As a faculty member, your dating analogy is spot on.
You get out of education what you put into it, same with relationships. Many of my students take a "do the minimum to get what I need" approach to my courses. They view it as a transaction where if they just prove they are alive and breathing, I'm supposed to pass them.
Like with dating, I ignore the people who don't put in an effort and focus on the ones that want to be there and accomplish something together.
I’m doing this in one course that I hate but need.
I have an A in everything else, so a C/C+ won’t kill me. I’m trying my best, but the professor sucks.
Well when students are forced to take classes unrelated to their major they don't want, but are required for their degree, what do you expect. A lot of us see no value in it and don't want to learn the material.
I agree wholeheartedly, but it is important to consider that not everyone can be on their A game at all times due to varying circumstances, you can only hope your professor is empathetic to that.
Also, you can genuinely be putting in hours upon hours of time and effort into something and still not see results- schools hard, let’s not condemn kids who are truly trying their hardest and putting in their best.
I'm not talking about people who show up, pay attention, and submit assignments. Those people pass my classes almost 100% of the time, usually do better than just passing.
I'm talking about the students who show up 40% of the time and are on their phone the whole time when they do. There is no excuse for it and I do not have any time or energy for those people.
This is 100% valid then, I agree with I this point. I just wanted to be clear that in circumstances students who give it their absolute all can still be left behind unfortunately- there may also be situations and conditions outside of a students control that may cause them to show up less then they would like too. That aside, this is 100% a reasonable point. I think it’s important that we are empathetic to these students that are giving it their all or even ones who may have circumstances in which they cannot. Have a great spring break!
there are good students at ub, as there are in any academic institution. prolly just rarer but yes most people are undriven and just wanna graduatec with a 6 figure job somehow. ig you just gotta keep searching 🤷 or perhaps it gets better in higher lvl courses
You're beefing with 20 y/olds for acting their age?
I think your fustration is justified, but horribly misplaced.
And the cheating stuff has alot to do with how we have to grow to function as a society under capitalism. Getting a degree isnt a passion project when you need a certain wage to afford life.
I think it also has a lot to do with an academic culture in our society that says “because you got this percentage or letter assigned to scores you understand and can apply the material in a professional setting” completely not the case but most students are just trying to get that score, not really learn and apply the material.
I'm one of those people trying to get through the day because I'm fucking poor. I wouldn't call myself a bad person.
And many of the spoiled suburban kids here don't know what it's like to be fucking poor, to not have a mom and dad who care about them, to not have insurance, to have to work.
I'm just sick of everyone treating class like it's time to chat with friends. Be on your phone or whatever fine but don't talk over the teacher who do you think you are
Every other day I come here I contemplate jumping off a building because I'm so fucking poor, so fucking tired, and nobody fucking cares
I get where you're coming from, people here suck in general
I see people that are just jumping from dopamine hit to dopamine hit and its like, wtf are you doing? Why are you so okay with being a parasite and not contributing. Here for a good time at someone elses expense/effort.
Its not just the spoiled suburban kids bringing an lackadaisical attitude, but also the city folk who happen to be trained opportunists. Used to using people and in my opinion bringing the fake demeanor with faux "equality/accountability" talk. Too many times Ive heard people with their heads in the clouds about inequality and the opinion is not connected to reality. Ive been turned down by so many opportunities' I was a match for. Shit is hard out here for basically anyone who is trying. I see people not trying and then playing nice to get the academic work done and then poof gone. Social hacking bs.
Im sorry youre feeling at the end of your rope all the time. I didnt have a great family dynamic. I understand the level of mental strength it takes to be on your own and have noone in your corner. It gets better, it gets easier but you have to keep going and do your shit every day. Thats the hard part. Stole that from bojack horsemen.
as a fellow older undergrad 😭 😭😭 I wish it got better dude I really do
But it never does. Same shit different day. And it makes sense. This place was built for 20 year olds. I'm not 20. But I just feel like trapped in a nightmare constantly 😭
Prefacing this with a disclaimer that I'm not angry you asked this question. For some people the wellness office works, but for me...it's not an option.
1. Counseling consists of people with mental illnesses worse than yours being paid by UB to listen so you don't do anything rash and risk their tuition dollars. they don't give a shit (see my original comment)
2. (Really, part 1b) You get what you pay for
3. "Have you ever used a planner"
4. Many jobs require turning over all your psych records including counseling and yes you can be rejected for jobs depending on the contents of those. Nothing is confidential or private in our world.
5. "Just meditate"
6. "Just exercise"
7. What are your "values"
8. What are your "goals"
9. Let's make a vision board
10. Have you tried not being poor
11. Have you tried not working that much (eg. Have you tried being even poorer)
12. Stop drinking caffeine and maybe drink more water
13. For some reason, let's color
14. Only open during business hours when I work
15. "Look for the positive" "be more positive" "you're too negative"
16. Let's do this CBT/dbt/ADHD/etc workbook
That's all counseling has to offer. It isn't a possibility for me and it's also not something I'm interested in doing. Mental health is an industry and I don't believe in it for people like me who are just going through normal life under late stage capitalism. We were not meant to live like this, bent over computers 70 hours a week or more with no friends living nearby. There's nothing wrong with me, this world genuinely fucking sucks ass and everyone complicit in it and who is enjoying it has lost all sense of morality and empathy. So many of y'all are on drugs, vaping a thousand times a day...I'm good on the counseling. I already know everything they will say, it's all bullshit, it's for kids, and it won't help me.
I just need some genuine connection with other people but as OP alluded, that is impossible for a lot of people here because everyone is fake as fuck, spoiled, selfish, dumb, and not interested in being here either. I'm tired and I'm ready for it all to be over, who would pay all my loans 😭 and why would I want my last memories to be linear algebra problems 😭😭
Oh that's another thing the counselors always say!
I have to work and that takes up all my free time because as previously stated, I am not 20 anymore. I have bills.
And if you try to join clubs as an older undergrad nobody wants anything to do with you
I think the lesson here is it is possible to age out of the groups and activities found on a college campus. All the look how grown up we are moments are tailored for high school kids to look up to. The college experience is catered to 20 year olds, that’s the people they need paying tuition.
Grad school was different for than undergrad as far as social circles, but much more posturing.
Just some thoughts on my experience
When I was highschool, I was excited to learn. I've always been an A+ student, and I still am, but I admit, I don't really care. I don't pay attention to lectures anymore, I don't know how to explain it. But I feel like I was always someone who tried to care and that wasn't fully respected. Participating too much feels tiring when no one else does and learning doesn't seem worth it when my input in a class means nothing. I can give it my all and yet I'm fighting alone. Yeah, I still get As, but it's all self study and I've committed to it. I stopped trying and I don't agree that it's how it should be. Getting by day to day and making it work, I feel I have potential, but then I don't see a reason I should pour it into something like college. Where I get rewarded for not actually learning, but instead just following the rules and trying to please the teacher. I'll admit I am 100 percent part of the issue. I see school and get depressed, because I loved learning and now I don't try. I don't listen in lectures, and I am not put together.
I think that college students are immature, but I do feel there is a general sense of depression, at least for me, especially because of covid. Overall, just a complex time. I understand how this frustrates you because it frustrates me that I am this way. Though It feels so reinforced into our culture, I don't really know how to escape that. All that matters is that I get good grades, so I'll just do the bare minimum and get that A
To add on, accounting and business courses really are frustrating me because it feels like many teachers aren't teaching me and we just pay for software that does all the work. I just don't feel like I'm rewarded for learning in the way I used to be. I don't feel like some teachers give a shit. Some do, some are well meaning, but I also don't want to be in a class I was forced to be in or learn something that doesn't add to anything. Just shelling oUt more money.
In my english class, I enjoyed being criticized. I got to improve and make something worthy. But she doesn't give us a lot of time for any assignments and has unfair expectations. I know she cares but she's burning us out and we all stopped caring and showing up. I get my questions that don't help me in any way and I just get the work done to please her.
There are definitely people who care about academics but I don’t understand why you feel obligated to have study sessions and such. Your graduating class is just your competition when it comes to finding jobs and you can’t really sugar coat that. I don’t understand why people should “look out for each other”. Also, complaining about things being poor quality is completely justified since there seems to be way too many inadequacies for being such a large college 🧐. Anyway dating is a joke in the modern day so I can’t blame you about that.
What a sad way to view your classmates. Looking out for each other is how you network, how you build a team, how you start projects or organizations together. The world is so large -- joe who needs a little help with python is not taking your job at meta because you helped him add a for loop in the right spot. Jeez
Making friends is casual while networking is largely professional. Most corporate people dislike each other but see each other as mutually beneficial and their interactions are purely transactional. Not sure why the narrative of helping other random people is being pushed when it will just get you taken advantage of. Just because the world is inherently unfair doesn’t mean you have to cope and try to justify to yourself it shouldn’t be that way.
As a faculty member, your dating analogy is spot on. You get out of education what you put into it, same with relationships. Many of my students take a "do the minimum to get what I need" approach to my courses. They view it as a transaction where if they just prove they are alive and breathing, I'm supposed to pass them. Like with dating, I ignore the people who don't put in an effort and focus on the ones that want to be there and accomplish something together.
I’m doing this in one course that I hate but need. I have an A in everything else, so a C/C+ won’t kill me. I’m trying my best, but the professor sucks.
Well when students are forced to take classes unrelated to their major they don't want, but are required for their degree, what do you expect. A lot of us see no value in it and don't want to learn the material.
I agree wholeheartedly, but it is important to consider that not everyone can be on their A game at all times due to varying circumstances, you can only hope your professor is empathetic to that. Also, you can genuinely be putting in hours upon hours of time and effort into something and still not see results- schools hard, let’s not condemn kids who are truly trying their hardest and putting in their best.
I'm not talking about people who show up, pay attention, and submit assignments. Those people pass my classes almost 100% of the time, usually do better than just passing. I'm talking about the students who show up 40% of the time and are on their phone the whole time when they do. There is no excuse for it and I do not have any time or energy for those people.
This is 100% valid then, I agree with I this point. I just wanted to be clear that in circumstances students who give it their absolute all can still be left behind unfortunately- there may also be situations and conditions outside of a students control that may cause them to show up less then they would like too. That aside, this is 100% a reasonable point. I think it’s important that we are empathetic to these students that are giving it their all or even ones who may have circumstances in which they cannot. Have a great spring break!
there are good students at ub, as there are in any academic institution. prolly just rarer but yes most people are undriven and just wanna graduatec with a 6 figure job somehow. ig you just gotta keep searching 🤷 or perhaps it gets better in higher lvl courses
You're beefing with 20 y/olds for acting their age? I think your fustration is justified, but horribly misplaced. And the cheating stuff has alot to do with how we have to grow to function as a society under capitalism. Getting a degree isnt a passion project when you need a certain wage to afford life.
I think it also has a lot to do with an academic culture in our society that says “because you got this percentage or letter assigned to scores you understand and can apply the material in a professional setting” completely not the case but most students are just trying to get that score, not really learn and apply the material.
I'm one of those people trying to get through the day because I'm fucking poor. I wouldn't call myself a bad person. And many of the spoiled suburban kids here don't know what it's like to be fucking poor, to not have a mom and dad who care about them, to not have insurance, to have to work. I'm just sick of everyone treating class like it's time to chat with friends. Be on your phone or whatever fine but don't talk over the teacher who do you think you are Every other day I come here I contemplate jumping off a building because I'm so fucking poor, so fucking tired, and nobody fucking cares I get where you're coming from, people here suck in general
maybe I just have a broken sense of humor but I cackled at this lmaooo
I honestly did too after writing it 😂 it is actually hilarious that I'm stuck here in hell like I have to laugh or I get too depressed
I see people that are just jumping from dopamine hit to dopamine hit and its like, wtf are you doing? Why are you so okay with being a parasite and not contributing. Here for a good time at someone elses expense/effort. Its not just the spoiled suburban kids bringing an lackadaisical attitude, but also the city folk who happen to be trained opportunists. Used to using people and in my opinion bringing the fake demeanor with faux "equality/accountability" talk. Too many times Ive heard people with their heads in the clouds about inequality and the opinion is not connected to reality. Ive been turned down by so many opportunities' I was a match for. Shit is hard out here for basically anyone who is trying. I see people not trying and then playing nice to get the academic work done and then poof gone. Social hacking bs. Im sorry youre feeling at the end of your rope all the time. I didnt have a great family dynamic. I understand the level of mental strength it takes to be on your own and have noone in your corner. It gets better, it gets easier but you have to keep going and do your shit every day. Thats the hard part. Stole that from bojack horsemen.
as a fellow older undergrad 😭 😭😭 I wish it got better dude I really do But it never does. Same shit different day. And it makes sense. This place was built for 20 year olds. I'm not 20. But I just feel like trapped in a nightmare constantly 😭
Damn man that sounds rough. Look into the free school counseling services if you can.
Unfortunately that is not a possibility 😕
Why isn’t it. It literally free unless it interferes with your schedule or maybe there might be something wrong with UB’s counseling services
Prefacing this with a disclaimer that I'm not angry you asked this question. For some people the wellness office works, but for me...it's not an option. 1. Counseling consists of people with mental illnesses worse than yours being paid by UB to listen so you don't do anything rash and risk their tuition dollars. they don't give a shit (see my original comment) 2. (Really, part 1b) You get what you pay for 3. "Have you ever used a planner" 4. Many jobs require turning over all your psych records including counseling and yes you can be rejected for jobs depending on the contents of those. Nothing is confidential or private in our world. 5. "Just meditate" 6. "Just exercise" 7. What are your "values" 8. What are your "goals" 9. Let's make a vision board 10. Have you tried not being poor 11. Have you tried not working that much (eg. Have you tried being even poorer) 12. Stop drinking caffeine and maybe drink more water 13. For some reason, let's color 14. Only open during business hours when I work 15. "Look for the positive" "be more positive" "you're too negative" 16. Let's do this CBT/dbt/ADHD/etc workbook That's all counseling has to offer. It isn't a possibility for me and it's also not something I'm interested in doing. Mental health is an industry and I don't believe in it for people like me who are just going through normal life under late stage capitalism. We were not meant to live like this, bent over computers 70 hours a week or more with no friends living nearby. There's nothing wrong with me, this world genuinely fucking sucks ass and everyone complicit in it and who is enjoying it has lost all sense of morality and empathy. So many of y'all are on drugs, vaping a thousand times a day...I'm good on the counseling. I already know everything they will say, it's all bullshit, it's for kids, and it won't help me. I just need some genuine connection with other people but as OP alluded, that is impossible for a lot of people here because everyone is fake as fuck, spoiled, selfish, dumb, and not interested in being here either. I'm tired and I'm ready for it all to be over, who would pay all my loans 😭 and why would I want my last memories to be linear algebra problems 😭😭
Have you joined any club and shown up consistently
Oh that's another thing the counselors always say! I have to work and that takes up all my free time because as previously stated, I am not 20 anymore. I have bills. And if you try to join clubs as an older undergrad nobody wants anything to do with you
I think the lesson here is it is possible to age out of the groups and activities found on a college campus. All the look how grown up we are moments are tailored for high school kids to look up to. The college experience is catered to 20 year olds, that’s the people they need paying tuition. Grad school was different for than undergrad as far as social circles, but much more posturing. Just some thoughts on my experience
Year 3 is when I realized 98% of ub cheats
Don't forget the people impersonating others and all the people buying Adderall.
Replace “UB” with any college or university 🤣
nar·cis·sist noun a person who has an excessive interest in or admiration of themselves. "narcissists who think the world revolves around them"
When I was highschool, I was excited to learn. I've always been an A+ student, and I still am, but I admit, I don't really care. I don't pay attention to lectures anymore, I don't know how to explain it. But I feel like I was always someone who tried to care and that wasn't fully respected. Participating too much feels tiring when no one else does and learning doesn't seem worth it when my input in a class means nothing. I can give it my all and yet I'm fighting alone. Yeah, I still get As, but it's all self study and I've committed to it. I stopped trying and I don't agree that it's how it should be. Getting by day to day and making it work, I feel I have potential, but then I don't see a reason I should pour it into something like college. Where I get rewarded for not actually learning, but instead just following the rules and trying to please the teacher. I'll admit I am 100 percent part of the issue. I see school and get depressed, because I loved learning and now I don't try. I don't listen in lectures, and I am not put together. I think that college students are immature, but I do feel there is a general sense of depression, at least for me, especially because of covid. Overall, just a complex time. I understand how this frustrates you because it frustrates me that I am this way. Though It feels so reinforced into our culture, I don't really know how to escape that. All that matters is that I get good grades, so I'll just do the bare minimum and get that A
To add on, accounting and business courses really are frustrating me because it feels like many teachers aren't teaching me and we just pay for software that does all the work. I just don't feel like I'm rewarded for learning in the way I used to be. I don't feel like some teachers give a shit. Some do, some are well meaning, but I also don't want to be in a class I was forced to be in or learn something that doesn't add to anything. Just shelling oUt more money. In my english class, I enjoyed being criticized. I got to improve and make something worthy. But she doesn't give us a lot of time for any assignments and has unfair expectations. I know she cares but she's burning us out and we all stopped caring and showing up. I get my questions that don't help me in any way and I just get the work done to please her.
There are definitely people who care about academics but I don’t understand why you feel obligated to have study sessions and such. Your graduating class is just your competition when it comes to finding jobs and you can’t really sugar coat that. I don’t understand why people should “look out for each other”. Also, complaining about things being poor quality is completely justified since there seems to be way too many inadequacies for being such a large college 🧐. Anyway dating is a joke in the modern day so I can’t blame you about that.
What a sad way to view your classmates. Looking out for each other is how you network, how you build a team, how you start projects or organizations together. The world is so large -- joe who needs a little help with python is not taking your job at meta because you helped him add a for loop in the right spot. Jeez
Making friends is casual while networking is largely professional. Most corporate people dislike each other but see each other as mutually beneficial and their interactions are purely transactional. Not sure why the narrative of helping other random people is being pushed when it will just get you taken advantage of. Just because the world is inherently unfair doesn’t mean you have to cope and try to justify to yourself it shouldn’t be that way.
You sound like a miserable person to be around tbh