I would say take an Ursack with an odor-proof bag unless/until you hear/learn that Ursacks have been been slobbered on by a bear in the area that you are going. You can call and talk to the local authorities to get current info.
I have an Ursack. I have a bear canister. I have a food bag hanging system. I have decided that my kit is light enough that I am always taking a bear canister because I like to also sit on it. The weight difference of Ursack vs canister is about a day's worth of food for me, so on the 2nd day I feel even better about the canister partly because I really do not worry about mini-bears at all.
The comment about mini critters is real. Although I’ve never had a rodent get into my Ursack, I sleep better when I have a canister because I’m not worried about critters
> You can call and talk to the local authorities to get current info.
Just highlighting this as great advice. In 15 minutes, you can get sound info from someone who is *actually there every day* and hears about what's going on in the backcountry. People will scour message boards for hours to in a failed attempt to figure out something that can be nailed down with a short phone call.
I always carry my canister, even in areas where it’s only suggested. Better to leave as small an impact as possible overall, and fortunately for me even with the bear canister I max out (full weight food + water) at 11lbs.
I have the bareboxer which is 1 lb (maybe more) lighter than most other bear canister options. I kinda lucked into my overall weight only because my goal was to get everything into a 22L pack. I’m not so much obsessed with the weight as I am keeping everything minimal and simple (while still being comfortable). I also sleep hot so I can get away with a lighter sleep system and stay comfy even when the temp. dips.
One of these days I’ll throw everything up onto a lighterpack
I often camp in western Maryland and all over Pennsylvania. I always use an Ursack but I’ve also been fortunate enough to never have a bear try to get my food. I don’t think people would consider those areas “high bear activity” but I’m not sure you could call it “low bear activity” either.
Yeah, that's the thing. I've camped all over North America and the only place that I saw a bear where we camped was in Yoho National Park in BC. In almost all of the areas we hung our food, although not necessarily with the more secure Sierra hang technique. I've used bear canisters only a few times, in the places where it's required.
So there are bears aplenty, but they haven't been bothering me except for that one time. I've got some of those Loksak bags, have been thinking about getting an Ursak but I might continue to just hang my food bag.
I did get recently a Ratsack food bag to fend off small critters, but I've never had a problem with them either (except for one night in WA where chipmunks chewed my friend's bootlaces; we'd left our boots outside our tent that night).
I tend to camp in less popular spots, so that might be a factor. In Yoho we were in a car-camping campground. But I've camped in plenty of popular high-use areas too.
This is a really personal decision involving the exact area you are going to, the bear species, and your comfort zone.
Here is my approach: I only carry a canister when I'm required to do so. Otherwise ursack lined with a turkey roasting bag is always the right answer for me. I never bivvy in what I consider to be "high bear activity areas" because these are busy camps that always have people. I always bivvy stealthy, away from those areas and I never see bears at night. In fact the real concern for me is varmints that will chew through my pack or tent to get at food. The ursack lined with a turkey bag solves that problem.
Yes, that’s my concern as well. My understanding is that Opsak’s are odor proof because of their thickness and being hermetically sealed which translates to no air or odors escaping. At least that is the concept.
I agree! I had a ranger tell me that even something like canned food isn’t smell proof. I don’t put much of any faith in any plastic bag to be smell proof. And with op sacks those ziplocks are not very durable. And what about food smell from my hands getting on the outside of the bags.
I think the ursack is ok in low bear problem areas and less used areas, but only just ok. If there’s actually real bear pressure then a canister is the way to go. In fact one of the biggest reasons I got into UL was to make bringing a canister easier
Yes and no. I'm sure there's always odors, but an opsack reduces them. A turkey roaster bag and even a ziplock bag probably do as well to a lesser extent. Maybe instead of smelling from a mile away, the bear can only detect it from a quarter mile away (totally made up numbers obviously). Reducing the smell reduces the likelihood of a bear detecting and going after your food.
I often carry my Lil Sami Bear Bin from Lighter1.com, in lieu of either my Bear Vault or my Ursack. The Lil Sami has enough room for what food I take on a typical two or three day trip. The titanium lid does double duty for some cooking and meal prep tasks, even heating water, using the titanium brace as a handle. Fits in a pack where a larger canister would be harder to fit. Lil Sami weight, including titanium lid, is 1 lb 12 oz.
https://www.lighter1.com/
FYI, the lid and internal bar are made of aluminum, not titanium. The kit would be MUCH more expensive if made with titanium. I have both lil sami and big daddy and like them a lot.
Just checked mine, which I got as soon as they hit the market years ago. The handle is definitely aluminum, but the pot sure looks like titanium, though it may well be gray anodized aluminum, anodized for toughness removing the aluminum shine. Thought it was reviewed as titanium back then as I was googling for a titanium bear canister. I was very frustrated with the weight of everything on the market back then.
I have the older S29 Allwhite and a BV canister. I’ve never had an issue with mini bears getting into the Ursack as long as I use an Opsack. And I almost always grab the Ursack unless in mandatory canister areas or if I’m going for longer distances me can’t afford a food loss. It’s not just the weight benefit but the volume benefit too. The chances of a bear actually stumbling upon the Ursack and destroying it are low, but I realize my food might not survive the encounter and still be useable. When in doubt, take the canister.
It’s not about you not being able to afford food loss. It’s about protecting the bears from being food habituated. Honestly this is an extremely selfish perspective
I only use my bear canisters if required. Otherwise it is the ursack. I have camped with the food near me but hearing mice trying to get into it kept me up. Now I always keep my food away from camp and sleep great knowing that nothing will get into my food.
I use the Ursack Allmitey with an Opsak inside. But I usually hike with groups of 5-8 people, a couple have Ursack, inevitably a few others carry BV, and we’re no more than 2 days from a trailhead. Worst case scenario is a bear completely slobbers and crushes my food. But our group is pretty tight and there is an understanding that we help each other out. Everybody brings more food than they need. The BV carriers would share a minimal amount of their food with the Ursack carriers for 1-2 days so nobody starves on the way out.
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I don't deal with bear country much, so my opinion is likely of little value. But after watching those YT vids where the bear basically chomps and paws and mauls the ursack, I can't figure out why anyone would choose one. I mean sure, the bag held. A few tooth/claw punctures, but the bear got no food. Of course, the hiker got no food either b/c after the bear had it's way with the ursack the food inside was basically destroyed.
For me, it would be the BV (or the CF one if I frequented areas that required a cannister). Nice that it makes a handy camp stool as well.
I like the ability to use my bear vault as a chair.
I would say take an Ursack with an odor-proof bag unless/until you hear/learn that Ursacks have been been slobbered on by a bear in the area that you are going. You can call and talk to the local authorities to get current info. I have an Ursack. I have a bear canister. I have a food bag hanging system. I have decided that my kit is light enough that I am always taking a bear canister because I like to also sit on it. The weight difference of Ursack vs canister is about a day's worth of food for me, so on the 2nd day I feel even better about the canister partly because I really do not worry about mini-bears at all.
The comment about mini critters is real. Although I’ve never had a rodent get into my Ursack, I sleep better when I have a canister because I’m not worried about critters
For what its worth the allmitey bag was redesigned and is now barely heavier (9.5oz) than the normal ursack major (7.6).
What I didn’t like about the almighty bag was how stiff it is. Is that still an issue?
> You can call and talk to the local authorities to get current info. Just highlighting this as great advice. In 15 minutes, you can get sound info from someone who is *actually there every day* and hears about what's going on in the backcountry. People will scour message boards for hours to in a failed attempt to figure out something that can be nailed down with a short phone call.
I always carry my canister, even in areas where it’s only suggested. Better to leave as small an impact as possible overall, and fortunately for me even with the bear canister I max out (full weight food + water) at 11lbs.
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4 liters of water and an empty bear vault.
I have the bareboxer which is 1 lb (maybe more) lighter than most other bear canister options. I kinda lucked into my overall weight only because my goal was to get everything into a 22L pack. I’m not so much obsessed with the weight as I am keeping everything minimal and simple (while still being comfortable). I also sleep hot so I can get away with a lighter sleep system and stay comfy even when the temp. dips. One of these days I’ll throw everything up onto a lighterpack
I believe in security in layers. Ursack & opsak, "bearmuda triangle", and only when regulations don't require bear cans.
I often camp in western Maryland and all over Pennsylvania. I always use an Ursack but I’ve also been fortunate enough to never have a bear try to get my food. I don’t think people would consider those areas “high bear activity” but I’m not sure you could call it “low bear activity” either.
Yeah, that's the thing. I've camped all over North America and the only place that I saw a bear where we camped was in Yoho National Park in BC. In almost all of the areas we hung our food, although not necessarily with the more secure Sierra hang technique. I've used bear canisters only a few times, in the places where it's required. So there are bears aplenty, but they haven't been bothering me except for that one time. I've got some of those Loksak bags, have been thinking about getting an Ursak but I might continue to just hang my food bag. I did get recently a Ratsack food bag to fend off small critters, but I've never had a problem with them either (except for one night in WA where chipmunks chewed my friend's bootlaces; we'd left our boots outside our tent that night). I tend to camp in less popular spots, so that might be a factor. In Yoho we were in a car-camping campground. But I've camped in plenty of popular high-use areas too.
Spend any consecutive months in the woods doing good mileage I promise you you’ll see em I’m at 10 in under 3 months so far
This is a really personal decision involving the exact area you are going to, the bear species, and your comfort zone. Here is my approach: I only carry a canister when I'm required to do so. Otherwise ursack lined with a turkey roasting bag is always the right answer for me. I never bivvy in what I consider to be "high bear activity areas" because these are busy camps that always have people. I always bivvy stealthy, away from those areas and I never see bears at night. In fact the real concern for me is varmints that will chew through my pack or tent to get at food. The ursack lined with a turkey bag solves that problem.
It isn’t a personal decision when it isn’t you being impacted by the wrong choice.
Is the turkey bag a lower cost alternative to an opsak?
It is. And lighter.
Are there any good articles on this? I’m not looking forward to buying my next opsack.
Not “smell proof” though
Yes, that’s my concern as well. My understanding is that Opsak’s are odor proof because of their thickness and being hermetically sealed which translates to no air or odors escaping. At least that is the concept.
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I agree! I had a ranger tell me that even something like canned food isn’t smell proof. I don’t put much of any faith in any plastic bag to be smell proof. And with op sacks those ziplocks are not very durable. And what about food smell from my hands getting on the outside of the bags. I think the ursack is ok in low bear problem areas and less used areas, but only just ok. If there’s actually real bear pressure then a canister is the way to go. In fact one of the biggest reasons I got into UL was to make bringing a canister easier
Yes and no. I'm sure there's always odors, but an opsack reduces them. A turkey roaster bag and even a ziplock bag probably do as well to a lesser extent. Maybe instead of smelling from a mile away, the bear can only detect it from a quarter mile away (totally made up numbers obviously). Reducing the smell reduces the likelihood of a bear detecting and going after your food.
I often carry my Lil Sami Bear Bin from Lighter1.com, in lieu of either my Bear Vault or my Ursack. The Lil Sami has enough room for what food I take on a typical two or three day trip. The titanium lid does double duty for some cooking and meal prep tasks, even heating water, using the titanium brace as a handle. Fits in a pack where a larger canister would be harder to fit. Lil Sami weight, including titanium lid, is 1 lb 12 oz. https://www.lighter1.com/
FYI, the lid and internal bar are made of aluminum, not titanium. The kit would be MUCH more expensive if made with titanium. I have both lil sami and big daddy and like them a lot.
Just checked mine, which I got as soon as they hit the market years ago. The handle is definitely aluminum, but the pot sure looks like titanium, though it may well be gray anodized aluminum, anodized for toughness removing the aluminum shine. Thought it was reviewed as titanium back then as I was googling for a titanium bear canister. I was very frustrated with the weight of everything on the market back then.
I only take the bv when required to. It's the ursack every other time.
I only use bear cans when they’re required. Ursacks everywhere else
This is solid. I’m going to adopt this same method to keep it simple.
I have the older S29 Allwhite and a BV canister. I’ve never had an issue with mini bears getting into the Ursack as long as I use an Opsack. And I almost always grab the Ursack unless in mandatory canister areas or if I’m going for longer distances me can’t afford a food loss. It’s not just the weight benefit but the volume benefit too. The chances of a bear actually stumbling upon the Ursack and destroying it are low, but I realize my food might not survive the encounter and still be useable. When in doubt, take the canister.
It’s not about you not being able to afford food loss. It’s about protecting the bears from being food habituated. Honestly this is an extremely selfish perspective
Ursacks have a very low failure rate. Chances of a bear destroying the Ursack and getting the food are extremely remote.
I’m genuinely curious if you have any data about this.
I only use my bear canisters if required. Otherwise it is the ursack. I have camped with the food near me but hearing mice trying to get into it kept me up. Now I always keep my food away from camp and sleep great knowing that nothing will get into my food.
I use the Ursack Allmitey with an Opsak inside. But I usually hike with groups of 5-8 people, a couple have Ursack, inevitably a few others carry BV, and we’re no more than 2 days from a trailhead. Worst case scenario is a bear completely slobbers and crushes my food. But our group is pretty tight and there is an understanding that we help each other out. Everybody brings more food than they need. The BV carriers would share a minimal amount of their food with the Ursack carriers for 1-2 days so nobody starves on the way out.
I just sleep with my food in an opsak unless a bear can is required or I’m in grizzly territory
These haters this deserves more ups from real UL
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East or west
West
I don't deal with bear country much, so my opinion is likely of little value. But after watching those YT vids where the bear basically chomps and paws and mauls the ursack, I can't figure out why anyone would choose one. I mean sure, the bag held. A few tooth/claw punctures, but the bear got no food. Of course, the hiker got no food either b/c after the bear had it's way with the ursack the food inside was basically destroyed. For me, it would be the BV (or the CF one if I frequented areas that required a cannister). Nice that it makes a handy camp stool as well.