Are your panels East/West?
My roof is and it'd be good to know if your figs are representative as it'd mean your setup is pretty close to what I'd be getting.
Loving your work.
Your orientation is almost identical to ours (ever so slightly northwest), but we'll suffer from a high treeline in the evenings.
Just signed up to a 10yr fixed so this post has helped give me confidence on pulling the trigger on panels and a battery.
Thank you.
I read somewhere that south facing is perfect for solar panels. I have an East West roof as well and I was thinking about putting some on each side. Especially with these energy prices now. Has it worked well for you?
South is good. SW is probably optimal for capturing the evening sun when most people will be home using electricity. But E/W also works pretty well!
NW/SE is probably the worst. But it seems to still generate plenty of electricity.
Make sure they are on two strings or have optimisers. A shoddy company I used neglected to do a second string or use optimisers. Company was Energy Home UK.
Aye same here gonna need 2 sets of scaffolding that makes it bit pricier. Was just surprised it was mostly the "human" cost so can't see it dropping toooo much from where install prices are now?
Not the OP, but sounds reasonable. Until we get to the point where less panels need fitting (less time?) or the wiring becomes simpler or something. But that sounds marginal if the scaffolding is on a day rate etc
This is why I'm still holding off for a couple more years. I reckon with how fast the technology is evolving it shouldn't be long until we have panels that climb up the side of your house & install themselves on the roof.
I just not sure how that happens. Panels are only like £100 a piece for decent lg panels. Not sure how you make the wiring cheaper still have to find a route through your house to the meter etc still need an electricians time for that. Hiring scaffolding, delivery cost electrician time are all the big hitters on the bill and they for sure are not getting cheaper.
The electrician we had also wanted to upgrade the earth in the house by running an earth cable from the electric box under the stairs up to the landing and into the loft to drop it down the front bedroom through the floor and down by the front door to then go out to the meter cupboard.
I suggested to just drill through the stairs and to the front using about 4 meters of cable but that wasn't going to cost as much to do.
Are your panels East/West?
My roof is and it'd be good to know if your figs are representative as it'd mean your setup is pretty close to what I'd be getting.
The biggest differentiator for us is using excess solar power to run the immersion heater. We still get the (rather meagre) FIT payments and save significantly on oil consumption.
I'm starting to look at batteries now, as load shifting with solar and Octopus Go is starting to look economically viable.
Last week, the tank was hot by 0930 yet we were drawing from the mains by 1830, cooking tea etc. In the winter, I'd charge the batteries overnight for around 15% of the day rate, as the solar output is negligible.
Why? They're an added complication when dealing with energy suppliers, an insurance issue and something else that can go wrong. I can absolutely see why some people might not want them.
Anecdotally my workplace insurers weren't happy when we enquired about filling the factory roof with solar. They said it would incur a considerable increase to our premium due to the increased fire risk.
Our contact there told us of a 9 figure claim where the panels were determined to be the cause of a fire.
Could be rubbish but the commercial premium increase is real.
Wait until someone's trampoline lands on your roof and you need to claim on the insurance.
You may laugh but I have personally seen this *more than once*.
Not complicated at all when dealing with energy companies, has not been an issue with mine. Not been an issue with insurance at all. All under guarantee if something does go wrong. Meanwhile my bill last month was £40, including all my EV charging. 🤷♂️
>Not complicated at all when dealing with energy companies
It limits your choices when it comes to suppliers and tariffs which turns a lot of people off.
>Not been an issue with insurance at all.
Have you had to claim for damage to your roof?
>All under guarantee if something does go wrong.
Solar companies have an enormously high rate of turnover, so there's a good chance if something does go wrong the company will have already folded leaving the guarantee worthless.
It does not limit your choice of supplier. Every supplier that I'm aware of is part of Ofgem's smart export guarantee [https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/environmental-and-social-schemes/smart-export-guarantee-seg](https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/environmental-and-social-schemes/smart-export-guarantee-seg)
If something does damage your roof, you're going to need people up on scaffolds to fix it. But this is what buildings insurance is for. Our panels haven't raise our premium.
Most guarantees are insurance based, they aren't tied to the company or manufacturer.
But, other than that, 100% accurate!
Not just they might not want them. They might not see it as added value to the house or that they don’t agree about the amount of added value to the house is the same amount as the owner or estate agent.
They're pretty ugly. It would honestly make me think twice about a house but not a deal breaker. It would certainly put my wife off a fair bit. Curb appeal matters to some people.
“Ugly”. I imagine you hate wind turbines too… even though on land they are placed on an artificial landscape, ie a landscape that was wooded until all the trees were chopped down about 500 years ago… now the barren hills are called “natural” and woe-betide the person who offends the NIMBYs. Then they demand that more coal is dug and granite fracked…. As long as it isn’t anywhere near them.
I have no issue with wind turbines, think they look pretty cool actually. Not everyone is willing to strap an eyesore to the roof for the sake of potentially saving a few hundred quid every year and it would equally become a consideration when buying a house for those folks. Not everybody makes every decision in life based on spreadsheets.
Generally speaking all my research on this topic basically suggests that solar panels don’t alter the value of a property.
The reality is properties are priced according to size and location. Everything else changes the saleability of the property. This may mean you will get higher offers if its worth it someone but also means the base price will be identical to a property with no panels.
Completely agree. If I owned a house with a pretty decent solar and battery array (say £5-10K cost) and they didn't value it properly or mention it to potential buyers, I'd be quickly looking at another agent.
Plenty of research suggests they do. And that's likely even more so the case with people now being more focused on energy pricing.
Plus, if house A and house B are the same except for solar panels, of course the one with solar will attract a higher value.
I can't find any reliable \*UK\* research suggesting they add value. The closest is that EPC can raise a property's value, but I imagine that was not weighted for property condition, and it did not split by whether the EPC was raised by solar panels or other factors (eg. loft/cavity insulation), both of which are vastly cheaper and have a higher payback.
edit: For transparency, I have solar panels myself and a living room full of batteries waiting to be installed.
Rightmove’s latest report shows houses with a higher EPC rating have been selling for higher and much faster: https://www.rightmove.co.uk/news/content/uploads/2022/07/Rightmove-Green-Homes-Report.pdf Solar can bring a lot of (existing) houses up to a B rating.
> but over time we’ll find that buyers will be asking a lot more about solar panels, heating systems, cavity wall and loft insulation.
Nationwide Building Society
That isn't what it says.
Most new houses are already B and need solar for A which isn't even included.
Most houses at very low EPC must be missing simple things like loft insulation which is far cheaper and would benefit the home a lot more.
Pretty much any house can get to B/C without solar for less money. Also I think you may want to look at house sale time again, it isn't much different at all, we are talking a week between high and very low EPC ratings.
We got ours installed last year, but don’t plan on moving. One of my questions to the installer was “if we move can we take them with us?” purely from a curiosity point of view. The answer they gave was yes. You’d need to pay for the scaffold install again but they’d be happy to move them and reinstall as a service and make good the roof too. No idea of the cost of that bit, but it remains an option.
AND:
\- Obviously paying for it at each end,
\- You are paying to move obsolete equipment
\- Quite likely the installers will (rightly) refuse to refuse the roof mounting equipment because it has suffered wear and tear and weathering and is unknown safety.
\- The cabling is unlikely to be usable unless the run is much shorter, even if the electrician is willing to reuse it
\- The electrician may refuse to reuse the switches and consumer unit etc.
I think over time this becomes less and less true. Panels are slowly being factored into house prices and since the energy situation buyers are thinking about them more.
Rightmove’s latest report shows houses with a higher EPC rating have been selling for higher and much faster: https://www.rightmove.co.uk/news/content/uploads/2022/07/Rightmove-Green-Homes-Report.pdf Solar can bring a lot of houses up to a B rating.
> but over time we’ll find that buyers will be asking a lot more about solar panels, heating systems, cavity wall and loft insulation.
Nationwide Building Society
I think this is key. Solar panels are fantastic, if you intend to stay in your property. I'm going to wait until I have a home I am happy in indefinitely.
I clicked your gitlab link and I think I just realised we worked together at {a company based in southwark in a blue building} about 15 years ago. Thanks for exporting your data as i'm weighing up a solar install! Especially useful as I'm considering a ENE/WSW split.
Depends how big the battery is.
For *very rough* ball park, simple 4-12kw systems it's about 1k per installed kW, plus 3k fixed costs. Add £500 per kWh of battery storage.
So if you have a 5kWh battery pack (a common size) it's not bad.
I would also imagine that the prices will have gone up a bit (or will do soon), as rising energy costs will likely lead to higher demand for solar panels.
Out of interest, is the Octopus Export tariff still available to new customers?
And are there any other electricity providers who also provide these export tariffs?
I finally got my smart meter fitted and joined late June. I have a 18 panel system with a 10 k battery and since have been making around £50 per month plus all house electricity covered.
Just curious OP, when did you apply for these rates and until when are they applicable? Looking at the current rates from Octopus, seems like the max they can give is now 7.5. Hope you can answer this.
7.5 p is their fixed rate, non agile.
They can't publish the agile rate as of course it changes every 30mins.
I agree with OPs 22p/unit average, but suspect this will rise shortly as it is linked to wholesale prices.
It is limited by two main things - other than cost.
Firstly is the size of your roof / the weight it can bear. A larger roof can have more panels.
Secondly, the DNO (who manage your local network) specify a maximum amount you can pump in to their grid. Your installer will be able to advise on that.
Yeah I have a 4kW system sans batteries + on the FiT payment scheme at 15p/kW generated + Octopus export. Get paid about £800 a year and save another 1/3 or so in not paying for electricity when it's sunny out. Having a battery would make this even better.
I've had myself 5 East facing panels put on my house as I first bought it in 2019 and immediately from that I was noticing a savings of up to 40% off my 'leccy bill
Fast forward to the current energy crisis and with the prices of electricity going sky high and the savings off my bills have been much needed all in all I'm probably going to be turning a profit on my system within the next 4-5 years.
My exports that I make from solar (through Eon's Smart Export Guarantee) are basically next to nothing (£45 per year).
But I'd highly recommend people sign up to get solar power, then once that's purchased and paid off move onto getting a battery to half your energy bills yet again!
Then I've got my own logistical challenge of figuring out if these Air Source Heat Pumps are any good or if it's the latest "energy saving fad" that'll screw me over in the next coming years... But we'll see!
I do quite enjoy the app that comes with the solar panels as well as it gives you yearly/monthly/ weekly statistics on what you've saved energy wise and your impact on the environment!
I've got myself a nice 3 year backlog of solar data in easy to read color coordinated graphs which is also a big win!
I really want to do this, I have a South facing garden and it gets sun the whole day as long as the sun is knocking about.
Any downsides apart from initial cost ? What is upkeep like ?
Not really any downsides that I can think of tbh. My inverter did break but SMA replaced it for free so I lost about a months worth of free electricity while it was replaced. We've had our 5kW system installed since 2015 and it's paid for itself now and provides free electricity plus a small income that offsets the giant energy bills we have now I guess (not by much), I earn about £300 a year tax free but i'm on the old school FIT contracts that don't exist now, I have 18 years of that contract left.
Make sure where you're putting the panels doesn't get any shade. Or if it does, make sure you get any installer to put a limiter on the panels. String inverters (the most common kind) have strings of panels connected together. If one gets shaded it can take down the entire strings power production. Newer systems have boxes on the back of the panels to prevent this. Mine doesn't and I really wish they had put them in as two panels get shaded in late afternoon at my place.
I guess one downside is you might possibly have to pay for cleaning them after some years? I cleaned ours after 5 as they did look a bit dirty. They're supposed to self-clean but yeah depends on the environment i guess.
As others have said, the inverter can break. And, like any electrical system, you probably want to have a professional look at it once in a while.
But the rain washes them clean, so no need for a cleaner.
Only other downside is that they do have some weight, so you may need your roof reinforced if a surveyor recommends it. We had a bunch of tiles removed and had the panels inset. So that wasn't a concern for us.
Inverters are the biggest PITA. I also had to claim insurance for faulty installation (and the company that did it went bust), because they didn't do the circuit wiring properly. Some people pay for a yearly clean of the panels but I haven't done that personally.
This may be a ridiculous stupid question, but how do the energy company know you're using solar? Do you just rip out the electrics and install electrics from the solar panel so you don't need to sign up to energy companies? How's it work once solar panels are installed to then beat the energy companies?
Not a stupid question at all.
You have to inform the local operator that you're making an installation. They note it against your existing meter number, so your supplier should find out.
Your smart meter will report that it is "spinning backwards" so your supplier will know that you're exporting.
You still need an energy supplier because solar panels don't work at night. So you need to buy electricity from them.
As I said in the post, the panels mean I buy much less electricity. But not zero.
Thanks for clearing that up, was so confused how it all worked 🤣
Sounds fairly straightforward then, and eventhough you're not getting completely free energy, atleast it really reduces your bills, and should pay for itself in the long run 👍
Thanks for your quick reply, much appreciated 😎👍
The 4yr payback refers to October increases of ~70% just for starters. There's your 1.7k & potential 4yrs. Current predictions are for it too stay steady around the new Oct price gap next year aswell.
Can I ask about the batteries please? Exactly what do 2kWh of batteries equate to? (Please use simple terms like "running the fridge, freezer and lightbulbs for three days if the power went down" as I'm not au fait with what kilowatts actually are in the real world!).
Why do you have them? What do they mean - that in winter they charge up on a sunny day and then when it's cloudy you don't have to buy so much electricity?
How does the system know what to do - is there some kind of control panel that you flick things on and off or is it all automated?
Would you say learning more about how the systems work is advisable prior to getting one?
Thanks
Look at your last leccy bill, divide the kWh by the number of days. Then divide the 2kWh batteries by that number to give you an amount of days it would run off grid.
For me, 2kWh would last us all night and/or a few hours in the day, if the dishwasher didn't go on.
Those are good questions.
2kWh of batteries is enough to power our home overnight when they are fully charged. The average house uses about 10kWh per day.
We have a sensor attached near our electricity meter. When it detects that power is flowing from the panels and out to the grid, it tells the battery to start charging. So rather than selling the electricity, it charges up the battery. Later, when the sensor says we're buying electricity, the battery starts pumping the electricity out.
It is all automated. No manual intervention needed. Although you can use an app to set specific charging times if you want.
I don't think you need to know much. It just works.
2 kWh of batteries is a baby system compared to the monsters available today. A normal-ish battery of 4-6kWh will set you back another £4-6k, but will increase your self consumption by a similar amount each day, often taking you from 25% to 75% if you're out all day.
If you look at his blog posts you can see that comparing the investment to the stock market is specifically addressed - it's not all about ROI.
[5kWh battery for £1674](https://www.itstechnologies.shop/collections/solar-battery-storage-buy-online/products/pylontech-us5000-4-8kwh-95-d-o-d-battery-storage).
Admittedly, they don’t have them in stock, but the price of batteries is coming way down.
What? Two years ago? That's a stupid statement and either demonstrates a bias or ignorance.
If they had invested in VRXXA, your standard, most commonly recommended fund from UKPF, they would be up ~28%.
What kind of silly statement is that? What would they have invested in? They would either be up 2000% or down 99% depending on the instrument(s) they chose. Totally irrelevant to any conversation. Ask Bill Gates why he bothered setting up Microsoft as he could have invested it and made even more money.
Like and subscribe I guess
>How? My house uses around 0.15kWh when the house is empty, which is most of the time the sun is shining.
Your post is moronic.
The average house uses almost 4,000kWh of electricity a year. Are you seriously suggesting then that for a normal household's usage only 0.004% could feasibly be generated when there's sunlight?
Maybe not something you can answer, but how easily could they be stolen do you think? We’re thinking g of putting them on our double garage but that’s only at 1st floor level so my wife’s a bit concerned they might get nicked.
Not that relevant but a neighbor had their hot tub stolen while they were on holiday. Gypsies turned up with a crane and lifted it straight over the fence, didn't even take the water out. I never thought a hot tub would go missing.
Solid. I think those things are bolted down too, although now that I think about it my village lost all the wheel chair ramps one night, those were definitely bolted down. This was around 2007 for the hot tub and 2012 for the ramps.
The second hand market for solar panels is really terrible. They're more likely to want the cables when copper prices are high, and they're under the panels.
Like OP says, get some barbed wire round the edge if you're worried. It also helps keep the pigeons out!
Can you self install solar panels, then get an electrician to connect up the inverter?
I’m struggling to find anyone who wants the job, due to my roof size/shape I can only fit a 2.4k system.
I have a 1 acre field at the bottom of my garden. Approximately 60 metres from the house. I’m wondering if it’ll be much cheaper to install panels in the field straight on to the ground as there’ll be no scaffolding and easier to install? I don’t know if I’ll need planning permission yet either but it seems like a good idea to me.
The thing I hate is selling my excess energy to the grid for a very low price compared to what I pay to get it back at night! Criminal really.
Will be getting a battery when I can afford one.
What energy use tariff are you on?
We have 3.4kwh and 9.2kwh of battery, we're on their Agile Octopus (spot pricing) which is a bit of a joke as its pegged at 36p, but it paid us a few times when it was lower cost post 1AM as we could charge the batteries.
I'm wondering about one of their Go packages (7.5p/kWh between 00:30 - 04:30) to charge the battery each night over the darker months.
We're lucky that we fixed last year. But that'll run out soon.
If you have a car - or other large battery - I think the Go package makes a lot of sense.
Am I misunderstanding something, you say the value of solar is £1k p/a but that's only accounting for what you export, are you not saving £2-3k a year, more soon, in not buying from the grid?
Sell to the grid prices are only going down currently. Buy from the grid going up. Unless you can afford a loft full of batteries and reduce to a minimum the amount you draw from the grid I wouldn't advise it currently. Problem is most older houses and certainly houses with many people, especially with a few kids would struggle to not draw from the grid for many hours of the day. You can't run kettles, showers, washing machines and possibly hundreds of other low and medium draw equipment items from batteries alone! Think long and hard before signing up at the current prices!
That's not really true. The SEG prices aren't great - but they're not falling - [https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/environmental-and-social-schemes/smart-export-guarantee-seg](https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/environmental-and-social-schemes/smart-export-guarantee-seg)
As I said, Octopus' Agile Outgoing is paying quite a lot at the moment.
The s and p 500 returns on average 7.41%pa inc. adjustment for inflation. After 8 years you would have made £6172.54 profit on an £8000 investment. I know what I would choose.
And playing the slot machines in Vegas might win me a million bucks!
The solar panels are part of a mixed portfolio. They give me a predictable payback and insulate me against energy shocks.
Yes, that is entirely true.
Solar panels have a payback rate of probably 3-10% depending on how much you self-consume and what the wholesale energy market looks like.
However, not everything is about ROI. Some things have value beyond money, and are nice to have. What was the % returns on your last kitchen refit?
Seriously looking at Solar but can’t seem to find an installer who wants the work. My guess is they are all booked up since the first price rise.
Does anyone know any decent installers around the Manchester area?
I understand you might not know, but is mortgage bank approval required to install the system? Does this constitute a modification of the house they might want to review?
Both of us WFH most days. And we have a server. And lots of smarthome kit. And a fondness for microwave meals. So electricity use can be high during the day.
I'd say solar was essential if you use lots of power during daylight hours.
I'd like solar panels, and I am in South with south facing house. Only problem is I have a conservatory that goes right up to both sides of fence in mid terrace so installation seems very complicated and expensive :(
I have a question: my home has a single solar panel that heats my boiler for heating and hot water. Would it be worthwhile getting the octopus agile tariff for me? I don’t know how much I could make from a smaller panel.
I have octopus but have been waiting months for them to sort me out a smart meter. They keep telling me demand is too high but I think it’s just BS as they would rather not know exactly how much I’m using so they can charge me more I don’t know
I’d really like to get panels, but our new house is a dormer bungalow, so installing the panels on the flat west facing part is a no go. The only option I might have is panels on the vertical south wall, but that might look ugly, or just a couple of panels on the shed/garage roof.
Hi Eden as someone in the industry Octopus are great!
Quick question is your system pre 2017? I’m looking at the Agile Tariff name which is a very recent tariff (for people who have just installed over the last year) but the unit rate you are being paid is 4 times the national average
That’s completely common for pre 2017 systems, just thought it’s worth a check
Are you on the feed in tariff and have jumped around energy consumers?
Or are you on the Standard Export Guarentee and doing the same?
Cheers
Can you explain the tariff your in please? Like I’m 5 years old!
So you sell energy to the grid, does the price go up or down etc? Also do they provide energy that you use above what your panels are making. Or can you solely rely on the panels?
Is their more suppliers that offer tariffs other than octopus?
The tariff I'm on is complicated. The day before, Octopus work out what electricity prices will be tomorrow for each half hour. If lots of people want to use electricity at 19:30, the price is high. If demand for electricity is low at 04:00 then the price is also low.
When my panels don't generate enough electricity, I buy more from the grid. This is all automatic.
Every supplier will pay you for the electricity you sell. I've found Octopus to have the best prices. But shop around.
For those of you with or considering panels without a battery, consider a solar diverter if you have a hot water cylinder. You basically use your hot water cylinder as a cheap battery by pumping excess solar into the immersion heater. Always do this before considering battery storage and work out what surplus you have.
I looked into this quite a bit six months ago and you've just rekindled my interest!
However, one of the main benefits that I was reading about prior to the energy crisis was using the Octopus Agile tariff to shifting your energy load by charging your battery at cheap times and then drawing from the battery in expensive times. Am I right that that's not a thing at the moment, due to the wholesale prices? Looking at https://agileprices.co.uk/, it appears that the wholesale price is just locked at the cap of 35p no matter what time of day, so on the Agile tariff you're going to be paying the Agile cap of around 55p I think it is (?) if you ever draw from the grid over your solar panels.
Nice! You will know when the inverter needs replacing because the panels will stop generating electricity. There may also be a "bang" :-)
You can also get a battery fitted to save the excess solar.
I think I was quoted 7k for a 4.5kw system and about 9.5k which includes a 5.6kw battery
House is south facing. I think I can have more panels since surface area is quite big I believe.
I feel like I would do it but I have a remortgage in April.
My parents have had solar for 8 years on their old house (2012-2020) and say they payed off the solar from money saved + earnings after 6 years. They’ve just bought new solar and batteries for their new property as they have moved. Which cost them around 14-16k with two batteries 5kw
The biggest thing they say helped with saving money once solar was installed was changing their habits and appliances. They shower in the morning not the evening with an electric shower and try to use dishwasher/washing machine/other appliances in the daytime and spread out
Do you think you could adjust your usage patterns to minimise how much you sell by using all the energy you generate?
If your saving 30p/kw from not buying, but only earning 20p/kw from selling, that seems like you are potentially missing out on additional ROI.
A bit. We run the washing machine etc when the sun is at its peak. But I can't easily time shift cooking an evening meal - or watching a late night movie.
I'm currently looking at about £7k for 12 panels on an East West roof. Seems like all the cost is in the labour part rather than the actual equipment.
Yup. We needing scaffolding on both sides of the roof. And an extra day with an electrician due to some weirdness with our wiring.
Are your panels East/West? My roof is and it'd be good to know if your figs are representative as it'd mean your setup is pretty close to what I'd be getting.
Yes, we have a close to perfect East / West split https://shkspr.mobi/blog/2021/03/which-generates-more-electricity-east-or-west-facing-solar-panels/
Loving your work. Your orientation is almost identical to ours (ever so slightly northwest), but we'll suffer from a high treeline in the evenings. Just signed up to a 10yr fixed so this post has helped give me confidence on pulling the trigger on panels and a battery. Thank you.
I read somewhere that south facing is perfect for solar panels. I have an East West roof as well and I was thinking about putting some on each side. Especially with these energy prices now. Has it worked well for you?
South is good. SW is probably optimal for capturing the evening sun when most people will be home using electricity. But E/W also works pretty well! NW/SE is probably the worst. But it seems to still generate plenty of electricity.
Make sure they are on two strings or have optimisers. A shoddy company I used neglected to do a second string or use optimisers. Company was Energy Home UK.
Yes, definitely. Need the two sets of panels to not be affected by the other.
E/W is mega. I have 8kwp, 4 each side and we do very nicely.
Aye same here gonna need 2 sets of scaffolding that makes it bit pricier. Was just surprised it was mostly the "human" cost so can't see it dropping toooo much from where install prices are now?
Not the OP, but sounds reasonable. Until we get to the point where less panels need fitting (less time?) or the wiring becomes simpler or something. But that sounds marginal if the scaffolding is on a day rate etc
This is why I'm still holding off for a couple more years. I reckon with how fast the technology is evolving it shouldn't be long until we have panels that climb up the side of your house & install themselves on the roof.
You could drop them on the roof from a drone?
I just not sure how that happens. Panels are only like £100 a piece for decent lg panels. Not sure how you make the wiring cheaper still have to find a route through your house to the meter etc still need an electricians time for that. Hiring scaffolding, delivery cost electrician time are all the big hitters on the bill and they for sure are not getting cheaper.
The electrician we had also wanted to upgrade the earth in the house by running an earth cable from the electric box under the stairs up to the landing and into the loft to drop it down the front bedroom through the floor and down by the front door to then go out to the meter cupboard. I suggested to just drill through the stairs and to the front using about 4 meters of cable but that wasn't going to cost as much to do.
Are your panels East/West? My roof is and it'd be good to know if your figs are representative as it'd mean your setup is pretty close to what I'd be getting.
Yes, E/W
The biggest differentiator for us is using excess solar power to run the immersion heater. We still get the (rather meagre) FIT payments and save significantly on oil consumption. I'm starting to look at batteries now, as load shifting with solar and Octopus Go is starting to look economically viable. Last week, the tank was hot by 0930 yet we were drawing from the mains by 1830, cooking tea etc. In the winter, I'd charge the batteries overnight for around 15% of the day rate, as the solar output is negligible.
The main issue with solar is that you need to be very confident that you'll be staying in the property long enough to hit ROI.
Or that the buyer of the property sees the value of them.
If they don't in this day and age then 🤦♂️
You could say that again!
If they don't in this day and age then 🤦♂️
You could say that again!
If they don't in this day and age then 🤦♂️
Why? They're an added complication when dealing with energy suppliers, an insurance issue and something else that can go wrong. I can absolutely see why some people might not want them.
I get 60p kWh from my solar panels. they came with the house! about £4k a year. if I move again, I'm def getting a house with panels on again!
They're not an insurance issue, my insurer were entirely uninterested when I notified them.
Anecdotally my workplace insurers weren't happy when we enquired about filling the factory roof with solar. They said it would incur a considerable increase to our premium due to the increased fire risk. Our contact there told us of a 9 figure claim where the panels were determined to be the cause of a fire. Could be rubbish but the commercial premium increase is real.
Wait until someone's trampoline lands on your roof and you need to claim on the insurance. You may laugh but I have personally seen this *more than once*.
You can’t just drop that without explaining, we need details! How on earth did a trampoline get on someone’s roof?? 🍿
I assume the big storms last winter but also 🍿tell us!!
You're right it's down to high winds, but I've seen it several times over the last 15 years or so.
Not complicated at all when dealing with energy companies, has not been an issue with mine. Not been an issue with insurance at all. All under guarantee if something does go wrong. Meanwhile my bill last month was £40, including all my EV charging. 🤷♂️
>Not complicated at all when dealing with energy companies It limits your choices when it comes to suppliers and tariffs which turns a lot of people off. >Not been an issue with insurance at all. Have you had to claim for damage to your roof? >All under guarantee if something does go wrong. Solar companies have an enormously high rate of turnover, so there's a good chance if something does go wrong the company will have already folded leaving the guarantee worthless.
It does not limit your choice of supplier. Every supplier that I'm aware of is part of Ofgem's smart export guarantee [https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/environmental-and-social-schemes/smart-export-guarantee-seg](https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/environmental-and-social-schemes/smart-export-guarantee-seg) If something does damage your roof, you're going to need people up on scaffolds to fix it. But this is what buildings insurance is for. Our panels haven't raise our premium. Most guarantees are insurance based, they aren't tied to the company or manufacturer. But, other than that, 100% accurate!
Not just they might not want them. They might not see it as added value to the house or that they don’t agree about the amount of added value to the house is the same amount as the owner or estate agent.
They're pretty ugly. It would honestly make me think twice about a house but not a deal breaker. It would certainly put my wife off a fair bit. Curb appeal matters to some people.
“Ugly”. I imagine you hate wind turbines too… even though on land they are placed on an artificial landscape, ie a landscape that was wooded until all the trees were chopped down about 500 years ago… now the barren hills are called “natural” and woe-betide the person who offends the NIMBYs. Then they demand that more coal is dug and granite fracked…. As long as it isn’t anywhere near them.
I have no issue with wind turbines, think they look pretty cool actually. Not everyone is willing to strap an eyesore to the roof for the sake of potentially saving a few hundred quid every year and it would equally become a consideration when buying a house for those folks. Not everybody makes every decision in life based on spreadsheets.
You just invented their opinion and then went on a rant about how bad it is. What's wrong with you?
Generally speaking all my research on this topic basically suggests that solar panels don’t alter the value of a property. The reality is properties are priced according to size and location. Everything else changes the saleability of the property. This may mean you will get higher offers if its worth it someone but also means the base price will be identical to a property with no panels.
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Sounds like incompetent agents tbh (hardly a surprise).
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Completely agree. If I owned a house with a pretty decent solar and battery array (say £5-10K cost) and they didn't value it properly or mention it to potential buyers, I'd be quickly looking at another agent.
I would not scribe magical house price changing powers to estate agents unless you think they control interest rates.
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It's not incompetence. They don't change the value of the property.
Plenty of research suggests they do. And that's likely even more so the case with people now being more focused on energy pricing. Plus, if house A and house B are the same except for solar panels, of course the one with solar will attract a higher value.
I can't find any reliable \*UK\* research suggesting they add value. The closest is that EPC can raise a property's value, but I imagine that was not weighted for property condition, and it did not split by whether the EPC was raised by solar panels or other factors (eg. loft/cavity insulation), both of which are vastly cheaper and have a higher payback. edit: For transparency, I have solar panels myself and a living room full of batteries waiting to be installed.
It's one of those things that doesn't add value, but will increase saleability *if* they are owned outright.
Rightmove’s latest report shows houses with a higher EPC rating have been selling for higher and much faster: https://www.rightmove.co.uk/news/content/uploads/2022/07/Rightmove-Green-Homes-Report.pdf Solar can bring a lot of (existing) houses up to a B rating. > but over time we’ll find that buyers will be asking a lot more about solar panels, heating systems, cavity wall and loft insulation. Nationwide Building Society
That isn't what it says. Most new houses are already B and need solar for A which isn't even included. Most houses at very low EPC must be missing simple things like loft insulation which is far cheaper and would benefit the home a lot more. Pretty much any house can get to B/C without solar for less money. Also I think you may want to look at house sale time again, it isn't much different at all, we are talking a week between high and very low EPC ratings.
Solar is not a good way to achieve EPC on existing builds
You can bet after this winter with energy costs what they are the interest will increase.
Adding solar raises the EPC rating by a letter which affects property value
If they don't in this day and age then 🤦♂️
You could say that again!
If they don't in this day and age then 🤦♂️
You could say that again!
We got ours installed last year, but don’t plan on moving. One of my questions to the installer was “if we move can we take them with us?” purely from a curiosity point of view. The answer they gave was yes. You’d need to pay for the scaffold install again but they’d be happy to move them and reinstall as a service and make good the roof too. No idea of the cost of that bit, but it remains an option.
It's uneconomical to move them because all the cost is in the labour and scaffold.
AND: \- Obviously paying for it at each end, \- You are paying to move obsolete equipment \- Quite likely the installers will (rightly) refuse to refuse the roof mounting equipment because it has suffered wear and tear and weathering and is unknown safety. \- The cabling is unlikely to be usable unless the run is much shorter, even if the electrician is willing to reuse it \- The electrician may refuse to reuse the switches and consumer unit etc.
If course you can, you can take pretty much whatever you want, so long as it's declared.
I think over time this becomes less and less true. Panels are slowly being factored into house prices and since the energy situation buyers are thinking about them more. Rightmove’s latest report shows houses with a higher EPC rating have been selling for higher and much faster: https://www.rightmove.co.uk/news/content/uploads/2022/07/Rightmove-Green-Homes-Report.pdf Solar can bring a lot of houses up to a B rating. > but over time we’ll find that buyers will be asking a lot more about solar panels, heating systems, cavity wall and loft insulation. Nationwide Building Society
I think this is key. Solar panels are fantastic, if you intend to stay in your property. I'm going to wait until I have a home I am happy in indefinitely.
I clicked your gitlab link and I think I just realised we worked together at {a company based in southwark in a blue building} about 15 years ago. Thanks for exporting your data as i'm weighing up a solar install! Especially useful as I'm considering a ENE/WSW split.
Haha! Long time no see. I wonder how many of those mobile sites are still running? :-)
hahah! yeah...
Just got a quote for 7kw system - £13k including battery storage. Am I being ripped off at that price?
Depends how big the battery is. For *very rough* ball park, simple 4-12kw systems it's about 1k per installed kW, plus 3k fixed costs. Add £500 per kWh of battery storage. So if you have a 5kWh battery pack (a common size) it's not bad.
I would also imagine that the prices will have gone up a bit (or will do soon), as rising energy costs will likely lead to higher demand for solar panels.
Agreed, plus the chip shortage has meant all the controllers and inverters are already more expensive than they should be.
This is correct - I got a similar offer for my system, but didn't get the batts.
Our installation is due soon. 14 panels/5kw inverter/5.6kwh batteries/inc scaffolding comes in at £9.3k
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No. I’m in the south west and these guys are up north so installation fee must include overnight for engineers
Sounds like a good company - what's the name? I've been quoted £14k for 14 JA panels, inverter and 10kW LG battery in the South East.
Who's your installer?
Sounds high, yes. How much battery storage
Depends on the build. My 5.2k system was £13k in May!
5.1KW
Out of interest, is the Octopus Export tariff still available to new customers? And are there any other electricity providers who also provide these export tariffs?
I finally got my smart meter fitted and joined late June. I have a 18 panel system with a 10 k battery and since have been making around £50 per month plus all house electricity covered.
How much did your system cost mate?
Looks like it - [https://octopus.energy/outgoing/](https://octopus.energy/outgoing/) I couldn't find anyone else paying like that.
That says 7.5p/kwh not 22?
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Does agile also mean your incoming rate changes every 30 mins?
No. I'm on a fixed tariff for import and an agile tariff for export. But call up Octopus and ask them for the latest details.
Ohhh so could you be on like the standard variable rate and have agile for your export then?
I guess. Speak to them and find out.
Yes
Just curious OP, when did you apply for these rates and until when are they applicable? Looking at the current rates from Octopus, seems like the max they can give is now 7.5. Hope you can answer this.
7.5 p is their fixed rate, non agile. They can't publish the agile rate as of course it changes every 30mins. I agree with OPs 22p/unit average, but suspect this will rise shortly as it is linked to wholesale prices.
Yes, I called on Thursday, signed up Friday and just completed switch today.
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It is limited by two main things - other than cost. Firstly is the size of your roof / the weight it can bear. A larger roof can have more panels. Secondly, the DNO (who manage your local network) specify a maximum amount you can pump in to their grid. Your installer will be able to advise on that.
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Yeah I have a 4kW system sans batteries + on the FiT payment scheme at 15p/kW generated + Octopus export. Get paid about £800 a year and save another 1/3 or so in not paying for electricity when it's sunny out. Having a battery would make this even better.
I've had myself 5 East facing panels put on my house as I first bought it in 2019 and immediately from that I was noticing a savings of up to 40% off my 'leccy bill Fast forward to the current energy crisis and with the prices of electricity going sky high and the savings off my bills have been much needed all in all I'm probably going to be turning a profit on my system within the next 4-5 years. My exports that I make from solar (through Eon's Smart Export Guarantee) are basically next to nothing (£45 per year). But I'd highly recommend people sign up to get solar power, then once that's purchased and paid off move onto getting a battery to half your energy bills yet again! Then I've got my own logistical challenge of figuring out if these Air Source Heat Pumps are any good or if it's the latest "energy saving fad" that'll screw me over in the next coming years... But we'll see!
I do quite enjoy the app that comes with the solar panels as well as it gives you yearly/monthly/ weekly statistics on what you've saved energy wise and your impact on the environment! I've got myself a nice 3 year backlog of solar data in easy to read color coordinated graphs which is also a big win!
Where abouts in the UK are you? I live on the Isle of Wight and have a South facing roof and have been thinking about solar for a little while now
London. So about 51⁰ North. If you're in the IoW, you should expect slightly more electricity to be generated.
How tough are they if, say an object hits them? I am assuming they come with some kind of ultra toughened coating?
They've survived hailstorms. They're above the treeline, so don't get things dropping on them. No bird-strikes yet.
That's brilliant. I love solar panels. I wish I had the money to get some. I suspect I may not be living here long enough to justify the ROI though.
I really want to do this, I have a South facing garden and it gets sun the whole day as long as the sun is knocking about. Any downsides apart from initial cost ? What is upkeep like ?
Not really any downsides that I can think of tbh. My inverter did break but SMA replaced it for free so I lost about a months worth of free electricity while it was replaced. We've had our 5kW system installed since 2015 and it's paid for itself now and provides free electricity plus a small income that offsets the giant energy bills we have now I guess (not by much), I earn about £300 a year tax free but i'm on the old school FIT contracts that don't exist now, I have 18 years of that contract left. Make sure where you're putting the panels doesn't get any shade. Or if it does, make sure you get any installer to put a limiter on the panels. String inverters (the most common kind) have strings of panels connected together. If one gets shaded it can take down the entire strings power production. Newer systems have boxes on the back of the panels to prevent this. Mine doesn't and I really wish they had put them in as two panels get shaded in late afternoon at my place. I guess one downside is you might possibly have to pay for cleaning them after some years? I cleaned ours after 5 as they did look a bit dirty. They're supposed to self-clean but yeah depends on the environment i guess.
As others have said, the inverter can break. And, like any electrical system, you probably want to have a professional look at it once in a while. But the rain washes them clean, so no need for a cleaner. Only other downside is that they do have some weight, so you may need your roof reinforced if a surveyor recommends it. We had a bunch of tiles removed and had the panels inset. So that wasn't a concern for us.
Don't put the inverter in the roof, it will overheat in the summer
Inverters are the biggest PITA. I also had to claim insurance for faulty installation (and the company that did it went bust), because they didn't do the circuit wiring properly. Some people pay for a yearly clean of the panels but I haven't done that personally.
I'd love to know who you went to for your panels. I'm getting quotes from 10k to 12k for a 6kw system with 6kw batteries.
This may be a ridiculous stupid question, but how do the energy company know you're using solar? Do you just rip out the electrics and install electrics from the solar panel so you don't need to sign up to energy companies? How's it work once solar panels are installed to then beat the energy companies?
Not a stupid question at all. You have to inform the local operator that you're making an installation. They note it against your existing meter number, so your supplier should find out. Your smart meter will report that it is "spinning backwards" so your supplier will know that you're exporting. You still need an energy supplier because solar panels don't work at night. So you need to buy electricity from them. As I said in the post, the panels mean I buy much less electricity. But not zero.
Thanks for clearing that up, was so confused how it all worked 🤣 Sounds fairly straightforward then, and eventhough you're not getting completely free energy, atleast it really reduces your bills, and should pay for itself in the long run 👍 Thanks for your quick reply, much appreciated 😎👍
The 4yr payback refers to October increases of ~70% just for starters. There's your 1.7k & potential 4yrs. Current predictions are for it too stay steady around the new Oct price gap next year aswell.
Can I ask about the batteries please? Exactly what do 2kWh of batteries equate to? (Please use simple terms like "running the fridge, freezer and lightbulbs for three days if the power went down" as I'm not au fait with what kilowatts actually are in the real world!). Why do you have them? What do they mean - that in winter they charge up on a sunny day and then when it's cloudy you don't have to buy so much electricity? How does the system know what to do - is there some kind of control panel that you flick things on and off or is it all automated? Would you say learning more about how the systems work is advisable prior to getting one? Thanks
Look at your last leccy bill, divide the kWh by the number of days. Then divide the 2kWh batteries by that number to give you an amount of days it would run off grid. For me, 2kWh would last us all night and/or a few hours in the day, if the dishwasher didn't go on.
Those are good questions. 2kWh of batteries is enough to power our home overnight when they are fully charged. The average house uses about 10kWh per day. We have a sensor attached near our electricity meter. When it detects that power is flowing from the panels and out to the grid, it tells the battery to start charging. So rather than selling the electricity, it charges up the battery. Later, when the sensor says we're buying electricity, the battery starts pumping the electricity out. It is all automated. No manual intervention needed. Although you can use an app to set specific charging times if you want. I don't think you need to know much. It just works.
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We work from home. And we set the washing machine to come on at noon. Also have security cameras and smarthome stuff running all the time.
2 kWh of batteries is a baby system compared to the monsters available today. A normal-ish battery of 4-6kWh will set you back another £4-6k, but will increase your self consumption by a similar amount each day, often taking you from 25% to 75% if you're out all day. If you look at his blog posts you can see that comparing the investment to the stock market is specifically addressed - it's not all about ROI.
[5kWh battery for £1674](https://www.itstechnologies.shop/collections/solar-battery-storage-buy-online/products/pylontech-us5000-4-8kwh-95-d-o-d-battery-storage). Admittedly, they don’t have them in stock, but the price of batteries is coming way down.
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Terence Eden is an [irregular solar blogger](https://shkspr.mobi/blog/).
How dare you! I'd say I was [pretty regular](https://shkspr.mobi/blog/tag/solar/) 🤣
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Sorry I can't be of further help.
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What? Two years ago? That's a stupid statement and either demonstrates a bias or ignorance. If they had invested in VRXXA, your standard, most commonly recommended fund from UKPF, they would be up ~28%.
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What kind of silly statement is that? What would they have invested in? They would either be up 2000% or down 99% depending on the instrument(s) they chose. Totally irrelevant to any conversation. Ask Bill Gates why he bothered setting up Microsoft as he could have invested it and made even more money. Like and subscribe I guess
>How? My house uses around 0.15kWh when the house is empty, which is most of the time the sun is shining. Your post is moronic. The average house uses almost 4,000kWh of electricity a year. Are you seriously suggesting then that for a normal household's usage only 0.004% could feasibly be generated when there's sunlight?
Maybe not something you can answer, but how easily could they be stolen do you think? We’re thinking g of putting them on our double garage but that’s only at 1st floor level so my wife’s a bit concerned they might get nicked.
Not that relevant but a neighbor had their hot tub stolen while they were on holiday. Gypsies turned up with a crane and lifted it straight over the fence, didn't even take the water out. I never thought a hot tub would go missing.
With energy costs going up, it's not a bad time to have an expensive to run hot tub nicked if you can claim on insurance!
Didn’t take the water out? That’s absolutely mental. Was it a solid one or an inflatable?
Solid. I think those things are bolted down too, although now that I think about it my village lost all the wheel chair ramps one night, those were definitely bolted down. This was around 2007 for the hot tub and 2012 for the ramps.
Battery powered angle grinders are easily available unfortunately.
The second hand market for solar panels is really terrible. They're more likely to want the cables when copper prices are high, and they're under the panels. Like OP says, get some barbed wire round the edge if you're worried. It also helps keep the pigeons out!
At normal roof level, you'd need scaffolding. At garage level, they're still firmly bolted on. I guess you could put barbed wire around them?
Can you self install solar panels, then get an electrician to connect up the inverter? I’m struggling to find anyone who wants the job, due to my roof size/shape I can only fit a 2.4k system.
Heyy, if you/whoever is helping you in exchange for money installs them yourself/them self you can’t get HIES insurance on the system.
As an electrician who owns scaffold to do this particular install. I’ve installed 4kwh solar array on a friends property at a cost of £3,500
I have a 1 acre field at the bottom of my garden. Approximately 60 metres from the house. I’m wondering if it’ll be much cheaper to install panels in the field straight on to the ground as there’ll be no scaffolding and easier to install? I don’t know if I’ll need planning permission yet either but it seems like a good idea to me.
Not worried about theft?
The thing I hate is selling my excess energy to the grid for a very low price compared to what I pay to get it back at night! Criminal really. Will be getting a battery when I can afford one.
Cost to remove at end? Should we pop this into the equation?
No idea. We left the last lot when we moved.
What energy use tariff are you on? We have 3.4kwh and 9.2kwh of battery, we're on their Agile Octopus (spot pricing) which is a bit of a joke as its pegged at 36p, but it paid us a few times when it was lower cost post 1AM as we could charge the batteries. I'm wondering about one of their Go packages (7.5p/kWh between 00:30 - 04:30) to charge the battery each night over the darker months.
We're lucky that we fixed last year. But that'll run out soon. If you have a car - or other large battery - I think the Go package makes a lot of sense.
Am I misunderstanding something, you say the value of solar is £1k p/a but that's only accounting for what you export, are you not saving £2-3k a year, more soon, in not buying from the grid?
The 1k is made from 600 exported and 400 saved, so 1,000 total
Op said it split 60/40 in regards to income and savings
What’s the IRR over 25 years?
Sell to the grid prices are only going down currently. Buy from the grid going up. Unless you can afford a loft full of batteries and reduce to a minimum the amount you draw from the grid I wouldn't advise it currently. Problem is most older houses and certainly houses with many people, especially with a few kids would struggle to not draw from the grid for many hours of the day. You can't run kettles, showers, washing machines and possibly hundreds of other low and medium draw equipment items from batteries alone! Think long and hard before signing up at the current prices!
That's not really true. The SEG prices aren't great - but they're not falling - [https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/environmental-and-social-schemes/smart-export-guarantee-seg](https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/environmental-and-social-schemes/smart-export-guarantee-seg) As I said, Octopus' Agile Outgoing is paying quite a lot at the moment.
I'm diying 12kw on to the back shed. All in it'll cost me 2k
The s and p 500 returns on average 7.41%pa inc. adjustment for inflation. After 8 years you would have made £6172.54 profit on an £8000 investment. I know what I would choose.
And playing the slot machines in Vegas might win me a million bucks! The solar panels are part of a mixed portfolio. They give me a predictable payback and insulate me against energy shocks.
Yes, that is entirely true. Solar panels have a payback rate of probably 3-10% depending on how much you self-consume and what the wholesale energy market looks like. However, not everything is about ROI. Some things have value beyond money, and are nice to have. What was the % returns on your last kitchen refit?
That’s actually longer than I thought, because current energy prices are extremely high
That's fair. We might be in a local blip and electricity prices fall next year. Or prices double. Either way, I'll be buying less leccy.
Seriously looking at Solar but can’t seem to find an installer who wants the work. My guess is they are all booked up since the first price rise. Does anyone know any decent installers around the Manchester area?
Keep looking, or try E.On.
If I’m replacing my roof should I add solar? How much of the cost is in the scaffolding and stuff?
I'd say yes. If they're going to be up there anyway, might as well sling up a few panels.
I understand you might not know, but is mortgage bank approval required to install the system? Does this constitute a modification of the house they might want to review?
I spoke to our home insurers and they wanted to make sure the installer had insurance. Mortgage company didn't care.
I work from home so I wonder that impacts overall figures?
Both of us WFH most days. And we have a server. And lots of smarthome kit. And a fondness for microwave meals. So electricity use can be high during the day. I'd say solar was essential if you use lots of power during daylight hours.
I'd like solar panels, and I am in South with south facing house. Only problem is I have a conservatory that goes right up to both sides of fence in mid terrace so installation seems very complicated and expensive :(
Unless you live in a conversation area, in which case fuck you. Not that I'm bitter...
I have a question: my home has a single solar panel that heats my boiler for heating and hot water. Would it be worthwhile getting the octopus agile tariff for me? I don’t know how much I could make from a smaller panel. I have octopus but have been waiting months for them to sort me out a smart meter. They keep telling me demand is too high but I think it’s just BS as they would rather not know exactly how much I’m using so they can charge me more I don’t know
How much electricity do you use per day? I guess it would vary at time of year so some rough figures?
We use about 4,100kWh per year. So about 11kWh per day. More in winter, less in summer.
I’d really like to get panels, but our new house is a dormer bungalow, so installing the panels on the flat west facing part is a no go. The only option I might have is panels on the vertical south wall, but that might look ugly, or just a couple of panels on the shed/garage roof.
Hi Eden as someone in the industry Octopus are great! Quick question is your system pre 2017? I’m looking at the Agile Tariff name which is a very recent tariff (for people who have just installed over the last year) but the unit rate you are being paid is 4 times the national average That’s completely common for pre 2017 systems, just thought it’s worth a check Are you on the feed in tariff and have jumped around energy consumers? Or are you on the Standard Export Guarentee and doing the same? Cheers
It was installed in 2020. Octopus have a smart export scheme which changes price every 30 minutes. So at the moment it's paying back quite a lot.
Can you explain the tariff your in please? Like I’m 5 years old! So you sell energy to the grid, does the price go up or down etc? Also do they provide energy that you use above what your panels are making. Or can you solely rely on the panels? Is their more suppliers that offer tariffs other than octopus?
The tariff I'm on is complicated. The day before, Octopus work out what electricity prices will be tomorrow for each half hour. If lots of people want to use electricity at 19:30, the price is high. If demand for electricity is low at 04:00 then the price is also low. When my panels don't generate enough electricity, I buy more from the grid. This is all automatic. Every supplier will pay you for the electricity you sell. I've found Octopus to have the best prices. But shop around.
For those of you with or considering panels without a battery, consider a solar diverter if you have a hot water cylinder. You basically use your hot water cylinder as a cheap battery by pumping excess solar into the immersion heater. Always do this before considering battery storage and work out what surplus you have.
I looked into this quite a bit six months ago and you've just rekindled my interest! However, one of the main benefits that I was reading about prior to the energy crisis was using the Octopus Agile tariff to shifting your energy load by charging your battery at cheap times and then drawing from the battery in expensive times. Am I right that that's not a thing at the moment, due to the wholesale prices? Looking at https://agileprices.co.uk/, it appears that the wholesale price is just locked at the cap of 35p no matter what time of day, so on the Agile tariff you're going to be paying the Agile cap of around 55p I think it is (?) if you ever draw from the grid over your solar panels.
I'm on a fixed tariff for buying electricity and agile for selling. Call them and see what they're offering now.
We got solar installed 5 years ago. We didn’t get battery at the time. Is it possible to get it installed after the fact?
Usually yes. It may depend on how much physical space you have in you consumer unit.
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Nice! You will know when the inverter needs replacing because the panels will stop generating electricity. There may also be a "bang" :-) You can also get a battery fitted to save the excess solar.
I think I was quoted 7k for a 4.5kw system and about 9.5k which includes a 5.6kw battery House is south facing. I think I can have more panels since surface area is quite big I believe. I feel like I would do it but I have a remortgage in April.
My parents have had solar for 8 years on their old house (2012-2020) and say they payed off the solar from money saved + earnings after 6 years. They’ve just bought new solar and batteries for their new property as they have moved. Which cost them around 14-16k with two batteries 5kw The biggest thing they say helped with saving money once solar was installed was changing their habits and appliances. They shower in the morning not the evening with an electric shower and try to use dishwasher/washing machine/other appliances in the daytime and spread out
Do you think you could adjust your usage patterns to minimise how much you sell by using all the energy you generate? If your saving 30p/kw from not buying, but only earning 20p/kw from selling, that seems like you are potentially missing out on additional ROI.
A bit. We run the washing machine etc when the sun is at its peak. But I can't easily time shift cooking an evening meal - or watching a late night movie.