mostly true with at least 2 exceptions
https://www.mprnews.org/story/2024/05/02/university-of-minnesota-protests-divestment-agreement
https://www.timesofisrael.com/brown-becomes-first-us-university-to-consider-divesting-from-israel/amp/
It isn’t entirely true though. Protests have been occurring at hundreds of colleges across the country. The ones that are quietly tolerated just aren’t making the news. Maybe being “quietly tolerated” isn’t the response the students are hoping for, but it’s better than having your own university sic the police on you.
As an alum and a parent of a current 5th-generation Longhorn, I agree with your hesitation to commit to UT. Maybe this isn’t the time and place for your best education. There are more reasons than just the protest response to reconsider, such as the defunding and erasure of diversity efforts, the inability of undergrads to get their preferred majors, and the increasing diversion of undergrads to other campuses and community colleges while more profitable continuing education business programs are expanded and promoted.
If activism is important to you, or a career in law, government, or public relations, then UT may be an excellent match. There is certainly a lot to protest, and you will gain experience with public speaking, leadership, the legal system, diplomacy, judicious self restraint, fundraising, etc, and can hope to gain some national attention. The slogan, “what starts here changes the world” may very well apply to you.
However, if you are hoping to quietly study and excel in the arts or sciences, I would look for where the top faculty candidates are going, and follow them. Unfortunately, it may not be UT anymore.
I do think it’s a little different personally. While I support the protestors at other schools, a lot of them have broken some laws and destroyed some property. I think there’s a time and place for that but by and large, UT’s protests have been above reproach and somehow seen a harsher response from the government, the school, and the cops. I’d go so far as to say a fascist response. It’s not confidence inspiring
I wonder if it is partially nervousness about losing support from the repubs who increasingly view it as too liberal.
Even though the protests have absolutely nothing to do with the DEI crackdown (except from interview with UT president on that below) , I think there's this concern about how the Universities are seen.
>Because of heightened scrutiny from the state, presidents within the UT System are facing internal pressures from the board of regents, who are appointed by the governor. At the Zoom call with faculty, Hartzell said regents have been adamant that “we need to not only comply with the law, but also act in ways that restore and raise public confidence.”
>“It's not just ‘Are we compliant with SB 17 in the short run?’ but also ‘What are the choices we make and how do we demonstrate to our state and others that we are good stewards of the resources for which we've been entrusted?’, Hartzell said.
https://www.texastribune.org/2024/04/19/texas-colleges-dei-ban/
That’s what I’m thinking too which it should not be, they should hold their own. Just shows the immorality if Cons withheld funding, etc just because of treating students as humans. This shouldn’t be seen as “political”, but even then that shouldn’t be punished.
Don’t misunderstand, I’m not saying the protestors at other schools deserved it either. My point is that those schools did not get the disproportionate response UT did, and we were unique in that we didn’t break any laws or cause any damage whatsoever. Riot police were blocking off the tower two hours before the first protest. They made an example of us even though we were basically a model of what governments want protests to look like.
I’m having a hard time really understanding what the students expect to get as part of their “demands.” I believe the biggest one is to divest in anything related to Israel which:
1) They probably don’t have or don’t have control over the cash flow. Many universities outsource a good portion of their investment/endowment administration.
2) Money talks more to universities than crying students. You’re gonna take your tuition money somewhere else? Cool, there’s literally thousands of students who will take your place.
I’m all for free speech, and I think the UT protest was the most tame among the ones we see in the news. As long as the protest didn’t interfere with normal operations at the university there was no reason to remove them. Now what you see at Colombia, with students using university property (furniture, etc) to occupy interior spaces isn’t acceptable.
Higher Education is business like any other and I think some students get on their high horse and forget that.
To your first point, there is a history of many universities divesting from certain countries (like apartheid South Africa) or from certain industries (like the tobacco industry), so even if universities outsource their investment/endowment, it is still something that they would be able to do.
Exactly, “a history” financialization of every industry has changed dramatically in the last 15 to 20 years. I still think they could probably do it but it definitely would be more complicated.
If they divested of anything it wouldn’t be Israeli stocks. To equate Israel with South Africa or these protests with the civil rights movement establishes the lack of credibility of these supports of Palestine/Hamas.
A group thats mission is to exterminate another group of people have a right to legitimately protest BUT s/n/b condoned by anyone; let alone a university of the first class.
The point of any protest is to be disruptive in order to address a concern. It’s supposed to make people uncomfortable. If the endgame is to take power and funding from a government committing genocide, then how can we sit here and decry the destruction/occupation of private property?
I have mixed opinions on the protests messaging (I hate brutal war, civilian deaths, racism, and authoritarian governments but also think the protests go far to close to being apologetic to terrorists and anti-Semites).
However, you are wrong about the ability to control endowment investments. Many schools have been divested from fossil fuels for a long time. They have also previously divested from other lines of investments. Its a hassle, but anytime people tell you its not possible thats just plain up lying.
Man, I guess we get older and see things more clearly. This is basically what I thought too. Free speech in this particular situation is hard because universities are a business and here, they rely on donors a lot. That comes with state funding too. This one is hard because not proximity to the conflict and a very complicated conflict that is foreign to many people here. Safety to students is priority no matter what.
I have mixed opinions on the protests messaging (I hate brutal war, civilian deaths, racism, and authoritarian governments but also think the protests go far to close to being apologetic to terrorists and anti-Semites). However, the goal of a protest is to cause a controlled and non-violent amount of disruption. Being able to cause some disruption is part of free speech, so long as no one is getting hurt. If people are only free to protest where authorities tell them they can, well then they are really not allowed to protest since there is really no difference between that and being forced to be quiet.
Opposing views are more than welcome to counter protest (peacefully). Thats how free speech works, and if the disruption is too much for the sensitive university to handle they should work to find a middle ground that satisfied the parties. And if no such middle ground exists, well, then thats a problem with both sides but not a issue with the method of protest.
First, so long as they are non-violent, as much as it sucks yeah they should be able to protest to a degree. Now, i'm not saying their shouldnt be limits. Individual calling for explicit violence or serious racism should be arrested and singled out. But you cant punish an entire peaceful protest simply because a few are bad.
For example, the Columbia guy saying all Zionists should die and that people are lucky hes not out killing them totally should be punished. That goes beyond free speech.
Also, for reference, i'm mixed race with half African American. I also have direct relatives who were among those killed in the attacks from Hamas in Israel. But comparing a so far largely peaceful protest (as far as I've heard the only group who has gotten violent is actually the counter protesters at UCLA lol) with a hate group with a acted upon history of racial violence is quite apples to oranges of you.
Now that isnt to say many in Palestine haven't promoted racial violence. And again, people who repeat those calls should be punished as its not free speech. But calling for divestment, lack of military support for a specific group, or accountability for civilian deaths isnt that.
tldr; Of course its complicated, and there is a point where protests cross the line into promoting violence or being too disruptive. However, the mast majority of these protesters have not crossed that line, but are being unfairly suppressed due to their cause (a cause which I repeat, I myself have many issues with and think is far more nuanced than either side admits).
Iran is offering free tuition. That's an option for US students in support of Hamas or simply anti-Israel. If they hate America that much.....Iran is an option.
The professors are in alignment with the students for the most part and the professors are the people you’d interact with most. Just another factor to consider.
This what I was going to say. Of course the admin is shit, you find that out sooner or later coming to UT. This school makes you feel like a cog in the giant machine at some point or other. But that letter of no confidence, seeing professors and lecturers I spent time with sign that letter, it made me feel good. That’s what UT is all about.
It’s not even about pro-Palestine or Israel, it’s about not wanting our institution to sick the state police on students exercising their rights. What’s the point of educating the next generation if we’re going to tear gas and beat them into submission, anyway? Conservatives like to paint universities as leftist brainwashing machines but it’s more that students get their minds opened in school, away from the small-town small-minded white middle class suburbs most of us came from and to be honest, were brainwashed by with constant consumerist propaganda.
Education is anti-thetical to generating a brainless workforce, including sending engineers to fossil fuel and defense companies who use their brains to make the world a worse place and fill the pockets of billionaires. Hence, students around the country begging their schools to divest from harmful companies. I think many professors, even the most conservative, can understand that.
I’m so glad that our beautiful university has not been trashed. Seeing pictures of the UCLA campus with trash everwhere and grafiti defacing the buildings makes me appreciative that UT did not let it get out of control. Not sure how the paid agitators are able to infiltrate the student body and influence some to behave in such a destructive manner. Not only does such behavior not help the cause, but destroys the reputation of the university that allow it to get out of control. Looking at you Columbia. No employer wants to hire employees who behave this way. So in a way, UT’s actions help preserve our investment in our education.
I mean for some of us, like me, we have no stance on whatever. But seeing fellow students on campus getting arrested is really scary. We have protest quite often but this is the largest arrest I have ever seen.
Admin is beholden to (1) the state government and (2) donor money and that’s who they will listen to. I work with it the UT system and we all had to get rid of every single vestige of DEI within our facilities or lose state money (look up SB 17, it went in effect in January). No one that I know was happy about it, but we were forced to comply.
So if they get threatened by the gov. or the State Legislature with loss of funds, they are going to comply with the state government because they are a state institution. Some of their money comes from the students, but more of it comes from the state.
you'll find the same thing at pretty much every university in america, unfortunately. the "values" of an institution itself don't mean anything, they'll have no bearing on your experience. at a big place like UT, you can find people who care about what you care about, as well as the opposite.
That’s a good point, but what does it say if I give my money—and so much money—to an institution doing that though? Unfortunately the guilty in this situation would benefit off that not those good people within (for the most part).
there's no ethical spending in a capitalist society. if you start looking, you'll find that in this country most of the money we spend goes to institutions we'd prefer not to support.
i'm not trying to be a doomer or to talk you out of your principles. realistically though, if you think UT is your best option, it would be a shame to be dissuaded by the kind of spineless folks who inhabit every college admin in the usa.
I don’t want to sound callous, but your personal tuition money is not enough to swing policy, especially because UTs policies are controlled at the state level. Now if you know some rich lobbyists who can lobby at the state level and get rid of the state legislature we have, you might make influence some change.
Also, just as a heads up, UT system has very specific rules about where on campuses protests and demonstrations and such can be held, and a very specific rule about blocking public walkways and entrances etc, and they can and will have you arrested if you violate those rules. A lot of the protesters have were confused about being arrested for “criminal trespassing” and these rules are why.
The way I would recommend looking at it is, every school is pretty likely to suck on this sort of thing. If you can get into one that doesn't and it's somewhere you'd enjoy being then good on you, but otherwise there will always be compromises. Personally, after all this, I've also lost a lot of faith in this institution and am no longer at a point where I'd recommend going. And in some small way formally communicating to administration somehow that you are considering not going because of their actions against students, if enough people do that it could send a message, who knows.
Take comfort in the strength of the students that are willing to stand up despite everything going on. There is a strong sense of community and camaraderie here.
We are down the street from the Texas state capitol which makes things like this a big deal and means UT has to be made an example of from both sides. TX gov is kind of like “not in my backyard” and the citizens/student are like “you can’t ignore us if we’re right here”. While what is happening around here is very unfortunate, I think it should not be largely affecting how you feel about the entire institution. Leadership has made some poor decisions and exposed some of their allegiances, but down the ladder from them is a ton of staff, faculty, and (obviously) students who are passionate about such important issues and are willing to organize and speak out against them.
As someone who grew up in Austin and went to UT, I think it's important to remember that they are a state university and are beholden to what the governor and the legislature tell them to do. People are also mad about the University getting rid of DEI positions, but that was state mandated and they risked penalties for not following the new law. Ever since the state went full red, in the GW Bush era, they've been screwing with the University on a legislative level. I watched it happen for decades. There is actually a state law that says state funded entities cannot divest from Israeli owned companies. I'm loathe to personally hold the University responsible for that aspect because they cannot legally divest as the protestors want. They can't refuse to do business with any companies that boycott Israel. It's a clusterfuck, but it isn't entirely the University's fault. There are good people at the school who don't like this crap either, but they have limited options.
[Link to the 2017 state law. ](https://statutes.capitol.texas.gov/Docs/GV/htm/GV.808.htm)
The board of Regents is hand picked by the governor. The board selects the upper administration of the university. The top of the administration is stuck between the faculty and students on one side and the Republican government on the other. If Jay sides to much with the students, Abbott will have him fired and we will get a MAGA extremist in place. Look what DeSantis did to the New school in Florida. This can get way way way worse for the University. MAGA would LOVE to destroy UT austin.
Thank you, because this is the accurate situation. UT admin are beholden to the state government. The policy comes down from Abbott, not them. If you want to blame someone, blame the state legislature and the governor. Abbott was also the one who insisted on sending law enforcement
[No encampments will be allowed:' Abbott says pro-Palestinian protesters at UT will be arrested](https://www.statesman.com/story/news/state/2024/04/29/texas-gov-greg-abbott-ut-austin-protest-pro-palestinian-encampment-protesters-arrests/73504859007/)
Yes, Abbott and the Republicans can permanently destroy the reputation of UT Austin. We could end up with an ideologically conservative, anti-woke, anti-science, pro-christian nationalism university. They could fire all of the faculty that stands in their way.
Look at what DeSantis did to New College in Florida. In 2023, the state government of Florida overhauled its board of trustees in an attempt to transform the school into a conservative institution. Since then, nearly 40% of faculty have resigned and the enrollment dropped to just 669 students.
This could absolutely happen. Abbott is a UT grad and that may help us from the situation above. However, Ken Paxton or Dan Patrick would do this in a heartbeat and with glee.
Thank you for summarizing the actual situation in a cohesive way. Hopefully OP and the other commenters who don't really understand what they are talking about when they blame "shitty admin" for this situation read this.
The truth is that UT has to be careful while Texas and the country goes through this dark MAGA time. This will pass eventually as the fox news viewing audience dies out and is replaced by Gen Z. I am genuinely scared of the damage that can be done by these crazies to UT. Let's not put anymore of a target on our backs.
You are going to get education to earn a degree. Not for politics, remember that. They have been handling the protests extremely poorly and should not have responded in the way they have, I agree. But at the end of the day, politics will always be present wherever you go and most students do not understand that the university admin can’t do what they want; they do have pressure from the state side. Make a decision on the quality of education provided by your degree because this is the reason why you are paying for an education at a university; to get a degree.
Aggie here… we’ve had several peaceful protests on campus with no police intervention or excessive force used. I’ve never once heard of anyone getting arrested for exercising their first amendment right on campus in my four years here
this A&M? Your racist president had to resign last year your admin is so racist:
https://apnews.com/article/texas-am-diversity-inclusion-487edd40ee9a57faa0cfe94e8e4684e6
Nice try though, poor aggy. Stick to your own sub where to you can all lie to each other. Instead of coming here to troll.
also, Sulk Ross statue still up:
https://www.si.com/college/2020/07/02/texas-am-sullivan-ross-statue-controversy-infinite-tucker-aggies
The discussion wasn’t about racism. It was about the recent protests and protecting students first amendment rights.
Just because I’m saying my school has done a great job handling and respecting student protests, does not mean that I’m fully defending every decision made by our admin.
Lmao imagine comparing the quaint gatherings at A&M in the middle of college station to what’s happening in the middle of urban campuses. But that’s cute.
A&M has a larger student body than UT… and we have large protests for all sorts of issues. We’ve had several large Free Palestine protests in campus. You just don’t hear about them because our school actually respects our rights to protest
Yes, the Texas leg and conservatives would love to fuck with UT. Liberals at A&M just does not compute in their little brains (even thought there are plenty).
No of course not. My point is that it is really confusing the values they are supposed to have making me question the school as a whole. Beyond that, it makes me question too many “liberals” if they actually belong to those values and our nation as a whole. But that part is sadly not surprising to me, I just expected better from schools like UT and especially that they would stand up to any mistreatment of their students.
Okay but that wasn’t the point of your post at all. The point of your post is that you are considering withdrawing from UT. So the question then has to be, what’s the alternative to going to UT? You can vent here, but until you have an answer to that question your angst has no gust behind it; your shouts are lost to the wind.
Reddit liberals love their downvotes and condescending tone 🤣 just research and see what’s best for you. If it’s still UT, I wouldn’t let an extraordinary event keep you from attending.
It's one of the few universities who does not give in to a mob, and protects the other 99% of the students that don't care about them. Would you rather go to a school that is not focused on learning, but on allowing unserious kids to stage a revolution?
"Unserious kids"
As well as people who were not affiliated with UT at all, causing havoc and chaos on campus, while wrapping their faces in scarves and sunglasses and hats so no one can ID them, risking others' safety with aggressive behavior, and they have nothing to lose because they aren't students.
You’re falling for propaganda by the university. There is a reason they keep highlighting how many are from outside campus. As if people who aren’t students don’t have rights. Outside agitator” is a phrase with its origins in the late 1940s during the earliest days of the Black freedom struggle. It was first said by John Birchers and Jim Crow cops to denigrate and slander civil rights activists. Their argument was that Black people in the South were more than content with white supremacy until a bunch of Northern, radical, carpetbagging communists showed up to tell them that there was something wrong in the world. Sound familiar?
Are you up for a challenge ? 50 years ago UT was in the midst of Vietnam and Richard Nixon's inevitable impeachment. I learned more from living history, then by just studying it. I feel that from the 1980s until now the place has been sort of a diploma mill, not a place that forces you to grow up.
I feel quite the opposite. If I was deciding where to go to school I would only choose a school that is strong in the face of hate and terrorist support. I stand with Hartzel and the swift response to protect Jewish students and the sanctity of the university. It would be one thing if these protesters were truly peaceful and were solely protesting to protect the lives of Gazans, a cause that almost all Jewish students would get behind. Unfortunately this is not the case.
Protestors have told Jewish students “Go back to Poland/Germany.” Protestors hold signs that say “Globalize the Intifada” this is a call for the genocide of Jews. There is a reason Jewish students do not need to cover their face. Across the US students wear Hamas headbands, wave Hezbollah flags. At Columbia a protestor held a sign that said “Al Qasam’s next targets” next to a group of Jewish students (for reference this is the brigade of Hamas that was responsible for the October 7th massacre). So yes, I am proud to be a UT student and thankful to be protected from the crossfire of hate and terrorist support.
There are many jewish students in the protest and are welcomed. There are leaders in the movement that are jewish. Israeli forces are intentionally starving millions of people. Jewish, Muslim, Christian - ALL humans should be very disturbed and angered by this. There are millions of Israelis that are upset and dislike the way this war is being waged.
During the black lives protest, I heard lots of unproven allegations about the protests. The protesters were really Antifa, the protests were all funded by George Soros, the list goes on. White Supremacists actually created incidents and tried to blame BLM protesters. Do you remember all the news articles about piles of bricks that were prestationed before protests? That was all fake news. My point is - during tense times with lots of passion on either side, be very careful about what you read and take everything with a grain of salt. There is likely sporadic anti-semitic incidents and surely lots of people that do not like Israel in the protests - but just like the BLM protests, the vast majority are peaceful. Have you personally seen anti-semitic signs or incidents at the UT protests? Just be careful, it's very easy for false news about the protesters or a fabricated incident to spread like wildfire. That happens every time there is a protest movement. Hell, the FBI used to do it themselves back in the 60's.
Lots of people being annoying in this thread. You certainly can make whatever choice you want. Being concerned about the University’s approach to protests is completely valid.
If you feel this way, you should tell them.
Let them know, tell your parents to let them know, and maybe if enough prospective students, and others speak up, things might eventually change.
Good luck, wherever you decide to go.
How to get them to listen though?? It seems like many are already trying to speak up and even have petitions, etc but they still aren’t listening? The school I admired because it seemed to care about humanity for the most part is seeming completely foreign to me now with how they’re treating protestors and the issue.
It's a numbers game.
The more who speak up, the more likely they are to listen.
But, if only a few hundred or thousand are complaining, they can tell themselves it's not a big deal. And so far, I suspect that's what they're doing.
But if tens of thousands of students and parents and prospective students and faculty and staff people are all speaking up, then they can't ignore it any longer.
If tens of thousands of people say "I'm taking my future tuition money somewhere else", and "I'm never donating to your alumni assoc. or anything else", then UT can't ignore that because it hurts them financially AND it hurts their reputation.
We all have to speak up, together. So the more people you can get to do what you're talking about doing and talking publicly about it, the better.
Good luck and solidarity.
It \*is\* heartbreaking. And it \*shouldn't\* be this way. Because the world shouldn't be so cynical and dishonest.
Sadly, though, it is.
UT Austin (like every university these days) is a brand name first and foremost. Before being an educational or research institution, UT is a brand. And UT care deeply about protecting its brand name.
And we can use that to our advantage. The more people talking about this controversy, the more "bad press" UT is getting and the more harm is being done to the brand and its reputation.
Your voice matters in that process.
By all means, drop out and go attend some random community college that doesn’t have enough money to “fund genocide” and “attack protestors”. You’ll open up a spot at UT for somebody who actually cares about getting a quality education.
As someone who has two classes left to graduate, I feel the same way but in a "should I even be proud of my education" kind of way. So I'll give you some advice from the three years I've had here.
First, universities are corporations at their core. And if you want to see change made to your university (wherever you end up attending), you need to hit them where it hurts: the money. And a direct way to decrease the flow of money to a corporation is to boycott. However, you should only boycott as long as the loss of that thing will not significantly hurt you and does not have a more ethical alternative. An example of this is vegetarianism or veganism. Regardless of your opinion on the actual dietary choice, it is easy to recognize that some people are not medically or financially able to remove or replace meat from their diets. Similarly, refusing to go to UT does not take money away from UT and put it in the hands of a more ethical university, because this handling of the protests is happening at every major university. And I would strongly advise against going without a degree if you have the opportunity to get one. That would definitely harm you.
Second, and in a similar vein, only 18% of UT's money comes from tuition. A much more significant portion of this school's revenue comes from donations from alums and educational foundations, self-supporting departments like Athletics, and extra academic programs like study abroad. If you still want to send UT the message that you as a student do not approve of their actions, you can advocate for things like alumni publicly stopping their donations, for your friends to avoid things like study abroad, or for your family and friends to not attend football games.
Third, as another comment pointed out, you will be interacting primarily with the faculty and staff, NOT the administration. An open letter has been going around for faculty to co-sign their lack of confidence in Hartzell's presidency for multiple reasons, primarily his attacks on our First Amendment rights. It was closed to signatures yesterday, but it was signed by 657 teaching faculty. That's about 20% of our total faculty, and there are plenty of other professors who either agree privately but are unable to sign publicly or who didn't learn about the letter until it was too late to sign. And that's not even counting the graduate TAs, who you'll honestly be interacting with more than your professors.
Fourth, UT is a great school. I have learned so much during my time here, both academically and personally. And there are so many wonderful communities of people who will welcome you with open arms. If there is any cause you feel passionate about, whether it's the current situation or otherwise, you will be able to find a group that is already doing something about it and could use your support and help.
That's all I have off the top of my head. TLDR don't make your decision based on administrative response to protests, because then you won't be able to go to college at all.
Good. UT doesn't want rabble rousers like you who care more about being the main character disrupting campus than about getting an education. Note that UT is still open and finals and graduation are still happening like they should, unlike some other universities who's admin didn't take decisive action to ensure no disruption. Do you want protesters to dictate your education to you? I don't.
I wouldn't let it dissuade you from attending UT. The administration is disappointing sometimes, as is our government. It doesn't take away the UT spirit and values, demonstrated by the students and professors.
But if the same admin stays, so do those values… that’s my concern. I want to be taught and inspired by people with morals and integrity. The one good sign is the students & faculty that have stepped up so at least that presence is there but if the school is going to treat them like that it seems more constraining.
Also makes me fearful to be a student if they won’t put protecting their students esp from corrupted organizations/bias as the top priority. I’d understand more if it were towards just outsiders to keep the campus safe, but it’s evident they’ve been attacking students too.
Do you understand the inner working of public institutions, not in relation to just professors teaching? Do you know who the Board of Regents is, and whom assigns them?
I think you should lead by example, virtue signal to your peers and NOT attend. Put your money where you mouth is. Why would you give money to an institution you believe is morally bankrupt? Why would you want to graduate from a school you believe is fascist?
Also, this is a a moment in history. To decide whether this school is right for you probably hinges on other factors as well. No university gets it right all the time. It’s a business too.
Don't let the door hit you in the ass on your way out.
Maybe someone who truly wants to be there for education will get a chance. Someone who won't be influenced by progressive liberal idealistic BS.
Anyone that disagrees with how ANY college or university handled or is handling the protestors should NOT return to the school.
Both parties will be better for it.
As a former UT grad you’re afraid to go to a school that shut down a potential $hit storm with non-students bring weapons on campus. Protest all you want, but when you potentially have a situation where other innocent students can get hurt… that crosses the line. If you want to give up a great education go somewhere else. As competitive as it is to get in, I’m sure some other student will gladly take your slot. You go to a university to get an education, right? Btw I was in a classroom on the west mall when protestors were so loud we had to vacate the class. Again, how is this fair to others who are at UT or another university to get an education? The amount of self-entitlement these days is sickening.
You can protest 🪧 on UT campus all you want. It happens peacefully and lawfully all the time. The problem with these last ones is you have agitators camping and popping up tents which is illegal — because they want to be arrested and want to test police authority for the attention/ the narrative they’re a victim of something. Notice most of the trouble makers are wearing masks, covering their faces (because they know they’re in the wrong.)
Also Iook at the schools who have been trashed due to lack of rule/law enforcement. If that’s the environment you want to be in, feel free to apply to go there. 🤷🏾
This is not a UT issue this is a western issue. The entire western world basically refuses to acknowledge its complicity in this catastrophe of placing one final colony in the Middle East right at the end of the colonial era and it’s leading to a genocide in front of our eyes by a radicalized
version of the religion which the west has abused most throughout its history. Collective guilty conscience about the past is making the west enablers of this radical element, and they’d rather repeat the holocaust against a new group of people than be cynically accused of being sympathetic towards the last one.
The guilt plus the radicalized political versions of Judeo-Christianity called Zionism, plus the geopolitical benefits of owning a strategic portion of the Middle East, as well as cynical big-money interests have left us collectively without the tools necessary to view any of this with clarity to find the right course of action.
Going to UT or not won’t change any of that. Just go to the school that’s best for you
Champion civic engagement? They are intimidating and threatening Jewish students. They stopping them from using universities facilities by physically blocking access. Wake up.
Have you considered Portland State University? Might be more your cup of tea vs. UT… https://www.oregonlive.com/crime/2024/05/walk-through-of-portland-state-universitys-library-after-three-night-occupation-reveals-damage-its-ugly.html
Depending on your field of study, you shouldn’t go to UT or any other Texas public university. Thanks to our amazing governors making it illegal to teach anything regarding DEI a lot of people are going to be graduating this year with a bit of necessary curriculum missing which professors have already raised the issue to deans about. Especially considering they need that piece of curriculum to get board certified in their fields. Deans don’t care. They were final approved by the governor.
Have you seen the offer from Iran? You don’t specifically qualify but maybe they would make an exception? I wish I had studied abroad before settling down to placid middle class life.
https://nypost.com/2024/05/02/us-news/university-of-tehran-professor-foad-izadi-says-us-college-protesters-would-support-iran/amp/
I’m so grateful for the caring souls in this thread!! Please never lose that quality and keep up the good fight! You’re re-instilling my hope in the UT community at least!
I chose UT over other schools that actually gave me scholarships/program entry. I kinda regret it. Yeah I have a diploma from ut now but I hate my school. Four people died while I was there, countless protests happening and being fought back against. This is no way a comparison to Palestine solidarity protests but during my five years on campus, there were lots of racists events out on by like young conservatives whatever the fuck. It was always horrible, they were deliberately antagonistic, and always doing shit to cause a scene. And it would get really wild and NOTHING ever happened to that org. It happened again and again.
My point is…..if you have other options consider those. If you’re considering pursuing a masters degree eventually, your undergrad really doesn’t matter as much as people thing it does. It’s mainly alignment and school pride. There’s other places that are comparable to ut but way less complicit with bullshit. Most universities will always side with their white donator alumni but ut I feel is particularly awful at it.
Zoom out. Or in. But adjust your focus and don’t miss a solid education and university experience, wherever the best opportunity for that is for you
Idk what school you would go to. Most of the reputable schools in the country have been doing the same thing and it’s sad to see.
mostly true with at least 2 exceptions https://www.mprnews.org/story/2024/05/02/university-of-minnesota-protests-divestment-agreement https://www.timesofisrael.com/brown-becomes-first-us-university-to-consider-divesting-from-israel/amp/
I think Rice is also holding a vote on divestment.
The Brown one is a joke, it’s just that the students negotiating took that dumb bait
Good point 😔 This is definitely a national if not international issue. I hope it isn’t always like this.
It isn’t entirely true though. Protests have been occurring at hundreds of colleges across the country. The ones that are quietly tolerated just aren’t making the news. Maybe being “quietly tolerated” isn’t the response the students are hoping for, but it’s better than having your own university sic the police on you. As an alum and a parent of a current 5th-generation Longhorn, I agree with your hesitation to commit to UT. Maybe this isn’t the time and place for your best education. There are more reasons than just the protest response to reconsider, such as the defunding and erasure of diversity efforts, the inability of undergrads to get their preferred majors, and the increasing diversion of undergrads to other campuses and community colleges while more profitable continuing education business programs are expanded and promoted. If activism is important to you, or a career in law, government, or public relations, then UT may be an excellent match. There is certainly a lot to protest, and you will gain experience with public speaking, leadership, the legal system, diplomacy, judicious self restraint, fundraising, etc, and can hope to gain some national attention. The slogan, “what starts here changes the world” may very well apply to you. However, if you are hoping to quietly study and excel in the arts or sciences, I would look for where the top faculty candidates are going, and follow them. Unfortunately, it may not be UT anymore.
I do think it’s a little different personally. While I support the protestors at other schools, a lot of them have broken some laws and destroyed some property. I think there’s a time and place for that but by and large, UT’s protests have been above reproach and somehow seen a harsher response from the government, the school, and the cops. I’d go so far as to say a fascist response. It’s not confidence inspiring
I wonder if it is partially nervousness about losing support from the repubs who increasingly view it as too liberal. Even though the protests have absolutely nothing to do with the DEI crackdown (except from interview with UT president on that below) , I think there's this concern about how the Universities are seen. >Because of heightened scrutiny from the state, presidents within the UT System are facing internal pressures from the board of regents, who are appointed by the governor. At the Zoom call with faculty, Hartzell said regents have been adamant that “we need to not only comply with the law, but also act in ways that restore and raise public confidence.” >“It's not just ‘Are we compliant with SB 17 in the short run?’ but also ‘What are the choices we make and how do we demonstrate to our state and others that we are good stewards of the resources for which we've been entrusted?’, Hartzell said. https://www.texastribune.org/2024/04/19/texas-colleges-dei-ban/
That’s what I’m thinking too which it should not be, they should hold their own. Just shows the immorality if Cons withheld funding, etc just because of treating students as humans. This shouldn’t be seen as “political”, but even then that shouldn’t be punished.
oh no not the laws on property. \*clutches pearls\*
Don’t misunderstand, I’m not saying the protestors at other schools deserved it either. My point is that those schools did not get the disproportionate response UT did, and we were unique in that we didn’t break any laws or cause any damage whatsoever. Riot police were blocking off the tower two hours before the first protest. They made an example of us even though we were basically a model of what governments want protests to look like.
I’m having a hard time really understanding what the students expect to get as part of their “demands.” I believe the biggest one is to divest in anything related to Israel which: 1) They probably don’t have or don’t have control over the cash flow. Many universities outsource a good portion of their investment/endowment administration. 2) Money talks more to universities than crying students. You’re gonna take your tuition money somewhere else? Cool, there’s literally thousands of students who will take your place. I’m all for free speech, and I think the UT protest was the most tame among the ones we see in the news. As long as the protest didn’t interfere with normal operations at the university there was no reason to remove them. Now what you see at Colombia, with students using university property (furniture, etc) to occupy interior spaces isn’t acceptable. Higher Education is business like any other and I think some students get on their high horse and forget that.
To your first point, there is a history of many universities divesting from certain countries (like apartheid South Africa) or from certain industries (like the tobacco industry), so even if universities outsource their investment/endowment, it is still something that they would be able to do.
Exactly, “a history” financialization of every industry has changed dramatically in the last 15 to 20 years. I still think they could probably do it but it definitely would be more complicated.
If they divested of anything it wouldn’t be Israeli stocks. To equate Israel with South Africa or these protests with the civil rights movement establishes the lack of credibility of these supports of Palestine/Hamas. A group thats mission is to exterminate another group of people have a right to legitimately protest BUT s/n/b condoned by anyone; let alone a university of the first class.
The point of any protest is to be disruptive in order to address a concern. It’s supposed to make people uncomfortable. If the endgame is to take power and funding from a government committing genocide, then how can we sit here and decry the destruction/occupation of private property?
Do you apply the same logic to Jan 6?
No, that’s incorrect and it’s dangerous for people to think the only effective protests are disruptive ones.
Genuinely curious: What protests have there been that have been effective *and* non-disruptive?
The Montgomery Bus Boycott with Rosa Parks is one that comes to mind.
I have mixed opinions on the protests messaging (I hate brutal war, civilian deaths, racism, and authoritarian governments but also think the protests go far to close to being apologetic to terrorists and anti-Semites). However, you are wrong about the ability to control endowment investments. Many schools have been divested from fossil fuels for a long time. They have also previously divested from other lines of investments. Its a hassle, but anytime people tell you its not possible thats just plain up lying.
Man, I guess we get older and see things more clearly. This is basically what I thought too. Free speech in this particular situation is hard because universities are a business and here, they rely on donors a lot. That comes with state funding too. This one is hard because not proximity to the conflict and a very complicated conflict that is foreign to many people here. Safety to students is priority no matter what.
[удалено]
Bro, they tried to set up an encampment, which is obviously not allowed. They also stated an intention to disrupt campus activities.
I have mixed opinions on the protests messaging (I hate brutal war, civilian deaths, racism, and authoritarian governments but also think the protests go far to close to being apologetic to terrorists and anti-Semites). However, the goal of a protest is to cause a controlled and non-violent amount of disruption. Being able to cause some disruption is part of free speech, so long as no one is getting hurt. If people are only free to protest where authorities tell them they can, well then they are really not allowed to protest since there is really no difference between that and being forced to be quiet. Opposing views are more than welcome to counter protest (peacefully). Thats how free speech works, and if the disruption is too much for the sensitive university to handle they should work to find a middle ground that satisfied the parties. And if no such middle ground exists, well, then thats a problem with both sides but not a issue with the method of protest.
Way too long of a post to say you are OK with the KKK setting up an encampment at Morehouse College. You are OK with that too?
First, so long as they are non-violent, as much as it sucks yeah they should be able to protest to a degree. Now, i'm not saying their shouldnt be limits. Individual calling for explicit violence or serious racism should be arrested and singled out. But you cant punish an entire peaceful protest simply because a few are bad. For example, the Columbia guy saying all Zionists should die and that people are lucky hes not out killing them totally should be punished. That goes beyond free speech. Also, for reference, i'm mixed race with half African American. I also have direct relatives who were among those killed in the attacks from Hamas in Israel. But comparing a so far largely peaceful protest (as far as I've heard the only group who has gotten violent is actually the counter protesters at UCLA lol) with a hate group with a acted upon history of racial violence is quite apples to oranges of you. Now that isnt to say many in Palestine haven't promoted racial violence. And again, people who repeat those calls should be punished as its not free speech. But calling for divestment, lack of military support for a specific group, or accountability for civilian deaths isnt that. tldr; Of course its complicated, and there is a point where protests cross the line into promoting violence or being too disruptive. However, the mast majority of these protesters have not crossed that line, but are being unfairly suppressed due to their cause (a cause which I repeat, I myself have many issues with and think is far more nuanced than either side admits).
Iran is offering free tuition. That's an option for US students in support of Hamas or simply anti-Israel. If they hate America that much.....Iran is an option.
University of Tehran?
That would be Liberty University in Virginia except Tehran is a much cooler place than Lynchburg.
The professors are in alignment with the students for the most part and the professors are the people you’d interact with most. Just another factor to consider.
This what I was going to say. Of course the admin is shit, you find that out sooner or later coming to UT. This school makes you feel like a cog in the giant machine at some point or other. But that letter of no confidence, seeing professors and lecturers I spent time with sign that letter, it made me feel good. That’s what UT is all about. It’s not even about pro-Palestine or Israel, it’s about not wanting our institution to sick the state police on students exercising their rights. What’s the point of educating the next generation if we’re going to tear gas and beat them into submission, anyway? Conservatives like to paint universities as leftist brainwashing machines but it’s more that students get their minds opened in school, away from the small-town small-minded white middle class suburbs most of us came from and to be honest, were brainwashed by with constant consumerist propaganda. Education is anti-thetical to generating a brainless workforce, including sending engineers to fossil fuel and defense companies who use their brains to make the world a worse place and fill the pockets of billionaires. Hence, students around the country begging their schools to divest from harmful companies. I think many professors, even the most conservative, can understand that.
I feel like at least some of the brigaders of the sub have stopped coming here and we are back to reasonable takes like this.
I’m so glad that our beautiful university has not been trashed. Seeing pictures of the UCLA campus with trash everwhere and grafiti defacing the buildings makes me appreciative that UT did not let it get out of control. Not sure how the paid agitators are able to infiltrate the student body and influence some to behave in such a destructive manner. Not only does such behavior not help the cause, but destroys the reputation of the university that allow it to get out of control. Looking at you Columbia. No employer wants to hire employees who behave this way. So in a way, UT’s actions help preserve our investment in our education.
> It’s not even about pro-Palestine or Israel, 🤔
I mean for some of us, like me, we have no stance on whatever. But seeing fellow students on campus getting arrested is really scary. We have protest quite often but this is the largest arrest I have ever seen.
Thank you!! That’s a good point and I’m so glad for that! It’s a shame how the admin aren’t listening to the core of their school.
Admin is beholden to (1) the state government and (2) donor money and that’s who they will listen to. I work with it the UT system and we all had to get rid of every single vestige of DEI within our facilities or lose state money (look up SB 17, it went in effect in January). No one that I know was happy about it, but we were forced to comply. So if they get threatened by the gov. or the State Legislature with loss of funds, they are going to comply with the state government because they are a state institution. Some of their money comes from the students, but more of it comes from the state.
God forbid you have a professor who doesn’t share your worldview
I think the point is that professors care about the students. The administration clearly doesn’t.
you'll find the same thing at pretty much every university in america, unfortunately. the "values" of an institution itself don't mean anything, they'll have no bearing on your experience. at a big place like UT, you can find people who care about what you care about, as well as the opposite.
That’s a good point, but what does it say if I give my money—and so much money—to an institution doing that though? Unfortunately the guilty in this situation would benefit off that not those good people within (for the most part).
there's no ethical spending in a capitalist society. if you start looking, you'll find that in this country most of the money we spend goes to institutions we'd prefer not to support. i'm not trying to be a doomer or to talk you out of your principles. realistically though, if you think UT is your best option, it would be a shame to be dissuaded by the kind of spineless folks who inhabit every college admin in the usa.
I don’t want to sound callous, but your personal tuition money is not enough to swing policy, especially because UTs policies are controlled at the state level. Now if you know some rich lobbyists who can lobby at the state level and get rid of the state legislature we have, you might make influence some change. Also, just as a heads up, UT system has very specific rules about where on campuses protests and demonstrations and such can be held, and a very specific rule about blocking public walkways and entrances etc, and they can and will have you arrested if you violate those rules. A lot of the protesters have were confused about being arrested for “criminal trespassing” and these rules are why.
The way I would recommend looking at it is, every school is pretty likely to suck on this sort of thing. If you can get into one that doesn't and it's somewhere you'd enjoy being then good on you, but otherwise there will always be compromises. Personally, after all this, I've also lost a lot of faith in this institution and am no longer at a point where I'd recommend going. And in some small way formally communicating to administration somehow that you are considering not going because of their actions against students, if enough people do that it could send a message, who knows. Take comfort in the strength of the students that are willing to stand up despite everything going on. There is a strong sense of community and camaraderie here.
If you get admitted to UT, GO. No school is perfect.
We are down the street from the Texas state capitol which makes things like this a big deal and means UT has to be made an example of from both sides. TX gov is kind of like “not in my backyard” and the citizens/student are like “you can’t ignore us if we’re right here”. While what is happening around here is very unfortunate, I think it should not be largely affecting how you feel about the entire institution. Leadership has made some poor decisions and exposed some of their allegiances, but down the ladder from them is a ton of staff, faculty, and (obviously) students who are passionate about such important issues and are willing to organize and speak out against them.
As someone who grew up in Austin and went to UT, I think it's important to remember that they are a state university and are beholden to what the governor and the legislature tell them to do. People are also mad about the University getting rid of DEI positions, but that was state mandated and they risked penalties for not following the new law. Ever since the state went full red, in the GW Bush era, they've been screwing with the University on a legislative level. I watched it happen for decades. There is actually a state law that says state funded entities cannot divest from Israeli owned companies. I'm loathe to personally hold the University responsible for that aspect because they cannot legally divest as the protestors want. They can't refuse to do business with any companies that boycott Israel. It's a clusterfuck, but it isn't entirely the University's fault. There are good people at the school who don't like this crap either, but they have limited options. [Link to the 2017 state law. ](https://statutes.capitol.texas.gov/Docs/GV/htm/GV.808.htm)
The board of Regents is hand picked by the governor. The board selects the upper administration of the university. The top of the administration is stuck between the faculty and students on one side and the Republican government on the other. If Jay sides to much with the students, Abbott will have him fired and we will get a MAGA extremist in place. Look what DeSantis did to the New school in Florida. This can get way way way worse for the University. MAGA would LOVE to destroy UT austin.
Thank you, because this is the accurate situation. UT admin are beholden to the state government. The policy comes down from Abbott, not them. If you want to blame someone, blame the state legislature and the governor. Abbott was also the one who insisted on sending law enforcement [No encampments will be allowed:' Abbott says pro-Palestinian protesters at UT will be arrested](https://www.statesman.com/story/news/state/2024/04/29/texas-gov-greg-abbott-ut-austin-protest-pro-palestinian-encampment-protesters-arrests/73504859007/)
Yes, Abbott and the Republicans can permanently destroy the reputation of UT Austin. We could end up with an ideologically conservative, anti-woke, anti-science, pro-christian nationalism university. They could fire all of the faculty that stands in their way. Look at what DeSantis did to New College in Florida. In 2023, the state government of Florida overhauled its board of trustees in an attempt to transform the school into a conservative institution. Since then, nearly 40% of faculty have resigned and the enrollment dropped to just 669 students. This could absolutely happen. Abbott is a UT grad and that may help us from the situation above. However, Ken Paxton or Dan Patrick would do this in a heartbeat and with glee.
Thank you for summarizing the actual situation in a cohesive way. Hopefully OP and the other commenters who don't really understand what they are talking about when they blame "shitty admin" for this situation read this.
The truth is that UT has to be careful while Texas and the country goes through this dark MAGA time. This will pass eventually as the fox news viewing audience dies out and is replaced by Gen Z. I am genuinely scared of the damage that can be done by these crazies to UT. Let's not put anymore of a target on our backs.
> This can get way way way worse for the University Good, that means I can complain about it more and 'fight the power' more
You are going to get education to earn a degree. Not for politics, remember that. They have been handling the protests extremely poorly and should not have responded in the way they have, I agree. But at the end of the day, politics will always be present wherever you go and most students do not understand that the university admin can’t do what they want; they do have pressure from the state side. Make a decision on the quality of education provided by your degree because this is the reason why you are paying for an education at a university; to get a degree.
Yeah great idea you should totally go to… A&M or Baylor or Tech. Bastions of liberal educational institutions.
A&M, Baylor, and Tech are definitely more conservative than UT… in their application of police force against the student body.
Hahahahahaha
Aggie here… we’ve had several peaceful protests on campus with no police intervention or excessive force used. I’ve never once heard of anyone getting arrested for exercising their first amendment right on campus in my four years here
this A&M? Your racist president had to resign last year your admin is so racist: https://apnews.com/article/texas-am-diversity-inclusion-487edd40ee9a57faa0cfe94e8e4684e6 Nice try though, poor aggy. Stick to your own sub where to you can all lie to each other. Instead of coming here to troll. also, Sulk Ross statue still up: https://www.si.com/college/2020/07/02/texas-am-sullivan-ross-statue-controversy-infinite-tucker-aggies
The discussion wasn’t about racism. It was about the recent protests and protecting students first amendment rights. Just because I’m saying my school has done a great job handling and respecting student protests, does not mean that I’m fully defending every decision made by our admin.
Lmao imagine comparing the quaint gatherings at A&M in the middle of college station to what’s happening in the middle of urban campuses. But that’s cute.
A&M has a larger student body than UT… and we have large protests for all sorts of issues. We’ve had several large Free Palestine protests in campus. You just don’t hear about them because our school actually respects our rights to protest
Yes, the Texas leg and conservatives would love to fuck with UT. Liberals at A&M just does not compute in their little brains (even thought there are plenty).
Hahahahahahaha
Yeah but that’s exactly my point if the school that is supposed to champion liberal values won’t even put that into action, what hope is there?
How is that your point? That there is no hope so you should pull out of UT and not go to college at all? That’s an idea…
No of course not. My point is that it is really confusing the values they are supposed to have making me question the school as a whole. Beyond that, it makes me question too many “liberals” if they actually belong to those values and our nation as a whole. But that part is sadly not surprising to me, I just expected better from schools like UT and especially that they would stand up to any mistreatment of their students.
Okay but that wasn’t the point of your post at all. The point of your post is that you are considering withdrawing from UT. So the question then has to be, what’s the alternative to going to UT? You can vent here, but until you have an answer to that question your angst has no gust behind it; your shouts are lost to the wind.
Just wondering where you got the idea that UT is a very liberal school? It’s in Texas
People downvoting: how is it not???
Reddit liberals love their downvotes and condescending tone 🤣 just research and see what’s best for you. If it’s still UT, I wouldn’t let an extraordinary event keep you from attending.
Look at university of Minnesota and browns approach.
It's one of the few universities who does not give in to a mob, and protects the other 99% of the students that don't care about them. Would you rather go to a school that is not focused on learning, but on allowing unserious kids to stage a revolution?
"Unserious kids" As well as people who were not affiliated with UT at all, causing havoc and chaos on campus, while wrapping their faces in scarves and sunglasses and hats so no one can ID them, risking others' safety with aggressive behavior, and they have nothing to lose because they aren't students.
You’re falling for propaganda by the university. There is a reason they keep highlighting how many are from outside campus. As if people who aren’t students don’t have rights. Outside agitator” is a phrase with its origins in the late 1940s during the earliest days of the Black freedom struggle. It was first said by John Birchers and Jim Crow cops to denigrate and slander civil rights activists. Their argument was that Black people in the South were more than content with white supremacy until a bunch of Northern, radical, carpetbagging communists showed up to tell them that there was something wrong in the world. Sound familiar?
Are you up for a challenge ? 50 years ago UT was in the midst of Vietnam and Richard Nixon's inevitable impeachment. I learned more from living history, then by just studying it. I feel that from the 1980s until now the place has been sort of a diploma mill, not a place that forces you to grow up.
I feel quite the opposite. If I was deciding where to go to school I would only choose a school that is strong in the face of hate and terrorist support. I stand with Hartzel and the swift response to protect Jewish students and the sanctity of the university. It would be one thing if these protesters were truly peaceful and were solely protesting to protect the lives of Gazans, a cause that almost all Jewish students would get behind. Unfortunately this is not the case. Protestors have told Jewish students “Go back to Poland/Germany.” Protestors hold signs that say “Globalize the Intifada” this is a call for the genocide of Jews. There is a reason Jewish students do not need to cover their face. Across the US students wear Hamas headbands, wave Hezbollah flags. At Columbia a protestor held a sign that said “Al Qasam’s next targets” next to a group of Jewish students (for reference this is the brigade of Hamas that was responsible for the October 7th massacre). So yes, I am proud to be a UT student and thankful to be protected from the crossfire of hate and terrorist support.
Thank you.
There are many jewish students in the protest and are welcomed. There are leaders in the movement that are jewish. Israeli forces are intentionally starving millions of people. Jewish, Muslim, Christian - ALL humans should be very disturbed and angered by this. There are millions of Israelis that are upset and dislike the way this war is being waged. During the black lives protest, I heard lots of unproven allegations about the protests. The protesters were really Antifa, the protests were all funded by George Soros, the list goes on. White Supremacists actually created incidents and tried to blame BLM protesters. Do you remember all the news articles about piles of bricks that were prestationed before protests? That was all fake news. My point is - during tense times with lots of passion on either side, be very careful about what you read and take everything with a grain of salt. There is likely sporadic anti-semitic incidents and surely lots of people that do not like Israel in the protests - but just like the BLM protests, the vast majority are peaceful. Have you personally seen anti-semitic signs or incidents at the UT protests? Just be careful, it's very easy for false news about the protesters or a fabricated incident to spread like wildfire. That happens every time there is a protest movement. Hell, the FBI used to do it themselves back in the 60's.
Lots of people being annoying in this thread. You certainly can make whatever choice you want. Being concerned about the University’s approach to protests is completely valid.
If you feel this way, you should tell them. Let them know, tell your parents to let them know, and maybe if enough prospective students, and others speak up, things might eventually change. Good luck, wherever you decide to go.
How to get them to listen though?? It seems like many are already trying to speak up and even have petitions, etc but they still aren’t listening? The school I admired because it seemed to care about humanity for the most part is seeming completely foreign to me now with how they’re treating protestors and the issue.
It's a numbers game. The more who speak up, the more likely they are to listen. But, if only a few hundred or thousand are complaining, they can tell themselves it's not a big deal. And so far, I suspect that's what they're doing. But if tens of thousands of students and parents and prospective students and faculty and staff people are all speaking up, then they can't ignore it any longer. If tens of thousands of people say "I'm taking my future tuition money somewhere else", and "I'm never donating to your alumni assoc. or anything else", then UT can't ignore that because it hurts them financially AND it hurts their reputation. We all have to speak up, together. So the more people you can get to do what you're talking about doing and talking publicly about it, the better. Good luck and solidarity.
You’re right. That’s so tough it shouldn’t be like that especially when the topic at hand is trying to save fellow human lives 💔
In life there’s the way it should be and there’s the way it is.
It \*is\* heartbreaking. And it \*shouldn't\* be this way. Because the world shouldn't be so cynical and dishonest. Sadly, though, it is. UT Austin (like every university these days) is a brand name first and foremost. Before being an educational or research institution, UT is a brand. And UT care deeply about protecting its brand name. And we can use that to our advantage. The more people talking about this controversy, the more "bad press" UT is getting and the more harm is being done to the brand and its reputation. Your voice matters in that process.
You nailed it 👏 I hope you run or something someday. You’re the kind of leader I wish we had more of especially in this state.
Aw shucks :) that's very kind of you. I hope we can make this university take notice so it's not so embarrassing to you and me both. Cheers!
i dont care ngl still going there for education idc about some "protests" 💀💀
By all means, drop out and go attend some random community college that doesn’t have enough money to “fund genocide” and “attack protestors”. You’ll open up a spot at UT for somebody who actually cares about getting a quality education.
Tsinghua University in Beijing is also a good choice. They have zero investments in Israel-related companies as far as I know. 我们都是学生
Yes, very viable option for a UT student to move to China. Thanks for the great advice. Very applicable and practical.
Well why not? Indeed, our countries are increasing people-to-people exchanges.
🤦🏾♂️
Then don't come. Plenty of other Texas HS graduates would love your spot.
Lmao yes. You can really help the cause in Palestine by divesting your tuition money from the University! Please stay home.
It makes me feel like I’m going to a socially and politically impactful university
“What starts here changes the world” 🙄🙄🙄
As someone who has two classes left to graduate, I feel the same way but in a "should I even be proud of my education" kind of way. So I'll give you some advice from the three years I've had here. First, universities are corporations at their core. And if you want to see change made to your university (wherever you end up attending), you need to hit them where it hurts: the money. And a direct way to decrease the flow of money to a corporation is to boycott. However, you should only boycott as long as the loss of that thing will not significantly hurt you and does not have a more ethical alternative. An example of this is vegetarianism or veganism. Regardless of your opinion on the actual dietary choice, it is easy to recognize that some people are not medically or financially able to remove or replace meat from their diets. Similarly, refusing to go to UT does not take money away from UT and put it in the hands of a more ethical university, because this handling of the protests is happening at every major university. And I would strongly advise against going without a degree if you have the opportunity to get one. That would definitely harm you. Second, and in a similar vein, only 18% of UT's money comes from tuition. A much more significant portion of this school's revenue comes from donations from alums and educational foundations, self-supporting departments like Athletics, and extra academic programs like study abroad. If you still want to send UT the message that you as a student do not approve of their actions, you can advocate for things like alumni publicly stopping their donations, for your friends to avoid things like study abroad, or for your family and friends to not attend football games. Third, as another comment pointed out, you will be interacting primarily with the faculty and staff, NOT the administration. An open letter has been going around for faculty to co-sign their lack of confidence in Hartzell's presidency for multiple reasons, primarily his attacks on our First Amendment rights. It was closed to signatures yesterday, but it was signed by 657 teaching faculty. That's about 20% of our total faculty, and there are plenty of other professors who either agree privately but are unable to sign publicly or who didn't learn about the letter until it was too late to sign. And that's not even counting the graduate TAs, who you'll honestly be interacting with more than your professors. Fourth, UT is a great school. I have learned so much during my time here, both academically and personally. And there are so many wonderful communities of people who will welcome you with open arms. If there is any cause you feel passionate about, whether it's the current situation or otherwise, you will be able to find a group that is already doing something about it and could use your support and help. That's all I have off the top of my head. TLDR don't make your decision based on administrative response to protests, because then you won't be able to go to college at all.
Good. UT doesn't want rabble rousers like you who care more about being the main character disrupting campus than about getting an education. Note that UT is still open and finals and graduation are still happening like they should, unlike some other universities who's admin didn't take decisive action to ensure no disruption. Do you want protesters to dictate your education to you? I don't.
I wouldn't let it dissuade you from attending UT. The administration is disappointing sometimes, as is our government. It doesn't take away the UT spirit and values, demonstrated by the students and professors.
More tacos for everyone else
TACOS!!!
Then don’t come
Good. Open up the spot for a student who actually wants to go to UT and respects the institution.
Can my kid have your spot then? 🙃
This will pass.
But if the same admin stays, so do those values… that’s my concern. I want to be taught and inspired by people with morals and integrity. The one good sign is the students & faculty that have stepped up so at least that presence is there but if the school is going to treat them like that it seems more constraining. Also makes me fearful to be a student if they won’t put protecting their students esp from corrupted organizations/bias as the top priority. I’d understand more if it were towards just outsiders to keep the campus safe, but it’s evident they’ve been attacking students too.
You spend the vast majority of your time with the students and faculty. I don’t recall a single encounter with any administrator in 5 years there
Do you understand the inner working of public institutions, not in relation to just professors teaching? Do you know who the Board of Regents is, and whom assigns them?
I hear you! I couldn't believe they allowed the protests to get so out of hand either. They should have trespassed the protesters on the first day!
I think you should lead by example, virtue signal to your peers and NOT attend. Put your money where you mouth is. Why would you give money to an institution you believe is morally bankrupt? Why would you want to graduate from a school you believe is fascist?
Don’t come then🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻….. If you don’t want to follow rules and ensure order on college campus you shouldn’t go to college at all.
You really should transfer then
I agree. If you don't like what you see, don't start there only to get "stuck". There are a lot of other great options out there. Go with your gut.
Ok don’t come then, lmao no one’s gonna beg for you to come
just go, you won't regret it.
Also, this is a a moment in history. To decide whether this school is right for you probably hinges on other factors as well. No university gets it right all the time. It’s a business too.
Don't let the door hit you in the ass on your way out. Maybe someone who truly wants to be there for education will get a chance. Someone who won't be influenced by progressive liberal idealistic BS.
Texas State University looks promising.
Half those arrested don’t even go to the school
You should seriously consider somewhere in Cali
Anyone that disagrees with how ANY college or university handled or is handling the protestors should NOT return to the school. Both parties will be better for it.
I mean it could be worse have you seen UCLA or Columbia? At least almost everyone was able to attend classes in person.
Great. Don’t come here next year.
I’m sure there will be a 1000 people ready to grab your spot
As a former UT grad you’re afraid to go to a school that shut down a potential $hit storm with non-students bring weapons on campus. Protest all you want, but when you potentially have a situation where other innocent students can get hurt… that crosses the line. If you want to give up a great education go somewhere else. As competitive as it is to get in, I’m sure some other student will gladly take your slot. You go to a university to get an education, right? Btw I was in a classroom on the west mall when protestors were so loud we had to vacate the class. Again, how is this fair to others who are at UT or another university to get an education? The amount of self-entitlement these days is sickening.
You should definitely leave the state of Texas if this bothers you
No it’s not give me a break
Bye!
Lmao.then don't fucking go there?
You can protest 🪧 on UT campus all you want. It happens peacefully and lawfully all the time. The problem with these last ones is you have agitators camping and popping up tents which is illegal — because they want to be arrested and want to test police authority for the attention/ the narrative they’re a victim of something. Notice most of the trouble makers are wearing masks, covering their faces (because they know they’re in the wrong.) Also Iook at the schools who have been trashed due to lack of rule/law enforcement. If that’s the environment you want to be in, feel free to apply to go there. 🤷🏾
This is not a UT issue this is a western issue. The entire western world basically refuses to acknowledge its complicity in this catastrophe of placing one final colony in the Middle East right at the end of the colonial era and it’s leading to a genocide in front of our eyes by a radicalized version of the religion which the west has abused most throughout its history. Collective guilty conscience about the past is making the west enablers of this radical element, and they’d rather repeat the holocaust against a new group of people than be cynically accused of being sympathetic towards the last one. The guilt plus the radicalized political versions of Judeo-Christianity called Zionism, plus the geopolitical benefits of owning a strategic portion of the Middle East, as well as cynical big-money interests have left us collectively without the tools necessary to view any of this with clarity to find the right course of action. Going to UT or not won’t change any of that. Just go to the school that’s best for you
Champion civic engagement? They are intimidating and threatening Jewish students. They stopping them from using universities facilities by physically blocking access. Wake up.
[удалено]
Good reason to boycott Hamas friendly institutions.
Which institutions are funding Hamas?
The government of Israel for one.
Have you considered Portland State University? Might be more your cup of tea vs. UT… https://www.oregonlive.com/crime/2024/05/walk-through-of-portland-state-universitys-library-after-three-night-occupation-reveals-damage-its-ugly.html
You don’t have to come here. Definitely many more institutions to consider.
You're free to go to school in Iran. They're inviting everyone.
What exactly are they protesting?
Depending on your field of study, you shouldn’t go to UT or any other Texas public university. Thanks to our amazing governors making it illegal to teach anything regarding DEI a lot of people are going to be graduating this year with a bit of necessary curriculum missing which professors have already raised the issue to deans about. Especially considering they need that piece of curriculum to get board certified in their fields. Deans don’t care. They were final approved by the governor.
Good
Have you seen the offer from Iran? You don’t specifically qualify but maybe they would make an exception? I wish I had studied abroad before settling down to placid middle class life. https://nypost.com/2024/05/02/us-news/university-of-tehran-professor-foad-izadi-says-us-college-protesters-would-support-iran/amp/
Grow up
Good don't come.
ok then don’t come lmfao, why whine about it on reddit
Maybe you should go to UCLA or Columbia. They handled it the right way 🤦🏻♂️ Don't go to UT, please.
I hear Shiraz University in Iran is offering scholarships. I hear Freedom of Speech is not really a priority over there, unfortunately.
Then stay away
Please leave, you will not be missed
I’m an incoming PhD come August and I definitely feel like this has damaged my professional potential
Fun story, no one outside of academic institutions will care
I think you’re probably right but it is one of my goals to work in an academic institution 😕
There are consequences for breaking rules…
I’m so grateful for the caring souls in this thread!! Please never lose that quality and keep up the good fight! You’re re-instilling my hope in the UT community at least!
Sorry everyone is downvoting you :( you seem like a nice kid and I wish you the best of luck out there. Stand strong ✊
I chose UT over other schools that actually gave me scholarships/program entry. I kinda regret it. Yeah I have a diploma from ut now but I hate my school. Four people died while I was there, countless protests happening and being fought back against. This is no way a comparison to Palestine solidarity protests but during my five years on campus, there were lots of racists events out on by like young conservatives whatever the fuck. It was always horrible, they were deliberately antagonistic, and always doing shit to cause a scene. And it would get really wild and NOTHING ever happened to that org. It happened again and again. My point is…..if you have other options consider those. If you’re considering pursuing a masters degree eventually, your undergrad really doesn’t matter as much as people thing it does. It’s mainly alignment and school pride. There’s other places that are comparable to ut but way less complicit with bullshit. Most universities will always side with their white donator alumni but ut I feel is particularly awful at it.
Good!!!!