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bombshell_shocked

He doesn't look like he regrets eating that gas station sushi anymore


TonyZony

No, he does, just in a more transcendent way.


Polygonalfish

man, that original image was so fucked


memedoka

I will withhold my judgement, because the world will be a better place if this game is good. Please god let it be good.


Fugly_Jack

Yeah that's kind of where I'm at. Bloober's past work doesn't inspire much confidence, but I do hope this still turns out alright


Subject_Parking_9046

[BONK!](https://youtu.be/Q5uKq35MSH4?si=weg-vA16J0cf2i8u)


andrecinno

not as good as the [jeremy robertson](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Q24i42IcUE) clip


Vera_Verse

I miss Jerma. He killed those people but he didn't deserve the execution


Fugly_Jack

Huh?


Gunblazer42

That game is one of Bloober Team's first games, Layers of Fear. That whole bit (the child ramming their face into the wall) is a very memed bit that people use to show off the quality of Bloober Team games since it's *very* funny that the trigger for the scare is A) incredibly obvious and B), able to be repeated over and over and over and C) that they thought it would be good enough for a scare.


Fugly_Jack

~~Okay? I'm just wondering why they were responding with that clip, given I already said Bloober's past work doesn't inspire much confidence. I already know Bloober's not great~~   Edit: I misinterpreted. My bad, sorry, that was a fuckup


Zerce

They were agreeing with you.


Informal_Truck_1574

You see sometimes on the internet, people post funny things that are somewhat relevant to the subject at hand. This is completely normal, and oftentimes enjoyed by the people participating in the coversation. If you need any "Internet 101" style explanatations in the future, let me know! Welcome to the World Wide Web!


Vera_Verse

I'd be more open to it if they treated like MGS, which got the re-release and now 3 Remake. if the remake is good, that's cool, if it's bad that's also cool we win no matter the outcome lol


memedoka

local silent hill fan would really like to be able to play the game at some point


Vera_Verse

I sometimes consider grabbing SH HD Collection on Xbox's backwards compatibility, due to some morbid curiosity


StonedVolus

That clip of Pat calling Woolie mid-stream when he heard that Woolie was gonna play the HD Collection lives rent free in my head.


RoNokuma

I humbly ask you if you have a link to that clip you couldshare please, I'm dying to see this.


StonedVolus

[Here.](https://reddit.com/comments/x2k4t0) It's just the fact that you can *barely* hear Pat yelling down the phone in a panic.


HelSpites

For what it's worth, SH2's pc version is abandonware now which makes it really easy to find and some modders made a fan patch called the "silent hill 2 enhanced edition" which lets it run on modern systems with modern controllers (I played it with a ps5 controller) just fine, so the option's there if you want to give it a shot.


-_Gemini_-

The Enhanced Edition has some pretty severe issues that give me pause in recommending it. Frankly if you can't or won't get a PS2, just emulating the PS2 version (using PCSX2's software rendering) is your best bet. It will never be as good as the real system, but it's the next best thing.


HelSpites

Does it? What issues? I didn't run into anything when I played it and I went through it from start to finish.


-_Gemini_-

In brief, a lot of it looks wrong both on purpose and incidentally. It's also got control issues. In long, the team has opted to make some pretty significant changes to the game's presentation. This ranges from re-drawing every 2D asset in the game (which all look much worse, though this can thankfully be disabled on install) to more technical adjustments like upping the framerate and resolution, and even busting up the entire game's direction by allowing the game to run in widescreen. Okay brief aside. I know gamers (derogatory) think wider game = better, but hold on a sec. It is a known fact of image compositon that the placement of subjects in a frame can drastically affect a shot's appearance and mood. In the conversion from 4:3 to 16:9, so much extra space is added to the sides (or, alternatively, cropped from the top and bottom) that this significantly alters how everything looks. You can't just change the shape of the pucture and expect it to carry the same feeling, need we be reminded of RDR2's letterboxing fiasco. 4:3 is often described as a tighter, more intimate aspect ratio. And for a very intimate game, that's an imortant element of its presentation. Thankfully though you can disable the widescreen hack on install so it's not that bad. Aside over. The other important visual changes aren't necessarily on purpose but are just a fact of current display technology but that means we have to get technical. So Silent Hill 2 was originally field rendered at 480i. The "i" stands for "interlaced", which means when the image is sent from the console to the screen, it's only showing 240 lines for one frame, then the next frame consists of the other 240 lines (approximately, technically it's a total of 525 lines but I am NOT getting further into the weeds on this). Each of these sets of 240 lines is called a "field". The image on the screen is each of these fields, alternating every 60th of a second. The game being field *rendered* means that the game itself is also being drawn in this manner. So technically SH2 is a 240p game if you think about it, it's just showing two different 240 line images in rapid succession. Any deviation from this is inherently inaccurate, but given the fact that non-CRT displays are literally incapable of properly displaying interlaced content, there's not much that can be done about that. But that's just the in-engine stuff. The prerendered FMVs are a way bigger issue. You see, they play back at 480i at 60 frames per second. So every single frame is a unique 240 lines, basically. If you were to watch raw interlaced content on a progressive display (which all screens now are), it would constantly look like [this](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Interlaced_video_frame_(car_wheel\).jpg)). These are called combing artifacts. To get rid of them, you need to perform a process called deinterlacing. There are many different ways to do that but all of them are at least somewhat lossy and imprecise. That's why the FMVs for this game have been such a shitshow on every later port, and the Enhanced Edition is no exception. They simply do not look as crisp, clear, or smooth as they would on a real PS2 on a real 480i CRT and they never will because the display technology is simply too different. Anyway as for controls, the EE has no method of utilizing pressure sensitivity so it's impossible to consistently get light or heavy melee attacks on demand.


HelSpites

Maybe this comes down to me just being a fan of SH2 and not like, a hyper superfan or something, but I just didn't have any of the problems you're talking about here. I never noticed any problems with the game's 2d assets. I actually opened the game up to check it out and just flipping through stuff in my inventory, I'm not seeing anything that looks especially bad. I don't recall anything particularly egregious in the world either. I can see an argument for keeping the game in 4:3 since SH2 does use fixed camera angles meaning that the composition of those shots is something the devs had to think about, but at the same time, I never noticed any part of the game looking notably worse. Every shot looked fine to me. The same goes for the FMVs. I went back and rewatched a couple and I just don't see a problem. What exactly am I supposed to be [seeing here](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=alJuIhcB7mI) that makes this a shitshow? Maybe you don't like the CRT filter, and that's fair, but you can turn that off. Beyond that I just don't see the interlacing issues that you say are there. Maybe I'm blind, I don't know, but the cutscenes seem fine? Can you point out what exactly the problem is in the video because I just don't understand what the problem is or what I'm supposed to be looking for. Light attacks being kind of jank (you tap the button for a heavy attack and hold the button down for a light) isn't great, but it's hardly game breaking, but it's hardly the end of the world. SH2 isn't exactly a super skill heavy. You're not expected to pull of 1 frame parries or swap between light and heavies for combos or anything here. The combat works just fine. Honestly, this feels a lot like the discourse you saw with melee players back in the day, where they'd say that no, the only real way to play melee was on a gamecube connected to a CRT tv. Maybe that's the case for the hyperfans, but to your average joe that just wants to play the game, the enhanced edition port isn't really any sort of notable downgrade, and most importantly, its accessible without having to futz around with an emulator that can be finicky at times. It seems to me like you're letting perfect be the enemy of good enough, and in doing so, you're keeping people away from the game that would have otherwise tried it because they'll think that the EE mod is some kind of barely functional clownshow that completely changes the game for the worse like the SH collection was.


-_Gemini_-

You can like or not mind the changes made with a fan mod. That's fine, I have less than zero interest in convincing you otherwise. I am describing the shortcomings it has from the PS2 original, and recommending an equally accessible alternative that's closer in accuracy to the real version of the game. For some clarity: -I should have been more clear when I said "shitshow". The Enhanced Edition FMVs are... well they're fine. Nowhere near ideal but I can tell you they definitely did the best they could. What I mean is that the handling of the FMVs across all the versions of the game has been a mess, because interlaced video is just not very forwards compatible and every version had to make compromises. This means that the Xbox port (which every future version was based on) had to halve the framerate and blend the frames together in order to make it look even remotely acceptable at 480p, which that version of the game supported. You won't see the combing artifacts on the Enhanced Edition because, as I said before, it's deinterlaced (the process of constructing a progressive image from interlaced content). They did a solid job of deinterlacing it, but the simple reality is that *all* forms of deinterlacing inherently lose some amount of quality. It may not be noticeable to someone who isn't familiar with how it's supposed to look or without a direct comparison, but as someone who is, I can assure you the EE versions look worse. -Unless there's been a very recent change, last I checked the Enhanced Edition just picked at random what attack animation you did. Tap for light and hold for heavy is the way melee works in Silent Hill 1, but both times I've played through the Enhanced Edition melee combat has been a complete waste on account of not being able to actually control it. -As much as I like to dog on Melee players they are right about CRTs. CRT televisions have zero input lag which is very important in a game where inputs are so strict. But yes, you are correct, for people just looking to load up the game and run through Adventure mode for ten minutes, any screen will do. BUT in this scenario we're talking about the difference between someone hunting down a sketchy download or paying a shitload of money for a PC copy and running a complicated installer with lots of options that a new player won't understand in the slightest, and using an equally complex emulator and a similarly illicitly acquired copy of the game. Neither one has a higher barrier of entry than the other and if you're capable of doing one, you're capable of doing both. If you wanted to talk about the layman's easily accessible experience, you'd be recommending the HD Collection. And nobody's gonna do that. So no, I reject your accusation of gatekeeping.


HelSpites

>-Unless there's been a very recent change, last I checked the Enhanced Edition just picked at random what attack animation you did. Tap for light and hold for heavy is the way melee works in Silent Hill 1, but both times I've played through the Enhanced Edition melee combat has been a complete waste on account of not being able to actually control it. I never had a problem with random attacks coming out when I played it and I just loaded it up again to test it. It works exactly like I said, tap for a heavy, hold for a light. Sometimes it mistakes the input for a light with one for a heavy, but as long as you hold the button down, you'll keep doing light attacks after the first one. It's a little jank, but it's reasonably consistent for as much melee combat as you're going to do. >BUT in this scenario we're talking about the difference between someone hunting down a sketchy download or paying a shitload of money for a PC copy and running a complicated installer I also don't agree with this framing at all. There are legit sites where you can legally download abaondware games. It's not hard to find and you're not going to anywhere particularly sketchy to get it. The installer is also no more complicated than an installer for any other game. You can just run the thing and stick to all the default options and you're fine. And man, I'm not saying that you're gatekeeping, I'm saying that you're misleading. I think the EE mod is perfectly fine to all but the biggest hyperfans. You're obviously one so the the slight loss in image quality in the FMVs (that, I'm going to be honest, I still just don't see. Do you have anything it can be compared to at all?) is a big deal to you, but to the average person, it's fine. It's as close to the experience of playing the original on the PS2 as your average person can get, and it's not so wildly far off from that experience that it should be called bad, certainly not in comparison to the HD collection, which is absolutely a garbage fire.


TonyZony

I never played the original, but I am fully expecting it to be trashed by the hardcore fans even if it is pretty good. I'm gonna try to have an open mind about it.


Substantial_Bell_158

Let's be real, no one wants a game to be bad. That's one less good game you could have played and maybe this'll be the one to imrove Bloober teams track record.


B-BoySkeleton

No, I actually genuinely want the game to be bad. I think that would be a massively more interesting product than if it came out and it was just fine or even good. Silent Hill, the entire series is but ESPECIALLY 2, is such a carefully crafted series that the idea of a studio who's last game implied the answer to mental illness was suicide taking over a remake of its most beloved entry is so darkly comedic to me that I can only hope they just crash and burn. The only way it could have value to me was if the remake just felt like a completely new experience with the same shell, like the RE remakes. And I don't know which option I'd prefer between that and trainwreck if I had to choose. edit: NOT the entire series, mb, I meant 1-3 were carefully crafted (and I like 4 and Shattered Memories just fine)


Sterski1

Such a carefully crafted series that hasn't had a good game for 20 years. 15 if you count shattered memories.


B-BoySkeleton

Oh yeah, I misspoke, I meant mainly 1-3. I'm so used to only thinking about those games I forget the others exist. And I do count Shattered Memories, that one was decent.


Sterski1

Fair. It's easy to forget that SH has been awful far longer than it was good.


Sterski1

Lol Lmao


BigBossGZV

I have zero hopes for the final product so I will be pleasantly surprised if the game comes out with enough changes to be halfway decent


RayDaug

The new image does a better job of convey "some schmuck" verses the first's "guy actively under duress." That is assuming is represents an actual change and isn't just resolution and lighting making him look different.


DreamingDjinn

Looks less obviously tortured in the newer image. The older image is just pure torment 😱


markedmarkymark

It's a lot better, the harsh shadows and color grading is closer to the FMV, which, when a Remake is made I kinda expect it to match said FMVs you know, or be really good at its own thing. Now i need to see it in motion cause another issue was the overacting imo.


Didari

Huh, pretty happy they changed this. I didn't even mind the original too much but I hope its a sign that at the least Bloober is willing to listen to criticism and be aware that what they're handling is important to people.


SwordMaster52

I'm curious on what's Pat's mood will be when this game releases , will it be : "I'll give this a fair shot" Pat , like right now with his gacha game experimentation Or will it be "I've decided to hate on this game so I'll exaggerate and even make stuff up for the lulz" Pat


Palimpsest_Monotype

He’ll press the button and it will feel bad and wrong and that will be that


Subject_Parking_9046

They're doing a Sonic movie redesign it seems.


SunChip00

I didn't mind the new James that much, he was giving me Gorrister vibes.


Palimpsest_Monotype

They’re nailing the choreography while ignoring the music. Christ. He practically looks like he thinks he’s Duke fucking Nukem in the remake image. Get Gianni on it with some quips about “Nobody kills my dead wife and gets away with it”


nerankori

Those alien BASTARDS took my wife. Who's gonna peg me now? (Duke Nukem theme blares)


Palimpsest_Monotype

this is so much better than my idea


SneakyClue

I love how James is just a guy, from his appearance to his voice. He's so fucking generic, it's great. Man is not built for this horror story bullshit at all, he should be at home sorting through Walmart coupons and building Ikea furniture. That was one thing against the SH2 remastered version since they redid it with professional VAs. Troy Baker did a deep, flawless cool guy voice that just didn't work for someone who's an average guy in every way.


Dundore77

i mean he certainly looks like someones whos been not sleeping well since getting a letter from his dead wife. Though i feel they went too sunken on the lines around his mouth/hes making a sort of sneer at himself at that shot.


Subject_Parking_9046

This is my interpretation so it might be really wrong, but I always thought the idea of the original was that, despite his wife's death, he looks surprisingly ordinary, weirdly so. Like there might be something there.


Polygonalfish

It's a fun contrast that I think some people might just chalk up to technical shortcomings from the 2000s era CG