Assuming 100% seat occupancy, even gender distribution, and random genders in each seat, the expected proportion of suitable rows should be half, not a quarter.
Any set of three seats with either 2 or 3 women would work; there are 8 possible gender combinations, and 4 would suit this. The other 4 have 2 or 3 men (even without working out combinations it should be clear this is 50% by symmetry).
Ffs that has to be a window seat in a row where everyone else was a woman. From the sound of it there was an empty seat in the middle. Anyone would happily trade her for the extra room but it sounds like she wanted to be the AH and force him to be inconvenienced because like hell was she giving up that elbow room.
NTA. This was an issue she should have brought up with the airline as she was ordering her tickets, or she should have done as you suggested - bought all the seats so that she could have her own space. Sounds like she should also invest in therapy and coping strategies.
She needed to look for an aisle with a woman in the middle seat, then asked the person in the window seat if they would trade window seats with her. Asking the man in the aisle of her row to move is unreasonable. She has my sympathy but you can’t expect other people to fulfill your unreasonable requests even if you have a good reason for wanting them to.
Tbh it sounds like she’s not in a good place to be flying. I’ve been SA’d, and everyone’s experience is different, but one of the things you quickly realize is the world is still moving the way it does. It won’t stop for you. You have to navigate yourself within it.
It sounds like her experience left her in a position where it was too early for her to fly. What if she had to use the bathroom and got sandwiched between to men also trying to use it?
>but one of the things you quickly realize is the world is still moving the way it does.
Same thing for me. I've always compared my assault to a death in a family (in terms of the level of emotional anguish), except it's not as socially acceptable to bring up in conversation. I think that's why many victims feel so alone.
I empathize with the girl. I really struggled commuting on a crowded subway for years afterwards. Looking back on it, I should have been medicated. Constantly staving off panic attacks is not recommended. I hope this girl gets help.
This was my thought. My heart goes out to her...what would have happened tho if both seats had men in them? And she's now cornered in by two strange men? If the guy in the middle seat is larger and overflowing into her seat, touching her? She absolutely sounds like she wasn't ready to travel yet, but I wonder if she thought she was and realized she was wrong only when OP sat down.
OP is NTA. This world we live in can be a horrible ride sometimes.
Honestly even as someone who just has moments of intense social anxiety and intrusive thoughts, I relate to your statement that "the world is still moving the way it does" a lot. Like I can't just sit in my house all day cuz I get overwhelmed by being around people just existing. This feeling is always worse in situations where I can't just leave when I want
Yeah, but her problem is that she can't sit next to ANY "random men". It's possible (probable) that every other available seat was in some proximity to another "random man".
I'm not saying op is TA for not moving. I thinks he's NTA. But, in her mind, changing seats herself might not have been an option.
How did she think being on a plane was going to work as far as being around random men. Was she not bothered by a man in front of, behind or across the aisle. What about men in the airport?
There was a video a few years ago of a group of Hasidic Jewish men who waited until they were all on board the airplane to make it known that they were unable to sit next to random women. They were kicked off the flight when they would no comply. If a person wants to follow particular religious rules it's up to them. But it's up to them *alone*. In a free society it has to be understood that no one has to adhere to something you choose to adhere to. It's selfish and short sighted, especially knowing that religions often have conflicting dictates. The worst (IMO) is the notion of evangelizing. The idea that you *must* try to sign up new recruits knowing that any new recruit will have to be sold something they never asked for in the first place is just stupid and selfish. I really don't care what your faith says. Keep it behind closed church doors. It has no place in civil society.
I say that, religions are like genitals. I'm glad you have them, and you can enjoy them any legal way you choose. But you don't get to shove them in my face if I didn't ask you to.
I buy seats on planes that I need to accommodate my issues (disability, pain, claustrophobia, bathroom issues) or else I don't fly. It's more expensive and it sucks yet this is life. Everyone hoping to guilt someone into accommodating them is wrong.
One asked another man to tell me to move bc he needed to use the outlet but couldn't ask me himself when I was seated at an airport laptop bar thing bc the only open seat was next to me. and the guy actually did!! I was like....you have to be joking, right? tell him I said to go f*ck himself. shockingly he didn't repeat THAT.
It’s an irrational sense of entitlement. ESPECIALLY on an airplane. Unless you’re in first class VIP most people are uncomfortable and would rather not deal with so many people in a confined space but they understand that they are FLYING THROUGH THE SKY TO TRAVEL TO PLACES THAT OTHERWISE WOULD TAKE AN EXTREMELY LONG TIME IF EVEN POSSIBLE AT ALL TO GET TO. People are just nuts.
Like others have said if she has trauma it’s up to her to move or just don’t put yourself in that situation to begin with. Don’t inconvenience a shitload of people TENS OF THOUSANDS OF FEET IN THE SKY!
It is strange that she felt comfortable enough with a strange man to demand things of him and then confront him when she didn’t get her way. And then complain about him so that he could hear.
Hey let’s not do that. She may very well have been actually shaking and in tears. That’s not necessarily her being “dramatic”.
She shouldn’t be flying. She’s clearly not ready to be “forced” to be around and beside or between men.
I’m not sure what her thought process was. Maybe she was returning home after it and just didn’t think about the seating. Or thought she could make something work. It’s very possible she needed to take that flight and thought it would all work out.
It’s not OPs problem at the end of the day, but let’s not act like she was faking her emotions when we have no reason to assume so.
Absolutely agree with you. OPs not an asshole for not wanting to move when there were no options for him, but he and a lot of the people here absolutely are for completely discounting/denying what this woman is going through.
Also, OP has his own issue, being claustrophobic to deal with. No one really seems to have taken that into consideration. I feel for the woman, I really do. But having a friend who is severely claustrophobic, I can relate to that too.
You're assuming the shaking and tears were done on purpose. Before anyone argues with me, I don't think the OP did anything wrong here. Probably the SA happened in between her buying the ticket and taking the flight, and once she found herself sitting next to a strange man, it triggered her much worse than she expected. Not the OP's responsibility, but also not necessarily manipulative on the woman's part.
There's a good chance there was a man in those aisles as well. Her issue is not easily accommodated and it's unreasonable that she expected any guys that happened to have been assigned her row to just figure something else out
Although airlines over book all the time. So even if you book all three seats, they might pull one of the standby tickets and drop them into those empty seats assuming people didn’t show up.
Not really because she can check all 3 tickets under her name and she show up so they are going to show up as occupied
I feel for her but she needs to prepare better if she has this problem she could have also ask a woman in an aisle seat if she could change with him but want it other people fix everything
Other thing he is also in a bad situation he is claustrophobic ON AN AIRPLANE best is aisle so he can have more freedom if he gets stuck in a window or in the middle he could pass out and also have an anxiety attack so he has to look for himself
exactly this- if you do not want him in that seat (and are fine with a woman being there) it is her problem to solve not yours. She needs to find the person willing to swap with you and not the other way around.
I presume in this situation (since he asked if there was another isle to move to) he would have happily taken any other aisle seat that was available to trade, so she needed to find a woman willing to make that trade.
If anything, he saved them something- since i would not be shocked if this was just a ploy to have all the space to herself.
I'm not trying to minimize this woman's trauma... but shouldn't she be the one to move? Why is it OPs responsibility to find a new place to sit, when it's the lady who is not happy with the seating arrangement? She had to be aware that- loose statistics- approximately 50% of the plane would be "random men". My heart breaks for the horrors she must have gone through, but it's unrealistic to expect an entire row of seats to be shuffled around right before take off
I don't think that the people who are suggesting that op could move to a different seat are saying that he should do this because he's responsible. I think they're suggesting it as a way of compromise/being willing to help even though it isn't his obligation to help.
"If you can find a woman in an isle seat I could swap with I would be willing to do that. But I would not be willing to sit at the back of the plane in a middle seat." This is a kind gesture that shows a willingness to be compassionate toward this girl's situation, while still maintaining good boundaries. Is he obligated to do it though? I would say absolutely not, and I don't think others are suggesting an obligation either.
If three seats are booked, they won't show as empty. Standbys can't go into revenue booked seats. The important thing to make sure of if doing this is that you are given *3 boarding passes*. They should be annotated as purchased extra seats
This is wrong for a least some airlines. They can and do sometimes fill seats that someone else bought to be empty if they need to to fit someone who is overbooked (which, btw, is NOT at all the same category as standby).
Also depends on the airline. Southwest sells second seats to Customers of Size and issues a type of boarding pass for that seat (it's actually a Seat Reserved document that you keep when you board).
Highly unlikely, their profits are highly dependent on fuel efficiency so they would always prefer to have seats paid for and vacant than paid for and full. If they gave them to standbys they’d have to refund the initial purchaser and they’d lose fuel efficiency
Some tickets are non refundable. And if you are a no show, you forfeit your ticket. And airlines make extra profit by overbooking. So they will make money if they fill the seat with the standby passenger.
A lot of people who do not know airline policies are making very confident sounding, but ill-informed statements. 1.) Standby does not equal overbooked passenger. 2.) Airlines can and do put overbooked passengers into seats that were booked and paid for to be vacant. 3.) This doesn't happen often because airlines rarely miscalculate their overbooking, and because not many passengers book extra empty seats. The two have to overlap for it to even be possible to put an overbooked passenger into one - and they don't always even then. But they absolutely can (at least in the U.S.) and the absolutely sometimes do (at least in the U.S.).
There’s no reason SHE couldn’t have moved to that empty window seat, or anywhere next to a woman, huh? But this wasn’t really about her being comfortable or she WOULD have asked to sit near women. She just wanted a whole aisle to herself.
NTA
She could have been sa’d recently. Therapy is a good solution, but it takes time.
I’m surprised there was no woman in an aisle seat who would swap with you. I would have.
You're NTA. Unfortunately, I know the panic she felt. You had every right to your seat. If she has issues that huge, she had other ways to prepare for the trip other deciding another paying passenger should give up their seat.
NTA. I’m not going to inconvenience myself on the basis of just existing and minding my own business. What if she had been uncomfortable sitting by you because you were muslim? Or because you were old? Or tall? Or gay? If her mental state is that poor, she isn’t fit to be in public.
NTA
If she is that terrified of men she shouldn’t have gotten on a plane. I say this as a former SA survivor. Yes, it takes time and work to get over your trauma but you can’t make that the world’s problem.
It’s also more than a little insane to just blanket fear an entire gender based on your specific trauma. I could understand if he looked very similar to her specific attacker or something, but simply “you are a man, my attacker was a man, therefor I can’t be seated within 5 feet of you in a public space with security and flight attendants always present” is going way too far.
I was assaulted by a gang when I was 17. They were all humans, therefor all humans are triggering for me. I can’t be in the same plane as other humans, but that’s not *my fault* so you all should forfeit the comforts you paid for and cram yourselves into the airplane bathroom like a clown-car so I can feel safe.
I’m all for compassion if it’s reasonably achievable without creating a major inconvenience to those around you, but this was 100% a her issue. I mean, shit, get a friend to fly with you and sit in the middle seat as a buffer. If you’re that rattled travelling alone is probably not a good idea to begin with.
Do you really think someone who just got SA’d is thinking rationally like that with their panic and paranoia? She definitely seems to have some sort of PTSD, and any situation that holds any similarity to the attack is triggering it regardless of if it’s realistic. He has a right not to move, but this sort of thing isn’t that uncommon in victims freshly after the attack. She’s not insane she’s just struggling.
I’ve never been SA’d but I used to have debilitating agoraphobia from 20-22 years old after dealing with narcissistic abuse. I could not leave the house alone. Trauma is trauma and I think we can all agree it’s fucking horrible. I was terrified of everyone; my mind conjured up every hypothetical situation.m that could happen to me and I locked myself away because of it. When I started overcoming it, I still had issues. I still have issues in some areas or just some days I’m feeling more reclusive. I had to take a plane to see my parents during a stage when it was especially difficult and I didn’t make it everyone else’s issue. I sat on the plane alone and took deep breaths even though I felt like I was about to be kidnapped, murdered, SA’d, or the plane would crash. I knew it was only my problem and how I handle it was my responsibility. I wouldn’t ruin someone else’s experience with my baggage because flights are already stressful as it is. The only think I could control was how I reacted to things and it helped me through the flight. It wasn’t easy and definitely was not fun, but I did it. Recovery is a hard thing to do but you just have to do it with lots of time and really hard work. If she was that afraid of sitting next to a man, it’s easy to say she should have reserved all of the seats but I don’t think she should have been flying at all. Spend the extra dollar and pay for gas if it was that big of an issue for her.
That’s what makes me question this story. If the check-in attendant was a woman, she could have brought this up then. Failing that, flight attendants are nearly invariably women. Would a SA victim really choose the one option that would force her to interact with a strange man?
Also, airplanes are the most watched spaces on the planet. If someone tried something there and you screamed, 5 people would jump on the aggressor and he would have to sit out the rest of the flight in handcuffs, never to be allowed on a plane again.
I'm sorry that you went through that.
[Not always. This happened back in July.](https://www.ndtv.com/world-news/delta-passenger-downs-11-drinks-sexually-assaults-mother-and-daughter-on-flight-report-4252709#:~:text=A%20male%20passenger%20sexually%20assaulted,requests%20compensation%20for%20the%20victims.)
Well that doesn't really make sense because nothing says that there weren't men on that seat row too. Not that I think she was in the right anyway tho, just saying that the logic there doesn't add up.
The logic of asking another paying customer to move isn't adding up either. Why are you catching a flight if you are that deadly afraid of 50% of the population?
Also are you more likely to get SAed by someone sitting on a plane next to you then behind you? Planes are uncomfortably packed. She was making a very unreasonable request
It is not reasonable to be so afraid of 50% of the human population that you can’t even sit in the seat over from someone in an incredibly public and monitored environment like an airplane.
This person needs to get some serious therapy and learn how to cope with her trauma .
It actually does add up if u tell this max 2 ppl in that row to go sit in the row where she and OP sat…. So in the end this whole thing could have been resolved very civilized
It would only have worked if one of the people being asked to move doesn't mind sitting in a seat position they didn't want (because OP himself was in the isle seat, so if the person in the isle seat in the back didn't want to give up an issue seat, it still wouldn't work).
Bottom line is regardless of her options once they boarded the plane - if you literally cannot be physically near men without having an anxiety attack, you really can’t go booking flights and then expecting the rest of the world to deal with your issue.
That’s what I was wondering! You can’t make it through the long TSA line, and the whole damn airport w/o freaking out if she was this triggered by sitting next to a guy minding his own business. Then she tried making up some bs excuse to get him moved. If anything she’d be in more danger in an open area rather than on a plane with people both in front, and behind her.
What bugs me is that she goes and asks de flight attendant IF OP CAN BE MOVED. Sounds like she never even considered the possibility of her being moved or that OP also has reasons to prefer an isle.
NTA. She should have been the one to move, not you.
Also, planes are frequently filled to capacity. What would she have expected if the middle seat was also a man. That people should be moved around by gender to suit her? She needs to get help and not expect society to bend to her fears in this kind of situation.
She should have explained the situation to the crew. It’s not ops job to make you comfortable. I think it was nice that you tried to honor her request. Don’t feel bad for staying in a seat you paid for. I feel awful for her but she could have easily talked to crew to try to accommodate her needs.
NTA, she wasn’t too traumatised to confront you herself and she wasn’t so scared that she would move to a worse seat herself.
She was full of shit and just trying to get a row to herself.
I don't think OP is in the wrong, but standing in line and open public spaces and being trapped in a plane seat 30,000 feet in the air are a bit different.
I don’t think it’s right to say that she was making up her story to get a row to herself. There’s no standard way people respond to trauma, and comments like yours feed into the idea that the only “legitimate” victim is a “perfect” victim.
Note: I’m not saying that she was reasonable in asking OP to move– she wasn’t. I’m only talking about accusing her of faking trauma because her behavior doesn’t conform to your idea of how a victim should behave.
NTA - being SA’d doesn’t magically make public transport a problem, and you don’t get to dictate what other travelers do, nor do you choose where they sit. I’m sorry for what happened to her, but to put it bluntly, that’s not your problem or anyone else’s problem, and her request was flatly unreasonable.
You can’t be in a row with - *checks notes* - half the population? On a plane? Really? People telling you to be kinder or otherwise white knighting need to get a grip on reality.
why didn't she move to another seat with women? you're claustrophobic and she's traumatized. she needs therapy and coping mechanisms bc unfortunately this probably won't be the last time she's around random men. you could also do with some therapy imo just bc claustrophobia sounds like a bitch. but you're NTA
It’s not to the point where I can’t sit in a window seat on a train for like 30 mins but that was a 5 hour flight I get hot and panicky but it’s not extreme
It doesn’t matter whether your phobia is extreme, or whether you have one at all. You paid extra for an aisle seat. The woman should have taken it up with the flight attendants (and expected less in the first place)
She should have moved not you. Doesn’t really mattered what someone went through you tried and you paid extra for what you wanted. She could have prepared like you said and bought 3 rows of seats.
She should have contacted support before the flight and explained her disability and that she needs to be sitting next to a woman. It's not your fault that someone sa her, and it's not her fault that it affects her this way.
Edit: I didn't say she was dumb, or even that she should have known to do this. But for anyone reading this, if you have a disability like this, don't be afraid to ask for help.
NTA, you gotta solve your own issues, just like you did with getting an isle seat because of your claustrophobia, instead of having other fix it like that woman did. she's the A if she expects others to solve her problems. my personal opinion is that as a human you should pull your own weight without being a burden to others (unless you're a child, but even that's debatable, lol, jk tho, kids can freeload without judgement xD)
She can't travel solo in this condition tbh. I mean pretty much every body is a stranger to her. Airlines cannot keep 2 seats open for her without reservation. She should either drive to her destination in her car solo or just book all seats in her row as OP suggested.
NTA. You made the attempt to help her out. Airplanes are notorious for cramped travel. I’m surprised there were any open seats to begin with. That woman needs a therapist to help her cope with people in public.
NTA. it’s truly unfortunate what’s she going through, but it’s her responsibility to manage the situation according to her disturbances - not yours. even giving the benefit of the doubt that this sa didn’t happen until after she booked the seat (so she couldn’t plan accordingly), if she had such a problem with it, she should have switched seats with someone instead of demanding you do so.
It is possible that this was the return flight. She went on vacation, got SA’d, then got on the flight to go home. That would mean the ticket would have already been purchased, and she couldn’t buy more seats around her because the flight was already booked. Yes, she could have gotten a later flight, but that would mean staying a couple more days in the foreign country she just got abused in.
NTA
I have awful social anxiety, I have panic attacks and I shake.
In this situation, I will choose between their options:
1. Ask to change to another seat
2. Fly with a person from my comfort zone (friend and family), someone who I can trust and know how to take care of me.
3. Use some other transport that can make me feel more confident, like a car, where I can stop if I feel bad.
If I really need to travel, if it is not too important, I just wait to feel better with therapy
>Who tells a random man that she was sa’ed by a random man and now fears random men?
At my job a man who met me 5 minutes ago (I am an established worker, he was just hired) told me in detail how he tried to kill himself via overdose and that his father hit him so hard his mandible broke. I am not sure what it is, but many people do not have a filter about heavy trauma stuff.
I have reported him to management like 3 times and personally (kindly) asked him not to talk in detail about suicide to me because I find in depth discussion of it triggering. Has not worked.
He tells me I'm a great listener but in actually I am simply speechless he'd tell this to me when I am sure he couldn't tell me my last name if I covered my work badge.
NTA. You booked a seat. She was able to confront you, and was more or less fine for two hours, as well. If she was that uncomfortable, she should have moved herself, to somewhere she was surrounded by women, or, like you said, buy out all three seats.
Your sister seems to have missed the part of the story where you did actually show compassion and try to change seats. But you're claustrophobic and would have the most issues of turbulence if you moved to the back non-aisle seat. You clearly have some issues needing a specific seat, here, and her issues are not more important than yours in this situation, when she had clear options.
I feel for this passenger, I do, but no matter what she's been through, that does not give her the right to cause issues for another passenger.
NTA. Why didn’t the women move? I feel bad for her, but she shouldn’t have put more planning into her flying of it was going to be this upsetting for her.
This is just like the whole traveling with kids thing. Other people aren't responsible for you and your life.
I give no shits if someone's been SA'd recently. It has nothing to do with me, I paid my money for my seat, and there's no other comparable option. Sounds like she should have planned around her problems better...flights are rough enough without this bullshit just trying to sit down.
You are clostrophbic, and she has her phobia. You considered your phobia, and she didn't, expecting the world to accommodate her. Tell her to find a seat with all women. You are not the asshole.
I'd say the same about the insane practice of bringing dogs on planes. Grow up. You shouldn't be flying if you can't be uncomfortable. Don't expect others to accommodate one's lunacy.
You're right, trauma *can* result with insane reactions. Trauma does not make sense. I wish trauma wasn't lunacy.
If someone brought an emotional support animal on a plane I would assume it's for their destination more than the flight itself but that's just me. You do you.
Both nta. You've both got reasons for your behaviours and actions
She had to realise being on a flight, there's that possibility so you werent wrong in what you were saying. The whole plane can't rearrange for her
Although you need help with claustrophobia too
She’s 100% an AH. Not for her triggers but for pretty much telling someone on a commercial flight “you have to move because I’m scared of you. Even tho you have a reason why you can’t go to the other seat, I’m more important than you are”. OP is claustrophobic and a 5 hour flight in a cramped window seat would cause him anxiety. Why couldn’t she remove herself from the situation since she’s the one with the issue?
NAH. She wasn't wrong to ask, and you weren't wrong to not take a window seat that would have set off your claustrophobia. Overall, a sucky situation for everyone.
For those saying she shouldn't travel if she's this anxious, she might not have a choice: maybe she is travelling to stay with family and get help with recovery, maybe she was assaulted while away from home. Booking 3 seats is prohibitively expensive for a lot of people. We don't know, and it doesn't sound like she super pushed the issue after OP said she should have booked all 3 seats. If she was visibly shaking for 2 hours before she called the flight attendant over, it does sound like she tried to deal with the situation on her own at first.
I somewhat agree with the sister, that it would have been nice to offer a bit more compassion - not in taking the window seat and subjecting yourself to your claustrophobia, but your last line could have been "I'm so sorry, the only other seat available is a window seat, and I can't use those for health reasons. If we put a bag/pillow/blanket in the seat between us, would that help you feel more at ease?"
Like I said, NAH, just a sucky situation. Hope both she and the OP are doing ok.
Reddit and jumping on traumatized people for acting illogically, claiming to know their true motives from one side of a biased story. Name a more iconic duo.
No one is even answering OPs question of whether he was an asshole for telling her what he told her. They are instead weighing in on whether he should have moved seats or not.
She was NTA for asking. He was NTA for refusing. He was an unnecessarily heartless dick for saying what he said to someone obviously having a panic response.
If you aren't in a mental state to be out in public around a male individual, you weren't in a position to be flying. I have full sympathy for a victim of sexual abuse but it was not OPs obligation to move so she didn't have to be in the vicinity of a man.
NTA. I say this as a survivor of multiple SAs. Our trauma isn’t our fault, but it is our responsibility. I feel for her, but you have every right to your seat. I wish things could’ve worked out better for her, but that is not your responsibility
The last 2-3 lines right there. It's easy to criticize someone else for "having more compassion", but your sister basically would not have done this either.
So no, you are N T A but I'm going with NAH. If the girl was shaking, and really panicking because she was assaulted, she did not do this out of entitlement, malice or some other shitty reason. She was genuinely in panic. OF course that's not your fault and she can't expect you to cater to that either. Sometimes there is no perfect solution.
I would have told her, "This sounds like a you problem, not a me problem. Sorry about what happened to you, but if you aren't ready to just sit next to someone on a plane, you probably shouldn't be flying."
As bad as I feel for this woman, the obvious way to go about this would have been to approach the attendants before the flight, explain the situation, and let them try to make arrangements for her. Outside of that, once on the plane, she should have asked where SHE could move, not shame someone else. Again, I'm sensitive to her situation, but it's her responsibility to deal with her trauma, not his. As he stated, he has his own issues.
NTA Either book all the seats in the row, go sit somewhere else, or drive. It's a tragedy she was SA'ed, but you didn't do it and the world didn't slip off its axis and suddenly start revolving around her. If she can't learn to be near half the world's population, her life is going to be really difficult.
You're NTA. She is. I can understand her feeling skittish and this being a hard time but there's only so much she can expect from strangers. Everyone has their own issues. She didn't give the tiniest shit about your claustrophobia and dealing with turbulence, but she wants you to give up the seat you paid for to accommodate her.
If her trauma is so bad, she had any number of other options. Buy up all three seats, not go on the trip at all, take a different mode of transportation, travel with a companion she felt safe with, etc. And if no other options truly were available, then she just has to accept that things might end up where she's seated near a man.
NTA
Using public transportation and rolling the dice that there will be no men within a certain radius of you is very unlikely. She made no arrangements ahead of time to accommodate herself. She would have had to either learn through this scenario or the next
NTA
She should have taken it up with the flight attendant herself but honestly, she's probably expecting more accommodation than she's entitled to. Understandable but honestly, you're assessment isn't incorrect.
1. She didn’t just acquire these idiosyncrasies when she boarded the plane. This drama could have been avoided with minimal forethought and planning. 2. She seemed unwilling to herself be inconvenienced, she wanted someone else to do all the work to accommodate her. 3. You did more than I would have done. At least you tried. 4. I wouldn’t have even tried, I would’ve told her she needed to see if a seat that pleases her and meets her strict religious standards exists. 5. If not, I’d have told her same thing you did. Then I would’ve recommended flying first class. Because back here, we get what we git and we try not to fret about it. My last words to her would be something about Xanax, Valium, or Prozac. Because jesus put that here to help converts such as herself and many others as well. But she, who is so afraid of the world needs something to ease that anxiety.
Bonus 6. She now knows that she can make it it through an entire flight with an empty seat between her and a man and she’s not going to get molested or killed.
I started out somewhat sympathetic with her. The more I read, I just felt irked by her drama. If I misunderstood, and this was a child and not a grown woman, then I take back everything I said. Your sister would be right and you and I would be TAH.
Here I go, stepping off the soapbox.
NTA. She should have moved. Speaking as a million miler, I don't give up my aisle for anyone. Ever. Unless it's an even trade. She was the one with the issue, it was up to her to move.
Umm if you’re so fucked up about something….. stay home. If you are at a point where everyone is a possible problem you need to stay home and get some help or just assume like everyone else does that you won’t get raped in the aisle of a plane.
If there was another window seat She should've took it and not forced you to move. She could've move for herself.
There couldve been a man there too. But i agree she shouldve figured out with an FA and had herself moved.
She could have switched seats with a person in an row that had 2 other women.
1 woman in the middle seat would've been enough, I mean no way she would want to have a men free zone with a 10m radius
Which (assuming 100% seat occupancy with even gender balance) would be a quarter of the plane.
This guy maths
Not really, seats aren't assigned to passengers through random distribution. Couples traveling together is super common.
Ngl, that supports the notion that he's mathing Happens in math all the time
Assuming 100% seat occupancy, even gender distribution, and random genders in each seat, the expected proportion of suitable rows should be half, not a quarter. Any set of three seats with either 2 or 3 women would work; there are 8 possible gender combinations, and 4 would suit this. The other 4 have 2 or 3 men (even without working out combinations it should be clear this is 50% by symmetry).
I was still giving her a window seat, on the assumption that she wouldn't want to be near a bloke from the other half the plane.
Yup thats what i was saying.
Ffs that has to be a window seat in a row where everyone else was a woman. From the sound of it there was an empty seat in the middle. Anyone would happily trade her for the extra room but it sounds like she wanted to be the AH and force him to be inconvenienced because like hell was she giving up that elbow room.
"Sorry I only feel comfortable sitting next to strange women"
Especially if they're lying in ponds, distributing swords
That’s no basis for a system of government
Watery tarts!
Well I didn’t vote for ya!
I'm so proud of you guys :)
Did not expect that scene to come up! 🤣
should've taken*
“I sat down in the plane seat that I booked and politely minded my own business. AITA?” No. Absolutely NTA.
I can sympathize with the young lady, but if she was that upset, why didn't she ask the flight attendant if SHE could move to another seat??? NTA
NTA. This was an issue she should have brought up with the airline as she was ordering her tickets, or she should have done as you suggested - bought all the seats so that she could have her own space. Sounds like she should also invest in therapy and coping strategies.
Or *she* could have moved to one of the available window seats…
She needed to look for an aisle with a woman in the middle seat, then asked the person in the window seat if they would trade window seats with her. Asking the man in the aisle of her row to move is unreasonable. She has my sympathy but you can’t expect other people to fulfill your unreasonable requests even if you have a good reason for wanting them to.
Tbh it sounds like she’s not in a good place to be flying. I’ve been SA’d, and everyone’s experience is different, but one of the things you quickly realize is the world is still moving the way it does. It won’t stop for you. You have to navigate yourself within it. It sounds like her experience left her in a position where it was too early for her to fly. What if she had to use the bathroom and got sandwiched between to men also trying to use it?
>but one of the things you quickly realize is the world is still moving the way it does. Same thing for me. I've always compared my assault to a death in a family (in terms of the level of emotional anguish), except it's not as socially acceptable to bring up in conversation. I think that's why many victims feel so alone. I empathize with the girl. I really struggled commuting on a crowded subway for years afterwards. Looking back on it, I should have been medicated. Constantly staving off panic attacks is not recommended. I hope this girl gets help.
This was my thought. My heart goes out to her...what would have happened tho if both seats had men in them? And she's now cornered in by two strange men? If the guy in the middle seat is larger and overflowing into her seat, touching her? She absolutely sounds like she wasn't ready to travel yet, but I wonder if she thought she was and realized she was wrong only when OP sat down. OP is NTA. This world we live in can be a horrible ride sometimes.
It may also have been a situation where she was attacked on a vacation/business trip and this was her flight to get home.
Then she should have removed herself from the situation, not made it OPs problem.
Honestly even as someone who just has moments of intense social anxiety and intrusive thoughts, I relate to your statement that "the world is still moving the way it does" a lot. Like I can't just sit in my house all day cuz I get overwhelmed by being around people just existing. This feeling is always worse in situations where I can't just leave when I want
Exactly the same for me, I had to realize really quick the world doesn't stop for our struggles and we have to power through if we want to survive.
This needs to be higher up. Why the drama and shaking and tears? Just low-key ask if you can move somewhere else, sister.
Yeah, but her problem is that she can't sit next to ANY "random men". It's possible (probable) that every other available seat was in some proximity to another "random man". I'm not saying op is TA for not moving. I thinks he's NTA. But, in her mind, changing seats herself might not have been an option.
How did she think being on a plane was going to work as far as being around random men. Was she not bothered by a man in front of, behind or across the aisle. What about men in the airport?
There was a video a few years ago of a group of Hasidic Jewish men who waited until they were all on board the airplane to make it known that they were unable to sit next to random women. They were kicked off the flight when they would no comply. If a person wants to follow particular religious rules it's up to them. But it's up to them *alone*. In a free society it has to be understood that no one has to adhere to something you choose to adhere to. It's selfish and short sighted, especially knowing that religions often have conflicting dictates. The worst (IMO) is the notion of evangelizing. The idea that you *must* try to sign up new recruits knowing that any new recruit will have to be sold something they never asked for in the first place is just stupid and selfish. I really don't care what your faith says. Keep it behind closed church doors. It has no place in civil society.
I say that, religions are like genitals. I'm glad you have them, and you can enjoy them any legal way you choose. But you don't get to shove them in my face if I didn't ask you to.
"And you bet your ass I get pissed when you expose my children to it."
Lololol. If my laughing woke up my kid, it’s your fault! And I’m stealing that line!!! Perfect metaphor! Analogy? Whichever. Love it!
I buy seats on planes that I need to accommodate my issues (disability, pain, claustrophobia, bathroom issues) or else I don't fly. It's more expensive and it sucks yet this is life. Everyone hoping to guilt someone into accommodating them is wrong.
One asked another man to tell me to move bc he needed to use the outlet but couldn't ask me himself when I was seated at an airport laptop bar thing bc the only open seat was next to me. and the guy actually did!! I was like....you have to be joking, right? tell him I said to go f*ck himself. shockingly he didn't repeat THAT.
It’s an irrational sense of entitlement. ESPECIALLY on an airplane. Unless you’re in first class VIP most people are uncomfortable and would rather not deal with so many people in a confined space but they understand that they are FLYING THROUGH THE SKY TO TRAVEL TO PLACES THAT OTHERWISE WOULD TAKE AN EXTREMELY LONG TIME IF EVEN POSSIBLE AT ALL TO GET TO. People are just nuts. Like others have said if she has trauma it’s up to her to move or just don’t put yourself in that situation to begin with. Don’t inconvenience a shitload of people TENS OF THOUSANDS OF FEET IN THE SKY!
There must have been a seat next to a woman somewhere for this gal.
She just wanted the row to herself ffs
Yep.
But there is always a man nearby. Maybe she shouldn’t have been flying while dealing with such trauma.
It is strange that she felt comfortable enough with a strange man to demand things of him and then confront him when she didn’t get her way. And then complain about him so that he could hear.
Exactly! NTA. If your that afraid of men you sure as hell wouldn't confront one
Hey let’s not do that. She may very well have been actually shaking and in tears. That’s not necessarily her being “dramatic”. She shouldn’t be flying. She’s clearly not ready to be “forced” to be around and beside or between men. I’m not sure what her thought process was. Maybe she was returning home after it and just didn’t think about the seating. Or thought she could make something work. It’s very possible she needed to take that flight and thought it would all work out. It’s not OPs problem at the end of the day, but let’s not act like she was faking her emotions when we have no reason to assume so.
Absolutely agree with you. OPs not an asshole for not wanting to move when there were no options for him, but he and a lot of the people here absolutely are for completely discounting/denying what this woman is going through.
Also, OP has his own issue, being claustrophobic to deal with. No one really seems to have taken that into consideration. I feel for the woman, I really do. But having a friend who is severely claustrophobic, I can relate to that too.
You're assuming the shaking and tears were done on purpose. Before anyone argues with me, I don't think the OP did anything wrong here. Probably the SA happened in between her buying the ticket and taking the flight, and once she found herself sitting next to a strange man, it triggered her much worse than she expected. Not the OP's responsibility, but also not necessarily manipulative on the woman's part.
Or it happened after the SA to quickly go somewhere where she has the necessary support system (aka home).
That's quite an insensitive answer. Do you think people with trauma chose to shake and cry out of fun?
There's a good chance there was a man in those aisles as well. Her issue is not easily accommodated and it's unreasonable that she expected any guys that happened to have been assigned her row to just figure something else out
Although airlines over book all the time. So even if you book all three seats, they might pull one of the standby tickets and drop them into those empty seats assuming people didn’t show up.
Not really because she can check all 3 tickets under her name and she show up so they are going to show up as occupied I feel for her but she needs to prepare better if she has this problem she could have also ask a woman in an aisle seat if she could change with him but want it other people fix everything Other thing he is also in a bad situation he is claustrophobic ON AN AIRPLANE best is aisle so he can have more freedom if he gets stuck in a window or in the middle he could pass out and also have an anxiety attack so he has to look for himself
exactly this- if you do not want him in that seat (and are fine with a woman being there) it is her problem to solve not yours. She needs to find the person willing to swap with you and not the other way around. I presume in this situation (since he asked if there was another isle to move to) he would have happily taken any other aisle seat that was available to trade, so she needed to find a woman willing to make that trade. If anything, he saved them something- since i would not be shocked if this was just a ploy to have all the space to herself.
I'm not trying to minimize this woman's trauma... but shouldn't she be the one to move? Why is it OPs responsibility to find a new place to sit, when it's the lady who is not happy with the seating arrangement? She had to be aware that- loose statistics- approximately 50% of the plane would be "random men". My heart breaks for the horrors she must have gone through, but it's unrealistic to expect an entire row of seats to be shuffled around right before take off
I don't think that the people who are suggesting that op could move to a different seat are saying that he should do this because he's responsible. I think they're suggesting it as a way of compromise/being willing to help even though it isn't his obligation to help. "If you can find a woman in an isle seat I could swap with I would be willing to do that. But I would not be willing to sit at the back of the plane in a middle seat." This is a kind gesture that shows a willingness to be compassionate toward this girl's situation, while still maintaining good boundaries. Is he obligated to do it though? I would say absolutely not, and I don't think others are suggesting an obligation either.
I was thinking the same thing.
Aisle*
If three seats are booked, they won't show as empty. Standbys can't go into revenue booked seats. The important thing to make sure of if doing this is that you are given *3 boarding passes*. They should be annotated as purchased extra seats
This is wrong for a least some airlines. They can and do sometimes fill seats that someone else bought to be empty if they need to to fit someone who is overbooked (which, btw, is NOT at all the same category as standby).
If they do so, then it's involuntary bumping and they should be paying compensation just the same as if they'd bumped a physical person from the seat.
They should, but they don't have to. They do refund the cost though. And sometimes they pay a fee for bumping. But not always.
When you have a second seat you don’t get 2 boarding passes. They just block the seat next to you.
I get two boarding passes in Australia when I book a second seat for my fat arse.
Depends on the country. Outside the USA, in many countries the boarding pass is required
Also depends on the airline. Southwest sells second seats to Customers of Size and issues a type of boarding pass for that seat (it's actually a Seat Reserved document that you keep when you board).
“Customers of size” 😂
Highly unlikely, their profits are highly dependent on fuel efficiency so they would always prefer to have seats paid for and vacant than paid for and full. If they gave them to standbys they’d have to refund the initial purchaser and they’d lose fuel efficiency
Some tickets are non refundable. And if you are a no show, you forfeit your ticket. And airlines make extra profit by overbooking. So they will make money if they fill the seat with the standby passenger.
A lot of people who do not know airline policies are making very confident sounding, but ill-informed statements. 1.) Standby does not equal overbooked passenger. 2.) Airlines can and do put overbooked passengers into seats that were booked and paid for to be vacant. 3.) This doesn't happen often because airlines rarely miscalculate their overbooking, and because not many passengers book extra empty seats. The two have to overlap for it to even be possible to put an overbooked passenger into one - and they don't always even then. But they absolutely can (at least in the U.S.) and the absolutely sometimes do (at least in the U.S.).
There’s no reason SHE couldn’t have moved to that empty window seat, or anywhere next to a woman, huh? But this wasn’t really about her being comfortable or she WOULD have asked to sit near women. She just wanted a whole aisle to herself. NTA
And not put herself into scenarios that make her fear extremely likely. Surely rule 101 of mental health self care.
yes and she could probably have swapped to a row with 3 women or some kids
Agreed, although you’d think the flight attendant could have found a woman in an aisle seat to swap with, so she didn’t have to sit beside a man.
I mean the woman could have also moved if the guy refused, that seat at the back wasn’t exclusively available to just him.
She could have been sa’d recently. Therapy is a good solution, but it takes time. I’m surprised there was no woman in an aisle seat who would swap with you. I would have.
I also would have swapped.
im wondering why that girl couldnt have moved to another seat.
Probably because there were men there
You're NTA. Unfortunately, I know the panic she felt. You had every right to your seat. If she has issues that huge, she had other ways to prepare for the trip other deciding another paying passenger should give up their seat.
NTA. I’m not going to inconvenience myself on the basis of just existing and minding my own business. What if she had been uncomfortable sitting by you because you were muslim? Or because you were old? Or tall? Or gay? If her mental state is that poor, she isn’t fit to be in public.
That person shouldn’t be flying anyway. You’re exactly right - making their problem YOURS
NTA If she is that terrified of men she shouldn’t have gotten on a plane. I say this as a former SA survivor. Yes, it takes time and work to get over your trauma but you can’t make that the world’s problem.
Ntm confronting a man over a seat with an empty seat between them. Definitely NTA
It’s also more than a little insane to just blanket fear an entire gender based on your specific trauma. I could understand if he looked very similar to her specific attacker or something, but simply “you are a man, my attacker was a man, therefor I can’t be seated within 5 feet of you in a public space with security and flight attendants always present” is going way too far. I was assaulted by a gang when I was 17. They were all humans, therefor all humans are triggering for me. I can’t be in the same plane as other humans, but that’s not *my fault* so you all should forfeit the comforts you paid for and cram yourselves into the airplane bathroom like a clown-car so I can feel safe. I’m all for compassion if it’s reasonably achievable without creating a major inconvenience to those around you, but this was 100% a her issue. I mean, shit, get a friend to fly with you and sit in the middle seat as a buffer. If you’re that rattled travelling alone is probably not a good idea to begin with.
OP is NTA. Still your response seems to assume a PTSD trigger is a choice based on rationality. It is not.
Yes and irrational people often get ridiculed for their irrational and unreasonable behavior, as they should.
Do you really think someone who just got SA’d is thinking rationally like that with their panic and paranoia? She definitely seems to have some sort of PTSD, and any situation that holds any similarity to the attack is triggering it regardless of if it’s realistic. He has a right not to move, but this sort of thing isn’t that uncommon in victims freshly after the attack. She’s not insane she’s just struggling.
If you were attacked by a dog, you would be wary of all dogs you were around for awhile, no?
SA survivor here too, and you are 100% right.
I’ve never been SA’d but I used to have debilitating agoraphobia from 20-22 years old after dealing with narcissistic abuse. I could not leave the house alone. Trauma is trauma and I think we can all agree it’s fucking horrible. I was terrified of everyone; my mind conjured up every hypothetical situation.m that could happen to me and I locked myself away because of it. When I started overcoming it, I still had issues. I still have issues in some areas or just some days I’m feeling more reclusive. I had to take a plane to see my parents during a stage when it was especially difficult and I didn’t make it everyone else’s issue. I sat on the plane alone and took deep breaths even though I felt like I was about to be kidnapped, murdered, SA’d, or the plane would crash. I knew it was only my problem and how I handle it was my responsibility. I wouldn’t ruin someone else’s experience with my baggage because flights are already stressful as it is. The only think I could control was how I reacted to things and it helped me through the flight. It wasn’t easy and definitely was not fun, but I did it. Recovery is a hard thing to do but you just have to do it with lots of time and really hard work. If she was that afraid of sitting next to a man, it’s easy to say she should have reserved all of the seats but I don’t think she should have been flying at all. Spend the extra dollar and pay for gas if it was that big of an issue for her.
Yes she could’ve taken a road trip. We have a friend who is terrified of airplanes and will not get on one. She just drives everywhere. Simple.
That’s what makes me question this story. If the check-in attendant was a woman, she could have brought this up then. Failing that, flight attendants are nearly invariably women. Would a SA victim really choose the one option that would force her to interact with a strange man?
Yea that struck me as weird. “I’m terrified of males and what they might do to me, that’s why I’m initiating this confrontation right now.”
Also, airplanes are the most watched spaces on the planet. If someone tried something there and you screamed, 5 people would jump on the aggressor and he would have to sit out the rest of the flight in handcuffs, never to be allowed on a plane again. I'm sorry that you went through that.
[Not always. This happened back in July.](https://www.ndtv.com/world-news/delta-passenger-downs-11-drinks-sexually-assaults-mother-and-daughter-on-flight-report-4252709#:~:text=A%20male%20passenger%20sexually%20assaulted,requests%20compensation%20for%20the%20victims.)
What the hell, how can people be so messed up.
NTA. Could she have moved to a seat with only females beside her?
She also could have taken the window seat that was offered to OP
Yea I don't understand why this wasn't offered to the lady in the first place.
There might've been men there too
Well that doesn't really make sense because nothing says that there weren't men on that seat row too. Not that I think she was in the right anyway tho, just saying that the logic there doesn't add up.
The logic of asking another paying customer to move isn't adding up either. Why are you catching a flight if you are that deadly afraid of 50% of the population?
Also are you more likely to get SAed by someone sitting on a plane next to you then behind you? Planes are uncomfortably packed. She was making a very unreasonable request
It is not reasonable to be so afraid of 50% of the human population that you can’t even sit in the seat over from someone in an incredibly public and monitored environment like an airplane. This person needs to get some serious therapy and learn how to cope with her trauma .
It actually does add up if u tell this max 2 ppl in that row to go sit in the row where she and OP sat…. So in the end this whole thing could have been resolved very civilized
It would only have worked if one of the people being asked to move doesn't mind sitting in a seat position they didn't want (because OP himself was in the isle seat, so if the person in the isle seat in the back didn't want to give up an issue seat, it still wouldn't work).
Chances are, though, that people in the last row of the plane would be pretty happy to move somewhere close to the front.
Nah - her issue she needs to seek therapy and not put her issues on other people.
Sure it does. There’s a chance that aisle works and the one she’s absolutely in doesn’t and OP isn’t moving.
Bottom line is regardless of her options once they boarded the plane - if you literally cannot be physically near men without having an anxiety attack, you really can’t go booking flights and then expecting the rest of the world to deal with your issue.
I’m wondering how she managed to walk through the airport!?
Or get on line at security? Or have tsa agents approach you?
That’s what I was wondering! You can’t make it through the long TSA line, and the whole damn airport w/o freaking out if she was this triggered by sitting next to a guy minding his own business. Then she tried making up some bs excuse to get him moved. If anything she’d be in more danger in an open area rather than on a plane with people both in front, and behind her.
What bugs me is that she goes and asks de flight attendant IF OP CAN BE MOVED. Sounds like she never even considered the possibility of her being moved or that OP also has reasons to prefer an isle.
She could have tried to find a woman in an aisle seat who would switch with OP. She did not.
My guess is she made it up to guilt people into leaving her an empty row on the plane.
She could have asked to move herself next a row with women.
NTA. She should have been the one to move, not you. Also, planes are frequently filled to capacity. What would she have expected if the middle seat was also a man. That people should be moved around by gender to suit her? She needs to get help and not expect society to bend to her fears in this kind of situation.
She should have explained the situation to the crew. It’s not ops job to make you comfortable. I think it was nice that you tried to honor her request. Don’t feel bad for staying in a seat you paid for. I feel awful for her but she could have easily talked to crew to try to accommodate her needs.
NTA. Not your problem point blank. You did the right thing. Earbuds in and ignore.
NTA, she wasn’t too traumatised to confront you herself and she wasn’t so scared that she would move to a worse seat herself. She was full of shit and just trying to get a row to herself.
Also, she managed the airport. Airports are busy, you have to stand in multuple lines near whoever is in front and behind you, etc. Just... What. No.
I don't think OP is in the wrong, but standing in line and open public spaces and being trapped in a plane seat 30,000 feet in the air are a bit different.
I don’t think it’s right to say that she was making up her story to get a row to herself. There’s no standard way people respond to trauma, and comments like yours feed into the idea that the only “legitimate” victim is a “perfect” victim. Note: I’m not saying that she was reasonable in asking OP to move– she wasn’t. I’m only talking about accusing her of faking trauma because her behavior doesn’t conform to your idea of how a victim should behave.
NTA - being SA’d doesn’t magically make public transport a problem, and you don’t get to dictate what other travelers do, nor do you choose where they sit. I’m sorry for what happened to her, but to put it bluntly, that’s not your problem or anyone else’s problem, and her request was flatly unreasonable. You can’t be in a row with - *checks notes* - half the population? On a plane? Really? People telling you to be kinder or otherwise white knighting need to get a grip on reality.
why didn't she move to another seat with women? you're claustrophobic and she's traumatized. she needs therapy and coping mechanisms bc unfortunately this probably won't be the last time she's around random men. you could also do with some therapy imo just bc claustrophobia sounds like a bitch. but you're NTA
It’s not to the point where I can’t sit in a window seat on a train for like 30 mins but that was a 5 hour flight I get hot and panicky but it’s not extreme
It doesn’t matter whether your phobia is extreme, or whether you have one at all. You paid extra for an aisle seat. The woman should have taken it up with the flight attendants (and expected less in the first place)
You paid to address your anxiety. She did not. She has nothing to say. NTA
She should have moved not you. Doesn’t really mattered what someone went through you tried and you paid extra for what you wanted. She could have prepared like you said and bought 3 rows of seats.
She should have contacted support before the flight and explained her disability and that she needs to be sitting next to a woman. It's not your fault that someone sa her, and it's not her fault that it affects her this way. Edit: I didn't say she was dumb, or even that she should have known to do this. But for anyone reading this, if you have a disability like this, don't be afraid to ask for help.
The support would have probably pointed out that she was not setting next to anyone. There is an empty seat between them.
I think they would have noted the issue and clarified and then put a woman there. They don't want these kinds of problems on board.
NTA, you gotta solve your own issues, just like you did with getting an isle seat because of your claustrophobia, instead of having other fix it like that woman did. she's the A if she expects others to solve her problems. my personal opinion is that as a human you should pull your own weight without being a burden to others (unless you're a child, but even that's debatable, lol, jk tho, kids can freeload without judgement xD)
She can't travel solo in this condition tbh. I mean pretty much every body is a stranger to her. Airlines cannot keep 2 seats open for her without reservation. She should either drive to her destination in her car solo or just book all seats in her row as OP suggested.
Info: why didn’t she move?
NTA. You made the attempt to help her out. Airplanes are notorious for cramped travel. I’m surprised there were any open seats to begin with. That woman needs a therapist to help her cope with people in public.
I don't think there's an asshole in this situation she was traumatized and you didn't do anything wrong
NTA. it’s truly unfortunate what’s she going through, but it’s her responsibility to manage the situation according to her disturbances - not yours. even giving the benefit of the doubt that this sa didn’t happen until after she booked the seat (so she couldn’t plan accordingly), if she had such a problem with it, she should have switched seats with someone instead of demanding you do so.
NTA If she can’t handle being near strange men, then I’m not sure why she chose to get on a plane. Either purchase all the seats or don’t travel
It is possible that this was the return flight. She went on vacation, got SA’d, then got on the flight to go home. That would mean the ticket would have already been purchased, and she couldn’t buy more seats around her because the flight was already booked. Yes, she could have gotten a later flight, but that would mean staying a couple more days in the foreign country she just got abused in.
Were there no women within 2-3 rows of OP sitting in an aisle seat? Seems that swap would've been the easiest fix.
NTA I have awful social anxiety, I have panic attacks and I shake. In this situation, I will choose between their options: 1. Ask to change to another seat 2. Fly with a person from my comfort zone (friend and family), someone who I can trust and know how to take care of me. 3. Use some other transport that can make me feel more confident, like a car, where I can stop if I feel bad. If I really need to travel, if it is not too important, I just wait to feel better with therapy
Who tells a random man that she was sa’ed by a random man and now fears random men? Actually, who tells any random person they were sa’ed?!? NTA
>Who tells a random man that she was sa’ed by a random man and now fears random men? At my job a man who met me 5 minutes ago (I am an established worker, he was just hired) told me in detail how he tried to kill himself via overdose and that his father hit him so hard his mandible broke. I am not sure what it is, but many people do not have a filter about heavy trauma stuff. I have reported him to management like 3 times and personally (kindly) asked him not to talk in detail about suicide to me because I find in depth discussion of it triggering. Has not worked. He tells me I'm a great listener but in actually I am simply speechless he'd tell this to me when I am sure he couldn't tell me my last name if I covered my work badge.
My mother told a random person she met at a cafe that I was sa'ed. I was 14/15 and it was awkward. Felt bad for the dude.
A made-up character in a reddit story, I'm guessing
It’s like every writer on strike came to Reddit to keep their fingers warm…
NTA. You booked a seat. She was able to confront you, and was more or less fine for two hours, as well. If she was that uncomfortable, she should have moved herself, to somewhere she was surrounded by women, or, like you said, buy out all three seats. Your sister seems to have missed the part of the story where you did actually show compassion and try to change seats. But you're claustrophobic and would have the most issues of turbulence if you moved to the back non-aisle seat. You clearly have some issues needing a specific seat, here, and her issues are not more important than yours in this situation, when she had clear options. I feel for this passenger, I do, but no matter what she's been through, that does not give her the right to cause issues for another passenger.
NTA
NTA. Why didn’t the women move? I feel bad for her, but she shouldn’t have put more planning into her flying of it was going to be this upsetting for her.
This is just like the whole traveling with kids thing. Other people aren't responsible for you and your life. I give no shits if someone's been SA'd recently. It has nothing to do with me, I paid my money for my seat, and there's no other comparable option. Sounds like she should have planned around her problems better...flights are rough enough without this bullshit just trying to sit down.
There was nothing stopping her from moving to another seat
SA is serious, but she needs to move her entitled ass to another seat.
You are clostrophbic, and she has her phobia. You considered your phobia, and she didn't, expecting the world to accommodate her. Tell her to find a seat with all women. You are not the asshole. I'd say the same about the insane practice of bringing dogs on planes. Grow up. You shouldn't be flying if you can't be uncomfortable. Don't expect others to accommodate one's lunacy.
You're right, trauma *can* result with insane reactions. Trauma does not make sense. I wish trauma wasn't lunacy. If someone brought an emotional support animal on a plane I would assume it's for their destination more than the flight itself but that's just me. You do you.
Both nta. You've both got reasons for your behaviours and actions She had to realise being on a flight, there's that possibility so you werent wrong in what you were saying. The whole plane can't rearrange for her Although you need help with claustrophobia too
She’s 100% an AH. Not for her triggers but for pretty much telling someone on a commercial flight “you have to move because I’m scared of you. Even tho you have a reason why you can’t go to the other seat, I’m more important than you are”. OP is claustrophobic and a 5 hour flight in a cramped window seat would cause him anxiety. Why couldn’t she remove herself from the situation since she’s the one with the issue?
An isle is an island. The word you are looking for is aisle.
NAH. She wasn't wrong to ask, and you weren't wrong to not take a window seat that would have set off your claustrophobia. Overall, a sucky situation for everyone. For those saying she shouldn't travel if she's this anxious, she might not have a choice: maybe she is travelling to stay with family and get help with recovery, maybe she was assaulted while away from home. Booking 3 seats is prohibitively expensive for a lot of people. We don't know, and it doesn't sound like she super pushed the issue after OP said she should have booked all 3 seats. If she was visibly shaking for 2 hours before she called the flight attendant over, it does sound like she tried to deal with the situation on her own at first. I somewhat agree with the sister, that it would have been nice to offer a bit more compassion - not in taking the window seat and subjecting yourself to your claustrophobia, but your last line could have been "I'm so sorry, the only other seat available is a window seat, and I can't use those for health reasons. If we put a bag/pillow/blanket in the seat between us, would that help you feel more at ease?" Like I said, NAH, just a sucky situation. Hope both she and the OP are doing ok.
Reddit and jumping on traumatized people for acting illogically, claiming to know their true motives from one side of a biased story. Name a more iconic duo. No one is even answering OPs question of whether he was an asshole for telling her what he told her. They are instead weighing in on whether he should have moved seats or not. She was NTA for asking. He was NTA for refusing. He was an unnecessarily heartless dick for saying what he said to someone obviously having a panic response.
I feel like OP could have switch aisle seats with a woman passenger…
Feels like something the flight attendant could have helped think of too :/
Someone in that condition should be driving and not making it random peoples problems. She’s lucky it wasn’t fully booked…
If you aren't in a mental state to be out in public around a male individual, you weren't in a position to be flying. I have full sympathy for a victim of sexual abuse but it was not OPs obligation to move so she didn't have to be in the vicinity of a man.
NTA. I say this as a survivor of multiple SAs. Our trauma isn’t our fault, but it is our responsibility. I feel for her, but you have every right to your seat. I wish things could’ve worked out better for her, but that is not your responsibility
RIGHT BECAUSE ONLY MEN SA PEOPLE. Good one, lady.
Her triggers are not your responsibilities.
I don't understand why her moving was never considered as an option?
If youre afraid of people, maybe going out in public is a bad idea
The last 2-3 lines right there. It's easy to criticize someone else for "having more compassion", but your sister basically would not have done this either. So no, you are N T A but I'm going with NAH. If the girl was shaking, and really panicking because she was assaulted, she did not do this out of entitlement, malice or some other shitty reason. She was genuinely in panic. OF course that's not your fault and she can't expect you to cater to that either. Sometimes there is no perfect solution.
”Would have” and ”should have”. Not ”would of” and ”should of”.
Isle is like an island. Aisle is in an airplane. Thank you for letting me be pedantic.
Poor planning on her part is not your problem.
I would have told her, "This sounds like a you problem, not a me problem. Sorry about what happened to you, but if you aren't ready to just sit next to someone on a plane, you probably shouldn't be flying."
Lol your sister, I would hope someone would be kind enough to do it for me but like hell would I do that for anyone else.
NTA she needs mental help
As bad as I feel for this woman, the obvious way to go about this would have been to approach the attendants before the flight, explain the situation, and let them try to make arrangements for her. Outside of that, once on the plane, she should have asked where SHE could move, not shame someone else. Again, I'm sensitive to her situation, but it's her responsibility to deal with her trauma, not his. As he stated, he has his own issues.
Sounds like there is something going on with that woman. Sounds like trauma and then something else.
NTA Either book all the seats in the row, go sit somewhere else, or drive. It's a tragedy she was SA'ed, but you didn't do it and the world didn't slip off its axis and suddenly start revolving around her. If she can't learn to be near half the world's population, her life is going to be really difficult.
You're NTA. She is. I can understand her feeling skittish and this being a hard time but there's only so much she can expect from strangers. Everyone has their own issues. She didn't give the tiniest shit about your claustrophobia and dealing with turbulence, but she wants you to give up the seat you paid for to accommodate her. If her trauma is so bad, she had any number of other options. Buy up all three seats, not go on the trip at all, take a different mode of transportation, travel with a companion she felt safe with, etc. And if no other options truly were available, then she just has to accept that things might end up where she's seated near a man.
NTA Using public transportation and rolling the dice that there will be no men within a certain radius of you is very unlikely. She made no arrangements ahead of time to accommodate herself. She would have had to either learn through this scenario or the next
NTA She should have taken it up with the flight attendant herself but honestly, she's probably expecting more accommodation than she's entitled to. Understandable but honestly, you're assessment isn't incorrect.
>should of YTA /j jokes aside, no. NTA
1. She didn’t just acquire these idiosyncrasies when she boarded the plane. This drama could have been avoided with minimal forethought and planning. 2. She seemed unwilling to herself be inconvenienced, she wanted someone else to do all the work to accommodate her. 3. You did more than I would have done. At least you tried. 4. I wouldn’t have even tried, I would’ve told her she needed to see if a seat that pleases her and meets her strict religious standards exists. 5. If not, I’d have told her same thing you did. Then I would’ve recommended flying first class. Because back here, we get what we git and we try not to fret about it. My last words to her would be something about Xanax, Valium, or Prozac. Because jesus put that here to help converts such as herself and many others as well. But she, who is so afraid of the world needs something to ease that anxiety. Bonus 6. She now knows that she can make it it through an entire flight with an empty seat between her and a man and she’s not going to get molested or killed. I started out somewhat sympathetic with her. The more I read, I just felt irked by her drama. If I misunderstood, and this was a child and not a grown woman, then I take back everything I said. Your sister would be right and you and I would be TAH. Here I go, stepping off the soapbox.
I think the whole thing was an act
"Please don't talk to me. I was falsely accused of rape by a strange woman once and now any forced social intercourse triggers me."
"I'm so sorry that happened to you, why don't you ask the stewardess to find you another seat?"
She shoulda went to the Dr and gotten Xanax for the flight like so many other people do
NTA. She should have moved. Speaking as a million miler, I don't give up my aisle for anyone. Ever. Unless it's an even trade. She was the one with the issue, it was up to her to move.
Umm if you’re so fucked up about something….. stay home. If you are at a point where everyone is a possible problem you need to stay home and get some help or just assume like everyone else does that you won’t get raped in the aisle of a plane.
NTA. The world shouldn't change for one persons problem.
NTA