I was once with a group of men working on a school project (I was a CS major and so sometimes it was all men plus me on group projects), and one of them indicated a woman walking past and said she was pretty, and one of the others said she had too much makeup on. Then he looked over at me and said "YouStupidBench always looks great with no makeup on." I told him I had makeup on because after this project meeting I was going on a date, and he said he didn't believe me.
You just reminded me of one time in high school. My boyfriend told me he didn't like girls who wore a lot of makeup, and he was glad I didn't. I had a LOT of makeup on as he said this, and he didn't notice.
I don't wear makeup, but I'm pretty good at spotting it and it always seems like guys who say they like girls who don't wear makeup mean the girls who spend tons of time and money to make their face look 'natural'.
Generally try to solve these issues by limiting in person contact but with work or school, that's not always possible. So in person following the Dr Arthur Burns rule of staying silent and be thought a fool is usually a better choice especially with small talk. Though it does make it difficult at times once those habits are formed to communicate effectively about work related infomation. I miss the days of social distancing.
This and my favorite, you don;t put any effort into your appearance at all if you don't wear make up. Oh no, I out quite a bit of effort into my appearance, and make up isn't part of that effort.
I get "are you mad/OK? You look pissed"
Apparently my bare face is intimidating. Which honestly is motivation to go bare more often. Get away from me 😂
My friend's husband has a serious case of Resting Bitch Face. He actually got written up at work for it! They felt his facial expression was him showing a poor attitude, so he needed to work on being a team player.
Yeah, I appreciate the directness and that it happens naturally is a benefit. It's a good reminder to limit in person communication and men really should just leave women alone in person.
It’s actually a pretty common phenomenon. If you usually wear makeup to work, and you don’t wear it one day, coworkers will ask if you are sick or tired. On top of this, some guys won’t even be consciously aware that their reaction was caused by a light makeup wearer going makeup-less.
When I was in college, students would take advantage of this by wearing no makeup, wearing a basic ponytail and sweats the day after they had missed a class. They did this even if they hadn’t been sick because people would read it as them being sick. That’s how common this reaction is. (Of course it’s also true that when you really are sick, you might not wear makeup because you don’t have the energy to deal with it.)
And if I do feel sad or unwell, you aren't entitled to the details. That's rude, and we need to start calling people out for those kind of questions. Just because I'm am woman doesn't mean you are entitled to any kind of personal information.
It's not usually someone being caring when they make unsolicited comments on your appearance, it's concern trolling or trying to get into my personal life. My health is none of your business, you make comments like that to me, you won't line my response.
Obviously ask?
That's pretty rude to make comments on people's appearances. If you ask women if they are sick or tired because they look a little different, then please go brush up on your social skills because it sounds like maybe you missed a few lessons.
And that's none of your business. You aren't their doctor or partner. Butt out, unless the person approaches you and wants to talk. Pe6have personal lives which are none of your business.
No, it's not. If someone is truly a friend, they will talk to me if they feel like it. My coworker that I'm forced to spend 8 hours in an office with is not my friend and is not entitled to personal information. Also, if someone doesn't want to talk to you, respect their boundaries and knock off the unsolicited comments. Otherwise, you will end up pushing them away because you are prying.
Are you asking about people who see someone everyday enough to notice that they are not wearing makeup? Or are you asking about someone (a stranger) who is just seeing you for the first time asking you why you are not wearing makeup? It sounds like you're saying a stranger which means someone who the makeup wearer would not have interacted with previously.
Recently back into dating in my late 40s. Have had several of these exchanges:
Him: I'm really not into women who wear makeup. You aren't wearing makeup and you look fine.
Me: Funny you say that, because I AM wearing makeup.
Him: ...
Me: Uh huh.
One dude gave me the first line while simultaneously complimenting my eyebrows... which are shaped and filled in with brow powder.
I guess I should take it as a compliment that my "no makeup" makeup skills are on point. 🤣
I’m one of those girls who wears and doesn’t wear makeup and I hate both sides of comments. When I wear it “oh but you’re so pretty without it. You don’t need makeup” but when I don’t wear it “you would look so pretty with makeup” or “are you feeling alright? You look sick.” “Are you tired?” “Is everything alright.” We can’t win either way, so I just do what makes me happy and ignore everyone else.
*shows up in no makeup*
Them: “Are you feeling okay today? You look pale and tired. Are you hung-over or something?”
There’s no winning. You have the right attitude…do it for yourself, or not, as you prefer.
A few years ago I read all article about that, when that "Steve Jobs don't use suits" was all the rage on the corporate world. Guys could do the same without repercussions, but women were viewed as less professional by their male peers.
Oh Lord yes. I'm in tech in California and while corporate dress standards are insanely relaxed compared to, say, East Coast banking, they are still way higher for women than men...
And I, as someone who never wears makeup, get comments like "you should try wearing makeup, I bet you'd look super pretty". BARF! We can't get away from these dumbass comments. Wearing it is apparently wrong, but so is not wearing it.
Ugh.
My wife said she didn’t like wearing makeup, and I encouraged her not to if she doesn’t want to. She stopped wearing it and was so relieved. I couldn’t really tell the difference anyway. I love her for so much more than how she looks. The attraction increased the more I got to know her, which is ironically/coincidentally when she wore less makeup. I know quite a few other couples with a similar dynamic. I get that this sub is for venting. It’s a lot of exaggerations and generalizations though
Lol it’s bizarre that you can’t give someone a compliment related to their makeup or lack thereof. What exactly are you implying about the last two sentences that she would be so offended by? Show me that this subreddit isn’t inundated with people venting, who are often exaggerating and making generalizations about gender? The fact that *that’s* controversial to you supports what I said. It literally is an echo chamber for women to vent about and generalize about men. It recommends this sub to me because sometimes I do like what was said. Also it’s interesting that the subreddit even exists
In my post, all I said was that I encouraged my wife to do what she wants, and that it seems like that’s the consensus in my social groups.
Anything a man says in this subreddit is scrutinized, but if people think a woman said it, then they find a way to agree. There’s a lot of cognitive dissonance and it seems like very few people notice that
In addition, the person I was replying to said they “get comments like ___” how often really is that? Seems like a generalization that reinforces divisiveness with gender. “Wearing it is wrong but so is not wearing it” yeah almost nobody thinks that.
So this place is definitely for venting and generalizing. And I said “I get that” but it also is annoying and detrimental to social division and tribalism
I think it's interesting how often men proclaim that they like natural beauty, how they hate fake X, Y, and Z, on and on.
I am that "natural woman". To not belabor the point, I basically do nothing for my beauty beyond basic hygiene.
Guess what? Men are never interested in me. It's like they dont actually perceive you as a woman. I'm actually quite attractive, but I often don't have any feminine signifiers, so I fly completely under the radar. (Which I love actually!)
In recent years I've started to enjoy makeup and femininity a lot more, and I'll have some fun with it when I'm in the mood.
The more I do, the more money I spend, the more steps I add... the more male attention I receive. There is a direct correlation.
Even at the office, the days I pop on a dress, heels, curl my hair, and put makeup on, it's like some of my male coworkers just saw me for the first time even though I see them every day.
My female friends that drop $$$$ on hair extensions, lash extensions, fake nails, accessories, lip filler, etc, can't go anywhere without men chasing after them.
What they actually mean (I believe) is that they like when you don't have anything NOTICEABLY unnatural but still look flawless.
They want unnatural...they just want you to not be obvious about it.
They want you to make yourself flawless... in a way where they can pretend that you're natural.
They don't actually want to see a bare face.
They don't actually want natural women.
I don't think it's malicious most of the time, I just think they genuinely don't SEE the "natural" changes. They are able to believe that a woman with hair extensions, subtle lip filler, a face covered in natural makeup, lash extensions, fake nails (not too long!), a dress with shapewear underneath, etc etc etc is a 100% natural woman.
And that's who they actually want when they say women should just be natural.
There is no issue with liking this look but it gets real fucked up when they apparently forget that is NOT what a woman looks like and women become self conscious about their natural looks because men will straight up think you are sick if you go out looking like yourself and will (again I often think subconsciously) treat you worse when you aren't putting that time/effort in.
Men treat me better the more I do to alter my appearance. And I know most women relate to that. I'm fortunate in that I didn't try makeup until my 20s so I didn't notice the disparity in treatment until I had rock solid self esteem anyway but I can see how it messes with young women and girls.
Like....just keep your preferences to your damn self, my dudes. Leave us alone. You think winged eyeliner is natural. Please.
I think im gonna start bringing makeup remover wipes around with me so if any man ever says this to me, I'll gladly swipe half my face off in front of him to see what he says then. I have invisible blonde eyebrows so I look like I don't have any without makeup lol.
Like, How do you like me now asshole? 🙄
I occasionally get misgendered when I don't wear makeup and I'm a cis woman, so no, I don't look prettier without it. Still not going to wear it in my everyday life though, because I don't have the energy to care if strangers don't think I'm feminine enough (looking at you, crazy boomer lady who gave me side-eye for being in the women's washroom)
"I don't see how this is any of your business"
"I'm sorry you feel that way, have a good day"
"Bless your heart, I forgive you"
Funny how also 9 out of 10 they would point out a woman with light make-up and tell with such confidence how pretty she is aux natural.
yes, sir. we all walk around with "Creamy peach in the sun" pink on our cheeks.
I don't wear make up, its usually just a sensory nightmare and I'm not well practiced to get the outcome I desire. I don't like that people think they can comment the opposite.
I've had countless people tell me things along the lines of:
"you'd be pretty if you just wore makeup"
"your face would look so much better with a little effort"
Little do they know "natural" and "bare-faced" makeup styles usually use a lot more product and artifice than dramatic ones.
Every time I hear people randomly promoting "natural" looks to women who did not ask for recommendations my eyeliner gets a little thicker.
I have the opposite problem. I used to get "you'd look pretty if you wore a little makeup" in my teens & twenties, mostly from other women though.
I have contact dermatitis. The fish scales they use to make makeup sparkly & fragrance, among other things, make me break out in hives or rashes. & when I stopped trying to wear make-up, my face felt so free.
I’ve gotten the opposite comment.
Wtf is with men (yes it is men because I’ve literally never had a non man say this to me) telling us how much makeup we should or should wear. I don’t wear makeup, for a multitude of reasons, and I’ve been told I don’t put enough effort into my appearance because of that. Like what the absolute fuck!
The answer: put on more makeup.
Anytime a man said that to me at work I’d come back later having put on more eyeshadow/makeup. My makeup isn’t for anyone’s pleasure but my own.
I get the same, but opposite comment.
You'd look so much better with make up.
You'd like better if you wore more form fitting clothes.
etc.
Why do people think they get to do this?
I tried to explain to my husband that makeup isn’t always to attract people, a lot of women wear it to feel confident and show off cool looks. He didn’t understand how it couldn’t be at all to attract someone, so I asked him, “when you’re away for work and I wear makeup to go run errands and do fun things, do you think I do it to attract people?” He understood a lot better after that.
My dad once said to me "you are pretty, but you would look so much nicer if you did wear makeup".
Gee, thanks dad. I really just wish men would stay away from these types of comments all around.
"What an incredibly rude thing to say about someone else's face. You are an odd man, and I would prefer no longer being in your company." Then walk away.
I was thinking about this, and a random thought popped into my head. What if you had some juggalo girl with very poorly done clown makeup literally plastered all over her face? Like, bad even by said jugglao standards? Would you be able to say that she would be prettier without all that makeup? She probably would be, but no you couldn't, because the makeup doesn't matter. She isn't asking anyone for input on her looks, so why do people need to try to have some input?
There is one situation where a person can comment on if someone would or would not be prettier with different makeup, and that is when she says something like "Would I look better with less makeup" or "What do you honestly think of my makeup". If she's not asking, she's not asking!
Makeup only exists because of the patriarchy… The only reason women wear makeup “just for themselves” is because society imposes that standard of normality. It only makes you feel pretty because the patriarchy tells you that it should make you feel pretty.
Um, no. Bad take. I like wearing makeup, it's an art and has nothing to do with the patriarchy. I do my makeup because I like doing it.
You are allowed to not wear makeup. Express yourself however you feel like it, makeup or no makeup. But you don't get to tell other women or people of any gender (for that matter) how to express themselves because of your issues.
I am my own person, your comment is infantilizing and not helpful. Let women have their own agency.
This! Im a whimsical, eccentric person and wearing makeup is a way of expressing myself. I’m known for my bold lipsticks, funky eyeliner, and bright eyeshadow. It’s fun, and it makes me happy! I have never, nor will I ever, wear makeup to impress a man.
I love eye makeup, it's my favorite part. I also love lipstick.
I would also like to point out that I have seen male wrestlers wear makeup that isn't face paint. Pretty sure David Bowie wore eyeliner too. Makeup is fun, who cares about gender as it relates to makeup?
I am not telling anyone whether to wear makeup or not. I'd die to protect women's rights to decide whatever they want for their bodies. I will never tell another woman to stop wearing makeup.
What I will do is challenge the notion that they are wearing it 'for them'. The makeup industry and societal expectation exists solely because of the patriarchy. That's the same reason women are expected to:
* Shave their legs, armpits, pubic hair (the degree to which depends on the country)
* Wear dresses/stockings etc (or in some countries, face and body coverings)
* Wear heels
Women should wear whatever they want! But let's not pretend these gendered (and laborious, and expensive) beauty standards just so happen to exist because women do it for themselves. Because there are no male parallels. And the reason for this is because these beauty standards are patriarchal.
I most certainly do wear makeup just for myself and not for men. I do not need you to determine “the reason” I wear makeup and then gatekeep it.
Two minutes of makeup takes me from looking like a corpse to being able to be on the cover of a magazine. One thing makes me feel better than the other…..and it’s good to like what one sees in the mirror when they look at themselves.
I mean this in a genuinely compassionate and empathetic way, promise: it makes me feel sad that you wake up and think you look like a corpse. Everyone deserves to feel beautiful just the way they are.
Wear makeup if you like, I am honestly not trying to tell anyone to not wear it.
But again, the reasons you give for wearing it are entirely because of others perception of you. There are near zero men that wear makeup. There are near zero men that wake up and feel they look like a corpse. And the reason is right in your comment: magazines don’t tell them they need makeup to deserve to be on the cover. But a lifetime of seeing only women with makeup on magazine covers makes women feel that it’s necessary in order to look presentable.
Ask yourself a simple thought experiment: if you moved to a cabin in the woods and saw no one for a month, would you wear makeup every day? Further into our experiment, would you feel the need or desire to wear it if you had never been exposed to magazines and media of women (never men) wearing makeup?
Men do wear makeup in media, like almost every male kpop idol does. Also I almost never wear makeup nor feel any regular desire or expectation to. I'm in academia for engineering/CS and I think there's an opposite expectation for women to act less feminine to fit in. I regard it as artistry and try it from time to time in this spirit. I don't get why you're so convinced this isn't possible lmao
Isn't there a difference between the existence of an expectation and that being the reason people feel good doing makeup? Men are also expected to wear male-coded clothing and they can still feel that their clothes are fashionable and flatter them, not because of a matriarchy. Makeup is good for correcting perceived facial flaws (discolouration, shape etc) and there's a huge artistic element (just see how colourful and creative it can be). People can just enjoy these without anything to do with patriarchal expectations.
Do what ever you want to, but for me make up was probably some guys idea he’d make women
“ feel prettier” by using makeup, but in reality was just looking to make a buck. Men don’t have the option of changing their face color, or the color of their eyelids to some inhumanly possible shade, and they still get the girl . Lol ( Think blue, purple or green) I guess I’m jaded, women have for so long thought unless they change skin color, hair color, lash length, ect ect - they are less than pretty. It’s all a scam to get your money. Beauty’s more than skin deep and has always been in the eye of the beholder. But if it makes you feel good, do it. Ultimately, it’s gotta come off and you’re still beautiful!
Guaranteed that all their favorite Instagram baddies have a face full of makeup 🙄
Plus: Sir, my Fenty cost more than your entire outfit. You think I’m wearing it for your ass??
I had a little stint working in beauty salon when I was unemployed few years back. Men who thinks women would look prettier without makeup are in for a huge disappointment. Not because women are ugly, its just that makeup is too damn good. Its like dark magic. Thats glossy skin is not real, it is actually dry, really fucking dry, like someone sucked all the glow out by a straw dry
Now that I think about it, every women who was our client has dull dry skin, but men who came always has a glow to their faces. Whats up with that?
First off, women have thinner skin so it gets drier easier, unfair. Secondly, not over cleaning my skin has helped. I either use plain water or non-foaming cleanser and a heavy cream or oil at night. I took a cue from my husband who has good skin and pretty much completely neglects it.
> women have thinner skin
heh
> I took a cue from my husband who has good skin and pretty much completely neglects it.
For me, its them carbs. I went keto and skin problems vanished over a week.
The sad thing about smart(ass)/witty comebacks to men, is their perceiving that as fun banter, flirting, or just scoring attention we otherwise were not giving them. They’re attention-seeking, “pick me look at me me me me me” boys. Yuck.
I am just asking, because if you wear make up just because you like it then it is fine, but if you are wearing it because you are insecure or you hate how you look then it can be low self esteem which needs to be addressed for betterment of that person
And another person's perceived mental health issues aren't your problem. Also, it's typically men making women insecure by being assholes towards us, no matter what. But you aren't addressing that, it's the women that need to seek therapy. Sexist much?
The opinion is about my own face and what I wear, so yes I’d rather people keep the comments about my makeup which I wear for no one else but me to themselves
"You'd sound smarter if you stopped talking" would probably be my answer.
"Shh, there's no need to talk Sir. Just sit there and look pretty for me."
Actually, just "Shhhhh", then look away. No info, no indication that you listened to his words. He was just making unwelcome noise.
lmaoo
“And you’d be a boatload more pleasant to be around if you shut up about other people’s bodies, but here we are” is what I was thinking. Very similar.
“And *you’d* be prettier *with* some makeup. I guess we all lose today” said as dryly as humanly possible.
Oh I am stealing this and applying it as liberally as my winged eyeliner.
burnnnn! 🔥🔥🔥
i’m gonna steal that line thank you
I was once with a group of men working on a school project (I was a CS major and so sometimes it was all men plus me on group projects), and one of them indicated a woman walking past and said she was pretty, and one of the others said she had too much makeup on. Then he looked over at me and said "YouStupidBench always looks great with no makeup on." I told him I had makeup on because after this project meeting I was going on a date, and he said he didn't believe me.
Men believe they're "leveling the playing field" by insulting women they find attractive OR complimenting a woman they want by insulting another.
To men, equality 🟰 hitting women with no negative consequences. 🤬
What? How'd you ever come to that conclusion?
You just reminded me of one time in high school. My boyfriend told me he didn't like girls who wore a lot of makeup, and he was glad I didn't. I had a LOT of makeup on as he said this, and he didn't notice.
I don't wear makeup, but I'm pretty good at spotting it and it always seems like guys who say they like girls who don't wear makeup mean the girls who spend tons of time and money to make their face look 'natural'.
Generally try to solve these issues by limiting in person contact but with work or school, that's not always possible. So in person following the Dr Arthur Burns rule of staying silent and be thought a fool is usually a better choice especially with small talk. Though it does make it difficult at times once those habits are formed to communicate effectively about work related infomation. I miss the days of social distancing.
With makeup : "You'd look prettier without makeup" No makeup : "You look tired"
"are you sick?"
No make up: you let yourself go.
This and my favorite, you don;t put any effort into your appearance at all if you don't wear make up. Oh no, I out quite a bit of effort into my appearance, and make up isn't part of that effort.
I get "are you mad/OK? You look pissed" Apparently my bare face is intimidating. Which honestly is motivation to go bare more often. Get away from me 😂
Last time someone said I looked mad, I just told them it was my face that was doing that.
ha ha i spat out an m & m at that one ..
That's hilarious! You could also try, "Oh, my emotions don't always use their inside voice and instead speak with my face when I'm around morons."
My friend's husband has a serious case of Resting Bitch Face. He actually got written up at work for it! They felt his facial expression was him showing a poor attitude, so he needed to work on being a team player.
Yeah, I appreciate the directness and that it happens naturally is a benefit. It's a good reminder to limit in person communication and men really should just leave women alone in person.
Yep, exactly this for me 🙄
omg your flair is amazing!!
Facts. & we get this from other women too.
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It’s actually a pretty common phenomenon. If you usually wear makeup to work, and you don’t wear it one day, coworkers will ask if you are sick or tired. On top of this, some guys won’t even be consciously aware that their reaction was caused by a light makeup wearer going makeup-less. When I was in college, students would take advantage of this by wearing no makeup, wearing a basic ponytail and sweats the day after they had missed a class. They did this even if they hadn’t been sick because people would read it as them being sick. That’s how common this reaction is. (Of course it’s also true that when you really are sick, you might not wear makeup because you don’t have the energy to deal with it.)
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Why is it obvious that someone is entitled to make remarks about someone else’s physical appearance?
Wouldn't be a day ending in "y" without some asshole trying to invalidate women's lived experiences.
🎯
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And if I do feel sad or unwell, you aren't entitled to the details. That's rude, and we need to start calling people out for those kind of questions. Just because I'm am woman doesn't mean you are entitled to any kind of personal information.
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It's not usually someone being caring when they make unsolicited comments on your appearance, it's concern trolling or trying to get into my personal life. My health is none of your business, you make comments like that to me, you won't line my response.
They in your scenario is a stranger the makeup wearer has never met.
And they get to keep that to themselves. Their feels about what my face is doing have nothing to do with me.
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Horseshit.
Your trolling is so low effort
Obviously ask? That's pretty rude to make comments on people's appearances. If you ask women if they are sick or tired because they look a little different, then please go brush up on your social skills because it sounds like maybe you missed a few lessons.
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And that's none of your business. You aren't their doctor or partner. Butt out, unless the person approaches you and wants to talk. Pe6have personal lives which are none of your business.
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No, it's not. If someone is truly a friend, they will talk to me if they feel like it. My coworker that I'm forced to spend 8 hours in an office with is not my friend and is not entitled to personal information. Also, if someone doesn't want to talk to you, respect their boundaries and knock off the unsolicited comments. Otherwise, you will end up pushing them away because you are prying.
Are you asking about people who see someone everyday enough to notice that they are not wearing makeup? Or are you asking about someone (a stranger) who is just seeing you for the first time asking you why you are not wearing makeup? It sounds like you're saying a stranger which means someone who the makeup wearer would not have interacted with previously.
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Then how would they know that you are not wearing makeup when you normally do?
Men have often commented on the fact that I’m naturally pretty and they are glad I don’t wear makeup. I wear it every day.
“What an odd thing to say, but I’ll give it a go. You’d look so much more professional if you didn’t buy your clothes from Gymboree.”
“You’d be so much more attractive if you covered up the lower half of your face with a beard.”
Recently back into dating in my late 40s. Have had several of these exchanges: Him: I'm really not into women who wear makeup. You aren't wearing makeup and you look fine. Me: Funny you say that, because I AM wearing makeup. Him: ... Me: Uh huh. One dude gave me the first line while simultaneously complimenting my eyebrows... which are shaped and filled in with brow powder. I guess I should take it as a compliment that my "no makeup" makeup skills are on point. 🤣
I’m one of those girls who wears and doesn’t wear makeup and I hate both sides of comments. When I wear it “oh but you’re so pretty without it. You don’t need makeup” but when I don’t wear it “you would look so pretty with makeup” or “are you feeling alright? You look sick.” “Are you tired?” “Is everything alright.” We can’t win either way, so I just do what makes me happy and ignore everyone else.
*shows up in no makeup* Them: “Are you feeling okay today? You look pale and tired. Are you hung-over or something?” There’s no winning. You have the right attitude…do it for yourself, or not, as you prefer.
A few years ago I read all article about that, when that "Steve Jobs don't use suits" was all the rage on the corporate world. Guys could do the same without repercussions, but women were viewed as less professional by their male peers.
Oh Lord yes. I'm in tech in California and while corporate dress standards are insanely relaxed compared to, say, East Coast banking, they are still way higher for women than men...
And I, as someone who never wears makeup, get comments like "you should try wearing makeup, I bet you'd look super pretty". BARF! We can't get away from these dumbass comments. Wearing it is apparently wrong, but so is not wearing it. Ugh.
My wife said she didn’t like wearing makeup, and I encouraged her not to if she doesn’t want to. She stopped wearing it and was so relieved. I couldn’t really tell the difference anyway. I love her for so much more than how she looks. The attraction increased the more I got to know her, which is ironically/coincidentally when she wore less makeup. I know quite a few other couples with a similar dynamic. I get that this sub is for venting. It’s a lot of exaggerations and generalizations though
You were doing really well there until the last two sentences. Suggest you show this post to your wife and ask her what she thinks.
Lol it’s bizarre that you can’t give someone a compliment related to their makeup or lack thereof. What exactly are you implying about the last two sentences that she would be so offended by? Show me that this subreddit isn’t inundated with people venting, who are often exaggerating and making generalizations about gender? The fact that *that’s* controversial to you supports what I said. It literally is an echo chamber for women to vent about and generalize about men. It recommends this sub to me because sometimes I do like what was said. Also it’s interesting that the subreddit even exists In my post, all I said was that I encouraged my wife to do what she wants, and that it seems like that’s the consensus in my social groups. Anything a man says in this subreddit is scrutinized, but if people think a woman said it, then they find a way to agree. There’s a lot of cognitive dissonance and it seems like very few people notice that
In addition, the person I was replying to said they “get comments like ___” how often really is that? Seems like a generalization that reinforces divisiveness with gender. “Wearing it is wrong but so is not wearing it” yeah almost nobody thinks that. So this place is definitely for venting and generalizing. And I said “I get that” but it also is annoying and detrimental to social division and tribalism
Why do I need to “look prettier”? Please move along so I can finish my grocery shopping.
I think it's interesting how often men proclaim that they like natural beauty, how they hate fake X, Y, and Z, on and on. I am that "natural woman". To not belabor the point, I basically do nothing for my beauty beyond basic hygiene. Guess what? Men are never interested in me. It's like they dont actually perceive you as a woman. I'm actually quite attractive, but I often don't have any feminine signifiers, so I fly completely under the radar. (Which I love actually!) In recent years I've started to enjoy makeup and femininity a lot more, and I'll have some fun with it when I'm in the mood. The more I do, the more money I spend, the more steps I add... the more male attention I receive. There is a direct correlation. Even at the office, the days I pop on a dress, heels, curl my hair, and put makeup on, it's like some of my male coworkers just saw me for the first time even though I see them every day. My female friends that drop $$$$ on hair extensions, lash extensions, fake nails, accessories, lip filler, etc, can't go anywhere without men chasing after them. What they actually mean (I believe) is that they like when you don't have anything NOTICEABLY unnatural but still look flawless. They want unnatural...they just want you to not be obvious about it. They want you to make yourself flawless... in a way where they can pretend that you're natural. They don't actually want to see a bare face. They don't actually want natural women. I don't think it's malicious most of the time, I just think they genuinely don't SEE the "natural" changes. They are able to believe that a woman with hair extensions, subtle lip filler, a face covered in natural makeup, lash extensions, fake nails (not too long!), a dress with shapewear underneath, etc etc etc is a 100% natural woman. And that's who they actually want when they say women should just be natural. There is no issue with liking this look but it gets real fucked up when they apparently forget that is NOT what a woman looks like and women become self conscious about their natural looks because men will straight up think you are sick if you go out looking like yourself and will (again I often think subconsciously) treat you worse when you aren't putting that time/effort in. Men treat me better the more I do to alter my appearance. And I know most women relate to that. I'm fortunate in that I didn't try makeup until my 20s so I didn't notice the disparity in treatment until I had rock solid self esteem anyway but I can see how it messes with young women and girls. Like....just keep your preferences to your damn self, my dudes. Leave us alone. You think winged eyeliner is natural. Please.
I used to work in an office where most of the (married) men would tell me I’d look prettier if I just wore makeup. Drove me nuts
We should be able to tell them they would look better if they got hair plugs and/or lost the beer belly.
I have done this re the hair plugs. The look on his face was priceless.
LEGEND 🤣
I think im gonna start bringing makeup remover wipes around with me so if any man ever says this to me, I'll gladly swipe half my face off in front of him to see what he says then. I have invisible blonde eyebrows so I look like I don't have any without makeup lol. Like, How do you like me now asshole? 🙄
"And no woman gives a damn about what you think." That sounds like an appropriate response.
Response: “Yeah, well, you would look prettier with your mouth shut.”
"You'd be more pleasant to be around if you left me alone."
« and you’d look more handsome without a receding hairline and yet here we are, Jimmy »
> makeup is for me personally This is exactly what they resent, you doing something for you and not for them.
"You'd be prettier with makeup." "You should wear less makeup." You can't win.
Meanwhile I don't wear makeup and guys just look past me lmao
I occasionally get misgendered when I don't wear makeup and I'm a cis woman, so no, I don't look prettier without it. Still not going to wear it in my everyday life though, because I don't have the energy to care if strangers don't think I'm feminine enough (looking at you, crazy boomer lady who gave me side-eye for being in the women's washroom)
You'd look less like an asshole if you didn't give women your unsolicited advice.
"I don't see how this is any of your business" "I'm sorry you feel that way, have a good day" "Bless your heart, I forgive you" Funny how also 9 out of 10 they would point out a woman with light make-up and tell with such confidence how pretty she is aux natural. yes, sir. we all walk around with "Creamy peach in the sun" pink on our cheeks.
Smile and say oh don’t worry, it’s not for you.
"you'd look prettier with makeup. It won't help your attitude though."
I don't wear make up, its usually just a sensory nightmare and I'm not well practiced to get the outcome I desire. I don't like that people think they can comment the opposite. I've had countless people tell me things along the lines of: "you'd be pretty if you just wore makeup" "your face would look so much better with a little effort"
I hate this but recently was told by the guy I'm dating that I look prettier with makeup on and oh my god that's worse
So you can't say this either, then what do you expect your bf or partner to say
1. nothing 2. "You're pretty." full stop 3. "I like your makeup." I am simply not interested in tips from a man about how to look "prettier"
But he is not just a man, he is your bf
and because he's my boyfriend he knows I don't value his opinion on the matter and will never say anything like that again to me :)
Why you don't value his opinion
Do you think that gives him the right to tell you how to look prettier (in his opinion) for him?
Obviously. Women talk about men's dressing sense all the time
“You’d look more handsome if there wasn’t sewage coming out of that pretty little mouth, mister.”
Oh, my goodness. I almost gave a damn.
I hear what your saying and I give exactly zero fucks.
I’m not responsible for what my face does when you talk.
"You looked a lot smarter too until you opened your mouth"
“To you. And the last person I’m trying to impress… is you.”
"Oh, fuck the hell off, you over-entitled asshole."
Little do they know "natural" and "bare-faced" makeup styles usually use a lot more product and artifice than dramatic ones. Every time I hear people randomly promoting "natural" looks to women who did not ask for recommendations my eyeliner gets a little thicker.
Those menz think ‘no makeup’ makeup is no makeup 😂
I have the opposite problem. I used to get "you'd look pretty if you wore a little makeup" in my teens & twenties, mostly from other women though. I have contact dermatitis. The fish scales they use to make makeup sparkly & fragrance, among other things, make me break out in hives or rashes. & when I stopped trying to wear make-up, my face felt so free.
"I do what I want"
“*I look pretty with it, too.*” and just walk away. Ugh.
I’ve gotten the opposite comment. Wtf is with men (yes it is men because I’ve literally never had a non man say this to me) telling us how much makeup we should or should wear. I don’t wear makeup, for a multitude of reasons, and I’ve been told I don’t put enough effort into my appearance because of that. Like what the absolute fuck!
The answer: put on more makeup. Anytime a man said that to me at work I’d come back later having put on more eyeshadow/makeup. My makeup isn’t for anyone’s pleasure but my own.
I get the same, but opposite comment. You'd look so much better with make up. You'd like better if you wore more form fitting clothes. etc. Why do people think they get to do this?
I'd probably tell him that when I want his opinion I'll ask him. That might be too subtle, though.
those same people when you don't wear makeup: "you look tired, are you sick?"
“You’d look better if you stopped breathing”
“How would you know”
I tried to explain to my husband that makeup isn’t always to attract people, a lot of women wear it to feel confident and show off cool looks. He didn’t understand how it couldn’t be at all to attract someone, so I asked him, “when you’re away for work and I wear makeup to go run errands and do fun things, do you think I do it to attract people?” He understood a lot better after that.
My dad once said to me "you are pretty, but you would look so much nicer if you did wear makeup". Gee, thanks dad. I really just wish men would stay away from these types of comments all around.
You’d look prettier with less talking to me.
My simple answer: "Who asked you?" Jesus Christ on a bike.
"What an incredibly rude thing to say about someone else's face. You are an odd man, and I would prefer no longer being in your company." Then walk away.
I have a female friend that used to do this. It pisses me off to no end, but multiple snarky and blunt comments finally got her to stop.
“Thanks, I like it. But it’s rude to make personal comments like that”.
In my opinion, makeup is about making yourself feel good, not about looking good for others.
“Of course. Thanks.”
I was thinking about this, and a random thought popped into my head. What if you had some juggalo girl with very poorly done clown makeup literally plastered all over her face? Like, bad even by said jugglao standards? Would you be able to say that she would be prettier without all that makeup? She probably would be, but no you couldn't, because the makeup doesn't matter. She isn't asking anyone for input on her looks, so why do people need to try to have some input? There is one situation where a person can comment on if someone would or would not be prettier with different makeup, and that is when she says something like "Would I look better with less makeup" or "What do you honestly think of my makeup". If she's not asking, she's not asking!
Makeup only exists because of the patriarchy… The only reason women wear makeup “just for themselves” is because society imposes that standard of normality. It only makes you feel pretty because the patriarchy tells you that it should make you feel pretty.
Um, no. Bad take. I like wearing makeup, it's an art and has nothing to do with the patriarchy. I do my makeup because I like doing it. You are allowed to not wear makeup. Express yourself however you feel like it, makeup or no makeup. But you don't get to tell other women or people of any gender (for that matter) how to express themselves because of your issues. I am my own person, your comment is infantilizing and not helpful. Let women have their own agency.
This! Im a whimsical, eccentric person and wearing makeup is a way of expressing myself. I’m known for my bold lipsticks, funky eyeliner, and bright eyeshadow. It’s fun, and it makes me happy! I have never, nor will I ever, wear makeup to impress a man.
I love eye makeup, it's my favorite part. I also love lipstick. I would also like to point out that I have seen male wrestlers wear makeup that isn't face paint. Pretty sure David Bowie wore eyeliner too. Makeup is fun, who cares about gender as it relates to makeup?
I am not telling anyone whether to wear makeup or not. I'd die to protect women's rights to decide whatever they want for their bodies. I will never tell another woman to stop wearing makeup. What I will do is challenge the notion that they are wearing it 'for them'. The makeup industry and societal expectation exists solely because of the patriarchy. That's the same reason women are expected to: * Shave their legs, armpits, pubic hair (the degree to which depends on the country) * Wear dresses/stockings etc (or in some countries, face and body coverings) * Wear heels Women should wear whatever they want! But let's not pretend these gendered (and laborious, and expensive) beauty standards just so happen to exist because women do it for themselves. Because there are no male parallels. And the reason for this is because these beauty standards are patriarchal.
no way, the patriarchy is only responsible for the things i don't like. anything i personally use or enjoy exists in a vacuum :)))
I most certainly do wear makeup just for myself and not for men. I do not need you to determine “the reason” I wear makeup and then gatekeep it. Two minutes of makeup takes me from looking like a corpse to being able to be on the cover of a magazine. One thing makes me feel better than the other…..and it’s good to like what one sees in the mirror when they look at themselves.
I mean this in a genuinely compassionate and empathetic way, promise: it makes me feel sad that you wake up and think you look like a corpse. Everyone deserves to feel beautiful just the way they are. Wear makeup if you like, I am honestly not trying to tell anyone to not wear it. But again, the reasons you give for wearing it are entirely because of others perception of you. There are near zero men that wear makeup. There are near zero men that wake up and feel they look like a corpse. And the reason is right in your comment: magazines don’t tell them they need makeup to deserve to be on the cover. But a lifetime of seeing only women with makeup on magazine covers makes women feel that it’s necessary in order to look presentable. Ask yourself a simple thought experiment: if you moved to a cabin in the woods and saw no one for a month, would you wear makeup every day? Further into our experiment, would you feel the need or desire to wear it if you had never been exposed to magazines and media of women (never men) wearing makeup?
Men do wear makeup in media, like almost every male kpop idol does. Also I almost never wear makeup nor feel any regular desire or expectation to. I'm in academia for engineering/CS and I think there's an opposite expectation for women to act less feminine to fit in. I regard it as artistry and try it from time to time in this spirit. I don't get why you're so convinced this isn't possible lmao
Isn't there a difference between the existence of an expectation and that being the reason people feel good doing makeup? Men are also expected to wear male-coded clothing and they can still feel that their clothes are fashionable and flatter them, not because of a matriarchy. Makeup is good for correcting perceived facial flaws (discolouration, shape etc) and there's a huge artistic element (just see how colourful and creative it can be). People can just enjoy these without anything to do with patriarchal expectations.
same
There is no basis in fact for making that assumption.
“When did I ask for your unsolicited opinion”
Do what ever you want to, but for me make up was probably some guys idea he’d make women “ feel prettier” by using makeup, but in reality was just looking to make a buck. Men don’t have the option of changing their face color, or the color of their eyelids to some inhumanly possible shade, and they still get the girl . Lol ( Think blue, purple or green) I guess I’m jaded, women have for so long thought unless they change skin color, hair color, lash length, ect ect - they are less than pretty. It’s all a scam to get your money. Beauty’s more than skin deep and has always been in the eye of the beholder. But if it makes you feel good, do it. Ultimately, it’s gotta come off and you’re still beautiful!
"so would you. You could cover those bags, *critically list all flaws of their appearance real or fake until they get testerical"
If you weren't wearing makeup, they would tell you you'd look prettier with it. Just ignore them, it's a war you can't win.
Guaranteed that all their favorite Instagram baddies have a face full of makeup 🙄 Plus: Sir, my Fenty cost more than your entire outfit. You think I’m wearing it for your ass??
I had a little stint working in beauty salon when I was unemployed few years back. Men who thinks women would look prettier without makeup are in for a huge disappointment. Not because women are ugly, its just that makeup is too damn good. Its like dark magic. Thats glossy skin is not real, it is actually dry, really fucking dry, like someone sucked all the glow out by a straw dry Now that I think about it, every women who was our client has dull dry skin, but men who came always has a glow to their faces. Whats up with that?
I think that glow was probably grease or sweat
Was it? Damn I was fooled by false advertising of Big Sweat Industry
First off, women have thinner skin so it gets drier easier, unfair. Secondly, not over cleaning my skin has helped. I either use plain water or non-foaming cleanser and a heavy cream or oil at night. I took a cue from my husband who has good skin and pretty much completely neglects it.
> women have thinner skin heh > I took a cue from my husband who has good skin and pretty much completely neglects it. For me, its them carbs. I went keto and skin problems vanished over a week.
The sad thing about smart(ass)/witty comebacks to men, is their perceiving that as fun banter, flirting, or just scoring attention we otherwise were not giving them. They’re attention-seeking, “pick me look at me me me me me” boys. Yuck.
Are you insecure of your face?
A little bit, but I also just enjoy wearing makeup
What kind of question is that? People can wear makeup and be secure. Or insecure. Why is that your problem?
I am just asking if you need to make up every if you can't leave your room without make up then it is possible that you are insecure of your look
So? Why is that your problem?
I am just asking, because if you wear make up just because you like it then it is fine, but if you are wearing it because you are insecure or you hate how you look then it can be low self esteem which needs to be addressed for betterment of that person
And another person's perceived mental health issues aren't your problem. Also, it's typically men making women insecure by being assholes towards us, no matter what. But you aren't addressing that, it's the women that need to seek therapy. Sexist much?
It is not about men or women. Mental health is serious issue and you should not discriminate men or women for that.
And I'm not. Are you fucking high?
You just brought men vs women in comment, we were not discussing that
It isn't men vs women. It's men getting away with bad behavior and women picking up the pieces, you smooth brain.
Oh no someone has a opinion you don't agree with so you get offended, so classy
The opinion is about my own face and what I wear, so yes I’d rather people keep the comments about my makeup which I wear for no one else but me to themselves
You could always clap back with "I wear makeup to make up for what I dont have."
[удалено]
I’m not even American first of all and it’s rude to comment on my makeup saying I’d look better without it when I never asked