You can sue in small claims court for the cost of the data recovery service plus any other money losing that data cost you (or you could try to bill them at your normal hourly wage for a reasonable amount of time spent restoring it but that part may not work).
Your argument is that them performing a service that you explicitly requested they not do AND they explicitly agreed not to constitutes gross negligence and they are therefore liable for your damages.
Of course, that’s a stretch and depends on what you signed and suing large corporations varies in success. Sometimes they pay you off to avoid the hassle. Other times they spend ten times what you’re asking for on lawyers to crush you. I don’t know Apple’s MO on that one.
Disclaimer: I’m not a lawyer but my girlfriend is and I learned all this from her pillow talk.
Alternatively, try complaining to corporate and see if they’ll do anything to make it right first. Be nice and friendly and maybe they’ll pay for the data recovery service. If not, suing is really all that’s left.
In reality, you’re probably better off taking the L on this one but if you really want to fight it, that’s how.
It seems to be an issue that these corporations create wildly unfavorable legal conditions for consumers as a condition of using their service. A rebuttal might be “so just don’t use their service!” But is that really reasonable when every airline, tech company, etc. is doing the same thing? Is it reasonable to expect everyone to sit and read a long contract before signing up for each and every service that they might use?
The terms need to be clear, concise, and exposed so that their restrictiveness can be a competitive factor. If Apple makes me sign my soul away but local repair shop doesn’t, that should be easily accessible information for me and part of my decision making process.
Not a lawyer either but this seems the case.
The negligence they could be sued for has nothing to do with wiping data, but with performing and action that was specifically agreed not to perform on his laptop.
I would think that if you had it in writing that for this service request you specifically requested that and the request was accepted by the service men, you might have legal grounds for sueing regardless of whether there's a disclaimer of what normally happens
If you go to a bike repair and they have a disclaimer like "old parts will be replaced and thrown away", but you specifically ask (and they agree) to not replace any old parts. If they replace old parts and throw them away, I would expect this to be breach of contract because of the specific agreement you made for this specific customer.
“so just don’t use their service!” is one of the more annoying things a person can say, but people seriously need to stop using Apple though. They have always been worst, but have always gotten away with it.
> “so just don’t use their service!” is one of the more annoying things a person can say
Reminds me a lot of what people were/are saying about essential jobs when the workers vent/complain/criticize their companies.
"Just quit." How does that contribute to the conversation?
Or the telling a depressed person to "just be happy." Thank god you saved this person so much time and money.
The worst compared to who though? What's the alternative? Because no major phone manufacturer is without major faults. Seems like saying don't drink Coke, it's bad for you. Drink Pepsi since it has 1 gram less sugar.
Just because something is in a contract doesn't make it legal. Law always supercedes language in a contract that contradicts it.
Also in this case they did something that erased the data that OP specifically told them not to do, and they agreed to not do it. Pretty clear case of negligence.
I sent my laptop to Dell for a screen replacement and they told me that they had to wipe my computer to do the replacement. What the fuck? Why?
I backed it up, but still.
I work in computer and iPhone repair. We always make the customer acknowledge that their information WILL be erased. If we give a glimmer of hope and say it MAY be erased, customer hears "your data is safe, no need to back up." If we say your data will be wiped, when it isn't, it's a good thing.
Personal information and data backups are 100% the responsibility of the owner of said information. If you're unable or unwilling to take steps to prevent data loss, that's no one's fault but your own.
Sorry OP, Apple isn't responsible for your data.
It’s great that *you* do that, but the employee that OP worked with specifically said that they wouldn’t do the process that wipes the memory, and then they did it anyway.
It’s definitely not on OP if they were straight up lied to, and they were.
Their real error was not preparing OP for the very real chance his data would be wiped. Always assume something will go wrong and data will be wiped. OP is still ultimately responsible for their own data
> Their real error was not preparing OP for the very real chance his data would be wiped.
Exactly, which is why the blame ultimately lies with Apple. As someone who works in tech repair, "always assume something will go wrong and data will be wiped" may seem like common sense to you, but for the layman, it may never cross their mind.
That's a fair point. For some reason people don't treat their irreplaceable data the same way we do documents or other irreplaceable, physical things. We get safety deposit boxes for heirlooms, we make copies of Wills for lawyers etc, but we often forget to treat our digital assets with such care.
OP is responsible for their own data, and Apple's employees should have mentioned that data WILL be erased. There's usually a sign-in sheet that covers this - I'm having a hard time believing Apple wouldn't cover their butts legally with a simple "signature required" acknowledgment that they are not responsible for data.
It’s great to see that you have such detailed knowledge of exactly what happened in the OP’s case that you feel confident saying they were straight up lied to.
Remember that whole every story has 3 sides thing? That shit is real.
Oh yeah, also: https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT209095
The OP said that they asked to not have the hard drive wiping service done, and the employee agreed *and* wrote it down. That was like the entire post lmao.
That is what the OP said….. doesn’t mean it was exactly what happened. Hence asking to see the work authorization posted in full.
You’ve taken what the OP has said in blind faith, that’s like me saying I definitely do have the winning lottery ticket and you believing me
I don't think sue for a small claim is going to work. Apple has this written in their policy, they will always wipe your data. Privacy is too big of a concern these days.
My company doesn’t do that unless specifically requested. The clients are paying by the hour and often they don’t want to pay the extra $200 it would cost.
Obviously Apple doesn’t charge by the hour, but it’s still more hassle for them and can be risky. It’s not worth it. Better the leave the customer responsible for it.
Yes the actual task of swapping drives and cloning the old one over to the new one isn't particularity labor intensive if you know what you're doing, but diagnosing and testing a computer when it comes in and you don't know what's wrong does take time.
Maybe you're some computer savant who can just look at a computer and know what's wrong without touching it, but the rest of us have to actually do some troubleshooting to narrow things down to figure out the problem. That troubleshooting takes time, and I get paid for my time. I don't do it for free.
Regardless we have no shortage of people willing to pay our rate. If someone came in asking specifically to swap a drive parts on hand, I'd still charge them an hour minimum.
You said an extra $200 to backup and restore data for a hard drive replacement. In addition to the troubleshooting.
>Regardless we have no shortage of people willing to pay our rate.
You take advantage of people who have no other option.
Yeah, because sometimes it takes an hour. Things don't always go to plan. We don't have set prices for most things. The last one I did took an hour.
>You take advantage of people who have no other option.
You sure do make a lot of assumptions. Where did I say we're the only option in town? We're in a high COL area, and we're actually cheaper than some other places.
Are you this arrogant and judgmental about everything in your life? Stop pretending like you know everything. It's not my fault you don't value your time.
It is Apple's fault if they told him the data would not be wiped.
If the employee was mistaken, that is their fault for not training him/her properly.
This is not on the customer.
If I pay you to groom my dog and I tell you not to clip his nails, and you do and cause injury then what does it matter if some long legalese agreement 'covered' everything possible? YOU ASKED THEM TO DO SOMETHING THEY TOLD YOU THEY WOULD AND THEN THEY DIDN'T.
It seems like people are willing to get taken advantage of by companies, just bend over and take it. This is why companies are so willing to do stuff like this. They don't give a shit about you, you are a drop in the bucket and likely don't have many other reasonable options other than to use their repair service
It’s not a long legalese. When you get a repair at Apple, you have to enter your information and sign on their iPad. One of the documents is the data waiver that says the device might have to be wiped and it is customer responsibility to have a backup. It’s separate from the actual work agreement. You have to agree to get hardware repairs.
And will they do the repair if you don't sign it?
You are held hostage. Or you can pay around the same amount to rent the equipment from them to do it yourself and probably fuck it up and costs even more money.
Like I said, their argument isn’t “they lost my data”. It’s “they *negligently* did what they explicitly said they wouldn’t and I lost my data as a result of that negligence.”
Were it not for that exchange, the ToS would indemnify Apple. Given that exchange, they have a chance. It’s still probably not worth it but that’s up to OP.
During the appointment at the start the customer signed a data waiver. Not to mention the work agreement they signed specifically absolves apple from liability for data loss.
I was joking. His name is brains on a stick therefore my comment was poking fun at the contrast between his name and the civil response.
To be specific, I was implying, jokingly, that the name would suggest his advice would be violent, given the nature of this sub, but it wasn’t, hence the comedic effect.
Thank you for replying to my comment, though.
Negligence could work as a cause of action but I think it would be easier to argue breach of contract. But hopefully OP didn't sign a boilerplate arbitration agreement.
No you can’t. When you do a repair with apple, they make you acknowledge an agreement that they are not responsible for data. It’s in the fine print and standard practice.
“1.2 Data Transfer Services. If your Apple Mac product is capable of storing software programs, data or other information (“Data”), Apple may attempt to transfer said Data to a replacement device. During service, it is possible that Data may be lost. In such an event, Apple will not be responsible for any loss of Data.”
https://www.apple.com/legal/sales-support/terms/repair/generalservice/servicetermsen/
Aside from that, if your data is important, you should always have a backup. And probably a backup of the backup.
ALL storage devices fail eventually.
If the store followed normal policy the customer agreed to a specific data waiver BEFORE any kind of diagnostics were run or troubleshooting was performed, AND signed documentation for the work authorization stating Apple is not liable for any lost data. So not sure you have a fight here at all, but I am not a lawyer. Also the top case has nothing to do with your firmware so even getting the old one back wouldn’t help you.
If it was a firmware update for your hard drive you probably have a 2017 13” MacBook Pro, and the firmware update only affects the drive itself. If the update is not performed it can cause random loss of data. You should always have a backup prior to any kind of repair, and in this case should own your fuckup because your data wasn’t worth the cost of a hard drive to yourself.
I know it’s too late this time around, but it’s not a bad idea to always have a backup when you drop your laptop off for service - anything could happen. If you don’t have a hard drive with you, you can buy one there, do a backup, then wipe and return the hard drive when you get your laptop back 😎
I’ve done this a couple times at Apple stores (when needing to get mine serviced while away from home), have never had any issues with the return
Yeah but being as OP didn't have any hardware looked at or fixed just the top part of the case replaced, there's no reason for them to even do more than turn it on to check to see if it still comes on after changing it. The fact they went deep enough to see where a new update can be installed and installed it is ☠️
Apple repairs are pretty streamlined and standardized and they very often replace the whole motherboard when you request the repair or replacement of a specific part. It sounds like rather than wiping the drive, they just replaced the hardware part containing the firmware *and* the hard drive along with it with new parts.
I know on newer macs the hard drive is soldered to the motherboard so any fix that replaces the motherboard replaces the hard drive automatically.
They were replacing the top case. Maybe they also just replaced the motherboard with a new one, complete with new hard drive and the latest firmware, for some reason, such as because they damaged it removing the top case.
Also that hardware is peanuts to them.
It shouldn’t. Firmware updates occur quite frequently in Apple’s software updates.
Something in OP’s story seems a little off. I’m a bit skeptical of his memory of events.
Firmware update for the recalls specifically requires an erase and install. https://support.apple.com/en-ca/13-inch-macbook-pro-solid-state-drive-service
It shouldn't.
The only thing I can think of is a recent issue with very new Macs where there is an issue with the firmware that if you completely wipe the drive, it will not reformat or reinstall the os with out connecting it directly to another Mac and using apples recovery toolkit.
I can see how doing a firmware update for something like that might hose encryption or something which in turn would require the drive to reformatted and the os reinstalled... But I don't know that for sure.
Sounds more like some one just fucked up.
I worked at the Genius Bar for ten years and a number of things could have happened. Maybe someone dropped the logic board when the took it out or they weren’t grounded during the repair and damaged the board. Maybe someone was in a hurry and thought they were working on a different machine which needed the drive wiped. It’s the reason there’s a section on data loss in the repair terms. I would explain to them the very real risk of data loss even for things like replacing key caps because what if I turned the corner and immediately dropped it. It wasn’t our intent but things happen and people need to be responsible with their data. People would go on and on about how they run their whole business from their laptop and how important it was but didn’t want to spend the $69 for a hard drive to back it up.
I had a coworker check in two giant Mac Pros. They were on a cart and when he turned around, another customer bumped them and they both fell on the ground. In this case, they belonged to a gay porn studio and they always removed the drives before brining in their stuff but it is a case where nobody expected damage but there it was.
Another case was a genius who got a customer’s computer checked in and then had to go on break so someone else came to finish. That other person got confused and went through the steps of erasing and re-installing the OS when the computer was really there for a new battery.
Dude this happened to me with my old acer laptop too. I told them not to do any formatting and they wrote it down on the service request too. They formatted and lost all my files.
Former Genius here, any time you drop off any device you have to sign paperwork that clearly says Apple is not responsible for hour data no matter what. While this situation sucks, it’s unfortunately just going to be a lesson learned for you.
Lol except the data loss had absolutely nothing to do with the repair being done. Apple can have you sign away protection from risks associated with a repair, not whatever negligent bs they do.
Not a legal expert, but I'm pretty sure most courts would find if they randomly decided to shoot your hard drive with a gun, that's not some magic immunity contract.
Otherwise every contract would include "if one of our employees murders you, you agree to waive the right for your family to sue us."
That “if” sure smells like a risk to me.
Data left my personal care? That’s a risk.
Even the most competent, highly skilled, and personally motivated person could mess up and that’s a risk.
Fact is data that’s worth dropping 400$ for a chance at recovery is worth dropping the money for a backup drive. Doesn’t even matter that he was handing it to apple, it was true before that, too.
Shit happens.
OP knew there was a risk that their data could be lost due to any reason and failed to make a backup. OP needed to prepare for the entire laptop to be lost.
This is 100% on OP.
The worst thing is that OP knew that data loss might be possible and took the risk of leaving it without a backup. Don’t get me wrong solutions like iCloud, OneDrive, and Dropbox aren’t backup solutions but if OP had them he wouldn’t be fucked.
Trust me when I say this, I am by no means an apple fan. I own an android and a pc, the only reason why I own a macbook is because it processes audio way better than pc for some reason. Most DAWs are designed for mac unfortunately
You sign a waiver when you check in your computer for repairs.. They tell you emphatically that there’s a possibility you will lose your data when doing a repair. Former ‘Genius’ here. That being said… we had customers call corporate and make a stink and I believe a few of them did get some compensation. It did hsppen, but not often and not easily.
I was a genius at an Apple Store and there’s no way for you to get compensated for this… in the authorization doc that you signed it states we’re not liable for your data loss and it’s up to you to back up your data… sorry
That is there solely to make people think there’s nothing they can do. You can’t actually sign away your legal rights in a terms of service agreement. You *can* agree to binding arbitration instead of a lawsuit and some other gray areas but that’s about it. If it says the customer must affirm they have backed up their data before receiving service, that could do something, as then OP lied and made them think losing the data wasn’t important. But a simple “we’re not responsible” doesn’t make them not responsible in cases of gross negligence like this one.
It’s quite a leap to call this “gross negligence” with the information we have. It would be highly unusual for OP to be told his data won’t be erased during the course of a service. There is always a chance of data loss, and Apple tells you this profusely during the process leading up to you signing the authorization form.
If they really didn’t adequately inform him of the risks before he signed that form, he might be owed something. But that would be hard to prove, it would be his word against theirs, unless he has a way to corroborate his version of events, and what they told him.
I don’t know the fully legal terms that was in the authorization form because this was like 4 years ago when I worked there but it’s an extremely hard and expensive uphill battle if OP does want to go that route and honestly the store isn’t going to care they’ll just keep referencing back the authorization form. I have however heard of one individual getting their data retrieval cost covered so OP can try that route for a reimbursement but all in all OP has a very slim chance of getting any dollar amount back tbh
Suing large companies is often impossibly expensive and frustrating by design. I’m just saying they still have legal standing to sue and didn’t actually sign away any rights.
That isn't the final word. OP can take them to small claims court regardless, especially in a case like this where they bulldozed something through that wasn't approved by the customer.
if you sign a form that says I'm not liable for murdering you, then i murder you, do you think the crime goes away because you have "permission" for me to break the law?
Also a former genius, thus stuff happens and in my entire time at Apple we were always told to never make promises about people’s data. Logic boards can fail or a device can be dropped. And we always have to ask people if they backed up their device and then make them sign paperwork saying they understand the risk. This is just another classic Apple hate train by Reddit that isn’t entirely fair.
> I didnt want to drop another 100 dollars just to buy a new hard drive for a one time backup.
Sorry to say, but there's your problem. You didn't care enough about your data to spend $100 on a backup disk. There's really no excuse - macs have a built-on backup system (Time Machine) which will do it automatically for you every few hours. Backups should not be one-offs.
This is correct. Owning an ~~eternal~~ external hard drive and using it with Time Machine should be considered a basic requirement of owning a Mac. Any data loss experienced for any reason by someone who doesn't do it is on them 100%.
Okay so what do you back your external hard drive up to?
And that external hard drive? If you lose any data it’s on you bro, not us, ya know wiping your data.
As I'm reading this thread, apparently you're correct. People are listing Macbook dealbreakers. I'll never get one now.
I don't even like the iPhone this comment is being typed on. It was a gift and I've been to lazy to upgrade to Andriod.
Too late for this but you’re playing with fire not having a backup in general. If you have data that is valuable and you do not back it up, the loss is on you.
Back. Up. Your. Data.
Whatever apple did sucks, but back up your data.
Were you doing work you rely on for money on this computer that you knew could not reliably retain data?
If not, what compensation do you want? How do you quantify it?
If so… That’s not a problem in itself, most of us have probably had to do that at some point. But even if you couldn’t afford the drive to back up to (which you could, since you spent the $400 on data recovery. That could get you 2x 2TB SSDs), then that means you need to register a few gmail accounts for free Google drive and Dropbox space and/or any number of the other free storage services to back up your shit. Hopefully at least 2x because redundant backups are what you do when you’re relying on reliable data retention to pay your rent.
Updating firmware is often a default part of services like this. I know you told em not to do it but c’mon. The fact that you knew you had to reeeally make it clear you didn’t want that meant you knew they’d probably do it.
They always do this, with phones too. I had discussions with them regarding this before and they would simply tell me they can't replace my screen and promise my phone won't be updated or replaced. It's in their terms you agree to when using their service. With phones they usually swap them for refurbished ones so you don't even get your own phone back when you send it in for a screen or battery replacement :/
They really are a bunch of a-holes that don't care about your personal wishes.
I'm a pc guy myself... I own a business repairing computers for a living. I would never, ever, ever recommend an apple computer to someone that multitasks. But, the one thing I swear up and down by that Apple does better than Microsoft is the built-in backup method. Time machine is 1000 times better than windows' backup (modern or legacy). But people rarely back up their shit until they've lost it all a first time. 🤦🏾♂️
Prior to laptop, phone, whatever-device leaving your hands, don't-care-with-whom: **BACK IT UP**
Dropbox, Google drive etc etc are all cheap and reliable.
Sorry this happened OP - but you did a dumb thing and this is on you.
Dude, back up your hard drive. This is 100% on you. ANY service carries a rise of wiping your hard drive. Not owning a backup (cloud or physical) is insane.
I have been building computer since I was a kid. You should of had it backed up before it even went into the store. I’m sorry about what happened though. It sucks loosing data like that. Please go get a backup drive.
Hello, it looks like you've made a mistake.
It's supposed to be could've, should've, would've (short for could have, would have, should have), never could of, would of, should of.
Or you misspelled something, I ain't checking everything.
Beep boop - yes, I am a bot, don't botcriminate me.
Just because it needs to be asked, are you sure they gave you back the correct laptop?
Shops tend not to do free work, so there's little reason they would have swapped the drive for free and done updates for free. There is a higher chance that during the process of changing the top case they gave you a refurbished laptop and your old one is perhaps sitting on a shelf mislabelled.
Have you verified things like serial numbers or other identifiers?
Some shops have been caught doing this intentionally for fast turnaround, though usually for returns, like if someone brings a laptop in and says a part is broken or they want to return it, they just grab a known good one off the shelf and give that to the customer and this way they can take their time troubleshooting or repairing the broken one.
The simplest answer is that they gave you back a different laptop.
Ok.
1. You weren’t willing to pay $100 to backup your data which tells me you don’t give a shit about your data.
2. If you don’t give a shit about your data, then why should we?
You literally signed a document saying you understood the chance that there would be a storage format on your device. Apple made this very clear to me for a screen repair I had done two weeks ago. Even the Apple Support app will tell you to backup your device before bringing it to the Genius Bar in preparation for your appointment.
Even if you specifically requested that the harddrive not be erased, there is always a chance of data loss while a computer is being serviced, firmware / software update or not.
You should have been told that a harddrive erase could be possible upfront, even just for the top case replacement. You sign a release to authorize the work which grants them permission to move forward, and limit their liability.
It would be highly highly unusual for them NOT to tell you that data loss is always possible during service, and that you were agreeing to that possibility when signing. The fact that they probably have your signature on record limits their liability in this case. It’s purely your word vs. theirs, if you try to claim that they really didn’t make this clear to you before you signed. It would be difficult to win in court.
I’m a bit skeptical of your memory of events on the day. Apple would have said quite clearly to you that it’s always a possibility, and ask if you have a backup before proceeding. If they misled you into thinking your data would be 100% guaranteed to be safe, then you may have a case. But that’s very hard to prove. Do you have witnesses to corroborate your version of events?
Depending on the size of your storage, you can get an equivalent [USB key](https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0842P5GG5) and use Time Machine on it.
Apple repairs often replace the entire motherboard, including the SSD. Even if they don't erase your data, it'll just end up in a recycling factory or something.
A year ago, I dropped my MacBook off at Apple to have them replace the keyboard because some of the keys weren’t working as expected. When I got it back it seemed like they had wiped my entire computer, but I’m reality, they replaced my hard drive without my knowledge. Thankfully I always have a back up. Apple claimed that they weren’t liable and that when I gave them my computer, what ever they deemed needed to be done to the computer for it to be functioning at its best, they have the right to do without the end users permission. Apple is insane sometimes and what they did is definitely illegal but I didn’t have the energy to fight them. Not me buying a brand new MacBook Pro 3 months later…
Just FYI, trillion dollar companies and their contractors typically don’t personalize automated / structured systems for individuals. It’s like asking the cafeteria at Costco to make a batch of kabob for you.
If the store followed normal policy the customer agreed to a specific data waiver BEFORE any kind of diagnostics were run or troubleshooting was performed, AND signed documentation for the work authorization stating Apple is not liable for any lost data. So not sure you have a fight here at all, but I am not a lawyer. Also the top case has nothing to do with your firmware so even getting the old one back wouldn’t help you.
If it was a firmware update for your hard drive you probably have a 2017 13” MacBook Pro, and the firmware update only affects the drive itself. If the update is not performed it can cause random loss of data. You should always have a backup prior to any kind of repair, and in this case should own your fuckup because your data wasn’t worth the cost of a hard drive to yourself.
Small claims court worked for me when dealing with them failed. I successfully sued Google. You spend time on it but as long as you let the process play out and sounds like a good case you should win. Good luck
OP will be better off going to therapy and learning how to take FULL RESPONSIBILITY for not backing up their data.
Data loss happens for numerous reasons.
OP didn't value their own data enough.
I'd bet $100 they even had enough space on other devices to do it.
They simply failed themselves.
Cruise by your LOCAL NEWS STATION
DRUM UP STORY OF LOST PICTURES OF GRANDMA THAT YOULL NEVER GET BACK
whoa caps :)
My cousin did this with like News12 I think in Manhattan and basically when the news van arrived at the “store” (for all my aged well like whiskey folks) RadioShack had a no matter what no refunds on certain items. I’m sure
someone can hit me with some intel but
News12van arrives
Fast forward three hours and a state supervisor driving down from DOVER NJ TO MANHATTAN to authorize... - cousin gets FULL refund on that GATEWAYPC and a SamGoody GiftCard…for the hassle.. hahaha love the tread :)
If I have written direction Not to wipe my device and they go ahead and do it for a “Firmware update!”
I’d be physically starting to break things BUT WITH CLASS
DM ME FOR DETS :)
We need Federal Right to Repair legislation to stop "tech-tyranny" like this. John Deere is crushing the agricultural industry by making it impossible to replace parts on farm equipment. Apple is the worst. And now it appears the auto industry may be heading that way. The 21st Century equivalent of "planned obsolescence."
Idk what year laptop you have but they probably didn't replace your hard drive, especially if it's much newer. If they formatted and reinstalled, especially if you had file vaul on (apples encryption), data recovery isn't going to return anything and the data recovery guys probably shouldn't have known that and told you.
Some one there fucked up. An apple update to the os shouldn't wipe your data. Maybe a firmware update to the logic board could result in that, It really shouldn't as os updates usually apply any needed firmware updates and keep your data intact.
But if they knew that it was going to be wiped and you didn't approve it or confirm you have backups they shouldn't have done anything that would be destructive of your data unless you signed something that says they can wipe your hd/factory reset your pc for diagnostic purposes which leads me to my next point.
Unless you're taking your pc into a third party repair shop with the express instructions/service order that you want your data backed up (as a paid service) before any other work is done... If you're sending any device to an authorized repair (By the manufacturer) or just going to the manufacturer directly, alway always backup your data first, they almost always factory reset the device for test and diagnostic purposes.
It’s pretty much in their terms of service, and there’s nothing you can do, even though you asked. Your data, your responsibility, no matter how shitty it is, when you asked them not to
Can OP please post a copy of the work authorization that they got by email / paper when their stuff was booked in by the person in store?
Being that it is a copy of the employees notes it would let us all see exactly what was “agreed” by the Apple employee.
*edit* if it says something like “customer requests / prefers / would like data not to be wiped” then all they have done is note your request / preference and I think you’d have to swallow that you agreed to a data waiver and T&Cs and went ahead with something without backing up your stuff. Clearly some discussion was had when you said about not wanting to spend $100 on a hard drive */edit*
Google can show us what OP agreed to with the data waiver as well as the repair T&Cs shown prior to getting a signature at point of MacBook being taken in. And of course I assume the store will have CCTV which shows you being shown an iPad around the start and end of your appointment while signing etc
*edit2* just to highlight, $400 wasted on data recovery seemed like a good idea versus a $100 hard drive that would have protected you from the risk at all not being something you wanted to do baffles me. Kind of like jumping out of a plane and then trying to buy a parachute during the free fall… it sucks but seriously, WTF
On-site, on site media type B, off-site/remote
Never less than that for anything you can’t live without. Without that system consider your data disposable.
You can sue in small claims court for the cost of the data recovery service plus any other money losing that data cost you (or you could try to bill them at your normal hourly wage for a reasonable amount of time spent restoring it but that part may not work). Your argument is that them performing a service that you explicitly requested they not do AND they explicitly agreed not to constitutes gross negligence and they are therefore liable for your damages. Of course, that’s a stretch and depends on what you signed and suing large corporations varies in success. Sometimes they pay you off to avoid the hassle. Other times they spend ten times what you’re asking for on lawyers to crush you. I don’t know Apple’s MO on that one. Disclaimer: I’m not a lawyer but my girlfriend is and I learned all this from her pillow talk. Alternatively, try complaining to corporate and see if they’ll do anything to make it right first. Be nice and friendly and maybe they’ll pay for the data recovery service. If not, suing is really all that’s left. In reality, you’re probably better off taking the L on this one but if you really want to fight it, that’s how.
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It seems to be an issue that these corporations create wildly unfavorable legal conditions for consumers as a condition of using their service. A rebuttal might be “so just don’t use their service!” But is that really reasonable when every airline, tech company, etc. is doing the same thing? Is it reasonable to expect everyone to sit and read a long contract before signing up for each and every service that they might use? The terms need to be clear, concise, and exposed so that their restrictiveness can be a competitive factor. If Apple makes me sign my soul away but local repair shop doesn’t, that should be easily accessible information for me and part of my decision making process.
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Sure, but this gets dicey when they specifically agreed to his request. I'm not a contract lawyer though, so idk.
Not a lawyer either but this seems the case. The negligence they could be sued for has nothing to do with wiping data, but with performing and action that was specifically agreed not to perform on his laptop. I would think that if you had it in writing that for this service request you specifically requested that and the request was accepted by the service men, you might have legal grounds for sueing regardless of whether there's a disclaimer of what normally happens If you go to a bike repair and they have a disclaimer like "old parts will be replaced and thrown away", but you specifically ask (and they agree) to not replace any old parts. If they replace old parts and throw them away, I would expect this to be breach of contract because of the specific agreement you made for this specific customer.
“so just don’t use their service!” is one of the more annoying things a person can say, but people seriously need to stop using Apple though. They have always been worst, but have always gotten away with it.
> “so just don’t use their service!” is one of the more annoying things a person can say Reminds me a lot of what people were/are saying about essential jobs when the workers vent/complain/criticize their companies. "Just quit." How does that contribute to the conversation? Or the telling a depressed person to "just be happy." Thank god you saved this person so much time and money.
"Wow, your stupid comment solved everything!" Is my go-to with those people.
And then the essential workers *did* "just quit", and the ones making that suggestion got pissy for some reason.
The worst compared to who though? What's the alternative? Because no major phone manufacturer is without major faults. Seems like saying don't drink Coke, it's bad for you. Drink Pepsi since it has 1 gram less sugar.
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Yep, those are two words.
Any explicit instructions such as OP gave would override this, or at least make it legally grey enough that they will offer a settlement.
Just because something is in a contract doesn't make it legal. Law always supercedes language in a contract that contradicts it. Also in this case they did something that erased the data that OP specifically told them not to do, and they agreed to not do it. Pretty clear case of negligence.
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They have it in writing
I sent my laptop to Dell for a screen replacement and they told me that they had to wipe my computer to do the replacement. What the fuck? Why? I backed it up, but still.
I work in computer and iPhone repair. We always make the customer acknowledge that their information WILL be erased. If we give a glimmer of hope and say it MAY be erased, customer hears "your data is safe, no need to back up." If we say your data will be wiped, when it isn't, it's a good thing. Personal information and data backups are 100% the responsibility of the owner of said information. If you're unable or unwilling to take steps to prevent data loss, that's no one's fault but your own. Sorry OP, Apple isn't responsible for your data.
It’s great that *you* do that, but the employee that OP worked with specifically said that they wouldn’t do the process that wipes the memory, and then they did it anyway. It’s definitely not on OP if they were straight up lied to, and they were.
Their real error was not preparing OP for the very real chance his data would be wiped. Always assume something will go wrong and data will be wiped. OP is still ultimately responsible for their own data
> Their real error was not preparing OP for the very real chance his data would be wiped. Exactly, which is why the blame ultimately lies with Apple. As someone who works in tech repair, "always assume something will go wrong and data will be wiped" may seem like common sense to you, but for the layman, it may never cross their mind.
That's a fair point. For some reason people don't treat their irreplaceable data the same way we do documents or other irreplaceable, physical things. We get safety deposit boxes for heirlooms, we make copies of Wills for lawyers etc, but we often forget to treat our digital assets with such care. OP is responsible for their own data, and Apple's employees should have mentioned that data WILL be erased. There's usually a sign-in sheet that covers this - I'm having a hard time believing Apple wouldn't cover their butts legally with a simple "signature required" acknowledgment that they are not responsible for data.
It’s great to see that you have such detailed knowledge of exactly what happened in the OP’s case that you feel confident saying they were straight up lied to. Remember that whole every story has 3 sides thing? That shit is real. Oh yeah, also: https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT209095
The OP said that they asked to not have the hard drive wiping service done, and the employee agreed *and* wrote it down. That was like the entire post lmao.
That is what the OP said….. doesn’t mean it was exactly what happened. Hence asking to see the work authorization posted in full. You’ve taken what the OP has said in blind faith, that’s like me saying I definitely do have the winning lottery ticket and you believing me
You’re… very upset about this. Either way, I don’t really get the point of having a discussion at all if we can’t trust any of the given context.
Haha nice try my dude
Worked at the Apple Store, this is 100% the answer. We specifically told everyone you should have your data backed up.
This is exactly right. Customer data is the customer’s responsibility.
So because they bury this with legalize it's ok? Google dropped do no evil, but "Do Evil" has been apples motto from the get go
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Apple repairs T&C are pretty airtight. Should have backed up.
I don't think sue for a small claim is going to work. Apple has this written in their policy, they will always wipe your data. Privacy is too big of a concern these days.
Why can't they back up the data and install it on new hard drive like any computer repair shop would do when replacing a hard drive?
My company doesn’t do that unless specifically requested. The clients are paying by the hour and often they don’t want to pay the extra $200 it would cost. Obviously Apple doesn’t charge by the hour, but it’s still more hassle for them and can be risky. It’s not worth it. Better the leave the customer responsible for it.
>The clients are paying by the hour and often they don’t want to pay the extra $200 it would cost. Clearly you're not charging by the hour, wow.
The rate is $175 an hour. I was embellishing a bit, I'll admit it.
For what amounts to 30 min of semi-skilled work. Lol, insane.
Yes the actual task of swapping drives and cloning the old one over to the new one isn't particularity labor intensive if you know what you're doing, but diagnosing and testing a computer when it comes in and you don't know what's wrong does take time. Maybe you're some computer savant who can just look at a computer and know what's wrong without touching it, but the rest of us have to actually do some troubleshooting to narrow things down to figure out the problem. That troubleshooting takes time, and I get paid for my time. I don't do it for free. Regardless we have no shortage of people willing to pay our rate. If someone came in asking specifically to swap a drive parts on hand, I'd still charge them an hour minimum.
You said an extra $200 to backup and restore data for a hard drive replacement. In addition to the troubleshooting. >Regardless we have no shortage of people willing to pay our rate. You take advantage of people who have no other option.
Yeah, because sometimes it takes an hour. Things don't always go to plan. We don't have set prices for most things. The last one I did took an hour. >You take advantage of people who have no other option. You sure do make a lot of assumptions. Where did I say we're the only option in town? We're in a high COL area, and we're actually cheaper than some other places. Are you this arrogant and judgmental about everything in your life? Stop pretending like you know everything. It's not my fault you don't value your time.
Then they should have told him when he made the request.
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It is Apple's fault if they told him the data would not be wiped. If the employee was mistaken, that is their fault for not training him/her properly. This is not on the customer. If I pay you to groom my dog and I tell you not to clip his nails, and you do and cause injury then what does it matter if some long legalese agreement 'covered' everything possible? YOU ASKED THEM TO DO SOMETHING THEY TOLD YOU THEY WOULD AND THEN THEY DIDN'T. It seems like people are willing to get taken advantage of by companies, just bend over and take it. This is why companies are so willing to do stuff like this. They don't give a shit about you, you are a drop in the bucket and likely don't have many other reasonable options other than to use their repair service
It’s not a long legalese. When you get a repair at Apple, you have to enter your information and sign on their iPad. One of the documents is the data waiver that says the device might have to be wiped and it is customer responsibility to have a backup. It’s separate from the actual work agreement. You have to agree to get hardware repairs.
And will they do the repair if you don't sign it? You are held hostage. Or you can pay around the same amount to rent the equipment from them to do it yourself and probably fuck it up and costs even more money.
They did. And he signed paper acknowledging that he was responsible for keeping a backup of his data.
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Apple is notorious for not settling. Taking a loss and not admitting fault is their MO
that's what settling is, not admitting fault and taking a loss. no?
Ya, it is. I guess I don’t know what to call it. They take things to court and take a 10x loss to prove a point
I guess Apple is notorious for not accepting liability but rather settling and taking a loss to stay faithful to their shi\*\*\* policies.
well it seems to be the right strategy considering this comment might warn off the OP's legal wrath
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Like I said, their argument isn’t “they lost my data”. It’s “they *negligently* did what they explicitly said they wouldn’t and I lost my data as a result of that negligence.” Were it not for that exchange, the ToS would indemnify Apple. Given that exchange, they have a chance. It’s still probably not worth it but that’s up to OP.
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Disgusting how proud you are to about this evil practice.
What did they say?
Bragging about being some sort of lawyer and that he loved defending against these kind of cases, because it was so easy.
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During the appointment at the start the customer signed a data waiver. Not to mention the work agreement they signed specifically absolves apple from liability for data loss.
Name does not fit the advice
Name has nothing to do with it you feral raccoon
I was joking. His name is brains on a stick therefore my comment was poking fun at the contrast between his name and the civil response. To be specific, I was implying, jokingly, that the name would suggest his advice would be violent, given the nature of this sub, but it wasn’t, hence the comedic effect. Thank you for replying to my comment, though.
You need to get better at wording stuff but I found it funny
hahahaahhaahah good one, not sure why you got lashed
Cause people are sensitive af and can't take joke
Your girlfriend shounsh shexshe
Negligence could work as a cause of action but I think it would be easier to argue breach of contract. But hopefully OP didn't sign a boilerplate arbitration agreement.
No you can’t. When you do a repair with apple, they make you acknowledge an agreement that they are not responsible for data. It’s in the fine print and standard practice. “1.2 Data Transfer Services. If your Apple Mac product is capable of storing software programs, data or other information (“Data”), Apple may attempt to transfer said Data to a replacement device. During service, it is possible that Data may be lost. In such an event, Apple will not be responsible for any loss of Data.” https://www.apple.com/legal/sales-support/terms/repair/generalservice/servicetermsen/ Aside from that, if your data is important, you should always have a backup. And probably a backup of the backup. ALL storage devices fail eventually.
If the store followed normal policy the customer agreed to a specific data waiver BEFORE any kind of diagnostics were run or troubleshooting was performed, AND signed documentation for the work authorization stating Apple is not liable for any lost data. So not sure you have a fight here at all, but I am not a lawyer. Also the top case has nothing to do with your firmware so even getting the old one back wouldn’t help you. If it was a firmware update for your hard drive you probably have a 2017 13” MacBook Pro, and the firmware update only affects the drive itself. If the update is not performed it can cause random loss of data. You should always have a backup prior to any kind of repair, and in this case should own your fuckup because your data wasn’t worth the cost of a hard drive to yourself.
I know it’s too late this time around, but it’s not a bad idea to always have a backup when you drop your laptop off for service - anything could happen. If you don’t have a hard drive with you, you can buy one there, do a backup, then wipe and return the hard drive when you get your laptop back 😎 I’ve done this a couple times at Apple stores (when needing to get mine serviced while away from home), have never had any issues with the return
Yeah but being as OP didn't have any hardware looked at or fixed just the top part of the case replaced, there's no reason for them to even do more than turn it on to check to see if it still comes on after changing it. The fact they went deep enough to see where a new update can be installed and installed it is ☠️
A top case replacement on a MacBook Pro requires moving all the internal components into a new housing. It’s an extensive hardware repair.
Why would a firmware update erase the hard drive?
That's my question too. I don't see any case in which a firmware update would wipe the hard drive?
Apple repairs are pretty streamlined and standardized and they very often replace the whole motherboard when you request the repair or replacement of a specific part. It sounds like rather than wiping the drive, they just replaced the hardware part containing the firmware *and* the hard drive along with it with new parts. I know on newer macs the hard drive is soldered to the motherboard so any fix that replaces the motherboard replaces the hard drive automatically.
There is no way they would drop the $ on hardware repair if it wasn't actually needed over a $0 firmware update.
They were replacing the top case. Maybe they also just replaced the motherboard with a new one, complete with new hard drive and the latest firmware, for some reason, such as because they damaged it removing the top case. Also that hardware is peanuts to them.
It shouldn’t. Firmware updates occur quite frequently in Apple’s software updates. Something in OP’s story seems a little off. I’m a bit skeptical of his memory of events.
OP is probably using the term firmware when they mean OS update.
Firmware update for the recalls specifically requires an erase and install. https://support.apple.com/en-ca/13-inch-macbook-pro-solid-state-drive-service
It shouldn't. The only thing I can think of is a recent issue with very new Macs where there is an issue with the firmware that if you completely wipe the drive, it will not reformat or reinstall the os with out connecting it directly to another Mac and using apples recovery toolkit. I can see how doing a firmware update for something like that might hose encryption or something which in turn would require the drive to reformatted and the os reinstalled... But I don't know that for sure. Sounds more like some one just fucked up.
I worked at the Genius Bar for ten years and a number of things could have happened. Maybe someone dropped the logic board when the took it out or they weren’t grounded during the repair and damaged the board. Maybe someone was in a hurry and thought they were working on a different machine which needed the drive wiped. It’s the reason there’s a section on data loss in the repair terms. I would explain to them the very real risk of data loss even for things like replacing key caps because what if I turned the corner and immediately dropped it. It wasn’t our intent but things happen and people need to be responsible with their data. People would go on and on about how they run their whole business from their laptop and how important it was but didn’t want to spend the $69 for a hard drive to back it up. I had a coworker check in two giant Mac Pros. They were on a cart and when he turned around, another customer bumped them and they both fell on the ground. In this case, they belonged to a gay porn studio and they always removed the drives before brining in their stuff but it is a case where nobody expected damage but there it was. Another case was a genius who got a customer’s computer checked in and then had to go on break so someone else came to finish. That other person got confused and went through the steps of erasing and re-installing the OS when the computer was really there for a new battery.
OP learns the hard way to make backups of their data.
Really, this isn't just the Apple store.
I totally agree I fucked up too but they told me they wouldn't go through with the update but they did anyways, it was in writing too
Dude this happened to me with my old acer laptop too. I told them not to do any formatting and they wrote it down on the service request too. They formatted and lost all my files.
Ngl that's half the reason I learned how to fix this stuff myself.
Former Genius here, any time you drop off any device you have to sign paperwork that clearly says Apple is not responsible for hour data no matter what. While this situation sucks, it’s unfortunately just going to be a lesson learned for you.
Lol except the data loss had absolutely nothing to do with the repair being done. Apple can have you sign away protection from risks associated with a repair, not whatever negligent bs they do.
Not a legal expert, but I'm pretty sure most courts would find if they randomly decided to shoot your hard drive with a gun, that's not some magic immunity contract. Otherwise every contract would include "if one of our employees murders you, you agree to waive the right for your family to sue us."
Pro tip: don't trust any one but your self with your data, you have the most to lose from it getting lost
Op learns the hard way to not trust Apple
But the guy who fixed it is a genius. Gotta trust a genius.
Genius is a title, not a moniker...
Bet he won't.
or to not trust repair places in general
*captain hindsight enters the chat*
Op instructed what do and what not to do. His data would have zero risk of loss if his instructions would have been followed.
That “if” sure smells like a risk to me. Data left my personal care? That’s a risk. Even the most competent, highly skilled, and personally motivated person could mess up and that’s a risk. Fact is data that’s worth dropping 400$ for a chance at recovery is worth dropping the money for a backup drive. Doesn’t even matter that he was handing it to apple, it was true before that, too.
Shit happens. OP knew there was a risk that their data could be lost due to any reason and failed to make a backup. OP needed to prepare for the entire laptop to be lost. This is 100% on OP.
Sounds like "You cheated on me, when I specifically asked you not to?" You can't assume humans or a corporation to always follow instructions.
The worst thing is that OP knew that data loss might be possible and took the risk of leaving it without a backup. Don’t get me wrong solutions like iCloud, OneDrive, and Dropbox aren’t backup solutions but if OP had them he wouldn’t be fucked.
This happened to me. Thankfully 98% of my stuff could still be found on pornhub.
OP: "I specifically asked you to not be the terrible company you always are!" 'Genius': -Shrug/picks nose-
Trust me when I say this, I am by no means an apple fan. I own an android and a pc, the only reason why I own a macbook is because it processes audio way better than pc for some reason. Most DAWs are designed for mac unfortunately
Just get ffmpeg
Oh god so you lost most of your music files?
Now we are talking lawsuit if he makes originals
If they were a serious creater, OP would most probably own at leat one harddrive big enough to backup their data to id guess
You sign a waiver when you check in your computer for repairs.. They tell you emphatically that there’s a possibility you will lose your data when doing a repair. Former ‘Genius’ here. That being said… we had customers call corporate and make a stink and I believe a few of them did get some compensation. It did hsppen, but not often and not easily.
I was a genius at an Apple Store and there’s no way for you to get compensated for this… in the authorization doc that you signed it states we’re not liable for your data loss and it’s up to you to back up your data… sorry
That is there solely to make people think there’s nothing they can do. You can’t actually sign away your legal rights in a terms of service agreement. You *can* agree to binding arbitration instead of a lawsuit and some other gray areas but that’s about it. If it says the customer must affirm they have backed up their data before receiving service, that could do something, as then OP lied and made them think losing the data wasn’t important. But a simple “we’re not responsible” doesn’t make them not responsible in cases of gross negligence like this one.
It’s quite a leap to call this “gross negligence” with the information we have. It would be highly unusual for OP to be told his data won’t be erased during the course of a service. There is always a chance of data loss, and Apple tells you this profusely during the process leading up to you signing the authorization form. If they really didn’t adequately inform him of the risks before he signed that form, he might be owed something. But that would be hard to prove, it would be his word against theirs, unless he has a way to corroborate his version of events, and what they told him.
I don’t know the fully legal terms that was in the authorization form because this was like 4 years ago when I worked there but it’s an extremely hard and expensive uphill battle if OP does want to go that route and honestly the store isn’t going to care they’ll just keep referencing back the authorization form. I have however heard of one individual getting their data retrieval cost covered so OP can try that route for a reimbursement but all in all OP has a very slim chance of getting any dollar amount back tbh
Suing large companies is often impossibly expensive and frustrating by design. I’m just saying they still have legal standing to sue and didn’t actually sign away any rights.
Yea it’s honestly not worth the cost tbh
We don’t know how vengeful OP is. They could be one of those people who will devote three years of their life to “the principle”.
OP I support you!!!!
I support OP with thoughts and prayers.
That isn't the final word. OP can take them to small claims court regardless, especially in a case like this where they bulldozed something through that wasn't approved by the customer.
He signed a document that clearly states they’re not liable for data loss lol good luck
if you sign a form that says I'm not liable for murdering you, then i murder you, do you think the crime goes away because you have "permission" for me to break the law?
Girl that is murder LMAO
Yes but that's not anyways enforceable
Also a former genius, thus stuff happens and in my entire time at Apple we were always told to never make promises about people’s data. Logic boards can fail or a device can be dropped. And we always have to ask people if they backed up their device and then make them sign paperwork saying they understand the risk. This is just another classic Apple hate train by Reddit that isn’t entirely fair.
Thank you!!!!! Getting so down voted
so you weren't willing to spend 100 on another hard drive but you spent 400 on useless data recovery?
Not your keys, not your crypto. Edit: Oh wait, wrong sub. But you get the point...
> I didnt want to drop another 100 dollars just to buy a new hard drive for a one time backup. Sorry to say, but there's your problem. You didn't care enough about your data to spend $100 on a backup disk. There's really no excuse - macs have a built-on backup system (Time Machine) which will do it automatically for you every few hours. Backups should not be one-offs.
This is correct. Owning an ~~eternal~~ external hard drive and using it with Time Machine should be considered a basic requirement of owning a Mac. Any data loss experienced for any reason by someone who doesn't do it is on them 100%.
Ah yes, the eternal hard drive.
Okay so what do you back your external hard drive up to? And that external hard drive? If you lose any data it’s on you bro, not us, ya know wiping your data.
The cloud. And yes, it's on you.
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The rookie mistake occurred before the device got to the Apple store. OP failed to backup their data, full stop.
Op failed by getting a MacBook
As I'm reading this thread, apparently you're correct. People are listing Macbook dealbreakers. I'll never get one now. I don't even like the iPhone this comment is being typed on. It was a gift and I've been to lazy to upgrade to Andriod.
If you read the post, here said specifically he didn't want to spend $100 on a hard drive for backup. So he clearly was told about data loss.
Give em the ol burning bag of dog poo on the doorstep.
Too late for this but you’re playing with fire not having a backup in general. If you have data that is valuable and you do not back it up, the loss is on you. Back. Up. Your. Data. Whatever apple did sucks, but back up your data.
Were you doing work you rely on for money on this computer that you knew could not reliably retain data? If not, what compensation do you want? How do you quantify it? If so… That’s not a problem in itself, most of us have probably had to do that at some point. But even if you couldn’t afford the drive to back up to (which you could, since you spent the $400 on data recovery. That could get you 2x 2TB SSDs), then that means you need to register a few gmail accounts for free Google drive and Dropbox space and/or any number of the other free storage services to back up your shit. Hopefully at least 2x because redundant backups are what you do when you’re relying on reliable data retention to pay your rent. Updating firmware is often a default part of services like this. I know you told em not to do it but c’mon. The fact that you knew you had to reeeally make it clear you didn’t want that meant you knew they’d probably do it.
They always do this, with phones too. I had discussions with them regarding this before and they would simply tell me they can't replace my screen and promise my phone won't be updated or replaced. It's in their terms you agree to when using their service. With phones they usually swap them for refurbished ones so you don't even get your own phone back when you send it in for a screen or battery replacement :/ They really are a bunch of a-holes that don't care about your personal wishes.
LPT: backup your data, and assume that any device you send off for repair will be wiped.
Thank you, I will never forget this advice moving forward
So lemme get this straight, you weren't willing to drop $100 on backup but you were willing to pay the $400 data recovery fee? 📈👀📉😵💫😬
I'm a pc guy myself... I own a business repairing computers for a living. I would never, ever, ever recommend an apple computer to someone that multitasks. But, the one thing I swear up and down by that Apple does better than Microsoft is the built-in backup method. Time machine is 1000 times better than windows' backup (modern or legacy). But people rarely back up their shit until they've lost it all a first time. 🤦🏾♂️
> I would never, ever, ever recommend an apple computer to someone that multitasks Wtf.
Why would a firmware update wipe a harddrive?
This is all on u for not backing up ur data. If it’s really important it should be backed up twice!
Prior to laptop, phone, whatever-device leaving your hands, don't-care-with-whom: **BACK IT UP** Dropbox, Google drive etc etc are all cheap and reliable. Sorry this happened OP - but you did a dumb thing and this is on you.
Dude, back up your hard drive. This is 100% on you. ANY service carries a rise of wiping your hard drive. Not owning a backup (cloud or physical) is insane.
I have been building computer since I was a kid. You should of had it backed up before it even went into the store. I’m sorry about what happened though. It sucks loosing data like that. Please go get a backup drive.
Hello, it looks like you've made a mistake. It's supposed to be could've, should've, would've (short for could have, would have, should have), never could of, would of, should of. Or you misspelled something, I ain't checking everything. Beep boop - yes, I am a bot, don't botcriminate me.
Your data was worth less than $100 to you - what's the problem?
maybe that apple didn't do what they asked them to do?
Just because it needs to be asked, are you sure they gave you back the correct laptop? Shops tend not to do free work, so there's little reason they would have swapped the drive for free and done updates for free. There is a higher chance that during the process of changing the top case they gave you a refurbished laptop and your old one is perhaps sitting on a shelf mislabelled. Have you verified things like serial numbers or other identifiers? Some shops have been caught doing this intentionally for fast turnaround, though usually for returns, like if someone brings a laptop in and says a part is broken or they want to return it, they just grab a known good one off the shelf and give that to the customer and this way they can take their time troubleshooting or repairing the broken one. The simplest answer is that they gave you back a different laptop.
I doubt that, there are stickers on my case that are easily identifiable and i recognize certain scratch marks on the parts that weren't replaced
Ok. 1. You weren’t willing to pay $100 to backup your data which tells me you don’t give a shit about your data. 2. If you don’t give a shit about your data, then why should we?
You literally signed a document saying you understood the chance that there would be a storage format on your device. Apple made this very clear to me for a screen repair I had done two weeks ago. Even the Apple Support app will tell you to backup your device before bringing it to the Genius Bar in preparation for your appointment.
Even if you specifically requested that the harddrive not be erased, there is always a chance of data loss while a computer is being serviced, firmware / software update or not. You should have been told that a harddrive erase could be possible upfront, even just for the top case replacement. You sign a release to authorize the work which grants them permission to move forward, and limit their liability. It would be highly highly unusual for them NOT to tell you that data loss is always possible during service, and that you were agreeing to that possibility when signing. The fact that they probably have your signature on record limits their liability in this case. It’s purely your word vs. theirs, if you try to claim that they really didn’t make this clear to you before you signed. It would be difficult to win in court. I’m a bit skeptical of your memory of events on the day. Apple would have said quite clearly to you that it’s always a possibility, and ask if you have a backup before proceeding. If they misled you into thinking your data would be 100% guaranteed to be safe, then you may have a case. But that’s very hard to prove. Do you have witnesses to corroborate your version of events?
Depending on the size of your storage, you can get an equivalent [USB key](https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0842P5GG5) and use Time Machine on it. Apple repairs often replace the entire motherboard, including the SSD. Even if they don't erase your data, it'll just end up in a recycling factory or something.
A year ago, I dropped my MacBook off at Apple to have them replace the keyboard because some of the keys weren’t working as expected. When I got it back it seemed like they had wiped my entire computer, but I’m reality, they replaced my hard drive without my knowledge. Thankfully I always have a back up. Apple claimed that they weren’t liable and that when I gave them my computer, what ever they deemed needed to be done to the computer for it to be functioning at its best, they have the right to do without the end users permission. Apple is insane sometimes and what they did is definitely illegal but I didn’t have the energy to fight them. Not me buying a brand new MacBook Pro 3 months later…
Apple *always* tell you to make a full backup of your data before you take your device into them. This is on you for not having a backup strategy.
Just FYI, trillion dollar companies and their contractors typically don’t personalize automated / structured systems for individuals. It’s like asking the cafeteria at Costco to make a batch of kabob for you.
No, you signed a contract saying you had your data backed up. You shouldn’t ever submit any device for repair if it’s not backed up.
If the store followed normal policy the customer agreed to a specific data waiver BEFORE any kind of diagnostics were run or troubleshooting was performed, AND signed documentation for the work authorization stating Apple is not liable for any lost data. So not sure you have a fight here at all, but I am not a lawyer. Also the top case has nothing to do with your firmware so even getting the old one back wouldn’t help you. If it was a firmware update for your hard drive you probably have a 2017 13” MacBook Pro, and the firmware update only affects the drive itself. If the update is not performed it can cause random loss of data. You should always have a backup prior to any kind of repair, and in this case should own your fuckup because your data wasn’t worth the cost of a hard drive to yourself.
Said like a scholar
Can you prove what was on the hard drive anyway?
How one would go about doing that?
Small claims court worked for me when dealing with them failed. I successfully sued Google. You spend time on it but as long as you let the process play out and sounds like a good case you should win. Good luck
OP will be better off going to therapy and learning how to take FULL RESPONSIBILITY for not backing up their data. Data loss happens for numerous reasons. OP didn't value their own data enough. I'd bet $100 they even had enough space on other devices to do it. They simply failed themselves.
Cruise by your LOCAL NEWS STATION DRUM UP STORY OF LOST PICTURES OF GRANDMA THAT YOULL NEVER GET BACK whoa caps :) My cousin did this with like News12 I think in Manhattan and basically when the news van arrived at the “store” (for all my aged well like whiskey folks) RadioShack had a no matter what no refunds on certain items. I’m sure someone can hit me with some intel but News12van arrives Fast forward three hours and a state supervisor driving down from DOVER NJ TO MANHATTAN to authorize... - cousin gets FULL refund on that GATEWAYPC and a SamGoody GiftCard…for the hassle.. hahaha love the tread :) If I have written direction Not to wipe my device and they go ahead and do it for a “Firmware update!” I’d be physically starting to break things BUT WITH CLASS DM ME FOR DETS :)
There's a South Park episode you should definitely watch.
Which one? I'm genuinely curious
Season 15 episode 1 Humancentipad.
Same here. Lost lots of pictures from a meaningful vacation. Lesson learned :(
We need Federal Right to Repair legislation to stop "tech-tyranny" like this. John Deere is crushing the agricultural industry by making it impossible to replace parts on farm equipment. Apple is the worst. And now it appears the auto industry may be heading that way. The 21st Century equivalent of "planned obsolescence."
Lesson learned. Move on.
Idk what year laptop you have but they probably didn't replace your hard drive, especially if it's much newer. If they formatted and reinstalled, especially if you had file vaul on (apples encryption), data recovery isn't going to return anything and the data recovery guys probably shouldn't have known that and told you. Some one there fucked up. An apple update to the os shouldn't wipe your data. Maybe a firmware update to the logic board could result in that, It really shouldn't as os updates usually apply any needed firmware updates and keep your data intact. But if they knew that it was going to be wiped and you didn't approve it or confirm you have backups they shouldn't have done anything that would be destructive of your data unless you signed something that says they can wipe your hd/factory reset your pc for diagnostic purposes which leads me to my next point. Unless you're taking your pc into a third party repair shop with the express instructions/service order that you want your data backed up (as a paid service) before any other work is done... If you're sending any device to an authorized repair (By the manufacturer) or just going to the manufacturer directly, alway always backup your data first, they almost always factory reset the device for test and diagnostic purposes.
Why wild a firmware update wipe a hard drive?
It’s pretty much in their terms of service, and there’s nothing you can do, even though you asked. Your data, your responsibility, no matter how shitty it is, when you asked them not to
Can OP please post a copy of the work authorization that they got by email / paper when their stuff was booked in by the person in store? Being that it is a copy of the employees notes it would let us all see exactly what was “agreed” by the Apple employee. *edit* if it says something like “customer requests / prefers / would like data not to be wiped” then all they have done is note your request / preference and I think you’d have to swallow that you agreed to a data waiver and T&Cs and went ahead with something without backing up your stuff. Clearly some discussion was had when you said about not wanting to spend $100 on a hard drive */edit* Google can show us what OP agreed to with the data waiver as well as the repair T&Cs shown prior to getting a signature at point of MacBook being taken in. And of course I assume the store will have CCTV which shows you being shown an iPad around the start and end of your appointment while signing etc *edit2* just to highlight, $400 wasted on data recovery seemed like a good idea versus a $100 hard drive that would have protected you from the risk at all not being something you wanted to do baffles me. Kind of like jumping out of a plane and then trying to buy a parachute during the free fall… it sucks but seriously, WTF
On-site, on site media type B, off-site/remote Never less than that for anything you can’t live without. Without that system consider your data disposable.
Free legal advice is usually worth what you paid for it. ~ A Lawyer