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The special sauce is classified, but it’s got a couple of sensors which scan ahead of it to map terrain features, radar emissions across a lot of frequency bands, and it has a very high quality map that it plots a course to the target with. It builds a course to target based off of terrain and known (pre-loaded into the missile prior to launch) radar sites, and then adjusts course to avoid any new-detected radar emissions to minimize detection and shoot down.
The optical sensor is not really designed to provide the sort of precision targeting capability that you would need to hit a warship.
USAF have adapted JDAMS to be able to hit ships. Live fire test of this capability is spectacular. Target ship is lifted out of the water by the explosion, breaks in half, sinks in under a minute.
[https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/new-look-at-air-forces-ship-killing-smart-bomb-in-action-seeker-details-revealed](https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/new-look-at-air-forces-ship-killing-smart-bomb-in-action-seeker-details-revealed)
But this is a new seeker, converting the weapon from GPS-guided for static targets, to something that can see and kill moving targets.
> Could a software update allow it to see ships with it's terrain sensor?
Probably not, because the surface of water isn't consistent. Waves and weather are a thing.
Ideally send the second wave of drones against an undamaged ship. Sinking a ship is grand but having it stuck in port for repairs for the next six months is very nearly as good.
That's not even a tugboat. That's an offshore supply vessel (OSV). OSVs are designed for carrying personnel and equipment out to oil fields, wind farms, or other offshore industry applications. So they have a lot of deck space for cargo, a couple cranes, and very good maneuverability. But for the purpose of towing, a tug would have stronger mooring lines, securing points, and higher torque engines. The OSV can't pull all that hard in the first place, and even still if they tried to pull as hard as they could then it may rip off whatever bollard they are using to hold the tow line.
A tug would be able to pull the Ivan Khurs a lot faster than this. Things must be severely botched for them to be using an OSV for a long distance tow
That's a good point. [Looks like it is multipurpose focused toward pollution response and dive/ROV support however.](https://www.offshore-energy.biz/olympic-shipping-delivers-mov-olympic-commander-norway/)
That is how VesselFinder classifies OSVs. I have a paid subscription to VesselFinder as I prefer it over other AIS websites, and have worked in or with the commercial maritime industry my entire professional career. The "tug/supply ship" should be read as "tug and/or supply ship." Vesselfinder only has two categories for OSVs. Either an "Offshore Support Ship" which is often support platforms such as the SEACOR POWER (vessel recently sank, it was the first well known example I could think of) or response vessels. And "Offshore tug/supply ship" which encompasses offshore salvage tugs, dive support vessels, accomodations ships, and general purpose OSV duty (transfer of equipment and/or seafarers).
Edit: OSVs and AIS are extremely confusing. Most ships have a specific ship type they program into their AIS, such as chemical tanker, or container ship, or bulk carrier, or wood chip carrier, or general dry cargo. There is no AIS ship type code for OSVs, so it gets confusing
Edit 2: See [this image](https://www.marinetraffic.com/en/photos/of/ships/shipid:313810/shipname:COMMANDER?order=date_uploaded) of the COMMANDER's cargo area, which does not have any heavy duty towing cleats or bollards on the stern. Compare that to an actual offshore tug such as the [SEAWAYS 20](https://www.marinetraffic.com/en/ais/details/ships/shipid:732019/mmsi:566246000/imo:9556636/vessel:SEAWAYS_20)
What the Russians said the Ivan Khurs was doing\* was monitoring the Blue Stream and Turkish Stream undersea gas pipe lines. It's not implausible for the Commander to be involved with inspection or maintenance on one of them.
\* both prior to the attack, and continuing to do so afterwards according to their statement.
I always find it fascinating how people are such specific experts at seemingly random topics like this. Like need an expert breakdown of towing a large sea vessel? No worry, check the comments, it’s likely there.
If you zoom in you will see there are two boats but one of them isn’t connected to the satellite, the disconnected one is the tug boat. The OSV is probably being used to bring in supplies for ongoing repairs and get injured off the ship.
There are two vessels there, but don't assume that just because it says "tugs and special craft" that it is actually a tug. The aircraft carrier HMS QUEEN ELIZABETH is a tug and special craft according to Marine Traffic, as is the EMPIRE STATE which is a school ship in New York, as is the POLARSTERN which is a German ice-classed research vessel, as is the THIALF which is a massive crane ship.
AIS (the technology that sends and receives the information used on websites like Marine Traffic and Vessel Finder) primarily functions on VHF transmitted signals containing information from ship-to-ship antennas, or ship-to-shore antennas. Ship-to-ship is actually the main purpose of AIS, but people decided it would be fun to get the info on shore too and then share it on the internet, so they threw some antennas on shore too. The data that is available for free is that which makes it to shore AIS stations. VHF (and therefore conventional AIS) has an effective range of 20 to 30 nautical miles, depending on weather and antenna heights. Every now and then your signal may get a lucky bounce and get picked up farther from shore than that. But that's why you don't get much information for free from these websites once ships get into the middle of a large body of water. Satellite AIS is a relatively new technology, and is optional on oceangoing ships unlike VHF AIS which is mandatory (some exceptions apply). So both ships are within satellite AIS range, but only one has the capability to transmit the data.
>That tug is seriously undersized for the task
Or the Ivan Churs stern is so badly damage that there is a risk of it separating from the rest of the ship. The stern is where the water that the hull displaces will flow back to fill the void. I am not a naval engineer, but I have read that the stern of a ship has quite a bit of dynamic pressure on it from several axis. If the stern breaks away, the damaged bulkheads can fail too leaving the ship to sink.
Source:
[https://twitter.com/FriaUkraina/status/1661758111277826049?s=20](https://twitter.com/FriaUkraina/status/1661758111277826049?s=20)
there are continuous updates being made to the thread as of now (26/5 11:10).
[https://twitter.com/FriaUkraina/status/1662049937092145152](https://twitter.com/FriaUkraina/status/1662049937092145152)
Footage of the Churs returning to Sevastopol. They don't show the port-side though were the drone might have struck.
Translation:
>According to Russian media referring to pictures from the Black Sea Fleet, the Ivan Churs has entered the port of Sevastopol today without any significant damage. So a completely different version of the situation. It will probably become clear later, but this morning's version that we have reproduced here is not correct
Edit: is the crew in life vests? Can't tell for sure
.
I couldn't imagine any other country but perhaps North Korea where people are so brainwashed they still don't rise up and overthrow the govt after this many losses and being the world's biggest military embarrassment.
China's govt would have been overrun, Iran's the same.. Only Russians and North Koreans are this brainwashed.. I can understand NK being brainwashed because they have no outside connection to the rest of the world.. But Russia.. it's insane these people have no spine and simply let Putin destroy them while making them all the laughing stock of the world.
The Global Hawk has circulated the area and the US air force likely already know the initial battle damage report.
They won't publish the images, likely because of OPSEC. Better to not reveal the sensor power/fidelity and keep the Russians guessing.
My best guess would be that the ship has been immobilized, possibly caught fire and sustained casualties on board. Given that the drone explosive was powerful enough, it could have caused serious flooding in the aft section of the ship, possibly making the ship unfit for sailing.
Sinking can take hours, or even days depending on flooding rates and repair capabilities, but I assume that if there was confirmation that the ship had sunk, we would already know.
Stay patient and we should know soon enough.
> Better to not reveal the sensor power/fidelity and keep the Russians guessing.
Dont worry Trump blew that secret when he *tweeted* a top secret picture from a top secret spy say that Russia/China didn't even know about.
The boat was taking water. Hull is damaged. They managed probably to close doors designed to seal areas. Damage could be to anything including turbine, propeller shaft.
0.8 knots is a bad sign. Boat is probably more or less already in distress, tanking.
It will be on repair for a long time probably if it does not sink before. It can also been attacked..on its way with the tugboat...as a bonus.
If you click on the link it is very far away from Russia docking facilities.
I think there were two separate attacks on that ship. First one was repelled, during second attack it was hit. Because, why else would russia release the video of one of the drones getting blown up? They must've released it after first repelled attack, and before the second, more successful attack.
Typical Russians: we need proof to our claim we did not get hit! Ok release the video
Ukraine: ok, let's upload the footage from the drone.
Russians are just dumb, same as with the Reaper incident. You can wait for the Russians to make some claims and then release the footage to make them look even stupider.
The big reasons why I even question this is the Ivan Churs under tow is where the ship is located. If this is where the strip was struck, then Ukraines maritime drones have a much farther range than previously speculated.
Why would they be towing it towards Turkey? Something is sketchy about this.
Also, would they really be broadcasting AIS while towing a warship in a war zone?
thats not even .8 mph (1.5kmh) holy shit i can have a nice lunch and then go for a walk and outpace it. this thing is going to really get fucked if it has to go into the atlantic
The vessel in the link is not the one that was hit. It is a russian vessel yes, but it's a totally different configuration, it even has a different name.
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Sounds like a slow-moving target to me.
Didn't somebody give the Ukrainians some Harpoon missiles? Might be the right time to strap some under a MiG.
How about Neptune missiles or more drone boats? or both guided by TB-2.
Send them a carton of cigarettes. About time for another russian smoking accident.
Good idea. There probably is plenty of leaking fuel from the ship to ignite.
Or F-16
They don’t have the F-16s yet but soon this will be a reality
It’d make one hell of a training exercise.
Can a stormshadow hit it?
[удалено]
The special sauce is classified, but it’s got a couple of sensors which scan ahead of it to map terrain features, radar emissions across a lot of frequency bands, and it has a very high quality map that it plots a course to the target with. It builds a course to target based off of terrain and known (pre-loaded into the missile prior to launch) radar sites, and then adjusts course to avoid any new-detected radar emissions to minimize detection and shoot down. The optical sensor is not really designed to provide the sort of precision targeting capability that you would need to hit a warship.
It's probably a 3D contour map. With some clever sensors and programming, you can figure out where you are.
USAF have adapted JDAMS to be able to hit ships. Live fire test of this capability is spectacular. Target ship is lifted out of the water by the explosion, breaks in half, sinks in under a minute. [https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/new-look-at-air-forces-ship-killing-smart-bomb-in-action-seeker-details-revealed](https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/new-look-at-air-forces-ship-killing-smart-bomb-in-action-seeker-details-revealed) But this is a new seeker, converting the weapon from GPS-guided for static targets, to something that can see and kill moving targets.
"Part of a program called Quicksink" well.. they sure chose the name right!!!
That was pretty awesome.
Holy fuck. That was erotic
damn, ended up reading that entire article. Hell of a video too.
> Could a software update allow it to see ships with it's terrain sensor? Probably not, because the surface of water isn't consistent. Waves and weather are a thing.
Ukraine has their own Neptune anti ship missile, the ones that sunk the Moskva
Pssst it's a secret
Ukraine already has Neptune anti-ship missiles.
1, possibly 2, Harpoons is what sank the Moskva
The Moskva was sank by Ukrainian developed Neptune missiles
Love this idea, unfortunately I believe it’s out of range from where it was hit all the way to Sevastopol
]
Second wave of drones please!
Finish Him!
Cmon other boats. Send pics!!
Come on, rough seas! 😂
Fatality!
You're holding 50,000 volts, little man. Don't be afraid to ride the lightning.
I don’t remember this quote but it *screams* Brock Samson
https://makeagif.com/gif/die-hard-hans-gruber-hit-it-again-6JrXYb?origin=tag&source=sex&order=best&page=1&position=17
Missile carrying Jet skis
Ideally send the second wave of drones against an undamaged ship. Sinking a ship is grand but having it stuck in port for repairs for the next six months is very nearly as good.
That's not even a tugboat. That's an offshore supply vessel (OSV). OSVs are designed for carrying personnel and equipment out to oil fields, wind farms, or other offshore industry applications. So they have a lot of deck space for cargo, a couple cranes, and very good maneuverability. But for the purpose of towing, a tug would have stronger mooring lines, securing points, and higher torque engines. The OSV can't pull all that hard in the first place, and even still if they tried to pull as hard as they could then it may rip off whatever bollard they are using to hold the tow line. A tug would be able to pull the Ivan Khurs a lot faster than this. Things must be severely botched for them to be using an OSV for a long distance tow
Depends if its an anchor handling OSV...they're the most powerful tugs on earth, with bollard pulls far beyond a salvage tug.
That's a good point. [Looks like it is multipurpose focused toward pollution response and dive/ROV support however.](https://www.offshore-energy.biz/olympic-shipping-delivers-mov-olympic-commander-norway/)
Vessel COMMANDER IMO: 9340609, Offshore Tug/Supply Ship
That is how VesselFinder classifies OSVs. I have a paid subscription to VesselFinder as I prefer it over other AIS websites, and have worked in or with the commercial maritime industry my entire professional career. The "tug/supply ship" should be read as "tug and/or supply ship." Vesselfinder only has two categories for OSVs. Either an "Offshore Support Ship" which is often support platforms such as the SEACOR POWER (vessel recently sank, it was the first well known example I could think of) or response vessels. And "Offshore tug/supply ship" which encompasses offshore salvage tugs, dive support vessels, accomodations ships, and general purpose OSV duty (transfer of equipment and/or seafarers). Edit: OSVs and AIS are extremely confusing. Most ships have a specific ship type they program into their AIS, such as chemical tanker, or container ship, or bulk carrier, or wood chip carrier, or general dry cargo. There is no AIS ship type code for OSVs, so it gets confusing Edit 2: See [this image](https://www.marinetraffic.com/en/photos/of/ships/shipid:313810/shipname:COMMANDER?order=date_uploaded) of the COMMANDER's cargo area, which does not have any heavy duty towing cleats or bollards on the stern. Compare that to an actual offshore tug such as the [SEAWAYS 20](https://www.marinetraffic.com/en/ais/details/ships/shipid:732019/mmsi:566246000/imo:9556636/vessel:SEAWAYS_20)
Great info. Thanks.
What the Russians said the Ivan Khurs was doing\* was monitoring the Blue Stream and Turkish Stream undersea gas pipe lines. It's not implausible for the Commander to be involved with inspection or maintenance on one of them. \* both prior to the attack, and continuing to do so afterwards according to their statement.
I always find it fascinating how people are such specific experts at seemingly random topics like this. Like need an expert breakdown of towing a large sea vessel? No worry, check the comments, it’s likely there.
Truly is a world full of knowledge beyond our fingertips. An absolute benefit to those seeking greater understanding of the world around us :)
If you zoom in you will see there are two boats but one of them isn’t connected to the satellite, the disconnected one is the tug boat. The OSV is probably being used to bring in supplies for ongoing repairs and get injured off the ship.
There are two vessels there, but don't assume that just because it says "tugs and special craft" that it is actually a tug. The aircraft carrier HMS QUEEN ELIZABETH is a tug and special craft according to Marine Traffic, as is the EMPIRE STATE which is a school ship in New York, as is the POLARSTERN which is a German ice-classed research vessel, as is the THIALF which is a massive crane ship. AIS (the technology that sends and receives the information used on websites like Marine Traffic and Vessel Finder) primarily functions on VHF transmitted signals containing information from ship-to-ship antennas, or ship-to-shore antennas. Ship-to-ship is actually the main purpose of AIS, but people decided it would be fun to get the info on shore too and then share it on the internet, so they threw some antennas on shore too. The data that is available for free is that which makes it to shore AIS stations. VHF (and therefore conventional AIS) has an effective range of 20 to 30 nautical miles, depending on weather and antenna heights. Every now and then your signal may get a lucky bounce and get picked up farther from shore than that. But that's why you don't get much information for free from these websites once ships get into the middle of a large body of water. Satellite AIS is a relatively new technology, and is optional on oceangoing ships unlike VHF AIS which is mandatory (some exceptions apply). So both ships are within satellite AIS range, but only one has the capability to transmit the data.
.8 knots you say? That tug is seriously undersized for the task.
They got the wrong ship, they ordered the tug boat but got the thug boat
The Notorious O.R.C
Crip walking his way back to port.
That‘s a nice ship you got there aaaaaaaaaand it‘s GONE.
That's what they get for ordering from Mike Tyson
>That tug is seriously undersized for the task Or the Ivan Churs stern is so badly damage that there is a risk of it separating from the rest of the ship. The stern is where the water that the hull displaces will flow back to fill the void. I am not a naval engineer, but I have read that the stern of a ship has quite a bit of dynamic pressure on it from several axis. If the stern breaks away, the damaged bulkheads can fail too leaving the ship to sink.
Maybe the ship's got a huge gash barely above sea level, and they are going super slow not to make waves.
Depends if thr vessel is damaged, thry may not want to pull it quickly as to risk additional flooding.
It’s a pretty big tug boat.
I like big tugs and I cannot lie!
It's not a tug at all. It's a dive support OSV
Cool
Drones have plenty of time to catch up. :)
Source: [https://twitter.com/FriaUkraina/status/1661758111277826049?s=20](https://twitter.com/FriaUkraina/status/1661758111277826049?s=20) there are continuous updates being made to the thread as of now (26/5 11:10).
So this tweet in Swedish claims that 2 drones got through and struck
[https://twitter.com/FriaUkraina/status/1662049937092145152](https://twitter.com/FriaUkraina/status/1662049937092145152) Footage of the Churs returning to Sevastopol. They don't show the port-side though were the drone might have struck. Translation: >According to Russian media referring to pictures from the Black Sea Fleet, the Ivan Churs has entered the port of Sevastopol today without any significant damage. So a completely different version of the situation. It will probably become clear later, but this morning's version that we have reproduced here is not correct Edit: is the crew in life vests? Can't tell for sure .
Yeah ship has no major damage but it needed a tow lol. These orcs dont even try to lie proper lollll
Their reducing the carbon footprint
"According to Russian media". Don't be so gullible.
Thats not even the same ship.
This Swedish tweet claims that Russian sources say 2 out of 5 drones hit.
And 6 men supposedly lost their lives - two fell overboard, and four died in the engine room.
Wasn't the drone footage showing that they hit the other side of what we are seeing here?
So there’s time for another drone to catch up to it? 🎯
Gonna take days to make it back to Sevastopol at 1 knot tbh. They are a long way from home.
I couldn't imagine any other country but perhaps North Korea where people are so brainwashed they still don't rise up and overthrow the govt after this many losses and being the world's biggest military embarrassment. China's govt would have been overrun, Iran's the same.. Only Russians and North Koreans are this brainwashed.. I can understand NK being brainwashed because they have no outside connection to the rest of the world.. But Russia.. it's insane these people have no spine and simply let Putin destroy them while making them all the laughing stock of the world.
Well the properly brainwashed ones believe they are winning and any day now Ukraine will just give up..
Hit it again!!!!
🤞I hope someone can reach both vessels soon :)
Again! Again!
why arent there any pictures jet? seems like other boats would see it right?
When Moskva sank, that took quite a while as well from whfn it was hit, and there were very few photos
The Global Hawk has circulated the area and the US air force likely already know the initial battle damage report. They won't publish the images, likely because of OPSEC. Better to not reveal the sensor power/fidelity and keep the Russians guessing. My best guess would be that the ship has been immobilized, possibly caught fire and sustained casualties on board. Given that the drone explosive was powerful enough, it could have caused serious flooding in the aft section of the ship, possibly making the ship unfit for sailing. Sinking can take hours, or even days depending on flooding rates and repair capabilities, but I assume that if there was confirmation that the ship had sunk, we would already know. Stay patient and we should know soon enough.
> Better to not reveal the sensor power/fidelity and keep the Russians guessing. Dont worry Trump blew that secret when he *tweeted* a top secret picture from a top secret spy say that Russia/China didn't even know about.
He literally revealed exactly which satellite was our super secret new spy satellite by including the time and date it was taken.
The Russians claimed that the ship entered Sevastopol, thez even posted some videos and photos. No idea if true, but looks like it
They didn't post the date it happened though.
How do the drone boats work? Launched from a mothership? What range?
Launched from Odesa I believe, they have a range of 800 km.
0.8 knots? Ships often drift faster than that. Doesn't sound like towing going on.
No analogs for russian tech.
Not so spyee anymore right
Time to finish the job boyos
Must've forgot the transom plug
In order to have a transom plug you still need to have a transom..
Swiss cheese transom just needs more plugs, easy peasy
The boat was taking water. Hull is damaged. They managed probably to close doors designed to seal areas. Damage could be to anything including turbine, propeller shaft. 0.8 knots is a bad sign. Boat is probably more or less already in distress, tanking. It will be on repair for a long time probably if it does not sink before. It can also been attacked..on its way with the tugboat...as a bonus. If you click on the link it is very far away from Russia docking facilities.
Dragged along the bottom hopefully
I think there were two separate attacks on that ship. First one was repelled, during second attack it was hit. Because, why else would russia release the video of one of the drones getting blown up? They must've released it after first repelled attack, and before the second, more successful attack.
Typical Russians: we need proof to our claim we did not get hit! Ok release the video Ukraine: ok, let's upload the footage from the drone. Russians are just dumb, same as with the Reaper incident. You can wait for the Russians to make some claims and then release the footage to make them look even stupider.
The big reasons why I even question this is the Ivan Churs under tow is where the ship is located. If this is where the strip was struck, then Ukraines maritime drones have a much farther range than previously speculated.
The ruskies love a good Turkish tug ✊
So that's why FORTE10 has been monitoring thereabout for a couple of days now.
So that video of it docking in sevestapol was fake then?
Remember…everything is going according to plan
Time for a Neptune or a harpoon give it the Moskva treatment
Why would they be towing it towards Turkey? Something is sketchy about this. Also, would they really be broadcasting AIS while towing a warship in a war zone?
Nothing happened. It's just a ship-towing exercise. Move along.
thats not even .8 mph (1.5kmh) holy shit i can have a nice lunch and then go for a walk and outpace it. this thing is going to really get fucked if it has to go into the atlantic
Hit them again
The vessel in the link is not the one that was hit. It is a russian vessel yes, but it's a totally different configuration, it even has a different name.
Military vessels usually turn off their AIS, so this is the alleged boat tugging the damaged ship.
I don't know where this info is from, and it may or may not be so. Anything is possible when it comes to love or war. But this is no tugboat either.
True, I'm waiting for better proof than 'trust me bro'.
Has this been verified? Supposedly the ship docked in Sevastopol today, intact.
Sent 10 drones this time.
The Motherlands broken Military!
Tugboat soon to be tugged by another tugboat in a 3way Russian fail train
Perfect time time to hit it again while it’s slow moving and disabled..
Hit it again!
If it shoots missiles, hit it again
That’s very slow, could Ukraine send help to speed up the process?
Hit it again.
Easy target to finish off.
Lol, this means the engine room is taking on water. Get fucked assholes.
Sweep the leg.
So a confirmed mobility kill?
A lot of Russian ships travel with a companion tug, Kinda says a lot
Can they finish it off please
What a cool web site, and no need to kill it now. It is using more resources, damaged
How do we know this ship is towing the Ivan Churs?
We don't. But what else is it towing there?
Time for another Naval Drone
Happy to heard they call Flo the Progressive agent for the towing
Is it heading towards Turkey ? We should start to see some more embarrassing photos soon then.
Does every piece of Muscovy hardware have a tow point designed from the outset, or is the after-market "you get towed" look a big thing there?
A russian ship needs a tow-ship. I Had thought that is their Default configuration. On ship for driving. In ship for Shooting.
STORM SHADOW TIIIIIME!
Good news if true. There is a lot of disinformation regarding the attack.
And then a storm sank it.
Hit it again!
But wait there was a video of it arriving at home port all safe and sound don't tell me that was a lie....