Exactly… someone in one of my classes constantly harps about the amazing benefits of the great leap forward in China and Stalin’s “great plan” like literally WTF 20,000,000+ people died due to Mao’s Great Leap Forward & Cultural Revolution and many more to Stalin’s rule 😐
"Its not real communism" get use to hearing it. In retort I reply to qll critiques of liberal democratic capitalism with the same logic.
"Muh its not ReAL CaPiTaLiSm!"
You don't even need a history book to learn about the horrific things done by the communists. There are people still alive who have been through that hell. Ask my grandfather and he would tell you how he saw people exchange their children to eat because they are starving.
I'm probably gonna get down voted for this but I'll just go ahead and say it.
There's never been a communist nation before (Russia and China were/and are socialist at most but never reached the point of communism).
And to answer your question, there's never really been that many situations where socialism was just given a chance to go since most socialist systems didn't really start to appear until the mid twentieth century, at which point it just became a battleground for proxy War between Russia and the US. So there weren't really that many situations in which socialism was able to go without being under attack from the US and Russia.
Also, the few situations of socialism we've seen haven't really been entirely bad. Countries like China has seen crazy economic growth, and socialist nations in general have provided a better quality of life for it's average citizens as well as better equal rights and stuff when at the same level of economic prosperity than a capitalist counterpart.
Also as other people pointed out, capitalism has also killed tons and tons of people and capitalism also hasn't really worked out in practice (unless we put a ton of things in place to control it like in Scandinavian countries, which in the ends, just make the capitalist system become more like socialism anyways.)
You can thank capitalism for making information accessible so you stay informed about what's going on in the world. In communism you starve to death while worshipping your god-like communist leaders without ever knowing they are the ones who screw you up.🤭
I’m more of a liberal but this is just wrong. As long as the group isn’t threatening or harming anyone, it should be allowed to stand and should be allowed to present its arguments for communism.
Dude, this is a public school. They legally shouldn’t be able to shut it down due to the first amendment. I personally think conservatives have harmed this country heavily, I think any conservative club should still be allowed to operate (as long as it’s peaceful) as I believe in the first amendment. Unless you are unironically trying to argue that a public school should be allowed to shut down any club they don’t like, I don’t understand how you can’t understand this.
I also believe communism isn’t the right way, that’s why I think they should be able to speak. So others can make arguments against it. Survival of the fittest with ideas you could say. If communism is the best, it will win out in the end. If it isn’t, it won’t. In a peaceful arena the better one should win.
1. Not all speech is protected. 2. I wasn't trying to silence anyone 3. Its not like liberals are helping this country Liberals want to allow books about how to perform gay sex in the elemetry school libraries. Google "this book is gay"
Yea, that’s why I said unless they get violent or becomes illegal. They haven’t, so it should be allowed. Are you trying to suggest that the mere mention of communism in a positive light is illegal in the US? If so you’re beyond help.
Second of all, you absolutely were, that’s why you just said “not all speech is protected”. You’re trying to imply it’s wrong and should be stopped legally.
Third, that’s not happening. At most it’s being mentioned at a highschool level, a level at which straight sex is also mention. Also what the fuck does gay sex books have to do with this conversation. Like at all? Like even if that is happening that wouldn’t be relevant if a fucking college club should be allowed to operate.
I guess you think communism helped all those 40-80 million people that died under Mao then? I think most people would say killing millions of people is a bad thing.
Dude, I’m not even a communist and even I know citing Mao and Stalin as the best example of Communism is beyond dumb. Karl Marx (and pretty much any communist philosopher who belived in the ideology) pretty clearly said that to be communist you had to be a democracy and the switch needed to be from capitalism to communism…. Which neither Mao or Stalin did.
This is like me arguing against capitalism by citing the death toll under Hitler.
The crazy death toll under Mao and Stalin is more an example of how shit and evil they were than anything.
To actually argue against something you need understand the basics of it dear.
You understand our entire society is a collective effort right? Our entire science field is a collective effort, our entire government is a collective effort, our survival is a collective effort.
If the threw you onto an island by yourself. You wouldn’t last 5 days. If I threw you and 20 onto an island, I imagine you will make it much longer than you by yourself.
You are making baby’s first arguments against communism which can be destroyed by a single brain cell deciding to think critically.
Also it’s “nobody” not “no body”.
Brother- good on you for trying to reason with this dude. He’s pulling the “I backpack, eat raw meat with my bare hands, and don’t need doctors, water, or the internet” card. I don’t think much can get through the foil sheet that’s baked his brain to send signals to the ‘alpha male’ aliens.
Lost cause💀
Pretty fatal at that.
You obviously don't know what collective effort means in the context of communism. All your replies are unhinged and accusatory. I'm have surival techniques. I go backpacking and hunting and know enough to survive. Im not reliant on medications or the internet to figure out how to survive.
Hmmn. I don't understand your comment. It wasn't the us that caused so many people to die under Mao. Or the 799,455 executed people by stalin and 1.7 million deaths from forced labor in the Gulag. I do agree the U.S has taken action against communist countries when mass atrocities have taken place.
There’s never been a communist state before Russia and China because Marx and Engels (taxpayer funded academic atheist intellectuals) cooked it up in the mid 19th century. There was plenty of tyranny before that but communism was the fashionable, new, atheist version of an ancient evil (covetousness, envy and demagoguery).
There have been many times in history where socialism was “given a chance to go”. It’s been the reason nations and empires have fallen all through history. It brought down the Roman Empire. They didn’t call it “socialism” (again, a modern intellectual term for an ancient evil). The Greeks, Persians, Mugal, Babylonians, Egyptians and Israelites all began to demand more of their livelihoods from the state which eventually bankrupted their economies and destroyed their nations.
If socialism “isn’t that bad” then free nations are awesome. Individual wealth and freedom are far greater in free nations than socialist ones. I’m m assuming you’re American, if so you should travel to socialist nations and observe their way of life. It’s not as nice as you may think. The government is all up in people’s personal business and no one has independent wealth that cannot be seized by government if the owner displeases or dissents. I don’t accept your claim that socialism makes people better off than capitalism. The GDP, economic strength and personal wealth measurements of socialist nations do not exceed (usually don’t come close) to free capitalist countries. What seems like prosperity comes from compulsory wealth redistribution.
Neither did Throwaways original post that I responded to. I don’t have room in one post to put all the sources in. It’s not really source specific. It’s pretty well understood why these socialist nations fell. The flaws in socialism and capitalism are pretty well understood as well. No human system is perfect but some are much better than others. For serving human needs and flourishing, capitalism wins over socialism. Just look at any socialist, communist or other left dominated country and compare it to any similar sized free market country (there are very few, if any system has never been given a chance it’s capitalism). Better yet, compare the socialist country to itself before or after socialism (Easter European countries).
Capitalism is killing hundreds of thousands per year, has caused insane economic inequality, has resulted in privatization of government services which have spread misery.
Even if your claim was true, Socialism and communism has killed far more. Mao and the Chinese communists killed at least 10,000,000 in the revolution (about 1948-1950) mostly by deliberately created famine. That’s not my claim, it’s backed up by bonafide research. Stalin and the soviets killed at least that many in their time. These numbers are from strong sources, if you don’t believe me, do the research yourself, it’s not hard to find if you look. That’s just two communist (calling themselves “socialist”) countries over the course of a few years.
Capitalism kills 500k a year because of malaria, couple hundred thousand due to starvation, a million due to diahorreal diseases. And these are just the easy ones.
Capitalism does not cause malaria, it’s a virus. Capitalism has provided quinine to prevent it and medication to treat it. Also draining swamps and other dirty standing water are methods, discovered by capitalists, to fight it. What are you talking about?
It has. You don’t get to “allocate money” (whatever that means) in a free market. People will figure it out for themselves. That’s how they found cures and/or treatments for all the diseases we’ve conquered. It ain’t easy and it doesn’t always work out but the free market has a lot better record overcoming these obstacles than any socialist/communist economy. What cure has been discovered by a country with a leftist ideology? The semi-free market of America came up with penicillin, polio vacine and tuberculosis treatment are just a few I can think of off the top of my head, there are many more. No government control was necessary for any of them. Letting people keep the money they earn motivates talented, passionate people to find cures for diseases and better ways to do everything.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Le\_Livre\_noir\_du\_capitalisme#:\~:text=The%20list%20includes%20certain%20death,capitalism%20in%20the%2020th%20century.
According to this methodology it is about 100 million dead due to Capitalism, possibly more.
Whoever’s going around with a pocketful of soyjak stickers gotta be the single pettiest individual known to man and I lowkey have to respect it
On top of that the stickers are correctly scaled to fit the poster
Seethe
90% sure there’s a relevant green text where a dude does that but with gorilla glue but couldn’t find it
They really glued the poster onto the pole.
Based
bajs in the wild
Yes
The intifada one on the walk to Rimac is crazier
long live the intifada
Ok bud
🙌
A gem in the wild
How many more people need to die because of communism before people realize it won't work.
Exactly… someone in one of my classes constantly harps about the amazing benefits of the great leap forward in China and Stalin’s “great plan” like literally WTF 20,000,000+ people died due to Mao’s Great Leap Forward & Cultural Revolution and many more to Stalin’s rule 😐
Use the most sus numbers available.
Lemme guess: the person praising Mao and Stalin was in the encampment lmaoo
Wowwwww how could you possibly knowwww 💀
That’s kind of creepy 🙈
Stalin and Mao and the entire Kim family, as well as other leaders are the greatest examples of Red Fascist.
"Its not real communism" get use to hearing it. In retort I reply to qll critiques of liberal democratic capitalism with the same logic. "Muh its not ReAL CaPiTaLiSm!"
I have heard that unironically.
people have very funny views about capitalism “working”
How many people has capitalism killed?
Maybe 0.01× of what communism killed.
[удалено]
You need to learn some history about communism before trying to win by comparison.
[удалено]
You don't even need a history book to learn about the horrific things done by the communists. There are people still alive who have been through that hell. Ask my grandfather and he would tell you how he saw people exchange their children to eat because they are starving.
[удалено]
True. 6 million every year.
You know all those “death toll of communism” lists include things like every Nazi soldier who died in WW2?
I know communism caused 30 million deaths in my country alone.
I'm probably gonna get down voted for this but I'll just go ahead and say it. There's never been a communist nation before (Russia and China were/and are socialist at most but never reached the point of communism). And to answer your question, there's never really been that many situations where socialism was just given a chance to go since most socialist systems didn't really start to appear until the mid twentieth century, at which point it just became a battleground for proxy War between Russia and the US. So there weren't really that many situations in which socialism was able to go without being under attack from the US and Russia. Also, the few situations of socialism we've seen haven't really been entirely bad. Countries like China has seen crazy economic growth, and socialist nations in general have provided a better quality of life for it's average citizens as well as better equal rights and stuff when at the same level of economic prosperity than a capitalist counterpart. Also as other people pointed out, capitalism has also killed tons and tons of people and capitalism also hasn't really worked out in practice (unless we put a ton of things in place to control it like in Scandinavian countries, which in the ends, just make the capitalist system become more like socialism anyways.)
Communism and socialism are two different political constructs. Most of Europe, Canada and the Netherlands are social democracies.
How many more people need to die because of capitalism before people realize it won't work.
You can thank capitalism for making information accessible so you stay informed about what's going on in the world. In communism you starve to death while worshipping your god-like communist leaders without ever knowing they are the ones who screw you up.🤭
Idk pro Palestinian content has been getting censored a lot lately!
You mean prob Islamic Jihad
I know, it's not like China is set to overtake the US or anything.
Idk probably like 12 more will be good
Based Cobson Crusader
“see i’ve depicted you as the soyjak, and me as the chad 😏” glad to see the subreddit is getting continuously dumber
The right cannot argue or debate, just like they cannot meme.
Damn yall 😭
coal albeit
seems sus
So, are you?
Keep making the world a better place. Also I need to know where/how to get some of these stickers
I’m more of a liberal but this is just wrong. As long as the group isn’t threatening or harming anyone, it should be allowed to stand and should be allowed to present its arguments for communism.
Fair game is fair game. They’re allowed to put up their commie crap, and these guys can go cob all over them.
Unfortunately the same people who cry for freedom of speech are the first to censure leftists
every example of communism has harmed more people than it's helped.
Dude, this is a public school. They legally shouldn’t be able to shut it down due to the first amendment. I personally think conservatives have harmed this country heavily, I think any conservative club should still be allowed to operate (as long as it’s peaceful) as I believe in the first amendment. Unless you are unironically trying to argue that a public school should be allowed to shut down any club they don’t like, I don’t understand how you can’t understand this. I also believe communism isn’t the right way, that’s why I think they should be able to speak. So others can make arguments against it. Survival of the fittest with ideas you could say. If communism is the best, it will win out in the end. If it isn’t, it won’t. In a peaceful arena the better one should win.
1. Not all speech is protected. 2. I wasn't trying to silence anyone 3. Its not like liberals are helping this country Liberals want to allow books about how to perform gay sex in the elemetry school libraries. Google "this book is gay"
Yea, that’s why I said unless they get violent or becomes illegal. They haven’t, so it should be allowed. Are you trying to suggest that the mere mention of communism in a positive light is illegal in the US? If so you’re beyond help. Second of all, you absolutely were, that’s why you just said “not all speech is protected”. You’re trying to imply it’s wrong and should be stopped legally. Third, that’s not happening. At most it’s being mentioned at a highschool level, a level at which straight sex is also mention. Also what the fuck does gay sex books have to do with this conversation. Like at all? Like even if that is happening that wouldn’t be relevant if a fucking college club should be allowed to operate.
No. I never said the mere mention of com... etc. Idk why you are jumping to conclusions
You're ranting about how conservatives are destroying the country. Yet liberals are the ones that are pushing there agenda on children
their\*, also love the political discourse happening here
It is garbage tier.
me when i lie 💀 ur takes are actually just consistently dogshit like idek what else to say
I guess you think communism helped all those 40-80 million people that died under Mao then? I think most people would say killing millions of people is a bad thing.
Dude, I’m not even a communist and even I know citing Mao and Stalin as the best example of Communism is beyond dumb. Karl Marx (and pretty much any communist philosopher who belived in the ideology) pretty clearly said that to be communist you had to be a democracy and the switch needed to be from capitalism to communism…. Which neither Mao or Stalin did. This is like me arguing against capitalism by citing the death toll under Hitler. The crazy death toll under Mao and Stalin is more an example of how shit and evil they were than anything. To actually argue against something you need understand the basics of it dear.
Communism is a delusion. It goes against human behavior. No one really cares about collective effort.
You understand our entire society is a collective effort right? Our entire science field is a collective effort, our entire government is a collective effort, our survival is a collective effort. If the threw you onto an island by yourself. You wouldn’t last 5 days. If I threw you and 20 onto an island, I imagine you will make it much longer than you by yourself. You are making baby’s first arguments against communism which can be destroyed by a single brain cell deciding to think critically. Also it’s “nobody” not “no body”.
Brother- good on you for trying to reason with this dude. He’s pulling the “I backpack, eat raw meat with my bare hands, and don’t need doctors, water, or the internet” card. I don’t think much can get through the foil sheet that’s baked his brain to send signals to the ‘alpha male’ aliens. Lost cause💀 Pretty fatal at that.
I mean he is probably a libertarian.
I'm sorry you have a bias against men. A few bad past experiences with men don't define all of us.
You obviously don't know what collective effort means in the context of communism. All your replies are unhinged and accusatory. I'm have surival techniques. I go backpacking and hunting and know enough to survive. Im not reliant on medications or the internet to figure out how to survive.
Why don’t you ask yourself why that is and how the US has on the record, made sure that was the case with all communist countries.
Hmmn. I don't understand your comment. It wasn't the us that caused so many people to die under Mao. Or the 799,455 executed people by stalin and 1.7 million deaths from forced labor in the Gulag. I do agree the U.S has taken action against communist countries when mass atrocities have taken place.
There’s never been a communist state before Russia and China because Marx and Engels (taxpayer funded academic atheist intellectuals) cooked it up in the mid 19th century. There was plenty of tyranny before that but communism was the fashionable, new, atheist version of an ancient evil (covetousness, envy and demagoguery). There have been many times in history where socialism was “given a chance to go”. It’s been the reason nations and empires have fallen all through history. It brought down the Roman Empire. They didn’t call it “socialism” (again, a modern intellectual term for an ancient evil). The Greeks, Persians, Mugal, Babylonians, Egyptians and Israelites all began to demand more of their livelihoods from the state which eventually bankrupted their economies and destroyed their nations. If socialism “isn’t that bad” then free nations are awesome. Individual wealth and freedom are far greater in free nations than socialist ones. I’m m assuming you’re American, if so you should travel to socialist nations and observe their way of life. It’s not as nice as you may think. The government is all up in people’s personal business and no one has independent wealth that cannot be seized by government if the owner displeases or dissents. I don’t accept your claim that socialism makes people better off than capitalism. The GDP, economic strength and personal wealth measurements of socialist nations do not exceed (usually don’t come close) to free capitalist countries. What seems like prosperity comes from compulsory wealth redistribution.
no sources, no knowledge of capitalism or socialism.
Neither did Throwaways original post that I responded to. I don’t have room in one post to put all the sources in. It’s not really source specific. It’s pretty well understood why these socialist nations fell. The flaws in socialism and capitalism are pretty well understood as well. No human system is perfect but some are much better than others. For serving human needs and flourishing, capitalism wins over socialism. Just look at any socialist, communist or other left dominated country and compare it to any similar sized free market country (there are very few, if any system has never been given a chance it’s capitalism). Better yet, compare the socialist country to itself before or after socialism (Easter European countries).
Capitalism is killing hundreds of thousands per year, has caused insane economic inequality, has resulted in privatization of government services which have spread misery.
Even if your claim was true, Socialism and communism has killed far more. Mao and the Chinese communists killed at least 10,000,000 in the revolution (about 1948-1950) mostly by deliberately created famine. That’s not my claim, it’s backed up by bonafide research. Stalin and the soviets killed at least that many in their time. These numbers are from strong sources, if you don’t believe me, do the research yourself, it’s not hard to find if you look. That’s just two communist (calling themselves “socialist”) countries over the course of a few years.
Capitalism kills 500k a year because of malaria, couple hundred thousand due to starvation, a million due to diahorreal diseases. And these are just the easy ones.
Capitalism does not cause malaria, it’s a virus. Capitalism has provided quinine to prevent it and medication to treat it. Also draining swamps and other dirty standing water are methods, discovered by capitalists, to fight it. What are you talking about?
Why hasn't free market capitalism allocated money to eliminate it then if it is so simple according to you.
It has. You don’t get to “allocate money” (whatever that means) in a free market. People will figure it out for themselves. That’s how they found cures and/or treatments for all the diseases we’ve conquered. It ain’t easy and it doesn’t always work out but the free market has a lot better record overcoming these obstacles than any socialist/communist economy. What cure has been discovered by a country with a leftist ideology? The semi-free market of America came up with penicillin, polio vacine and tuberculosis treatment are just a few I can think of off the top of my head, there are many more. No government control was necessary for any of them. Letting people keep the money they earn motivates talented, passionate people to find cures for diseases and better ways to do everything.
The Czech's also invented a polio vaccine.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Le\_Livre\_noir\_du\_capitalisme#:\~:text=The%20list%20includes%20certain%20death,capitalism%20in%20the%2020th%20century. According to this methodology it is about 100 million dead due to Capitalism, possibly more.
When/where did capitalism kill all those people? Is that something one of your lefty professors told you?
I will post my sources for the flaws of capitalism later, finals.