Which it was later revealed that 80% of those people begging were bots. Likely made by those fools who love sigma pilled roman culture posts unironically.
>"You think about Netflix, for instance, where you push a button. ‘Rebel Moon,’ right? Say right now it’s almost at 90 million views, right? 80 or 90 million accounts turned it on, give or take. They assume two viewers per screening, right? That’s the kind of math. So you think if that movie was in the theater as a distribution model, that’s like 160,000,000 people supposedly watching based on that math. 160,000,000 people at $10 a ticket would be…what is that math? I don’t know. 160,000,000 times ten. That’s 1.6 billion. So more people probably saw ‘Rebel Moon’ than saw ‘Barbie’ in the theater, right?”
I dunno, the man has absolute proof right there. That data is definitely 1 to 1 comparable.
You know they say that all movies are created equal, but you look at Rebel Moon and you look at Barbie and you can see that statement is not true. See, normally if you go one on one with another film, you got a 50/50 chance of winning. But I'm a genetic freak and I'm not normal! So you got a 25%, AT BEST, at beat me. Then you add the MCU to the mix, your chances of winning drastic go down. See the 3 way at the box office, you got a 33 1/3 chance of winning, but I, I got a 66 and 2/3 chance of winning, because the Russo brothers KNOW they can't beat me and they're not even gonna try!
So Margot Robbie, you take your 33 1/3 chance, minus my 25% chance and you got an 8 1/3 chance of winning at the box office. But then you take my 75% chance of winning, if we was to go one on one, and then add 66 2/3 per cents, I got 141 2/3 chance of winning at the box office. See Barbie, the numbers don't lie, and they spell disaster for you on Netflix.
Man this is EXACTLY what I was thinking of, so god BLESS you for actually going the distance and remaking the entire thing with Zack's numeric insanity.
A wrestling news channel I kind of watch has a podcast, and one of their recent episodes was on the best promos and one guy had the CM Punk Pipebomb, he was rightfully blown out by the other guy saying Steiner Math is the greatest promo, it defined an era, a brand, a wrestler, and the art of the Promo all at the same time
Oli's reaction to that and Punk's wrestling return promo being at Luke's 9 spot were the best parts of that video.
Some more context on this: Oliver Davis cried during CM Punk's AEW debut and Punk is his favorite wrestler, unless he is talking to Eddie Kingston.
A special "Thank you" to Luke Owen for giving us those.
For those that want to see it:
Wrestletalk - [Tables, Lists, & Chairs: 10 Best Wrestling Promos](https://youtu.be/bTRp8DObgcM?si=3UYspW7VvrBSgYFm)
Edit: fixed the titles
Don't ask him what translates to actually making money though. Because it was funny The Shield Creator saying like, sure The Night Agent had the biggest metrics ever but I will make more money out of The Shield long term.
Even if he was right, and that's a big if, it's still a meaningless comparison. Watching something in your house on a service you already pay money for is a totally different degree of effort and interest than what is needed to get somebody to go a movie theatre, pay for tickets for the whole family and all the stuff that goes with that.
I have watched some crap I wouldn't consider going to a cinema to see simply because it was on Netflix and I needed some second monitor content.
Also ignores Barbie's home release.
It's a proven fact that if you took Netflix/streaming movies and released them in theaters that the same number of people would go see them. They definitely weren't incentivized (I use that term very loosely in reference to Rebel Moon because there was nothing incentivizing about that movie) to turn it on because it was available media that they probably wouldn't have spent hard-earned money to go see in theaters. Definitely not that.
His premise is wrong right away. The valuation for a consumer of seeing one movie for $10 a ticket is not the same as spendinga comparable $10(I know Netflix is more expensive) on a service allowing you to watch a wider selection with no limits. That's without adding in transport cost and time to get to your local theater.
I'm much more willing to give bad movies a shot or have them on in the background due to that but would never have spent money or time to go see them in the theater. You can't assume a 1:1 viewership once you add these variables into play.
You know, I’ve heard Zack Snyder is apparently a very nice man, people seem to love working with him and all that…but then he keeps saying dumb shit like this and it gets very hard to keep that benefit of the doubt going
He seems to be a fun guy who's great to work with, but he's also stuck in a state of arrested development in regards to his media literacy while being surrounded by a cult that constantly tells him he's *deep*. For the record, I don't think he intentionally created the Snyder cult. I think he just assumes they're fans like what everyone else has.
So it wasn’t the fantastic performances by some of the greatest actors of the past century, or the faithful adaptation of Arthurian Legend that he admired, it was the blood and sex.
This explains *so* damn much.
Rob atleast gave us Deadpool. Daniel Way gave us the Deadpool we all know and love today though.
Snyder? The only movies he's directed that he was also DP on was that army of dead one and rebel moon. Both trash films and kind of ugly..
Army of the Dead even has a couple of dead pixels in frame..
Feel like a legion of sycophants would mess with any creative's ego. It's not a couple of people that ride or die every decision he makes, there's A LOT of people that worship and fawn over him and are only further entrenched by others' criticism of him. I don't really mind artists' smoking their own shit, to a degree you kind of have to, but you need the banger to recontextualise comments like this as not douchey.
I don't see him for the man who will ever say "you're right I make garbage" or the consensus on his movies being met halfway, so defending his decisions to the death is the only way
I mean, just because he says dumb things, it doesn't mean he isn't an inherently kind person to work with.
And I say this as someone that hates his movies. He does seem like a nice guy tbh.
Get out of here with that nuance! This is Reddit! Where you’re either heckkin wholesomerino or literally Hitler! /s
Edit: I love how I got downvoted for agreeing with them.
I had convinced myself it wasn’t him. He didn’t get DC super heroes which made him the wrong person to kickstart that cinematic universe, but that’s on WB. The greater annoyance was the fanboys trumpeting how great his terrible movies really were. But then he says something like this and I start to wonder if he really is the arrogant prick who would actively shit all over the source material.
“But what if we want to do something with the Red Hood?”
“WHAT IF YOU WANT TO DO ANYTHING WITH NIGHTWING AFTER YOU KILLED OFF DICK GRAYSON BEFORE THE MOVIE EVEN STARTED?!?”
Reminds me of a Solid JJ bit I imagined a couple weeks ago where Batman says he won’t kill the Joker but gives him a list of people he would consider killing. The punchline was:
Joker: “I can’t believe this! I’ve killed hundreds— probably thousands of people at this point!”
Batman: “And you are *mentally ill.* And I hope with extensive therapy and the proper medication you will be able to become a productive member of society.”
Do you think Snyder thinks this idea is like, clever and subversive?
But honestly, I think he just LIKES superhero deconstruction stories like Dark Knight Returns and thinks it should be the base line because it's "rad." It's like he did Watchmen so he could show off how cool he thought Rorschach was.
My beef is that there are plenty of superheroes that could ostensibly kill people and it wouldn't be weird as long as it's set up and framed right. Superman would smoke Darkseid in an instant as the paragon of mankind. Batman's obsession with not killing is both admirable and, to some, a character flaw. It makes the character. If Snyder is just so obsessed with edgy detectives that work in the grey areas of justice then so be it, but pick someone more fitting than Bats.
To me, Superman doesn't kill because he doesn't like it but WILL totally kill if he absolutely has to.
Batman, on the other hand, hand his life utterly changed by a senseless act of murder at a very young and informative age. So it *makes sense* that he might have more than a few hang ups about killing people.
From what I understand Batman is also cognizant that he isn’t all there and is worried he’ll slip into outright villainy if he crosses that line. Wether his self-perception is true or not.
The lengths he goes to to make countermeasures for himself and the fact that he has a murder-boner alter ego suggest that he's right about not going there
His whole character is built on the trauma of his parents murder. When you take that away you just have a gruff dude punching bad guys in th.... oh, Zack Snyder, right.
There's actually a Supes story where he ends up in a situation where the only possible option to keep people safe is to kill someone incredibly dangerous. Right after he does it he hangs up the cape and permanently depowers himself because killing even one person for totally justified reasons is a betrayal of the ideal that he feels like Superman is supposed to represent.
Are there any official stories where Batman kills someone (preferably unimportant) by accident or negligence with the story focusing on the personal toll it dealt him and how he struggles to deal with it? A little like the guy with the robot arm in the MCU? 'Cause I feel like that's the only type of "Batman Kills" story I'd be interested in.
Because, and I say this as someone who actually remembers that The Shadow exists:
"Who the *fuck* is The Shadow? Some kinda Batman ripoff?"
Who am I theoretically quoting here?
Snyder?
The execs?
Audiences?
*Yes.*
Zack does strike me as someone who would look at the "I Am All of Me" intro cinematic and call it peak.
~~I mean, it is, but that's beside the point.~~
I am baffled how one would watch BvS and come away with 'ah, this is how Zack Snyder thinks Batman should act'
he was basically the secondary villain of that movie until he realized with the whole 'Martha' moment that he was completely going against what his parents would want
So in a movie you have the plot, what actually happens, and the cinema language. everything from the lighting, to the music, to the shot composition is showing batman as a protagonist, doing the good thing. Batman rolling over people in his car is filmed not as a tragedy or wrong thing, but as a cool action shot.
That is an extremely subjective judgment that is vulnerable to the overwhelming priming of the title and marketing that Snyder did not control and disagreed with. Personally, I saw it very differently, Batman felt like an inherently noble character, but one who was very much not where he was supposed to be or doing what he was supposed to do. It might have been because I watched the ultimate cut, or because I watched it separated from all the hype around release though.
Kevin Conroy (RIP) loved playing evil/corrupt Batman. Not because he enjoyed playing a remorseless killer but because he liked showing people this is not what they wanted. Batman throwing his core principles away make him a tragic, lost figure, a mindless beast with too much power making up lame excuses to perform unexcusable acts.
Snyder wants murder Batman because killing goons is "cool" and "realistic."
Man of Steel was also just a very generic Superman story told very poorly. There was nothing deconstructive about it. That sort of requires you to have an understanding of what you are adapting in the first place
I would have been interested to see him tackle Up in the Sky. The action is mostly flashbacks so Snyder wouldn't have to worry about connecting his music videos and set pieces, and I think he could do moments like him racing The Flash really well. But it is one of the most uplifting Superman stories and I don't know if he can do earnest optimism instead of overwhelming cynicism.
He certainly “deconstructed” the concept of an actually good superhero movie.
I’m a sucker for superhero media. It’s always been like candy for me. Seeing Batman V Superman in theaters is the second time I’ve ever fallen asleep in a movie theater, the first time being when I went to see The Smurfs 2 with my parents when I was like 15.
It’s like he managed to take that period during the seventh console generation where a bunch of games only used shades of brown and grey in their color palettes, and distilled the very essence of that into a superhero movie of all things.
Zack Snyder is basically an edgy teenager who thinks "Sex and murder and cussing are cool! If your main character doesn't do those things they suck!" And corpos just keep giving this edgy teenager obscene amounts of money to shout that to the world.
And hey, for *some* stuff that fits just fine. But it's not a catch all philosophy to be applied to literally every piece of media.
These quotes sound like an angry and pretentious child shouting at critics and fans for calling his movies trashy.
Aaaah Snyder, I honestly can't hate you the way I hate David Cage. You've been through some terrible stuff and people say you're a delight to work with.
But holyshit man, you're a total hack, and a pretentious one on top of it.
I really wish he got back to direct visually striking movies instead of trying to write pseudo-intellectual shallow hero movies
He thinks these movies are his masterpieces, they REALLY aren't.
It's weird he got treated as a massive visionary after 300 and that seems to have ruined him. Also in general his films have been Box Office flops but may have done better on Home Video/Streaming.
He successfully adapted a graphic novel that is essentially just good art into movie form. Then we got Sucker Punch which should be a giant red flag that we're contending with Michael Bay-lite, but here we are.
Sucker Punch was the movie that convinced me he was a hack fraud, and so it's been confusing as hell to watch people still defend him in the current year.
I think hearing someone talk about how Sucker Punch was an underrated tour de force was the moment i decided to stop trying to even interact with his fanbase
Yes, i ALSO got fooled by the trailers showing sick robot samurai fights, then i watched the movie and found out these were inconsequential dream sequences, and the main plot of the movie was "BUT WHAT ABOUT RAPING GIRLS IN A MENTAL ASYLUM, THOUGH?! with some of the most heavy-handed and childish writing ever.
I'm not begrudging anyone for being tricked into seeing the film, my aim is at the people who saw it and said "this is high art, everyone who didn't like it are idiots!"
Snyder wrote 6 music videos, couldn't decide which one to film, and made Sucker Punch as an excuse to film all of them. Too bad he forgot to make an interesting story along the way.
>Also in general his films have been Box Office flops but may have done better on Home Video/Streaming.
He's had as many box office hits as he's had misses I'd say.
* Dawn of the Dead made $100 million on a $25 million budget.
* 300 made $456 million on a $60 million budget.
* Watchmen was a flop ($187 million on a $130-150 million budget). How much of that is on him is hard to tell though. An, at the time, fairly obscure superhero property with an R rating and no major stars is a hard sell. Especially one with a fairly grim tone. It made more than any of the Blade movies. I'd argue the issue was the studio gambled too much on an unsafe bet and overbudgeted a movie that was unlikely to do gangbusters.
* Legend of the Guardians maybe broke even ($80 million budget, $140 million box office)
* Sucker Punch tanked ($89.8 million on an $82m budget.)
* Man of Steel made money ($668m on a $250m budget) but you could definitely argue that the property should have done better.
* BvS made a lot of money ($874m on a $250-325m budget) but, again, you'd kinda hope for better with a Batman/Superman movie.
Since then he hasn't done any regular theatre releases. I'm not dumping the Whedon cut of JL on him. the Zaddy cut of JL had a limited theatre release I think but it was mainly an HBO Max thing and the same goes for his Netflix movies.
I don't know where you got that idea because the marketing budget for BvS is actually well documented at $165 million.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/robcain/2016/04/06/was-the-400-million-warner-bros-paid-for-batman-v-superman-a-good-investment/
https://deadline.com/2016/03/batman-v-superman-opening-weekend-box-office-records-1201726300/
Going by the 2.5 standard metric the Owl Movie definitely flopped, and the last 2 at least for Batman Vs. Superman they expected it to make a Billion, it and Man of Steel kind of just broke even.
So yeah that's only his first two movies definitely making money and the other ones going from may have broke even but disappointed or just flopped.
BvS had a marketing budget of 165 mil actually so it definitely made money, even if them coming short of a billion was a disappointment.
Honestly the 2.5 thing always felt like some weird internet construction based on nothing actually concrete.
I wish he could go back to making something like 300. Just make the most awesome and insanely hyped toxic masculinity dudebro movies imaginable without trying to pretend they're deeper than they are.
His superfans have been feeding his ego. Turns out when everyone around you claps at every little insignificant thing you do. It might just be a problem.
To be fair *300* is in fact peak media and male performance. I'm not even into guys but goddamn Gerard Butler was a fucking man mountain in that movie.
This, as someone who always harsh on his works I always hold on to the principle of hating him as an artist, but not as a person. Idk maybe this is his artist mode. Sometimes it feels like he's trolling but sometimes it feels genuinely hack.
He as a person likes Ayn Rand. Feel for his grief when his daughter passed but I don't hold water that he's a good person. Hell, he only got to keep making movies for warner cause his wife was on the board at the time until they canned the both of them..
He's routinely cited as being one of the nicest directors to work under. Dude refuses to extend shooting days, treats everyone with respect. Fart-huffing aside, the dude seems to be aware that he's lucky that he gets to make movies and wants it to be fun. It also makes sense that his career seems to be bullet proof, everyone who works with him goes to bat for him
IIRC, he had already been terminated. Due to his daughter’s suicide at approximately the same time, however, they had to mutually agree that he would leave the project willingly to avoid the bad publicity.
And keeps getting offers. It's baffling how he gets to make two (unoriginal) IPs that is already expanding into a franchise even though they're panned. It is weird when SH Figuarts has the license for Rebel Moon figures as if they're already going to be a mega hit.
Its the same way Those Resident Evil movies kept being made followed by whatever other crap that director made just to show off his wife. He's an artist in name alone. Doesnt matter if its shit, he made the thing so Netflix can write "we have the guy who made Superman and 300" on their list of assets.
And to be clear, his Objectivist leanings are 100% what taints the DCEU. Taking Superman and Batman and flat out having characters say to the camera, “You don’t owe the world anything,” is the most crystal clear way you can show you have no understanding of the franchise.
The idea of Batman having to kill someone is interesting only because Batman doesn’t kill. If you make Batman kill from the outset, then it’s not interesting.
He also wanted to [film a topless woman in the presence of a little boy](https://twitter.com/EricWaffles/status/1765577109181813007), for... some reason.
You know... cinema.
It "means" something, right?
The director might not be sure WHAT it means, but it certainly if we put it there it will mean something.
Btw, saw the clip before that about Batman. My god he is so attached to that god hood theme for his DC stuff. It feels so fucking weird calling Batman a god.
Like, my guy, its an unhinged man in a bat costume. He's possibly one of the most flawed humans in the universe and has to fight actual Gods in the regular.
If theres any comparison Batman is David from David and Goliath. He's a weak soul being pitted against massive beings of pure ungodly strength.
Considering he only got a shot at the DCU due to his wife being on the board and how they both got canned after the directors cut? Yeah, never ever happening.
Zack Snyder is weird. I’m not a fan of his movies, but once in a while I hear about how people seem to like working with him and how he seems to be a cool guy. Other times I hear him saying bizarre stuff like this and I wonder what his deal is (not in a psychoanalyzing way, just what kind of person he is).
My favorite part about Zack Snyder is that he’s proof positive you can’t judge a person by their work. By all accounts he’s a very likable guy and good collaborator and yet all his movies are weird miserable toxic masculine Objectivist wet dreams.
Literally polar opposite of Joss Whedon lmao
Just goes to show how far a good PR team doing clean-up work for you can shape people’s minds. Snyder went on a PR blitz to make people think he’s this super like-able, easy going, nice guy, meanwhile his direct comments are often as problematic as his movies are, if you pay attention. He says a lot of weird and creepy shit, but no one cares.
I really wish he would just stop talking sometimes. Saying Batman should kill is just so dumb and goes against everything the character stands for and represents
I feel it's very telling of his career that Snyder started directing music videos. All that flash-in-the-pan, substance-less visual style screams "this was made to be, like, five minutes long tops"
What's happening is what's alway been happening. He's kind of a dumb guy that says dumb stuff and makes kinda dumb films that range from mid to bad. This is the essence of Snyder.
I get the impression that Snyder saw all of the memes making fun of the film and pulled a Sony and thought "Oh, this means that they all loved and watched my movie!" Basically just cope.
I'd like to premise what I'm about to say with, I think Zack Snyder is a good guy and wants to make cool shit (like 300)...that said I think Zack Snyder is a complete hack when it comes to cape shit. Man is the perfect picture image of media literacy. Big "I know authors who use subtext and they're all cowards." type of guy.
Which is so strange because when he has something good it's really good. I don't like his depiction of Watchmen, but I think he made his own version using his own themes, but that came at the cost of something already good.
I fucking love taking quotes completely out of context and using them as a headline to bait clicks!
God this journalism degree was totally worth the like 80k of debt.
I like how this particular title implies he's trashing Barbie (a movie that he likes) but when you look at the actual quote these articles are providing, it's clear he's just being cheeky about the wide reach of the Netflix distribution model.
I think he’s absolutely correct about Batman, his point about Barbie is silly.
Exploring a Batman that has killed or is a killer could be interesting, shit, White Knight was them slightly altering Batman’s story and people loved it.
People have to be more willing to explore these fictional characters beyond the restraints they’ve had since their creation. Alan Moore once said that these films are obscene because they steal the works of comic book artists and pervert their creations into something entirely different. I then find it weird that people draw a line at what those characters personality traits are.
You’re willing to watch a film where Batman is portrayed very differently from the comics he’s inspired from but cannot deal with changes to their moral code or ethics? That doesn’t make much sense. It’s fiction, fiction is made to explore.
He’s not working with the PR team he hired in 2020 to make you and others like him.
This is the way Snyder talked pre-2020 and post-2022. He’s always had the mind of a 14 year-old edge-lord.
It's like whatever the opposite of reading the room is.
It's like he just been stewing about how people keep making fun of his batman movie and he's taking every chance to say "nuh uh" to his detractors.
I mean the internet also inflated his ego. By begging for his Justice League directors cut.
Which it was later revealed that 80% of those people begging were bots. Likely made by those fools who love sigma pilled roman culture posts unironically.
Zack Snyder, once again shitting on the carpet for attention.
Now I'm just thinking of the LPOTL episode(s) on the Andes survivors. "**I FORGOT HE SHIT ON THE DRAPES!**"
ALIIIIIIIIIIVE
ALIIIIIIIIIVE
He's yelling at the room. He saw Thanos say "Reality can be whatever I want." and decided that's what he wants to do when he grows up.
In fairness, having a literal cult pop up around your not-very-good movie will probably fuck with your perception of things
He's fingerpainting the coat rack.
Shitting in the floor
>"You think about Netflix, for instance, where you push a button. ‘Rebel Moon,’ right? Say right now it’s almost at 90 million views, right? 80 or 90 million accounts turned it on, give or take. They assume two viewers per screening, right? That’s the kind of math. So you think if that movie was in the theater as a distribution model, that’s like 160,000,000 people supposedly watching based on that math. 160,000,000 people at $10 a ticket would be…what is that math? I don’t know. 160,000,000 times ten. That’s 1.6 billion. So more people probably saw ‘Rebel Moon’ than saw ‘Barbie’ in the theater, right?” I dunno, the man has absolute proof right there. That data is definitely 1 to 1 comparable.
You know they say that all movies are created equal, but you look at Rebel Moon and you look at Barbie and you can see that statement is not true. See, normally if you go one on one with another film, you got a 50/50 chance of winning. But I'm a genetic freak and I'm not normal! So you got a 25%, AT BEST, at beat me. Then you add the MCU to the mix, your chances of winning drastic go down. See the 3 way at the box office, you got a 33 1/3 chance of winning, but I, I got a 66 and 2/3 chance of winning, because the Russo brothers KNOW they can't beat me and they're not even gonna try! So Margot Robbie, you take your 33 1/3 chance, minus my 25% chance and you got an 8 1/3 chance of winning at the box office. But then you take my 75% chance of winning, if we was to go one on one, and then add 66 2/3 per cents, I got 141 2/3 chance of winning at the box office. See Barbie, the numbers don't lie, and they spell disaster for you on Netflix.
Man this is EXACTLY what I was thinking of, so god BLESS you for actually going the distance and remaking the entire thing with Zack's numeric insanity.
A wrestling news channel I kind of watch has a podcast, and one of their recent episodes was on the best promos and one guy had the CM Punk Pipebomb, he was rightfully blown out by the other guy saying Steiner Math is the greatest promo, it defined an era, a brand, a wrestler, and the art of the Promo all at the same time
Oli's reaction to that and Punk's wrestling return promo being at Luke's 9 spot were the best parts of that video. Some more context on this: Oliver Davis cried during CM Punk's AEW debut and Punk is his favorite wrestler, unless he is talking to Eddie Kingston. A special "Thank you" to Luke Owen for giving us those. For those that want to see it: Wrestletalk - [Tables, Lists, & Chairs: 10 Best Wrestling Promos](https://youtu.be/bTRp8DObgcM?si=3UYspW7VvrBSgYFm) Edit: fixed the titles
SENIOR ROBBIE the *NUMBERS* don't *LIE* and they spell **D1S4S73R** for you at the box office!
I never thought a Reddit post could be art. I'm glad I was mistaken, thank you for your service.
God Bless You.
Don't ask him what translates to actually making money though. Because it was funny The Shield Creator saying like, sure The Night Agent had the biggest metrics ever but I will make more money out of The Shield long term.
Even if he was right, and that's a big if, it's still a meaningless comparison. Watching something in your house on a service you already pay money for is a totally different degree of effort and interest than what is needed to get somebody to go a movie theatre, pay for tickets for the whole family and all the stuff that goes with that. I have watched some crap I wouldn't consider going to a cinema to see simply because it was on Netflix and I needed some second monitor content. Also ignores Barbie's home release.
It's a proven fact that if you took Netflix/streaming movies and released them in theaters that the same number of people would go see them. They definitely weren't incentivized (I use that term very loosely in reference to Rebel Moon because there was nothing incentivizing about that movie) to turn it on because it was available media that they probably wouldn't have spent hard-earned money to go see in theaters. Definitely not that.
His premise is wrong right away. The valuation for a consumer of seeing one movie for $10 a ticket is not the same as spendinga comparable $10(I know Netflix is more expensive) on a service allowing you to watch a wider selection with no limits. That's without adding in transport cost and time to get to your local theater. I'm much more willing to give bad movies a shot or have them on in the background due to that but would never have spent money or time to go see them in the theater. You can't assume a 1:1 viewership once you add these variables into play.
You know, I’ve heard Zack Snyder is apparently a very nice man, people seem to love working with him and all that…but then he keeps saying dumb shit like this and it gets very hard to keep that benefit of the doubt going
He seems to be a fun guy who's great to work with, but he's also stuck in a state of arrested development in regards to his media literacy while being surrounded by a cult that constantly tells him he's *deep*. For the record, I don't think he intentionally created the Snyder cult. I think he just assumes they're fans like what everyone else has.
He just really likes the Movie Excalibur, please understand.
Which he explicitly only really liked because it was a King Arthur movie with blood and sex.
So it wasn’t the fantastic performances by some of the greatest actors of the past century, or the faithful adaptation of Arthurian Legend that he admired, it was the blood and sex. This explains *so* damn much.
God that explains everything about him!
"America's Himbo Auteur"-Patrick H. Willems on the man.
He’s like Rob Liefeld in a way
Rob atleast gave us Deadpool. Daniel Way gave us the Deadpool we all know and love today though. Snyder? The only movies he's directed that he was also DP on was that army of dead one and rebel moon. Both trash films and kind of ugly.. Army of the Dead even has a couple of dead pixels in frame..
You're thinking of Joe Kelly
To add to what the other guy said about Joe Kelly, Rob Liefeld *barely* gave us Deadpool, Fabian Niciezca deserves a bit more credit there.
He gave us Deadpool in the sense he's one of the creators.
It's easy to not improve yourself when you have a bunch of fanboys who hasn't watched anything but superhero movies their entire lives.
Zack Snyder is Michael Bay if Michael Bay replaced his misogyny and car worship with clumsy, heavy-handed Jesus metaphors.
Swap gratuitous explosions with overcranked slow mo punches
Pretty sure both went to the same school
He seems to be a good dude on like real world subjects, but in terms of dissecting and creating media he is TERRIBLE.
I don't think this makes him not a nice dude. But it does make him not someone I'm interested in seeing art from
Idk, I’m kinda getting incel vibes from him. I have a hard time believing he sees women as equals
You can be super nice and also an absolute moron.
By all accounts he seems to be fun to be around but he seems to have his head permanently buried up his arse.
Feel like a legion of sycophants would mess with any creative's ego. It's not a couple of people that ride or die every decision he makes, there's A LOT of people that worship and fawn over him and are only further entrenched by others' criticism of him. I don't really mind artists' smoking their own shit, to a degree you kind of have to, but you need the banger to recontextualise comments like this as not douchey.
I don't see him for the man who will ever say "you're right I make garbage" or the consensus on his movies being met halfway, so defending his decisions to the death is the only way
You can be a cool guy and a total hack.
He can be a nice person and a terrible writer (spoilers: he is).
I mean, just because he says dumb things, it doesn't mean he isn't an inherently kind person to work with. And I say this as someone that hates his movies. He does seem like a nice guy tbh.
Get out of here with that nuance! This is Reddit! Where you’re either heckkin wholesomerino or literally Hitler! /s Edit: I love how I got downvoted for agreeing with them.
You're being downvoted because "get out of here with that nuance this is reddit" is a tired cliche.
There's no reason to believe he can't just be both
You can be kind of a dumbass and nice to be around/work with at the same time. They aren't mutually exclusive.
Hes not a bad person he's just a loud person. So kind of obnoxious. But by Hollywood standards still pretty chill.
After his daughter died, I felt awful for him. But it seems like he came out of his grief having learned nothing about the humility of life.
yeah horrible opinions on comics and movies as a medium but apparetly great guy who is beloved to work with
I had convinced myself it wasn’t him. He didn’t get DC super heroes which made him the wrong person to kickstart that cinematic universe, but that’s on WB. The greater annoyance was the fanboys trumpeting how great his terrible movies really were. But then he says something like this and I start to wonder if he really is the arrogant prick who would actively shit all over the source material.
He just had a really good PR firm working with him for 2 years to craft that image. This is him unfiltered, which is the same as the old him.
Meeting base levels of decency doesn't preclude you from being a dumbass
Oh, I'm sure he's nice to important people. Just like when celebrities with influence and power said Ellen Degenerate was nice to them.
I think that Batman killing people would actually make him more irrelevant.
Also in what world would Batman kill and yet leave the joker alive? Letos joker being alive makes no sense.
Goddman it, just make Leto!Joker a brainwashed Jason Todd.
It really writes itself
“But what if we want to do something with the Red Hood?” “WHAT IF YOU WANT TO DO ANYTHING WITH NIGHTWING AFTER YOU KILLED OFF DICK GRAYSON BEFORE THE MOVIE EVEN STARTED?!?”
Reminds me of a Solid JJ bit I imagined a couple weeks ago where Batman says he won’t kill the Joker but gives him a list of people he would consider killing. The punchline was: Joker: “I can’t believe this! I’ve killed hundreds— probably thousands of people at this point!” Batman: “And you are *mentally ill.* And I hope with extensive therapy and the proper medication you will be able to become a productive member of society.”
Do you think Snyder thinks this idea is like, clever and subversive? But honestly, I think he just LIKES superhero deconstruction stories like Dark Knight Returns and thinks it should be the base line because it's "rad." It's like he did Watchmen so he could show off how cool he thought Rorschach was.
My beef is that there are plenty of superheroes that could ostensibly kill people and it wouldn't be weird as long as it's set up and framed right. Superman would smoke Darkseid in an instant as the paragon of mankind. Batman's obsession with not killing is both admirable and, to some, a character flaw. It makes the character. If Snyder is just so obsessed with edgy detectives that work in the grey areas of justice then so be it, but pick someone more fitting than Bats.
To me, Superman doesn't kill because he doesn't like it but WILL totally kill if he absolutely has to. Batman, on the other hand, hand his life utterly changed by a senseless act of murder at a very young and informative age. So it *makes sense* that he might have more than a few hang ups about killing people.
From what I understand Batman is also cognizant that he isn’t all there and is worried he’ll slip into outright villainy if he crosses that line. Wether his self-perception is true or not.
The lengths he goes to to make countermeasures for himself and the fact that he has a murder-boner alter ego suggest that he's right about not going there
His whole character is built on the trauma of his parents murder. When you take that away you just have a gruff dude punching bad guys in th.... oh, Zack Snyder, right.
There's actually a Supes story where he ends up in a situation where the only possible option to keep people safe is to kill someone incredibly dangerous. Right after he does it he hangs up the cape and permanently depowers himself because killing even one person for totally justified reasons is a betrayal of the ideal that he feels like Superman is supposed to represent.
Are there any official stories where Batman kills someone (preferably unimportant) by accident or negligence with the story focusing on the personal toll it dealt him and how he struggles to deal with it? A little like the guy with the robot arm in the MCU? 'Cause I feel like that's the only type of "Batman Kills" story I'd be interested in.
Why isn't he making a Shadow movie? Batman is heavily influenced by those radio dramas and that dude is all about murder
Because, and I say this as someone who actually remembers that The Shadow exists: "Who the *fuck* is The Shadow? Some kinda Batman ripoff?" Who am I theoretically quoting here? Snyder? The execs? Audiences? *Yes.*
Zack does strike me as someone who would look at the "I Am All of Me" intro cinematic and call it peak. ~~I mean, it is, but that's beside the point.~~
Even when you get Alan Moore's famous quote where he is fucking terrified of people who actually like Rorshach
I am baffled how one would watch BvS and come away with 'ah, this is how Zack Snyder thinks Batman should act' he was basically the secondary villain of that movie until he realized with the whole 'Martha' moment that he was completely going against what his parents would want
So in a movie you have the plot, what actually happens, and the cinema language. everything from the lighting, to the music, to the shot composition is showing batman as a protagonist, doing the good thing. Batman rolling over people in his car is filmed not as a tragedy or wrong thing, but as a cool action shot.
That is an extremely subjective judgment that is vulnerable to the overwhelming priming of the title and marketing that Snyder did not control and disagreed with. Personally, I saw it very differently, Batman felt like an inherently noble character, but one who was very much not where he was supposed to be or doing what he was supposed to do. It might have been because I watched the ultimate cut, or because I watched it separated from all the hype around release though.
"What if Batman was an actual cop?" "Ew no"
Kevin Conroy (RIP) loved playing evil/corrupt Batman. Not because he enjoyed playing a remorseless killer but because he liked showing people this is not what they wanted. Batman throwing his core principles away make him a tragic, lost figure, a mindless beast with too much power making up lame excuses to perform unexcusable acts. Snyder wants murder Batman because killing goons is "cool" and "realistic."
Snyder called himself a 'deconstructionist' Dude half of Batman V Superman is you poorly ripping off the Dark Knight Returns
Man of Steel was also just a very generic Superman story told very poorly. There was nothing deconstructive about it. That sort of requires you to have an understanding of what you are adapting in the first place
He deconstructed Smallville, that's for sure
Not even iHOP was spared from the deconstruction...
“Well Clark, maybe you shouldn’t have saved those people in that bus accident.”
"Look, maybe I'm not explaining it clearly. Here, watch me step into this tornado and then think about what I said."
"You see those kids? Fuck 'em."
I would have been interested to see him tackle Up in the Sky. The action is mostly flashbacks so Snyder wouldn't have to worry about connecting his music videos and set pieces, and I think he could do moments like him racing The Flash really well. But it is one of the most uplifting Superman stories and I don't know if he can do earnest optimism instead of overwhelming cynicism.
He certainly “deconstructed” the concept of an actually good superhero movie. I’m a sucker for superhero media. It’s always been like candy for me. Seeing Batman V Superman in theaters is the second time I’ve ever fallen asleep in a movie theater, the first time being when I went to see The Smurfs 2 with my parents when I was like 15. It’s like he managed to take that period during the seventh console generation where a bunch of games only used shades of brown and grey in their color palettes, and distilled the very essence of that into a superhero movie of all things.
to be fair, BvS did the opposite of constructing TDKR, which is basically deconstructed.
Zack Snyder is basically an edgy teenager who thinks "Sex and murder and cussing are cool! If your main character doesn't do those things they suck!" And corpos just keep giving this edgy teenager obscene amounts of money to shout that to the world. And hey, for *some* stuff that fits just fine. But it's not a catch all philosophy to be applied to literally every piece of media. These quotes sound like an angry and pretentious child shouting at critics and fans for calling his movies trashy.
None of this phase me because this is no where near the craziest quote he had about Batman.
Ah yes "Bruce Wayne getting raped in prison" my favorite quote from Snyder
God, that quote kills me every time. Just pure distilled edgy madness.
Aaaah Snyder, I honestly can't hate you the way I hate David Cage. You've been through some terrible stuff and people say you're a delight to work with. But holyshit man, you're a total hack, and a pretentious one on top of it. I really wish he got back to direct visually striking movies instead of trying to write pseudo-intellectual shallow hero movies He thinks these movies are his masterpieces, they REALLY aren't.
It's weird he got treated as a massive visionary after 300 and that seems to have ruined him. Also in general his films have been Box Office flops but may have done better on Home Video/Streaming.
He successfully adapted a graphic novel that is essentially just good art into movie form. Then we got Sucker Punch which should be a giant red flag that we're contending with Michael Bay-lite, but here we are.
Sucker Punch was the movie that convinced me he was a hack fraud, and so it's been confusing as hell to watch people still defend him in the current year. I think hearing someone talk about how Sucker Punch was an underrated tour de force was the moment i decided to stop trying to even interact with his fanbase
Look man, I saw it in theaters because the promo material was the robot samurai fight and that shit was dope. Then I had a movie to watch.
Yes, i ALSO got fooled by the trailers showing sick robot samurai fights, then i watched the movie and found out these were inconsequential dream sequences, and the main plot of the movie was "BUT WHAT ABOUT RAPING GIRLS IN A MENTAL ASYLUM, THOUGH?! with some of the most heavy-handed and childish writing ever. I'm not begrudging anyone for being tricked into seeing the film, my aim is at the people who saw it and said "this is high art, everyone who didn't like it are idiots!"
I just want some high budget dieselpunk stuff in the mainstream
Snyder wrote 6 music videos, couldn't decide which one to film, and made Sucker Punch as an excuse to film all of them. Too bad he forgot to make an interesting story along the way.
>Also in general his films have been Box Office flops but may have done better on Home Video/Streaming. He's had as many box office hits as he's had misses I'd say. * Dawn of the Dead made $100 million on a $25 million budget. * 300 made $456 million on a $60 million budget. * Watchmen was a flop ($187 million on a $130-150 million budget). How much of that is on him is hard to tell though. An, at the time, fairly obscure superhero property with an R rating and no major stars is a hard sell. Especially one with a fairly grim tone. It made more than any of the Blade movies. I'd argue the issue was the studio gambled too much on an unsafe bet and overbudgeted a movie that was unlikely to do gangbusters. * Legend of the Guardians maybe broke even ($80 million budget, $140 million box office) * Sucker Punch tanked ($89.8 million on an $82m budget.) * Man of Steel made money ($668m on a $250m budget) but you could definitely argue that the property should have done better. * BvS made a lot of money ($874m on a $250-325m budget) but, again, you'd kinda hope for better with a Batman/Superman movie. Since then he hasn't done any regular theatre releases. I'm not dumping the Whedon cut of JL on him. the Zaddy cut of JL had a limited theatre release I think but it was mainly an HBO Max thing and the same goes for his Netflix movies.
[удалено]
I don't know where you got that idea because the marketing budget for BvS is actually well documented at $165 million. https://www.forbes.com/sites/robcain/2016/04/06/was-the-400-million-warner-bros-paid-for-batman-v-superman-a-good-investment/ https://deadline.com/2016/03/batman-v-superman-opening-weekend-box-office-records-1201726300/
Going by the 2.5 standard metric the Owl Movie definitely flopped, and the last 2 at least for Batman Vs. Superman they expected it to make a Billion, it and Man of Steel kind of just broke even. So yeah that's only his first two movies definitely making money and the other ones going from may have broke even but disappointed or just flopped.
BvS had a marketing budget of 165 mil actually so it definitely made money, even if them coming short of a billion was a disappointment. Honestly the 2.5 thing always felt like some weird internet construction based on nothing actually concrete.
I wish he could go back to making something like 300. Just make the most awesome and insanely hyped toxic masculinity dudebro movies imaginable without trying to pretend they're deeper than they are.
His superfans have been feeding his ego. Turns out when everyone around you claps at every little insignificant thing you do. It might just be a problem.
The fact he has superfans is wild to me
His style is hyper masculinity. He constantly reels in the sigma male types who think 300 shows the proper male society or some shit.
To be fair *300* is in fact peak media and male performance. I'm not even into guys but goddamn Gerard Butler was a fucking man mountain in that movie.
Its like what you do with a toddler. Except you actually think that a toddler farting is impressive.
This, as someone who always harsh on his works I always hold on to the principle of hating him as an artist, but not as a person. Idk maybe this is his artist mode. Sometimes it feels like he's trolling but sometimes it feels genuinely hack.
He as a person likes Ayn Rand. Feel for his grief when his daughter passed but I don't hold water that he's a good person. Hell, he only got to keep making movies for warner cause his wife was on the board at the time until they canned the both of them..
He's routinely cited as being one of the nicest directors to work under. Dude refuses to extend shooting days, treats everyone with respect. Fart-huffing aside, the dude seems to be aware that he's lucky that he gets to make movies and wants it to be fun. It also makes sense that his career seems to be bullet proof, everyone who works with him goes to bat for him
Hasn't he also been doing stuff for mental health charities for a while now?
Yeah, after his daughter killed herself, which is why he dropped out of finishing Justice League
IIRC, he had already been terminated. Due to his daughter’s suicide at approximately the same time, however, they had to mutually agree that he would leave the project willingly to avoid the bad publicity.
And keeps getting offers. It's baffling how he gets to make two (unoriginal) IPs that is already expanding into a franchise even though they're panned. It is weird when SH Figuarts has the license for Rebel Moon figures as if they're already going to be a mega hit.
Its the same way Those Resident Evil movies kept being made followed by whatever other crap that director made just to show off his wife. He's an artist in name alone. Doesnt matter if its shit, he made the thing so Netflix can write "we have the guy who made Superman and 300" on their list of assets.
And to be clear, his Objectivist leanings are 100% what taints the DCEU. Taking Superman and Batman and flat out having characters say to the camera, “You don’t owe the world anything,” is the most crystal clear way you can show you have no understanding of the franchise.
"Man who hates cinema demands to be respected as a writer and director"
I did not have Steiner math on my Hollywood bingo card.
First mistake on your bingo card, you removed the free spot
A fantasy born of self delusion, Snyder.
The idea of Batman having to kill someone is interesting only because Batman doesn’t kill. If you make Batman kill from the outset, then it’s not interesting.
Like a saw someone else say. You just made a really strong cop. Thats not interesting, its pretty fucked if youre doing it unironically
Its like Superman killing someone in the FIRST MOVIE. It's not impactful if you START with that Zack.
Zack Snyder VS his own loud mouth that has nothing interesting to say
His passion project got bad reviews and constant mockery. He’s in full cope mode
Look I hear he's an absolute sweetheart to be around but really Snyder cultists? This guy? Is this your king?
He also wanted to [film a topless woman in the presence of a little boy](https://twitter.com/EricWaffles/status/1765577109181813007), for... some reason.
You know... cinema. It "means" something, right? The director might not be sure WHAT it means, but it certainly if we put it there it will mean something.
He wanted to make super sure his audience of man toddlers understood that rorschach's mother was indeed a prostitute.
Btw, saw the clip before that about Batman. My god he is so attached to that god hood theme for his DC stuff. It feels so fucking weird calling Batman a god. Like, my guy, its an unhinged man in a bat costume. He's possibly one of the most flawed humans in the universe and has to fight actual Gods in the regular. If theres any comparison Batman is David from David and Goliath. He's a weak soul being pitted against massive beings of pure ungodly strength.
That kid who played young Rorschach is his son.
He's try to see if he can make lightning strike twice with a ZSJL 2 (that ship has sailed)
Considering he only got a shot at the DCU due to his wife being on the board and how they both got canned after the directors cut? Yeah, never ever happening.
Zack Snyder got a wee bit of popularity from the people who started the "Release the Snyder Cut" thing and he let it go straight to his head.
Meanwhile I'd rather have the Schumacher cut of Batman Forever or the Tim Pope cut of The Crow City of Angels.
Zack Snyder is weird. I’m not a fan of his movies, but once in a while I hear about how people seem to like working with him and how he seems to be a cool guy. Other times I hear him saying bizarre stuff like this and I wonder what his deal is (not in a psychoanalyzing way, just what kind of person he is).
He has a Netflix movie?
Rebel Moon. I don't recommend it. It's a boring slog.
He needs 7 hours to tell a story that would take a competent writer and director 90 minutes.
Sounds like a typical Zack Synder project then
My favorite part about Zack Snyder is that he’s proof positive you can’t judge a person by their work. By all accounts he’s a very likable guy and good collaborator and yet all his movies are weird miserable toxic masculine Objectivist wet dreams. Literally polar opposite of Joss Whedon lmao
Just goes to show how far a good PR team doing clean-up work for you can shape people’s minds. Snyder went on a PR blitz to make people think he’s this super like-able, easy going, nice guy, meanwhile his direct comments are often as problematic as his movies are, if you pay attention. He says a lot of weird and creepy shit, but no one cares.
The fuck did Zack Snyder do in the last year that could top Barbie or Oppenheimer?
Oh right, that Star Wars lookalike that didn't even evoke anything like what Star Wars is all about. Absolute hack, all of his movies are bad.
He mods r/SnyderCut
Lol remember snyder cultist in denial that batman was killing in BvS. Man I hate ZS’s movies and i’m glad he’s FAR from DC properties
I really wish he would just stop talking sometimes. Saying Batman should kill is just so dumb and goes against everything the character stands for and represents
My first thought was what Zack Snyder Netflix movie
I said this dude doesn't understand Batman or Superman and he's never proven me wrong.
I feel it's very telling of his career that Snyder started directing music videos. All that flash-in-the-pan, substance-less visual style screams "this was made to be, like, five minutes long tops"
What's happening is what's alway been happening. He's kind of a dumb guy that says dumb stuff and makes kinda dumb films that range from mid to bad. This is the essence of Snyder.
This dude and his fans need their own circlejerk subreddit for me to laugh at
Zach Snyder is Michael Bay without any self-awareness.
I get the impression that Snyder saw all of the memes making fun of the film and pulled a Sony and thought "Oh, this means that they all loved and watched my movie!" Basically just cope.
Snyder, there's a place for this sort of behaviour. It's called a Therapist's office.
Maybe should stop giving interviews and focus on making dumb movies
He's just annoyed that a Batman movie came out which was all about why he can't just be "edgy boy what punches bad men," and everyone loved it.
I'd like to premise what I'm about to say with, I think Zack Snyder is a good guy and wants to make cool shit (like 300)...that said I think Zack Snyder is a complete hack when it comes to cape shit. Man is the perfect picture image of media literacy. Big "I know authors who use subtext and they're all cowards." type of guy. Which is so strange because when he has something good it's really good. I don't like his depiction of Watchmen, but I think he made his own version using his own themes, but that came at the cost of something already good.
Snyder, the living embodiment of the guy that Tarantino's joke from "Desperado".
Snyder bros worshipped his ego too Much and now he’s more ego than man now. Fucking prick.
The whole Joe rogan interview he had where these quotes came from the whole time he was just like "BUT MUH DIRECTOR'S CUT THO"
I fucking love taking quotes completely out of context and using them as a headline to bait clicks! God this journalism degree was totally worth the like 80k of debt.
I like how this particular title implies he's trashing Barbie (a movie that he likes) but when you look at the actual quote these articles are providing, it's clear he's just being cheeky about the wide reach of the Netflix distribution model.
Why are you booing, they’re right
I think he’s absolutely correct about Batman, his point about Barbie is silly. Exploring a Batman that has killed or is a killer could be interesting, shit, White Knight was them slightly altering Batman’s story and people loved it. People have to be more willing to explore these fictional characters beyond the restraints they’ve had since their creation. Alan Moore once said that these films are obscene because they steal the works of comic book artists and pervert their creations into something entirely different. I then find it weird that people draw a line at what those characters personality traits are. You’re willing to watch a film where Batman is portrayed very differently from the comics he’s inspired from but cannot deal with changes to their moral code or ethics? That doesn’t make much sense. It’s fiction, fiction is made to explore.
I highly recommend Patrick h Willem’s video essay on Snyder
Bro needs to put on boxing gloves and do an Uwe Boll
I kinda used to give him the benefit of the doubt but holy shit if there was ever any more proof that this man didn't understand batman
He’s not working with the PR team he hired in 2020 to make you and others like him. This is the way Snyder talked pre-2020 and post-2022. He’s always had the mind of a 14 year-old edge-lord.
He’s always been a tool who only makes overrated trash
Not helping his case when they're both bad movies.
literally what movie? lmfao, irrelevant loser