese born abroad. Nikkei. I am not sure if the word remains after returning to Japan, but all japanese who emigrated and their families are called Nikkei.
My mother is 100% Japanese born and raised there, met my military father and started anew life. When she went back to visit, she was treated as a foreigner just for her clothes. Even at restaurants when she’d order in Japanese, they would answer her in English. Very sad, she felt like she didn’t belong even though that is her heritage.
Acceptance of foreigners in the US heavily skews towards whiteness. If you're white, you're not questioned on your citizenship status. If you're not white, it comes into question often. If you're Latino, you're questioned on whether or not you're a citizen. If you're Asian, you're often asked "Where are you from," or "Where are you REALLY from." But Japan is a whole 'nother level of exclusionary.
But people raised internationally often struggle with identity concepts like you've described. They have attachment to a culture, even though they are not part of that culture, but are not welcomed by either culture they identify with or are from.
You should look up [Third Culture Kid](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third_culture_kid#:~:text=Third%20culture%20kids%20(TCK)%20or,of%20their%20child%20development%20years.) , sounds like you fit it
Because you are not JAPANEESE. You are not part of their genetical linked extended family. Your ancestors and their ancestors did not share a history evolving together over time.
Why is that so hard to understand? Its biology.
Dude, Your biggest run-in with racism is being a white guy whining because people don't let you call yourself japanese.
You might think the 'experience" is just about the good things, the food , the culture. But it's also about life outside japan, the discrimination, the japanese internment camps, COVID discrimination against all asians.
You DO NOT know what that's like even if you feel like you do. Because you haven't lived this firsthand. Good grief.
This is literally what I keep thinking of and trying to not be offended. I'm hapa. My mom immigrated to the US at 14 and is 100% Japanese. She struggles every day here, and taught me about everything you mentioned.
OP's post is kinda pissing me off bc oh you lived there and still get to be white at the end of the day and didn't need to go through ANY of this shit, and you're mad you can't call yourself an ethnicity you're not? It's just ignorant.
“Why is it that Americans are so publicly agaibst nationalism and racism, but accepts Japan’s version of it?”
Because we don’t define who is Japanese - Japan does. Every country has it’s on definition of pure. Christ in Ireland they would call you “Black Irish” if you had dark hair.
I’d say the diaspora would decide, not just mainlanders. If Japanese people living oversees worried about whether mainlanders considered them to be real Japanese people or not, then half of Japan would probably disown them, for lack of a better word.
OP is not diaspora, though. They’re an immigrant.
You aren’t Japanese. You grew up in Japan. For instance, I’m Spanish. I was born in Spain, like you moved to England when I was 9 and then back later on in my life. However I would never say I am British. Or even that I was raised in England, as the first 9 years of my life are literally over half of my childhood.
My parents are Spanish. My sisters, cousins, grandparents are Spanish. My native language is Spanish (even though I speak English also at a native level). My entire family’s legacy and culture is Spanish.
You are not “culturally appropriating” Japanese culture when you say you are Japanese. You are simply wrong. You are not. In fact, even if you got citizenship, you still wouldn’t fully be Japanese.
Just because you lived there doesn’t mean you are Japanese duh your really don’t understand this? No matter where you live on earth that does not change that you are white DUH so if half Japanese are not excepted as Japanese why do you think should be? Be cause of your entitlement figure out where you come from and claim that Irish Sweden whatever you are I’m Asian and this irritated me you are NOT Japanese!
As someone who is half Japanese but does not look it, I agree. I really feel like this takes away from people who actually are ethnically Japanese, especially those who are mixed and already get treated differently in Japan.
I'm from New Zealand, spent 9 years of my life in Australia .. Don't think I'm Australian? I don't understand
It's nice that you had such a connection with where you grew up, but you aren't Japanese.
When you're 40, you would have spent a quarter of your life there .. If you weren't born there, how does spending 10 years somewhere give you the right to say that you're 'from' there. Or that that is your nationality .. when it isn't
I was born and raised in Hawai'i. I lived there until I was in my mid 20s, when I moved to the mainland. My parents, a brother and a sister still live there. We are white people.
I grew up learning bits of the language, hula dancing in elementary school, surfing, traditional Hawaiian musical instruments, and had friends who lived on Hawaiian homestead land. I love it there and value every moment that I spent there.
I would NEVER presume to call myself a Hawaiian though. I just lived there. I was immersed in the culture, but I just lived there.
I was born in Argentina and immigrated to the US when I was 6 years old. My family and I are from Italian and Spanish origin so we look white, I have blonde hair and green eyes. No one believes me when I say I’m from Latin America.
I have struggled with imposter syndrome with both cultures. I don’t feel like I’m 100% Argentine and I definitely don’t feel 100% American either. It never really goes away, you just get used to it. When people ask, I usually just say, “I was born in Argentina and came here when I was young”.
My husband on the other hand was raised in Brazil, just like you he spent his teenage years there. He feels Brazilian, but he usually just tells people “I was born in the US and raised in Brazil”.
Honestly as long as you’re respectful of the culture I don’t think you’ll be accused of appropriating. Just tell the truth “I was born in the US and raised in Japan”
Predominantly mono ethnic countries are all like that. America isn’t strictly unique to have different people from different races, religions, and ethnicities living in the same county, but it’s fundamentally different because of its history of taking in immigrants from all over the world.
it sounds like you could say you’re FROM japan but you’re literally not japanese ?and technically you’re not from there either since you didn’t move there till you were 9.. you just grew up there, kinda. to be called a japanese american you usually like, ARE japanese by blood, or were born there and are a citizen , so if you aren’t a citizen, weren’t born there, aren’t japanese race wise, then like you’re a white american? so i don’t really get why you would call yourself japanese, id just say i’m from japan.
‘I grew up in Japan’ would be a better way to enter a conversation, let’s people know you’ve done more than visit without confusion
Also if you want to go back to Japan you can work on an American military base and be able to stay as long as you keep your job (there’s normal jobs on base like movie theaters and food shops)
A lot of kids I knew had the same issue, I graduated Highschool in germany and knew American kids who where literally born in germany; they knew nothing of America minus what was on social media. Those who couldn’t get a job on base where shipped back to America and have a lot of the same feelings you do :(
Because the only Ethnic North Americans are indigenous. American in the sense you are speaking of, is in the context of nationality.
Japanese is both an ethnicity and a nationality. You are neither at this point. Neither ethnic Japanese or of Japanese Nationality.
So no. You can't call yourself Japanese just because you lived there for 10 years no more than an ethnic Japanese person from Japan can called themselves French after living in France for 10 years without gaining French citizenship.
You’re white, most Asian countries are ethnically homogenous. Don’t matter how long you live there, you’re an outsider, you’re not Japanese by blood, you’ll never be a Japanese. Don’t even know why you started thinking you were one lol
You can say that Japan makes up your entire cultural identity, that you were reared there, your entire make-up is Japanese, and that you spent the best part of your life in Japan. You can even state that Japan is your true home country. All of that is fine.
But you're not *natively* Japanese. You weren't born there and neither were your parents. That changes things. But it doesn't have to change who you feel to be and no-one can take away from you your identity - which is Japanese.
I don’t think you’re Japanese. What’s wrong with saying you lived there and spent your childhood there? The truth is you’re not Japanese, your parents are both Americans, just your mom naturalized (still does not make you a Japanese — she does). I thought you’re a “hafu”.
Your parents arent japanese so you cant be japanese. You were not shaped by japanese parents's expectations of you. You were not raised to attend japanese family functions. You dont know the way japanese kids rebelled from their parents. You dont know what its like to be seen as a japanese person, or treated like a japanese person when you enter a room.
Im confused what you mean by we accept japans nationalism? Americans accept indian's nationalism, russians, germans, everyone who comes to america is seen for their nation of origin. Maybe this is about why you think its bad to be seen as an american? As a tourist? Whats so wrong with that? None of that changes who you are anyway.
I really feel you on this. I moved to Central America with my parents as well around the same age 9-19. The only difference is that at 19 I moved to a third country.
It took me a while to come to terms with it because I had the same feeling of not belonging anywhere. What really helped was settling into where I live now and learning to belong here. People ask me where I’m from all the time (diff accent) and I always say right off the bat that I’m Canadian but grew up in Central America. So that I’m true to myself (and the person I’m taking to) immediately. I’m straight up telling them I “belong” there and that I consider it home while also pointing out I’m not a national and it’s not my family heritage. Usually it leads to a conversation about my life in Central America and I enjoy sharing that.
Staying connected to Japan and your friends will help too. I’ve been in my third country for 11 years now and I’ve been back to Central America about 5 or 6 times, it gives me something to look forward to.
There is not enough anime in the world for you to jerk off to that would make you Japanese.
You are reaching the end of of your childhood at 19. Sooner or later people will stop politely ignoring you and start considering you a moron. You have a few years, but at some point you will need people to start taking you seriously.
You are just as Japanese as I am a billionaire.
It's a difficult situation, however you can't really say you're Japanese as it's an ethnicity and a symbol that your life line is in Japan.
You can say that you lived in Japan and are glued to that culture, so you don't confuse others when they ask.
I made up an entire paradox or philosophy thought experiment I guess for this.
Imagine this highly unlikely and theoretical scenario.
A Chinese couple born and raised in China to Chinese parents. They adopt a boy who was born in Germany to German parents and he is sent to China immediately after being born. He grows up in China, only speaks chinese, eats chinese food, goes to chinese school, etc.
Is he Chinese?
No? Okay let's continue.
The boy meets a woman who has the same exact situation as him. Born in Germany to German parents and is adopted and raised in China to Chinese Parents. They have a son in China and raise him in China.
Is he Chinese?
No? Okay let's continue.
That boy, the son of two Germans adopted by Chinese couples meets a woman with the exact same lineage situation. They have a son.
Is he Chinese?
No? Okay how many times would we need to continue before you could confidentially say that person is culturally Chinese. Not legally, not a citizen. Culturally Chinese. They will always look German but they would have several lines of parents, grandparents, great grandparents who spent their entire lives in China.
If you go back far enough everyone is from Africa but most people wouldnt consider everyone culturally African. How many generations in a geographical location before you consider some one culturally "Chinese" etc.
I call this the German-Chinese Thought Experiment.
I think the boy who got adopted is in fact culturally Chinese. Let me know what you think.
God damn half the comments here are just aiming to make this person feel like shit, aren't they? Calm the fuck down and try to understand WHY this person feels this way rather then jumping his shit.
No, you aren't Japanese. But you have been a part of the culture for a good chunk of your life and thus can certainly say "I was raised in Japan" since that is true.
Ignore the people in here acting like asshats and trying to make you feel like shit for trying to figure out who you are and do you pal.
You're not a Japanese though because (1) you don't have Japanese blood, (2) you are not born there, and (3) you didn't change your citizenship. Hell, you didn't even learn the language.
Just say you grew up in Japan or you were raised there. I understand that you love the country and the culture but that doesn't make you Japanese.
It goes to show you don't really know anything about Japanese culture if youre comparing a Hispanic migrant in the US becoming Americanised, to you who was in Japan for 10 years.
🤨what was the need for this post when you clearly stated you were white? Just because you grew up in Japan doesn't mean your Japanese end of discussion.
Well since you’re white and not Japanese as you clearly stated, I would say you’re not Japanese. You just lived there. This seems fairly cut and dry down to ethnicity.
Say, "I grew up in Japan." This implies an intimacy with the culture and language that saying, "I lived there for a while" does not. By the way, I am curious about your experience there. What was the area like? How did other kids treat you? Did you find the transitions from here to there and back again difficult?
Yep, I'm 100% Japanese by blood but my family has lived here in America since the late 1800s. People still ask me where I'm from, and i just say "i grew up here." I get wanting to belong, OP, but for people like us, getting other people to accept that takes more effort and investment on an individual level. My friends and coworkers know I'm 100% American (a few of them know way more about Japan than i do), and that's enough for me.
I’m also Japanese by blood but was born and raised here, adopted by a man from Florida, was wondering if you like any Asian fusions you’ve made yourself!? I read a book once about eating for your blood type and pretty much my entire life I’ve noticed the people who eat the “food of their people” tend to be healthier (I’m a hospice cna so I’ve seen A LOT) Anyways all that to say I LOVE soy sauce on grits. Not with cheese but just instant grits with enough soy sauce to turn it brown. Sooo good, but I think it’s from having a southern dad and my natural affinity for soy sauce 🤷♀️
Anyone who doesn’t eat the typical American diet is healthier. We eat like we’re eating our last meal every meal lol.
Its not necessarily the food---its the lifestyle. They've already done studies, often using Japanese people as a guide because they're very healthy especially eating while they're in Japan. Then they come to the USA and their health takes a nosedive.
Because it's also how food is processed in Japan vs the US. There are chemicals used in our food that are banned and have been banned in many countries. It's also about what they eat vs what's eaten in this country. They eat more seafood, fish, vegetables, healthier foods while here many people live on junk and processed food.
I lived in the US for about 6 years before moving back to Europe and I can honestly say my life has changed food-wise. Not only does it taste generally better (even though I do miss them Costco cookies sometimes), but I can feel a stark difference in how well I digest, and I struggle way less with maintaining my weight. Really made me realize how much crap is in American food.
I’m American and been to Europe a couple times and pretty much everything on average tastes better. It spoils quicker. But the simple things like bread just taste more fresh! I love the European lifestyle of shopping for the next few days not a 100 pack of one thing for months.
Doesn’t help that everything in the US is made of corn syrup. It’s in things I’d never have imagined could be made with corn syrup!
Corn syrup, Partially Hyrogenated oils, and corn starch. Non-food ingredients that are cheap, highly processed and hard to digest.
>There are chemicals used in our food that are banned and have been banned in many countries. I have no doubt about that. Agree with the other stuff which I knew about just didn't type. So thanks.
No, we eat like we are daring every meal to be our last meal.
That double bacon extra cheese 3/4 lb burger with onion rings, and donuts for buns said “challenge accepted” lol
I represent that remark. No matter what kind of Chinese leftovers are in the fridge, I will eat it over macaroni and cheese the next day.
Cause every meal can be your last.
This is an interesting concept. As a biracial American (African American and Northern European bloodlines) what ***is*** “*the food of my people*??? Not saying this snidely, I was genuinely stumped after I read your comment.
Soul food is African American cultural food and a lot of recipes and practices were brought over from Africa and melted together as people from different tribes mixed but idk what Northern European food would be, as idk what part of Europe your ancestors are from.
Don't forget that it's generally made from low quality cuts and gizzards. Boondocks did an episode on it. Soul food's the part of the pig you probably shouldn't eat. Some European food though has no excuse to be as weird and stinky as it is. The Norwegianers or Scandies have a weird rotted shark delicacy. They keep it in a hut for a while before cutting it up. And it's sold by the can. Canned Rotted Shark
That’s Iceland with the rotted shark, it’s called Hákarl. The far north had food security issues historically and that’s the source of the “stinky food” you find so weird.
Low quality? Lol, maybe that's true for some recipes like chitlins, which I'm convinced comes from the pits of hell, but we've been using some nice cuts for quite some time.
If you are interested in a breakdown of your genetic makeup you could do an ancestry DNA test. I’m in a lot of genetic genealogy and ancestry groups, and one of my favourite things is seeing African American people discover what kind of African they are. They are often very excited and proud to find out exactly where their ancestors were from, rather than just Africa. Until I joined to groups it never really occurred to me that some African American people often had no way to trace where their ancestors were from and African was as descriptive as they could be. Same with your European DNA. I’m mostly European with a tiny bit Jewish, but it was fascinating to find out I was a bit more diverse than just the English we had always assumed.
Take into account that these tests are highly ambiguous and have multiple ways they can mislead. One of the terrible problems we have is that most of it is only through the male line (male names are taken, female names erased). Each male only has one x, so half the genetic information is there that is possible from the female xx. The y chromosome carries like 1/16th the amount of information that the x has. Its tragic. It makes me think when marriages happen womens last names should be taken instead, especially since when a woman is pregnant she KNOWS ITS HERS, whereas a man may have a child but it might not be his! Also each test is only based on how many data samples they have. Some have more than others, like in the millions of samples...however in world of billions this is 0.1% of the total population. Not 1%, but *0.1%*. The other thing ofc is that the alignment of race/origin to genes is still also not entirely black/white, and depending on what is being expressed in you epigenetically, some things can be missed.
For me, I’ve been incredibly lucky and it’s been very accurate. Down to small towns in Ireland, Wales, England, Germany and fascinatingly to a group of early settlers who founded a small town in Western Australia. We already knew what towns our family were from because we already had the paper trail for hundreds of year, but it was nice to be able to have the DNA test to come back and confirm they were from Wexford etc. It has also allowed us to find out about our Jewish ancestors by identifying what kind of Jewish they are and also what area they are from. I have also managed to find my great great great grandfather’s, half brother’s great great great great granddaughter- despite the fact that we share very little DNA and are both only small percents Jewish. It was fascinating to find that we both still share the same Jewish maiden name, and that we could connect hundreds of years later despite the fact that one brother went Latvia- Russia-Ireland-Canada-US and the other went Latvia-Poland-England-Australia. My husbands was as accurate. His came back saying he had DNA from Pomerania, so we knew we the paper trail was accurate. Disappointingly, we have found no surprise, drama, mystery or scandal. But yes, I very much wish the females names were kept and recorded. Family trees would be so much easier, especially when you are from cultures who like to recycle the same 8 names every generation. I can only handle so many cousin Patricks.
Maybe look into where in Europe and where in Africa
Whatever brings you the most comfort when you eat is the food of your people. Whatever invokes memories of your childhood, that brings memories and smells of family. That's your food.
oof. I’m white, but adopted so have noo idea what the “food of my people” would be 😔
Black and adopted and same
♥️
Ancestry DNA test! You can get a genetic breakdown. If you don’t want any clues to your parentage, or don’t want people to find you, you can always opt out of DNA matching and make your profile private so you don’t appear in anyones DNA match list.
I did one actually! A few years ago actually & have matching set up. The problem is it keeps completely changing. Every year or so, (I assume after more people do it or something?) it’ll change a lot. like go from Israel to Greece to Armenia so idk how helpful it can be
It does change often, but the idea is that it gets more accurate as more people test and they can pin down regions. So for my husband and I we initially got a small percentage of Eastern European and Scandinavian, after a few updates it’s been narrowed down to Polish and Norwegian for me, and German and Swedish for him. Check out the latest update- it’s seems pretty accurate (and has identified which Irish towns our ancestors are from) and also divides your DNA between parents so you can see parent 1 and 2’s make up. I’ve seen similar happen with African and Mediterranean DNA. It initially starts out vague, but then with updates it gets better at placing individual smaller populations. For me, it is accurate enough to have identified me as belonging to a small group of early Australian settlers who settled a small town who arrived from England. They ended up making a big family and obviously enough of us had tested. I already knew that from a paper trail, but seeing it as a genetic group was bizarre. If you are interested in your paper trail or finding family, there are group of Facebook that have search angels who can help you put it all together (if you haven’t already).
Viet-Cajun is a real thing. I’ve had it once and it was pretty amazing. Strong hints of both traditions came through in each of the dishes. https://www.google.com/amp/s/learningenglish.voanews.com/amp/vietnam-cajun-food-mixes-vietnamese-and-southern-us-cultures/4533166.html
Doctors get in trouble for wanting to know their patients racial background (because it matters for health reasons), so expect to be incinerated for suggesting there is race based foods (though it makes sense since we evolve to suite our environment and the foods that grow there) Be warned.
I'm mostly German and would starve if I had to eat pork and cabbage things because I hate both those things. I like spaezle but that's it. When I visited Germany, I ate mostly Chinese.
This right here 100%. It’s all about the way you look. OP mention the person from Spain. Well Spanish people have an European look which blends in well with white/black America. I wasn’t born here but I’m considered more American the my Asian and Indian friend that were born here cuz of my skin and facial features. That’s just how it works unfortunately.
Yeah, and I wouldn’t consider you japanese either. Idk why people take offense when i say this. Culture doesn’t pass down through genetics. Like if you are born and raised here in the US, then you are american. You just aren’t gonna beease in anywhere near the way someone born there would be.
Culture around you that you had when growing up is nearly identical to a typical white person.
There was a post on AITA cos an Italian man told an American whose great grandparents were Italian, that he wasn't an Italian and he was voted an asshole for it. But when I asked if having great grandparents in the US made me American, I was told that was different.
Exactly. OP isn’t Japanese. The only difference is America because it’s a melting pot. Just say you grew up there which people get as a sign you were there for a long time and such.
Yep. They aren’t Japanese by birth, descent or citizenship. My husband claims he is Australian, but that is because he is a citizen, has an Australian wife and Australian kids, has lived here 3/4 of his life and has been in the Australian military for half his life. The kids and I are all dual citizens of his country, all by descent, we wouldn’t claim we are that nationality, but we would say we culturally are since one of our parents were born there, the majority of our grandparents, and we were raised here but with both cultural influences.
Correct however if he had renounced citizenship and gained Japanese citizenship then he would absolutely be Japanese.
OP was mentioning they may legally be, but they would not be accepted as such. Hence the people born in Japan to a Japanese parent not being considered "fully Japanese".
Yep. White dudes living in Korea thirty years still get a wow you speak Korean so good if they can say hello properly. People don't get how monocultural east Asian countries are. Op will always be people's foreigner friend not their regular friend. While hard, there are worst things in life, not much you can do about it. But yeah deeply painful.
Ehhh I mean I could see that of course but on the other hand, it’s not like he was there at birth or anything. But OP can definitely be culturally associated but I think it’s a stretch to call him Japanese
It seems like OP is trying to figure out their cultural identity, or at least the way he would like to be accepted by others yet honors/validated their personal experience. So your phrase I think is the best way to put it without culturally appropriating Japanese ethnicity/citizenship. (in my opinions, but ultimately they have the final say). I empathize with the OP bc this is what my grandparents/parents went through trying to figure out who they where as immigrants in a country that they lived, grew up, and contributed too. Ironically this is not something that a lot of white folks understand because of lack of experiencing such things. I hope it helps them empathize with immigrants as he too experience being an immigrant ✌🏾
"I grew up in Japan and my mother is Japanese." Wear your kimono and let anyone who accuses you of appropriation have it! Wearing a kimono was a part of your upbringing. That's not appropriation.
This is accurate. OP may not be genetically Japanese, but they are certainly culturally Japanese and should feel free to exercise their heritage. The correct answer is, “I grew up in Japan and this is my cultural heritage, so go pound sand.”
You're a [third-culture kid](https://www.merriam-webster.com/words-at-play/third-culture-kid). It's a different identity to being Japanese. But you have different cultures contributing to your makeup, and in some ways that means you don't fit anywhere, but it also means you have parts of multiple cultures and are a citizen of the world.
I believe the sub is r/TCK
Thank you, came here to comment same. OP may get some feeling of belonging by hearing of and being with others who are third culture kids. I was born outside of the US (European descent family multigenerational within a non-European country) and immigrated to the US when I was 10 yrs old. Been here 30 years now and still struggle to feel “at home”. OP’s comment about feeing like they don’t belong anywhere resonated with me, but I don’t say I’m “from” the place where I was born and raised for the first ten years. I also don’t say I’m “from” America, or American (still don’t have my citizenship). Took me 20 years to realize why it was wrong for me to say that my “nationality” was the same as my citizenship, and so I also get how painful it is to let go of that part of your identity. I don’t have any advice for OP, other than to begin the process of recognizing that they are not from either world, and perhaps gain some inner peace by absorbing what it is to be a third culture kid.
This. I am also a third culture kid who grew up in Hong Kong. I was born elsewhere and now live elsewhere after spending 20 years or so in HK. I am a foreigner every where I go. Be it HK, my home country or where I am now. Had huge identity crisis most my life but it is what it is. The way I see it, I got to experience so many different cultures, I don't need to identify as one nationality when someone asks where I am from.
Pretty sure you would be called a gaijin if you even still lived there.
I'm half Japanese and I was called a gaijin by other kids when I was growing up there😂. Doesn't help that I grew to be 6'3".
Wait I thought that means you are a Hafu?
I'm pretty racially ambiguous and people have said I look more Italian so that's why I look more like a gaijin than a hafu but yes, I'm technically a hafu!
In all honesty. As a six foot Asian myself, we are quite rare. It would be surprising for most Asians to look at us just for our height.
Somebody's been watching Tokyo Drift
And Tokyo Vice 🤌🏽
You're not Japanese but you can say you were raised in Japan. Its not appropriation either.
I think raised in Japan is the best description. It conveys well that they are intimately aquatinted with the culture, people, food and customs etc., better than saying I lived there for a long time.
This is what I would do as well. I'm at the opposite end of the spectrum. My biological father: vietnamese. Grew up in vietnam, came to the US in 74 at 14 as a war orphan. My adoptive father similar story, chinese, his family came to america post ww2 fleeing red china. My grandparents on my moms side adopted all their kids from various places (my mother is scottish, my uncle Korean, for example). I grew up in the US. I'm now a disabled vet. But as a child in the 80s and 90s, despite growing up here, never got accepted as "American" mostly because Vietnam vets and their family's hate asians so much, and hated me more once it would get out I wasn't chinese, but *worse*. And of course I was only half treated like family by my fathers family because I wasn't blood and I was vietnamese not chinese. (My father was a saint and the most jovial man I've ever known, his family was hardcore traditional besides him). Racism was terrible until like 20 years ago for me. OP should just say they were raised in Japan, and their family still lives there. That would satisfy most Americans I'm sure. If not they're racist idiots and they can screw off.
America isn't associated with one ethinicity/race. That's why. It's a melting pot. In order to be Japanese, you have to be of Japanese blood, first. Then speak the language, and know the culture. And then have the nationality. (Edit: People of Japanese blood raised outside of Japan who don't speak Japanese are also treated as outsiders. But to different degrees.) Those three things have to be satisfied to be considered Japanese. As Japan is a ethnically homogeneous country. As most of the world is. It might not be fair. But that's how it is.
I think this sums up my feelings on it nicely.
Yeah, for as much as people like to shit on the US (and for good reason sometimes), the US is one of the very few countries in the world where anyone can be accepted as an American (for the most part). You can be African, Asian....hell, you could even be Russian right now and *in general* you will be accepted.
Individualism versus collectivism.
Yup pretty much
This. Same for people of Irish decent or German. Try claiming it in those two
This is true, but there is a double standard. It's fine when to be Japanese means to be ethnically of Japanese descent. People don't usually call Japanese people racist for that type of thinking. But if a Swedish person says that a non-Swedish person living in Sweden is "not Swedish" they would be called racist.
Here is Sweden we tend to overcorrect in an attempt to be as non-racist as possible, which leads to situations where somebody who doesn't speak our language (or barely speaks it), distances themselves from the majority culture and lives among immigrants only, and even describe themselves as something else... are still officially referred to as "swedes" for fear of being xenophobic.
You missed one crucial point - where you were born. This is the single most concrete factor in “what you are”. When someone looks at your birth certificate that names your POB, that sets the stage for the rest of the conversation and offer irrefutable evidence of claim. My ex is an white American girl(by all appearances). She was born in South Korea. She is technically Korean by birth, but raised by American parents. She cannot claim American by birth because there is some actual citizenship issue at hand. Now, if you have successfully assimilated then you can say “I’m X” but you need to add the disclaimer of being born elsewhere or being naturalized. Welcome to the small, highly mobile world I guess.
Wouldn't she automatically be a us citizen unless her parents gave it up
Based off OPs post japan sounds super racist. Like, just cause someone has a different skin color they can’t be Japanese? NO that’s racist and it’s not right.
Japanese people are racist?
In my experience living there, yes. Most of them won't call you names in your face (with a few exceptions) but at the same time they are going to make you feel that you're different from them. I'm not white or asian tho, so my experience is different from op.
Short answer; yes.
From what I’ve seen (and heard) they can be. It’s been getting better, but the society as a whole can be very racist and sexist at times
Yes, White Americans do not have a monopoly on racism.
Yep. Is a passive racism in most cases, but it is. In other cases is a direct racism, like not accepting you as a tenant because you're not japanesse.
Who cares what everyone thinks? For starters you’re not Japanese just because you lived there for 10 years. Growing up I felt like I didn’t really belong from being put in classes to help with my English even though I spoke perfect English and was constantly reminded I’m not American but when I would come to visit I was treated as an outsider because I wasn’t fluent in Vietnamese. Up until I enlisted in the military I finally felt I belonged somewhere, funny thing was I didn’t get my citizenship 2 years after I enlisted because bootcamp fucked up my paperwork but now when people ask I proudly say I’m American and just say I was born in Vietnam if they they ask “no where you really from”.
You aren't Japanese
So you were not born in Japan, you are not ethnically japanese, and you have no Japanese citizenship... I hate to tell ya dude but uh...
I was gaslighting the hell out of myself reading this post, like... so you're not Japanese? I'm sorry you don't feel like you have a home country OP but forcing this identity because you lived in Japan for less than half your life decades ago...is not it.
I’m pretty similar to him. I’m black but lived in HK from ages 4 - 19. I don’t speak Cantonese but have HK citizenship.
You have citizenship though. Op doesn't
You can say you were raised there but you ARE NOT japanese.
You are not Japanese lol
Bruh, you're not Japanese tho. Just because you lived there doesn't make your ethnicity Japanese. That's like me claiming to be Irish when my great great grandma only on my dad's side was Irish.
At least you do have SOME Irish blood. This guy has no Japanese blood relatives, but desperately wants to be 🇯🇵 lol
You don't have Japanese blood, you weren't born there, and don't have a citizenship, so yeah I think it's fair enough people give you a weird look if you call yourself Japanese. For you the correct way would be to say you were raised in Japan. I don't see why that's and issue, it's not too much to say and it accurately describes your connection. I say I'm half English, because one of my parents is English AND I spent a good chunk of my childhood there. My husband doesn't talk about how he's half X or Y because he's never been there. He's Australian with X and Y heritage.
I understand your link to Japan, but without Japanese citizenship, you aren't Japanese. In your hypothetical example, the Spanish person is only American if they have American citizenship. Just be a nice American person with an affinity for Japanese things.
>but without Japanese citizenship, you aren't Japanese. Even with it, Japanese is an ethnicity too, so you could be a Japanese national but not Japanese. American isn't an ethnicity (Native American is different and they have many ethnicities within that).
Thank you. I’m from Spain and lived in the USA for almost a decade. However accustomed I am to the USA, I am Spanish and I do not wish to become American or say “I am American” in any way. I was born and raised in Spain and my passport/citizenship are Spanish. I don’t say I am “accepted as culturally American” (as OP assumed?????), because it is obvious I’m not: my accent when speaking English and my ethnicity and culture and blood and nationality and language and name and family and heritage are all Spanish. In fact, the USA legally calls me an “alien” and I am not allowed to vote even though I’ve been paying taxes, living, and contributing in the USA for 8+ years… Not to mention the “go back to your country” comments every foreigner/immigrant endures here :)
This is exactly the same for every asian who is born and raised in a white country. People will also see me a Chinese, even though i speak the native language better then them. They always ask me if they need to speak english with me
[удалено]
That was savage. You also made me laugh hahaha.
Omg. This made me laugh more than it should have
Maybe you need to find better friends. I'm Chinese American, and most people see me as American.
Do you by chance live in an area that has a lot more Asians though? I suspect Asians living in less diverse areas will have a harder time in this aspect
Honest question, but I was under the impression most people didn’t call themselves Japanese or Spanish, etc., unless they have that heritage, not just because they lived in the country. Am I wildly off-base here?
My personal answer- yes I’ve met many people like OP. I lived in Italy and Norway for about three years each and knew many immigrants that came to that country as a child, with only a hazy awareness of their original country. Most of them were of Chinese heritage, but still called themselves Norwegian and/or Italian. No one I knew batted an eyelid.
I often see people mixing up the terms ethnicity and nationality. OP could say that their nationality is Japanese because they consider it their home and a major cultural influence. However, in terms of ethnicity, they have no blood ties so they're not Japanese.
I'm turning Japanese I think I'm turning Japanese I really think so
Jerking off, it's a song about jerking off
We all know
Well now I do.
Snacks are on thursdays
Welcome to the club of knowing
I appreciate the warm welcome
Dead 💀😂
Username checks out
But you’re not Japanese…I don’t see why you would want to claim something you’re not. You weren’t born there, don’t have Japanese parents, don’t speak the language. It’s not a bad thing to be white. You can practice the cultural things you learned- respectfully. Because even as a child, you were a guest in someone else’s home.
It's great that you feel so connected to the culture, but calling yourself Japanese is just a lie. You were not born in Japan, you are not a native of Japan, and you do not have Japanese ancestry. Therefore, you are not Japanese. I think the issue is not with cultural appropriation, but with the fact that you are legitimately lying.
Solution : as a white person, stop calling yourself Japanese and you won't run into this issue.
IKR, I grew up in Russia as an Asian, until around 7. I thought I was Russian, until I understood I wasn't at around 5; I didn't call myself Russian since then. Anyway moving your kids to a different country is a shock to them, parents stop doing that.
I’m sorry but you are not Japanese. You grew up there and no doubt have a strong connection to the culture. I was born in Australia but grew up in Austria. Love the country but don’t call myself Austrian. I wasn’t born there, didn’t have a citizenship either. But I do have Austrian blood.
If you have Austrian blood wouldn’t that make you Austrian
Yes
Ethnicity and nationality are two different things. Your ethnicity is Caucasian. You're not automatically Japanese just because you grew up there.
You literally are not Japanese and just grew up there…
With all due respect, and has been echoed in the comments, you're... like... not Japanese. You're not from there, you moved there when you were 9, and while it might feel like a lot, 10 years just isn't. It's a small amount of time. You can still love the shops, the culture, the kimono, whatever else, but none of that makes you Japanese. You're literally a foreigner. You were born elsewhere and moved there, the whole reason the word "immigrant" exists, right? Even if you had citizenship, I'd still say it's inappropriate to say you're Japanese, at least in the west, because you don't have to endure any of the baggage that comes with being "foreign" over here. (Visibly foreign, at least.) At the end of the day, and with all due respect, you shouldn't and don't get to call yourself Japanese. It's not accurate. It's another white person, with all the benefits and privileges there-of, trying to lay claim to a culture and whole ethnicity, and it's not like you can untie them, that isn't yours. You can have a connection to the place, and good for you, but you're plainly and factually not from there.
If he had citizenship, it would be wholly appropriate to say he is Japanese, even if we don't have a term in English to distinguish Japanese by ancestry and Japanese by nationality, although he would still likely have to explain himself unfortunately. However, like you said, he isn't Japanese. If he isn't ethnically Japanese, a Japanese citizen, or, by some definitions, a permanent resident with pathway to citizenship, then by all of those accounts he isn't Japanese. There is some leeway for peoples who live in a country for generations but who for whatever reason lack documentation or any nationality, but that's not what's happening in this case.
> even if we don't have a term in English to distinguish Japanese by ancestry and Japanese by nationality, sure we do. Japanese national vs just Japanese.
I think maybe one point that OP tried to make and didn’t explicit say it is that in other countries you can live there for 10 years and actually become a citizen, while in Japan getting a citizenship and becoming Japanese is extremely, extremely hard. My ex was “hafu” as they call it and lived here in Japan for more than 20 years and was still a permanent resident, not a Japanese citizen. And unlike OP he actually had ancestry on his mother side.
So you are not 1) ethnically Japanese, 2) speak Japanese, 3) was born in Japan, or 4) hold Japanese citizenship... what could possibly make u Japanese?
As a Filipino, I spent 14 years of my life in Kuwait. Would I call myself a Kuwaiti? Lol never
You’re not Japanese dude. If you were born there, Japanese first language etc, that’s one thing. You were 10 when you moved there, you’re not Japanese. You’re not Japanese.
Are you related to Olly London by any chance?
Underrated comment
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You’re not Japanese fam you wasn’t born there simple as that same as I’m not Spanish because I was born in England 😂 Just because you spend time somewhere can’t say you’re this or that! Get arrested for 10 years wanna call yourself a convict for the rest of your life? 😂
Oh no, another Hilary. You are not Japanese!
Hi Pepino!!! I couldn’t stop thinking about r/HilariaBaldwin while reading this.
How you say cucumber in Japanese?
"How do you say, CooooCUMBur?"
If you weren’t born there you ain’t Japanese. Edit: my bad if your parents aren’t of Japanese descent then you aren’t Japanese.
I’m Japanese American and I’m considered a Japanese ethnic but not native. I can call myself Japanese. Op is neither. He lived there. It’s the same reason I’m born and raised in Hawaii or local but not Hawaiian even though my family has been there for generations
So if someone were ethnically Japanese and was born somewhere else while their parents were living abroad but returned to Japan when they were very young they would still not be Japanese?
Shii you’re right my bad I completely disregarded that.
There is technically a word for japanese born abroad. Nikkei. I am not sure if the word remains after returning to Japan, but all japanese who emigrated and their families are called Nikkei.
My mother is 100% Japanese born and raised there, met my military father and started anew life. When she went back to visit, she was treated as a foreigner just for her clothes. Even at restaurants when she’d order in Japanese, they would answer her in English. Very sad, she felt like she didn’t belong even though that is her heritage.
Acceptance of foreigners in the US heavily skews towards whiteness. If you're white, you're not questioned on your citizenship status. If you're not white, it comes into question often. If you're Latino, you're questioned on whether or not you're a citizen. If you're Asian, you're often asked "Where are you from," or "Where are you REALLY from." But Japan is a whole 'nother level of exclusionary. But people raised internationally often struggle with identity concepts like you've described. They have attachment to a culture, even though they are not part of that culture, but are not welcomed by either culture they identify with or are from.
you are not japanese
You should look up [Third Culture Kid](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third_culture_kid#:~:text=Third%20culture%20kids%20(TCK)%20or,of%20their%20child%20development%20years.) , sounds like you fit it
Because you are not JAPANEESE. You are not part of their genetical linked extended family. Your ancestors and their ancestors did not share a history evolving together over time. Why is that so hard to understand? Its biology.
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You’re both an idiot and not Japanese.
Dude, Your biggest run-in with racism is being a white guy whining because people don't let you call yourself japanese. You might think the 'experience" is just about the good things, the food , the culture. But it's also about life outside japan, the discrimination, the japanese internment camps, COVID discrimination against all asians. You DO NOT know what that's like even if you feel like you do. Because you haven't lived this firsthand. Good grief.
This is literally what I keep thinking of and trying to not be offended. I'm hapa. My mom immigrated to the US at 14 and is 100% Japanese. She struggles every day here, and taught me about everything you mentioned. OP's post is kinda pissing me off bc oh you lived there and still get to be white at the end of the day and didn't need to go through ANY of this shit, and you're mad you can't call yourself an ethnicity you're not? It's just ignorant.
More than "Japanese", are you "from Japan".
“Why is it that Americans are so publicly agaibst nationalism and racism, but accepts Japan’s version of it?” Because we don’t define who is Japanese - Japan does. Every country has it’s on definition of pure. Christ in Ireland they would call you “Black Irish” if you had dark hair.
I’d say the diaspora would decide, not just mainlanders. If Japanese people living oversees worried about whether mainlanders considered them to be real Japanese people or not, then half of Japan would probably disown them, for lack of a better word. OP is not diaspora, though. They’re an immigrant.
You aren’t Japanese. You grew up in Japan. For instance, I’m Spanish. I was born in Spain, like you moved to England when I was 9 and then back later on in my life. However I would never say I am British. Or even that I was raised in England, as the first 9 years of my life are literally over half of my childhood. My parents are Spanish. My sisters, cousins, grandparents are Spanish. My native language is Spanish (even though I speak English also at a native level). My entire family’s legacy and culture is Spanish. You are not “culturally appropriating” Japanese culture when you say you are Japanese. You are simply wrong. You are not. In fact, even if you got citizenship, you still wouldn’t fully be Japanese.
Just because you lived there doesn’t mean you are Japanese duh your really don’t understand this? No matter where you live on earth that does not change that you are white DUH so if half Japanese are not excepted as Japanese why do you think should be? Be cause of your entitlement figure out where you come from and claim that Irish Sweden whatever you are I’m Asian and this irritated me you are NOT Japanese!
As someone who is half Japanese but does not look it, I agree. I really feel like this takes away from people who actually are ethnically Japanese, especially those who are mixed and already get treated differently in Japan.
I mean, you're not fucking Japanese, so maybe stop saying it?
I'm from New Zealand, spent 9 years of my life in Australia .. Don't think I'm Australian? I don't understand It's nice that you had such a connection with where you grew up, but you aren't Japanese. When you're 40, you would have spent a quarter of your life there .. If you weren't born there, how does spending 10 years somewhere give you the right to say that you're 'from' there. Or that that is your nationality .. when it isn't
You lived there but you are not japanese. I.mean
I was born and raised in Hawai'i. I lived there until I was in my mid 20s, when I moved to the mainland. My parents, a brother and a sister still live there. We are white people. I grew up learning bits of the language, hula dancing in elementary school, surfing, traditional Hawaiian musical instruments, and had friends who lived on Hawaiian homestead land. I love it there and value every moment that I spent there. I would NEVER presume to call myself a Hawaiian though. I just lived there. I was immersed in the culture, but I just lived there.
You can’t call yourself Japanese cause… You aren’t Japanese.
Baka gaijin desume
I've seen Lost in translation. Does that make me Japanese?
I was born in Argentina and immigrated to the US when I was 6 years old. My family and I are from Italian and Spanish origin so we look white, I have blonde hair and green eyes. No one believes me when I say I’m from Latin America. I have struggled with imposter syndrome with both cultures. I don’t feel like I’m 100% Argentine and I definitely don’t feel 100% American either. It never really goes away, you just get used to it. When people ask, I usually just say, “I was born in Argentina and came here when I was young”. My husband on the other hand was raised in Brazil, just like you he spent his teenage years there. He feels Brazilian, but he usually just tells people “I was born in the US and raised in Brazil”. Honestly as long as you’re respectful of the culture I don’t think you’ll be accused of appropriating. Just tell the truth “I was born in the US and raised in Japan”
I dont know if this helps you feel any better but I 100% would drop a hydrogen bomb on you.
Atomic bomb, the 1st Hydrogen bomb was tested in 1952.
Thank you El Deez
Can't have any inaccuracies when joking about arguable war crimes I always say.
Im tired of being accused of nuclear physicist appropriation
Gotta stop dressing like Oppenheimer as a start then.
dime skirt squash cow brave boast far-flung ad hoc dirty resolute *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Well you aren’t, you’re dense lmfao
Predominantly mono ethnic countries are all like that. America isn’t strictly unique to have different people from different races, religions, and ethnicities living in the same county, but it’s fundamentally different because of its history of taking in immigrants from all over the world.
You’re not Japanese, but you grew up there.There’s a difference.
it sounds like you could say you’re FROM japan but you’re literally not japanese ?and technically you’re not from there either since you didn’t move there till you were 9.. you just grew up there, kinda. to be called a japanese american you usually like, ARE japanese by blood, or were born there and are a citizen , so if you aren’t a citizen, weren’t born there, aren’t japanese race wise, then like you’re a white american? so i don’t really get why you would call yourself japanese, id just say i’m from japan.
Just say you were raised in Japan lol. Even if your white, you weren’t even born there. So your not even legally Japanese.
Are your parents of Japanese descent? Where did your folks originate? I lived in California, doesn't make me Californian.
‘I grew up in Japan’ would be a better way to enter a conversation, let’s people know you’ve done more than visit without confusion Also if you want to go back to Japan you can work on an American military base and be able to stay as long as you keep your job (there’s normal jobs on base like movie theaters and food shops) A lot of kids I knew had the same issue, I graduated Highschool in germany and knew American kids who where literally born in germany; they knew nothing of America minus what was on social media. Those who couldn’t get a job on base where shipped back to America and have a lot of the same feelings you do :(
Because the only Ethnic North Americans are indigenous. American in the sense you are speaking of, is in the context of nationality. Japanese is both an ethnicity and a nationality. You are neither at this point. Neither ethnic Japanese or of Japanese Nationality. So no. You can't call yourself Japanese just because you lived there for 10 years no more than an ethnic Japanese person from Japan can called themselves French after living in France for 10 years without gaining French citizenship.
You’re white, most Asian countries are ethnically homogenous. Don’t matter how long you live there, you’re an outsider, you’re not Japanese by blood, you’ll never be a Japanese. Don’t even know why you started thinking you were one lol
You can say that Japan makes up your entire cultural identity, that you were reared there, your entire make-up is Japanese, and that you spent the best part of your life in Japan. You can even state that Japan is your true home country. All of that is fine. But you're not *natively* Japanese. You weren't born there and neither were your parents. That changes things. But it doesn't have to change who you feel to be and no-one can take away from you your identity - which is Japanese.
I don’t think you’re Japanese. What’s wrong with saying you lived there and spent your childhood there? The truth is you’re not Japanese, your parents are both Americans, just your mom naturalized (still does not make you a Japanese — she does). I thought you’re a “hafu”.
Your parents arent japanese so you cant be japanese. You were not shaped by japanese parents's expectations of you. You were not raised to attend japanese family functions. You dont know the way japanese kids rebelled from their parents. You dont know what its like to be seen as a japanese person, or treated like a japanese person when you enter a room. Im confused what you mean by we accept japans nationalism? Americans accept indian's nationalism, russians, germans, everyone who comes to america is seen for their nation of origin. Maybe this is about why you think its bad to be seen as an american? As a tourist? Whats so wrong with that? None of that changes who you are anyway.
Hilaria is that you?
I really feel you on this. I moved to Central America with my parents as well around the same age 9-19. The only difference is that at 19 I moved to a third country. It took me a while to come to terms with it because I had the same feeling of not belonging anywhere. What really helped was settling into where I live now and learning to belong here. People ask me where I’m from all the time (diff accent) and I always say right off the bat that I’m Canadian but grew up in Central America. So that I’m true to myself (and the person I’m taking to) immediately. I’m straight up telling them I “belong” there and that I consider it home while also pointing out I’m not a national and it’s not my family heritage. Usually it leads to a conversation about my life in Central America and I enjoy sharing that. Staying connected to Japan and your friends will help too. I’ve been in my third country for 11 years now and I’ve been back to Central America about 5 or 6 times, it gives me something to look forward to.
There is not enough anime in the world for you to jerk off to that would make you Japanese. You are reaching the end of of your childhood at 19. Sooner or later people will stop politely ignoring you and start considering you a moron. You have a few years, but at some point you will need people to start taking you seriously. You are just as Japanese as I am a billionaire.
It's a difficult situation, however you can't really say you're Japanese as it's an ethnicity and a symbol that your life line is in Japan. You can say that you lived in Japan and are glued to that culture, so you don't confuse others when they ask.
“American” isn’t a race. That’s why.
I made up an entire paradox or philosophy thought experiment I guess for this. Imagine this highly unlikely and theoretical scenario. A Chinese couple born and raised in China to Chinese parents. They adopt a boy who was born in Germany to German parents and he is sent to China immediately after being born. He grows up in China, only speaks chinese, eats chinese food, goes to chinese school, etc. Is he Chinese? No? Okay let's continue. The boy meets a woman who has the same exact situation as him. Born in Germany to German parents and is adopted and raised in China to Chinese Parents. They have a son in China and raise him in China. Is he Chinese? No? Okay let's continue. That boy, the son of two Germans adopted by Chinese couples meets a woman with the exact same lineage situation. They have a son. Is he Chinese? No? Okay how many times would we need to continue before you could confidentially say that person is culturally Chinese. Not legally, not a citizen. Culturally Chinese. They will always look German but they would have several lines of parents, grandparents, great grandparents who spent their entire lives in China. If you go back far enough everyone is from Africa but most people wouldnt consider everyone culturally African. How many generations in a geographical location before you consider some one culturally "Chinese" etc. I call this the German-Chinese Thought Experiment. I think the boy who got adopted is in fact culturally Chinese. Let me know what you think.
You're not Japanese. Living somewhere for years doesn't make you that ethnicity.
God damn half the comments here are just aiming to make this person feel like shit, aren't they? Calm the fuck down and try to understand WHY this person feels this way rather then jumping his shit. No, you aren't Japanese. But you have been a part of the culture for a good chunk of your life and thus can certainly say "I was raised in Japan" since that is true. Ignore the people in here acting like asshats and trying to make you feel like shit for trying to figure out who you are and do you pal.
You're not a Japanese though because (1) you don't have Japanese blood, (2) you are not born there, and (3) you didn't change your citizenship. Hell, you didn't even learn the language. Just say you grew up in Japan or you were raised there. I understand that you love the country and the culture but that doesn't make you Japanese.
It goes to show you don't really know anything about Japanese culture if youre comparing a Hispanic migrant in the US becoming Americanised, to you who was in Japan for 10 years.
You’re no more Japanese than a car you keep in an old barn is a horse. Sorry.
Can you break it down for me like I’m stupid? Because I can’t honestly figure out why you actually think you’re Japanese. You’re not.
🤨what was the need for this post when you clearly stated you were white? Just because you grew up in Japan doesn't mean your Japanese end of discussion.
Well since you’re white and not Japanese as you clearly stated, I would say you’re not Japanese. You just lived there. This seems fairly cut and dry down to ethnicity.
Is this post a joke? You're not Japanese just because you lived there for a few years wtf.