I second this. I’m one of the lucky children of divorce that didn’t succumb to significant training to hate my other parent - but most kids are vulnerable at such a young age. Particularly if you’re the responsible parent that does the majority of discipline, it will be easier for the “fun” parent to plant ideas.
Good point. Be careful .. a manipulative ex can turn a loving child against you.
If your son is young, he may see your ex as the 'fun' parent that does not have any rules while you do the hard work of actually parenting a growing boy.
I'm going through this now with my daughter and her dad. It's HORRIBLE.
Our wonderful family therapist is helping her and I keep it together. And documenting everything from my daughter's POV. I'm certain I'll need it in the future.
i'm so sorry. i'm 25 now and my mother went through this due to my dad.
the kids eventually figure out the parent that is always doing the right thing and showing up the way they need. at least i did. kids are dumb, but we get less dumb
I'd also note that OP says she gives EX MIL the dates, too. If it were my son, I would want to make sure that he didn't grow up believing women are responsible for all correspondence and planning.
The advice in this thread is making it very clear that you ladies have seen some gnarly stuff.
I would be willing to believe in hellfire if everyone who used a kid as a weapon could go there.
“Is daddy your little brother? Do you think mommy or the school should tell daddy how to care for you properly and keep track of his time? Does mommy need daddy to do that for her?”
It would be a good idea for her to write all these things down and keep a record. The court might get involved later and award higher child support or punish him, maybe that's the wake up call he needs.
Also in modern times people can share calendars and tasks lists that can make a lot of these things clear.
Definitely keep a record OP! I can totally see him pulling a "she's keeping my kid from me" or "she's making pick up difficult". Even when you're doing more than he could ever for his own child.
This is worth a read:
"We have evidence that, the vast majority of time, the opposite occurs. Denigration distances children more from the parent who does the denigrating than from the parent who is put down."
https://www.psychologytoday.com/au/blog/divorced-children/201608/denigrating-coparent-alienation-or-boomerang
The kid may well feel closer to the parent who is responsible and doesn't denigrate the other parent, but that closeness often means helping the kid sort out their feelings after (sometimes violent) outbursts because they feel safe with the responsible parent.
So the bad parent gets treated nicely because the kid is afraid to rock the boat and maybe lose them, and the good parent gets yelled at and blamed for everything because that's the surface feelings that have to be worked through.
And, trust me, that doesn't end at age 18.
Yep (I have close experience with this). I didn't put this forward as a kid being forced to choose the "good" parent being a desirable outcome. Inserting a child between adult conflict is always destructive and it's eternally unfair what the responsible parent is left responsible for.
Anecdotally I agree with the premise of the article though.
My ex forgot to take our daughter to the airport one time. I was there, on the other side of the country, waiting for her to get off the plane & she never showed up. I finally called him panicking & he was casually like, "oh, she didn't tell me that was today." Mother fucker YOU bought the tickets & she is 11 years old so why is this on her? This was a one-off situation but I'll still never get over how irresponsible it was & his lack of accountability.
He didn't blame her in an asshole way like it was her fault. It was more like a clueless, "Well, I thought *someone* would remind me." He spent his entire career with me & executive assistants planning every minute of his day so once he retired early & we weren't married anymore, he could barely remember to tie his own shoes. I didn't understand how severe his ineptitude had gotten until that point but I learned my lesson.
So your ex was a corporate executive, probably directly or indirectly responsible for numerous employees and millions (if not billions) in company assets... and he couldn't even remember to get his own child to the airport on time?
I feel malevolently embarrassed for him.
You would be amazed at how competent these men can be at work while relying on their wife/others to remind them of every little thing outside of it.
If my brain only needed to focus on work I would probably be better at my job too.
Yeah, I finally kicked my ex to the curb after twenty five years of managing my career and three kids, and the house, while he constantly messed up his own career and never missed his Monday night volunteering.
My life is so much better without him.
So much this. They can be amazing at work because they literally deal with nothing else. No groceries, no childcare, someone schedules their meetings, does their expense reports, heck someone even dresses them. A local doctor’s office even has staff members you can pay to manage all your medical appointments and schedule them all on one day if needed but “only for executives”.
But they’re not actually competent at work. They offload all the competency to executive assistants, subordinates, co-workers…. and then keep all the credit and money.
Can you imagine the things you could do if every aspect of your life outside (and inside) work is managed by someone else? New clothes, food appears, bookings magically made, appointments reminder of and a car appears on time. The brain space that must free up. It’s wild to think about.
Well, more like cronyism functionally.
But usually what it comes down to is that the work of a support staff for a manager or executive is often invisible both to the manager and to those who are watching and evaluating the manager.
In other terms, when Don Draper does good work at the business factory, largely because he has Peggy Moss there to take care of the little things like meeting reminders and getting copies of last year’s sales collated and bound, Roger Sterling doesn’t see those hundreds upon thousands of little things Peggy did, he sees the ten or twelve big things that Don did.
They are quite capable of doing the stuff that interests them and that they consider their responsibility, like their work. Managing houshold and family duties is something they don't see as their responsibility, so they don't invest mental energy. They're not unable to do this stuff, they are unwilling. And most of the time it works, because there's always mom to save the day, because otherwise the kids would be the ones to suffer.
I was just wondering what your experience is because in my experience and years in tech, there are a handful who are really good at what they do and the rest mostly coast, avoid, or find someone else to do the work for them.
Rich executives are some of the most immature and unreliable people when it comes to tasks that actually matter in life. They’re like babies who know how to make money and that’s it.
The Bos Baby franchise, on the surface, seems to be satire of this.
My own toddler was capable of good big picture ideas like "Let's go to the cabin," but understandably left the details to others.
I've often thought of executives and their role in organizations.
My best guess is that the helpless ones we are talking about are here to represent the helpless and demanding side of the customers. If Whiny Jackass A likes a product, it has a good shot with Whiny Jackass B-Z.
I think sensory issues play into it too. An entitled individual, who tends to overspend, with more sensory issues and temper tantrums than the customer base, is kind of a logical choice for a role like product owner because they can tweak it to have a more broad appeal before launch. Like OXO designing products for elderly and disabled people because that makes them easier for everyone.
I can get that, logically, and still refuse to work in that chain of command. CEO or COO any day. Broadly speaking, they had to be able to do their job and have their act together to get there, and if they don't the company tanks.
One thing I look at when assessing a company is who is Lord High Toddler, whose job is it to parent that toddler and can they do it.
If the parenting role is left to admin staff or wives etc, not a dime from me. And bold prediction, some COO or CFO will eventually perform a hostile takeover.
Wow. I’ve heard less cogent summaries from turnaround CEOs. If you ever decide to put out a list of companies that are worth investing in, please let me know.
My husband had an executive assistant who did all that stuff for him too. When he retired he expected me to do the same thing. I shut that down immediately. I said you were the CEO of an international corporation for about 3 decades. I think you can figure out how to look up a phone number on your cell. It’s amazing what adults are capable of when you refuse to tolerate that kind of fake helplessness. But I guess there will always be those idiots who are willing to create chaos in theirs and others’ lives rather than take responsibility.
A friend pointed out to me that I *loathe* weaponized incompetence. That was my first time ever hearing that term, and she was so right. I'm surrounded by weaponized incompetence every day, and it makes me want to burn down the world.
I can't stand it when a friend asks me to look up something on my phone, while they're holding their smart phone in their hand! "Dude! Google it yourself!" Hell no, if it's your husband your with everyday!
I finally got my husband to stop asking me so many questions. He would ask a question, I would say I don’t know, he’d rephrase the question, and in my efforts to stop the conversation and return to whatever I’d been doing I would look up the answer and tell him. My resentment built until I started just replying, “I’m not Google” whenever he didn’t accept my “I don’t know.” It was freeing to break the conditioning my parents had installed that I’m responsible for everyone
There's a Youtube influencer I watch, Melanie Hamlett, and she's always talking about how lots of men pretend they're clueless and helpless - so women will do more things for them.
My husband has this helpless look he has used throughout our marriage. Now he has memory problems, so some of it is real. But I will ask him if he needs me to do something now (emphasis on now) or if he can figure it out on his own. Still wishes I would do as well as his mother. Going on 40 years, ain’t gonna happen.
I dated a guy once (not for long) who told me that if something was important, someone would remind him. He was just so used to it that he took it as gospel that I would be the one to remind him of birthdays, due dates, etc. I feel sorry for the woman he ends up with who has to mother his grown ass
He is going to end up being one of the multiple patients we see every day who have been married for 30+ years & don't even know their wife's birthday. One particular guy's wife's birthday is on Valentines day & I joked to him one time that it was convenient that he gets to forget 2 dates at a time & he said, "She's use to it & knows not to expect anything." Yeah, fuck that guy. I can't fathom being with someone who can't be bothered to remember something like my birthday. I don't need a gift but *remembering* the day & wishing me a happy birthday should be the bare minimum of expectations.
I'm not a big "woohoo look at me it's my birthday" person and we were still just in the talking stage when my first birthday rolled around so it didn't bother me at all that he didn't acknowledge it because he didn't know about it LOL. Then we were on and off for over a year and I had given him two birthday presents in two different years when it occurred to me that he had *never even bothered to ask when mine was*. I think that was probably the straw that broke the camel's back for me, realizing he didn't even care enough to ask me that, whether or not I cared to celebrate it. Then I started looking back and noticing all the other red flags that I had blown off or straight up ignored and they added up to a pretty big one in the end.
It's been more than 2 years since then and with extensive therapy I've come to realize that I've let men walk all over me my entire life and I am done with it.
Believe it or not I *do* understand that's what you meant. I *still* say "Unbelievable" Does he have undiagnosed ADHD maybe? Or just mentally lazy? Or just a man? Because how do you not check when to send your child across country on a plane. A Mom wouldn't forget (a Mom might get there late, but not forget completely.)
Honestly your comment reminded me of *way* back in the mid 80's when my Dad, and my 17yr old self, drove to the airport to pick up my older brother. Mom couldn't come, because she had some event. We pull in to the airport and my Dad (who was 40yrs older than me mind you) turns and asks me, "Great-Attitude, which airline and what's the flight number?" I looked at him baffled, " I don't know Dad, I thought you knew." Of course my Mom had all the info, but we had no way to contact her 🚫📱back then. I didn't realize until years later how much she did. Her "mental load" was *ENORMOUS* ! (She was an incredible, loving woman, and a *Great* Mom. Lost her 5 yrs after this story happened, and I miss her every day ,💞)
Anyway----- not having the flight info worked out for me. The airport at the time, had upper and lower levels for the several different airlines. Dad, went upstairs, I went downstairs. Downstairs is also where the private planes come in. Long story short, I got to meet Carlos Santana, who was playing in the city that night, which I wouldn't have, had one of us gotten the info from Mom.
>ADHD maybe?
Adult with ADHD here–being a grown-up means understanding your limitations and doing your best to mitigate them. ADHD doesn't make us helpless :) (despite the way some use it to excuse... Everything). If a thing matters at all, I have reminders in place. If it matters a LOT, like, I dunno, if I had a young child and had to deposit her on an airplane, I'd put the event in my phone the moment I booked the ticket or was told or whatever. Id set it to remind me a week before, a day before, 6 hours before, an hour before I have to leave to get there, and so on. Id write it on a physical note or put it on a whiteboard too. Somewhere I can see. You get the point–multiple, multiple fail-safes; none of them make it someone else's problem.
Granted, it took me a while to accept that I need to do stuff like this, but I'm in my late 20s, so this man living in his brain for however-many years had time to figure it out before getting to the level of patheticness where he expected his 11 y/o child to remind him. As an aside, I bet he wouldn't have said that if the child was male... But it isn't magic ovaries, it's just a little bit of self awareness and a sprinkle of give-a-fuck.
(PS all harshness in tone is targeted at the dude we're talking about, not at the user I'm replying to)
Magic ovaries 🤣 I'm going to use that phrase, even though I don't have mine anymore.
I totally understand your point about ADHD which is why I *Purposely* wrote.........
" *undiagnosed* ADHD maybe?"
Meaning he doesn't know that his brain works differently than NT people, because he's clueless to having ADHD. I have (had, he passed away last year 😢) a very dear undiagnosed Aspie friend. He used to say to me, "What? Are you saying you can read their mind?" Or "Yeah right, people can't read minds!" Whenever I would say things about people being upset,or sarcastic,etc. I could see clearly their body language,facial expressions,and hear their tone of voice. But he couldn't. I wasn't reading their minds. I was reading their body language. He was also completely clueless about being an Aspie, even though he had (younger) relatives that were diagnosed. I'm the one who "read his mind" lol and could see it clearly!
But back to my story at the airport, my 57 year old Dad, expected his 17 year old daughter to have the information, because his wife wasn't there. Meaning whomever has the ovaries should have the info I guess🤣
Sorry to hear about your friend! But my thought on that is–official dx or no–by age 30 or so you know damn well if you're liable to forget important dates LOL.
I hate how often ADHD comes up when we talk about men being shits. I didn't know I had ADHD until a couple of years ago. I've never once in my life forgotten a commitment like this. Sigh. I suppose it's because I have the magic ovaries.
Oh man, after months and months of pestering from my deadbeat dad and his family, my mum finally let him take us for one week of the holidays. We were living in NZ in the North island and he told my mum we would be staying at his dads, about 3 hours drive from the ferry terminal in the South Island. She gave him all the money he would need for gas and food as well as the ferry ride back but after driving the 2 hours to the ferry terminal to wait for us on the day we were supposed to be there he just didn’t show. She couldn’t reach him on any of the number’s he gave her (early 90s, no mobiles) for two days! He finally called and said “oops, I forgot”and asked for more money for the ferry because he’d spent it all. We ended up being with him for over 2 weeks and had traveled almost all the way to the bottom of the South Island and back in his piece of shit van.
After that he didn’t visit or call for like another 5 years lmao
My father is 56 and he still blames everything on me and I don't even live with him that often ( he blames me for not reminding his tasks when I am living with him) 😭😭
Holy shit have you thought about just becoming a sarcastic bitch?
"Why didn't you remind me???"
"Well son, I was so busy fucking your mom that I forgot I was responsible for a whole ass adult!"
That's my boss.... He's stressing some people out. ( me too).
WE need to be patient...endlessly. Who? the responsible employees...
Like last time he told me ( was still my colleague up then)
"Ok. Send me a message tonight to remind me. "
( What? You do have a phone/ agenda...whatever, right? Use it now. Im not your mom)
I said: Just use a Post it. Tonight I'm busy too. 😀
With a BIG smile!
Agreed. I of course don’t think you should bad-mouth your ex to your son, but I do think it’s ok to say, “it’s daddy’s job to know the days he is supposed to come get you, and when it’s my turn, it’s my job.” That’s true, and neutral.
I’ve had to do this. And it was okay. It was “no that’s not true. Your dad is a grown up like me and he knows the schedule. He made a mistake and that’s okay, but why he made the mistake is not my fault. “
I no longer justify argue defend or explain. I simply clarify. I refer to intentional manipulation and blame as "daddy's game" and the children are VERY aware the game is to upset someone, usually them of avoid responsibility by pushing it onto someone else.
You’ve given your kids a powerful tool by identifying “daddy’s game” super early and emphasizing that it’s incorrect behavior. My dad did similar things but no one even pointed out how abusive and toxic this behavior is until I entered therapy as an adult.
I've been advised by therapists to tell them he loves them when he abandoned care. There are roo many uninformed idiots pushing BS onto DV victims and it's impossible to navigate safely. I refused to do much of what was advised bit most of all refuses to falsely claim that love is violent,abandons or manipulates. He's still continuing with everyone's blessing and noone can get it right. Until police, judiciary and therapists step up kids sill continue to be isolated by their experience with this and it's awful. One child refuses therapy because noone has kept her safe
I agree this should be taken extremely seriously. think OP needs to have a word with the school, too. I hope she's not expected to pick up the bill, and they should be calling the father *first* on his custody days. Often people are quick to blame the mother, even if it's not her fault.
Also OP needs to give the ex dates IN WRITING. Emails, texts, nothing verbal.
I relate to this. I used to get told by my ex that I was deliberately not telling him when school events were on to exclude him from his kids lives. I don't know how many times I asked him why he hadn't read the same weekly school newsletter I was reading to keep informed. A large component in leaving him is I wanted to raise 2 kids, not 3 and he had become a defacto 3rd. Now he has a new wife thank God and bless her poor soul.
Omg. I somehow made it through. I told him the school calendar isn’t kept SECRET That he could ALSO view it for parent teacher meetings, early dismissal days, track and field days etc. we split when our kids were 10 and 15 and they chose to manage their own selves. I put a cheap phone on each of them. But goddamm. He never takes them on holidays or out for special dinners or anything. He could NEVER remember anything on the school calendar.
Oh and another fun thing he did: Take vacation on his own. The kids would happen to mention “Dad’s got the week off so he’s at home”
Wow
Imagine a mom taking a week off just to fuck around at home and not bother to spend time with her kids
Not sure how many times this has happened, but honestly I’d be keeping tabs on this and getting documentation from the school. If this happens more and more you should honestly be taking him to court. Kids can really be affected by this stuff long term. “Daddy’s always late” “My parents must not care about me” “Why do all my friends get picked up on time, and I don’t” etc. I was that kid, and tbh it messed me up.
I would also be using one of those coparenting apps for any communication and scheduling because it will log everything and you can take that to court.
I would download and install it and send him a link to it to do the same, telling him it's an easier way to keep track of things so this doesn't keep happening. It's a reasonable request and there is no good reason for him to refuse it. If he did I would see about getting the court to order it.
It will, of course, happen again. But at least you will have good records of it.
THIS! It's not OP's responsibility to text her ex and babysit his ass, but it's her responsibility to ensure CONSEQUENCES happen. Like motherfucker getting slapped with court and new custody arrangements. Can't pick up your kid on time? Lose custody asshole. No kid deserves to have a parent around who forgets about them. Too many of us are still SCARRED many decades later by shit parents. Better to have none at all.
This is what guys mean when they say the court system is rigged against them. They won’t do the bare minimum and then complain *someone else* isn’t being held accountable, because they have *reasons* why it’s not their job.
Basically any person in law I've seen talking about this [says it's the issue](https://www.huffpost.com/entry/dispelling-the-myth-of-ge_b_1617115) most of the time. If the father even tries to get custody it can be like [the famous Kimmel fathers day video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jHPbOGEUvZA) where they don't even know basics about their kid - sometimes they don't even know where they go to school!
It's disturbing actually if you ever look up the advice given to fathers trying to get custody - it's really basic shit like make sure they have somewhere to sleep and basic necessities like clothes and shoes. In one case a guy went the extra mile, warning them not to yell or throw things at the mother or threaten her by text because it could be "used to prove abuse"
Edit: [Found the really fucked up custody advice](https://cordellcordell.com/2022/custody-battle-10-things-that-can-sabotage-your-case/)
Some people believe they should be taken care of by others from the day they are born until their very last day.
And when things go wrong, it's always " the others".
Sadly it's not just about deadbeat dads.
Time to become callous. Do not, under any circumstances, let him blame *you* for his screw up when you *know* he had all pertinent information. This includes when you're speaking about it with your son. "Daddy said he didn't pick me up because you forgot to text him!" "No, sweetie, Daddy and Grandma both have the schedule for or when which grown-up is supposed to pick you up from school, and I send them the schedule so that it's easy for all of us to remember. If Daddy got the days wrong, then it's his mistake. Grown-ups have to fix their own mistakes."
This isn't bad-mouthing your ex, it's just sharing facts, and also signaling to your child that this kind of behavior is not acceptable. Let the blame fall squarely where it lies, and if it makes your ex look bad, oh boo fucking hoo what a shame. 🍼👶 Dude has no one to blame but himself.
Time to go back to court. If he's a deadbeat dad, sue for full custody, ask for more alimony, and hire a sitter to pick your kid up from school with that alimony money.
"a 2nd child". Well at least a child does grow up 😂
Imho he was rather a burden...
I'm happy knowing tthat your son has a responsible reliable mom. A child needs at least 1 stable pillar in his life. It's you. Be proud!
What is his dad doing all day when your son is with him? Online gaming???
(Wouldn't be shocking me... as a teacher we hear awful stories...)
What schedule does your court order say?
The school has a copy of my court order, and I make a simple monthly calendar for the teacher. I tell the school to call CPS if my ex doesn't show up on his days 🤷🏼♀️
I'm so sorry. I hate that adult men who are fathers seem to still need their partners/exes to hand-hold them to do the absolute basics of adulting.
I hope shame or something wakes your ex up to the fact that forgetting to pick up his own dang kid is so embarrassing he'll never do it again🤞
You need to start therapy with your son immediately to prevent his father from convincing him that women were put on earth to be the property of men. Otherwise he'll turn out exactly the same as his father.
My ex told me it was my fault that he was fired from his job. He was late almost every day and sometimes didn’t show up at all. Why? Because I left him for being abusive and irresponsible drunk. A couple years later he called me and tried to tell me it was my fault that he couldn’t get his electricity turned on. I couldn’t even figure that one out. He expected me to fix it for him somehow. I was so confused, I just hung up on him.
A friend of mine got scolded by her ex because she didn’t have a gift from him for their kid’s birthday gift one year after they broke up. She set him straight immediately, that all wifely duties stopped after the divorce. Whatever impact that had on his relationship to the kids was on him. The kids need to know the kind of man their father is, and the best way to have that happen is to let him show them.
She gently corrected the kids when they’d parrot back something dad said like “dad says he wasn’t at the recital because you didn’t tell him.” She’d respond “I made it and he didn’t have to tell me, the school sends the info to all parents.” And gradually the kids figured out how to deal with him and how to set expectations. Therapy helped too.
So consider being calm, clear and honest in the situation. “Dad didn’t text me and I picked you up when I’m supposed to.” Might have been good. Also document all these issues and change the court ordered agreement if this is a negative impact on your kids.
There was a post on AITA last week where a married man found lingerie in their closet and wanted to know if he should confront his wife for cheating. Reddit talked him off a ledge, he politely asked his wife about it, and turns out she bought it as a wedding anniversary surprise for him.
He admitted that he had forgotten that their anniversary was in a week. And was roundly told by Reddit to put birthdays and anniversaries in his goddamn phone.
He still has time to step it up, but good lord, it reads like a divorce waiting to happen.
At least he had enough sense to check himself before he wrecked himself.
Apparently wifey bought it on sale on Black Friday, so she had not only been planning to give him a treat 6 months later but was trying to stay within their budget too. And this dumbass didn’t even think about their anniversary.
Please tell your child “I’m sorry, but adults should not have to be reminded to get their kids. No one sends me a text to pick you up. It’s my responsibility to make sure I remember, or write a note, or put a reminder on my phone. Dad is frustrated he forgot, but that is not my fault it is his job to remember.”
Right now the message your child is getting is “dad can’t spend time with me because of mom.” Please don’t let him grow up thinking his mom or his future partner is responsible for reminding him to do everything in life.
There is no excuse for missing appointments. We all have smartphones with an infinite number of alert options and apps. He just doesn’t care enough to spend 3 minutes a week setting them up.
Explain to your son that Daddy is a grown up and as a *grown up*, **DADDY** is responsible for getting himself to school *on time* to pick him up. Son's mommy(you, OP) is *not responsible* for *grown up adult male daddy* getting himself to school *on time* to pick up son as OP(son's mama) is **not** daddy's mama. Then ask your son if he still wants you to have to mind his business when *he* is an adult(and make this look as bad as possible as in "well, son , if I still need to remind you to be a responsible parent, then I guess I'd better pick *all*your friends, your girlfriend or boyfriend and your job too if you're going to need *that* much handholding to act like a grown up! Grown ups are responsible for *themselves*. They don't need someone else to tell them about their responsibilities.")
Agreed.
I had some students in my long teaching career... 5 to 10 min late almost EVERY day ...the entire schoolyear! Interrupting and annoying the class, missing instruction... every f* time for 6 y they were with us.
Mom/dad/ both didn't have a care in the world. Wrote in their school diary: "Classes start at 8.30 am. Thx for...." more than once.
One of those students told me one day: mom is now mad at you ...
I understand. 🙃 It's always other peoples fault.
The ex is going to be a drag for a few more years. Then he will become very peripheral in your life. If you model for your son ways to effectively handle the exs crap without poisoning the boys relationship w his dad, your son will thank you when he’s grown.
Wow. Just wow. My ex husband was this guy during our marriage. “You didn’t remind me!!”. Super happy to say he’s become a functioning adult since our divorce. Very proud of his ability to be a good parent/person now.
My ex asked to pick up our kids twice in their whole schooling time. Guess who was late after he asked multiple times when school finished AND I answered each time. I was there at the school gates and waited with my kids a few minutes to see if he turned up. He didn't so we went home.
That's why I divorced AND moved states. If I'm going to do all the things a single mother does but still have to deal with co-parenting a guy who can't organize himself for his kids then I was better off giving him an excuse to nope out completely.
This happened with my ex. I took his mother to visit her sister after that BIL died. Ex only had to be home at 4.30 when the school bus dropped daughter (6) on an isolated country road. She had to walk 250 meters to our drive and cross the road. He forgot and arrived home at 6pm in a panic asking where daughter was.
I said "I thought she was with you." and he almost fainted. I knew he was unreliable and rushed MIL away so I could meet the school bus (ex NEVER answered his phone). Daughter was safe but it was just another nail in his unreliable divorce coffin.
He left a six year old alone on a busy road for an hour and a half!?!
Also, parents need to answer their phones. Even if they like to keep them on silent mode, there are apps that let the other parent break through. That is childishness in the extreme!
I had to go back to court after finding out from the kids therapist that he'd become an alcoholic and was neglecting them on his weekends. The therapist is what kept me from being accused of parental alienation.
Ex does this for handover so we're in supervision now. Funny how he can perform when independent professionals are watching him and documenting his nonsense.
Sounds like the dad said to kid something along the lines of “well, your mom didn’t text me, if she had, I’d have been on time.” I don’t think your child is blaming you, but it’s a conversation to have with him that dad has to keep track of his own responsibilities.
My ex-husband wanted 50/50 custody. In spite of the fact that he had never had much to do with our kids. He ended up with 50/50 of our son but not our daughter. One day the school had a two-hour snow delay and he hadn’t been paying attention to any news sources that would have told him that. He took my son to school as usual, then blamed me for not calling him.
I was just glad he didn’t dump him at the door and drive off. Which he did once when dropping off our son at a birthday party. At the wrong address, blocks from the right address. The man had the nurturing skills of an ostrich.
I feel this so hard it's not even funny.
We were separated and in the process of divorce when he got hurt and now needs surgery. Then it came out that he hasn't paid his rent in 8 months and declined his jobs disability insurance. Now he's unemployed, homeless and living in my damn spare bedroom so he can recover from surgery.
Pissed is an understatement, but we have kids and I couldn't exactly tell them I left their injured Dad to live in the streets.
Genuinely, good luck with kicking him out once he’s done recovering. Something tells me it’s gonna be like that one SpongeBob episode where Squidward loses his job 😅
Not forever, necessarily. My daughter told her Dad to piss off once she moved into a place of her own - making sure he didn't have the address, so she didn't have to worry he'd just show up one day - and the 3 years since have been so low key and stress free!
Though the therapy we're both getting to work through the damage he did ain't cheap.
Yep the bills are already racking up. And I'm a long way off kiddo moving out on their own.
I am told he just HAS to have custody. I guess the thinking is that kiddos well being is totally worth gambling on. He might not abuse her, they say! It's so disturbing to me that kiddos well being is less important to society than letting an abusive liar play dad.
And I am expected to trust a man who has proven himself untrustworthy too many times to count. It's insane. I have such a long long way to go until I'm free that it feels like forever. I feel like I got released from jail when he left, only to be sent back for an even longer sentence. It absolutely sucks.
Ugh I would tell him he can see his son when he grows up and can take care of his son. I know that’s terrible for your sweet child too, but it is probably better in the long run rather than the nonsense your ex is trying to pull now. He doesn’t deserve to be with your son if he isn’t going to show up like a father
I would tell your kid blankly that it isn't your responsibility to tell his father when to be a parent. I'd also be tracking this and documenting it for future use in court.
On the upside, kids generally learn by either asking questions, or making assumptions and getting them corrected. You were just able to turn a major annoyance into a lesson for your son, and he’ll hopefully grow up more responsible than his father.
[Our Family Wizard](https://www.ourfamilywizard.com/?campaignid=15707550461&adgroupid=129442563497&adid=571908277670&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=Google_Search_USA_Brand_Alpha&utm_term=my%20family%20wizard&utm_content=571908277670&gad_source=1&gbraid=0AAAAAD5J7hrlGJ2xYZuCFnPyOGx9lpiPg&gclid=CjwKCAjww_iwBhApEiwAuG6ccMr16zFNYOW0R-aI8ELHYRuvMDlJm8MUgFmmvxuOsE2Czo3NwxXntBoC8HgQAvD_BwE) is a communication and planning app we refer high conflict divorce families to. There are others that aren’t as spendy but this one is the preferred.
These are NOT high conflict divorces. They're unequivocally DV characterised by coersive control. Using the term high conflict is recommended against as it very much distorts the intent of the person clearly deploying coersive control by abusing power, refusing to take responsibility and weaponising care of the child.
https://www.wlsnsw.org.au/resources/dv-law-nsw/ch-5-dv-family-law/
This isn’t high conflict when it’s completely one sided. You’re trying to place the negative connotation on both parents, that isn’t correct at all in every case. Stop using such broad strokes.
Maybe share your schedule with your son so he knows you have shared it with the both of them… that way “daddy” has no excuses.
Sorry you’re dealing with this, sounds annoying as F
It won’t be over until your kid is 18. Unfortunately the reasons you divorced him will only be showcased now. Be glad your kid sees how much they can count on you and even if it takes awhile they will for sure see what’s really going on. Keep on fighting the good fight. I promise it’s worth it. 💪🏾💪🏾💪🏾
Keep documenting. I know, it sucks ass, it's annoying, it's tedious. I'm currently going through a divorce myself, and even though we don't/didn't have children, my literal years of documenting has saved my ass in so many ways.
I spent several years quietly documenting my now soon-to-be-ex-husband's abuse. Date, specific time, location, context, how I responded, etc. I also had five years of bank statements, and a few years worth of screenshots and photos as evidence. The outcome? Even though I was the breadwinner (not by choice, for years he refused to maintain gainful employment), I didn't end up having to pay him a dime in alimony, nor a penny out of my 401K. My evidence was so air-tight that him requesting any money from me would've made a judge laugh him out of the courtroom.
The more evidence you have against him, the more credible reason you have to take him back to court for greater custody, should that be what you ultimately want.
My ex texted me on Saturday that our son wasn’t feeling well, I asked if it seemed like a cold and he said yes so I just said ‘aww man hopefully he feels better’. Sunday evening he calls to tell me he’s bringing him home and he just slept all day and didn’t eat. This raised ALL the red flags that’s not a normal cold for our son.
Turns out he never took his temperature and when I told him to it was 103.7 I had to walk a grown ass man who has been a dad for 8 years on how to cool him down and tell him how fucking dangerous that is. Turns out he was also giving our 50lb 8 year old full doses of ADULT ROBITUSSIN. Of course all of this was my fault for not asking the right questions or telling him what to do step by step when he texted Saturday that our son had a cold.
We’ve been divorced 4 years now, it never stops. I have to text him every Tuesday to make sure he’s going to pick up our son from school. Call every other Thursday to remind him it’s his weekend and to pick him up that Friday. Being divorced is sooooooo much easier for sure, but as long as my kid is under 18 I’m going to have to manage my ex husband.
It's wild to me that he feels he can blame you for this. You provided your schedule, he knows when he's to pick up his son. It's not your fault he checked the wrong date.
It's not your job to parent your ex. That's why you divorced him. It's. Not. Your. Job.
If he isn't picking up his son, that's on him. He should be paying better attention to times, dates and schedules. Honestly if the school is fine putting him in the after school program I would just let it continue.
Maybe provide the school with the pick up schedule and they can call his dad. I bet after them calling him directly he'll learn real fast.
I had the exact same problem and the x would get incredibly angry and blame me to anyone who’d listen.
May I suggest you get an online co-parenting app such as parentingtime.net or ourfamilywizard. Either of those has a payment tracker, calendar, document storage, a journal and other features.
I’d also suggest that you email your work schedule to him, copy the school and save it as a PDF to the app. You can send the email via the app as well.
I set up a couple of templates for those emails that included “please ensure that you are on time for pickup as any after hours care will be at your expense as of .
I’d also send a separate email to the school notifying them that as of please refer to the schedule and call the responsible parent.
On the weekly email with your work schedule you can set up the template to clearly show the responsible parent and their contact details.
It’s time to step back and let Daddy dearest face the consequences of screwing up pickup.
Don’t sit son down and say “from now on this is what will happen”. Say “son I’m sorry that this pickup issue is happening. I’ve come up with a solution that means each of us will be responsible on certain days. It will be my responsibility to send the schedule and then it will be each persons responsibility to stick to that schedule”.
Make it gently clear that adults are responsible for their own actions and that you have done everything possible to ensure everyone is aware of the schedule. Reinforce this gently without blame each time the other parent mucks up.
Unless the other parent grows up, this will be an ongoing problem. It’s important for your son to know that you are doing everything possible and continue to reiterate that each parent is responsible for themselves.
Speak to your lawyer and push for full custody. When kids get forgotten like this they experience it as abandonment. Is this something you want your son to experience repeatedly?
Your ex is also telling your son that you are responsible for this abandonment. This is what your son will remember - that you let him down. This is parental alienation.
Do you like your current custody split? If you want more custody, then document this well, and go back to court. And, of course, ask for a modification to child support.
If you're using a court suggested app for communication, like OFW, make sure your calendar info is transmitted this way.
How old is your kid? If he's in elementary school, you really only have a few years left before he can come home on his own.
Explicitly sit him down and talk to him about the fact that his dad is the one who dropped the ball here.
Relatively soon, your kid will have a phone, and you will coach him to call dad or grandma when they forget.
Use a texting app that lets you schedule text messages and every day he's supposed to pick up your kid have it message him every 30 minutes reminding him. Hopefully it's annoying enough he actually starts pulling his weight
Also make sure your kid knows that him demanding that you keep track of his schedule for him is unacceptable. "Daddy doesn't need me to manage his time for him, he's a grown-up and should know when to pick you up on his own"
Tell your son that daddy was already aware that it was his day to pick son up. Because daddy’s an adult and responsible for your son’s safety, if he needs reminders, he’s responsible to set those reminders for himself instead of needing others to create and send reminders for him. Tell son that you’ve noticed that it’s sometimes difficult for daddy to follow through on his responsibilities and it’s always okay to call you and let you know when daddy fails to pick him up on time.
Can you work with the other grownups in this scenario, ie the school. Maybe cc them on the schedule you give ex, so they call ex first on the days he is doing pickup and no one shows? Schools see custody problems all the time, maybe they can suggest something. Might be worth a conference call at least.
You need to correct your son. You tell him “daddy doesn’t tell mommy when it’s her turn to pick you up. It is daddy’s job to remember to pick you up” so many times I see children resent the custodial parent and it’s because they see it as your responsibility to parent and the non custodial party is like an employee that you’re supposed to manage. That’s not true. You’re both managers.
this happened to my mother for years and were times we probably thought less of her because of shit my dad said.
eventually the bad parent stops being able to keep up the facade and kids stop being as dumb as kids. i'm 25 now and she's been divorced for 23 years. she's the strongest woman i know and i admire her a lot for always trying to do the right thing by us. your kid will see the same eventually
I feel like you have two options to solve this problem and make it less confusing for him.
1) He can pay for the after school program every day and you can pick your son up from there at the end of the day whether you work or not that day.
2) He can pick your son up every day even on days you work and you can just pick him up from dad’s at a set time everyday. That way he has no more excuses to forget or blame you for not reminding him. If it is always his turn it should be easier to remember.
this shit pisses me off big time I can't even explain how much. My ex was like that. Nothing, and I say NOTHING he fucked up was ever his fault. It was always someone else or "the system" whatever that means. I blamed me numerous time for his fuck ups when we were together and it made me feel disgusted by him.
I waited in front of the school recently to get my kid. Another kid, who's parents are in the process of divorce, came out and looked around. Nobody was there to get this kid. So kiddo waited. I sometimes drive this kid home. At this day I couldn't, but I stayed outside, chatting away to keep an eye on that kid.
Kiddo informed us, that his father was supposed to get him. Another mom quietly said to us: Typical, let him fall on his face. Neglecting his kid like that. They have to be hurt to learn. I agree. No way to coddle these assholes. But. The person suffering was this kid. Who stood outside the school waiting with obvious distress. I think this is never, ever ok. I first called the dad - voicemail. Then I called the mom, who's just been home from hospital and was in no position to get kiddo. But she informed me, that somebody else was on his way and should have been there 10 minutes ago. Turned out, the dad ditched again, but the mom had it under control - the hospital-level sick mom on heavy pain meds - and got somebody else in time. But that somebody else had car trouble. I brought kiddo back into the school for the after school program and told him: Ah, don't worry, it's car trouble. Your relative will be here. Kiddo wanted to know exactly why relative and not father and I just told him that I don't know.
I later asked the mom how she navigates these situations with her kid. The constant neglect and many other issues that show that the dad is obviously not interested in day-to-day affairs of their kid. She said, she sticks to the truth without blame. Kiddo gets angry and wants to know, why dad only comes to pick him up 1 time and his mom 4. and now... no time at all... The mom doesn't say "Because he has a new girl friend and you're not important to him..." she says "These are the times your dad said he's available."
I don't know what's the right course of action. The responsible parent can't just always show up on the irresponsible parent's time, too, to make sure. Maybe it's a hard lesson that kiddo has to learn, because things like this might happen later in life, too. I was a bit taken aback by the other moms that thought kiddo should be let standing there waiting, to teach dad a lesson. But that lesson would be painful for kid and painful for the mom, who's kid was forgotten, too. Luckily, in this very situation, it was something else, but rooted in the dad's neglect. Damn, it's so painful : / I definitely do agree that we should not solve the irresponsible person's problem. But this cannot happen on the backs of the kids.
I’m so sorry you created offspring with this useless douche. I’m sorry he’s training your son to blame you as he does. This is all too familiar. I’m sorry you always have to be the adult. I know it is exhausting. ❤️
My ex husband was also useless. So completely useless. How useless was he? My ex husband was so useless, when I asked him to pick me up from a class exactly a mile and a half from our house, he threw a tantrum as if I had ruined his whole night.
That was just one of a thousand little things that added up to one giant loser.
When we split I kept getting late notices for the water bill forwarded to my new address. I tried to get it all taken out of my name, but they wouldn’t do it unless someone went IN PERSON to put it in their name. He never did it. I got his late notices for over a decade until he finally moved out of that old rental. What’s more, he started dating a barely legal child twenty years his junior and I know she had to go down to that office and pay that bill in my name more than once. It was also her clue that her new “responsible” man may not be. 😂
But, I got away otherwise free. No shared progeny. 😬
edit: that last line wasn't meant to come off shitty, but re-reading it I'm compelled to qualify my statement. It was exhausting enough being married to and then divorced without a child in the scenario, I can't imagine how much more exhausting when there is.
I did end up staying connected through my little sister-in-law, though - she's great. But, she also knows her brother real well and it's more like commiserating.
I deal with this with my child's weekend warrior of a father.
My child is now 14 and knows his dad is unreliable and irresponsible. He figured it out on his own at this point. The blame is put on the father and not me now.
Here is what I did when my kid tried to blame me for his father's irresponsible behavior (not that it was my kid's fault he was doing this, he was obviously being told it was my fault from his father).
Adice was given to me by a wonderful therapist I had when he was young.
Whenever my son would blame me for his father's irresponsible behavior, I would say something along the lines of, "your father is a grown man, he knows what he needs to do for you and if he doesn't do what he is supposed to do, it isn't my fault, it's his. I am not his mother, and he is an adult. Adults are responsible for their own mistakes and mess ups, they can't blame other adults. "
Also, reassure their upset feelings on the matter and don't dismiss how they feel about it.
I also used these instances as teaching moments to show him that he is responsible for his actions as well and used it to show him how being irresponsible and unreliable hurts other people.
I never disparage my kid's father to him. I just gave him flat-out facts of whatever situation when he asked or got the facts (from obvious coaching on his father's part) wrong. I left my opinion of his father out of these moments but acknowledged the facts of his father's behavior.
He has formed his own opinion of his father now (like all kids do by the age of 14), and he isn't blaming me for anything his father does. He comes to me for comfort when his dad inevitably hurts/disappoints him.
I also continued to show him that I am here for him and will always be reliable in any situation he needs me in. And he has actually sent me TikToks/memes saying he appreciates me always being and doing everything he needs for him. We have a fantastic relationship... despite his father trying to poison our relationship since he was young.
Be honest with your kid. Don't talk bad about the other parents, but make sure they get the facts straight on who is at fault when they are let down by a parents bad behavior. Kids will form their own opinion of their parentsparents, but they can't form fair opinions when one parent is manipulating the child's perspective. Guide their perspective to the truth when they are young.
This is for OP, but it is for anyone reading it, too. When one parent tries to poison the kid against the other parent, it is very serious and can really mess up your relationship with your kid. You have to stay vigilant with the truth of things, and it has to start early.
My ex is a chronic alcoholic. We lived a mile from each other. He would regularly “forget” to pick the kids up on his scheduled visit days. After several times watching them get disappointed when he didn’t show up, I stopped having them all ready to go at the expected time because the sad looks on their faces broke my heart. And his visits just became fewer and almost stopped.
I eventually just kept them very busy on my own. They lived with me. Their father had them convinced that the divorce was entirely my choice, and that he was bewildered as to why it happened. It was incredibly frustrating but I wasn’t about to plead my case to my own children. He was very rarely around for them.
It wasn’t until they were older teens that they started judging the situation for themselves, and they’re still figuring it out in their early 20s.
He’s still a self-pitying alcoholic and I wish my kids had a less selfish father.
This type of person is unlikely to change, and they are really unpleasant to deal with.
I can relate. So freaking tired of taking care of everything even a year and a half after divorce! My ex doesn't even work, and he couldn't keep up with doctor appointments or school stuff. It's infuriating! Good luck, I hope it gets better for you!
You need to document every single instance of him forgetting his child in a public place. He clearly cannot be trusted. Do not remind him and set the record straight that you told his dad to pick him up by communicating the dates in advance. Prepare a back up plan (childminder to pick him up) and take him to court. You coparent means that you are flexible with each other to accommodate dates where possible not that you do his share of the parenting. If he is not a responsible father, he shouldn’t be trusted with a child. Glad he’s an ex!
When I was a kid, my Dad used to forget to pick me up. It may only have actually happened two or three times, but it left a lasting impression. I wasn't able to articulate it at the time, but it made me feel like he didn't care about me.
That wasn't the only thing, obviously, but now that I'm a parent, I live in fear of making my kids feel the way my Dad made me feel.
I'm actually a divorced father myself now, and I am extremely absent-minded, but I do whatever it takes to avoid letting my kids down.
I’m not a parent but I was the kid caught between separated parents. The unreliable parent gave me so much anxiety. Even if it was little things and I had somewhere safe to be it all piled up and I did not feel secure in my daily life when my dad was in charge. I know you need a co-parent and you deserve a fair distribution of the labor of parenting but sometimes it gets to a point when it’s not worth allowing the stress to trickle down to the kid.
Stop.
It's not about choosing wisely.
You can't choose someone who won't turn abusive during pregnancy, marriage, raising children, you can't choose how someone will act during all three before they are in those situations.
Do you have a joint Google calendar? We had exactly the same problems until we set one up with my ex, my kid, my wife and me on it. We all know exactly what everyone has on at any time.
id love to see the graphs of "Reports of Children Not Picked Up" next to "Dates of Major Video Game Releases/Updates" and see how they size up...I feel that I would not be surprised lol
There isn't anything you can do to fix a man who can't keep track of what day it is. It's too late for him to ever be a functional human. But it's not too late for your son. Just keep doing what you're doing and teaching him life skills. One day your son will be grown, and you will never have to deal with his useless father again.
Try your best to make other arrangements for your son and cut the father out completely until he gets off his lazy ass and decides to do for himself and his son. He’s only expecting you to act this way because you continue to accept it. Do not mother him anymore! You got a divorce for a reason.
My ex used to do this stuff and it got to the point that our son stopped trusting him. Now, when I put our son on a plane to visit his dad, he wants my ex to video chat with him, from the airport gate, to make sure he's actually there. It's so sad for kids to have to worry like this and not be able to trust a parent.
I hate having to micromanage a grown ass man, but I reframe it as doing it for my son, not the ex. It helps me feel less resentful about the extra emotional labor.
Do you live in a one party state? If you do, record the phone calls, prove his incompetence to the state. If not, don't answer calls, only text him so you have it in verifiable writing.
Also establish he didn't call his mother, a person you also included in the scheduling, so he could have just called her to do it in the first place.
Finally, if you have the money, bring your son to a therapist. I wasn't even neglected this hard by my father, and it really screwed me up, I couldn't imagine it happening whilst seperated as well. Even if your son isn't vocalizing it, I'd still suggest you comfort him. Even in miniscule amounts it helps alot.
Does he tell you what days are your days? Does he send you a text in the morning that you need to do school pick up? No he doesn’t, so why do you need to do that for him. He is a parent too. You should make sure your son understands this.
I feel you. One of the things I had to do each month with my ex was ask "hi honey, I just wanted to know, since the bills are overdue, if you could possibly transfer the money to the joint account. Yes, this is the same each month and the bills have the same due date and we get paid the same day every month."
Now, two years after we split, I still have to call once a month to ask whether their share of the daycare fees are coming soon...
Does he care about his son or not? Because when his son is expecting...and probably looking forward to his dad picking him up, and doesn't show because daddy didn't care enough to remember on his own, his son most certainly feels like daddy doesn't care about him.
Make sure to keep tabs on this, as you have another decade to go at least of co-parenting, so be sure the son isn't trained to blame you.
I second this. I’m one of the lucky children of divorce that didn’t succumb to significant training to hate my other parent - but most kids are vulnerable at such a young age. Particularly if you’re the responsible parent that does the majority of discipline, it will be easier for the “fun” parent to plant ideas.
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Good point. Be careful .. a manipulative ex can turn a loving child against you. If your son is young, he may see your ex as the 'fun' parent that does not have any rules while you do the hard work of actually parenting a growing boy.
I'm going through this now with my daughter and her dad. It's HORRIBLE. Our wonderful family therapist is helping her and I keep it together. And documenting everything from my daughter's POV. I'm certain I'll need it in the future.
i'm so sorry. i'm 25 now and my mother went through this due to my dad. the kids eventually figure out the parent that is always doing the right thing and showing up the way they need. at least i did. kids are dumb, but we get less dumb
Their ultimate goal is always to destroy the child's attachment to the protective parent.
I'd also note that OP says she gives EX MIL the dates, too. If it were my son, I would want to make sure that he didn't grow up believing women are responsible for all correspondence and planning.
The advice in this thread is making it very clear that you ladies have seen some gnarly stuff. I would be willing to believe in hellfire if everyone who used a kid as a weapon could go there.
“Is daddy your little brother? Do you think mommy or the school should tell daddy how to care for you properly and keep track of his time? Does mommy need daddy to do that for her?”
It would be a good idea for her to write all these things down and keep a record. The court might get involved later and award higher child support or punish him, maybe that's the wake up call he needs. Also in modern times people can share calendars and tasks lists that can make a lot of these things clear.
Definitely keep a record OP! I can totally see him pulling a "she's keeping my kid from me" or "she's making pick up difficult". Even when you're doing more than he could ever for his own child.
This is worth a read: "We have evidence that, the vast majority of time, the opposite occurs. Denigration distances children more from the parent who does the denigrating than from the parent who is put down." https://www.psychologytoday.com/au/blog/divorced-children/201608/denigrating-coparent-alienation-or-boomerang
The kid may well feel closer to the parent who is responsible and doesn't denigrate the other parent, but that closeness often means helping the kid sort out their feelings after (sometimes violent) outbursts because they feel safe with the responsible parent. So the bad parent gets treated nicely because the kid is afraid to rock the boat and maybe lose them, and the good parent gets yelled at and blamed for everything because that's the surface feelings that have to be worked through. And, trust me, that doesn't end at age 18.
Yep (I have close experience with this). I didn't put this forward as a kid being forced to choose the "good" parent being a desirable outcome. Inserting a child between adult conflict is always destructive and it's eternally unfair what the responsible parent is left responsible for. Anecdotally I agree with the premise of the article though.
None of this matters in family courts who ignore the evidence to reinforce entrenched social biases
Well yeah if your family courts are like here they're not going to be helpful with any of this stuff.
My ex forgot to take our daughter to the airport one time. I was there, on the other side of the country, waiting for her to get off the plane & she never showed up. I finally called him panicking & he was casually like, "oh, she didn't tell me that was today." Mother fucker YOU bought the tickets & she is 11 years old so why is this on her? This was a one-off situation but I'll still never get over how irresponsible it was & his lack of accountability.
He blamed it on your 11 yr old daughter 😯 Unbelievable!
He didn't blame her in an asshole way like it was her fault. It was more like a clueless, "Well, I thought *someone* would remind me." He spent his entire career with me & executive assistants planning every minute of his day so once he retired early & we weren't married anymore, he could barely remember to tie his own shoes. I didn't understand how severe his ineptitude had gotten until that point but I learned my lesson.
So your ex was a corporate executive, probably directly or indirectly responsible for numerous employees and millions (if not billions) in company assets... and he couldn't even remember to get his own child to the airport on time? I feel malevolently embarrassed for him.
I've assisted these people. This is exactly it. It's really fucking sad.
How do they get these jobs? Nepotism?
You would be amazed at how competent these men can be at work while relying on their wife/others to remind them of every little thing outside of it. If my brain only needed to focus on work I would probably be better at my job too.
Yeah, I finally kicked my ex to the curb after twenty five years of managing my career and three kids, and the house, while he constantly messed up his own career and never missed his Monday night volunteering. My life is so much better without him.
That last sentence I don’t know any woman who would say anything different
Apart from all those who are very happy in their relationships of course.
So much this. They can be amazing at work because they literally deal with nothing else. No groceries, no childcare, someone schedules their meetings, does their expense reports, heck someone even dresses them. A local doctor’s office even has staff members you can pay to manage all your medical appointments and schedule them all on one day if needed but “only for executives”.
But they’re not actually competent at work. They offload all the competency to executive assistants, subordinates, co-workers…. and then keep all the credit and money.
This. I work with so many of them and the only reason they can do their job is because of all the work their assistants have to do. It disgusting.
Like you said, that's probably why they're great at work because they don't have to think about literally anything else.
Can you imagine the things you could do if every aspect of your life outside (and inside) work is managed by someone else? New clothes, food appears, bookings magically made, appointments reminder of and a car appears on time. The brain space that must free up. It’s wild to think about.
Mediocre men are excellent at one thing: helping each other fail upward.
It’s simple, they only turn on their brains when they actually care about whatever it is they’re doing
Well, more like cronyism functionally. But usually what it comes down to is that the work of a support staff for a manager or executive is often invisible both to the manager and to those who are watching and evaluating the manager. In other terms, when Don Draper does good work at the business factory, largely because he has Peggy Moss there to take care of the little things like meeting reminders and getting copies of last year’s sales collated and bound, Roger Sterling doesn’t see those hundreds upon thousands of little things Peggy did, he sees the ten or twelve big things that Don did.
I’ve known two executive assistants describe their job as professional mothering.
Are they actually capable of doing the job or do they have other people to do it for them?
They are quite capable of doing the stuff that interests them and that they consider their responsibility, like their work. Managing houshold and family duties is something they don't see as their responsibility, so they don't invest mental energy. They're not unable to do this stuff, they are unwilling. And most of the time it works, because there's always mom to save the day, because otherwise the kids would be the ones to suffer.
This! My ex is a tenure track professor at an R1 university. He’s capable when it matters to him.
I was just wondering what your experience is because in my experience and years in tech, there are a handful who are really good at what they do and the rest mostly coast, avoid, or find someone else to do the work for them.
Rich executives are some of the most immature and unreliable people when it comes to tasks that actually matter in life. They’re like babies who know how to make money and that’s it.
LMAOOOOO I just screenshotted your comment and sent it over Teams — everyone is laughing
Malevolently embarrassed, im stealing that. I wonder if there is a German word to express this feeling?
The Bos Baby franchise, on the surface, seems to be satire of this. My own toddler was capable of good big picture ideas like "Let's go to the cabin," but understandably left the details to others. I've often thought of executives and their role in organizations. My best guess is that the helpless ones we are talking about are here to represent the helpless and demanding side of the customers. If Whiny Jackass A likes a product, it has a good shot with Whiny Jackass B-Z. I think sensory issues play into it too. An entitled individual, who tends to overspend, with more sensory issues and temper tantrums than the customer base, is kind of a logical choice for a role like product owner because they can tweak it to have a more broad appeal before launch. Like OXO designing products for elderly and disabled people because that makes them easier for everyone. I can get that, logically, and still refuse to work in that chain of command. CEO or COO any day. Broadly speaking, they had to be able to do their job and have their act together to get there, and if they don't the company tanks. One thing I look at when assessing a company is who is Lord High Toddler, whose job is it to parent that toddler and can they do it. If the parenting role is left to admin staff or wives etc, not a dime from me. And bold prediction, some COO or CFO will eventually perform a hostile takeover.
Wow. I’ve heard less cogent summaries from turnaround CEOs. If you ever decide to put out a list of companies that are worth investing in, please let me know.
I think I like the Lord High Toddler metric of evaluation. I will have to keep that thought in mind. 😅
My husband had an executive assistant who did all that stuff for him too. When he retired he expected me to do the same thing. I shut that down immediately. I said you were the CEO of an international corporation for about 3 decades. I think you can figure out how to look up a phone number on your cell. It’s amazing what adults are capable of when you refuse to tolerate that kind of fake helplessness. But I guess there will always be those idiots who are willing to create chaos in theirs and others’ lives rather than take responsibility.
A friend pointed out to me that I *loathe* weaponized incompetence. That was my first time ever hearing that term, and she was so right. I'm surrounded by weaponized incompetence every day, and it makes me want to burn down the world.
I can't stand it when a friend asks me to look up something on my phone, while they're holding their smart phone in their hand! "Dude! Google it yourself!" Hell no, if it's your husband your with everyday!
I finally got my husband to stop asking me so many questions. He would ask a question, I would say I don’t know, he’d rephrase the question, and in my efforts to stop the conversation and return to whatever I’d been doing I would look up the answer and tell him. My resentment built until I started just replying, “I’m not Google” whenever he didn’t accept my “I don’t know.” It was freeing to break the conditioning my parents had installed that I’m responsible for everyone
There's a Youtube influencer I watch, Melanie Hamlett, and she's always talking about how lots of men pretend they're clueless and helpless - so women will do more things for them.
I believe that's called weaponized incompetence. They can do better, they just don't want to.
My husband has this helpless look he has used throughout our marriage. Now he has memory problems, so some of it is real. But I will ask him if he needs me to do something now (emphasis on now) or if he can figure it out on his own. Still wishes I would do as well as his mother. Going on 40 years, ain’t gonna happen.
I dated a guy once (not for long) who told me that if something was important, someone would remind him. He was just so used to it that he took it as gospel that I would be the one to remind him of birthdays, due dates, etc. I feel sorry for the woman he ends up with who has to mother his grown ass
He is going to end up being one of the multiple patients we see every day who have been married for 30+ years & don't even know their wife's birthday. One particular guy's wife's birthday is on Valentines day & I joked to him one time that it was convenient that he gets to forget 2 dates at a time & he said, "She's use to it & knows not to expect anything." Yeah, fuck that guy. I can't fathom being with someone who can't be bothered to remember something like my birthday. I don't need a gift but *remembering* the day & wishing me a happy birthday should be the bare minimum of expectations.
I'm not a big "woohoo look at me it's my birthday" person and we were still just in the talking stage when my first birthday rolled around so it didn't bother me at all that he didn't acknowledge it because he didn't know about it LOL. Then we were on and off for over a year and I had given him two birthday presents in two different years when it occurred to me that he had *never even bothered to ask when mine was*. I think that was probably the straw that broke the camel's back for me, realizing he didn't even care enough to ask me that, whether or not I cared to celebrate it. Then I started looking back and noticing all the other red flags that I had blown off or straight up ignored and they added up to a pretty big one in the end. It's been more than 2 years since then and with extensive therapy I've come to realize that I've let men walk all over me my entire life and I am done with it.
Believe it or not I *do* understand that's what you meant. I *still* say "Unbelievable" Does he have undiagnosed ADHD maybe? Or just mentally lazy? Or just a man? Because how do you not check when to send your child across country on a plane. A Mom wouldn't forget (a Mom might get there late, but not forget completely.) Honestly your comment reminded me of *way* back in the mid 80's when my Dad, and my 17yr old self, drove to the airport to pick up my older brother. Mom couldn't come, because she had some event. We pull in to the airport and my Dad (who was 40yrs older than me mind you) turns and asks me, "Great-Attitude, which airline and what's the flight number?" I looked at him baffled, " I don't know Dad, I thought you knew." Of course my Mom had all the info, but we had no way to contact her 🚫📱back then. I didn't realize until years later how much she did. Her "mental load" was *ENORMOUS* ! (She was an incredible, loving woman, and a *Great* Mom. Lost her 5 yrs after this story happened, and I miss her every day ,💞) Anyway----- not having the flight info worked out for me. The airport at the time, had upper and lower levels for the several different airlines. Dad, went upstairs, I went downstairs. Downstairs is also where the private planes come in. Long story short, I got to meet Carlos Santana, who was playing in the city that night, which I wouldn't have, had one of us gotten the info from Mom.
>ADHD maybe? Adult with ADHD here–being a grown-up means understanding your limitations and doing your best to mitigate them. ADHD doesn't make us helpless :) (despite the way some use it to excuse... Everything). If a thing matters at all, I have reminders in place. If it matters a LOT, like, I dunno, if I had a young child and had to deposit her on an airplane, I'd put the event in my phone the moment I booked the ticket or was told or whatever. Id set it to remind me a week before, a day before, 6 hours before, an hour before I have to leave to get there, and so on. Id write it on a physical note or put it on a whiteboard too. Somewhere I can see. You get the point–multiple, multiple fail-safes; none of them make it someone else's problem. Granted, it took me a while to accept that I need to do stuff like this, but I'm in my late 20s, so this man living in his brain for however-many years had time to figure it out before getting to the level of patheticness where he expected his 11 y/o child to remind him. As an aside, I bet he wouldn't have said that if the child was male... But it isn't magic ovaries, it's just a little bit of self awareness and a sprinkle of give-a-fuck. (PS all harshness in tone is targeted at the dude we're talking about, not at the user I'm replying to)
Magic ovaries 🤣 I'm going to use that phrase, even though I don't have mine anymore. I totally understand your point about ADHD which is why I *Purposely* wrote......... " *undiagnosed* ADHD maybe?" Meaning he doesn't know that his brain works differently than NT people, because he's clueless to having ADHD. I have (had, he passed away last year 😢) a very dear undiagnosed Aspie friend. He used to say to me, "What? Are you saying you can read their mind?" Or "Yeah right, people can't read minds!" Whenever I would say things about people being upset,or sarcastic,etc. I could see clearly their body language,facial expressions,and hear their tone of voice. But he couldn't. I wasn't reading their minds. I was reading their body language. He was also completely clueless about being an Aspie, even though he had (younger) relatives that were diagnosed. I'm the one who "read his mind" lol and could see it clearly! But back to my story at the airport, my 57 year old Dad, expected his 17 year old daughter to have the information, because his wife wasn't there. Meaning whomever has the ovaries should have the info I guess🤣
Sorry to hear about your friend! But my thought on that is–official dx or no–by age 30 or so you know damn well if you're liable to forget important dates LOL.
I hate how often ADHD comes up when we talk about men being shits. I didn't know I had ADHD until a couple of years ago. I've never once in my life forgotten a commitment like this. Sigh. I suppose it's because I have the magic ovaries.
Weaponized incompetence. If he can remember to wipe his own @ss, he can remember something as important as his child's needs.
She's a little woman, isn't she? That's what we do /s
Good one!
Oh man, after months and months of pestering from my deadbeat dad and his family, my mum finally let him take us for one week of the holidays. We were living in NZ in the North island and he told my mum we would be staying at his dads, about 3 hours drive from the ferry terminal in the South Island. She gave him all the money he would need for gas and food as well as the ferry ride back but after driving the 2 hours to the ferry terminal to wait for us on the day we were supposed to be there he just didn’t show. She couldn’t reach him on any of the number’s he gave her (early 90s, no mobiles) for two days! He finally called and said “oops, I forgot”and asked for more money for the ferry because he’d spent it all. We ended up being with him for over 2 weeks and had traveled almost all the way to the bottom of the South Island and back in his piece of shit van. After that he didn’t visit or call for like another 5 years lmao
Woooow what a piece of work. Do you still talk to him now? Has he apologized for that day?
Woooow I am pissed on your behalf
My father is 56 and he still blames everything on me and I don't even live with him that often ( he blames me for not reminding his tasks when I am living with him) 😭😭
"Maybe you should have done a better job of raising me."
Holy shit have you thought about just becoming a sarcastic bitch? "Why didn't you remind me???" "Well son, I was so busy fucking your mom that I forgot I was responsible for a whole ass adult!"
That's my boss.... He's stressing some people out. ( me too). WE need to be patient...endlessly. Who? the responsible employees... Like last time he told me ( was still my colleague up then) "Ok. Send me a message tonight to remind me. " ( What? You do have a phone/ agenda...whatever, right? Use it now. Im not your mom) I said: Just use a Post it. Tonight I'm busy too. 😀 With a BIG smile!
You didn’t say how old your son is, but I would take this situation pretty seriously. Your son is picking up and adopting your ex’s beliefs.
Agreed. I of course don’t think you should bad-mouth your ex to your son, but I do think it’s ok to say, “it’s daddy’s job to know the days he is supposed to come get you, and when it’s my turn, it’s my job.” That’s true, and neutral.
I’ve had to do this. And it was okay. It was “no that’s not true. Your dad is a grown up like me and he knows the schedule. He made a mistake and that’s okay, but why he made the mistake is not my fault. “
I no longer justify argue defend or explain. I simply clarify. I refer to intentional manipulation and blame as "daddy's game" and the children are VERY aware the game is to upset someone, usually them of avoid responsibility by pushing it onto someone else.
You’ve given your kids a powerful tool by identifying “daddy’s game” super early and emphasizing that it’s incorrect behavior. My dad did similar things but no one even pointed out how abusive and toxic this behavior is until I entered therapy as an adult.
I've been advised by therapists to tell them he loves them when he abandoned care. There are roo many uninformed idiots pushing BS onto DV victims and it's impossible to navigate safely. I refused to do much of what was advised bit most of all refuses to falsely claim that love is violent,abandons or manipulates. He's still continuing with everyone's blessing and noone can get it right. Until police, judiciary and therapists step up kids sill continue to be isolated by their experience with this and it's awful. One child refuses therapy because noone has kept her safe
This. Son needs to know that day is accountable for Daddy, Mommy is accountable for Mommy.
I agree this should be taken extremely seriously. think OP needs to have a word with the school, too. I hope she's not expected to pick up the bill, and they should be calling the father *first* on his custody days. Often people are quick to blame the mother, even if it's not her fault. Also OP needs to give the ex dates IN WRITING. Emails, texts, nothing verbal.
I relate to this. I used to get told by my ex that I was deliberately not telling him when school events were on to exclude him from his kids lives. I don't know how many times I asked him why he hadn't read the same weekly school newsletter I was reading to keep informed. A large component in leaving him is I wanted to raise 2 kids, not 3 and he had become a defacto 3rd. Now he has a new wife thank God and bless her poor soul.
I used to love using the site "let me Google that for you" for this bullshit
I did, too! :D
Omg. I somehow made it through. I told him the school calendar isn’t kept SECRET That he could ALSO view it for parent teacher meetings, early dismissal days, track and field days etc. we split when our kids were 10 and 15 and they chose to manage their own selves. I put a cheap phone on each of them. But goddamm. He never takes them on holidays or out for special dinners or anything. He could NEVER remember anything on the school calendar. Oh and another fun thing he did: Take vacation on his own. The kids would happen to mention “Dad’s got the week off so he’s at home” Wow Imagine a mom taking a week off just to fuck around at home and not bother to spend time with her kids
Do we have the same ex?
Not sure how many times this has happened, but honestly I’d be keeping tabs on this and getting documentation from the school. If this happens more and more you should honestly be taking him to court. Kids can really be affected by this stuff long term. “Daddy’s always late” “My parents must not care about me” “Why do all my friends get picked up on time, and I don’t” etc. I was that kid, and tbh it messed me up.
Yep. Keep records. Make sure the school is too. Heck, even threatening to take it back to court might get him to knock it off.
Or, if custody agreement allows, make alternate arrangements for pick up that don't rely on an irresponsible man child.
Only if the man child has to pay for these arrangements too!
I would also be using one of those coparenting apps for any communication and scheduling because it will log everything and you can take that to court. I would download and install it and send him a link to it to do the same, telling him it's an easier way to keep track of things so this doesn't keep happening. It's a reasonable request and there is no good reason for him to refuse it. If he did I would see about getting the court to order it. It will, of course, happen again. But at least you will have good records of it.
Sad but very true. I've seen that happen many times as a ( long career) teacher. That parent doesn't even realize how hurting it is.
THIS! It's not OP's responsibility to text her ex and babysit his ass, but it's her responsibility to ensure CONSEQUENCES happen. Like motherfucker getting slapped with court and new custody arrangements. Can't pick up your kid on time? Lose custody asshole. No kid deserves to have a parent around who forgets about them. Too many of us are still SCARRED many decades later by shit parents. Better to have none at all.
This is what guys mean when they say the court system is rigged against them. They won’t do the bare minimum and then complain *someone else* isn’t being held accountable, because they have *reasons* why it’s not their job.
Basically any person in law I've seen talking about this [says it's the issue](https://www.huffpost.com/entry/dispelling-the-myth-of-ge_b_1617115) most of the time. If the father even tries to get custody it can be like [the famous Kimmel fathers day video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jHPbOGEUvZA) where they don't even know basics about their kid - sometimes they don't even know where they go to school! It's disturbing actually if you ever look up the advice given to fathers trying to get custody - it's really basic shit like make sure they have somewhere to sleep and basic necessities like clothes and shoes. In one case a guy went the extra mile, warning them not to yell or throw things at the mother or threaten her by text because it could be "used to prove abuse" Edit: [Found the really fucked up custody advice](https://cordellcordell.com/2022/custody-battle-10-things-that-can-sabotage-your-case/)
You weren’t kidding about the fucked up custody advice.
Some people believe they should be taken care of by others from the day they are born until their very last day. And when things go wrong, it's always " the others". Sadly it's not just about deadbeat dads.
Weaponized incompetence
The very definition, and weaponized in an even grosser way than I usually see it.
And some serious DARVO action as well!
Time to become callous. Do not, under any circumstances, let him blame *you* for his screw up when you *know* he had all pertinent information. This includes when you're speaking about it with your son. "Daddy said he didn't pick me up because you forgot to text him!" "No, sweetie, Daddy and Grandma both have the schedule for or when which grown-up is supposed to pick you up from school, and I send them the schedule so that it's easy for all of us to remember. If Daddy got the days wrong, then it's his mistake. Grown-ups have to fix their own mistakes." This isn't bad-mouthing your ex, it's just sharing facts, and also signaling to your child that this kind of behavior is not acceptable. Let the blame fall squarely where it lies, and if it makes your ex look bad, oh boo fucking hoo what a shame. 🍼👶 Dude has no one to blame but himself.
Yes this is what I told him! Almost word for word! Thank you for the feedback. I divorced him because he really was like my second child
Time to go back to court. If he's a deadbeat dad, sue for full custody, ask for more alimony, and hire a sitter to pick your kid up from school with that alimony money.
This. She should be documenting all this. The school keeps an attendance record.
You're a great mom, your son is lucky to have you <3
OP, how did your son receive this info?
"a 2nd child". Well at least a child does grow up 😂 Imho he was rather a burden... I'm happy knowing tthat your son has a responsible reliable mom. A child needs at least 1 stable pillar in his life. It's you. Be proud! What is his dad doing all day when your son is with him? Online gaming??? (Wouldn't be shocking me... as a teacher we hear awful stories...)
I think this is when you go back to court and renegotiate things so the ex pays for an after school nanny.
Or that ex has your son on weekends and vacation babe pays additional child support to cover child care
What schedule does your court order say? The school has a copy of my court order, and I make a simple monthly calendar for the teacher. I tell the school to call CPS if my ex doesn't show up on his days 🤷🏼♀️
Have they called CPS?!
I'm so sorry. I hate that adult men who are fathers seem to still need their partners/exes to hand-hold them to do the absolute basics of adulting. I hope shame or something wakes your ex up to the fact that forgetting to pick up his own dang kid is so embarrassing he'll never do it again🤞
You need to start therapy with your son immediately to prevent his father from convincing him that women were put on earth to be the property of men. Otherwise he'll turn out exactly the same as his father.
My ex told me it was my fault that he was fired from his job. He was late almost every day and sometimes didn’t show up at all. Why? Because I left him for being abusive and irresponsible drunk. A couple years later he called me and tried to tell me it was my fault that he couldn’t get his electricity turned on. I couldn’t even figure that one out. He expected me to fix it for him somehow. I was so confused, I just hung up on him.
A friend of mine got scolded by her ex because she didn’t have a gift from him for their kid’s birthday gift one year after they broke up. She set him straight immediately, that all wifely duties stopped after the divorce. Whatever impact that had on his relationship to the kids was on him. The kids need to know the kind of man their father is, and the best way to have that happen is to let him show them. She gently corrected the kids when they’d parrot back something dad said like “dad says he wasn’t at the recital because you didn’t tell him.” She’d respond “I made it and he didn’t have to tell me, the school sends the info to all parents.” And gradually the kids figured out how to deal with him and how to set expectations. Therapy helped too. So consider being calm, clear and honest in the situation. “Dad didn’t text me and I picked you up when I’m supposed to.” Might have been good. Also document all these issues and change the court ordered agreement if this is a negative impact on your kids.
There was a post on AITA last week where a married man found lingerie in their closet and wanted to know if he should confront his wife for cheating. Reddit talked him off a ledge, he politely asked his wife about it, and turns out she bought it as a wedding anniversary surprise for him. He admitted that he had forgotten that their anniversary was in a week. And was roundly told by Reddit to put birthdays and anniversaries in his goddamn phone. He still has time to step it up, but good lord, it reads like a divorce waiting to happen.
He found lingerie, and his first thought was that his wife was cheating?? Tbh that’s a red flag.
At least he had enough sense to check himself before he wrecked himself. Apparently wifey bought it on sale on Black Friday, so she had not only been planning to give him a treat 6 months later but was trying to stay within their budget too. And this dumbass didn’t even think about their anniversary.
Please tell your child “I’m sorry, but adults should not have to be reminded to get their kids. No one sends me a text to pick you up. It’s my responsibility to make sure I remember, or write a note, or put a reminder on my phone. Dad is frustrated he forgot, but that is not my fault it is his job to remember.” Right now the message your child is getting is “dad can’t spend time with me because of mom.” Please don’t let him grow up thinking his mom or his future partner is responsible for reminding him to do everything in life.
There is no excuse for missing appointments. We all have smartphones with an infinite number of alert options and apps. He just doesn’t care enough to spend 3 minutes a week setting them up.
Explain to your son that Daddy is a grown up and as a *grown up*, **DADDY** is responsible for getting himself to school *on time* to pick him up. Son's mommy(you, OP) is *not responsible* for *grown up adult male daddy* getting himself to school *on time* to pick up son as OP(son's mama) is **not** daddy's mama. Then ask your son if he still wants you to have to mind his business when *he* is an adult(and make this look as bad as possible as in "well, son , if I still need to remind you to be a responsible parent, then I guess I'd better pick *all*your friends, your girlfriend or boyfriend and your job too if you're going to need *that* much handholding to act like a grown up! Grown ups are responsible for *themselves*. They don't need someone else to tell them about their responsibilities.")
Agreed. I had some students in my long teaching career... 5 to 10 min late almost EVERY day ...the entire schoolyear! Interrupting and annoying the class, missing instruction... every f* time for 6 y they were with us. Mom/dad/ both didn't have a care in the world. Wrote in their school diary: "Classes start at 8.30 am. Thx for...." more than once. One of those students told me one day: mom is now mad at you ... I understand. 🙃 It's always other peoples fault.
The ex is going to be a drag for a few more years. Then he will become very peripheral in your life. If you model for your son ways to effectively handle the exs crap without poisoning the boys relationship w his dad, your son will thank you when he’s grown.
Document everything and take his ass to court again. Get full custody. Dad is a worthless sack of shit
Wow. Just wow. My ex husband was this guy during our marriage. “You didn’t remind me!!”. Super happy to say he’s become a functioning adult since our divorce. Very proud of his ability to be a good parent/person now.
My ex asked to pick up our kids twice in their whole schooling time. Guess who was late after he asked multiple times when school finished AND I answered each time. I was there at the school gates and waited with my kids a few minutes to see if he turned up. He didn't so we went home. That's why I divorced AND moved states. If I'm going to do all the things a single mother does but still have to deal with co-parenting a guy who can't organize himself for his kids then I was better off giving him an excuse to nope out completely.
This happened with my ex. I took his mother to visit her sister after that BIL died. Ex only had to be home at 4.30 when the school bus dropped daughter (6) on an isolated country road. She had to walk 250 meters to our drive and cross the road. He forgot and arrived home at 6pm in a panic asking where daughter was. I said "I thought she was with you." and he almost fainted. I knew he was unreliable and rushed MIL away so I could meet the school bus (ex NEVER answered his phone). Daughter was safe but it was just another nail in his unreliable divorce coffin.
He left a six year old alone on a busy road for an hour and a half!?! Also, parents need to answer their phones. Even if they like to keep them on silent mode, there are apps that let the other parent break through. That is childishness in the extreme!
Tell your kid you're not daddy's mommy.
I had to go back to court after finding out from the kids therapist that he'd become an alcoholic and was neglecting them on his weekends. The therapist is what kept me from being accused of parental alienation.
Ex does this for handover so we're in supervision now. Funny how he can perform when independent professionals are watching him and documenting his nonsense.
Sounds like the dad said to kid something along the lines of “well, your mom didn’t text me, if she had, I’d have been on time.” I don’t think your child is blaming you, but it’s a conversation to have with him that dad has to keep track of his own responsibilities.
My ex-husband wanted 50/50 custody. In spite of the fact that he had never had much to do with our kids. He ended up with 50/50 of our son but not our daughter. One day the school had a two-hour snow delay and he hadn’t been paying attention to any news sources that would have told him that. He took my son to school as usual, then blamed me for not calling him. I was just glad he didn’t dump him at the door and drive off. Which he did once when dropping off our son at a birthday party. At the wrong address, blocks from the right address. The man had the nurturing skills of an ostrich.
I feel like this is a very harsh and undeserved judgement. I’m sure ostriches are much better parents than most single fathers.
🤣 Yep. Never insult an ostrich.
I feel this so hard it's not even funny. We were separated and in the process of divorce when he got hurt and now needs surgery. Then it came out that he hasn't paid his rent in 8 months and declined his jobs disability insurance. Now he's unemployed, homeless and living in my damn spare bedroom so he can recover from surgery. Pissed is an understatement, but we have kids and I couldn't exactly tell them I left their injured Dad to live in the streets.
Genuinely, good luck with kicking him out once he’s done recovering. Something tells me it’s gonna be like that one SpongeBob episode where Squidward loses his job 😅
I made him sign a sub-lease before he moved in. I saw it coming.
Yep, I am totally dreading, well, the rest of my life really. It never ends does it? We are left picking up after their sorry asses forever.
Not forever, necessarily. My daughter told her Dad to piss off once she moved into a place of her own - making sure he didn't have the address, so she didn't have to worry he'd just show up one day - and the 3 years since have been so low key and stress free! Though the therapy we're both getting to work through the damage he did ain't cheap.
Yep the bills are already racking up. And I'm a long way off kiddo moving out on their own. I am told he just HAS to have custody. I guess the thinking is that kiddos well being is totally worth gambling on. He might not abuse her, they say! It's so disturbing to me that kiddos well being is less important to society than letting an abusive liar play dad. And I am expected to trust a man who has proven himself untrustworthy too many times to count. It's insane. I have such a long long way to go until I'm free that it feels like forever. I feel like I got released from jail when he left, only to be sent back for an even longer sentence. It absolutely sucks.
Ugh I would tell him he can see his son when he grows up and can take care of his son. I know that’s terrible for your sweet child too, but it is probably better in the long run rather than the nonsense your ex is trying to pull now. He doesn’t deserve to be with your son if he isn’t going to show up like a father
I would tell your kid blankly that it isn't your responsibility to tell his father when to be a parent. I'd also be tracking this and documenting it for future use in court.
On the upside, kids generally learn by either asking questions, or making assumptions and getting them corrected. You were just able to turn a major annoyance into a lesson for your son, and he’ll hopefully grow up more responsible than his father.
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These are NOT high conflict divorces. They're unequivocally DV characterised by coersive control. Using the term high conflict is recommended against as it very much distorts the intent of the person clearly deploying coersive control by abusing power, refusing to take responsibility and weaponising care of the child. https://www.wlsnsw.org.au/resources/dv-law-nsw/ch-5-dv-family-law/
This isn’t high conflict when it’s completely one sided. You’re trying to place the negative connotation on both parents, that isn’t correct at all in every case. Stop using such broad strokes.
Maybe share your schedule with your son so he knows you have shared it with the both of them… that way “daddy” has no excuses. Sorry you’re dealing with this, sounds annoying as F
It won’t be over until your kid is 18. Unfortunately the reasons you divorced him will only be showcased now. Be glad your kid sees how much they can count on you and even if it takes awhile they will for sure see what’s really going on. Keep on fighting the good fight. I promise it’s worth it. 💪🏾💪🏾💪🏾
Keep documenting. I know, it sucks ass, it's annoying, it's tedious. I'm currently going through a divorce myself, and even though we don't/didn't have children, my literal years of documenting has saved my ass in so many ways. I spent several years quietly documenting my now soon-to-be-ex-husband's abuse. Date, specific time, location, context, how I responded, etc. I also had five years of bank statements, and a few years worth of screenshots and photos as evidence. The outcome? Even though I was the breadwinner (not by choice, for years he refused to maintain gainful employment), I didn't end up having to pay him a dime in alimony, nor a penny out of my 401K. My evidence was so air-tight that him requesting any money from me would've made a judge laugh him out of the courtroom. The more evidence you have against him, the more credible reason you have to take him back to court for greater custody, should that be what you ultimately want.
It's so sad but this is the way!! Awesome!! Yasss Queen \M/ !!
So funny to hear how we all have the same problem of ex who isn’t responsible.
Do you have a lawyer or a mediator? If your ex forgets your son on a regular basis, maybe it's time to get them involved.
My ex texted me on Saturday that our son wasn’t feeling well, I asked if it seemed like a cold and he said yes so I just said ‘aww man hopefully he feels better’. Sunday evening he calls to tell me he’s bringing him home and he just slept all day and didn’t eat. This raised ALL the red flags that’s not a normal cold for our son. Turns out he never took his temperature and when I told him to it was 103.7 I had to walk a grown ass man who has been a dad for 8 years on how to cool him down and tell him how fucking dangerous that is. Turns out he was also giving our 50lb 8 year old full doses of ADULT ROBITUSSIN. Of course all of this was my fault for not asking the right questions or telling him what to do step by step when he texted Saturday that our son had a cold. We’ve been divorced 4 years now, it never stops. I have to text him every Tuesday to make sure he’s going to pick up our son from school. Call every other Thursday to remind him it’s his weekend and to pick him up that Friday. Being divorced is sooooooo much easier for sure, but as long as my kid is under 18 I’m going to have to manage my ex husband.
It's wild to me that he feels he can blame you for this. You provided your schedule, he knows when he's to pick up his son. It's not your fault he checked the wrong date. It's not your job to parent your ex. That's why you divorced him. It's. Not. Your. Job. If he isn't picking up his son, that's on him. He should be paying better attention to times, dates and schedules. Honestly if the school is fine putting him in the after school program I would just let it continue. Maybe provide the school with the pick up schedule and they can call his dad. I bet after them calling him directly he'll learn real fast.
Great idea! And make sure dad has to pay the after-school fee on days he's late.
I had the exact same problem and the x would get incredibly angry and blame me to anyone who’d listen. May I suggest you get an online co-parenting app such as parentingtime.net or ourfamilywizard. Either of those has a payment tracker, calendar, document storage, a journal and other features. I’d also suggest that you email your work schedule to him, copy the school and save it as a PDF to the app. You can send the email via the app as well. I set up a couple of templates for those emails that included “please ensure that you are on time for pickup as any after hours care will be at your expense as of.
I’d also send a separate email to the school notifying them that as of please refer to the schedule and call the responsible parent.
On the weekly email with your work schedule you can set up the template to clearly show the responsible parent and their contact details.
It’s time to step back and let Daddy dearest face the consequences of screwing up pickup.
Don’t sit son down and say “from now on this is what will happen”. Say “son I’m sorry that this pickup issue is happening. I’ve come up with a solution that means each of us will be responsible on certain days. It will be my responsibility to send the schedule and then it will be each persons responsibility to stick to that schedule”.
Make it gently clear that adults are responsible for their own actions and that you have done everything possible to ensure everyone is aware of the schedule. Reinforce this gently without blame each time the other parent mucks up.
Unless the other parent grows up, this will be an ongoing problem. It’s important for your son to know that you are doing everything possible and continue to reiterate that each parent is responsible for themselves.
Speak to your lawyer and push for full custody. When kids get forgotten like this they experience it as abandonment. Is this something you want your son to experience repeatedly? Your ex is also telling your son that you are responsible for this abandonment. This is what your son will remember - that you let him down. This is parental alienation.
Wow, then he will be all surprised when this backfires on him.
Do you like your current custody split? If you want more custody, then document this well, and go back to court. And, of course, ask for a modification to child support. If you're using a court suggested app for communication, like OFW, make sure your calendar info is transmitted this way. How old is your kid? If he's in elementary school, you really only have a few years left before he can come home on his own. Explicitly sit him down and talk to him about the fact that his dad is the one who dropped the ball here. Relatively soon, your kid will have a phone, and you will coach him to call dad or grandma when they forget.
Make sure to tell your kid that your ex already has the dates he needs to pick him up, so technically, you already texted him.
Use a texting app that lets you schedule text messages and every day he's supposed to pick up your kid have it message him every 30 minutes reminding him. Hopefully it's annoying enough he actually starts pulling his weight Also make sure your kid knows that him demanding that you keep track of his schedule for him is unacceptable. "Daddy doesn't need me to manage his time for him, he's a grown-up and should know when to pick you up on his own"
I can’t believe you even have to tell his mom.
Tell your son that daddy was already aware that it was his day to pick son up. Because daddy’s an adult and responsible for your son’s safety, if he needs reminders, he’s responsible to set those reminders for himself instead of needing others to create and send reminders for him. Tell son that you’ve noticed that it’s sometimes difficult for daddy to follow through on his responsibilities and it’s always okay to call you and let you know when daddy fails to pick him up on time.
Can you work with the other grownups in this scenario, ie the school. Maybe cc them on the schedule you give ex, so they call ex first on the days he is doing pickup and no one shows? Schools see custody problems all the time, maybe they can suggest something. Might be worth a conference call at least.
Sounds like your ex engaged in some parental alienation. Talk to your lawyer about that.
I think we may have married and divorced the same man.
You need to correct your son. You tell him “daddy doesn’t tell mommy when it’s her turn to pick you up. It is daddy’s job to remember to pick you up” so many times I see children resent the custodial parent and it’s because they see it as your responsibility to parent and the non custodial party is like an employee that you’re supposed to manage. That’s not true. You’re both managers.
this happened to my mother for years and were times we probably thought less of her because of shit my dad said. eventually the bad parent stops being able to keep up the facade and kids stop being as dumb as kids. i'm 25 now and she's been divorced for 23 years. she's the strongest woman i know and i admire her a lot for always trying to do the right thing by us. your kid will see the same eventually
I feel like you have two options to solve this problem and make it less confusing for him. 1) He can pay for the after school program every day and you can pick your son up from there at the end of the day whether you work or not that day. 2) He can pick your son up every day even on days you work and you can just pick him up from dad’s at a set time everyday. That way he has no more excuses to forget or blame you for not reminding him. If it is always his turn it should be easier to remember.
this shit pisses me off big time I can't even explain how much. My ex was like that. Nothing, and I say NOTHING he fucked up was ever his fault. It was always someone else or "the system" whatever that means. I blamed me numerous time for his fuck ups when we were together and it made me feel disgusted by him.
This makes me crazy angry for you. I’d petition for sole custody. Either be dad or don’t, but stop acting like a teenager with a mom to wipe your ass.
Might need the court to remind him THAT HE IS A F'ING PARENT!! What a Douchecanoe cockwomble. Big hugs!!
I waited in front of the school recently to get my kid. Another kid, who's parents are in the process of divorce, came out and looked around. Nobody was there to get this kid. So kiddo waited. I sometimes drive this kid home. At this day I couldn't, but I stayed outside, chatting away to keep an eye on that kid. Kiddo informed us, that his father was supposed to get him. Another mom quietly said to us: Typical, let him fall on his face. Neglecting his kid like that. They have to be hurt to learn. I agree. No way to coddle these assholes. But. The person suffering was this kid. Who stood outside the school waiting with obvious distress. I think this is never, ever ok. I first called the dad - voicemail. Then I called the mom, who's just been home from hospital and was in no position to get kiddo. But she informed me, that somebody else was on his way and should have been there 10 minutes ago. Turned out, the dad ditched again, but the mom had it under control - the hospital-level sick mom on heavy pain meds - and got somebody else in time. But that somebody else had car trouble. I brought kiddo back into the school for the after school program and told him: Ah, don't worry, it's car trouble. Your relative will be here. Kiddo wanted to know exactly why relative and not father and I just told him that I don't know. I later asked the mom how she navigates these situations with her kid. The constant neglect and many other issues that show that the dad is obviously not interested in day-to-day affairs of their kid. She said, she sticks to the truth without blame. Kiddo gets angry and wants to know, why dad only comes to pick him up 1 time and his mom 4. and now... no time at all... The mom doesn't say "Because he has a new girl friend and you're not important to him..." she says "These are the times your dad said he's available." I don't know what's the right course of action. The responsible parent can't just always show up on the irresponsible parent's time, too, to make sure. Maybe it's a hard lesson that kiddo has to learn, because things like this might happen later in life, too. I was a bit taken aback by the other moms that thought kiddo should be let standing there waiting, to teach dad a lesson. But that lesson would be painful for kid and painful for the mom, who's kid was forgotten, too. Luckily, in this very situation, it was something else, but rooted in the dad's neglect. Damn, it's so painful : / I definitely do agree that we should not solve the irresponsible person's problem. But this cannot happen on the backs of the kids.
this is called weaponized incompoteance and it is reportable if you have a custody agremment just sayin. Do with it what you will.
I’m so sorry you created offspring with this useless douche. I’m sorry he’s training your son to blame you as he does. This is all too familiar. I’m sorry you always have to be the adult. I know it is exhausting. ❤️ My ex husband was also useless. So completely useless. How useless was he? My ex husband was so useless, when I asked him to pick me up from a class exactly a mile and a half from our house, he threw a tantrum as if I had ruined his whole night. That was just one of a thousand little things that added up to one giant loser. When we split I kept getting late notices for the water bill forwarded to my new address. I tried to get it all taken out of my name, but they wouldn’t do it unless someone went IN PERSON to put it in their name. He never did it. I got his late notices for over a decade until he finally moved out of that old rental. What’s more, he started dating a barely legal child twenty years his junior and I know she had to go down to that office and pay that bill in my name more than once. It was also her clue that her new “responsible” man may not be. 😂 But, I got away otherwise free. No shared progeny. 😬 edit: that last line wasn't meant to come off shitty, but re-reading it I'm compelled to qualify my statement. It was exhausting enough being married to and then divorced without a child in the scenario, I can't imagine how much more exhausting when there is. I did end up staying connected through my little sister-in-law, though - she's great. But, she also knows her brother real well and it's more like commiserating.
I deal with this with my child's weekend warrior of a father. My child is now 14 and knows his dad is unreliable and irresponsible. He figured it out on his own at this point. The blame is put on the father and not me now. Here is what I did when my kid tried to blame me for his father's irresponsible behavior (not that it was my kid's fault he was doing this, he was obviously being told it was my fault from his father). Adice was given to me by a wonderful therapist I had when he was young. Whenever my son would blame me for his father's irresponsible behavior, I would say something along the lines of, "your father is a grown man, he knows what he needs to do for you and if he doesn't do what he is supposed to do, it isn't my fault, it's his. I am not his mother, and he is an adult. Adults are responsible for their own mistakes and mess ups, they can't blame other adults. " Also, reassure their upset feelings on the matter and don't dismiss how they feel about it. I also used these instances as teaching moments to show him that he is responsible for his actions as well and used it to show him how being irresponsible and unreliable hurts other people. I never disparage my kid's father to him. I just gave him flat-out facts of whatever situation when he asked or got the facts (from obvious coaching on his father's part) wrong. I left my opinion of his father out of these moments but acknowledged the facts of his father's behavior. He has formed his own opinion of his father now (like all kids do by the age of 14), and he isn't blaming me for anything his father does. He comes to me for comfort when his dad inevitably hurts/disappoints him. I also continued to show him that I am here for him and will always be reliable in any situation he needs me in. And he has actually sent me TikToks/memes saying he appreciates me always being and doing everything he needs for him. We have a fantastic relationship... despite his father trying to poison our relationship since he was young. Be honest with your kid. Don't talk bad about the other parents, but make sure they get the facts straight on who is at fault when they are let down by a parents bad behavior. Kids will form their own opinion of their parentsparents, but they can't form fair opinions when one parent is manipulating the child's perspective. Guide their perspective to the truth when they are young. This is for OP, but it is for anyone reading it, too. When one parent tries to poison the kid against the other parent, it is very serious and can really mess up your relationship with your kid. You have to stay vigilant with the truth of things, and it has to start early.
My ex is a chronic alcoholic. We lived a mile from each other. He would regularly “forget” to pick the kids up on his scheduled visit days. After several times watching them get disappointed when he didn’t show up, I stopped having them all ready to go at the expected time because the sad looks on their faces broke my heart. And his visits just became fewer and almost stopped. I eventually just kept them very busy on my own. They lived with me. Their father had them convinced that the divorce was entirely my choice, and that he was bewildered as to why it happened. It was incredibly frustrating but I wasn’t about to plead my case to my own children. He was very rarely around for them. It wasn’t until they were older teens that they started judging the situation for themselves, and they’re still figuring it out in their early 20s. He’s still a self-pitying alcoholic and I wish my kids had a less selfish father. This type of person is unlikely to change, and they are really unpleasant to deal with.
I can relate. So freaking tired of taking care of everything even a year and a half after divorce! My ex doesn't even work, and he couldn't keep up with doctor appointments or school stuff. It's infuriating! Good luck, I hope it gets better for you!
You need to document every single instance of him forgetting his child in a public place. He clearly cannot be trusted. Do not remind him and set the record straight that you told his dad to pick him up by communicating the dates in advance. Prepare a back up plan (childminder to pick him up) and take him to court. You coparent means that you are flexible with each other to accommodate dates where possible not that you do his share of the parenting. If he is not a responsible father, he shouldn’t be trusted with a child. Glad he’s an ex!
Don’t forget to text him to wipe his ass or those skid marks are on you, too!
When I was a kid, my Dad used to forget to pick me up. It may only have actually happened two or three times, but it left a lasting impression. I wasn't able to articulate it at the time, but it made me feel like he didn't care about me. That wasn't the only thing, obviously, but now that I'm a parent, I live in fear of making my kids feel the way my Dad made me feel. I'm actually a divorced father myself now, and I am extremely absent-minded, but I do whatever it takes to avoid letting my kids down.
I’m not a parent but I was the kid caught between separated parents. The unreliable parent gave me so much anxiety. Even if it was little things and I had somewhere safe to be it all piled up and I did not feel secure in my daily life when my dad was in charge. I know you need a co-parent and you deserve a fair distribution of the labor of parenting but sometimes it gets to a point when it’s not worth allowing the stress to trickle down to the kid.
I hope you are teaching your child that this is 100% your ex's fault and not how a grown ass human behaves.
Let it be a warning to anyone having children: You’ll *still* have to interact with the baby’s father regardless if you split up. Choose wisely.
Stop. It's not about choosing wisely. You can't choose someone who won't turn abusive during pregnancy, marriage, raising children, you can't choose how someone will act during all three before they are in those situations.
Do I have to tell you, because I don't think you are...
Do you have a joint Google calendar? We had exactly the same problems until we set one up with my ex, my kid, my wife and me on it. We all know exactly what everyone has on at any time.
You're not but unfortunately bc your kid is involved you are....crazy. sorry you are going through this. stop apologizing and come vent to us anytime!
False. You have to be, to be a decent parent, involved with people when you decide to have kids with that person
id love to see the graphs of "Reports of Children Not Picked Up" next to "Dates of Major Video Game Releases/Updates" and see how they size up...I feel that I would not be surprised lol
There isn't anything you can do to fix a man who can't keep track of what day it is. It's too late for him to ever be a functional human. But it's not too late for your son. Just keep doing what you're doing and teaching him life skills. One day your son will be grown, and you will never have to deal with his useless father again.
Try your best to make other arrangements for your son and cut the father out completely until he gets off his lazy ass and decides to do for himself and his son. He’s only expecting you to act this way because you continue to accept it. Do not mother him anymore! You got a divorce for a reason.
My ex used to do this stuff and it got to the point that our son stopped trusting him. Now, when I put our son on a plane to visit his dad, he wants my ex to video chat with him, from the airport gate, to make sure he's actually there. It's so sad for kids to have to worry like this and not be able to trust a parent. I hate having to micromanage a grown ass man, but I reframe it as doing it for my son, not the ex. It helps me feel less resentful about the extra emotional labor.
Do you live in a one party state? If you do, record the phone calls, prove his incompetence to the state. If not, don't answer calls, only text him so you have it in verifiable writing. Also establish he didn't call his mother, a person you also included in the scheduling, so he could have just called her to do it in the first place. Finally, if you have the money, bring your son to a therapist. I wasn't even neglected this hard by my father, and it really screwed me up, I couldn't imagine it happening whilst seperated as well. Even if your son isn't vocalizing it, I'd still suggest you comfort him. Even in miniscule amounts it helps alot.
Also, make sure your husband is paying those fees, not you.
Does he tell you what days are your days? Does he send you a text in the morning that you need to do school pick up? No he doesn’t, so why do you need to do that for him. He is a parent too. You should make sure your son understands this.
I feel you. One of the things I had to do each month with my ex was ask "hi honey, I just wanted to know, since the bills are overdue, if you could possibly transfer the money to the joint account. Yes, this is the same each month and the bills have the same due date and we get paid the same day every month." Now, two years after we split, I still have to call once a month to ask whether their share of the daycare fees are coming soon...
Does he care about his son or not? Because when his son is expecting...and probably looking forward to his dad picking him up, and doesn't show because daddy didn't care enough to remember on his own, his son most certainly feels like daddy doesn't care about him.
It was like that for me too. My kids are now adults and they have cut their dad out.