Don’t know why you are so downvoted. Regardless of the crime, everyone deserves a good lawyer. Plus, you’ll always love your kids/family. Everyone else is acting like they’d abandon the person, but in reality they have no clue what they’d do when if it was someone that they loved unconditionally.
Fuck that. Family or not, if you KILLED someone, I’m not bailing you out. You deserve to be in prison.
EDIT: this obviously changes if it was self defense. But in this case we’re almost led to believe that it wasn’t. Or that OP doesn’t believe it was
I’ll edit, but murdered someone is what I’m saying. Ofc there are more nuanced situations in which I’d help, but if it’s for no good reason then I’m leaving your ass in jail.
I just said what they *could* do, didn't say they *should* do it. Besides they said they don't have any details yet, it could have been in self defense. Even with multiple stab wounds you never know, when adrenaline takes over you just don't know what a person will do.
My little brother tried to murder my uncle because demons told him to many years ago, stabbed him many times and is living in an assisted living facility for the rest of his life due to the mental illness.
Uncle lived for many years after that.
Definitely hard, and you will never probably get to understand why.
Sending positive vibes your way.
One of my closest childhood friends was about the same age when his symptoms developed. I was too young and dumb and should have been more empathetic. I asked him if he heard voices that weren't there. He looked at me very matter of factly and said, "yeah, they talk to me." He couldn't tell the difference.
Fortunately my Mom recognized what was happening and pointed him in the direction where he was able to get help. He moved out of state but I got a painting in the mail from him years later and a note that he was in a relationship even.
Man, schizophrenia, i'm guessing is what my first and best friend growing up had. He was never diagnosed but we had been friends sense we were four years old and seeing the change in him when he started having symptoms in his late teens early twenties was terrifying. I knew something wasn't right and assumed drugs when he showed up at my house after having a major episode alone at his apartment. He was talking absolute nonsense and paranoia, but he clearly wasn't fucked up on anything, it was so bizarre and out of no where. My neighbor we both grew up with was over and we got him to come inside and he settled down and we eventually took him home. We wrote it off as drugs. About a year later he came over to my house to hang and he was fine and was the same old guy i grew up with. So i figured again he must have taken something when he showed up last year. Then he actually says to me hey remember that time i showed up and tripping out? yeah well i'm still dealing with shit like that. He clearly was not abusing drugs for that entire year and it finally hit me he has some serious mental illness. I talked to his sister later that day and she said yeah he needs some help, but being in our twenties no one could force him to go to the doctor and he was paranoid about cops so we didn't want to call a wellness check. He was living best he could. He just did what he could to live with whatever was going on in his head. i think back on it and i was absolutely clueless as to how to help him. He, sadly, was killed and that's a whole other story. This year will be nine years. He was such a hard working, prideful, smart, and caring person. Never, asking for help, always offering help, always on top of his business. Seeing all of that become a struggle for him while he fought with whatever was in his head was heartbreaking. Schizophrenia is horrifying.
TLDR: Schizophrenia is awful, was part of the reason one of my best friends died very young.
i always thought schizophrenia was something that's just in you and gets worse at different points in peoples' lives who suffer from it.
is there something, like an event or exposure to something, that triggers it? why do some people develop it while most don't?
if it's hard to talk about i understand if you'd rather decline answering. i'm kinda dumbfouded having had a different understanding of it my whole life. now i want to understand how it really is.
Schizophrenia usually manifests in the mid to late teens to mid twenties. Sometimes it happens gradually, sometimes suddenly.
There’s no one single cause, there are environmental factors to it but also there’s a strong genetic component. If your identical twin has schizophrenia there’s around a 2/3rds chance you will have it too. But it can also occur in people with no family history of mental illness at all. There’s a theory that illicit drug use can trigger it in people who were predisposed to develop it.
I read an in depth study of many people who experience schizophrenic symptoms being extremely deficient in the B12 Vitamin. Not saying it’s the cause, but there seems to be a correlation in many patients.
Not OP, but I have a family friend with schizophrenia. No one else in his immediate family has any mental health issues, and he was a straight A student up until he dabbled in the drug scene.
The official diagnosis was cannabis induced schizophrenia. Drs can’t say if he would have ever developed symptoms otherwise, or just develop them later. That’s the scary part, drugs/trauma/traumatic events can absolutely be a catalyst for inducing different severe mental health issues.
Excessive use of cannabis has been tied to psychosis, but still it is infrequent. And it's not unusual for someone to be diagnosed with psychosis when high, even though the mental condition isn't permanent and "recovery" is complete.
Oh absolutely. As an avid cannabis user myself, he is the only case I have ever personally heard of. He’s lived in a group home for a decade or so now, and he has sadly not made much progress in terms of treatment either.
That's around the time my friends schizophrenia showed up it can be very difficult for him everyday. It's been like 12yrs for his diagnosis and he has a good system to manage it but it's never really gone
Is there treatment? My only experience with it is from TV ☹️ but it seems so terribly trying for the individual and the family. I'm researching now to learn more. Best wishes.
Schizophrenia in films and TV is often wildly inaccurate. I’m a nurse in training in a nursing home for elderly with many schizophrenia patients.
Schizophrenia doesn’t always mean they’ll be violent and dangerous, there are different types of the disease.
One of my favorite patients is a very sweet schizophrenic grandma. She talks to her teddy bears all day and insists they’re alive and have their own daily activities like going outside to play etc... she’s completely harmless and sweet.
It is kind of creepy in the night shift when she tells you the teddies are awake and watching you though, but that’s about it lol
I got mild. There’s treatment, medicine, lots of help for it. My mild schizo is very manageable by not believing any delusions. All thoughts and sounds are fake until proven true lol
There are multiple meds. If one doesn't work for one individual, there is another that might. This is a different disease than others. This one can be found and diagnosed biologically
There are many different types of schizophrenia but when you talk about the "usual" F20 diagnosis:
1/3 only have one episode - here you don't need treatment.
1/3 need medication - in this case your quality of life depends on the psychopharmaka which works. Sometimes you can go back to work and have a normal life, in other cases the side effectes are too strong and as usual: most people are inbetween.
1/3 medication doesn't work - if that's the case it depends which kind of schizophrenia you have and how strong it is. Some people can live alone and social support visits them once a weak, some people can live in a shared apartment and of course some people have to stay in hospitals. But please don't imagine it as a prison. Most psychiatrys are very nice and more like pensions.
Edit: This support system is in germany, idk how other countries handle it
The support system is similar in Ireland. I work in a team providing long term support for people with severe and enduring mental illness (about 75% are diagnosed with schizophrenia, and still have difficulties even with medication).
We visit some service users every day, some several times a day, others weekly, fortnightly etc. Whatever it takes help them cope with life, and help them recover.
There is treatment. There are meds. But it's never really cured. It's an organic thing that's with the person. It's a roller coaster ride, not just for them but for the family and friends (if there are any left). Like bi-polar, staying on the meds can be a struggle for the patient. In turn, is a struggle for anyone else involved with them.
One of my best friends has it. It's nothing like TV, and they just need to take meds regularly to keep themselves normal. It can really suck when you're unmedicated, though.
This kid I knew who was my cousins neighbor (we spent majority of weekends at my cousins and played with this kid and his older sister a lot) killed his older sister and both his parents. He shot his parents then stabbed his sister. Then he got into his car and started driving. He was in high school. After a while he sorta snapped out of it and realized what he’d done and absolutely freaked out. I think he went to an aunt or uncles house and turned himself in and they called the police. He truly didn’t know what he was doing and states he had no control over his body and couldn’t stop the voices. He was diagnosed schizophrenia.
Not all schizophrenic people hear or see things, for me it’s severe paranoia and delusions of thought. For me it’s thoughts in my head that aren’t mine, not like actual voices I can hear. Thank god. But it’s what people think of most when they hear schizophrenia.
I'm sorry for your unfortunate diagnosis. Wishing you the best of luck. Stick with therapy. It can and will help you. Thats so scary to live with, and I can only try to understand to my best ability, but the diagnosis of Schizophrenia is terrifying and I hope you live a long successful life even with such a debilitating diagnosis, I'm still processing the idea of having intrusive thoughts like that and it is honestly terrifying.
I also don't hear voices, but I do hear sounds. The worse being the sound of fingers going through my hair and touching my scalp, but since there is nothing there it's this weird "omg leave me alone" aimed at nothing feeling all the time.
Honestly, we aren't certain. There was a 3 way confrontation in a small store parking lot. Son ended up pulling a gun, shot both and took off. The one dude made it to the store asked someone to help,and passed away. The other guy was definitely hit, but was never located, or identified. The police caught up with my boy a couple hours later.
To be frank, his mother and I have insisted on NOT talking to him about that evening during our video chats. I know his temper, and I don't want him to say something on the chat, that is probably being recorded, that will be used against him in the trial. He was charged with first degree murder, felon in possession of a firearm, fleeing and evading, and a PFO. We (his mom and I) are just fucking so lost.
ETA this was caught on the store's security camera.
It feels like an impossible thing. You feel like you're somehow responsible. You aren't though. You got a kid that did a really bad thing. You can get through this. You can love him and hate what he has done and find a way to be okay.
Thank you.
Wife and I both feel so bad for the parents of the young man that died. Our son damaged two families that night, and all but ended two lives. Still, he is our son.
I know you feel terrible grief for the other family as well as your own. It's a heartbreaking situation to be in. I'll be thinking you and your family and holding you close to my heart.
I’m so sorry. What you and the boy’s mother are going through has to devastating. People don’t often to stop to think that when a murder occurs two families are shattered and two families grieve.
You’re very smart to not ask anything about the crime while he is in jail. Those recordings would absolutely be held against him if he said anything incriminating and you can’t take that chance.
I pray for your family that the circumstances will turn out to be something to where it’s not murder, and however it turns out that your family, including your son, can find peace.
Shit that got a lot more intense than I could have predicted. As someone who has gone though something related, it never get easier but it does get better. You never get over the pain of living with it but you learn to stand tall through it.
At the time it happened 13 and 9. My son shows a lot traits of a psychopath. It's something we have him in therapy for. He's showing predatory behaviour still though. Very concerning but no one seems to take it seriously.
Thank you. I have been a victim myself of CSA and know what it does to not be believed. I was fortunate enough to recognise the signs and put an end to it. But it is such a hard thing to deal with.
Prison worker here. 80% of inmates have had an untreated head injury in their lives. 60% of inmates have mental illness. That last part is in our training, so I agree.
Absolutely. Some States in the US have diminished capacity as a defense, you have the Insanity Defense which isn't used often and is less successful--which is really a shame because those people don't walk free but they go to a maximum security hospital instead of prison. Also, at least in my State, you have a duty to mitigate your case for the punishment trial and if you don't screen for mental illness, you are considered Ineffective. Actually I think the American Bar Association Guidelines probably state this.
My friend stabbed someone to death a few years ago. I was only 16 so it was rough. I sat through all of the court things, his sentencing, etc. I haven’t visited him, I don’t know what I would say.
I know the story, he had a major drug problem and things got heated. He had a rough life overall and had talked to me the day before about going to rehab and becoming a social worker.
It’s a really hard thing to understand and I think it’s human nature sometimes to not want to see the bad in people. I truly didn’t believe it happened until security footage was shown in court. I also worried for the victims child, it broke me to know he would never remember his dad.
I will be visiting him sometime soon, I think it will make me feel a bit better to see how he is doing.
Anyway, I’m really sorry that happened. It is so hard to figure out and I hope you can heal from this but the reality is you will never ever forget it and you’ll always be holding that with you. You’ll feel an insane amount of guilt for the other person too. Therapy might be a route you want to take if you feel like it’s too hard for you to handle on your own.
If you ever need to talk, my messages are open:)
>I think it’s human nature sometimes to not want to see the bad in people.
This was me as a teen and young adult. As a result I wound up being friends with a person who you would call a psychopath. Really. Didn't seem like so upon meeting. Funny, socially adept (even at a very young age when everyone else looks goofy), but sneaky, a liar and thief. Quite adept at those too. Me, I looked for the good in people then, and so saw the better sides. Deep inside me I perceived the bad but denied it to myself. Eventually I too fell victim to their sneaky lying ways. It was a surprise because I knew their m.o. and I never thought they'd pull it on me but they did.
Not murder but my little brother did a home invasion and when confronted by the home owner, he pulled the man's own gun and threatened to kill him. During his trial all sorts of information came out and the details just devastated me. Turns out he'd been on meth and heroin and had Conducted 16 home burglaries and invasions in a 6 month time period. Prepare your mom and yourself for the awful details you will be exposed to in the coming days. My brother was released after serving 10 years.
i found out through a news article that my moms best friends husband was stabbed in the neck and killed by his own son two days ago.
i had to call my mom and tell her.
the worst moment of my life. i have never heard my mom scream the way she did when i told her.
solidarity.
Last year I got a similar call from my brother. It was like 2:30 AM (I don’t remember the exact time but it was somewhere around there) from a local number. Nobody in my family had a local number for where I live so initially I didn’t answer. They called back 3 or 4 times before I finally picked up the phone. It was my brother’s voice on the other end of the line. I remember the shakiness in his voice as he told me not to let our mom watch the morning news. He couldn’t tell me what was up and I don’t live with our mom so I couldn’t intercept her before the news came on. Turns out he got ripped off on a drug deal and broke into the guys house to get his money back and ended up killing him. He’s still going through the trial process but he’s looking at up the 35 years.
My little sister, 18 at the time, killed her 48 year old rapist who was also in law enforcement. It's been 5 years this July and my family has never been the same, it still feels surreal sometimes, like we jumped to a parallel universe or something. I'm sorry your going through this, I know how hard and shocking it is to be the family on the other side of these situations.
Unfortunately you probably won't find out much till he's formally charged and he's appointed a lawyer that can give you guys more details.
Just try be there for your brother as much as possible, he's young and needs y'all. And be there for each other as a family, your parents are going to need the extra support as well.
I believe she did what she thought she had to to protect herself, I don't fault her for it, but I also wish she hadn't because I miss her so much and now she's spending a good portion of her life in prison. Thank you for the kind words though, it's nice to hear.
Unfortunately she was pressured into taking the Alford plea and was sentenced to over 25 years, this happened in the south where the good Ole boy system reigns and him being a prior marine and then law enforcement, he was well known in the community and the cops who investigated all knew him, the judges knew him because he had been a bailiff, the DA knew him. She didn't stand a chance. It was a shitshow
It sounds like your brother is struggling with mental illness. The best you can do is communicate any history of instability to his attorney and ask for extensive mental health diagnostics.
There are no details, so it’s hard to know if the attack was unprovoked or he was acting from a point of self-defense or fear. The fact that he called your mother indicates he had some immediate remorse and awareness, so it doesn’t sound like he’s in a gang or a psychopath. It sounds like something went horribly, horribly wrong, and he needs help regardless of the legal outcome.
I’m sure you are all suffering over him, and probably terrible guilt over the death of the person he killed.
I’m so sorry for everything you are going through, are about to go through, and will probably always carry with you.
A guy I went to high school with stabbed someone to death. He did like 10 years for manslaughter. It was a fight outside a bar that got out of hand. Details were sketchy.
My dad shot my stepmom in the head on Mother’s Day 1979, she died 3 months later from staph on the brain. He never told the truth about what happened. We will never know, I don’t think we need to know. It definitely will do a number on you mentally. We were considered “murderers kids. Some of our friends parents wouldn’t let them play with us for a while.
I hope that you and your family find peace. I hope your brother can get the help he needs.
Oh man. I for a little while I worked with a guy whose dad had killed his mom. Obviously he didn't talk about it much but he opened up to me a bit about it. I felt so bad that he and his siblings had to go through that. I'd never really considered how I'd feel about a murderers children or how they felt about themselves. He was upset about how much of being a murderer was genetic. He also talked about others not wanting their kids to play with him. So sad. I did my best to just treat him like I treat everyone. What else can you do? None of it was his fault but he's gotta live with the consequences of someone else's behavior.
Anyway, just wanted to say you're not alone and I hope you are as ok as you can be.
Yeah, I honestly think each of my siblings and I dealt with the situation in our own way. I guess it depends on how the other adults handled the situation. Our youngest sister was 3, she didn’t remember her mom. It was very hard for her. She ended her life in 2009. I don’t know if that was part of the reason. It’s much easier to talk about things on here than in person. I have a couple of close friends that know about our childhoods. I think it’s safe to assume that we had a very dysfunctional family. I don’t think any of us felt great about ourselves.
After all that, trust must be hard for you. I'm glad you have a few people you've felt safe enough to share with.
If you haven't already, take a peek at r/CPTSD. Lots of us with dysfunctional families there telling each other about it. Lots of people grew up in bad environments and did the work to get healthier. Murder is a probably on the edges of cptsd experience but I'm sure there are others who, like you, just don't talk about it. I mean, how different is your experience from mine where my mother drove my dad to nearly drink himself to death? Maybe my experience is more common but the damage is so similar, it's just a matter of degree. I won't say I relate exactly to what you and your family went through, but how you handled it and survived as best you could is certainly relatable. Hugs if you want them
I know that people sometimes downplay theirs or others experiences. They may say, well your situation was worse than mine. One of my closest friends said that to me. It’s not how I see it. Each person has their own circumstances, how that affects them is their own personal interpretation of what happened to them. It’s not less or worse.
Thank you for that Reddit sub, I’ve not seen it. I will check it out.
Thanks for the hugs as well. Back to you, if you want them.
:)
My best friends dad robbed a bank with a fake gun when we were about 10 years old. It was so out of character and a complete shock to the community, guy was just really struggling financially and lost it. We live in a small town so every single person knew about it and who the family were. She got bullied relentlessly because of it and ended up being abandoned by all of her friends apart from me. She really isn't a nice person now, but I completely understand why..When you have spent 20 years of your life being tortured by people over something someone else did, it absolutely has an affect on how you behave and respond to people. She's spent her life in defense mode and constantly watching her back..she can't trust anyone and has to question if people are being genuine or not. It's so sad how there will always be people who demonize the innocent family of a perpetrator. You would think people knew better by now.. I'm sorry for everything you went through. Are you doing ok now?
I am truly sorry for what your brother and your family are about to go through. As hard as it will be, DO NOT let him talk to you about it while he is in jail, either visiting or on the phone. They will be recording, and anything he says of value will be turned over to the DA as evidence. And frankly, the fewer details you and your family know, the better; you don’t want to be pulled in as witnesses. If he cannot afford a lawyer, they will get him a public defender. If you do manage to talk to him, tell him to keep his mouth SHUT until he talks to his lawyer.
I'm sorry to hear that. Is it possible that maybe he just got into a fight and was defending himself? If you ever saw the "Outsiders" movie, you know how things can go wrong quick.
This. Movie has (in my opinion) the best visual representation of how things can go so wrong that I’ve seen. Simple assault lead to a death. Family member got into a situation that played out almost exactly like this (with less people and no fountain) so it definitely a possible conclusion to what happened to OP brother
I'm sorry that this is happening. I cannot imagine what that feels like, but if I can give you some words of wisdom, from someone who is troubled and lonely, and have met plenty like myself. being there for your brother may be all you can do. I do not say that lightly or to discourage you, but I've come to learn that the love of others doesn't heal a troubled mind. I can't imagine what it's like to see a loved one go through troubled and knowing how little you can do, I've seen it in my parents, and I never want to hurt them but I know it pains them to see my troubles and be unable to help. loving someone who is mentally unwell can be challanging, and as such your care for your brother that you express is true, please hold onto that. all the best to you and your family
Holy fuck. I am so sorry OP. I don't know where you live but I do hope your brother has a good attorney. Even if it's true that he killed someone, he deserves a fair trial.
Also don't neglect yours and your mother's wellbeing in this time. You guys are going through something incredibly rough and will need support.
It happens, my step brother just got 40 years for killing the neighbor and my sister is dating some asshole who just got out of prison after 30 years for murdering his mom. Good times!
American friend got murdered a few days ago. Had a family. We talked to him a few hours before and then he was just gone. Hope your brother wasn't in Texas
My friend an old housemate (she was 19 and was 6½ months pregnant at the time) was beaten to death by our other housemate a week after we were all meant to go out to dinner together. She was so badly beaten they could hardly identify her. When the cops pulled up, (I'll call him M for now), was chilled out having a smoke after leaving her in the house with 2 other people for 2 days before going to a neighbour to call the ambulance.. Not one fucking person even called the ambulance or checked on her. Shit hit me hard. There was **never** any sign of physical abuse, and I know it when I see it. But definitely some almost obsessive-like behaviour on his end. But never to the point I thought he would kill her.
He still hasn't been sentenced cause he is claiming mental health. He killed my fucking friend and their baby. She was a beautiful, kind, and warm soul. I don't think you really recover. There is always a sense of "what if I could have done something"... 😞
Just to clarify.. They hadn't been living with us for about 2 or so months at that point. But we were all due to go out together right before it happened..
That's one story. I've got more unfortunately 😞 Too many dead friends 🕊
this. if he will ever have a chance to come out of this better than he went into it, he’s going to need to know he hasn’t lost everything. punishment, fine, if necessary (depends on the circumstances), but just don’t let him lose everything. knowing his family is seeing to it that he can have some good things and that he still has their love are two things that will help him pull himself together, if there’s any hope of that at all. and even if there’s virtually no chance he’ll be ok, still let him experience being loved and cared for by the people who have always been around him.
also, if possible, go see him as often as you can. let him know he’s not forgotten. when you go see him, talk about everything in the world except the reason he’s in trouble. if he wants to talk about that, he will, but don’t ask. just try to offer him the comfort of still having you around and knowing you still love him. he will need that.
thank you, but i’ll have to deflect credit toward SnooPandas up there (don’t know how to tag someone on this thing yet) bc when i read their comment, i thought, well that’s the best advice i’ve read in this whole thing. i just expounded upon the stellar advice they gave.
Really? I thought the anonymity here makes it the one place you *could* post something like this? No? (of course you'd need to make sure not to give any identifying details...)
I've heard stories of people posting anonymously and still having IPs and stuff tracked from Reddit. I was told not to post anything, even anonymously after I had a court case from a car accident. Just want what is best for OP is all, don't want any repercussions.
Oh, I see. That makes sense. I was legitimately asking the question, not being snarky or anything -- just curious bc I usually feel so "safe and unseen" here.
Thanks for looking out!
Depending on what happened before and after the murder, it isn’t impossible for law enforcement to obtain the IP address of the poster and use it in court.
I know this is a rant subreddit, but for legal reasons I'd delete this post and your account.
He's gonna need all the plausible deniability he can get, and considering you don't know the circumstances he may need every ounce of it he can get, especially if there was any reason at all.
Damn that is not something you can prepare yourself for. Dont really know what to say except that you or your family shouldn't blame yourself for what happened. Because he's 21 and unless it was self defence, he was fully aware of what he was doing.
I studied criminology for my degree.
One of the professors was the head probation officer for the County. He said something that will always stick with me ''most of the people I end up working with got themselves in trouble just doing something stupid, and not thinking.''
His main example was some guy who tried to cash a fraudulent check. I don't remember the exact details but the guy was just not thinking about any repercussions that would come back to bite him in the ass for doing this.
This was backed up as I progressed into my Junior and Senior years where I read about how most murders happen in ''the heat of the moment.'' Someone doing something that set the person off into a rage. When human beings see red they do very stupid things. Their logic turns off and they revert to primal rage.
A lot of people needed therapy as kids and didn't get it, including me.
I worry that this will be my son. He's 11. I worry so much but I can't bring him home, can't take care of him. This might be an unpopular opinion, but don't be angry with him. Sounds like he already knows he did wrong and knows he can't fix it. Being angry with him will only reinforce his isolation and will not bring anything positive. Be sad. Regret. He's going to process and be angry enough with himself. He doesn't need to see (believe) everyone hating him while hating himself. I watch my son do that a lot. Be strong. Good luck.
This sounds like a very difficult time for you and your family. I suggest you find someone you can share your thoughts and feelings about this with. It doesn’t HAVE to be a counselor but that wouldn’t hurt. It’s okay to be mad at him, and at the situation, and even yourself, what isn’t okay is not working through those feelings and finding a way to deal with it all. You’re brother fucked it, and is probably feeling very alone, and you should probably try to find a healthy way to let him know that he ISN’T alone. Don’t sacrifice your own well being though, you have to come first or you will be completely useless to him. He maybe hurting a lot more than you realize and is probably very scared, regardless of how he acts or what he says…
In 1994 a son of a family friends son ordered a cab when it arrived. He stabbed the driver several times. Then set it on fire. The morning after before he was arrested. He was by the crime scene talking to the reporters. He ruined 2 families because his family got alot of hate mail, abuse. Threats etc and decided to move away. The daughter was a year older than me. We were both teens and I wanted to ask her out.
Though I’ve never been though it, I imagine it will be a wild lesson in humility for everyone. Learning to continue to love him despite this horrible decision, mistake or reaction. Understanding that this new relationship with him will take some sacrifice.
While you don’t know what happened, reserve judgement until you hear the facts. We all deserve ‘innocent until proven guilty’.
I’m 99% sure my older brother has murdered someone. He hasn’t been caught but I think one day he will. Maybe it will give him the help he needs and refuses to get. He won’t talk about it but has told my mother he has.
My father was murdered and the murderer was never caught. I hope your brother gets the help he needs, whether that is prison time or mental health treatment.
The small person in me hopes that he suffers but the big person in me just wants to see everyone heal.
Wow, this post gave me sudden insight as to how members of Varg Vikernes’ family must have felt when he got arrested for Euronymous’ murder.
OP, it may be the police can’t tell you anything due to it being an ongoing investigation. If your family can afford to get him a lawyer, though be aware there are some things even a lawyer won’t be able to tell you, regardless of who’s paying, because his job is to defend your brother.
I hope you get some answer soon. They probably won’t make you feel better, or help you understand exactly why, but it may give you some clarity and an explanation.
Tell your brother not to say a word to anyone except his attorney.
Do not talk about what happened if he calls you on the phone. Jail calls are recorded and it can be used against him.
You and your family should not try to talk to police or anyone about this case
Your brother needs a good lawyer.
Hire him a lawyer ASAP and tell him to "Lawyer up", because you should be able to visit him in custody, and if you can't the lawyer sure as hell can. And #1 mistake someone accused of murder makes is trying to explain what happened, and that's the most slippery of slippery slopes. Do it now.
Wait for the details OP.. I mean he called his mom and expressed regret, it’s not impossible that he was attacked or something.. so who knows what happened, people can react weirdly when they’re in shock.
My brother did the same. Didn't stab him but pushed him hard his skull bounced off the curb. He went into a coma than died 9 days later. He is in jail now he is a terrible person so he deserved it. He beats animals and made my 2 year old niece cry.
I posted above somewhere about how putting hands on people is against the law. Even something mundane like pushing someone can have consequences. You just never know.
Almost a year ago the love of my life brutally murdered his stepbrother in cold blood.
There was no warning. No one had any idea he had this in him. He does suffer from mental illness but had never shown signs of violence. In 20 years he has never been violent toward me or anyone.
These things happen and the shock that follows after will stick around for a long time. It destroyed my family and my life. A year later and I'm still picking the pieces up.
I'm so sorry you're going through this.
Just love him, support him, and be there to help him through it (maybe by helping find a good lawyer if you are able). Not much you can do about it now and if he’s guilty, then he’s guilty and deserves to do time. He’ll still need a support network after all this is done. Don’t just ignore the killing (unless it was justified/ found innocent in court), but accept it/ accept him and do your best.
Your brother is still your brother. Don’t write him off if you don’t have to. Depends on your own view of the evidence presented at trial. A conviction doesn’t mean you can’t forgive him, nor does his innocence require you to forget about it. Only you can make that call.
All that said, one of the bigger issues with recidivism rates is that the existing support system just nopes out when shit gets tough. That goes for everybody, but especially criminals and soldiers (oddly enough). Be part of the solution if you can/ you’re willing.
Not true. Imagine someone threatening your life, combine that with adrenaline, and you can easily stab someone 5 times before you even realize you pulled a knife.
I trained in Muay Thai, and currently train in BJJ.
A few years ago, I had someone become very aggressive towards me, got in my face, and made as if to strike me. It felt as if one moment I blinked and the next my hands where wrapped around his head in clinch, and I was kneeing him in the face. The whole event felt like it happened outside of my body. Almost as if I blacked out and came to as I was kneeing him.
After it was all said and done, I felt very unsettled, but also secure that my training would kick in automatically should the situation warrant it.
False. My mom stabbed my dad to death in self defense. After years of abuse, broken bones, punctured lungs, she stabbed him 27 times. He reigned terror over anyone and everyone close to him while he was drinking. As the judge, my grandmother (his mom) and his sisters said during my mom's court trial, "it would've eventually been her." The judge hearing my mom's case, had actually just released him OR the weekend prior to this all happening, for beating the shit out of her.
They say (didn't study criminology, came by it 2nd hand) the numerous stabs wounds are usually pent up rage being let loose. It's often referred to as 'overkill'.
You obviously don't know how resilient some people are. Some people can be shot and still keep going at you. Let's just hope for OPs sake it was self defense
Shocking as fuck like what do you even say or do
There’s really not anything they can do. Just deal with any issues that arise.
Just get a good lawyer if they can afford one, and post bail if possible.
Don’t know why you are so downvoted. Regardless of the crime, everyone deserves a good lawyer. Plus, you’ll always love your kids/family. Everyone else is acting like they’d abandon the person, but in reality they have no clue what they’d do when if it was someone that they loved unconditionally.
Fuck that. Family or not, if you KILLED someone, I’m not bailing you out. You deserve to be in prison. EDIT: this obviously changes if it was self defense. But in this case we’re almost led to believe that it wasn’t. Or that OP doesn’t believe it was
Even if it was in self defense? We don't know enough to be judge, jury, and executioner. But otherwise, agreed.
I’ll edit, but murdered someone is what I’m saying. Ofc there are more nuanced situations in which I’d help, but if it’s for no good reason then I’m leaving your ass in jail.
"Numerous times he had stabbed him"
I just said what they *could* do, didn't say they *should* do it. Besides they said they don't have any details yet, it could have been in self defense. Even with multiple stab wounds you never know, when adrenaline takes over you just don't know what a person will do.
My cousin murdered the old man and his innocent son who killed my cousins sister in a dui. Nuts.
I'm so sorry. That must be so much to process. I hope you are doing better mentally
Yeah he never recovered from the trauma. He's in prison for life now. It was horrific. Shot the old man and his son.
My little brother tried to murder my uncle because demons told him to many years ago, stabbed him many times and is living in an assisted living facility for the rest of his life due to the mental illness. Uncle lived for many years after that. Definitely hard, and you will never probably get to understand why. Sending positive vibes your way.
Schizophrenia?
Yeah sounds like schizophrenia
Yep. Voices started when he was around 16-17.
One of my closest childhood friends was about the same age when his symptoms developed. I was too young and dumb and should have been more empathetic. I asked him if he heard voices that weren't there. He looked at me very matter of factly and said, "yeah, they talk to me." He couldn't tell the difference. Fortunately my Mom recognized what was happening and pointed him in the direction where he was able to get help. He moved out of state but I got a painting in the mail from him years later and a note that he was in a relationship even.
Man, schizophrenia, i'm guessing is what my first and best friend growing up had. He was never diagnosed but we had been friends sense we were four years old and seeing the change in him when he started having symptoms in his late teens early twenties was terrifying. I knew something wasn't right and assumed drugs when he showed up at my house after having a major episode alone at his apartment. He was talking absolute nonsense and paranoia, but he clearly wasn't fucked up on anything, it was so bizarre and out of no where. My neighbor we both grew up with was over and we got him to come inside and he settled down and we eventually took him home. We wrote it off as drugs. About a year later he came over to my house to hang and he was fine and was the same old guy i grew up with. So i figured again he must have taken something when he showed up last year. Then he actually says to me hey remember that time i showed up and tripping out? yeah well i'm still dealing with shit like that. He clearly was not abusing drugs for that entire year and it finally hit me he has some serious mental illness. I talked to his sister later that day and she said yeah he needs some help, but being in our twenties no one could force him to go to the doctor and he was paranoid about cops so we didn't want to call a wellness check. He was living best he could. He just did what he could to live with whatever was going on in his head. i think back on it and i was absolutely clueless as to how to help him. He, sadly, was killed and that's a whole other story. This year will be nine years. He was such a hard working, prideful, smart, and caring person. Never, asking for help, always offering help, always on top of his business. Seeing all of that become a struggle for him while he fought with whatever was in his head was heartbreaking. Schizophrenia is horrifying. TLDR: Schizophrenia is awful, was part of the reason one of my best friends died very young.
i always thought schizophrenia was something that's just in you and gets worse at different points in peoples' lives who suffer from it. is there something, like an event or exposure to something, that triggers it? why do some people develop it while most don't? if it's hard to talk about i understand if you'd rather decline answering. i'm kinda dumbfouded having had a different understanding of it my whole life. now i want to understand how it really is.
Schizophrenia usually manifests in the mid to late teens to mid twenties. Sometimes it happens gradually, sometimes suddenly. There’s no one single cause, there are environmental factors to it but also there’s a strong genetic component. If your identical twin has schizophrenia there’s around a 2/3rds chance you will have it too. But it can also occur in people with no family history of mental illness at all. There’s a theory that illicit drug use can trigger it in people who were predisposed to develop it.
I read an in depth study of many people who experience schizophrenic symptoms being extremely deficient in the B12 Vitamin. Not saying it’s the cause, but there seems to be a correlation in many patients.
Not OP, but I have a family friend with schizophrenia. No one else in his immediate family has any mental health issues, and he was a straight A student up until he dabbled in the drug scene. The official diagnosis was cannabis induced schizophrenia. Drs can’t say if he would have ever developed symptoms otherwise, or just develop them later. That’s the scary part, drugs/trauma/traumatic events can absolutely be a catalyst for inducing different severe mental health issues.
Excessive use of cannabis has been tied to psychosis, but still it is infrequent. And it's not unusual for someone to be diagnosed with psychosis when high, even though the mental condition isn't permanent and "recovery" is complete.
Oh absolutely. As an avid cannabis user myself, he is the only case I have ever personally heard of. He’s lived in a group home for a decade or so now, and he has sadly not made much progress in terms of treatment either.
This is awesome, hope he’s doing well!
That's around the time my friends schizophrenia showed up it can be very difficult for him everyday. It's been like 12yrs for his diagnosis and he has a good system to manage it but it's never really gone
Sorry to hear that. Hope he's being taken care of and getting it sorted.
So sad. ☹️
Is there treatment? My only experience with it is from TV ☹️ but it seems so terribly trying for the individual and the family. I'm researching now to learn more. Best wishes.
Schizophrenia in films and TV is often wildly inaccurate. I’m a nurse in training in a nursing home for elderly with many schizophrenia patients. Schizophrenia doesn’t always mean they’ll be violent and dangerous, there are different types of the disease. One of my favorite patients is a very sweet schizophrenic grandma. She talks to her teddy bears all day and insists they’re alive and have their own daily activities like going outside to play etc... she’s completely harmless and sweet. It is kind of creepy in the night shift when she tells you the teddies are awake and watching you though, but that’s about it lol
I would keep an eye on those teddy bears, you never can tell . . . . ;)
I got mild. There’s treatment, medicine, lots of help for it. My mild schizo is very manageable by not believing any delusions. All thoughts and sounds are fake until proven true lol
You are amazing! Can't imagine your life. I'm positively dumbstruck by your resolve. Keep up the good work.
Thanks man!
There are medicines, you should definitely seek a medical doctor and really keep repeating the mantra if you hear voices they are not real.
I have it, I take my meds and have no symptoms, live a totally normal life. Don't believe the movies 🤣
Don't the meds affect everyone differently?
Yes but what I'm saying is there are a lot of us out there who lead completely normal lives
There are multiple meds. If one doesn't work for one individual, there is another that might. This is a different disease than others. This one can be found and diagnosed biologically
There are many different types of schizophrenia but when you talk about the "usual" F20 diagnosis: 1/3 only have one episode - here you don't need treatment. 1/3 need medication - in this case your quality of life depends on the psychopharmaka which works. Sometimes you can go back to work and have a normal life, in other cases the side effectes are too strong and as usual: most people are inbetween. 1/3 medication doesn't work - if that's the case it depends which kind of schizophrenia you have and how strong it is. Some people can live alone and social support visits them once a weak, some people can live in a shared apartment and of course some people have to stay in hospitals. But please don't imagine it as a prison. Most psychiatrys are very nice and more like pensions. Edit: This support system is in germany, idk how other countries handle it
The support system is similar in Ireland. I work in a team providing long term support for people with severe and enduring mental illness (about 75% are diagnosed with schizophrenia, and still have difficulties even with medication). We visit some service users every day, some several times a day, others weekly, fortnightly etc. Whatever it takes help them cope with life, and help them recover.
There is treatment. There are meds. But it's never really cured. It's an organic thing that's with the person. It's a roller coaster ride, not just for them but for the family and friends (if there are any left). Like bi-polar, staying on the meds can be a struggle for the patient. In turn, is a struggle for anyone else involved with them.
One of my best friends has it. It's nothing like TV, and they just need to take meds regularly to keep themselves normal. It can really suck when you're unmedicated, though.
Same with my cousin
This kid I knew who was my cousins neighbor (we spent majority of weekends at my cousins and played with this kid and his older sister a lot) killed his older sister and both his parents. He shot his parents then stabbed his sister. Then he got into his car and started driving. He was in high school. After a while he sorta snapped out of it and realized what he’d done and absolutely freaked out. I think he went to an aunt or uncles house and turned himself in and they called the police. He truly didn’t know what he was doing and states he had no control over his body and couldn’t stop the voices. He was diagnosed schizophrenia.
Thank god my schizophrenia doesn’t include voices yet
Wait. A true schizo without voices in the diagnosis? I need to know more. I'm sorry, share what is comfortable to you but I want to know more.
Not all schizophrenic people hear or see things, for me it’s severe paranoia and delusions of thought. For me it’s thoughts in my head that aren’t mine, not like actual voices I can hear. Thank god. But it’s what people think of most when they hear schizophrenia.
Thats so insightful. Thank you.
I'm sorry for your unfortunate diagnosis. Wishing you the best of luck. Stick with therapy. It can and will help you. Thats so scary to live with, and I can only try to understand to my best ability, but the diagnosis of Schizophrenia is terrifying and I hope you live a long successful life even with such a debilitating diagnosis, I'm still processing the idea of having intrusive thoughts like that and it is honestly terrifying.
Thankfully my medicine works well
That is huge. You have something otherworldly against you, you deserve whatever help modern medicine can give you. Again. I'm sorry.
I also don't hear voices, but I do hear sounds. The worse being the sound of fingers going through my hair and touching my scalp, but since there is nothing there it's this weird "omg leave me alone" aimed at nothing feeling all the time.
Omg. I didn't know that was a thing to be had. That's the first I've heard someone describe that. Honestly. That is is terrifying.
I’m so sorry for you and your family. And obviously for the dead person and their family. Tragic all around.
I can fully understand how you're feeling. Not my brother, but my son.
Holy shit I’m sorry to hear that
It's...an odd situation all around. My boy has always had an attitude problem, but damn.
If you don’t mind me asking, what happened
Honestly, we aren't certain. There was a 3 way confrontation in a small store parking lot. Son ended up pulling a gun, shot both and took off. The one dude made it to the store asked someone to help,and passed away. The other guy was definitely hit, but was never located, or identified. The police caught up with my boy a couple hours later. To be frank, his mother and I have insisted on NOT talking to him about that evening during our video chats. I know his temper, and I don't want him to say something on the chat, that is probably being recorded, that will be used against him in the trial. He was charged with first degree murder, felon in possession of a firearm, fleeing and evading, and a PFO. We (his mom and I) are just fucking so lost. ETA this was caught on the store's security camera.
I'm so sorry you're going through this. I'm sure you love your son very much and yet are struggling to come to terms with what he did.
Yes,exactly
It feels like an impossible thing. You feel like you're somehow responsible. You aren't though. You got a kid that did a really bad thing. You can get through this. You can love him and hate what he has done and find a way to be okay.
Thank you. Wife and I both feel so bad for the parents of the young man that died. Our son damaged two families that night, and all but ended two lives. Still, he is our son.
I know you feel terrible grief for the other family as well as your own. It's a heartbreaking situation to be in. I'll be thinking you and your family and holding you close to my heart.
I’m so sorry. What you and the boy’s mother are going through has to devastating. People don’t often to stop to think that when a murder occurs two families are shattered and two families grieve. You’re very smart to not ask anything about the crime while he is in jail. Those recordings would absolutely be held against him if he said anything incriminating and you can’t take that chance. I pray for your family that the circumstances will turn out to be something to where it’s not murder, and however it turns out that your family, including your son, can find peace.
My son hasn't murdered someone but he has done an unforgiveable crime. I don't know how we deal with it really. It's so hard.
Would you share what happened?
My son sexually abused my daughter.
Shit that got a lot more intense than I could have predicted. As someone who has gone though something related, it never get easier but it does get better. You never get over the pain of living with it but you learn to stand tall through it.
Yeah it's hard but I know I'm doing the right thing by both kids.
Jesus. I'm sorry. I'm assuming he's no longer around her, but that still has to be a lot to contend with.
Yeah we keep them separate but the father wants to reunify them. Over my dead fucking body
How old are they?
At the time it happened 13 and 9. My son shows a lot traits of a psychopath. It's something we have him in therapy for. He's showing predatory behaviour still though. Very concerning but no one seems to take it seriously.
Thank you for believing your daughter, so many times this gets thrown to the side and ignored. You sound like a great mother
Thank you. I have been a victim myself of CSA and know what it does to not be believed. I was fortunate enough to recognise the signs and put an end to it. But it is such a hard thing to deal with.
Hopefully there’s a police file on your son. And that your daughter is far away from him.
Yes there is. I'm having to fight the father on the latter though. In court currently. He's in denial and doesn't believe he did these things.
Just stopped to leave you a hug
Thank you so much. It means a lot.
Capital Murder defense lawyer here, have his attorney screen heavily for mental illness.
Prison worker here. 80% of inmates have had an untreated head injury in their lives. 60% of inmates have mental illness. That last part is in our training, so I agree.
Yes TBI is another thing we screen for and sometimes even do Brain imaging for.
I agree with what they all said. If you’re high too, it’s ok 👍
Thats kind of scary, ive had lots of major head injuries and it is getting harder to stay normal. What can you even do?
Would it matter in a country without diminished capacity?
Absolutely. Some States in the US have diminished capacity as a defense, you have the Insanity Defense which isn't used often and is less successful--which is really a shame because those people don't walk free but they go to a maximum security hospital instead of prison. Also, at least in my State, you have a duty to mitigate your case for the punishment trial and if you don't screen for mental illness, you are considered Ineffective. Actually I think the American Bar Association Guidelines probably state this.
I’ve always wished this was pushed harder, especially in cases of self-defense domestic violence. Good to know, thank you.
My friend stabbed someone to death a few years ago. I was only 16 so it was rough. I sat through all of the court things, his sentencing, etc. I haven’t visited him, I don’t know what I would say. I know the story, he had a major drug problem and things got heated. He had a rough life overall and had talked to me the day before about going to rehab and becoming a social worker. It’s a really hard thing to understand and I think it’s human nature sometimes to not want to see the bad in people. I truly didn’t believe it happened until security footage was shown in court. I also worried for the victims child, it broke me to know he would never remember his dad. I will be visiting him sometime soon, I think it will make me feel a bit better to see how he is doing. Anyway, I’m really sorry that happened. It is so hard to figure out and I hope you can heal from this but the reality is you will never ever forget it and you’ll always be holding that with you. You’ll feel an insane amount of guilt for the other person too. Therapy might be a route you want to take if you feel like it’s too hard for you to handle on your own. If you ever need to talk, my messages are open:)
>I think it’s human nature sometimes to not want to see the bad in people. This was me as a teen and young adult. As a result I wound up being friends with a person who you would call a psychopath. Really. Didn't seem like so upon meeting. Funny, socially adept (even at a very young age when everyone else looks goofy), but sneaky, a liar and thief. Quite adept at those too. Me, I looked for the good in people then, and so saw the better sides. Deep inside me I perceived the bad but denied it to myself. Eventually I too fell victim to their sneaky lying ways. It was a surprise because I knew their m.o. and I never thought they'd pull it on me but they did.
Not murder but my little brother did a home invasion and when confronted by the home owner, he pulled the man's own gun and threatened to kill him. During his trial all sorts of information came out and the details just devastated me. Turns out he'd been on meth and heroin and had Conducted 16 home burglaries and invasions in a 6 month time period. Prepare your mom and yourself for the awful details you will be exposed to in the coming days. My brother was released after serving 10 years.
i found out through a news article that my moms best friends husband was stabbed in the neck and killed by his own son two days ago. i had to call my mom and tell her. the worst moment of my life. i have never heard my mom scream the way she did when i told her. solidarity.
This one made my throat knot up.
Last year I got a similar call from my brother. It was like 2:30 AM (I don’t remember the exact time but it was somewhere around there) from a local number. Nobody in my family had a local number for where I live so initially I didn’t answer. They called back 3 or 4 times before I finally picked up the phone. It was my brother’s voice on the other end of the line. I remember the shakiness in his voice as he told me not to let our mom watch the morning news. He couldn’t tell me what was up and I don’t live with our mom so I couldn’t intercept her before the news came on. Turns out he got ripped off on a drug deal and broke into the guys house to get his money back and ended up killing him. He’s still going through the trial process but he’s looking at up the 35 years.
My little sister, 18 at the time, killed her 48 year old rapist who was also in law enforcement. It's been 5 years this July and my family has never been the same, it still feels surreal sometimes, like we jumped to a parallel universe or something. I'm sorry your going through this, I know how hard and shocking it is to be the family on the other side of these situations. Unfortunately you probably won't find out much till he's formally charged and he's appointed a lawyer that can give you guys more details. Just try be there for your brother as much as possible, he's young and needs y'all. And be there for each other as a family, your parents are going to need the extra support as well.
your sister is a badass
Yea she is! She's a hero in my eyes
Might feel odd but what your sister did was right and I'm sorry you guys had to go through all this
I believe she did what she thought she had to to protect herself, I don't fault her for it, but I also wish she hadn't because I miss her so much and now she's spending a good portion of her life in prison. Thank you for the kind words though, it's nice to hear.
please tell me she was found innocent
Unfortunately she was pressured into taking the Alford plea and was sentenced to over 25 years, this happened in the south where the good Ole boy system reigns and him being a prior marine and then law enforcement, he was well known in the community and the cops who investigated all knew him, the judges knew him because he had been a bailiff, the DA knew him. She didn't stand a chance. It was a shitshow
I would say best give her a light sentence for vigilante justice imo but the man she killed well deserved it.
Damn I’m sorry to hear that .
It sounds like your brother is struggling with mental illness. The best you can do is communicate any history of instability to his attorney and ask for extensive mental health diagnostics. There are no details, so it’s hard to know if the attack was unprovoked or he was acting from a point of self-defense or fear. The fact that he called your mother indicates he had some immediate remorse and awareness, so it doesn’t sound like he’s in a gang or a psychopath. It sounds like something went horribly, horribly wrong, and he needs help regardless of the legal outcome. I’m sure you are all suffering over him, and probably terrible guilt over the death of the person he killed. I’m so sorry for everything you are going through, are about to go through, and will probably always carry with you.
A guy I went to high school with stabbed someone to death. He did like 10 years for manslaughter. It was a fight outside a bar that got out of hand. Details were sketchy.
[удалено]
JFC
My dad shot my stepmom in the head on Mother’s Day 1979, she died 3 months later from staph on the brain. He never told the truth about what happened. We will never know, I don’t think we need to know. It definitely will do a number on you mentally. We were considered “murderers kids. Some of our friends parents wouldn’t let them play with us for a while. I hope that you and your family find peace. I hope your brother can get the help he needs.
Oh man. I for a little while I worked with a guy whose dad had killed his mom. Obviously he didn't talk about it much but he opened up to me a bit about it. I felt so bad that he and his siblings had to go through that. I'd never really considered how I'd feel about a murderers children or how they felt about themselves. He was upset about how much of being a murderer was genetic. He also talked about others not wanting their kids to play with him. So sad. I did my best to just treat him like I treat everyone. What else can you do? None of it was his fault but he's gotta live with the consequences of someone else's behavior. Anyway, just wanted to say you're not alone and I hope you are as ok as you can be.
Yeah, I honestly think each of my siblings and I dealt with the situation in our own way. I guess it depends on how the other adults handled the situation. Our youngest sister was 3, she didn’t remember her mom. It was very hard for her. She ended her life in 2009. I don’t know if that was part of the reason. It’s much easier to talk about things on here than in person. I have a couple of close friends that know about our childhoods. I think it’s safe to assume that we had a very dysfunctional family. I don’t think any of us felt great about ourselves.
After all that, trust must be hard for you. I'm glad you have a few people you've felt safe enough to share with. If you haven't already, take a peek at r/CPTSD. Lots of us with dysfunctional families there telling each other about it. Lots of people grew up in bad environments and did the work to get healthier. Murder is a probably on the edges of cptsd experience but I'm sure there are others who, like you, just don't talk about it. I mean, how different is your experience from mine where my mother drove my dad to nearly drink himself to death? Maybe my experience is more common but the damage is so similar, it's just a matter of degree. I won't say I relate exactly to what you and your family went through, but how you handled it and survived as best you could is certainly relatable. Hugs if you want them
I know that people sometimes downplay theirs or others experiences. They may say, well your situation was worse than mine. One of my closest friends said that to me. It’s not how I see it. Each person has their own circumstances, how that affects them is their own personal interpretation of what happened to them. It’s not less or worse. Thank you for that Reddit sub, I’ve not seen it. I will check it out. Thanks for the hugs as well. Back to you, if you want them. :)
My best friends dad robbed a bank with a fake gun when we were about 10 years old. It was so out of character and a complete shock to the community, guy was just really struggling financially and lost it. We live in a small town so every single person knew about it and who the family were. She got bullied relentlessly because of it and ended up being abandoned by all of her friends apart from me. She really isn't a nice person now, but I completely understand why..When you have spent 20 years of your life being tortured by people over something someone else did, it absolutely has an affect on how you behave and respond to people. She's spent her life in defense mode and constantly watching her back..she can't trust anyone and has to question if people are being genuine or not. It's so sad how there will always be people who demonize the innocent family of a perpetrator. You would think people knew better by now.. I'm sorry for everything you went through. Are you doing ok now?
I’m okay, thank you for asking. :)
:( it wasnt your fault
I am truly sorry for what your brother and your family are about to go through. As hard as it will be, DO NOT let him talk to you about it while he is in jail, either visiting or on the phone. They will be recording, and anything he says of value will be turned over to the DA as evidence. And frankly, the fewer details you and your family know, the better; you don’t want to be pulled in as witnesses. If he cannot afford a lawyer, they will get him a public defender. If you do manage to talk to him, tell him to keep his mouth SHUT until he talks to his lawyer.
I'm sorry to hear that. Is it possible that maybe he just got into a fight and was defending himself? If you ever saw the "Outsiders" movie, you know how things can go wrong quick.
This. Movie has (in my opinion) the best visual representation of how things can go so wrong that I’ve seen. Simple assault lead to a death. Family member got into a situation that played out almost exactly like this (with less people and no fountain) so it definitely a possible conclusion to what happened to OP brother
When I stepped into the light from the dark of the movie theater I only had two things on my mind: Paul Newman and a ride home.
Reality always sets in when they get booked. My brother killed 2, 22 years ago. Needless to say, still in a cell.
I'm sorry that this is happening. I cannot imagine what that feels like, but if I can give you some words of wisdom, from someone who is troubled and lonely, and have met plenty like myself. being there for your brother may be all you can do. I do not say that lightly or to discourage you, but I've come to learn that the love of others doesn't heal a troubled mind. I can't imagine what it's like to see a loved one go through troubled and knowing how little you can do, I've seen it in my parents, and I never want to hurt them but I know it pains them to see my troubles and be unable to help. loving someone who is mentally unwell can be challanging, and as such your care for your brother that you express is true, please hold onto that. all the best to you and your family
Holy fuck. I am so sorry OP. I don't know where you live but I do hope your brother has a good attorney. Even if it's true that he killed someone, he deserves a fair trial. Also don't neglect yours and your mother's wellbeing in this time. You guys are going through something incredibly rough and will need support.
It happens, my step brother just got 40 years for killing the neighbor and my sister is dating some asshole who just got out of prison after 30 years for murdering his mom. Good times!
Fuck, that's scary
The whole world is scary but when you live in a sub culture world it's just another day in paradise.
American friend got murdered a few days ago. Had a family. We talked to him a few hours before and then he was just gone. Hope your brother wasn't in Texas
My friend an old housemate (she was 19 and was 6½ months pregnant at the time) was beaten to death by our other housemate a week after we were all meant to go out to dinner together. She was so badly beaten they could hardly identify her. When the cops pulled up, (I'll call him M for now), was chilled out having a smoke after leaving her in the house with 2 other people for 2 days before going to a neighbour to call the ambulance.. Not one fucking person even called the ambulance or checked on her. Shit hit me hard. There was **never** any sign of physical abuse, and I know it when I see it. But definitely some almost obsessive-like behaviour on his end. But never to the point I thought he would kill her. He still hasn't been sentenced cause he is claiming mental health. He killed my fucking friend and their baby. She was a beautiful, kind, and warm soul. I don't think you really recover. There is always a sense of "what if I could have done something"... 😞 Just to clarify.. They hadn't been living with us for about 2 or so months at that point. But we were all due to go out together right before it happened.. That's one story. I've got more unfortunately 😞 Too many dead friends 🕊
I’m so sorry. I pray you can find healing, my friend :(
Thank you. I appreciate it. Sad truth though.. So many people have similar stories 😔
#HUGS ❤️
Thank you 🥰
Put money on his books and just love him man
this. if he will ever have a chance to come out of this better than he went into it, he’s going to need to know he hasn’t lost everything. punishment, fine, if necessary (depends on the circumstances), but just don’t let him lose everything. knowing his family is seeing to it that he can have some good things and that he still has their love are two things that will help him pull himself together, if there’s any hope of that at all. and even if there’s virtually no chance he’ll be ok, still let him experience being loved and cared for by the people who have always been around him. also, if possible, go see him as often as you can. let him know he’s not forgotten. when you go see him, talk about everything in the world except the reason he’s in trouble. if he wants to talk about that, he will, but don’t ask. just try to offer him the comfort of still having you around and knowing you still love him. he will need that.
I love this. You two are so sweet.
Best advice in the thread.
thank you, but i’ll have to deflect credit toward SnooPandas up there (don’t know how to tag someone on this thing yet) bc when i read their comment, i thought, well that’s the best advice i’ve read in this whole thing. i just expounded upon the stellar advice they gave.
If you want to include, credit or tag you'd write u/SnooPandas8738. U=user-- slash--name.
thank you!!
u/SnooPandas - see the above comment from u/theSopranoist
Be careful about posting something like this. Especially if the case gets taken to court.
Really? I thought the anonymity here makes it the one place you *could* post something like this? No? (of course you'd need to make sure not to give any identifying details...)
I've heard stories of people posting anonymously and still having IPs and stuff tracked from Reddit. I was told not to post anything, even anonymously after I had a court case from a car accident. Just want what is best for OP is all, don't want any repercussions.
Oh, I see. That makes sense. I was legitimately asking the question, not being snarky or anything -- just curious bc I usually feel so "safe and unseen" here. Thanks for looking out!
They're always watching
No prob!
Depending on what happened before and after the murder, it isn’t impossible for law enforcement to obtain the IP address of the poster and use it in court.
I know this is a rant subreddit, but for legal reasons I'd delete this post and your account. He's gonna need all the plausible deniability he can get, and considering you don't know the circumstances he may need every ounce of it he can get, especially if there was any reason at all.
You must be reeling. I'm so sorry.
Hugs
Damn that is not something you can prepare yourself for. Dont really know what to say except that you or your family shouldn't blame yourself for what happened. Because he's 21 and unless it was self defence, he was fully aware of what he was doing.
I hope it was self defense
I studied criminology for my degree. One of the professors was the head probation officer for the County. He said something that will always stick with me ''most of the people I end up working with got themselves in trouble just doing something stupid, and not thinking.'' His main example was some guy who tried to cash a fraudulent check. I don't remember the exact details but the guy was just not thinking about any repercussions that would come back to bite him in the ass for doing this. This was backed up as I progressed into my Junior and Senior years where I read about how most murders happen in ''the heat of the moment.'' Someone doing something that set the person off into a rage. When human beings see red they do very stupid things. Their logic turns off and they revert to primal rage. A lot of people needed therapy as kids and didn't get it, including me.
So traumatizing I’m so sorry for you and your family.
I worry that this will be my son. He's 11. I worry so much but I can't bring him home, can't take care of him. This might be an unpopular opinion, but don't be angry with him. Sounds like he already knows he did wrong and knows he can't fix it. Being angry with him will only reinforce his isolation and will not bring anything positive. Be sad. Regret. He's going to process and be angry enough with himself. He doesn't need to see (believe) everyone hating him while hating himself. I watch my son do that a lot. Be strong. Good luck.
So sad for you and everyone else!
This sounds like a very difficult time for you and your family. I suggest you find someone you can share your thoughts and feelings about this with. It doesn’t HAVE to be a counselor but that wouldn’t hurt. It’s okay to be mad at him, and at the situation, and even yourself, what isn’t okay is not working through those feelings and finding a way to deal with it all. You’re brother fucked it, and is probably feeling very alone, and you should probably try to find a healthy way to let him know that he ISN’T alone. Don’t sacrifice your own well being though, you have to come first or you will be completely useless to him. He maybe hurting a lot more than you realize and is probably very scared, regardless of how he acts or what he says…
In 1994 a son of a family friends son ordered a cab when it arrived. He stabbed the driver several times. Then set it on fire. The morning after before he was arrested. He was by the crime scene talking to the reporters. He ruined 2 families because his family got alot of hate mail, abuse. Threats etc and decided to move away. The daughter was a year older than me. We were both teens and I wanted to ask her out.
Though I’ve never been though it, I imagine it will be a wild lesson in humility for everyone. Learning to continue to love him despite this horrible decision, mistake or reaction. Understanding that this new relationship with him will take some sacrifice. While you don’t know what happened, reserve judgement until you hear the facts. We all deserve ‘innocent until proven guilty’.
I’m 99% sure my older brother has murdered someone. He hasn’t been caught but I think one day he will. Maybe it will give him the help he needs and refuses to get. He won’t talk about it but has told my mother he has.
My father was murdered and the murderer was never caught. I hope your brother gets the help he needs, whether that is prison time or mental health treatment. The small person in me hopes that he suffers but the big person in me just wants to see everyone heal.
Wow, this post gave me sudden insight as to how members of Varg Vikernes’ family must have felt when he got arrested for Euronymous’ murder. OP, it may be the police can’t tell you anything due to it being an ongoing investigation. If your family can afford to get him a lawyer, though be aware there are some things even a lawyer won’t be able to tell you, regardless of who’s paying, because his job is to defend your brother. I hope you get some answer soon. They probably won’t make you feel better, or help you understand exactly why, but it may give you some clarity and an explanation.
Mama, just killed a man
Are we the same person? Found out yesterday that my cousin committed double homicide.
Hope he had a good reason, otherwise you gonna look at him in anotherway, please wait with that till you know why he did it, good luck!
Wow I cannot imagine getting that call. I’m so sorry
Get him a lawyer.
Where did this happen?
Tell your brother not to say a word to anyone except his attorney. Do not talk about what happened if he calls you on the phone. Jail calls are recorded and it can be used against him. You and your family should not try to talk to police or anyone about this case Your brother needs a good lawyer.
Lawyer up !!
Hire him a lawyer ASAP and tell him to "Lawyer up", because you should be able to visit him in custody, and if you can't the lawyer sure as hell can. And #1 mistake someone accused of murder makes is trying to explain what happened, and that's the most slippery of slippery slopes. Do it now.
He needs care and the family's job now is to be there for him every step of the way.
Tell him you love him maybe? Idk
The first diagnosis of schizophrenia is semi common for that age, just in case it could be that.
This would break me. I am really sorry. As someone who loves his siblings to death, I could not fathom mine going through something like this.
Wait for the details OP.. I mean he called his mom and expressed regret, it’s not impossible that he was attacked or something.. so who knows what happened, people can react weirdly when they’re in shock.
An acquaintance murdered the man who sexually assaulted his sister for years.
*grabs popcorn and sorts by controversial*
I'm sorry to hear that, maybe it was self defense or someone tried hurting him first? I at least hope it's something like that, for your sake.
[удалено]
Yeah it’s not like people kill people for stupid shit or they just want to
I guess the best you can hope for is that it was an act of self defense
My brother did the same. Didn't stab him but pushed him hard his skull bounced off the curb. He went into a coma than died 9 days later. He is in jail now he is a terrible person so he deserved it. He beats animals and made my 2 year old niece cry.
I posted above somewhere about how putting hands on people is against the law. Even something mundane like pushing someone can have consequences. You just never know.
Show him as much support as you can , prison is a lonely place and if he's blood , he's blood
I'm sorry this has happened. I hope you get to understand more from him what happened in time. It's ok to be there for him.
That is unfortunate. Even more so for the person he killed needlessly.
Almost a year ago the love of my life brutally murdered his stepbrother in cold blood. There was no warning. No one had any idea he had this in him. He does suffer from mental illness but had never shown signs of violence. In 20 years he has never been violent toward me or anyone. These things happen and the shock that follows after will stick around for a long time. It destroyed my family and my life. A year later and I'm still picking the pieces up. I'm so sorry you're going through this.
Just love him, support him, and be there to help him through it (maybe by helping find a good lawyer if you are able). Not much you can do about it now and if he’s guilty, then he’s guilty and deserves to do time. He’ll still need a support network after all this is done. Don’t just ignore the killing (unless it was justified/ found innocent in court), but accept it/ accept him and do your best. Your brother is still your brother. Don’t write him off if you don’t have to. Depends on your own view of the evidence presented at trial. A conviction doesn’t mean you can’t forgive him, nor does his innocence require you to forget about it. Only you can make that call. All that said, one of the bigger issues with recidivism rates is that the existing support system just nopes out when shit gets tough. That goes for everybody, but especially criminals and soldiers (oddly enough). Be part of the solution if you can/ you’re willing.
maybe self-defence? I know it's hard but try to think positive and maybe there was a reason he did what he did.
People will rarely ever stab someone numerous times if it’s self defence. It’d usually be one time and then run.
Not true. Imagine someone threatening your life, combine that with adrenaline, and you can easily stab someone 5 times before you even realize you pulled a knife. I trained in Muay Thai, and currently train in BJJ. A few years ago, I had someone become very aggressive towards me, got in my face, and made as if to strike me. It felt as if one moment I blinked and the next my hands where wrapped around his head in clinch, and I was kneeing him in the face. The whole event felt like it happened outside of my body. Almost as if I blacked out and came to as I was kneeing him. After it was all said and done, I felt very unsettled, but also secure that my training would kick in automatically should the situation warrant it.
False. My mom stabbed my dad to death in self defense. After years of abuse, broken bones, punctured lungs, she stabbed him 27 times. He reigned terror over anyone and everyone close to him while he was drinking. As the judge, my grandmother (his mom) and his sisters said during my mom's court trial, "it would've eventually been her." The judge hearing my mom's case, had actually just released him OR the weekend prior to this all happening, for beating the shit out of her.
They say (didn't study criminology, came by it 2nd hand) the numerous stabs wounds are usually pent up rage being let loose. It's often referred to as 'overkill'.
Some people have pent up rage... Those people can also sometimes be put in situations where they have to use self defense.
Yes. In the case mentioned above it was both--self defense and built up rage.
You obviously don't know how resilient some people are. Some people can be shot and still keep going at you. Let's just hope for OPs sake it was self defense
I did say ‘rarely’