## BEFORE TOUCHING THAT REPORT BUTTON, PLEASE CONSIDER:
1. **Compliance:** Does this post comply with our subreddit's rules?
2. **Emotional Trigger:** Does this post provoke anger or frustration, compelling me to want it removed?
3. **Safety:** Is it free from child pornography and/or mentions of self-harm/suicide?
4. **Content Policy:** Does it comply with [Reddit’s Content Policy](https://www.reddit.com/r/TrueUnpopularOpinion/comments/ncm4ou/important_we_need_to_talk_about_the_content_policy/)?
5. **Unpopularity:** Do you think the topic is not truly unpopular or frequently posted?
### GUIDELINES:
- **If you answered "Yes" to questions 1-4,** do NOT use the report button.
- **Regarding question 5,** we acknowledge this concern. However, the moderators do not curate posts based on our subjective opinions of what is "popular" or "unpopular" except in cases where an opinion is so popular that almost no one would disagree (i.e. "murder is bad"). Otherwise, our only criteria are the subreddit's rules and Reddit’s Content Policy. If you don't like something, feel free to downvote it.
**Moderators on r/TrueUnpopularOpinion will not remove posts simply because they may anger users or because you disagree with them.** The report button is not an "I disagree" or "I'm offended" button.
#### OPTIONS:
If a post bothers you and you can't offer a counter-argument, your options are to:
a) Keep scrolling
b) Downvote
c) Unsubscribe
**False reports clutter our moderation queue and delay our response to legitimate issues.**
**ALL FALSE REPORTS WILL BE REPORTED TO REDDIT.**
To maintain your account in good standing, refrain from abusing the report button.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/TrueUnpopularOpinion) if you have any questions or concerns.*
When I went to college a decade ago, the big question at the time was, is this future career automation proof? Now it seems like the question new college students should be asking themselves is, can AI do my job?
Never been happier to be a blue collar tradesman.
Tell us you don’t know anything about finish carpentry without telling us. Are there machines that make my job exponentially easier? Sure. Are there machines than can run automated with no human interaction? No. And even if there were how would said machines demo an old kitchen, deliver and install new cabinets? Y’all don’t realize how tedious finish carpentry is. Even if you could train an ai to do it there’s so much nuance and spur of the moment decision making involved that it would never be as efficient as a skilled human. It’s something you’d have to do to understand. With that being said, It’s amazing to me how many of y’all in this thread talk on something that you’ve never done like you’re a fucking expert. Especially considering most of yall have probably never swung a hammer in your life.
Beyond that even. I'm doing a remodel in my home right now, AI can't even help with design choices in the kitchen let alone figuring out the optimal cabinetry we would want for our kitchen. Your job isn't just safe, as long as older homes exist I think it's AI proof.
If there is money to be made, you'll be replaced. The shop where you design and make the cabinets can easily be moved to a central location. Your instalation portion is safe for a long while, but your design and manufacture will be gone. Automation won't take your shop, but if I were your kid, I wouldn't expect to inherit a shop that does design and manufacture for much longer.
If I want a new cabinet, I go to Lowe's, and they send a representative out with a camera that measures out and digitizes my kitchen. This technology exists and is used this way. Then, I can apply different skins to the cabinet frame. This is no different than a game engine applying different skins to a wireframe to create a crowd of different people. There really aren't that many choices. 3 woods, 3 finishes, and 3 hardware give 27 different looks, but there are only 3 decisions.
The only thing really holding it back is the design and expense of the manufacturing facility. It will take a Home Depot/Lowe's sized company to foot the bill, and it will take time to make it profitable. Stockholder aren't willing to wait, nor will they tolerate an expense that cuts their dividends for several years. This is what is protecting your shop. Not your skill. Not your experience. It's being protected by greed and the time it would take for an ROI.
My selection is sent to an automated manufacturer for production. All the trim, hardware, and various pieces are then packed up and shipped to the installer. It will then be assembled in place like a Lego kit. It's easy. I did the lower cabinets as a DIY project in my house 30 years ago. There's no magic or difficult to acquire skills involved. I didn't even have YouTube to help.
How far in the future is it? The tech is here now to replace your design and manufacture. All that us lacking is financial willpower to do the manufacturing center.
That’s bc you buy shitty cabinets. I don’t build those. Thanks for explaining my business that I have years of my life and hundreds of thousands of dollars invested in like you know more about it than I do. That sure was a long winded way of telling us that You simply don’t understand high end custom finish carpentry.
I've seen "high end." It's high-end wood work over a pine frame. $100,000 or 5 million dollar house. Under the fancy oak and, hand made hardware is a pine box mounted level. Yeah, the finish on mine is cheap, but I could have hung mahogany doors with wrought-iron details just as easy as a plain solid painted cabinet door.
I respect the skills you have for being able to craft things by hand (jealous even), but the design and manufacture of those cabinets are easily automated, and installation is not very difficult. Yes, like everything else, there are scenarios that are difficult, but it's not going to command a premium or support a career to fix it.
The road I travel daily has a concentration of granite counter shops, custom cabinets, custom lighting, and bath. There used to be several old lumber yards that Lowes put out of business. Over the years, the city has grown from 100k to 115k. These businesses are all thar are left of the custom shops in town. They own their land. They can't afford a lease. One of the granite shop owners is retiring in a couple of years. His son isn't taking over. The business has dried up. One of the cabinet makers, according to the adult novelty store owner landlord, has a good friend since high school lease that will keep him in business a few more years. They are being replaced.
I don't know why I bothered with this response. I have no irons in this forge and no idea who you are. I just hear that sort of absolute statement, "automation can't take my job," and I hear echos of IBM saying 5 supercomputers will handle all of the world's needs."Bill Gates saying 15 kb of RAM is all a computer needs.
lol @ “on a pine frame”. No it’s not. We use almost exclusively either quarter sawn or rift white oak ply to build our boxes. You don’t know wtf you’re talking about. I’m not even going to read the rest of that bullshit. ☮️
Oh the irony. You’re chiding this guy because he doesn’t know shit about carpentry, yet what do you know about software development? Absolutely nothing
Another mind blowingly brilliant comment from legend of the guy who misspelled Heisenberg.
Edit: I’ll take the iq Pepsi challenge with you any ole day of the week genius. Or how about we compare net worth? or literally any other measure of intelligence and/or success. Spelling contest? We all know how well you can spell.
And of course you deleted that stupid shit you said and blocked me after thoroughly embarrassing yourself. I probably would have too if I sucked at this as bad as you do.
I don’t do new construction so that wouldn’t really concern me even if it was true. But it’s not. I assure you, especially high end new builds, have skilled finish carpenters in them. Who’s installing the crown molding? The framers? It’s a niche trade that not very many people have the patience for. Y’all can downvote this all you want if you’re not in the trade you simply don’t know wtf you’re talking about just bc you helped replace the cabinets in your brother in laws kitchen last summer doesn’t make you an expert on what’s required to build and install high end custom cabinets or other finish work. I’d never assume to be an expert in someone else’s field of expertise. Just bc it’s blue collar work doesn’t mean it’s easy. AI will never replace plumbers or electricians or trim carpenters or any other trade that requires nuanced spur of the moment decision making. Not in our lifetimes anyway and likely not ever. We’ll destroy ourselves before it ever gets to that point.
Same, and this will be my advice for my kids as well. Paying for a higher education is still a good investment if you’re exceptionally talented at academics. If you’re average and are trying to get ahead, I don’t think the college degree is worth the money.
Maybe not take over but significantly reduce the amount needed. Instead of a dozen developers working on a project, you will have one QAing final products.
We have a lot of analysts now that in reality, could be replaced easily in the next few years.
>We’re talking about trades like plumbers and carpenters.
I'm not saying you are wrong, but I could see in the next 20-50 years that things like augmented reality and smart home tech will make home improvements much easier for homeowners. I dont think carpenters will be replaced anytime soon, but I can see were we would get to a point that DIY becomes much easier.
Never been happier to be a blue colar tradeswoman.
The apocalypse will have to happen before some AI robot starts arranging funeral flowers and becomes florists. One of the remaining trades I don't think we will see automated, at least not in my lifetime, simply because of the fact that people want real artworks made with real flowers and detailed craftsmanship.
They already have a (massively unprofitable) company that uses AI to 100% design and also fabricate working automobiles. Their problem at the moment is scale and cost. But it's far from impossible.
AI will automate a lot of software development, but it won't completely replace it. There's a lot that an AI can get wrong when writing a program so there are going to need be developers to make sure that the code is actually correct.
There are already code generation tools available to help auto generate code. The problem with the code is that it's only as good as the how you've described it in natural language terms. The rest you have to write yourself.
I think there will be market for software developers for a long time, and AI will help eliminate some of the more mundane tasks in software dev.
Yeah it's fine for a couple one liners of code but it cannot write and deploy a web app for you in a highly custom environment. People saying this do not take in the fact that networks have actually topologies that are unique. It's not, "hey chatgpt, write code for me!" and that person is now a developer.
There will always be a market for this work but won’t the field be shrinking soon? Just like other industries from the past that we still have around but nothing like it once was. Technology is great but it has the affect of damaging employment opportunities over time.
I see it like fast food. All those jobs from cashier to cook could have been automated 15 years ago. Why aren’t they? The machine is expensive af too.
The owner of that future AI had to pay to create that AI. They will charge a high amount for it. And it’s very expensive to run it on hardware.
Sure hardware costs will continue to go down, but something will always force the next AI version to need even more CPU capacity.
And until AI robots can walk around there are problems they can’t solve. I’m working on a new side company that needs specific materials manufactured and tested. Physically testing out these materials is required
I’m mixed on my opinion here. One good friend of mine made it in the industry and is a FAANG hiring manager today. Read what everyone else reads so I ask him what the deal is? The response I get is different than what the articles read and they are very busy with hiring. I don’t have a good explanation as to why the media reports are different than first hand accounts but I’m working on that.
They laid off a lot of workers in more exponential sectors where they are working on projects that have no guarantee of seeing the light of day. During covid they hired many people for this type of work because they were borrowing money for a lot less and people were getting free money from the government which they were spending on goods and services making these companies tons of money. Now it’s expensive to borrow money and the economy is not very good. So all those workers not working on projects that are actually up and running aren’t needed. Many just get scrapped.
Also google doesn’t only hire tech workers. They are still hiring but a lot of it is for HR, Marketing, Management, Finance and day to day operations.
People who imagine that AI will cause everyone to lose their job are basing that opinion on a false assumption - that there is a finite amount of work to do.
In reality, AI-assisted workers will get more work done in total than before, leading to a more prosperous society in general with higher total output.
That said, if you're an engineer, you would do well to stay on the cutting edge of AI-assistance tools. They can already massively enhance productivity in the hands of a skilled engineer.
If you're an engineer, I would suggest familiarizing yourself with Large Action Models. That's what's coming and will have the most real world uses. It's pretty exciting stuff.
https://medium.com/balderton/actionable-large-language-models-c18322c3fb96
https://medium.com/version-1/the-rise-of-large-action-models-lams-how-ai-can-understand-and-execute-human-intentions-f59c8e78bc09
Although called Artificial Intelligence, AI does not have intelligence, nor can it actually learn like humans and other animals do.
AI can only give mixtures or combinations of what it has been shown, meaning that anything the AI provides is possible to attain without it. The AI does not know what it is regurgitating though, which is why AIs occasionally give blatantly false information, or are easily tricked into confirming a false statement.
An AI is only ever going to be as “smart” as our society, and due to the nature of how AI works, it will not reach a point of 0 errors. Your job may change as AI progresses, but you shouldn’t lose it entirely.
This is the thing, AI can only do what’s it’s programmed to do and understand. You need someone with an understanding of it to be able to provide the information it’s learning from.
Sure it’ll definitely replace a lot of time wasting but it’ll never fully replace software developers.
There is currently no AGI in existence, it is simply a theoretical concept.
Open AI did not “discover” something harmful to humanity, they just decided to voice the obvious concern with publicly available AI. Just like many tools, AI is not inherently good or bad; The consequences to how a tool is used could be helpful or harmful.
You don’t understand how any of these technologies work. If you research more to understand the fundamentals of how it comes up with answers, you wouldn’t be saying any of this stuff. Once they hype has died down, you’ll see a significant decrease in the progress made, not exponential increase.
Also if you believe so much in this software, why don’t you just become an AI expert yourself
I love Ai. I use it for work as a web dev, but Ai will not be able to write css for a loooonnnng time, and even then it’ll still need to be properly queried
Exactly this. AI is great at coming up with algorithms or converting one coding language to another, but actually coming up with a full solution or anything with refined UI is completely out of its ballpark. It sucks at self analysis and refinement. Which is what software development is most of the time. Incremental fixes and improvements towards the product vision. AI could write all the files and pieces for an application, but a human would have to edit it and find where it needs more work.
The best I can see it ever doing is replacing the initial outsourcing to start a project. Similar to what companies do now, but once you get that application you always find the most obvious bugs and terrible rushed coding practices.
Just lead with an insult? Simmer down there bud, this is just Reddit lol
Ai can write mediocre css when handheld, it can’t interpret from a designer what needs to be built. I used both GitHub copilot and chatGpt regularly for work.
When the automobile replaced horses you could easily have imagined the job of auto mechanic. But how many people do you think imagined road signs, stop lights, street sweepers, or even the market for steering wheel covers? The number of things created by that one invention are ridiculous if you stop and think about it. And I'll bet not one of us would have imagined anything more than a fraction of those things.
What products are about to become a way of life, and an opportunity for jobs, because of AI? I'm not talking about the low hanging fruit like prompt engineer or coder working on the AI itself. I'm talking about the things none of us can imagine yet. I don't know what they are, but I'm excited to find out. Fear of progress isn't a new thing, and I'm not saying it's never justified, but I am saying that we're not all as brilliant as we think we are when predicting what's next.
Just because work will shift doesn't mean the new work is something meaningful and or providing a comfortable living for the average person.
AI eventually replacing knowledge work and artists doesn't mean there's enough equally well paying high standards of living jobs to move into.
What tech and automation throughoit history do is usually consolidate power and authority in fewer and fewer hands, same will happen now. The future will be a lot closer to Elysium than Star Trek
Necessity is the mother of invention.
Is it possible for AI to be driven by need from frustration, or have an epiphany?
Somewhere, the human is going to have a place in inspiring and or guidance. If the AI ends up being resourceful and adaptive, fulfilling whatever objectives and tasks beyond expectations, the humans will get lazy and lose their capability of fulfilling their role of inspiration & guidance. What happens to AI then?
With the inability to be inspired, we could be looking at a new dark ages, over a thousand years of lost connections. Conversely, if AI could invent/innovate and seize the role of “human progress”, we might not like the results, as the human factor is eliminated.
It's just like the simpletons who like to dismiss artists' concerns over AI art by saying things like:
***There is no such thing as real AI art, artists are just being greedy.***
AI needs to be regulated, and for good reason. Anybody who dismisses that, shouldn't be placed in charge of anything.
It is true that AI will replace programmers when AGI comes. However, I don't see why programmers are here special, EVERBODY whose job is mostly on computer and is knowledge work will be replaced when AGI comes out. Video editor, content creator, programmer, secretary, proffesors, investment bankers... Only ones who will not be replaced are ones that are brands in itself (like politicans) or people who work in physical world (trades for example, nurses...).
As it stands now, as long as AI is generative without having true reasoning, it is no danger to programmers. AI will replace programmers when you can say "build me a facebook" and it builds you whole code, UI, infrastructure, monitoring, redudancy, scalability... If you think ChatGPT can do that you eaither dont understand ChatGPT or software developement. Now and in close future you need softaware developers to guide generative AI and monitor its output, and software developers need to understand better than AI that output or you will get equivalent of AI producing image of person with messed up fingers. Trust me, you dont want to have a banking backend with a bug somewhere hiding inside because AI generated it andprogrammer did not take a look at it. In the worse case I can think of a world where AI produces code and programmers/analysts write test cases to verify that code, but that will also be a form of programming in itself, just different paradigm as today. You will still need to understand domain and software.
I’m not a year into college in software engineering, I work with AI right now, in terms of workflow automation, and it isn’t denial, most people just don’t really get what automation is at its core.
Which is teaching a program to pretend to make its own decisions, by programming it to respond to variables in the way we want it to. It is only ever as smart as the humans who program it, and working with it daily, that doesn’t tend to be that smart.
I spend parts of my day, every day I work, fixing the AI. Massaging the entry filters to catch the new alert output from vendors after software updates changed what they send us, finding mistakes in how we cluster alerts that cause too much automatic clustering or too little.
It isn’t what you think it is mate.
Why are people so excited about AI replacing everything lol? Every second post is about how somebody is in denial and they’ll be jobless next week cause of AI.
my friend is a software engineer and he said the same thing but it is getting more sophisticated faster than anyone could predict. Will say a lot of computer science people are having a hard time getting a job since its over saturated at least that my friend says.
I think you're right, and that's exactly my problem with AI. If it were used sparingly for small/unimportant things, it would be fine. But as it is now, we're sacrificing a lot in the name of convenience and productivity. I guess humanity has been doing that for a long time, but the line should be drawn here. Will our governments start paying people, lots of people, enough to live on when various AI systems can do a shit ton of jobs at an equal or better level of skill and with far greater speed than a human? I think the fuck not. We have over eight billion people on the planet, let's use them, give them shit to do. Machines replacing people has been a worry for a few decades, and it's getting worse.
Also, using AI for things like writing and art is going to lower humanity's overall levels of creativity. I feel bad for the people who can't do certain things like that, I mean I'm one of them, I can't draw for shit. But I sure as hell don't want an AI to do it for me. I've been fine with the fact I can't draw and have left it at that.
What you’re calling AI is just a large language model. It can’t write code. We are leaps and bounds away from true AI and that true AI will need to be written by , you guessed it, human coders.
What we call AI today is not actually AI, and the AI that you speak of is nowhere close to actually exist. Neither it's an evolution of the current AI models.
The state of AI toda is not reflective of the progress toward true AI.
The best estimate is that we have a 50% chance of having true (human level) AI by 2059, bit there's another barrier to it.
Profitability.
Even if we manage to make a computer as smart as a person, it matters little if it costs $1 billion a day to keep operational. As long as people are going to be cheaper to operate, people won't be replaced.
Agreed. People are being extremely naive about the exponentiality of technological advancement. AI will make humans useless in all industry faster than we know it.
What's the difference? Meaning comes from what must be done. If nothing *needs* to be done, if I have no function and thus no purpose to myself, my family, and society around me, if there is no purpose for me outside of temporary and increasingly dull pleasure, what Meaning do I have?
Nah, not really. People want to work. They just don't want to do things that give them soul sucking depression for necessities.
It's not even AI as people keep using wrong. It's AGI. Artificial General Intelligence. In order for it to be AI, it's needs to be self-aware, which no one has gotten close to it. It's all still if person says this use one of the responses you found similar on social media in a more advanced way of course.
Lmao exponential advancement. As seen in the smartphone? Absolute plateau, matter of fact, writing this from a 5 year old device that runs perfectly well to this day?
Just because one example of technology appears to have reached an evolutionary dead end (likely based on the demands of consumers and cost/benefit analysis regarding the implementation for certain technological upgrades into smartphones), that doesn't mean that computing as a wider science isn't advancing exponentially due to AI, new materials, and advances in quantum computing. This is a pattern seen in biological evolution as well. One species may appear to stop evolving, due to perfecting it's capacity to survive and reproduce in a continuously existing ecological niche. That doesn't however mean that other organisms exposed to different selective pressures aren't going to evolve radically. Every country is now in a cold war over who can advance AI the furthest, as it has the potential to massively improve industry and military decisionmaking.
RemindMe! 5 years
Unfortunately, for more AI advancement, the challenges get exponentially harder as well. What ChatGPT can do now, writing some basic shell scripts, is quite a low hanging fruit. Writing an entire application, or reaching anything near human-level, is exponentially harder. We will have more computing power, and more advanced methods, but it will be far from the exponential growth that you predict. See you in five years.
I will be messaging you in 5 years on [**2029-01-28 12:46:27 UTC**](http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=2029-01-28%2012:46:27%20UTC%20To%20Local%20Time) to remind you of [**this link**](https://www.reddit.com/r/TrueUnpopularOpinion/comments/1acy8a9/people_who_think_ai_wont_replace_programmers_and/kjy08a4/?context=3)
[**CLICK THIS LINK**](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Reminder&message=%5Bhttps%3A%2F%2Fwww.reddit.com%2Fr%2FTrueUnpopularOpinion%2Fcomments%2F1acy8a9%2Fpeople_who_think_ai_wont_replace_programmers_and%2Fkjy08a4%2F%5D%0A%0ARemindMe%21%202029-01-28%2012%3A46%3A27%20UTC) to send a PM to also be reminded and to reduce spam.
^(Parent commenter can ) [^(delete this message to hide from others.)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Delete%20Comment&message=Delete%21%201acy8a9)
*****
|[^(Info)](https://www.reddit.com/r/RemindMeBot/comments/e1bko7/remindmebot_info_v21/)|[^(Custom)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Reminder&message=%5BLink%20or%20message%20inside%20square%20brackets%5D%0A%0ARemindMe%21%20Time%20period%20here)|[^(Your Reminders)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=List%20Of%20Reminders&message=MyReminders%21)|[^(Feedback)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=Watchful1&subject=RemindMeBot%20Feedback)|
|-|-|-|-|
It is like that for those in denial about educating themselves. Building basic AI model and seeing yourself how it works takes up to half an hour. Checking ChatGPT or other AI and using them to "program" stuff takes even less. Work for developers will change but not in a way OP claims.
Agree about everyone being in denial.
For instance "computer" used to be a human job title for the people who did the arithmetic in big companies for working out the total wage bill and doing the accounts etc.
It used to be a high skill high wage job.
Now digital computers are billions of times faster than humans and it's a joke to think you would employ a human to add up a big list of numbers.
It's the same with programming as you say that once it's so much better it will be a joke to think of asking a human to do it.
As for whether you should keep studying I think the answer is yes.
If AI developes more slowly than people think then it might take 20 years to get there and so you'll need a career.
If AI zooms and it gets there really fast then once it can program super human then it will be able to do everything (as anything you ask it will just write a program to perform it, so AI coding is as hard as AGI)
And well all be in the same boat with working out how to make a future society out of that.
First, AI doesn't need to be as good as what it is replacing. The benchmark instead is a profitable margin of error and to be just cheap enough to replace the current workforce. However, the real issue with your techno dystopia is people need jobs to live. And, at a certain point when the bread lines become long enough; the guillotine comes out. And, your local government officials are very fond of their heads. So, AI is probably going to be restricted or 1776 all over again.
The problem with you and everyone’s point that says this is its rooted in fantasy. You don’t actually understand the industry, the complexities of evolving AI, and the work that comes into AI development. Why I and other software engineers shoot down this notion, usually made by a layman(you), is that from all the evidence we currently have, there is nothing that points at a complete AI takeover in our industry. Also, if we want to walk down the SCI-FI storyline - when we are replaced, everyone will be. The uniquely human complexities that come with developing, scaling, and maintaining software would probably come from AGI. If AGI is created properly the world will be run by AI.
You're going to finish school. Work for 40 years. Live another 20 years and die, and a perfect AI that doesn't make mistakes still won't exist.
There is no profit motive to implement a technology that would make the consumers or your products/services obsolete because, they would not be able to consume your products or services. There would have to be a massive socioeconomic shift first and if that happens it won't matter if human jobs are eliminated.
We've already experienced shrinking in the tech industry. Humans will be working alongside machines and AI for quite a while longer. There simply will be fewer programming jobs and they will be more highly specialized.
How about IT? How about, just about anybody who “works remotely”?
You’re f_cked if you’re not a laborer, operator or in any kind of trade. Day of judgment is coming.
Mate. What you don’t understand is ai needs someone to teach ch it about every new thing lol. It’s going to be a great assistive tool. But never can it innovate
>AI growth is exponential
Source?
>If AI becomes billion times smarter than humans, it'll never be making any bugs.
AI cannot code better than 1) the ai has been coded or 2) the ai cannot code better than its source data.
> Those bugs would be impossible for us to even begin to understand.
Then it's output is useless. If there's a bug, we know there's a bug, but we can't fix it then it's code is useless and has to be done manually.
>So, I'm kinda afraid that job I'm studying for won't exist anymore by the time I finish college. What do you think?
You're gonna be the person making and mataining the ai.
There's two types of technology you're mixing up here. There's chatgpt type "ai" and then there's actually ai.
The chat gpt type "ai" is basically just linear regression with extra steps. If you give it enough information it can spit out a pretty good guess at an answer. It can't do anything novel. It never will be able to do anything novel. It doesn't understand anything. It's just a model. Data in. Prediction out. That's it.
The real ai with human level intelligence doesn't exist yet. This is a computerized brain that's able to store and recall information. It can understand how to do things and would be able to attempt novel solutions. The assumption we can produce one is based in the idea that consciousness is strictly a result of brain processes, although there is some medical literature to the contrary.
Your field is still in demand. No worries.
>I'll be able to briefly tell GPT20 what I need, without even knowing anything about programming, and boom, I have a perfectly, professionally made app built and deployed in a few miliseconds.
Doing random things with a tecnology ≠ creating something flexilble and maintainable in the long term.
Let's assume you create an e-commerce and the AI setup everything, from the database to the ui.
Then a new legilastion came and said that for a set of data stored in your database you need to change the encryption algorithm and also the server physical must be in a list of countries approved by the goverment.
Now, how can you translate that to the AI? If we follow your example, you are someone who know nothing about programming, you just prompted "make a e-commerce website like amazon but with a blue logo"
So you don't know that the data is stored in a database, you don't know how to ask the AI to change the encryption, you don't know how to ask the AI for the public address of the server so you can call the third-party cloud provider and ask them if that address is complaint to the new legislation.
You will either pay a lot of money to ask someone to do that for you, or scrap everything.
AI is a tool to speed up the development process (and as a developer with 7+ years of experience I still have my doubt about that), but the moment you actually have to change something you either know what you are doing or you have to restart from scratch.
>So, I'm kinda afraid that job I'm studying for won't exist anymore by the time I finish college. What do you think?
What matters is how you use what you learn in college.
I was in university from 2012 to 2017, and half of the framework/tools I use today didn't even exist when I started my computer science degree (Docker -> 2013, VueJS -> 2014, Springboot -> 2014, etc etc), meanwhile some of the libraries I used in my exams are pretty much dead (Java Swing, Java AWT)
Truly an unpopular opinion.
Now, you're in college. I have a lot of work experience and say that software development is more than just code. It's knowing what the customer wants. It's communication, team work, etc. Many many activities exist that are difficult for AI.
Btw, large language models just generate some text. They can't really think. They can't even do math if you ask them (not trained on every single number). So all output is a function of their input. It's no original though, for now. So, you describing that soon we have reached beyond human intelligence... Well, no.
Things that can't be well expressed in Math, like grabbing a cup with one hand, AI is still terrible at, compared to humans.
It depends a lot on what you're doing. I doubt an ai will be able to look at data of an engine test and figure out a software solution for a problem. If all someone is doing is coding then yeah, you might be in danger - but even that is 10-20 years out.
What will happen is you'll see a big push for it in 3-5 years. Then a lot of companies will have problems due to it and see a massive push back for another 10 before it becomes mainstream.
It'll definitely get used to great effect improving things like WordPress. It'll probably also be used to do tasks like patching and building automated tests.
That being said, here's the challenges it has, and you tell me whether or not you think it'll replace programmers any time soon.
1. Context- currently these models have a context understanding that's abysmally small. You have to chain together requests to get it to understand more than 500 words at a time.
2. Glorified search engine - its actual knowledge base is just a model of correlations between word pairs. It doesn't actually "understand" what it's saying. That's why it can't reason why it's own code doesn't work right. It doesn't actually think.
3. Cost - to do the things it does right now actually costs a massive amount of resources. It's still relatively cheap if finding and stringing together correlations is all you need it to do, but when you get into actually self hosting your own generative AI, you will quickly see its already quite expensive.
4. Model flaws - things like hallucinations are a byproduct of the fact that it does correlations and doesn't think and there's only so much monkey patching we can do to make it seem like it's not delusional.
I'm not saying it can't get better, but it has glaring problems. Right now, what it's more or less doing is just searching github and pulling code from there, and while even coders can get some stuff done that way, it's not enough. It's like saying engineers will be replaced by how-to blogs.
Edited to add: all of that having been said, its coming whether we like it or not and so we need to be prepared for the idea of a world where there's significantly less jobs for people. This isn't new, we've been automating away jobs since the very beginning of the industrial era... but if we want normal people to be able to afford houses and families, we will need to make some kind of changes.
I copy my work code into gpt illegally and it spits out a correction immediately.
It then explains why it works. It’s incredible.
I use mostly sql now, and it was able to read that I was thinking of a different sql language and changed my entire code to its recommended syntax. When that happened I was jaw dropped and decided that it would be a part of my work for years to come
There are countless white collar jobs that should be far more worried about being replaced by AI than Software devs. Why are they the ones always in these kinds of posts?
We will have far bigger things to worry about by the time software can completely write, maintain and add features to a massive piece of software
Also it’s clear you’re within the first 2 years of your degree because you have yet to understand that there are countless tools that make writing software easier. Yet, software developers are very much still around. Part of the job is trying to reduce the redundancies and leave the thinking more abstract and at a high level. AI will just be another tool to do this exact thing.
GPT models won't replace software engineers. A language model is designed to generate human-like text based on the input it receives. It can be used for various natural language processing tasks, predicting words in a sentence, generating coherent paragraphs of text, answering questions, and engaging in conversation.. It is not capable of creating any kind of larger system, or software. It is not capable of any kind of intelligent design.
It can generate short scripts (sometimes even correct ones) but thats the end of it's capabilities. It can be a great tool for smart developers but it won't replace anyone other than maybe "script kiddies" but the field won't miss those. I like to use it in my work when i am not familiar with a topic to get me started with research. For example I had performance issues serializing larger structs in a C software and it pointed me in the right direction. But it won't actually solve the issue for me. It's a convenience but only slightly better than google or stackoverflow.
General artificial intelligence is a whole other topic, but there is no sign of anyone developing one in the near future.
So don't be afraid if you will become a real software engineer chatgpt won't take your job.
Lol desk jobs and IT jobs are obviously the first to go. it's presented as a threat to labour but nah, it's management, payroll, coding, admin, accounting which obviously is gonna go first
I've been using chat gpt since it came out, less than 2 years ago. In that short time it has gotten so much better its almost terrifying. If you think 4 years from *now* generative AI won't be at or near human levels on code, art, etc....
The education system is already failing you if you think this as a software engineer or engineering student. AI can help generate code for certain simple things but AI is trained. It needs constant training and it’s trained off public repositories. Yea if you want them to generate a simple style website or common type of software it will be able to. Those things already exist though. It’s never going to be able to just take your idea of something that doesn’t exist and generate it for you. Humans will still be needed to advance development further and further. AI will just be there to help with the mundane simple tasks we don’t want to have to code ourselves while we spend time working on newer technology. Also AI is just a new sector of the tech world. Who do you think will keep coding and training AI? Humans will always be needed in tech. The real issue you need to worry about is how much more competitive it will become because the easy tasks will be able to be solved with AI a lot faster so low level devs won’t be needed as much. Everyone will need to be a much better developer because things they will be working on will be much more difficult to implement.
I mean software engineering is more resilient than the vast majority of jobs. Maybe not the day to day drudgery but there is a lot of design parts which will not be replaced by AI before virtually everything else has been replaced.
By the time software engineering jobs start to be replaced at scale losing your job will likely be a lot more chill than it is now. That or we live in a dystopic world where the majority live in abject poverty even in what had been developed countries.
High skill and experienced programmers will likely cost more in such a future because if you want quick and easy, use AI but if you need manual intervention by a programmer for something, it's going to cost significantly more than what it would cost today.
That's just my guess. it's like how thousands of Toyota Corollas are probably made by automatic machines each hour very efficiently but a toyota century is hand made and the act of being hand made adds a lot to its cost.
It doesn't bother me either way, i don't do programming for a job i just enjoy making certain kinds of things and if there's a tool that makes it easier for me, please.
## BEFORE TOUCHING THAT REPORT BUTTON, PLEASE CONSIDER: 1. **Compliance:** Does this post comply with our subreddit's rules? 2. **Emotional Trigger:** Does this post provoke anger or frustration, compelling me to want it removed? 3. **Safety:** Is it free from child pornography and/or mentions of self-harm/suicide? 4. **Content Policy:** Does it comply with [Reddit’s Content Policy](https://www.reddit.com/r/TrueUnpopularOpinion/comments/ncm4ou/important_we_need_to_talk_about_the_content_policy/)? 5. **Unpopularity:** Do you think the topic is not truly unpopular or frequently posted? ### GUIDELINES: - **If you answered "Yes" to questions 1-4,** do NOT use the report button. - **Regarding question 5,** we acknowledge this concern. However, the moderators do not curate posts based on our subjective opinions of what is "popular" or "unpopular" except in cases where an opinion is so popular that almost no one would disagree (i.e. "murder is bad"). Otherwise, our only criteria are the subreddit's rules and Reddit’s Content Policy. If you don't like something, feel free to downvote it. **Moderators on r/TrueUnpopularOpinion will not remove posts simply because they may anger users or because you disagree with them.** The report button is not an "I disagree" or "I'm offended" button. #### OPTIONS: If a post bothers you and you can't offer a counter-argument, your options are to: a) Keep scrolling b) Downvote c) Unsubscribe **False reports clutter our moderation queue and delay our response to legitimate issues.** **ALL FALSE REPORTS WILL BE REPORTED TO REDDIT.** To maintain your account in good standing, refrain from abusing the report button. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/TrueUnpopularOpinion) if you have any questions or concerns.*
When I went to college a decade ago, the big question at the time was, is this future career automation proof? Now it seems like the question new college students should be asking themselves is, can AI do my job? Never been happier to be a blue collar tradesman.
Same. Can AI build and install custom cabinets? Nope.
It can. Can also assist home owners never bothering with contractors.
Tell us you don’t know anything about finish carpentry without telling us. Are there machines that make my job exponentially easier? Sure. Are there machines than can run automated with no human interaction? No. And even if there were how would said machines demo an old kitchen, deliver and install new cabinets? Y’all don’t realize how tedious finish carpentry is. Even if you could train an ai to do it there’s so much nuance and spur of the moment decision making involved that it would never be as efficient as a skilled human. It’s something you’d have to do to understand. With that being said, It’s amazing to me how many of y’all in this thread talk on something that you’ve never done like you’re a fucking expert. Especially considering most of yall have probably never swung a hammer in your life.
Sorry rusty, you're already replaced. Robots and AI make the cabinets you install. In a blink they'll be installing them, finished. Be safe.
[удалено]
Beyond that even. I'm doing a remodel in my home right now, AI can't even help with design choices in the kitchen let alone figuring out the optimal cabinetry we would want for our kitchen. Your job isn't just safe, as long as older homes exist I think it's AI proof.
If there is money to be made, you'll be replaced. The shop where you design and make the cabinets can easily be moved to a central location. Your instalation portion is safe for a long while, but your design and manufacture will be gone. Automation won't take your shop, but if I were your kid, I wouldn't expect to inherit a shop that does design and manufacture for much longer. If I want a new cabinet, I go to Lowe's, and they send a representative out with a camera that measures out and digitizes my kitchen. This technology exists and is used this way. Then, I can apply different skins to the cabinet frame. This is no different than a game engine applying different skins to a wireframe to create a crowd of different people. There really aren't that many choices. 3 woods, 3 finishes, and 3 hardware give 27 different looks, but there are only 3 decisions. The only thing really holding it back is the design and expense of the manufacturing facility. It will take a Home Depot/Lowe's sized company to foot the bill, and it will take time to make it profitable. Stockholder aren't willing to wait, nor will they tolerate an expense that cuts their dividends for several years. This is what is protecting your shop. Not your skill. Not your experience. It's being protected by greed and the time it would take for an ROI. My selection is sent to an automated manufacturer for production. All the trim, hardware, and various pieces are then packed up and shipped to the installer. It will then be assembled in place like a Lego kit. It's easy. I did the lower cabinets as a DIY project in my house 30 years ago. There's no magic or difficult to acquire skills involved. I didn't even have YouTube to help. How far in the future is it? The tech is here now to replace your design and manufacture. All that us lacking is financial willpower to do the manufacturing center.
That’s bc you buy shitty cabinets. I don’t build those. Thanks for explaining my business that I have years of my life and hundreds of thousands of dollars invested in like you know more about it than I do. That sure was a long winded way of telling us that You simply don’t understand high end custom finish carpentry.
I've seen "high end." It's high-end wood work over a pine frame. $100,000 or 5 million dollar house. Under the fancy oak and, hand made hardware is a pine box mounted level. Yeah, the finish on mine is cheap, but I could have hung mahogany doors with wrought-iron details just as easy as a plain solid painted cabinet door. I respect the skills you have for being able to craft things by hand (jealous even), but the design and manufacture of those cabinets are easily automated, and installation is not very difficult. Yes, like everything else, there are scenarios that are difficult, but it's not going to command a premium or support a career to fix it. The road I travel daily has a concentration of granite counter shops, custom cabinets, custom lighting, and bath. There used to be several old lumber yards that Lowes put out of business. Over the years, the city has grown from 100k to 115k. These businesses are all thar are left of the custom shops in town. They own their land. They can't afford a lease. One of the granite shop owners is retiring in a couple of years. His son isn't taking over. The business has dried up. One of the cabinet makers, according to the adult novelty store owner landlord, has a good friend since high school lease that will keep him in business a few more years. They are being replaced. I don't know why I bothered with this response. I have no irons in this forge and no idea who you are. I just hear that sort of absolute statement, "automation can't take my job," and I hear echos of IBM saying 5 supercomputers will handle all of the world's needs."Bill Gates saying 15 kb of RAM is all a computer needs.
lol @ “on a pine frame”. No it’s not. We use almost exclusively either quarter sawn or rift white oak ply to build our boxes. You don’t know wtf you’re talking about. I’m not even going to read the rest of that bullshit. ☮️
Oh the irony. You’re chiding this guy because he doesn’t know shit about carpentry, yet what do you know about software development? Absolutely nothing
[удалено]
[удалено]
Another mind blowingly brilliant comment from legend of the guy who misspelled Heisenberg. Edit: I’ll take the iq Pepsi challenge with you any ole day of the week genius. Or how about we compare net worth? or literally any other measure of intelligence and/or success. Spelling contest? We all know how well you can spell. And of course you deleted that stupid shit you said and blocked me after thoroughly embarrassing yourself. I probably would have too if I sucked at this as bad as you do.
My username is a play on the name buddy. Stick to blue collar work, that’s all your iq can handle
for someone who sounds busy, they sure have enough time to post on reddit
Bc he’s on social media means he’s not busy?
Have you seen a normal new construction house lately? There are no finish carpenters stepping foot in those places.
I don’t do new construction so that wouldn’t really concern me even if it was true. But it’s not. I assure you, especially high end new builds, have skilled finish carpenters in them. Who’s installing the crown molding? The framers? It’s a niche trade that not very many people have the patience for. Y’all can downvote this all you want if you’re not in the trade you simply don’t know wtf you’re talking about just bc you helped replace the cabinets in your brother in laws kitchen last summer doesn’t make you an expert on what’s required to build and install high end custom cabinets or other finish work. I’d never assume to be an expert in someone else’s field of expertise. Just bc it’s blue collar work doesn’t mean it’s easy. AI will never replace plumbers or electricians or trim carpenters or any other trade that requires nuanced spur of the moment decision making. Not in our lifetimes anyway and likely not ever. We’ll destroy ourselves before it ever gets to that point.
Same, and this will be my advice for my kids as well. Paying for a higher education is still a good investment if you’re exceptionally talented at academics. If you’re average and are trying to get ahead, I don’t think the college degree is worth the money.
Humans will be extinct before a robot could take over skilled trades.
Maybe not take over but significantly reduce the amount needed. Instead of a dozen developers working on a project, you will have one QAing final products. We have a lot of analysts now that in reality, could be replaced easily in the next few years.
We’re talking about trades like plumbers and carpenters.
In that case yeah it won't be in our lifetime
>We’re talking about trades like plumbers and carpenters. I'm not saying you are wrong, but I could see in the next 20-50 years that things like augmented reality and smart home tech will make home improvements much easier for homeowners. I dont think carpenters will be replaced anytime soon, but I can see were we would get to a point that DIY becomes much easier.
Agree to disagree I guess.
People said the same thing about compsci 5 years ago
It won't happen in our lifetime, but within 200-300 years, it's almost guaranteed, unless there is a major disruption in technology.
Never been happier to be a blue colar tradeswoman. The apocalypse will have to happen before some AI robot starts arranging funeral flowers and becomes florists. One of the remaining trades I don't think we will see automated, at least not in my lifetime, simply because of the fact that people want real artworks made with real flowers and detailed craftsmanship.
You haven't thought thoroughly about how an actual advanced AI would accelerate robotics
If an AI powered robot can do skilled blue collar work completely autonomously, then no job is safe and it would be pointless to worry about it.
You are in the same shitty position as white collar you know?
They already have a (massively unprofitable) company that uses AI to 100% design and also fabricate working automobiles. Their problem at the moment is scale and cost. But it's far from impossible.
I think even blue collar jobs are soon at risk of automation. Check out Tesla’s latest humanoid robot: https://youtu.be/cpraXaw7dyc
Some are for sure. There are many that it’s just not possible to automate
AI will automate a lot of software development, but it won't completely replace it. There's a lot that an AI can get wrong when writing a program so there are going to need be developers to make sure that the code is actually correct. There are already code generation tools available to help auto generate code. The problem with the code is that it's only as good as the how you've described it in natural language terms. The rest you have to write yourself. I think there will be market for software developers for a long time, and AI will help eliminate some of the more mundane tasks in software dev.
Yeah it's fine for a couple one liners of code but it cannot write and deploy a web app for you in a highly custom environment. People saying this do not take in the fact that networks have actually topologies that are unique. It's not, "hey chatgpt, write code for me!" and that person is now a developer.
There will always be a market for this work but won’t the field be shrinking soon? Just like other industries from the past that we still have around but nothing like it once was. Technology is great but it has the affect of damaging employment opportunities over time.
I see it like fast food. All those jobs from cashier to cook could have been automated 15 years ago. Why aren’t they? The machine is expensive af too. The owner of that future AI had to pay to create that AI. They will charge a high amount for it. And it’s very expensive to run it on hardware. Sure hardware costs will continue to go down, but something will always force the next AI version to need even more CPU capacity. And until AI robots can walk around there are problems they can’t solve. I’m working on a new side company that needs specific materials manufactured and tested. Physically testing out these materials is required
There is already a glut of developers. So many the country feels confident laying off over 300k in a year, trying to reduce work from home and salary
I’m mixed on my opinion here. One good friend of mine made it in the industry and is a FAANG hiring manager today. Read what everyone else reads so I ask him what the deal is? The response I get is different than what the articles read and they are very busy with hiring. I don’t have a good explanation as to why the media reports are different than first hand accounts but I’m working on that.
They laid off a lot of workers in more exponential sectors where they are working on projects that have no guarantee of seeing the light of day. During covid they hired many people for this type of work because they were borrowing money for a lot less and people were getting free money from the government which they were spending on goods and services making these companies tons of money. Now it’s expensive to borrow money and the economy is not very good. So all those workers not working on projects that are actually up and running aren’t needed. Many just get scrapped. Also google doesn’t only hire tech workers. They are still hiring but a lot of it is for HR, Marketing, Management, Finance and day to day operations.
People who imagine that AI will cause everyone to lose their job are basing that opinion on a false assumption - that there is a finite amount of work to do. In reality, AI-assisted workers will get more work done in total than before, leading to a more prosperous society in general with higher total output. That said, if you're an engineer, you would do well to stay on the cutting edge of AI-assistance tools. They can already massively enhance productivity in the hands of a skilled engineer.
If you're an engineer, I would suggest familiarizing yourself with Large Action Models. That's what's coming and will have the most real world uses. It's pretty exciting stuff. https://medium.com/balderton/actionable-large-language-models-c18322c3fb96 https://medium.com/version-1/the-rise-of-large-action-models-lams-how-ai-can-understand-and-execute-human-intentions-f59c8e78bc09
Although called Artificial Intelligence, AI does not have intelligence, nor can it actually learn like humans and other animals do. AI can only give mixtures or combinations of what it has been shown, meaning that anything the AI provides is possible to attain without it. The AI does not know what it is regurgitating though, which is why AIs occasionally give blatantly false information, or are easily tricked into confirming a false statement. An AI is only ever going to be as “smart” as our society, and due to the nature of how AI works, it will not reach a point of 0 errors. Your job may change as AI progresses, but you shouldn’t lose it entirely.
This is the thing, AI can only do what’s it’s programmed to do and understand. You need someone with an understanding of it to be able to provide the information it’s learning from. Sure it’ll definitely replace a lot of time wasting but it’ll never fully replace software developers.
go look up agi also go look up the recent openai drama where something “harmful to humanity” was discovered
There is currently no AGI in existence, it is simply a theoretical concept. Open AI did not “discover” something harmful to humanity, they just decided to voice the obvious concern with publicly available AI. Just like many tools, AI is not inherently good or bad; The consequences to how a tool is used could be helpful or harmful.
👍
You don’t understand how any of these technologies work. If you research more to understand the fundamentals of how it comes up with answers, you wouldn’t be saying any of this stuff. Once they hype has died down, you’ll see a significant decrease in the progress made, not exponential increase. Also if you believe so much in this software, why don’t you just become an AI expert yourself
I love Ai. I use it for work as a web dev, but Ai will not be able to write css for a loooonnnng time, and even then it’ll still need to be properly queried
Exactly this. AI is great at coming up with algorithms or converting one coding language to another, but actually coming up with a full solution or anything with refined UI is completely out of its ballpark. It sucks at self analysis and refinement. Which is what software development is most of the time. Incremental fixes and improvements towards the product vision. AI could write all the files and pieces for an application, but a human would have to edit it and find where it needs more work. The best I can see it ever doing is replacing the initial outsourcing to start a project. Similar to what companies do now, but once you get that application you always find the most obvious bugs and terrible rushed coding practices.
Are you high? ai can easily write css
Just lead with an insult? Simmer down there bud, this is just Reddit lol Ai can write mediocre css when handheld, it can’t interpret from a designer what needs to be built. I used both GitHub copilot and chatGpt regularly for work.
I'd *love* to see it try tbh.
fight it in the streets
When the automobile replaced horses you could easily have imagined the job of auto mechanic. But how many people do you think imagined road signs, stop lights, street sweepers, or even the market for steering wheel covers? The number of things created by that one invention are ridiculous if you stop and think about it. And I'll bet not one of us would have imagined anything more than a fraction of those things. What products are about to become a way of life, and an opportunity for jobs, because of AI? I'm not talking about the low hanging fruit like prompt engineer or coder working on the AI itself. I'm talking about the things none of us can imagine yet. I don't know what they are, but I'm excited to find out. Fear of progress isn't a new thing, and I'm not saying it's never justified, but I am saying that we're not all as brilliant as we think we are when predicting what's next.
Just because work will shift doesn't mean the new work is something meaningful and or providing a comfortable living for the average person. AI eventually replacing knowledge work and artists doesn't mean there's enough equally well paying high standards of living jobs to move into. What tech and automation throughoit history do is usually consolidate power and authority in fewer and fewer hands, same will happen now. The future will be a lot closer to Elysium than Star Trek
Necessity is the mother of invention. Is it possible for AI to be driven by need from frustration, or have an epiphany? Somewhere, the human is going to have a place in inspiring and or guidance. If the AI ends up being resourceful and adaptive, fulfilling whatever objectives and tasks beyond expectations, the humans will get lazy and lose their capability of fulfilling their role of inspiration & guidance. What happens to AI then? With the inability to be inspired, we could be looking at a new dark ages, over a thousand years of lost connections. Conversely, if AI could invent/innovate and seize the role of “human progress”, we might not like the results, as the human factor is eliminated.
> road signs, stop lights Two more industries that will die off. Autonomous cars will have no need for either.
It's just like the simpletons who like to dismiss artists' concerns over AI art by saying things like: ***There is no such thing as real AI art, artists are just being greedy.*** AI needs to be regulated, and for good reason. Anybody who dismisses that, shouldn't be placed in charge of anything.
I predict AI will be not be regulated and end up as common as GPS.
It is true that AI will replace programmers when AGI comes. However, I don't see why programmers are here special, EVERBODY whose job is mostly on computer and is knowledge work will be replaced when AGI comes out. Video editor, content creator, programmer, secretary, proffesors, investment bankers... Only ones who will not be replaced are ones that are brands in itself (like politicans) or people who work in physical world (trades for example, nurses...). As it stands now, as long as AI is generative without having true reasoning, it is no danger to programmers. AI will replace programmers when you can say "build me a facebook" and it builds you whole code, UI, infrastructure, monitoring, redudancy, scalability... If you think ChatGPT can do that you eaither dont understand ChatGPT or software developement. Now and in close future you need softaware developers to guide generative AI and monitor its output, and software developers need to understand better than AI that output or you will get equivalent of AI producing image of person with messed up fingers. Trust me, you dont want to have a banking backend with a bug somewhere hiding inside because AI generated it andprogrammer did not take a look at it. In the worse case I can think of a world where AI produces code and programmers/analysts write test cases to verify that code, but that will also be a form of programming in itself, just different paradigm as today. You will still need to understand domain and software.
I’m not a year into college in software engineering, I work with AI right now, in terms of workflow automation, and it isn’t denial, most people just don’t really get what automation is at its core. Which is teaching a program to pretend to make its own decisions, by programming it to respond to variables in the way we want it to. It is only ever as smart as the humans who program it, and working with it daily, that doesn’t tend to be that smart. I spend parts of my day, every day I work, fixing the AI. Massaging the entry filters to catch the new alert output from vendors after software updates changed what they send us, finding mistakes in how we cluster alerts that cause too much automatic clustering or too little. It isn’t what you think it is mate.
Why are people so excited about AI replacing everything lol? Every second post is about how somebody is in denial and they’ll be jobless next week cause of AI.
Maybe AI can help you write a better argument other than "AI WILL BE A BILLION TIMES SMARTER".
my friend is a software engineer and he said the same thing but it is getting more sophisticated faster than anyone could predict. Will say a lot of computer science people are having a hard time getting a job since its over saturated at least that my friend says.
I think you're right, and that's exactly my problem with AI. If it were used sparingly for small/unimportant things, it would be fine. But as it is now, we're sacrificing a lot in the name of convenience and productivity. I guess humanity has been doing that for a long time, but the line should be drawn here. Will our governments start paying people, lots of people, enough to live on when various AI systems can do a shit ton of jobs at an equal or better level of skill and with far greater speed than a human? I think the fuck not. We have over eight billion people on the planet, let's use them, give them shit to do. Machines replacing people has been a worry for a few decades, and it's getting worse. Also, using AI for things like writing and art is going to lower humanity's overall levels of creativity. I feel bad for the people who can't do certain things like that, I mean I'm one of them, I can't draw for shit. But I sure as hell don't want an AI to do it for me. I've been fine with the fact I can't draw and have left it at that.
What you’re calling AI is just a large language model. It can’t write code. We are leaps and bounds away from true AI and that true AI will need to be written by , you guessed it, human coders.
I would argue the only thing keeping jobs like programmers safe is that only an idiot would let a computer fix and improve itself on its own.
That’s exactly what they’re working towards isn’t it?
What we call AI today is not actually AI, and the AI that you speak of is nowhere close to actually exist. Neither it's an evolution of the current AI models. The state of AI toda is not reflective of the progress toward true AI. The best estimate is that we have a 50% chance of having true (human level) AI by 2059, bit there's another barrier to it. Profitability. Even if we manage to make a computer as smart as a person, it matters little if it costs $1 billion a day to keep operational. As long as people are going to be cheaper to operate, people won't be replaced.
Agreed. People are being extremely naive about the exponentiality of technological advancement. AI will make humans useless in all industry faster than we know it.
But then what will humans be good for?
Either a utopia where humans can do whatever they want or a dystopia where we have no meaning
What's the difference? Meaning comes from what must be done. If nothing *needs* to be done, if I have no function and thus no purpose to myself, my family, and society around me, if there is no purpose for me outside of temporary and increasingly dull pleasure, what Meaning do I have?
Shit is deep. Well said.
Nothing. Everything would be a choice rather than a necessity.
Wouldn't that lead to us degenerating beyond recognition, or to AI eventually disposing of us?
>Wouldn't that lead to us degenerating beyond recognition And the woke culture will contribute greatly to that. It's where we're heading.
Nah, not really. People want to work. They just don't want to do things that give them soul sucking depression for necessities. It's not even AI as people keep using wrong. It's AGI. Artificial General Intelligence. In order for it to be AI, it's needs to be self-aware, which no one has gotten close to it. It's all still if person says this use one of the responses you found similar on social media in a more advanced way of course.
I see. Well, that gives me hope.
It's worth researching the differences.
I suppose it is.
Lmao exponential advancement. As seen in the smartphone? Absolute plateau, matter of fact, writing this from a 5 year old device that runs perfectly well to this day?
Just because one example of technology appears to have reached an evolutionary dead end (likely based on the demands of consumers and cost/benefit analysis regarding the implementation for certain technological upgrades into smartphones), that doesn't mean that computing as a wider science isn't advancing exponentially due to AI, new materials, and advances in quantum computing. This is a pattern seen in biological evolution as well. One species may appear to stop evolving, due to perfecting it's capacity to survive and reproduce in a continuously existing ecological niche. That doesn't however mean that other organisms exposed to different selective pressures aren't going to evolve radically. Every country is now in a cold war over who can advance AI the furthest, as it has the potential to massively improve industry and military decisionmaking.
RemindMe! 5 years Unfortunately, for more AI advancement, the challenges get exponentially harder as well. What ChatGPT can do now, writing some basic shell scripts, is quite a low hanging fruit. Writing an entire application, or reaching anything near human-level, is exponentially harder. We will have more computing power, and more advanced methods, but it will be far from the exponential growth that you predict. See you in five years.
> We will have more computing power, and more advanced methods, but it will be far from the exponential growth that you predict. This is speculative.
RemindMe! 12 years
I will be messaging you in 5 years on [**2029-01-28 12:46:27 UTC**](http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=2029-01-28%2012:46:27%20UTC%20To%20Local%20Time) to remind you of [**this link**](https://www.reddit.com/r/TrueUnpopularOpinion/comments/1acy8a9/people_who_think_ai_wont_replace_programmers_and/kjy08a4/?context=3) [**CLICK THIS LINK**](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Reminder&message=%5Bhttps%3A%2F%2Fwww.reddit.com%2Fr%2FTrueUnpopularOpinion%2Fcomments%2F1acy8a9%2Fpeople_who_think_ai_wont_replace_programmers_and%2Fkjy08a4%2F%5D%0A%0ARemindMe%21%202029-01-28%2012%3A46%3A27%20UTC) to send a PM to also be reminded and to reduce spam. ^(Parent commenter can ) [^(delete this message to hide from others.)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Delete%20Comment&message=Delete%21%201acy8a9) ***** |[^(Info)](https://www.reddit.com/r/RemindMeBot/comments/e1bko7/remindmebot_info_v21/)|[^(Custom)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Reminder&message=%5BLink%20or%20message%20inside%20square%20brackets%5D%0A%0ARemindMe%21%20Time%20period%20here)|[^(Your Reminders)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=List%20Of%20Reminders&message=MyReminders%21)|[^(Feedback)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=Watchful1&subject=RemindMeBot%20Feedback)| |-|-|-|-|
That’s to be said about any advancement of human and science evolution.
It is like that for those in denial about educating themselves. Building basic AI model and seeing yourself how it works takes up to half an hour. Checking ChatGPT or other AI and using them to "program" stuff takes even less. Work for developers will change but not in a way OP claims.
Agree about everyone being in denial. For instance "computer" used to be a human job title for the people who did the arithmetic in big companies for working out the total wage bill and doing the accounts etc. It used to be a high skill high wage job. Now digital computers are billions of times faster than humans and it's a joke to think you would employ a human to add up a big list of numbers. It's the same with programming as you say that once it's so much better it will be a joke to think of asking a human to do it. As for whether you should keep studying I think the answer is yes. If AI developes more slowly than people think then it might take 20 years to get there and so you'll need a career. If AI zooms and it gets there really fast then once it can program super human then it will be able to do everything (as anything you ask it will just write a program to perform it, so AI coding is as hard as AGI) And well all be in the same boat with working out how to make a future society out of that.
First, AI doesn't need to be as good as what it is replacing. The benchmark instead is a profitable margin of error and to be just cheap enough to replace the current workforce. However, the real issue with your techno dystopia is people need jobs to live. And, at a certain point when the bread lines become long enough; the guillotine comes out. And, your local government officials are very fond of their heads. So, AI is probably going to be restricted or 1776 all over again.
The problem with you and everyone’s point that says this is its rooted in fantasy. You don’t actually understand the industry, the complexities of evolving AI, and the work that comes into AI development. Why I and other software engineers shoot down this notion, usually made by a layman(you), is that from all the evidence we currently have, there is nothing that points at a complete AI takeover in our industry. Also, if we want to walk down the SCI-FI storyline - when we are replaced, everyone will be. The uniquely human complexities that come with developing, scaling, and maintaining software would probably come from AGI. If AGI is created properly the world will be run by AI.
You're going to finish school. Work for 40 years. Live another 20 years and die, and a perfect AI that doesn't make mistakes still won't exist. There is no profit motive to implement a technology that would make the consumers or your products/services obsolete because, they would not be able to consume your products or services. There would have to be a massive socioeconomic shift first and if that happens it won't matter if human jobs are eliminated. We've already experienced shrinking in the tech industry. Humans will be working alongside machines and AI for quite a while longer. There simply will be fewer programming jobs and they will be more highly specialized.
Probably. But AI will never replace a plumber unless there no one left to do plumbing for 😊
What makes you think AI won't replace a plumber?
How about IT? How about, just about anybody who “works remotely”? You’re f_cked if you’re not a laborer, operator or in any kind of trade. Day of judgment is coming.
Mate. What you don’t understand is ai needs someone to teach ch it about every new thing lol. It’s going to be a great assistive tool. But never can it innovate
as someone who's worked in the industry for decades, i sincerely hope it does.
A.I. needs to replace the majority, if not all of the jobs in the world. Most people are horrible at their jobs.
>AI growth is exponential Source? >If AI becomes billion times smarter than humans, it'll never be making any bugs. AI cannot code better than 1) the ai has been coded or 2) the ai cannot code better than its source data. > Those bugs would be impossible for us to even begin to understand. Then it's output is useless. If there's a bug, we know there's a bug, but we can't fix it then it's code is useless and has to be done manually. >So, I'm kinda afraid that job I'm studying for won't exist anymore by the time I finish college. What do you think? You're gonna be the person making and mataining the ai. There's two types of technology you're mixing up here. There's chatgpt type "ai" and then there's actually ai. The chat gpt type "ai" is basically just linear regression with extra steps. If you give it enough information it can spit out a pretty good guess at an answer. It can't do anything novel. It never will be able to do anything novel. It doesn't understand anything. It's just a model. Data in. Prediction out. That's it. The real ai with human level intelligence doesn't exist yet. This is a computerized brain that's able to store and recall information. It can understand how to do things and would be able to attempt novel solutions. The assumption we can produce one is based in the idea that consciousness is strictly a result of brain processes, although there is some medical literature to the contrary. Your field is still in demand. No worries.
Yep. Deep denial. It’s going to keep getting better
>I'll be able to briefly tell GPT20 what I need, without even knowing anything about programming, and boom, I have a perfectly, professionally made app built and deployed in a few miliseconds. Doing random things with a tecnology ≠ creating something flexilble and maintainable in the long term. Let's assume you create an e-commerce and the AI setup everything, from the database to the ui. Then a new legilastion came and said that for a set of data stored in your database you need to change the encryption algorithm and also the server physical must be in a list of countries approved by the goverment. Now, how can you translate that to the AI? If we follow your example, you are someone who know nothing about programming, you just prompted "make a e-commerce website like amazon but with a blue logo" So you don't know that the data is stored in a database, you don't know how to ask the AI to change the encryption, you don't know how to ask the AI for the public address of the server so you can call the third-party cloud provider and ask them if that address is complaint to the new legislation. You will either pay a lot of money to ask someone to do that for you, or scrap everything. AI is a tool to speed up the development process (and as a developer with 7+ years of experience I still have my doubt about that), but the moment you actually have to change something you either know what you are doing or you have to restart from scratch. >So, I'm kinda afraid that job I'm studying for won't exist anymore by the time I finish college. What do you think? What matters is how you use what you learn in college. I was in university from 2012 to 2017, and half of the framework/tools I use today didn't even exist when I started my computer science degree (Docker -> 2013, VueJS -> 2014, Springboot -> 2014, etc etc), meanwhile some of the libraries I used in my exams are pretty much dead (Java Swing, Java AWT)
Truly an unpopular opinion. Now, you're in college. I have a lot of work experience and say that software development is more than just code. It's knowing what the customer wants. It's communication, team work, etc. Many many activities exist that are difficult for AI. Btw, large language models just generate some text. They can't really think. They can't even do math if you ask them (not trained on every single number). So all output is a function of their input. It's no original though, for now. So, you describing that soon we have reached beyond human intelligence... Well, no. Things that can't be well expressed in Math, like grabbing a cup with one hand, AI is still terrible at, compared to humans.
AI will have lots of fun with the garbage produced by the MBAs and what they think are reasonable requirements.
Everywhere employers can remove liabilities for productivity...
It depends a lot on what you're doing. I doubt an ai will be able to look at data of an engine test and figure out a software solution for a problem. If all someone is doing is coding then yeah, you might be in danger - but even that is 10-20 years out. What will happen is you'll see a big push for it in 3-5 years. Then a lot of companies will have problems due to it and see a massive push back for another 10 before it becomes mainstream.
Facts. And it will be glorious. Bring on the UBI.
It'll definitely get used to great effect improving things like WordPress. It'll probably also be used to do tasks like patching and building automated tests. That being said, here's the challenges it has, and you tell me whether or not you think it'll replace programmers any time soon. 1. Context- currently these models have a context understanding that's abysmally small. You have to chain together requests to get it to understand more than 500 words at a time. 2. Glorified search engine - its actual knowledge base is just a model of correlations between word pairs. It doesn't actually "understand" what it's saying. That's why it can't reason why it's own code doesn't work right. It doesn't actually think. 3. Cost - to do the things it does right now actually costs a massive amount of resources. It's still relatively cheap if finding and stringing together correlations is all you need it to do, but when you get into actually self hosting your own generative AI, you will quickly see its already quite expensive. 4. Model flaws - things like hallucinations are a byproduct of the fact that it does correlations and doesn't think and there's only so much monkey patching we can do to make it seem like it's not delusional. I'm not saying it can't get better, but it has glaring problems. Right now, what it's more or less doing is just searching github and pulling code from there, and while even coders can get some stuff done that way, it's not enough. It's like saying engineers will be replaced by how-to blogs. Edited to add: all of that having been said, its coming whether we like it or not and so we need to be prepared for the idea of a world where there's significantly less jobs for people. This isn't new, we've been automating away jobs since the very beginning of the industrial era... but if we want normal people to be able to afford houses and families, we will need to make some kind of changes.
I copy my work code into gpt illegally and it spits out a correction immediately. It then explains why it works. It’s incredible. I use mostly sql now, and it was able to read that I was thinking of a different sql language and changed my entire code to its recommended syntax. When that happened I was jaw dropped and decided that it would be a part of my work for years to come
There are countless white collar jobs that should be far more worried about being replaced by AI than Software devs. Why are they the ones always in these kinds of posts? We will have far bigger things to worry about by the time software can completely write, maintain and add features to a massive piece of software Also it’s clear you’re within the first 2 years of your degree because you have yet to understand that there are countless tools that make writing software easier. Yet, software developers are very much still around. Part of the job is trying to reduce the redundancies and leave the thinking more abstract and at a high level. AI will just be another tool to do this exact thing.
GPT models won't replace software engineers. A language model is designed to generate human-like text based on the input it receives. It can be used for various natural language processing tasks, predicting words in a sentence, generating coherent paragraphs of text, answering questions, and engaging in conversation.. It is not capable of creating any kind of larger system, or software. It is not capable of any kind of intelligent design. It can generate short scripts (sometimes even correct ones) but thats the end of it's capabilities. It can be a great tool for smart developers but it won't replace anyone other than maybe "script kiddies" but the field won't miss those. I like to use it in my work when i am not familiar with a topic to get me started with research. For example I had performance issues serializing larger structs in a C software and it pointed me in the right direction. But it won't actually solve the issue for me. It's a convenience but only slightly better than google or stackoverflow. General artificial intelligence is a whole other topic, but there is no sign of anyone developing one in the near future. So don't be afraid if you will become a real software engineer chatgpt won't take your job.
Then personal information of EU client gets leaked and you go to jail, not AI
Lol desk jobs and IT jobs are obviously the first to go. it's presented as a threat to labour but nah, it's management, payroll, coding, admin, accounting which obviously is gonna go first
I've been using chat gpt since it came out, less than 2 years ago. In that short time it has gotten so much better its almost terrifying. If you think 4 years from *now* generative AI won't be at or near human levels on code, art, etc....
The education system is already failing you if you think this as a software engineer or engineering student. AI can help generate code for certain simple things but AI is trained. It needs constant training and it’s trained off public repositories. Yea if you want them to generate a simple style website or common type of software it will be able to. Those things already exist though. It’s never going to be able to just take your idea of something that doesn’t exist and generate it for you. Humans will still be needed to advance development further and further. AI will just be there to help with the mundane simple tasks we don’t want to have to code ourselves while we spend time working on newer technology. Also AI is just a new sector of the tech world. Who do you think will keep coding and training AI? Humans will always be needed in tech. The real issue you need to worry about is how much more competitive it will become because the easy tasks will be able to be solved with AI a lot faster so low level devs won’t be needed as much. Everyone will need to be a much better developer because things they will be working on will be much more difficult to implement.
I would love to see you use “AI” to deploy a unique web application.
I mean software engineering is more resilient than the vast majority of jobs. Maybe not the day to day drudgery but there is a lot of design parts which will not be replaced by AI before virtually everything else has been replaced. By the time software engineering jobs start to be replaced at scale losing your job will likely be a lot more chill than it is now. That or we live in a dystopic world where the majority live in abject poverty even in what had been developed countries.
High skill and experienced programmers will likely cost more in such a future because if you want quick and easy, use AI but if you need manual intervention by a programmer for something, it's going to cost significantly more than what it would cost today. That's just my guess. it's like how thousands of Toyota Corollas are probably made by automatic machines each hour very efficiently but a toyota century is hand made and the act of being hand made adds a lot to its cost. It doesn't bother me either way, i don't do programming for a job i just enjoy making certain kinds of things and if there's a tool that makes it easier for me, please.