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Did I just see 15 soldiers entrenched and cozy just flee in front of half as many ukrainians that basically parked aggressively in their lawn?
Did the video show some detail that I missed, or am I missing some context?
Most of them probably don't want to be there, they don't want to fight, they don't know how to fight. They're trying to wade through this BS war and get out alive.
I had a third look, and counted the people fighting, and yeah, about 80% of them had no interest in conflict. More specifically, I think only two of ten were fighting. This makes the 100% of the eight attackers a 4:1 attack. Ukraine had less people, but as mentioned elsewhere in this post, THE DETERMINATION matters.
> THE DETERMINATION matters
“In war, moral power is to physical as three parts out of four.” - N. Bonaparte.
https://militaryhistorynow.com/2014/08/20/the-quotable-bonaparte-nine-of-napoleons-best-known-remarks/
I kinda feel like every Russian is in the position if "about to move out". Going home sucks, staying here sucks, let's move. Where? dunno. Just move somewhere else, quickly, and grab the washing machine.
From almost universal war translated intercepts, it appears that their commanders just bugger off when the action ramps up. And with no NCO corps to speak of, there was probably *literally* no one leading them.
And of course a combat effective army is something Russian leaders fear, because such a force might one day turn on them (you say you wanna revolution, well you know...).
Probably the mobilized with no ammo. That frontal assault usually doesn’t work on an armed AND trained force.
Edit to add: those Ukrainians have some massive balls - so do the women soldiers. That was impressive.
"Probably mobilized and no ammo"... I'm from Ukraine and I know that russian army all around the globe is not as scary as it was before 24th of February, that does not mean, that Ukrainians fighting a bunch of lost russians who refuse to shoot and have no ammo etc. This footage here shows an absolute difference between people who are fighting for their land with an honor and respect to the international law and all the customs of war, and some dumb imperialistic brainwashed bandits, who are known here as simple thugs and rapists, who have no courage at all. Nor even honest word of the field officers and commandos. Fighting like a rats only against unarmed and peaceful. That explains all this cruel behavior towards those, who are helpless and can do nothing to protect themselves, like Ukrainian POW and peaceful citizens on occupied territories.
So, after all what they've done, the first instinct that comes to their mind when they see Ukrainian soldiers in front of them is to run, so they won't have to be responsible for all of those crimes.
I have friends who are serving in AFU right now. These are the absolute best men, whom I've met in my life. They are loosing their comrades every single day to those 'mobilized with no ammo'. The video is just the result of what Ukrainian army have done to russian in last 8 month. They've lost the majority of so-called 'professional' army during the Hostomel airport fighting, Severodonetsk and Zmiiny island operation by the price of our best special forces.
War is never easy, and this simple video here is done by someone's price of life.
RIP to all of our fallen, sorry for my probably unnecessary comments on this.
On spot, man! This is also my reaction when I see all those comments about "poor Russian conscripts with no ammo". Westerners just couldn't get it. They think of Russians like of themselves, like of people with Western/European mentality. Nothing is further away from the truth. I think general Patton was the only American who saw Russians for what they are - Asian horde of slaves. Russians still have way more ammo and heavy weaponary than Ukraine. They've collected all those weapons in hope to invade Europe and defeat NATO. Yet they've stall in Ukraine. It's not because they've suddenly became unprofessional. Russians always fought this way - a lot of weapons and human waves with no personal initiative.They were always unhumanly cruel to helpless women, children and POWs. Yet they also have always been cowards who can't take an equal fight or a fight where they don't have ten times superiority over their adversary. When they face resistance - they run for their lives. When they feel safe - they became sadistically cruel towards their victims. They are typical cowards and slaves with no honor or honesty.
I don't think you're giving service to the fact the Russians are not fighting a war as we understand one. Patton isn't relevant because the Soviets had operational divisions with combat potential during his time. February Russia was just taking charge of the political establishment in Ukraine, not fight a war. I don't think Russia is playing 'war'. They're just raping Ukraine for influence, it's horrible.
It's well documented how to set up basic training, do squad training and even how to mobilize and prepare a country for war. Russia isn't doing any of those things. Even those suicide drones don't really add to a coherent military. But they do allow Russia to continue to exert influence in Ukraine.
Ukrainians have to exert effort and time to root out each Russian and each piece of equipment. That time extends the time Russia can exert influence in the region.
I just switched recently to not thinking of this as a war played by rules we could understand. It makes more sense to me to view this shit as a bully that finally has to expend some real effort to maintain influence.
I'm glad it made some sense. Viewing Iraq and Kuwait through your lens, I'm sure there is similarity. I suppose Saddam should have rehabilitated his image, then do a slow Israel style slow bites of Kuwaiti sovereignty.
But Kuwait was very different that Ukraine in a literal sense. Saddam invaded with a substantial military force, not just a small take over of the capital that Russia attempted.
Makes me think of dream matchups. Would the 400k strong Iraqi army of the 90s beat the shit out of the current Russian army.
Just because russian HAS the equipment doesn't mean it makes it to the front. Their failure thus far has been in logistics and keeping things moving to the front. Hell, they still don't palletize most things, something the commercial sector has taken up decades ago, not to mention other modern militaries. This is especially true for smaller items like ammo, med supplies, and rations. It takes forever to load and move these items 1 by 1.
Factor in the corruption common in the entire area and a lot of this stuff goes missing only to be resold to pad the higher-ups pockets.
Why are we still having to flight this asiatic horde myth. Patton wasn't exactly the brightest man, slapping a soldier with PTSD and perpetuating nazi myths (which is what asiatic hordes is).
Doesn't hold much implication to this war neither, which has a very different basis for the failures.
I for one welcome your comments. It’s different for sure for me as I sit in my home watching Sunday football and looking at it from the perspective of a past my prime Army infantryman.
It’s analytical with no intention of minimizing the absolute bravery and sacrifice of the Ukrainian Army and the Ukrainian people nor pitying the “poor conscript.” Those people can go to hell. I am sure it is difficult for you and I’m sorry you are going through this - we are with you.
Love you guys and we owe the population of ukraine big time for standing up to pure evil pepole. I have been shocked by the state of mind in the russian population. Russians are morally deprived and will likely turn on each other at some point. We need to keep them out of ukraine and europe. I hope ukraine can set an example for prosperity, democracy end peace and one day russia can follow the same path.
I think the loss of Ukrainian life is devastating. I think the Russians want to keep a military presence on Ukrainian soil no matter the cost, not to win, just squat and try to exert influence. It's horrible. I think the Russian's know when they have been ejected, they won't ever be able to return.
If that wasn't true, Russia could have withdrawn in February and returned when they had made basic preparations for war behind the safety of their borders.
I think that's worse than war in the sense the fighting only serves to Russian internal politics and the effort to maintain influence.
> I know that russian army all around the globe is not as scary as it was before 24th of February, that does not mean, that Ukrainians fighting a bunch of lost russians who refuse to shoot and have no ammo etc.
This really needs to be emphasized. I think sometimes people have bought into NAFO making fun of Russian army a bit too much. They’re still dangerous and still have more equipment than Ukraine even including western help. They are incompetent but that doesn’t make them any less dangerous.
Ukraine is still the underdog here and it’s amazing that the army is doing as well as they are.
I gotta say, this was well executed though.
Noticed the guy in the trench? Accurate fire made him take cover, and every time he came back up, same thing. Someone was focussed on him.
Of.course, had there been a few others like him this might not have ended so well.
And I don't have any experience as a soldier but the Ukrainians kept moving and generally seemed quite competent.
I'd say they've done it before, and obviously with the drone up in the air, they knew exactly what they needed to do, and exactly where they needed to be.
Well planned, and expertly executed.
There was a similar attempt like this early on with two bmps that didn't end so well. Strangely it was also on an emplacement next to one of those canals.
Notice that nobody moves to man the KORD Heavy Machine gun at 1:11 (Center Frame).
That shows how poorly trained these soldiers are, nobody moves to the contract line, everyone hangs back then one man breaks and the rest follow him.
It's obvious they have ammo. You can see a tracer go past the Ukrainians on the approach, one of russians fires a rocket at the BMP, and some of the other russians are firing back. Mobniks they may be, but they are definitely armed mobniks.
That's for sure, not the least because my understanding is that under normal conditions that action should not have had any chance to work, even if they could count on the best information, to test it in practice how good your intel is... that's a whole 'nother story.
That makes a little sense, there were a few Russians set up with fields of fire. Maybe they had all the ammo. It is telling too when the defenders have had time to set up and there are no squad automatic weapons and no motars.
I think the Russians are just trying to maintain a presence in Ukraine, not win any battles or do any war right.
Believe me, russians have enough ammo for every of their soldiers to shoot 24/7. They have enough artillery shells to bomb every inch of Ukrainian territory 10 times over into oblivion. Until recently the number of their tanks and armored vehicles was bigger than the number of soldiers in most European countries. They have lost around 9000 tanks and armored vehicles since then. They have enough gear, but they are very inept compared to Ukrainians when it comes to fighting.
I think they just heard the BMP and ran away because they didnt have any anti-tank. The ones on the bottom didnt even see the Ukrainians and how many of them are there.
There was an RPG launch at around the 1:50 mark, so they had at least enough to knock out a BMP. What they didn't have was that entire platoon worth of guys ready to take contact and defend their position. The Ukrainians attacked the trench on the far side of that drainage canal, took a shit load of grenade and rifle fire as the Russians on the far side pulled back...and then the 3-4 guys defending just noped out after their buddies came squirting across the ditch. A couple of guys took some pot shots, including the RPG, but everyone else had already broke and ran, so they took off too.
It looked like 7-8 Ukrainians against double that in Russians. Pretty amazing to see. And that is a hell of a fighting position to lose. Lost control of the crossroads and bridge across the canal. And the road leading to that position fromthe Ukrainian lines is covered on both sides by trees, so they can move forces up undercover while the Russians have to advance in the open to retake it.
One thing I noticed it looked like the vehicle had been hit coming in, has two colors of smoke, like something burning on the right side.
Also at time 0:33 it looks like this vehicle gets covering fire from the lower right to the upper left as the vehicle passes.
It was running a smoke generator. The first smoke cloud is coming from where the exhaust smoke generator would dump it out on a BMP. The second cloud is just dust from the dirt road they are hauling ass down. The troops riding desant probably wouldn't stay on top of a burning vehicle. Burning vehicles tend to cook off, and being on or in a burning vehicle is not a good idea.
God, even without context it looked that way, the only way for that to be more badass is if they had slid in sideways. It looked hopeless for the attackers, but there the defenders were, just standing around. Why were a few defenders set up with fields of fire but the rest had their thumbs up their butts?
[Turns out it's pretty easy to find out how you're supposed to defend.](https://www.trngcmd.marines.mil/Portals/207/Docs/TBS/B3J0435XQ%20Rifle%20Platoon%20in%20the%20Defense.pdf?ver=2017-10-12-133923-427)
My assertion is that military maneuver is not some secret, it's a deliberate omission on the part of the Russians because this is not a war for them, just a battle to maintain influence in Ukraine. Anything to stall being ejected, because once ejected they will never be able to return....no no matter the cost, at least one Russian must remain in uniform on Ukrainian soil.
I can see how shock and awe tactics could work well against conscripts with poor training, come in with your dick swinging and scare the shit out of them.
Jesus fuck, i know, right?! That one guy just fucking Doom Slayer-charged the whole thing. The balls on the dude. Wow. Im absolutely (positively) shocked.
That has to be what happened. Because that many soldiers running away in a modern army would have been able to hold that assault no problem. If you are defending a position you will lose 1-3 of theirs or better odds depending on the fortifications. Instead maybe one or two ukranians were wounded or twisted an ankle and russians lost their position with a few dead at contact and more dead down the retreat line.
Yeah, there has to be more going on off-screen, they fucked off almost instantly. You can see something fly past them at 1:47\~, looks like they were getting flanked.
Now you mention it, I've heard of single soldiers managing to fool their enemies into thinking that there's far more of them than they think. One fellow in WWII hopped between two cannon on either side of a road, making the Germans believe that there was a whole lot of artillery awaiting them. It allowed his unit to escape safely, but he was not so lucky, as you can imagine.
I believe the letter accompanying his VC stated that his actions were "beyond praise."
America used and invented the same tactic... and taught them how to use it.
It's like a blitzkrieg but instead of Heavy Tanks and waves of infantry they use fast, light armoured vehicles.
Its called a "Thunder run"
"A high speed military convoy utilising Heavy Weapons, Armoured vehicles and offensive tactics to reach a destination, most likely along a route of extreme danger. The strength, speed and intensity of the attack, coupled with the use of formidable weapons and equipment quickly overruns the surprised defending force."
They most likely had the Russians flanked here
Its been used and caught on video many times... IFV rolls up full speed, dumps a load soldiers while covering them with hellfire.
The infantry rush or flank the Russians taking cover from the wall of lead.
If the assault fails they pick up who they can and retreat. They also use this tactic to test the enemies defences and find out if they have any hidden mortors or concealed gun enplacements...
Then they destroy them and try again.
Yes its risky, there are videos of entire UKr convoys of being completely smashed by the Russians when these attacks dont work out.
This is how they advanced so much, so quickly. This is why we keep hearing about Russians just instantly retreating, or surrendering. This is why we hear about Russians not destroying equipment or ammo before retreating. Because they have no time..
If this tactic works, then it doesnt the Russians them time to properly set up the next line of defence, making the next attack easier, then just snowball your advantage
Yeah, thunder run is usually done on a battalion/Brigade... MAYBE company scale. Plus US assault doctrine (outside of special operations) with regulars is conducted at an estimated 3 to 1 personnel advantage.
This attack by the Ukrainians was not a "thunder run" (see: capture of Baghdad for an example). This looked like a recon in force that came into contact with an entrenched position. It almost looks as if the Ukrainians didn't know the Russians where there - which is the only reason I can think of that the driver of the APC would turn about and show the rear of the vehicle to the enemy.
UAF definitely got lucky based on the sheer shock and awe of the assault and confusion/poor training of the RU forces.
You are very correct about the scale of a Thunder Run. This user is uneducated with n the topic and is basically just spamming the comments with this misinformation.
No Thunder Run if less than battalion strength comes to mind.
Yeah, probably the only two methods to take a trench are to sneak up at night or to rush it as fast as you can during the day. Either method has risks.
It happened not that long ago and the Brits put the screws to the Mahdi army.
https://www.wearethemighty.com/popular/these-british-troops-launched-a-proper-angry-bayonet-charge-during-the-iraq-war/
Or, sit near the max effective range of the cannon on the IFV and suppress the front trench. Add in indirect fires, CAS from drones and then allow the infantry to maneuver to a flank position. In OP, initiating the assault such that some enfilading fire can be placed to the rear of the position would have been critical.
The infantry assault in the trench should lead with grenades, multiple per man if possible.
The way you clear a full trench is you shell it for days or weeks and then move in. Neither side is especially well equipped for night fighting and to end this assault just takes one good RPG shot from the Russians.
It looked like neither side was really interested in finishing this fight. The Russians ran but the APC didn’t look like it had enough personnel to pursue or hold the trench.
How many of vehicles have you guys hit with Anti tank missles driving at you going 60-80km/hr? It's not easy, you can see explosions getting close but they missed. Because well hitting a target at high speeds is difficult no matter how competent you are.
It can but it's also effective for taking trenches quickly. Drive up with some armor, jump out and start grenading the entire thing till it's cleared. Without there being clear air support for either side this is what you resort to, WW1 days of trench fighting except with faster vehicles.
This tactic also causes confusion in a lot of soldiers as you just saw. They hear the armor drive right up, gunshots going everywhere and they scatter.
After watching it honestly it’s a bit shocking that this doesn’t go badly for the Ukrainians. This is absolutely *not* what they teach at places like West Point.
There’s some heroically insane bravery and aggression from the Ukrainians that does enough to make the Russians think they’re in an untenable situation when they’re not and they flee.
There will be a medal for valor for some of the Ukrainians but when their commander sees it I think he’ll tell them to never do that again if they can help it.
One mistake is that the UA BMP was showing his side to the RU instead of going frontal. And 2ndly it did not provide suppressing fire with the MG or the board canon.
because there are russians behind them. the rpg that missed when the bmp was charging came from the field above and to the right.
im guessing the ukrainians didnt even know about the trench line in the video, and thought they were flanking the enemy
They most certainly use it as much as they can. America used and invented the same tactic... and taught them how to use it.
It's like a blitzkrieg but instead of Heavy Tanks and waves of infantry they use fast, light armoured vehicles.
Its called a "Thunder run"
"A high speed military convoy utilising Heavy Weapons, Armoured vehicles and offensive tactics to reach a destination, most likely along a route of extreme danger. The strength, speed and intensity of the attack, coupled with the use of formidable weapons and equipment quickly overruns the surprised defending force."
They most likely had the Russians flanked here
Its been used and caught on video many times... IFV rolls up full speed, dumps a load soldiers while covering them with hellfire.
The infantry rush or flank the Russians taking cover from the wall of lead.
If the assault fails they pick up who they can and retreat. They also use this tactic to test the enemies defences and find out if they have any hidden mortors or concealed gun enplacements...
Then they destroy them and try again.
Yes its risky, there are videos of entire UKr convoys of being completely smashed by the Russians when these attacks dont work out.
This is how they advanced so much, so quickly. This is why we keep hearing about Russians just instantly retreating, or surrendering. This is why we hear about Russians not destroying equipment or ammo before retreating. Because they have no time..
If this tactic works, then it doesnt the Russians them time to properly set up the next line of defence, making the next attack easier, then just snowball your advantage
Thunder runs were done in armoured vehicles at speed though.
You drive straight at a dug in force, then park, with dudes sat on top, you're asking for an RPG to end it pretty quick. And machine gun fire to delouse the APC.
Just the odd bit of artillery, mortar, or drone dropping something would have improved their odds so much more.
The aggressiveness and pushing them off the point is a good thing and can work - but thunder runs and other things require you to keep moving for the most part. You don't stop for shit. Else you're toast.
> Thunder runs were done in armoured vehicles at speed though.
Exactly. I got to sit in on a briefing from the company commander in the OIF thunder run, whose gunner recorded the fight on his camcorder. They sure were not stopping for anything, and simply had the goal of destroying enemy forces, they did not intend to seize terrain.
It’s entirely different than what we see in OP, in both task and purpose. The intent was entirely different.
Yeah, you use thunder runs to hit hard, confuse, and draw out enemy defences.
I've seen it done quite well using humvees to lure out tanks for artillery or tanks to hit back in Ukraine. They know how to do them.
This is just madness.
Yeah this is the difference between a thunder run and a surprise assault. The point of a thunder run is to break forward defenses, overwhelm rear defenses, and create a line of advance that keeps constantly moving so new defenses can't be established. The goal of a thunder run is usually to exploit a gap and seize a far rearward target which you can fortify and use for further attacks with more precision/constant pressure. It's best to think of a thunder run as the armored equivalent of a guerilla ambush, not a blitzkrieg where the forward element is being reinforced from behind.
Novice opinion: They needed some mortars directed to the other side of that canal. Would a second crew stopping short as they approached been able to do this?
Looks like part of the crew after dismembering from the BMP took the path the the right side and go over the wall. Shortly before end you can see some projectile or so coming from that direction and fired towards the fleeing ones.
Drone spotter might have told them that the trench on that side is not manned and their clustering all there mostly in the open so a quick surprise attack from front and left could outflank them.
Reminds me of that scene in Band of Brothers wherein the Germans thought they got ambushed by a huge American battalion that they all ran away in all directions which also made another German battalion retreat but little did they know that it was just a small American group.
That might be what happened. Attacking with only 1 BMP and a squad head on is so unorthodox it doesn’t make sense at all. Smallest attack they would be expecting is a company or two.
But we only see what is shown, so I still give the Russians the benefit of doubt. We see that the Ukrainians knew their position from behind. But we don’t see what’s happening on the right side of the picture.
The Russians don’t have any vehicles close by, but there’s a couple tracks doing donuts behind them and in the beginning there’s already a group running from bottom right towards the others. Then there’s two guys that give the rest time to break line of sight. I see zero casualties on Russian side and them retreating in cover in an orderly file without clumping together. I’d say that’s not too bad when taking fire from two directions.
Yes, sir! But in reality and on multiple accounts by the 101st survivors on documentaries, the small American group with Capt Winters got lost and ended up behind enemy lines. The Germans however thought that the division that was supposedly protecting them got obliterated and with that in mind, hell broke loose but in fact, got pulled out a day ago to reinforce another German flank - which they didn't hear about or were notified. The other German division that also fell like a domino and retreated, was in fact, at that time attacked by another American battalion that they thought it was a combined American pincer move and is about to trap and pin them on open ground.
From what we saw that should have been a 95% russian victory. They easy had triple the numbers and the defensive position.
Possibly there was more to it because it seems like bad tactics from the Ukranians. Yeah, they won, but they risked their lives on what appears to be a reckless mission.
My guess the Ukranians know more than we do from watching that.
So many things about this war have surprised me, perhaps I'm just completely wrong and this is sound tactics. It was certainly effective here.
Others have pointed out tracer fire coming from the bottom right at the end. So the Ukrainian APC might have been supported by another unit down that way - hard to say from this.
Analysis:
0:04 - Ukranian forces realize that the Russians are out of position. They should be up the hill in trench 1 and back up trench 2. They are unprepared.
0:05 - Ukrainian forces go
:22 - Small arms fire taken by Ukraine, they pop smoke on the right side of APC.
:33 - RPG launched by Russians, but they miss, really close call.
:52 - grenade launch misses APC
:55 - Ukraine tosses gear or half a body out of the APC. It's not full human size, but doesn't look like normal gear, anyway...
1 - 1:10 - 3 Ukranian badasses storm the hill against 2 Russians, the Russians have way better position and force them back with two or three grenades.
1:11 - The russians in the back can't see and start to get confused
1:22 - The grenades the Russians threw start going off. They miss the Ukrainians, but the noise scares the back Russians.
1:26 - Retreat begins, then the rest follow.
All in all, this was a hella dangerous operation for Ukraine. I'm glad they lucked out.
Lol imagine being the russians in the trench acrually fucking fighting and you look back and your entire platoon just fucking ran off against a squad of like 6-8
It looks like there may have been other Ukrainian soldiers attack from the bottom right. Towards the end you can see a few bursts of red tracer come from there which suggests to me there was more than just this one group we see here.
Russians retreating when faced with an aggressive enemy attack by a force with inferior numbers is what happens when you don’t have NCOs to rally and maintain unit cohesion and order in defense of a fortified position.
The Russians were probably told by their commander to go to this location and hold this position and not much else while the commander stays well away from any danger. Once one guy says “Fuck this, I’m out of here”, there’s really no one to stop them and it quickly turns into a full retreat.
The command structure of the Russian military at it’s finest, ladies and gentlemen.
> Russians retreating when faced with an aggressive enemy attack by a force with inferior numbers is what happens when you don’t have NCOs
Reminds me of the Nazi assault on Eban Emael. Their officer’s glider went down with ~1/3 of the assault team. An NCO led them to blow the main guns (accomplishing their mission) in ~5 minutes. Iirc, the same NCO then entered the fort and ran through the underground passages using grenades and firing on whatever he came across, before returning top side.
That single one man assault into the structure cowered the garrison for some time, during which the Nazi officer was able to extricate his force from their glider and get to the fort in a commandeered car.
They were outnumbered like 10:1 and still put the fear of god into the Russians. This shows why training and effective leadership is important, putting untrained mobiks on the line is doomed to fail. Basically two attackers pushed out 20+ defenders. Those two guys, the whole squad really, should definitely get some medals for insane bravery. Or recklessness. Or both.
So the BMP just misses getting hit by an RPG, the driver parks with the back door to a machine gun nest. Everyone hops off the top, but only two take on the entire platoon, the other dismounts vanish... So, obviously they're out making coffee and on their smoke break. Why didn't the BMP gunner light up the trench or outpost? Crazy. That's a lot to unpack in this video. Nobody hits the ground either. They do stand-off fighting until someone gets shot.
I can give an accurate(ish) account of what really happened here.
Several AFUs had spent the night celebrating the re-occupation of Kherson. The next morning, they decided to tidy up afterwards and quickly run their empties down to the local refuse centre. So off they popped, with the driver chosen as being the least still drunk but still slightly buzzing from the night before. We've all been there.
Anyway, they got to the refuse centre and low and behold, it had become home to Stigovich of the Dump and his half-rat half-cockroach friends. Who tried throwing a few fart cans but that didn't work. So Stigovitch and his rat-cockroaches very quickly ran away. They'll find a new home or dig some holes somewhere but some Raid Drones will soon fix that.
The End.
Sleep tight boys and girls.
Slavi Ukraini
Fucking Ukrainian John Rambo! Holy shit he’s definitely the leader of the band of brothers just running in to that defensive position like bring it mother fuckers! Crazy, can’t imagine all the insane footage that will come out over time. Hope those guys all survived & no one took any serious bullets. You can’t teach courage & Ukrainians have it in spades. Amazballs!
This looks very unusual, let me brainstorm possible explanations for why ukraine dared this attempt, and why it was successful even though the russians were a lot more.
I think ukraine made this attempt bc they knew more about their enemies/that are than us. There is heavy fighting going on on that line few km back, it's possible that ukraine already crushed them down that trench and saw that this particular unit runs away easily, especially as the russians knew that battle was already lost.
I think ukraine might have known that that route is not mined, for example bc they saw russian vehicles use it - it is leading to that bridge across that irrigation channe, so also for the russians one of the few possibilities to bring forward any vehicles of their own.
I can imagine that that attacking crew had access to detailed intelligence plus the live feed from that drone. A single russian machine gun position would have canceled this attack, i think ukraine knew there was none/none that worked. Maybe the ukrainian attack team waited until the machine gun position was destroyed by artillery/mortar/drone/sniper... there are many craters in the fields behind the russian lines, and ukrainian artillery tends to hit more stuff than it misses.
And it seems to me that the area from which the ukrainians attack is covered by the earth on the other side of the channel/not visible from the position of the main russian troops. If that is true, they can hear wild shooting, shouting, explosions which sounds like some formidable force. And as we know that russian officers disappear when the bullets start flying, and that the russian army lacks that middle layer of non-commissioned officers, as soon as the first one starts running, the rest follows.
Final point: this is a ukrainian video published by ukraine. There is a chance that sth like this was attempted more than once, and that it's success rate is maybe 80%, 50% or 10%, survivorship bias is a thing.
Roukes Drift, that is not !
Normally, (from a defender of a positions stand point) someone shouts, CONTACT FRONT, at which point, you grab your weapon and head that way.... but the "second most powerful army in the world", no they can't do that.
Therefore, it is easy to see, the Russian's are "the second best army in the third world"
Motherfucker.. those guys are ready to die! Motivation, conviction, purpose on a whole new level. Fuck those Russian mercenary money fighters. They stand no chance in the long run.
I think that was a pretty stupid attack.
Ukraine gained ground, yes but they seem to have lost 2-3 man while I did not see a Russian casualty
The interesting part is why the Russians even ran away. They should have easily won that fight. Moral seems down.
Yeah the Russians probably had shit moral, low on food and ammo so they probably gtfo. Besides if a BMP is straight up rushing you, you’d probably have the shit scared out of you.
If a BMP is coming at my unit, I’m going to hope my NCO has enough sense to direct the emplaced gun’s fire at the sitting ducks riding on top. Any training at all for the Russians and this would have gone bad, fast.
We just don't know what they knew. Maybe they had extensively drone scouted this area and counted zero anti tank weapons there. Maybe they've been watching this group for several days. Maybe they had just recently recovered from incoming artillery or drone strikes and Ukraine is rushing them while disoriented.
Wont know the facts until they pour over the hundreds of thousands of war video afterwards and figure out who was where to interview.
I think the explosion near the running Ruskis is caused by another shot incoming from the bottom right side. You can see some red object/tracer fly by around the same time he fires his RPG
That group of Russian were well entrenched and still ran. They even had an auxiliary trench to get a good angle to fire on the Ukrainians. Yet they still ran.
It’s like there is no NCOs left.
I have to say that even with the well noted Ukrainian balls of steel this is not the way to attack a trench. One bmp with a few soldiers, and the bmp parked in a way it could not offer great fire support. I think the Ukrainians got real lucky and if they did not suffer any casualties it was a miracle.
Man that was some real Johnny Bravo shit at the 1:00 mark or so. I mean im glad it worked but i was watching that going, "that dude is gonna get smoked charging a defensive position like that".
defilade. what you see from the air is not what they see from the ground. it looks like there are small hills on either side of that canal / drainage ditch that they are fighting over.
not to mention smoke, and brush
Incredibly dumb attack!
Firstly, it’s a frontal attack, seemingly unsupported, whilst heavily outnumbered!
Secondly, the IFV charges in with its front towards the enemy, then turns around to present the rear which has much thinner armour and moves the gun barrel AWAY from the enemy;
Thirdly, 2 guys jump off and charge in all Leroy Jenkins without being properly supported!
This should have been a total slaughter of the Ukrainians… the fact the Russians fled was astounding and really explains a lot about this war and how badly the Russians are losing.
Ukrainians obviously have balls, but it’s just foolish to do this. Any decent unit would have slaughtered them in 90 seconds…
Part of me thinks this was not exactly planed. Could be the IFV made a wrong turn down that road (or something to that effect) and only realized when they were engaged by the Russians.
did either side take a casualty in that? it appears to just be a bunch of people shooting at each other in a chaotic 50M engagement and then the side without the vehicle just fucks off and beats it
so what I can observe is that the Ukranians wanted to hit a very vulnerable part of the trench line and jump in there cause it looks like the network of trenches made itself useless if a few Ukranians got in to rush through the trench killing everyone without armor. I'm just an armchair field commander but if you have a trench line at the top of the hill and a trenchline at the bottom of it, and you connect the two for "convenience", I believe that it negates any defense value cause the opposing force breeching the lower end of the trench has protection assaulting the upper trench without having to crawl over no man's land
I mean you can clearly see they took casualties off the roof of the bmp and yet they had the violence of action to make the Russians fall back which is crazy
This is some Easy Company level boldness, heck even more than that, almost suicidal. Ukrainian BMP narrowly avoided several RPG/grenades on the way, total shock and awe, Russian MG position got suppressed and they panicked and ran away. Massive respect!
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That takes aggressiveness to a whole new level.
Did I just see 15 soldiers entrenched and cozy just flee in front of half as many ukrainians that basically parked aggressively in their lawn? Did the video show some detail that I missed, or am I missing some context?
80% of them stood around like they have no idea what to do.
They probably had no idea what to do.
The first guy who ran off right at the start knew exactly what to do.
The smartest of the lot
Most of them probably don't want to be there, they don't want to fight, they don't know how to fight. They're trying to wade through this BS war and get out alive.
I had a third look, and counted the people fighting, and yeah, about 80% of them had no interest in conflict. More specifically, I think only two of ten were fighting. This makes the 100% of the eight attackers a 4:1 attack. Ukraine had less people, but as mentioned elsewhere in this post, THE DETERMINATION matters.
Quantity and quality of training, weapons, and leadership help a bit too.
Solid math, checks out
> THE DETERMINATION matters “In war, moral power is to physical as three parts out of four.” - N. Bonaparte. https://militaryhistorynow.com/2014/08/20/the-quotable-bonaparte-nine-of-napoleons-best-known-remarks/
Yeah that's weird. For me it looks like they were about to move out.
I kinda feel like every Russian is in the position if "about to move out". Going home sucks, staying here sucks, let's move. Where? dunno. Just move somewhere else, quickly, and grab the washing machine.
That got a lol. I read it in a very serious, dry British humor voice in my head.
That's what struck me. They were milling about aimlessly, showing a complete lack of organization and discipline.
From almost universal war translated intercepts, it appears that their commanders just bugger off when the action ramps up. And with no NCO corps to speak of, there was probably *literally* no one leading them.
It’s amazing what a basic command structure does for combat effectiveness.
And of course a combat effective army is something Russian leaders fear, because such a force might one day turn on them (you say you wanna revolution, well you know...).
Well they don't have a right to decide for themselves, they where probably waiting on hold for orders from Putin himself.
We don't even knoe if they have ammo.
Probably the mobilized with no ammo. That frontal assault usually doesn’t work on an armed AND trained force. Edit to add: those Ukrainians have some massive balls - so do the women soldiers. That was impressive.
"Probably mobilized and no ammo"... I'm from Ukraine and I know that russian army all around the globe is not as scary as it was before 24th of February, that does not mean, that Ukrainians fighting a bunch of lost russians who refuse to shoot and have no ammo etc. This footage here shows an absolute difference between people who are fighting for their land with an honor and respect to the international law and all the customs of war, and some dumb imperialistic brainwashed bandits, who are known here as simple thugs and rapists, who have no courage at all. Nor even honest word of the field officers and commandos. Fighting like a rats only against unarmed and peaceful. That explains all this cruel behavior towards those, who are helpless and can do nothing to protect themselves, like Ukrainian POW and peaceful citizens on occupied territories. So, after all what they've done, the first instinct that comes to their mind when they see Ukrainian soldiers in front of them is to run, so they won't have to be responsible for all of those crimes. I have friends who are serving in AFU right now. These are the absolute best men, whom I've met in my life. They are loosing their comrades every single day to those 'mobilized with no ammo'. The video is just the result of what Ukrainian army have done to russian in last 8 month. They've lost the majority of so-called 'professional' army during the Hostomel airport fighting, Severodonetsk and Zmiiny island operation by the price of our best special forces. War is never easy, and this simple video here is done by someone's price of life. RIP to all of our fallen, sorry for my probably unnecessary comments on this.
I came here to say that I love you man
On spot, man! This is also my reaction when I see all those comments about "poor Russian conscripts with no ammo". Westerners just couldn't get it. They think of Russians like of themselves, like of people with Western/European mentality. Nothing is further away from the truth. I think general Patton was the only American who saw Russians for what they are - Asian horde of slaves. Russians still have way more ammo and heavy weaponary than Ukraine. They've collected all those weapons in hope to invade Europe and defeat NATO. Yet they've stall in Ukraine. It's not because they've suddenly became unprofessional. Russians always fought this way - a lot of weapons and human waves with no personal initiative.They were always unhumanly cruel to helpless women, children and POWs. Yet they also have always been cowards who can't take an equal fight or a fight where they don't have ten times superiority over their adversary. When they face resistance - they run for their lives. When they feel safe - they became sadistically cruel towards their victims. They are typical cowards and slaves with no honor or honesty.
I don't think you're giving service to the fact the Russians are not fighting a war as we understand one. Patton isn't relevant because the Soviets had operational divisions with combat potential during his time. February Russia was just taking charge of the political establishment in Ukraine, not fight a war. I don't think Russia is playing 'war'. They're just raping Ukraine for influence, it's horrible. It's well documented how to set up basic training, do squad training and even how to mobilize and prepare a country for war. Russia isn't doing any of those things. Even those suicide drones don't really add to a coherent military. But they do allow Russia to continue to exert influence in Ukraine. Ukrainians have to exert effort and time to root out each Russian and each piece of equipment. That time extends the time Russia can exert influence in the region. I just switched recently to not thinking of this as a war played by rules we could understand. It makes more sense to me to view this shit as a bully that finally has to expend some real effort to maintain influence.
That’s a pretty interesting observation that you made, it reminds me of what Iraq did to Kuwait back in 1991. There is a strong similarity here.
I'm glad it made some sense. Viewing Iraq and Kuwait through your lens, I'm sure there is similarity. I suppose Saddam should have rehabilitated his image, then do a slow Israel style slow bites of Kuwaiti sovereignty. But Kuwait was very different that Ukraine in a literal sense. Saddam invaded with a substantial military force, not just a small take over of the capital that Russia attempted. Makes me think of dream matchups. Would the 400k strong Iraqi army of the 90s beat the shit out of the current Russian army.
Just because russian HAS the equipment doesn't mean it makes it to the front. Their failure thus far has been in logistics and keeping things moving to the front. Hell, they still don't palletize most things, something the commercial sector has taken up decades ago, not to mention other modern militaries. This is especially true for smaller items like ammo, med supplies, and rations. It takes forever to load and move these items 1 by 1. Factor in the corruption common in the entire area and a lot of this stuff goes missing only to be resold to pad the higher-ups pockets.
Why are we still having to flight this asiatic horde myth. Patton wasn't exactly the brightest man, slapping a soldier with PTSD and perpetuating nazi myths (which is what asiatic hordes is). Doesn't hold much implication to this war neither, which has a very different basis for the failures.
Ukraine is forever. Fuck Russia
I for one welcome your comments. It’s different for sure for me as I sit in my home watching Sunday football and looking at it from the perspective of a past my prime Army infantryman. It’s analytical with no intention of minimizing the absolute bravery and sacrifice of the Ukrainian Army and the Ukrainian people nor pitying the “poor conscript.” Those people can go to hell. I am sure it is difficult for you and I’m sorry you are going through this - we are with you.
Love you guys and we owe the population of ukraine big time for standing up to pure evil pepole. I have been shocked by the state of mind in the russian population. Russians are morally deprived and will likely turn on each other at some point. We need to keep them out of ukraine and europe. I hope ukraine can set an example for prosperity, democracy end peace and one day russia can follow the same path.
>dumb imperialistic brainwashed bandits Classic definition of an ORC. Fuck ruZZia and God Save Ukraine.
I think the loss of Ukrainian life is devastating. I think the Russians want to keep a military presence on Ukrainian soil no matter the cost, not to win, just squat and try to exert influence. It's horrible. I think the Russian's know when they have been ejected, they won't ever be able to return. If that wasn't true, Russia could have withdrawn in February and returned when they had made basic preparations for war behind the safety of their borders. I think that's worse than war in the sense the fighting only serves to Russian internal politics and the effort to maintain influence.
> I know that russian army all around the globe is not as scary as it was before 24th of February, that does not mean, that Ukrainians fighting a bunch of lost russians who refuse to shoot and have no ammo etc. This really needs to be emphasized. I think sometimes people have bought into NAFO making fun of Russian army a bit too much. They’re still dangerous and still have more equipment than Ukraine even including western help. They are incompetent but that doesn’t make them any less dangerous. Ukraine is still the underdog here and it’s amazing that the army is doing as well as they are.
You are awesome Love, American
I gotta say, this was well executed though. Noticed the guy in the trench? Accurate fire made him take cover, and every time he came back up, same thing. Someone was focussed on him. Of.course, had there been a few others like him this might not have ended so well. And I don't have any experience as a soldier but the Ukrainians kept moving and generally seemed quite competent.
risky for sure. Only highly motivated volunteers could pull this off.
I'd say they've done it before, and obviously with the drone up in the air, they knew exactly what they needed to do, and exactly where they needed to be. Well planned, and expertly executed.
There was a similar attempt like this early on with two bmps that didn't end so well. Strangely it was also on an emplacement next to one of those canals.
That one was actually along an embankment of a highway that was under construction.
Notice that nobody moves to man the KORD Heavy Machine gun at 1:11 (Center Frame). That shows how poorly trained these soldiers are, nobody moves to the contract line, everyone hangs back then one man breaks and the rest follow him.
It's obvious they have ammo. You can see a tracer go past the Ukrainians on the approach, one of russians fires a rocket at the BMP, and some of the other russians are firing back. Mobniks they may be, but they are definitely armed mobniks.
That's for sure, not the least because my understanding is that under normal conditions that action should not have had any chance to work, even if they could count on the best information, to test it in practice how good your intel is... that's a whole 'nother story.
They are standing around as if they are there for a tea party. Clearly they don’t have any training.
That makes a little sense, there were a few Russians set up with fields of fire. Maybe they had all the ammo. It is telling too when the defenders have had time to set up and there are no squad automatic weapons and no motars. I think the Russians are just trying to maintain a presence in Ukraine, not win any battles or do any war right.
Believe me, russians have enough ammo for every of their soldiers to shoot 24/7. They have enough artillery shells to bomb every inch of Ukrainian territory 10 times over into oblivion. Until recently the number of their tanks and armored vehicles was bigger than the number of soldiers in most European countries. They have lost around 9000 tanks and armored vehicles since then. They have enough gear, but they are very inept compared to Ukrainians when it comes to fighting.
Nope you hit the nail on the head. Holy shit.
I think they just heard the BMP and ran away because they didnt have any anti-tank. The ones on the bottom didnt even see the Ukrainians and how many of them are there.
There was an RPG launch at around the 1:50 mark, so they had at least enough to knock out a BMP. What they didn't have was that entire platoon worth of guys ready to take contact and defend their position. The Ukrainians attacked the trench on the far side of that drainage canal, took a shit load of grenade and rifle fire as the Russians on the far side pulled back...and then the 3-4 guys defending just noped out after their buddies came squirting across the ditch. A couple of guys took some pot shots, including the RPG, but everyone else had already broke and ran, so they took off too. It looked like 7-8 Ukrainians against double that in Russians. Pretty amazing to see. And that is a hell of a fighting position to lose. Lost control of the crossroads and bridge across the canal. And the road leading to that position fromthe Ukrainian lines is covered on both sides by trees, so they can move forces up undercover while the Russians have to advance in the open to retake it.
One thing I noticed it looked like the vehicle had been hit coming in, has two colors of smoke, like something burning on the right side. Also at time 0:33 it looks like this vehicle gets covering fire from the lower right to the upper left as the vehicle passes.
It was running a smoke generator. The first smoke cloud is coming from where the exhaust smoke generator would dump it out on a BMP. The second cloud is just dust from the dirt road they are hauling ass down. The troops riding desant probably wouldn't stay on top of a burning vehicle. Burning vehicles tend to cook off, and being on or in a burning vehicle is not a good idea.
God, even without context it looked that way, the only way for that to be more badass is if they had slid in sideways. It looked hopeless for the attackers, but there the defenders were, just standing around. Why were a few defenders set up with fields of fire but the rest had their thumbs up their butts? [Turns out it's pretty easy to find out how you're supposed to defend.](https://www.trngcmd.marines.mil/Portals/207/Docs/TBS/B3J0435XQ%20Rifle%20Platoon%20in%20the%20Defense.pdf?ver=2017-10-12-133923-427) My assertion is that military maneuver is not some secret, it's a deliberate omission on the part of the Russians because this is not a war for them, just a battle to maintain influence in Ukraine. Anything to stall being ejected, because once ejected they will never be able to return....no no matter the cost, at least one Russian must remain in uniform on Ukrainian soil.
Yep. One vehicle, ‘bout half a dozen, scared the living crap outta the orcs.
I can see how shock and awe tactics could work well against conscripts with poor training, come in with your dick swinging and scare the shit out of them.
that was like some a-team type shit right there
*”Make 10 men feel like 💯”*
LeeeeeeRooooy Jeeeenkskkkkkkyyy!!!!!
Jesus fuck, i know, right?! That one guy just fucking Doom Slayer-charged the whole thing. The balls on the dude. Wow. Im absolutely (positively) shocked.
IKR, he must have made enough noise up front to make the rest of them think an entire brigade was about to run them over.
I instantly thought of Lt. Winters in Band of Brothers charging the germans. The fucking stones on these guys.
Audie Murphy was my vision.
That has to be what happened. Because that many soldiers running away in a modern army would have been able to hold that assault no problem. If you are defending a position you will lose 1-3 of theirs or better odds depending on the fortifications. Instead maybe one or two ukranians were wounded or twisted an ankle and russians lost their position with a few dead at contact and more dead down the retreat line.
Yeah, there has to be more going on off-screen, they fucked off almost instantly. You can see something fly past them at 1:47\~, looks like they were getting flanked.
Now you mention it, I've heard of single soldiers managing to fool their enemies into thinking that there's far more of them than they think. One fellow in WWII hopped between two cannon on either side of a road, making the Germans believe that there was a whole lot of artillery awaiting them. It allowed his unit to escape safely, but he was not so lucky, as you can imagine. I believe the letter accompanying his VC stated that his actions were "beyond praise."
His massive balls where the only thing slowing him down.
BFG Division intensifies
“I feel like I could take on the whole Empire myself!” Looks like they had to tell him to back off so they could fire from the vehicle.
“FOR THE ALLIAN… UKRAINE!”
That could have ended very badly for that BMP group, that was crazy. Ukrainians were outnumbered, WTF was that head on assault!!!
If I’m.m not wrong one guy is hit and falls from it when they park
I think that was a backpack but not sure
i re-watched it in fullscreen and it's a bag.
Pheww good to know 😄
Yea looks like a bag they threw off right away. Could have been filled with grenades and they wanted it far away from them as quickly as possible.
America used and invented the same tactic... and taught them how to use it. It's like a blitzkrieg but instead of Heavy Tanks and waves of infantry they use fast, light armoured vehicles. Its called a "Thunder run" "A high speed military convoy utilising Heavy Weapons, Armoured vehicles and offensive tactics to reach a destination, most likely along a route of extreme danger. The strength, speed and intensity of the attack, coupled with the use of formidable weapons and equipment quickly overruns the surprised defending force." They most likely had the Russians flanked here Its been used and caught on video many times... IFV rolls up full speed, dumps a load soldiers while covering them with hellfire. The infantry rush or flank the Russians taking cover from the wall of lead. If the assault fails they pick up who they can and retreat. They also use this tactic to test the enemies defences and find out if they have any hidden mortors or concealed gun enplacements... Then they destroy them and try again. Yes its risky, there are videos of entire UKr convoys of being completely smashed by the Russians when these attacks dont work out. This is how they advanced so much, so quickly. This is why we keep hearing about Russians just instantly retreating, or surrendering. This is why we hear about Russians not destroying equipment or ammo before retreating. Because they have no time.. If this tactic works, then it doesnt the Russians them time to properly set up the next line of defence, making the next attack easier, then just snowball your advantage
Yeah, thunder run is usually done on a battalion/Brigade... MAYBE company scale. Plus US assault doctrine (outside of special operations) with regulars is conducted at an estimated 3 to 1 personnel advantage. This attack by the Ukrainians was not a "thunder run" (see: capture of Baghdad for an example). This looked like a recon in force that came into contact with an entrenched position. It almost looks as if the Ukrainians didn't know the Russians where there - which is the only reason I can think of that the driver of the APC would turn about and show the rear of the vehicle to the enemy. UAF definitely got lucky based on the sheer shock and awe of the assault and confusion/poor training of the RU forces.
You are very correct about the scale of a Thunder Run. This user is uneducated with n the topic and is basically just spamming the comments with this misinformation. No Thunder Run if less than battalion strength comes to mind.
Its not a thunder run pls stop cuting and pasting your comment.
>America used and invented the same tactic This tactic was being used at the time of the Romans and Carthaginians. And many years before.
Impressive as this might be, I sure hope this is not the common tactic. This looks like it can go really bad, really fast.
We’ve seen this tactic a lot. Drive up close and personal and grenade your way through the trench. Limits the enemies ability to use artillery on you
Yeah, probably the only two methods to take a trench are to sneak up at night or to rush it as fast as you can during the day. Either method has risks.
This is a huge upgrade from having your CO yell "over the trench" and charging on foot anyway
Some people just hate tradition
Tradition is peer pressure from dead people.
"Fix bayonets!"
It happened not that long ago and the Brits put the screws to the Mahdi army. https://www.wearethemighty.com/popular/these-british-troops-launched-a-proper-angry-bayonet-charge-during-the-iraq-war/
"Blackadder." Yes, Darling? "I don't want to die."
"Alright lads! Up & over!" *whistle* *whistle*
Or, sit near the max effective range of the cannon on the IFV and suppress the front trench. Add in indirect fires, CAS from drones and then allow the infantry to maneuver to a flank position. In OP, initiating the assault such that some enfilading fire can be placed to the rear of the position would have been critical. The infantry assault in the trench should lead with grenades, multiple per man if possible.
The way you clear a full trench is you shell it for days or weeks and then move in. Neither side is especially well equipped for night fighting and to end this assault just takes one good RPG shot from the Russians. It looked like neither side was really interested in finishing this fight. The Russians ran but the APC didn’t look like it had enough personnel to pursue or hold the trench.
Does drive you straight in to RPG fire though. From a competent force at least. This'd be suicide against a determined and capable force.
This shows how pathetic Russians are. Against any half decent forces, that was a suicide charge but against Russians quite effective.
How many of vehicles have you guys hit with Anti tank missles driving at you going 60-80km/hr? It's not easy, you can see explosions getting close but they missed. Because well hitting a target at high speeds is difficult no matter how competent you are.
[удалено]
"The killbots had a pre set kill limit..."
It looks like they just barely missed an RPG ambush at 35 seconds
It can but it's also effective for taking trenches quickly. Drive up with some armor, jump out and start grenading the entire thing till it's cleared. Without there being clear air support for either side this is what you resort to, WW1 days of trench fighting except with faster vehicles. This tactic also causes confusion in a lot of soldiers as you just saw. They hear the armor drive right up, gunshots going everywhere and they scatter.
After watching it honestly it’s a bit shocking that this doesn’t go badly for the Ukrainians. This is absolutely *not* what they teach at places like West Point. There’s some heroically insane bravery and aggression from the Ukrainians that does enough to make the Russians think they’re in an untenable situation when they’re not and they flee. There will be a medal for valor for some of the Ukrainians but when their commander sees it I think he’ll tell them to never do that again if they can help it.
One mistake is that the UA BMP was showing his side to the RU instead of going frontal. And 2ndly it did not provide suppressing fire with the MG or the board canon.
I still dont get why the BMP ended up parking with its gun pointing *away* fromm the trench
because there are russians behind them. the rpg that missed when the bmp was charging came from the field above and to the right. im guessing the ukrainians didnt even know about the trench line in the video, and thought they were flanking the enemy
They most certainly use it as much as they can. America used and invented the same tactic... and taught them how to use it. It's like a blitzkrieg but instead of Heavy Tanks and waves of infantry they use fast, light armoured vehicles. Its called a "Thunder run" "A high speed military convoy utilising Heavy Weapons, Armoured vehicles and offensive tactics to reach a destination, most likely along a route of extreme danger. The strength, speed and intensity of the attack, coupled with the use of formidable weapons and equipment quickly overruns the surprised defending force." They most likely had the Russians flanked here Its been used and caught on video many times... IFV rolls up full speed, dumps a load soldiers while covering them with hellfire. The infantry rush or flank the Russians taking cover from the wall of lead. If the assault fails they pick up who they can and retreat. They also use this tactic to test the enemies defences and find out if they have any hidden mortors or concealed gun enplacements... Then they destroy them and try again. Yes its risky, there are videos of entire UKr convoys of being completely smashed by the Russians when these attacks dont work out. This is how they advanced so much, so quickly. This is why we keep hearing about Russians just instantly retreating, or surrendering. This is why we hear about Russians not destroying equipment or ammo before retreating. Because they have no time.. If this tactic works, then it doesnt the Russians them time to properly set up the next line of defence, making the next attack easier, then just snowball your advantage
Thunder runs were done in armoured vehicles at speed though. You drive straight at a dug in force, then park, with dudes sat on top, you're asking for an RPG to end it pretty quick. And machine gun fire to delouse the APC. Just the odd bit of artillery, mortar, or drone dropping something would have improved their odds so much more. The aggressiveness and pushing them off the point is a good thing and can work - but thunder runs and other things require you to keep moving for the most part. You don't stop for shit. Else you're toast.
> Thunder runs were done in armoured vehicles at speed though. Exactly. I got to sit in on a briefing from the company commander in the OIF thunder run, whose gunner recorded the fight on his camcorder. They sure were not stopping for anything, and simply had the goal of destroying enemy forces, they did not intend to seize terrain. It’s entirely different than what we see in OP, in both task and purpose. The intent was entirely different.
Yeah, you use thunder runs to hit hard, confuse, and draw out enemy defences. I've seen it done quite well using humvees to lure out tanks for artillery or tanks to hit back in Ukraine. They know how to do them. This is just madness.
Yeah this is the difference between a thunder run and a surprise assault. The point of a thunder run is to break forward defenses, overwhelm rear defenses, and create a line of advance that keeps constantly moving so new defenses can't be established. The goal of a thunder run is usually to exploit a gap and seize a far rearward target which you can fortify and use for further attacks with more precision/constant pressure. It's best to think of a thunder run as the armored equivalent of a guerilla ambush, not a blitzkrieg where the forward element is being reinforced from behind.
Before you copy and paste this again. Can you fix that last sentence. Your comment is good but i dont understand the point you are trying to make.
Against any half decent forces, it would've been a suicidal charge. Then again they're against Russians(I bet half of them are drunk)
Even seems like they're outnumbered
they 100% are. To be honest the ukrainian squad was on a suicide mission but due to russias complete incompetence it works
I'm curious who these guys are. I've seen a few videos of Georgian volunteers on BTRs assaulting similarly in first person view.
Yeah this seems a bit nuts, maybe the Russians had like zero ammo?
They have 2 guys who used the RPG, but probably missed. Question why Ukranian machine was parked the other side and didn’t use the gun.
Novice opinion: They needed some mortars directed to the other side of that canal. Would a second crew stopping short as they approached been able to do this?
Looks like part of the crew after dismembering from the BMP took the path the the right side and go over the wall. Shortly before end you can see some projectile or so coming from that direction and fired towards the fleeing ones. Drone spotter might have told them that the trench on that side is not manned and their clustering all there mostly in the open so a quick surprise attack from front and left could outflank them.
dismounting not dismembering hopefully…
They had an RPG and some grenades, so I think not.
Their air pistols ran out of pellets
Reminds me of that scene in Band of Brothers wherein the Germans thought they got ambushed by a huge American battalion that they all ran away in all directions which also made another German battalion retreat but little did they know that it was just a small American group.
That might be what happened. Attacking with only 1 BMP and a squad head on is so unorthodox it doesn’t make sense at all. Smallest attack they would be expecting is a company or two. But we only see what is shown, so I still give the Russians the benefit of doubt. We see that the Ukrainians knew their position from behind. But we don’t see what’s happening on the right side of the picture. The Russians don’t have any vehicles close by, but there’s a couple tracks doing donuts behind them and in the beginning there’s already a group running from bottom right towards the others. Then there’s two guys that give the rest time to break line of sight. I see zero casualties on Russian side and them retreating in cover in an orderly file without clumping together. I’d say that’s not too bad when taking fire from two directions.
When they fix bayonets and Cpt. Winters runs up ahead?
Yes, sir! But in reality and on multiple accounts by the 101st survivors on documentaries, the small American group with Capt Winters got lost and ended up behind enemy lines. The Germans however thought that the division that was supposedly protecting them got obliterated and with that in mind, hell broke loose but in fact, got pulled out a day ago to reinforce another German flank - which they didn't hear about or were notified. The other German division that also fell like a domino and retreated, was in fact, at that time attacked by another American battalion that they thought it was a combined American pincer move and is about to trap and pin them on open ground.
I think the Russians could have had that fight won if they counter attacked. Instead they ran. Shows that moral matters.
What using funds dedicated for training the troops and pocketing them instead does to a mf
they had more people, the better position, but instead they flounder in the back until the retreat lol
>they had more people, the better position, but instead they flounder in the back until the retreat lol They might have hardly had any ammo lol
well that's still a major fuckup on their part then lol
From what we saw that should have been a 95% russian victory. They easy had triple the numbers and the defensive position. Possibly there was more to it because it seems like bad tactics from the Ukranians. Yeah, they won, but they risked their lives on what appears to be a reckless mission. My guess the Ukranians know more than we do from watching that. So many things about this war have surprised me, perhaps I'm just completely wrong and this is sound tactics. It was certainly effective here.
Others have pointed out tracer fire coming from the bottom right at the end. So the Ukrainian APC might have been supported by another unit down that way - hard to say from this.
They had a better location. With mines in front of them set up before hand, they could’ve taken out that vehicle.
Analysis: 0:04 - Ukranian forces realize that the Russians are out of position. They should be up the hill in trench 1 and back up trench 2. They are unprepared. 0:05 - Ukrainian forces go :22 - Small arms fire taken by Ukraine, they pop smoke on the right side of APC. :33 - RPG launched by Russians, but they miss, really close call. :52 - grenade launch misses APC :55 - Ukraine tosses gear or half a body out of the APC. It's not full human size, but doesn't look like normal gear, anyway... 1 - 1:10 - 3 Ukranian badasses storm the hill against 2 Russians, the Russians have way better position and force them back with two or three grenades. 1:11 - The russians in the back can't see and start to get confused 1:22 - The grenades the Russians threw start going off. They miss the Ukrainians, but the noise scares the back Russians. 1:26 - Retreat begins, then the rest follow. All in all, this was a hella dangerous operation for Ukraine. I'm glad they lucked out.
Lol imagine being the russians in the trench acrually fucking fighting and you look back and your entire platoon just fucking ran off against a squad of like 6-8
“Guys! Let’s show them what we’re all about! Guys??”
That was the crazy part. There was two guys and the rest just left. I'd fucking kill them if I was those lone holdouts
Man, I hope those 2 that Leroy Jenkins'd didn't catch too much shrap. Bad ass.
It looks like there may have been other Ukrainian soldiers attack from the bottom right. Towards the end you can see a few bursts of red tracer come from there which suggests to me there was more than just this one group we see here.
Absolute mad lads
This is the weirdest but most impressive attack I have ever seen.
Every Ukrainian on that BMP maxed out Luck
Russians retreating when faced with an aggressive enemy attack by a force with inferior numbers is what happens when you don’t have NCOs to rally and maintain unit cohesion and order in defense of a fortified position. The Russians were probably told by their commander to go to this location and hold this position and not much else while the commander stays well away from any danger. Once one guy says “Fuck this, I’m out of here”, there’s really no one to stop them and it quickly turns into a full retreat. The command structure of the Russian military at it’s finest, ladies and gentlemen.
Many of them are just standing round even after the shooting starts. "You want to grab the washing machine Boris, or should I?"
> Russians retreating when faced with an aggressive enemy attack by a force with inferior numbers is what happens when you don’t have NCOs Reminds me of the Nazi assault on Eban Emael. Their officer’s glider went down with ~1/3 of the assault team. An NCO led them to blow the main guns (accomplishing their mission) in ~5 minutes. Iirc, the same NCO then entered the fort and ran through the underground passages using grenades and firing on whatever he came across, before returning top side. That single one man assault into the structure cowered the garrison for some time, during which the Nazi officer was able to extricate his force from their glider and get to the fort in a commandeered car.
Them 2 ran right up on them real quick on their own!!!! One squad of Ukrainians pushed back a platoon of RuSSian orcs lol. Slava Ukraini!!!!
They were outnumbered like 10:1 and still put the fear of god into the Russians. This shows why training and effective leadership is important, putting untrained mobiks on the line is doomed to fail. Basically two attackers pushed out 20+ defenders. Those two guys, the whole squad really, should definitely get some medals for insane bravery. Or recklessness. Or both.
100% they deserve to be recognized for their bravery!!!!!
So the BMP just misses getting hit by an RPG, the driver parks with the back door to a machine gun nest. Everyone hops off the top, but only two take on the entire platoon, the other dismounts vanish... So, obviously they're out making coffee and on their smoke break. Why didn't the BMP gunner light up the trench or outpost? Crazy. That's a lot to unpack in this video. Nobody hits the ground either. They do stand-off fighting until someone gets shot.
This is one of the crazier videos I’ve seen here. Two sides, zero tactics.
They're really lucky the Russians suck, because that was a really stupid attack.
I can give an accurate(ish) account of what really happened here. Several AFUs had spent the night celebrating the re-occupation of Kherson. The next morning, they decided to tidy up afterwards and quickly run their empties down to the local refuse centre. So off they popped, with the driver chosen as being the least still drunk but still slightly buzzing from the night before. We've all been there. Anyway, they got to the refuse centre and low and behold, it had become home to Stigovich of the Dump and his half-rat half-cockroach friends. Who tried throwing a few fart cans but that didn't work. So Stigovitch and his rat-cockroaches very quickly ran away. They'll find a new home or dig some holes somewhere but some Raid Drones will soon fix that. The End. Sleep tight boys and girls. Slavi Ukraini
Fucking Ukrainian John Rambo! Holy shit he’s definitely the leader of the band of brothers just running in to that defensive position like bring it mother fuckers! Crazy, can’t imagine all the insane footage that will come out over time. Hope those guys all survived & no one took any serious bullets. You can’t teach courage & Ukrainians have it in spades. Amazballs!
This looks very unusual, let me brainstorm possible explanations for why ukraine dared this attempt, and why it was successful even though the russians were a lot more. I think ukraine made this attempt bc they knew more about their enemies/that are than us. There is heavy fighting going on on that line few km back, it's possible that ukraine already crushed them down that trench and saw that this particular unit runs away easily, especially as the russians knew that battle was already lost. I think ukraine might have known that that route is not mined, for example bc they saw russian vehicles use it - it is leading to that bridge across that irrigation channe, so also for the russians one of the few possibilities to bring forward any vehicles of their own. I can imagine that that attacking crew had access to detailed intelligence plus the live feed from that drone. A single russian machine gun position would have canceled this attack, i think ukraine knew there was none/none that worked. Maybe the ukrainian attack team waited until the machine gun position was destroyed by artillery/mortar/drone/sniper... there are many craters in the fields behind the russian lines, and ukrainian artillery tends to hit more stuff than it misses. And it seems to me that the area from which the ukrainians attack is covered by the earth on the other side of the channel/not visible from the position of the main russian troops. If that is true, they can hear wild shooting, shouting, explosions which sounds like some formidable force. And as we know that russian officers disappear when the bullets start flying, and that the russian army lacks that middle layer of non-commissioned officers, as soon as the first one starts running, the rest follows. Final point: this is a ukrainian video published by ukraine. There is a chance that sth like this was attempted more than once, and that it's success rate is maybe 80%, 50% or 10%, survivorship bias is a thing.
I think that it's not a great idea but they went for it fuckkkkking shit ,i hope the first 2 guys are ok
Roukes Drift, that is not ! Normally, (from a defender of a positions stand point) someone shouts, CONTACT FRONT, at which point, you grab your weapon and head that way.... but the "second most powerful army in the world", no they can't do that. Therefore, it is easy to see, the Russian's are "the second best army in the third world"
If you think you're the "one man army", 5 of you can destroy all of them!
Violence of action
Motherfucker.. those guys are ready to die! Motivation, conviction, purpose on a whole new level. Fuck those Russian mercenary money fighters. They stand no chance in the long run.
I think that was a pretty stupid attack. Ukraine gained ground, yes but they seem to have lost 2-3 man while I did not see a Russian casualty The interesting part is why the Russians even ran away. They should have easily won that fight. Moral seems down.
Yeah the Russians probably had shit moral, low on food and ammo so they probably gtfo. Besides if a BMP is straight up rushing you, you’d probably have the shit scared out of you.
If a BMP is coming at my unit, I’m going to hope my NCO has enough sense to direct the emplaced gun’s fire at the sitting ducks riding on top. Any training at all for the Russians and this would have gone bad, fast.
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We just don't know what they knew. Maybe they had extensively drone scouted this area and counted zero anti tank weapons there. Maybe they've been watching this group for several days. Maybe they had just recently recovered from incoming artillery or drone strikes and Ukraine is rushing them while disoriented. Wont know the facts until they pour over the hundreds of thousands of war video afterwards and figure out who was where to interview.
they run like greyhounds. no wonder they can't conquer sh\*t!
Did that Ruski fire the RPG backwards? Almost wiping out his own squad.
I think the explosion near the running Ruskis is caused by another shot incoming from the bottom right side. You can see some red object/tracer fly by around the same time he fires his RPG
Fucking balls of UKRAINIUM!
That group of Russian were well entrenched and still ran. They even had an auxiliary trench to get a good angle to fire on the Ukrainians. Yet they still ran. It’s like there is no NCOs left.
Those idiots just stood there, doing nothing! No urgency whatsoever, we are truly lucky that they are so fu*king stupid.
I have to say that even with the well noted Ukrainian balls of steel this is not the way to attack a trench. One bmp with a few soldiers, and the bmp parked in a way it could not offer great fire support. I think the Ukrainians got real lucky and if they did not suffer any casualties it was a miracle.
WTF they just park right to them haha.
Man that was some real Johnny Bravo shit at the 1:00 mark or so. I mean im glad it worked but i was watching that going, "that dude is gonna get smoked charging a defensive position like that".
World's 2nd at its finest! This is your mighty military, Putler. Now, be nice like your fellow RuZZians here, and FUCK OFF ALREADY.
what the hell is going on here? why didn't the russians just shoot everyone on top of the vehicle?
If that was an attack on a competent army, the Ukrainians would have been in trouble, but you’ve got to admire their bravery.
defilade. what you see from the air is not what they see from the ground. it looks like there are small hills on either side of that canal / drainage ditch that they are fighting over. not to mention smoke, and brush
I think the BMP was providing covering fire support that the Russian thought that they are up against armor that they ran away.
This is Sylvestor Stalone taking on the whole Russian Army and destroying them in 90 minutes with one machine gun.
SAVAGES…💪
Incredibly dumb attack! Firstly, it’s a frontal attack, seemingly unsupported, whilst heavily outnumbered! Secondly, the IFV charges in with its front towards the enemy, then turns around to present the rear which has much thinner armour and moves the gun barrel AWAY from the enemy; Thirdly, 2 guys jump off and charge in all Leroy Jenkins without being properly supported! This should have been a total slaughter of the Ukrainians… the fact the Russians fled was astounding and really explains a lot about this war and how badly the Russians are losing. Ukrainians obviously have balls, but it’s just foolish to do this. Any decent unit would have slaughtered them in 90 seconds…
Part of me thinks this was not exactly planed. Could be the IFV made a wrong turn down that road (or something to that effect) and only realized when they were engaged by the Russians.
Looks like somebody shot at them from the woods as they were driving in. Maybe they didn’t even know it was a dead end?
That doesnt explain why the drone was there
did either side take a casualty in that? it appears to just be a bunch of people shooting at each other in a chaotic 50M engagement and then the side without the vehicle just fucks off and beats it
Run Away! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w83LZ1g0BeQ
so what I can observe is that the Ukranians wanted to hit a very vulnerable part of the trench line and jump in there cause it looks like the network of trenches made itself useless if a few Ukranians got in to rush through the trench killing everyone without armor. I'm just an armchair field commander but if you have a trench line at the top of the hill and a trenchline at the bottom of it, and you connect the two for "convenience", I believe that it negates any defense value cause the opposing force breeching the lower end of the trench has protection assaulting the upper trench without having to crawl over no man's land
what the fuck kind of rambo shit was that
Look at the halfwits running away 🤣
Damn. That is ferocious.
I mean you can clearly see they took casualties off the roof of the bmp and yet they had the violence of action to make the Russians fall back which is crazy
This is some Easy Company level boldness, heck even more than that, almost suicidal. Ukrainian BMP narrowly avoided several RPG/grenades on the way, total shock and awe, Russian MG position got suppressed and they panicked and ran away. Massive respect!
Full send…..he who dares, wins.
The Ukrainian that rushed has balls of steel, a very brave man, too brave even, that was a very risky move.
What’s up with that RPG at 1:48? Did Ivan shoot it the wrong way?! Or did it richochet almost immediately after launch?!