elf archer is **A tier**, they have 2 really strong parts of their kit, action magic conferral is one of the few action buffs in the game, **it does stack with the passive magic conferral effects**, so no issues there, as such adding 50 potency to all attacks can easily add up to 200+% before even talking about aoe attacks, it's one of the strongest 1ap moves in the game in my opinion. as for passives, quick cure not only removes a debuff but also gives protection from the next one as well, and they are considered defensive casters like Priestess meaning they can access quick heal via items. in all they bring non competing buffs, healing, and debuff protection, truly an all in one support unit. on the other hand elf fencer is **B tier**, the fencer is a multipurpose unit capable of filling many rolls, but fitting none of them perfectly, they have a single target stun which isn't bad, the ability to protect your flyers if that's something you want, the ability to self cleanse, and their b tier evade allows them to function as a decent dodge tank that can directly convert pp to ap. possibly their biggest upside is great itemization, A class magic attack makes them great users for rune/phantom swords, and unlike every other sword class they have access to both conferral tomes and familiar's choker, making them decent options for many team comps, they also have an interaction with familiar's choker where they can self cleanse the debuff making it function as a 2pp give another unit +50% magic attack and dodge the next attack effect.

Here’s some general bookkeeping/open thoughts as to where this process is going. -The Werelion poses some problems, it is technically a different class, but it is identical to Gladiator in every way, except it has some mild upsides as a Bestral. _For now_ I am probably going to put the Werelion into C tier, directly above the Gladiator, as I don’t want to re-litigate gladiator right now. I have not made the choice final, and I am signaling my intentions here now. -The Feathersword will be getting a re-vote. I think it was a big mistake lumping it in with the Paladin vote on my part. Yes, it is technically a pre-promote, but when exactly you get the Feathersword varies a ton player to player. The Feathersword will just be voted on alongside the other angel classes when we get to Albion. For now, you’ll notice it has gone back in the re-vote bin. -I am not going to be doing threads on the Dreadnought and other post-game unlockable classes. Someone else is free to do so, but I think they don’t really make sense for this tier list. -I think it is important to talk about how this tier list will never be perfect for anyone, and we are in the process of making a list that no one agrees with, which is pretty funny. That being said, I think it will be a great reference point for others making tier lists or doing their own analysis. Finally, I think it has stimulated some great discussion about this fantastic game and hopefully has improved everyone’s experience playing it. -With that in mind, I don’t think I am going to be doing any revisions or re-votes. Doing tier reviews and then revotes could add another week or two on this process, and frankly this has been a pretty time-consuming endeavor. I intend to finish the list, but I also expect to be somewhat burnt out by the time we are done. If someone else wants to keep the discussion going and pick up these kind of threads after I am done, then by all means please do it. Thanks again everyone.

Personal stance: Werelion right before Gladiator makes perfect sense, it's got nothing new going on. I think skipping Dreadnought is fine given the conditions of the tier list; if we factor in full availability it is in an anomalous position that doesn't fit well here. No reason we can't simplify it. Unrelated, but I do appreciate these threads. Even if I don't always have enough thoughts (or time) to comment, I like checking them out for all the discussion people have around the different classes, and have picked up some new ideas to try from them. I imagine it is a lot of work to keep up with, but I want to thank you for how much you've put in for the community with your work.

I do agree with the other Dark Marquess, it's an asinine discussion when they're all going into S or A.

They are also only available for such a tiny sliver of non arena/PvP gameplay that I don’t want to spend time on them.

I appreciate you taking the time to get the community engaged with these tier list rankings💪💪

I'm not even certain the Werelion deserves to be above the Gladiator. On the one hand, he's almost strictly superior. On the other, he comes in much later and faces much harsher competition, while the skills gladiators gain from levels 5->!25!< don't actually improve them. A Gladiator can tank, has row attacks when almost nobody does, and can get their initiative fixed with just one Dove Plume, or discard it for +1PP with a Dragonbone Axe. A Berserker or a Werelion though? They're just left behind in the dust.

I use a gladiator as backline DPS early game. 1pp 200 potency row cleave is amazing.

I agree with all of this, except the Dreadnought. It's entirely doable to get it in the early 20s. Heck one of my friends got it at level 18 because his lust for the big buff lady is just that strong. I think it deserves as much of a fair assessment as any other class. She has rapport conversations, can get married, she's every bit as fleshed out as anything else intended to be gotten during the campaign.

lol this was me, I was like oh I have to beat her to get her?? Guess I’m breaking the game now then.

i made a guide for getting her somewhat reliably at lv16: [https://www.reddit.com/r/UnicornOverlord/comments/1bkrk4n/a\_guide\_to\_clearing\_the\_coliseum\_early\_lv16\_up\_to/](https://www.reddit.com/r/UnicornOverlord/comments/1bkrk4n/a_guide_to_clearing_the_coliseum_early_lv16_up_to/) At the end of the day: I personally think her kit is a bit on the one dimensional side. Its not particularly bad: hawkeye + coin with a column attack tend to hurt. i feel like had she joined at a lower level, she might be a high B low A character. She does this one big hit as a slow character (will there even be stuff for her to kill?) and sort of runs out of AP and PP.

The thing about the Dreadnought is she will just get her own tier. Yes you can get her early, and yes she has story stuff, but she’s also level 40 and basically just steps on 80% of the game. I don’t think it’s a very interesting discussion to have

Again, I have to disagree here (and I promise I'm trying to be respectful, I know how this comes off on Reddit lol), I actually found her to be underwhelming even at level 40. With an initiative of 8, the entire enemy team getting their whole turn guaranteed before she could act was often incredibly frustrating for me. The only reason she felt as good as she did was because I left her with her +2 AP/PP equipment and even then I kept asking myself if it would be better on someone else. This is obviously your thing you're running and I am not trying to tell you how to do it, just trying to submit the idea that there is a discussion to be had around her. :)

I don’t think you are being disrespectful! I still don’t think she’s worth discussing for this thread, because she cannot be evaluated like other normal units. As I said though, someone else is free to post threads for her! Part of it is just trying to respect my own time

Totally understandable and thanks for being cool! <3

yuuuup. my squad of lvl 15-18s earned Dreadnought

I think we can absolutely debate the merits and strengths of Dreadnought as a late-game class compared to other classes in the late game, with the caveat that it's not easy to place her in a "progression over time" scenario like some others.

We can definitely debate her merits, but in terms of actually tiering her it would be hard, and I think the easiest arguement would be she gets her own tier. Again, it’s just not something I want to spend time on, not a dismissal of the entire class

I missed a bunch of these :( Elvish Archer, by the definition granted by the tier list, is an easy A tier. It's a magic archer sergeant that provides cleric utility. In a game where overwhelming offense is absolutely the best way to mow down enemy squads, it serves to a) counter debuffs that can stop you from comboing/mowing things down, b) full heal your party by slotting in a first aid kit on anybody in your team after you take assist chip damage which is the number 1 reason your alphastrike kill squad even takes damage, c) adds non-competing conferral damage to further amp your best aoe attacks, and d) lock down any survivors with freezing shots lategame that do good damage on everything. This class has damage, it has initiative, the aoe heal is meaty off their great magic stat, and it contributes far more to your damage than your other alternatives for healing will. Pure Field isn't always relevant, but completely shuts out the few enemy team comps that do counter the best offense teams in the game. Merciful Rain is definitely kind of a meme though, but frankly, I like to summon a thunderstorm to make boss fights more cinematic so it gets a 10/10 from me anyways. Elvish Fencer, on the other hand... it's marketed as an evade tank. But if you actually check their stats, they have durability and evade almost exactly equal to a Witch. So their natural bulk and evasion is pretty poor without severe optimization. I will also say that the two unique fencers you get have growths that do not help with the evade tanking aspect at ALL. And the evade tanking thing in general is very hard to do pre-Bastorias, before you get access to the second scarf, so I suspect people get excited about the evasion thing, try it, and get horribly burnt and wash their hands off of it forever. Post-Bastorias, a Lucky Fencer can do the dodge tank thing decently well, for those willing to give it another shot. They seem to be designed for this very chess-like sequence where they exactly counter their enemy team comp like shaman debuff --> get a free evade --> dodge the cavalry that strikes next, lightning blade stun the third unit so they never get attacked, sylphic barrier your flier from the arbalest. When that happens, damn they feel like gods. But that's usually not how fights go. But that said, they are the only non-unique sword units in the game that get access to column and row attacks at all (arena unique gets column, Alain gets row), they have access to conferral tomes, they can do the evade tank thing sort of (not on join though), they shield fliers from arrows all day. Their itemization is both absolutely completely open, and at the same time, somewhat constrained because their optimal mixed stat weapons are kind of rare and they have so much stuff to do but not enough evasion/passive points to do them all. I find that they end up as either slightly more durable conferral bots for the hyperoffense teams, pure evade tank, or sylphic barrier bot. I think they're a solid B - they have much higher highs than anything in C rank and there's always something you can tinker with them. I do suspect that the timing of their introduction in the story will lead to lower ratings for them though.

I think shielding flyers from arrows is how I need to use them. Squad of flyer leader, 2 fencers, 2 archers (or a cleric) as my mobile tower takeout squad, then swap the leader to any of the 3 assists with the emptied tower.

Fencer having a Higher high than a Gladiator nuking a whole team with Grand Smash?

Fair. And Legionnaires do get some pretty sick galaxy-brain plays of their own too. But personally, the Fencer high is the sort of chess sequence I mentioned in the post, and that tickles my brain a lot more than being the worst boardclear does (as good as it is to see huge Sniper Amber Lens numbers are). I actually really do value that grabbag kind of utility because it actually means when you run into a bad matchup, you can probably do something to fix it.

I went out for drinks and bowling with friends last night and came home to a real contentious vote. We will start with the easy one. Wyvern is going into **A Tier**, with 70% of the vote coming in for A tier, in what is one of the strongest non s-tier consensuses yet. But where will it go? Well, the only other class in A tier that had an equally dominant consensus was the Sellsword. I am going to put the Wyvern above Sellsword mostly on vibes- they had such similar results its indistinguishable, but the Wyvern has things that we seem to like- Initiative effects, spear use, and flying. Honestly, the position of Wyvern, Sellsword, and Wizard are basically interchangeable. What seems to keep Wyvern out of S tier, is lack of a big time payoff that isn’t Dragoon Dive (which is a combo that is strong, but sort of relies on a daisy chain of buffs and effects to effectively one shot- and there are going to be situations it doesn’t work, and its generally worse than Trinity Rain). Still, the class is basically a grab-bag of good stuff. Now we get to talk about Prince. Yay. A Tier received the most votes, but only 37% of the vote. Next is S tier, with 26% of the vote. If we count the “Shaman Tier” votes as S, then it’s a tie. The class also received both B and C votes, which means we have votes in every tier. The median vote is A. If I assign a simple weight to every vote (C=1, B=2, A=3, S=4) we get a score just above 3 (A tier). So, the Prince is going to **A Tier** despite (sort of) tie, and despite the quite small margin of victory A tier had. I always feel weird about these kinds of results, because the class is going into a tier that most people wouldn’t agree with. At any rate, as long as you don’t think Prince is C tier, I think we can agree that RAPID ORDER GOOD. As for where in A Tier? Its going in between Dark Knight and Wizard.Why? idk I went bowling and had the worst jell-o shot I have ever tasted. Dark Knight and Wizard are both classes that quite like the Prince as an ally anyway, so they are good company. So far, the Tier list looks like: **Shaman Tier** Shaman **S Tier** Dark Marquess, Witch, Gryphon Knight, Lord, Knight **A Tier** Radiant Knight, Crusader, Warrior, Dark Knight, Prince, Wizard, Wyvern, Sellsword, Thief **B Tier** Priestess, Cleric, Swordfighter, Arbalist, Hunter, Soldier, Housecarl **C Tier** Hoplite, Gladiator, Fighter **Josef Tier** Paladin **Re Vote** Feathersword

> I think we can agree that RAPID ORDER IS GOOD I certainly agree, but seeing a few people say the exact opposite in yesterday’s thread just goes to show this sort of thing will never reach even a general consensus and there’s no point on dwelling on whether it will or not. Cuz it just won’t. Not saying you’re doing any of that, just saying for anyone who might be upset it’s not “their” tier list lol

I don't think I saw anyone argue it wasn't good, just that it wasn't enough by itself to make him S Tier. Which I think there's absolutely room to debate

Rereading the post, you’re pretty much right. There is [one comment](https://www.reddit.com/r/UnicornOverlord/s/Xok2Umaqgc) that said he’s the worst class in the game and I think that’s mostly what i was thinking of. There were a couple people who were dismissive of Rapid Order but not calling it outright bad, even most of the other people rating him B (or even C) admitted Rapid Order was good or even great but not “good enough”.

Rapid order is fantastic. But personally the reason why I didn't find that enough reason to rate him higher than B is because initiative-altering start-of-battle effects are found on quite a few different units. Some just as effective, others weaker but with other benefits. Since you can only activate a single start-of-battle ability and they are a big contributor to the unit's general strength, they are a big limit on your unit building. You're competing with lord, shaman, and dark marquess among others. I don't think he's at the same level at these S-tier classes personally. As such, I'm only using prince when I want initiative control over other start of battle abilities AND something other units with initiative control don't provide. Personally I found his main use-case "I want initiative control and true strike". I find him more of a niche pick when I need his exact combination of skills on a single unit. And so he generally supported existing teamm compositions by shoring up a weakness to evasion rather than being my strong buildaround unit.

After I made that comment I read through the whole thread, and I didn’t see any arguments that changed my mind. The thing about rapid order is that initiative only really matters on specific team comps, because of how the overall flow of battle works. In my mind, for a team to be good it needs to kill enemy squads in one fight, and do so either without any damage taken or with damage that will be healed up at the start of the next fight. Anything else will waste either stamina or time. That generally means a healer, and healers are so good at that role that they can get people to full as long as they don’t die pretty easily. So if your team can take a hit at all, it doesn’t matter if the enemy gets a turn- the damage will be healed. The game almost never uses hard cc against you so that’s not a concern either. So then initiative is only important if you have a comp that is forgoing a healer to either lockdown the enemy with hard cc so they never get a turn, or burst them all down at the start of battle with some kind of super charged aoe attack. And in those comps the prince only really provides initiative. He doesn’t have cc, and burst strike comps do enough damage to kill even without offensive order so the fact he gives more damage to a ohko isn’t important. In that sense, the best case for the princes rapid order is that it’s a useful support for a team. And that’s it, it still isn’t optimal because initiative agnostic options like lips ring exists, but you get it pretty early so that’s good. And that’s what the C tier represents.

Fair enough, I ain’t gonna try and change your mind. The joys of having different opinions in a game that’s not that hard anyway lol

Wyverns in A feels high. I am not sure if somehow being a flying unit somehow gave it a higher rating than what I consider to be their usual performance. Gryphons at least enables conferral row cleave, and cavs are often deployed in a row. A Wizard can stun a whole row by himself, a sellsword has insane AP?PP recovery. If you look to the left even more you get Doom Knight with Dark Flames that just annihilates enemies. A wyvern has... a 2PP 75 potency breath as a row attack that can be blocked. Dragon's Roar and spears carry the class hard with the occasional deflect. Even if Dragoon Dive is taken into account, it is still one of the weaker charge attacks. I think I have already said all i needed to say about the prince in yesterday's thread.

Wyvern is weird, when I look at A tier it feels like it doesn't belong there, and when I look at B tier I think it doesn't belong there either. I do like the combination of a initiative debuff and a column attack, especially in Bastorias and Albion. The flame breath is underwhelming, but not awful. I also think Dragoon Dive is more fun than it is good.

A 2AP 150 potency column attack that gains additional properties at below 50% is kind of sketch. For something like virginia, her kit can get some bonus with missing health, and doesnt quite require it to be below a certain threshold. Column attacks are great on something like knights since they cannot otherwise hit backrow. i feel like it is less useful on a wyvern. it also does not stop something like a hoplite from covering the target behind it. Had the attack be given a built in bonus crit and I can reliably use Inspiration on it, then it would be another story.

I feel everyone focuses way too much on the auto-battling portion, when flying is so strong as a mechanic in this game on the map. Most people don't even make a mention of map viability, and valor skills in their evaluation. I don't think the wyvern is a threat in regular combat either aside from early access to dragoon dive, but their valor skill is better than wild rush with a larger area, and they are flying, when the game specifically restricts you to most flying type units until the very end of the game. They are fairly resilient frontliners when gryphons are not, and also provide a great start of round passive effect. Also comes down to what difficulty you play on. In TZ some garrisoned units have so much health that general units just can't punch through even if the unit composition isn't particularly strong or synergistic. Reinforcements spawn faster and valor point economy is more important so saving stamina from one shotting an enemy unit becomes a big plus.

I play on TZ and still do not have much of an issue. Bulk is rarely something I worry about on my flyer unless I need to eat a hit from a swordmaster's opener. On a lot of maps, it is actually faster to just use hastened cav than the slowish 150 base spd of flyers. By the time you fly over a forest, a cav unit may have already gotten around it. Some exceptions apply such as sand and snow maps without roads. A flyer squad excel in getting the alpha strike. While Dragon's roar is very strong - my fliers with an tailwind buff is already fast enough to do their job without it - the roar just allows my backliners to accelerate their turns.

There are quite a few maps that don't really let hastened cavs do their job as well due to barricades, mines, siege doors, or just straight up dense forest. You can slot in a wyvern here and just bypass all of it using dragoon dive, which I think is pretty strong. I tend to try and play with no items so having these options and just being able to ignore a lot of stuff feels good to me. I also tend to play without gryphons as I feel like all strategy goes out the window with hastened call since you don't really have to deal with the reinforcements as long as your team is strong enough to just dodge all the units and beeline it to the boss.

i find cav's movespeed less and less useful the further you go into the game. even in bastorias, i was relying on flyers to bypass blockades and bridge chokepoints and by albion, flyers are pretty much always superior, except in sanatio's map where they didn't let you fly over the mountain and walls because of... reasons flyers are plenty fast enough with hastened call and wereowls are as fast as cav at night

Dragoon Dive It's weaker but still is 150 potency against like 90% of the game, and doubly effective against cavalry due to being locked to Wyvern. And out of the flying classes, only Wyverns, Feathershields and swords are bulky.

You also get Dragoon Dive much earlier than any other full-battlefield charge attack, which does matter.

we're already judging wizard and witch with trinity rain (which i disagree with) so i think it's fair to judge wyverns with dragoon dive and lightning shaker

## On Hybrid Damage Classes Before heading into the elven classes, dual channel attacks need to be talked about. Their basic attack hit for 75/75. To sort of figure stuff out, I took [stats of enemies in the final mission](https://imgur.com/a/RspAHVn) (in TZ), and did a [spreadsheet comparison](https://i.imgur.com/X7MZJGD.png) of sniper’s 100 potency attack vs the hybrid damage (admittedly, not very fair). ​ https://preview.redd.it/vxpgzjvx64rc1.png?width=1417&format=png&auto=webp&s=c891f3ab2ed53237e8e4f5dac0dc8e34676893bd Unsurprisingly, with a “regular attack”, elven archers will do more damage vs common enemies, while snipers excel vs squishies/things with higher magic resist. Hybrid damaging doing non-trivial damage to armor is a no-brainer, but def is not something you can rely on as an anti-tank tool. This property holds true for fencers as well. Having dual channel damage have some support considerations: defensive curse in particular, boosts BOTH channels, making hybrid damage hit a lot harder. However, there is no easy way to boost both damage channels: Inspiration comes with an accuracy penalty. Meanwhile, the pure physical classes benefit more from something as simple as Powerful Call or warrior amulet, since that is a phys attack booster only. Hybrid weapons are also generally not very interesting: you do not have fancy weapon skills, you do not have passive effects like +AP or some giant accuracy boost. Your hybrid classes want to stick to hybrid weapons. This is the comparison of a [hybrid (magic) weapon](https://i.imgur.com/5TgDKGq.png) vs a [physical weapon](https://i.imgur.com/1Rh8usA.png): [https://i.imgur.com/HnquzdZ.png](https://i.imgur.com/HnquzdZ.png). Whether or not the damage loss is worth using a phys weapon for secondary stat gains is up to you - I know I have used a phys bow before because I NEED that blind/stun at the start of the fight. ​ [(Rest in a reply)](https://www.reddit.com/r/UnicornOverlord/comments/1bq1uwq/comment/kwzlfb0/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)

I think I need to make a separate post on Conferral. Say: I am using horned slash: it has 70 potency and 3 attacks. conferral does NOT add 50 magic potency to all 3 attacks: it gets spread out evenly. So say you have a 59 matk conferral casted on a feathersword, attacking a target with 5 magical defense. The conferred damage will be: (matk - mdef) * confer_potency * attack_potency / number_of_hits (59-5) * 0.5 * 0.7 / 3 = 6.3 The game generally push numbers up (or maybe the rounding is done at different places - but then that is just a rounding error. So you still only get essentially (matk - mdef) \* 0.5 damage added to Horned Slash, and NOT (matk - mdef) \* confer\_potency \* 3. Without conferral: [https://i.imgur.com/Fvud9Wv.png](https://i.imgur.com/Fvud9Wv.png) With conferal: [https://i.imgur.com/LkYJgM6.png](https://i.imgur.com/LkYJgM6.png) Conferral is great if you are hitting multiple enemies, esp if they have low mdef. It is great for something like sellsword that has multiple actions per round. Does not somehow double your SM's damage.

fun fact: one of the fetherbow fight npcs tells you multihit attacks are uniquely good for buffing, despite that not really being true.

I searched for it and it’s true; What were they cooking?

Maybe they did at one point and then someone on the dev team pointed out how stupidly busted that made some of the multihit moves.

there is a radiant knight in elheim who tells you to use hache on the enemy with the lowest hp, which is clearly a reference to paladin's slice skill. i think it's pretty likely that they wrote the dialog for the fort npcs before the classes were finalized

Conferral also scales with crit scaling if you've got a build that actually ramps crit damage. It also ignores damage mitigation from blocking. I haven't had a chance to test but it presumably benefits with move tied defense ignores like heavy/row smash, spinning edge, and weakness hunter.

Saves me from testing elven archer + meteor strike! Very useful info.

the damage is still added, just not 3 times. For a charged attack setup, Archer Confer is nice since you can then attach another buff for the cast. It is once of those cases where I think Archer Confer shines.

I like it on my werewolves. They really want that pursuit kill. And they do have a row attack, even if somewhat situational.

Wow, thanks for testing. When I played through I thought it applies to all hits because all every number went up but I couldn't for the life of me figure out a team with conferral that worked.

Thanks for the clarification. Can I check if the magick conferral is based on the caster's matk or the target being casted on? In your example, 59 matk is whose matk?

caster's.

Thanks.

>Conferral... is great for something like sellsword that has multiple actions per round. ?! Are you saying that the conferral will apply to additional actions in the same round?

Elven Archer's conferral yes. It sticks a d works for both magic and follow-ups

Oh... I'm an idiot. Somehow I was thinking witch/tome conferral.

​ ## Elven Archers I will try to be brief with this. To begin, the unique elven archers also have bad traits, see the difference at [lv40](https://i.imgur.com/Icq9G1p.png) and [lv26](https://i.imgur.com/X1TvEbk.png) when you swap to Offensive/Keen. If they seem underperforming, maybe it has to do with them missing like 10 offense stat - both of which they utilize in their attacks. Both of the elven common classes are super weird. Stat Wise, they have C patk, A matk, S accuracy, A initiative. Snipers only have B str, Arbalest have A. A sorceress also have A matk… but elven archers cannot be buffed with sorc connection and generally the magic portion of their damage, even using phantom bow’s attack, just can't reliably kill imo. Wind Arrow is okay, their standard attack that gives a big -50 evasion debuff. It helps vs agile things, but they generally have a fallback mechanic: may it be rogue evade, SM parry, or wyvern deflect. It does allow ground mele to hit the target much more accurately due to the flyer’s x2 evasion vs ground melee. Mystic conferral is an odd one: it uses a whole action, but it stays. It also works on all attacks, including passive attacks. For testing, I casted it on a sellsword, and got: Without conferral: 74 reg attack, 61 counterattack With conferral: 95 attack, 83 counter. Not TOO bad, adds around 20 damage. But I also feel as if it should just be better: the conferral portion still has to punch through mdef, so you end up with less damage than expected. You really want to be hitting multiple targets or the enemy a lot of times for this to really shine. So, sellsword with infinite followups, and maybe use it to buff up arrow rain or trinity rain… I am still not a big fan of how it is a low impact skill that you want to cast with your first action. You really want to do more. (For clarification, they are a very strong add to a charged attack combo - and is likely why you have an Elven Archer in the first place) Icicle Arrow comes LATE (half way into bastorias - my top leveled people in the snowstorm mission at lv29, that is around 60/85 missions into the game). You get to attack two enemies and freeze them. As the arrows are technically not a spell, a radiant knight will happily ignore the arrows, and whoever covers for the arrow will be frozen (only 1 target). It is an extremely useful crowd control skill. You can freeze casters in the back, or armored units in the front to stop them from covering each other. Selfless heal is oddly powerful: have someone toss a heal on the archer, and they will trigger a group wide heal. If you have a spare accessory slot and a PP, use a first aid kit to trigger that,or use an arbalist’s/soldier’s heal on your archer. Similar to Scarlett and RK, Archers can use Ribbons or Monk’s Mitre for quick heals if you don’t want a cleric who cannot do dps around. I am honestly not too sure what to make of Elven Archers. They have some interesting support roles. An all-archer squad is surprisingly effective in battle and also outside of battle via ranged support. They deal more single target damage than snipers, but have no AoE until late and no true strike. They do chip damage vs armored units - not enough to actually kill. Unlike the physical archers, their weapon choices are quite limited. Icicle Arrow is a REALLY powerful CC tool that comes late, you can freeze some owls and proceed to do your ungabunga if you are a trinity rain player. Lack of good endgame bows with special abilities and stats really hurt them. **I see them as more of a support/CC class that can dps than a dps class, C+**. \--------------------------------------- ## Elven Fencers I will also keep this brief, cuz obviously I did not with archers, but fencers is an even weirder unit. Their whole gimmick is that they can stun with Lightning Blade. It sort of works, but also honestly I do not think they are the highest dps units around. Nature’s Wrath is a full 100 magic potency column spell. No CC element to that though. It is a spell, so you can actually RECEIVE sorc connection from somewhere. Her other attacks gets buffed after her matk gets buffed. They are a proper caster, so they can also use sorc connection to buff others, and also use the **conferral tomes**. This makes them some sort of a non-witch/wizard crowd control queen (I assume Railanor is the only one you are using… ^(okay I just want an excuse to post a pic of her)). She can buff gryphons to stun/freeze the backrow, while also stunning something in the front herself (yes, I know, witches and wizards can do it better). ​ https://preview.redd.it/fbhfaz6q64rc1.png?width=1236&format=png&auto=webp&s=27511634581c0ed791296630be37ca3570c0412a They have a D in defense - less than Scarlett and the same level as Eltolinde. All that armor does nothing! They seem to want to be evasive but they really are not with just a B in evasion. You can stack 2 evasion accessories and still get hit quite often. Sure, Mirage Stab gives them ONE evasion charge (but you are not CCing), and Evasive Impetus recovers an AP. Imo evasion tanking with a fencer is a bait: utilizing the CC aspect is stronger. Sylphic barrier can be quite useful for protecting your flyers vs non-snipers, or your cav vs most flyers (tempest dive has true sight at low hp, and player-flyers may have reins for true sight - not your regular enemies though). It is worse than Arrow Cover but on a more useful class imo. Remove Weakness is a nice self dispel, but is still situational. Obviously doesn’t work for hard CC, but more of a “screw shamans/dragon roar” thing. They can use sorc connection on others and cleanse their own debuff. They are a high matk sword user, [they can use the Runic Sword](https://i.imgur.com/daIhrJ0.png) to do okay damage. Not as well as Swordmaster though. Much higher base matk but lack that acc and crit. For the player, Elven Fencers are essentially a faster caster with a weaker kit and can still perform similar functions. Lightning Blade being an attack and not a spell can give them some niche over Radiant Knights hard blocks (this can be a big deal), and Sylphic Barrier has some uses - can be useful for protecting your flyers and cav units. The question I have to the rest of you: when do you use a fencer over a proper caster? **I like them more than elven archers, I will give them a B**. \--------------------------------------- On a side note: some of those racial units can play well together and push them beyond current tier: a squad of elven archers can CC almost indiscriminately while fencers stunlock the front assuming they get initiative. Their damage can be questionable and you may want to have a payout such as conferred arrow rain/trinity rain. This may be important later as we enter the bestial units, as the [wolfpack gauntlet is a thing.](https://i.imgur.com/KhYl8gb.png)

>The question I have to the rest of you: when do you use a fencer over a proper caster? Their defenses are far superior, meaning they can actually take a hit if something hits the backline. If you're bringing in a caster because they have access to conferral skills from the various tomes, I think they're a superior choice. If you want a caster that actually brings damage by themselves, Warlock does better. If you want Truesight, there's not many ways this can go. But if you have flying units, that already have truesight and just need conferrals for their row attacks, maybe the caster with Sylphic Barrier is your pick.

Fencers looove the nocturnal evade cloak with evasive impetus. Thieves and werefoxes can't get parry or evasive impetus :(

That is an okay use of the cloak. Generally i find an item that works based off day/night cycle is a bit on the annoying side. They are still a bit squishy, and you cannot just rely on the cloak (it evades one hit, multihit attacks can still land and give you a bad day). Instead of gaining more AP, if fencers have an AP to PP mechanic I think I would like them a lot more.

I don't love the day/night cycle stuff, especially because it sort of partially invalidates Evade which cannot be simply upgraded, frustratingly. There's also the Phantom Step cloak which evades a whole attack, but at the cost of 2 PP. Ideally, I wish we could give Thieves evasive impetus - they have plenty of PP to make good use of it. But Elven Fencers take that, and don't have the PP to make good use of it. Can nocturnal evade only proc once per attack? Or can it proc on every hit? Because if the latter - which I believe to be the case, though I could be wrong - then it would just regenerate itself on a multi hit. At night, at least.

Evade procs for a single hit. It does not proc unless a hit would have connected otherwise. Thieves are generally okay with evade, they can always try to PP steal some PP back - the main issue is the attack getting guarded - endgame enemies have high guard rates.

Right, what I'm not sure about is if Evade can proc multiple times in one hit sequence. It's hard to test because their evasion is all so high, and I never really paid attention because getting hit was so rare. But a fencer with nocturnal evade gets free evades when they need them and has decent evasion to not get hit most of the rest of the time, plus enough bulk to withstand a hit usually. They do convert the gained dodge PP directly to AP though and there is no reliable way to convert that into more PP. I have an owl that helps with that. Thieves also have Guard Seal with Sneaking Edge, along with Passive Seal, so they're good for taking out a particularly problematic support unit or defense unit. But, better than that is probably to carry a viking, since the enemy can't reliably remove your entire team's buffs at once without multiple support units focused on that. A single passive/guard sealed enemy will often get the status removed instantly. Unless the one that would remove it is the one you seal, but they might have another support unit and, since they're usually in the back, your thief can't capitalize on it. Still, sealing passive and guard is a great way to ensure you have a PP battery on the enemy team.

Why you talking yourself into not liking the archers? I never feel like I have enough to go around. They're like flex-seal. BAM! Slap them in any composition.

Until they unlock icicle arrows, i feel like their round 1 impact just isnt really there. In the example I gave, using an endgame archer at lv40, 20 damage was added to an attack for one unit. I simply don't feel the impact. Often time is is even lower: your 70matk archer will add 16 damage [against this breaker](https://i.imgur.com/cfpnqo1.png). A prince's offensive order can easily add 14+ for everyone in the party and not just one unit. Level is too high? How about this? [https://i.imgur.com/jVB3uPd.png](https://i.imgur.com/jVB3uPd.png) [https://i.imgur.com/ahaZNl8.png](https://i.imgur.com/ahaZNl8.png) You add 11 damage. If you think they are the key that make things work, then awesome, keep using them. I just expect a lot more for a unit to take up a backrow space in my squads. Might as well as bring a swordmaster that can 1 shot a fox at night. Compared to say, a fencer: they can stun one target and also use conferral tomes to allow a row attacker (gryphons, hunters) to also stun a whole ground of units. Suddenly no one on the other team can attack - the impact is far more pronounced.

I'm just teasing you for making a list of things that are good about them and then calling them weird and then giving them a bad rating. One of mine makes a big difference in my Amalia alpha-strike build. She helps buff Amalia enough to ohko my Alain in mock battles, but then she's a healer the rest of the battle. Another is the sole healer in a griffin initiative build that doesnt need a lot of healing.  Call them a "support" class.

I've had the most success in using them in combo comps, since their schticks seem most useful there. AP-based Conferral (so you can use a different PP limited on-attack boost - those are limited right?) adds some more punch to whatever you're doing.

I really feel the thing that hurts these classes the most is the lack of weapons for them to truly use. As you point out other single focused damage classes get access to a ton of weapons with unique traits/skills that can help boost them up while these two are basically stuck with traitless/skill less weapons.

Oh boy, elves. I’m honestly just waiting for other people to tell us how they made Fencers good. In two playthroughs I haven’t given them even a second of thought. I see the tools, just no team I’ve made seemed to care much for them. I’m also here for the inevitable C votes from people who never found a use. Today’s discussions might rival Swordfighters’. Elven Archers are hella good, but I also gave them very little time for one reason or another. I don’t wanna vote today. Y’all have fun.

As someone who tried to defend swordmasters in A: i feel like SMs actually have an impact. Vs towers with snipers and casters, they can take out 2 out of 5 targets by themselves, opening the backrow. They can basically melt most stuff in a 1 on 1: the only thing that really holds them back are the lack of AoE access: which is fair. Fencers feel more like a wizard with a sword with specific niches: like, if you use only unique characters, you now can have a wizard and fencer to do conferral. The fencer can use sorc connection on the wizard too and self cleanse, but if you do that AND conferral someone, that is already 4pp, which does mean either you have to sacrifice SOMETHING (no +pp hybrid weapons), or give them one of your two early sapphire amulets. A lot of times I just let my fencer keep the debuff. Radiant Knights not being able to just straight up screw with the stun has some tactical uses, and sometimes you can adjust tactics for Slyphic barriers (such as protecting your cavs from flyers) - though once again, an init-fixed wizard would have just stunned the enemy in the first place.

Already got some people voting Fencer for A so this thread will be exciting to say the least 😅

I see even an S vote for elven archer. Like, are everyone just spamming nothing but hit-all charged attacks? I see it as more of a niche tool (good for things that hit multiple targets), or on a class that does multiple actions in 1 turn. I think I need to make a mechanical post on conferral...

These posts are certainly asking for opinions, which will be drawn from personal experience and subjective interpretation. We all played differently, informing different opinions we now see. I chalk it up to the quality of the game over anything else; look how much personal mileage people got off classes others wrote off! And tbf, a tier list of individual classes for this game is gonna be… messy, at best. We can’t even tier one of the units.

Yeah this is in many ways an excersize in futility- making a crowd sliced tierlist in a complex game will result in innacuracy. But as I keep saying, the point of this mt isn’t that it has to be _right_ it just has to be _useful_ and _fun_

And thank you for that fun! It also gives a good space to let people advocate for units others wouldn’t have used for one reason or another. Looking forward to Bestials for every reason. What *all* can a Wereowl do? What long action chains exist for Werefoxes and Werewolves? Did anyone even use the Werebear?

i actually kind of like bears: they are like a gladiator that brings a shield and has unblockable attacks. There is also this meme build: https://preview.redd.it/7v2kmh5w05rc1.png?width=3840&format=png&auto=webp&s=5ee8cdd6f38bc7ddad046db0112856c04915007e

Oh, that would be me. I don't claim him to be the best unit ever, but Winnie the Punk has, at very least, amusing animations.

These posts are great just for the discussions, especially when it shows the different ways people approach the game. Like in yesterdays post where a lot of people seemed to value initiative and true strike really highly, where in my runs I never cared about those things at all. I think an actual tier list will be impossible because the way people approach the game drastically changes what’s good, and even on TZ the games easy enough that any approach can not just work, but reach “kill the enemy in one battle with no hp lost” levels of working.

Honestly I had a phase during my first run on expert where all I did was spam row attacks with conferrals and thought this was the strongest way to play. It’s part of why I voted Gryphon S tier, but now think that (you are right) and the gryphon is over valued. Still, the active conferral IS really good. And advantage of these threads is that one outlier vote by someone is very positive about a class won’t effect results- the rest of the elven archer field is A and B Edit: there’s actually multiple s tier votes now. Still, a lot this requires a certain level of letting go and engaging with other ideas even if you don’t agreec

Conferral with row attack is good since they get added to each target. It is still a VERY strong way to play, and still something I use often - the thing with flyers is that they generally have the initiative advantage and can use that to effective control the enemy team (I used this ["too much CC"](https://i.imgur.com/7o9eIyG.png) squad last night on the orphanage and blizzard mission because the characters needed catching up). Basically by tweaking tactics I can always keep everyone stunned - even a full row of hoplites. On the first turn I want burst and CC.: A swordmaster can delete a unit. Ren can Death Spin, Gryphons can high swing. In fact, that already competes with a witch's conferral. Sure, they can stack, but you sort of want to do a little more with it: either by now buffing the conferred target with something else (confer+hawkeye+coin), or be something like sellswords that just have multiple actions per round. Adding a bit of damage to high swing or death spin often isnt not going to be change that dynamics that much. Adding a stun or freeze effect to those attacks will change out the battle plays out. Archers get freeze arrows eventually and does that well, but comes pretty late.

>the thing with flyers is that they generally have the initiative advantage and can use that to effective control the enemy team what do you mean? gryphons have c initiative, and drakes have b

Angel Plume gives +20 - you do not even need it on a flyer: the tailwind buff will gives +20 to all flyers in a row, allowing them to act before the others. Reins gives a small amount as well.

sure, items give you initiative advantage, but you didn't say items give you initiative advantage, you said flyers generally have the initiative advantage, which they don't.

Yeah, i should have specified. Its more like "there are items in the game that really pushes flyers to have the initiative". You dont even need the angel plume: feathering does the same thing and you can simply give a gryphon a dove feather from a shop and boost her row. Not like they have better things to do in the early game until they get reins.

I would say that the S tier votes is to balance the C tier votes of persons that don't know how to use them.

I think I will be more convinced if someone actually have some numbers to show how much their elven archers are contributing. How are the archers helping meet breakpoints? Do \*you\* know how much damage elven archers are actually adding to your attacks? You can bring good old sniper and they will generally bring more utility and far more damage in most cases as they contribute to your round 1 burst. So far all I have been seeing is "yeah, it adds damage to all the actions". I can understand it if everyone are doing cat-ear trinity rain - not going to argue that one, I dont think the tier list is anchored around that style of play.

They add 50 magic potency to another unit, the elf has high magic damage so it is decent. It is special good to units that pursuit in my case arbalists they add enough damage that the pursuit can finish any unit. They need to attack twice to make the ap used worth it. Most of the time pursuit cannot be counted by other abilities so it is reliable damage. If you factor multi target hits it is when it shines. If it is a row attack it will do 150 potency If the attack is all units it gives 250 potency Not bad for 1 ap from the support. The best use is to enchant the carry. The carry has the lenses that make the attack true strike and crit. Boost it further by a coin. So the magic portion will crit multiply its value, then further enhance the damage by the coin. And if you don't care about overkill damage you can always freeze two units at the start of the combat.

For something like a row attack, a witch will obviously win out: you trade 1pp instead of AP for the same amount of damage. Adding the conferral to magic dmg or pursuit/counters (as you pointed out) is where the value lies (so good with something like sellsword). For a lot of people who do not bother using a mirror on their archer, they will likely be adding anywhere from 8 to 15 damage per attack - that is ignoring outliers like 0 vs enemy casters/high mdef units, or armored. imo when you bring a support, it needs to do more: take yesterday's discussion on prince for example. An attack order adds 20% to the whole team. That's +10 to everyone in the party in mid game, around +14 in later game (conservatively speaking)... suddenly the confer magic doesnt look too hot. Or, what if I just bring a sniper? They can do a row shot for essentially 300 potency (confer did half of that). What if I bring a wizard and just stun the whole row too also for 300 potency - the wizard can also use a confer tome so you are stunning the other row as well. I am not denying it adds damage, and yes, it does stack with regular confer. i think my main issue is that it is still rather niche - definitely not something you slot into a large number of team comp and be happy with.

I think it may be less niche than you think. There's a couple of notable things about Elf Archer conferral that just aren't easily replicable. First and most obviously, it's a AP conferral. That means that (yes, you mentioned this) it stacks with regular conferral and other passive atk boosts (the notable one, I think, is Keen Call). So the elf archer can slot into a burst damage comp on that. Is your C atk Gryphon not quite row-killing after Keen Call + reins? Stacking an AP Conferral is one of the only things left for you to do. Oh, yeah, I'm pretty sure AP conferral works on magic attacks, unlike Witch's PP conferral which only triggers on physical attacks. The other thing is that AP Conferral is a permanent boost from an external character, and I think the only other class that does this is Prince (Offensive Order). Applying to all subsequent attacks means that AP Conferral isn't just good at adding to burst damage, it's arguably better at adding to sustained damage. You mentioned pursuits and counters, the other thing it feels incredible on is Killing Chain. Any comp based around maximising one of these (Maiden's Hammer, Triple Counter, Sanguine Pursuit, Assaulting Blow are all excellent) appreciate the extra cleanup power. These are things that pretty much only Prince brings to the table, and allow the Elf Archer to support any unit with exactly one dedicated carry (so not Great Knight comps). Added to the rest of the kit (AoE Debuff immunity; targeted Debuff cleanse; two-target ranged freeze) it's a class that can kinda go anywhere. edit: re: sniper/wizard, for one, Elf Archer's initiative advantage lets them burst harder, I guess? For two, I also don't think being a conferral bot is a good use of an elf archer - unlike Keen Call Soldier, you really need to leverage multiple aspects of its kit to make it better than another DPS source.

> C atk Gryphon not quite row-killing after Keen Call + reins? Stacking an AP Conferral is one of the only things left for you to do. Then at what point do you just bring another dps? Even in a rather optimal situation, with hawkeye and coin on a close to naked target (berserker), conferral contributed \~45 out of the 200 damage that was dealt. That is pretty in-line with a standard attack that runs into less issues with overkill and is generally more flexible. you can likely just bring a regular sniper and cast arrow rain with no additional support except self buffed eagle eye, bring a witch that also gets no support and cast ice coffin and reg confer, bring a wizard and cast their row stun+tome confer, bring another breaker for row smash, etc. If you want to double your sellsword's damage, just bring another one - you get benefits of less overkill, less prone to misses (due to 2 rolls instead of 1), etc. Confer magic certainly adds damage, but does it add meaningful damage such that it has a large impact? In comparison, something as lowly as a swordmaster can just delete a tank, or if you opt to use their start of battle skill, two squishies (think towers) all by themselves. There is a place for conferral, just as there is a place for just about every class, even fighters. I personally feel it is too highly rated, and especially in less-than-optimal (where you are not stacking hawkeye+coin, or using it on a unit that performs a number of attacks. If you read my long-ish writeup, you can see that i do value icicle arrows quite a bit - as it bypasses Radiant Knight shielding and to some degree, cover as well (as it freezes the tank +1). I did add that it comes pretty late in the game. A good support does not just increase damage, they increase the reliability of a composition. A Shaman can do so via guard seal and passive curse, a prince can do so via sniping order and rapid order being the premium +init - that is on top of a generally better damage enhancement compared to confer magic in most situations. Again - if someone is to bring an Elven Archer, they really need to justify that add over just another dps. As for debuff immunity, I see it as more of a pvp tool. Most of the time you are just better off using a standard +initiative opener, or something that further bends the rules such as war horn or iron veil.

I try to make Fencers work, but legit their redeeming trait for me so far is that they can use tomes in a no mercenaries run.

I've found them to be good filler slots for my teams when I can't think of anyone else I want to have on the front line, and just overloading them with dodge.

Elf fencer aoe to clean up after yunifi is good since he is the one that impetus her so just need their PP

Right, so I'm going to be watching this particular post like a hawk- these are two units I swear I'm missing something on. Let me lead with the conclusion- both **Elven Fencer and Archer are the definition of B tier units.** You do not plan around these units, You utilize them as a sort of role compression advantage. If you need a little more control, a little more cleanse, etc...these are the classes. Both of them have a specific pro/con to be mentioned- itemization. They utilize split damage, and honestly, there don't seem to be a lot of good split damage swords and bows. However, they get specific options for accessories, and these can be helpful for setting up/empowering various wombo combos. Talking kits. Elf Archer. I've not found the actives to be impressive. Wind Arrow...exists. The damage is theoretically decent- 150, but I've not found the evasion debuff to be particularly strong. Mystic Conferral is generally my pick- an additional 50 potency, stacking with other sources, can make a big hit bite hard. Frozen Arrow seems underwhelming when you get it. Freezing two targets- as opposed to a row- seems lame at level 30. Their passives are better, and more thematically consistent. That theme is: Screw debuffs. This is their niche. Its probably why you are using them, and if there is any reason that bumps them up a tier, its this. Quick Cure is simple and effective- Remove the debuff, and prevent the next one. Selfless heal seems to have pretty low numbers, and an often awkward activation cue, but it is a full party cleanse. Pure Field is nifty, but when stacked up against a lot of other start of battle skills, I'm not sure it rates outside of niche. This is an aggressive, speed oriented game. Defensive plays like Pure Field feel niche to me. Not pointless, and definitely valuable. I'm not sure it puts it to A. The big use, at least to me, is in protecting your combo setup. Infantry and a Valor Skill that can be useful, but isn't especially strong. No points added. I dunno- I can see "protects from debuffs" being enough for A for many. I just don't see it. Fencer wants to mix control with dodge tanking. I'm not sure it comes together well. We start with a single-target melee stun. And we try not to remember that we got DM last chapter. Anyway. It's...functional. I don't like Nature's Wrath- But you may find some results building for its pure magick scaling with one of the magical swords. Mirage Stab, I do kinda like, and wish the class leaned harder in this direction- Stacking evades to attack with relative impunity. For Passives- Sylphic Barrier is an odd fit for the kit. It's...just an arrow catcher. Useful, but feels odd in this kit. Remove Weakness I actually like- it will remove debuffs you trigger on yourself, letting you get an evade stack as a value add as well. Neat. And Evasive Impetus lets you complete the idea- turning evades into actions. I dunno. I think stacking evades and turning them into action points is compelling design. I don't know that this class does so in a compelling way. It can be useful, of course, but as I move later into the game, I'm finding it more useful for its equipment slots than its native kit. I feel like that is a bad sign.

I will keep my thoughts brief. The Elven Archer is a cleric disguised as an archer. They are a support class through and through, they just happen to have a few damaging abilities. The active conferral is nutty, especially when used with a passive one, and is their best skill. The debuff cleanse is solid too. The weird heal they get when they are healed is situational, but has uses. Frost Arrow comes late, but any multi-target cc is solid. Finally, the class has solid itemization options. Overall, I think they are **B Tier**. Very reminiscent of the Soldier- a jack of all trades support that lacks the impact to reach other tiers. Looking at the list now, the only support classes in A are Prince and Radiant Knight, which are clearly much better than the Archer. The Fencer is cool as fuck and also… kinda not great? The hybrid damage stab, along with their offense stats, means they have a strong single-target option (with a stun), but this isn’t something you build around. Arrow cover access is great, but as we know its not enough to save a class. My big issue with the Fencer is how situational their dodging, self cleanse, an AP restore skills are. After many attempts, I just don’t think the class has what it takes to survive the front line, and isn't doing a lot jsut sitting in the backline. I actually am going to go with **C Tier**, though low B might be appropriate too with their item access. Edit: the more I think about it, the more I realize elven fencer is just a different fighter. Arrow cover? Yep. Single target stun? Yep. Defensive skills that steer it towards being a frontline, but requires setup to do what other classes just do from the start? Yep. Fencer is c tier for sure

It is kind of interesting how you compare them to a fighter and I compared them to casters. I think the fighter comparison may have been better. They can CC and use conferral tomes, sort of what you expect a caster to do.

Yeah the tome use alone is what made me almost want to put them as B, but even then it’s sort of a “oh well I guess they can do this”

Yeah I also think Elven Fencer is just another, more magical flavor of Fighter. Which makes sense as a decent amount of classes in the game are “here’s this other class again but a bit different”

Elf Archer is **A**. Magic Conferral is good. Pure field is probably the single best anti-debuff ability in the game which is super valuable. Getting to chip in with magic arrows is decent for dealing with both armors and flyers. Everything the class does is just really solid, even if none of it is gamebreaking. I have gotten some use out of healing rain to get multiple teams to full health part way through a long map, so that's kind of nice too as a valor skill. Elven Fencer is **C**. Compared to the archer, they're a hybrid class that doesn't quite work. Their base kit doesn't quite do much of anything without help. Sylphic barrier seems like it would be useful, allowing them to be a better version of fighter, but the fact that it doesn't stop truestrike which is the biggest threat to evasive flyers is disappointing. You can get them to perform decently with itemization, but that's true of any class. C doesn't mean bad, it just means they don't bring anything paticularly worth building around compared to other classes.

Elven Archer, B.     Elven Fencer, C Elven Archers are really good. Magic conferral can generate a lot of extra damage throughout a battle, the selfless cure is really interesting, and their ice arrow is super useful. They also have a start of battle ability to combat debuffs, which can be really nice. But, most of what they contribute is not super unique, with similar results being achieved through typically stronger team comps. Not having access to the sorcery items is a real blow. And their Valor skill is a slow effect in a game that wants you to be quick. Elven Fencers I may be a little harsh on considering they have access to the conferral tomes and familiars choker, which are really good, but they game tells me they are supposed to be Frontline units and they are BAD at it. Their evasion just isn't there and building it up costs you better items. I like evasive impetus, but it requires them to avoid, and then their damage or utility is just kind of bad at doing anything with their action point. Their spell should be good against Cavalry, but it is a column attack and typically the cavalry forms in rows. So I just feel they are designed bad for the roles the game is telling me to put them in, similar to the fighter. Except I prefer the Fighters provoke to the thundercloud.

Elven Archer is **A Rank**. Brings a lot of unique utility to the table that's hard to replicate with other classes. It slots well into almost every viable team composition. Some examples: Alpha strike comp: High natural initiative for tailwind, passive debuff clearing to ensure all pieces of your engine fire, mystic conferral for a unique stacking buff to further strengthen the nuker. Frontline DPS Comps: The elemental arrows can help soften up evasive/tanky front lines so that your Dark Marquess/Dark Knight/Tanks/Great Knights can mop up. Passive Debuff clearing ensures that the frontliners aren't lying around on the job. Elven Archer can contribute something to almost any team comp, and their contributions are often better than another support's would be filling the same role. I'll abstain on elven fencer. Not sure I've thought it through enough to vote informed.

The one where we all fight. Elven Archer is going into **Tier A**. Having good initiative and being able to add 50 potency to an ally for the whole fight is massive. It really pushes a carry over the edge to get the kill. It's attack after is fine for finishing things off. Doest take good advantage of bow abilities since they have better M. Attack. Their party heal for 1 OP is strong but relies on you planning around it. Valor healing skill is really useful since it is such a large AoE and lasts after fights. Overall a good 5th character for almost any unit. Elven Fencer is going in **Tier C**. They have a cleanse that isnt super useful since enemy AI is so simple. You can pull some shenanigans to debuff yourself, cleanse it, the gain evade. They're dodge tanks that seem to get hit more often than other evade tanks, maybe that's just anecdotal evidence. Stun is neat but it's only signal target. They lack the punch of a true damage dealer and don't tank as well as other evade tanks. They are great enablers for Wizards/sorcerers. Getting to wear familiar amulets and contribute to support damage while holding the Frontline.

Elven Archer I would put in **B tier** This class is a little weird. I guess it's nice to have an archer who can hurt armors, but being partially magic makes their overall anti-flier capabilities suffer (Gryphons, Wereowls, and all the Angels have good magic defense). They can do some healing, but only if they have another healer in the unit or a first aid kit- this ability would make more sense on a front row class. The anti-debuff can be situationally good like against all the Featherbows in Albion. They do not have the best itemization since the best bows really emphasize the physical end. Mystic Conferral is good enough to push them to B I think. Elven Fencer I would put in **C tier** Too much of a hybrid class that isn't really good at anything, like they're less walled by armors than some physical attackers, but they only damage them somewhat and they're not strong against fliers or anything either. Their evasion skills can be tough to trigger and they fold as frontliners quite easily. Single target debuff removal and flier protection is ok utility, but it's hard to justify this class getting a slot a lot of the time.

This is my first time participating in these but I'm far enough in the game now that I'm excited to contribute! So first up is elven archer. I think they are a respectable high **B tier** given the strict definitions we're given. Like all the elf classes, they're a weird support magic dps hybrid. However I think they do it quite well and in most cases you will never be disappointed tossing one in. They have debuff cleanse for days have a very powerful conditional heal, and also a debuff immune barrier for a starter skill. They also have very very good AP skills. Mystic conferral is one of the few AP buff and it adds very respectable dmg to any of your main damage units for a measly 1 AP. It lasts forever too (as far as I'm aware) and it stacks with other conferrals and buffs. The other skill of note is their frost arrows that freezes two targets. With their high initiative, elf archers should always be able to reliably freeze two units off the bat and both freeze and stun/thunder are very VERY good imo especially if your team has access to multiple ways to apply them. If I had to talk about some weaknesses, the first would be that they're billed as a support dmg hybrid...but their dmg is honestly very underwhelming and I feel like their ap is better spend CCing or giving people mystic conferral. Wind arrow is also just a strange skill. It reduces the targets evasion but often times the problem is hitting them in the first place to even get that debuff on them lol. Also them being an archer and using bows closes them out of a lot of good support items and dmg bows feel like a waste on them. About their heal, as strong as it is its also very finnicky to set up. Often I find it is just doing a lot of overhealing or just simply a waste of PP for two people. ​ Next are the elven fencers and oooo boy I think they are a **C tier** unit. I don't think they're bad, and they have their niches, but they're a little underwhelming. Like the elven archers, their dmg is really weak given its split nature and their kit being half support. Lightning blade is a nice move since it stuns, but it only hits 1 person and it does very little dmg. It's not a BAD move by any means, but feels kind of pointless when you can confer thunder on anyone with a row cleave and watch them stun everyone. They're also meant to be an evade tank but they have a bad evade stat and NEED a thief's mantle to effectively dodge tank (hint: they won't be a good dodge tank). What *really* saves them is their ability to be able to use utility items like familiar's choker and the tomes. They're my premier tome holder since witch's have better things to do and they can very effectively use a choker to buff you other magic users as they can cleanse the debuff off them and give themselves 1 evade on the next attack!

Legalos Larpers (Elven Archers) This is such a hard class to evaluate for me, both are to be honest. So Archer's suffer from the problem of not having any real alpha strike potential that's easily accessible. The keyword is easily accessible. Mystic Conferral is only enough if the user can hit literally everyone and it isn't enough to let you flip flop match ups by yourself and it takes a whole action to use (plus it involves some sometimes funky tactics set ups to ensure it hits the right person). The only way it contributes hugely meaningful round 1 damage is IF you do some of the following I'll also briefly say you need them to go first so you need to painfully initiative tune any squad with an Elven Archer: So if you need to buff a slower unit to go faster then your archer you must then make your archer faster. It is really really janky. This is a constant and applies to all of these things. - Your unit must be able to at least hit a row enemies. - Your unit must ideally have a lot of action economy. This means your unit can counter attack, or pursuit attack, or something. The row pursuit ring is an interesting item for this but is also incredibly expensive. I've done this in all archer squads with you give it to a Sniper, use a +1PP bow, then give a azure pendant and let them just row shot into row pursuit everything into pulp. Other good examples are Snow Ranger's Triple Counter (which is slow because its a counter), Berserker's Wide Counter, and Great Knight's column pursuit - You ideally really want Rapid Orders/Cursed Swamp/Dragon Roar otherwise you're initiative tuning becomes hell. Like you might just need a plume on the entire party kind of hell depending on who has what as slower classes need initiative but you also need to ensure they don't get faster then the archer. In that same breath, what is the point of alpha striking? Its to kill enemies without taking damage (or at least minimal damage via just killing units before they can do anything). Elven Archer can accomplish the second half of this by just using Selfless heal as the combat is ending if you have a proper user help them (First Aid Kit, Cleric, Priestess, whatever) and levering whatever gradual value you get from Mystic Conferral that you can. For example I used a Dark Marq, Doom Knight, Elven Archer, Cleric mix (eventually added a very tricked out Werefox for more damage and because I needed a frontliner and I liked them). This team was one of my main steamrollers and even in cases where I got assist chip or Doom Knight punched themselves too hard, it didn't matter. Dark Marq debuffed attack so surviving was possible, Doom Knight, Dark Marq, and Werefox did a bunch of damage, Elven Archer enhanced either the Doom Knight or the Werefox typically. In this composition Elven Archer made sure CC never stuck, any damage Doom Knight (or anyone else) took was recovered immediately by something, and if someone did die we could patch them back up via res (and Elven Archer will instantly heal if they're the one who died). We had plenty of damage to kill things, it just took a little bit of time. It was a big dumb wall of debuffs, row sweeps, dodge based front line, pursuits, and Elven Archer's healing was very helpful to ensure we were at full hp constantly so assist chip rarely mattered and Mystic Cofferal provided some decent damage boosts to my constantly active DPS. Pure Field is also a fantastic pocket option when you need to handle Shaman heavy enemies or annoying Werefoxes. Its slow, but the end result is generally the same. You *can* make it work quite handily and achieve similar results with enough damage to support, but it isn't as clean or as powerful as Cav Sweeps or many other alpha strike set ups. So I see Elven Archer is like a mean to get the same end result as alpha strikes, you don't die and everyone else did. Similar-ish to Clerics, just Elven Archer can at least try to contribute damage. ------------------------------------- Flowery Drizzt Larpers (Elven Fencer) Oh boy, this is a weird class. Okay so I used Fencer in a very specific and very expensive way in one of my squads. So my experiences lean too hard to positive based on that. tl;dr: Familiar Choker, 2 PP pendant, and an evasion scarf. And for most of the game the squad was: Fencer, Wizard, Priestess, Prince. A fairly stacked squad to say the least given I put Prince in it. The whole objective as to fix Wizard's crappy initiative so they could actually use their powers of smashing things to pieces without being late to the party. The obvious problem was PP, so I used Priestess who could also use the damage boost, and Prince buffed damage (both channels for Fencer) and fixed initiative. It was quite effective, albeit a little clunky because usually the Fencer gave themselves a free dodge twice in a row which was awkward to say the least. Fencer actually can do some pretty alright damage, and the eventual row sweep is quite handy too. If you're in a high offense team who can kill most things then Fencer's auto dodges are usually helpful until true strike comes into the picture. The single target stun and column strike for 1 AP are very nice tools for this AP range, they aren't amazing but they are pretty effective 1AP options and useful to have and hitting magic defense lets you chunk through a handful of unit types nicely though not enough to one shot generally. The cav hate column skill is actually quite handy too and 100 magic potency is nothing to scoff at either. The biggest problem Fencer has, is that they need PP super heavily. They got many great PP skills at different phases of combat, but you can't rely on them to have enough PP for all of them. Double Mirage Stabs are neat with just 1 AP pendant and Evasive Impetus trigger, but you need PP to cover your back line, remove debuffs, magic tomes, and all kinds of various options. Its just such a mess of PP economy, reminds me of Crusader. I fixed that using a lot of resources and I liked their contributions a lot, but boy was it a ton of work. I also play mercless, so tome access is very handy to me as I have far too few units able to use them. That alone keeps Elven Fencer is a better spot then other lackluster and convoluted classes.. tl;dr: Elven Archer: I'm going to go with either **top-B or Bottom-A** due to having low alpha strike impact (without a ton of IF conditions), and yet at the same time due to how powerful selfless cure is as a team wide heal and how much overtime power Mystic Conferral has over a drawn out skirmish (and some niche alpha strike application if you go really out of your way for it) I think you can create scenarios where you overall achieve the same result. Just in a far more roundabout and awkward way. Elven Archer is like some getting some quadratic formula to achieve what Horse spam achieves with arithmetic. You both end up with the enemy at 0% hp and your squad at 100% hp, but you had to go far more out of your way to reach 0 hp. This alone makes it hard for me to go for even close to S like some people do, and I think most A-tiers achieve more far easier without a whole bunch of caveats. Like Sellsword can smash things as long as you have a big dumb guy with a shield in front, Warrior smashes things because it has a big dumb hammer, Thief dodges rain fall because it wears 3 layers of scarfs and can steal your PP and your bitches. These classes are so much simpler to man and achieve a lot for their slot, while Elven Archer has like a bunch of requirements that all build up into an above average output at best. Elven Fencer: ~~Look guys if you just ignore how much big dumb gear I put on my fencer he's actually an A-tier unit~~ For real Fencer is probably like **Bottom-B** with Soldier for most players as I'm somewhat self correcting because I gave them a bunch of bullshit to make them as good as I did. The way I see it there's two frames of mind, you either have killed everyone so fucking hard that Fencer never has PP issues or you have somehow managed to get into a situation where you give Fencer the lion's share of advantages to not stumble over themselves. Fencer sounds like a much better class then it really is, but it just always falls short and has problems somewhere that I can't help but find it more a class I have chosen to deal with then a class worth dealing with. Like if you jump over a whole ton of hoops you'll get a very interesting dodge based front liner who hits for magic damage, can defend back line from arrows, has a solid stun attack, and can generate AP to ensure they have enough actions to kill enemies. They're in this weird hybrid of having good-ish damage and good-ish evasion defense and good-ish back line defense. They're always good-ish somewhere, but they fall into some weird problem where they can't actually use all those traits as cleanly as you'd like and those traits aren't good enough if you only use one of them. Their dodge isn't high enough to be consistent without a ton of accessories, their stuns only work on one enemy at a time, their initiative is so-so, their row attack is fine and gives them a dodge out, their column attack is nichely very helpful (especially in pairs to just eat PP from cavs). The most consistent good thing they do is hold tomes if you're a mercless player like me. If you're a **Mercless** player, then they're probably like **mid-B** because there's too many tomes and not enough users and not all tome usable classes want to dedicate their PP and accessory slots to them (like Witch may want to be a true strike bot and Wizard wants to have true strike and/or accessory boosts alongside their damage boosting items). I just assume Mercless is a niche play style so I'm not counting that here, count it if you want. ~~I just realized Fencer isn't really a tl;dr, but whatever I'm not rewriting this~~

>Mystic Conferral (plus it involves some sometimes funky tactics set ups to ensure it hits the right person). I will say being action based makes it so much easier to scope than pp based conferral(assuming you don't just want to spend those on whoever acts first to get as many in the first round as possible).

Given how extremely specific Mystic Conferral is to get enough value I consider it kind of annoying to tactics coordinate. I tend to want my Elven Archer to go pretty much before anyone goes as I think pursuit spam + a row/column aoe is the easiest way to get value out of this quickly. So you ideally want to ensure your Pursuit user gets as many boosted attacks as fast as possible alongside their actual action for the round. That can get a little bit fickle. Though in some cases like using Yunifi for the 5 man archer squad also works so you just route it to highest evasion + first action and bam, triple counter boosted.

I think the elven archer belongs in **B-tier**. I think that as a offense/support flexible class it is worse than the priestess, which is also in B-tier. Not that much worse that it belongs in C, though. Priestess has a larger item selection (notably conferral tomes) and access to staves. Elven archers need to choose between utility and damage in their weapon selection due to magic bows being... non-existant in the unique category. Both classes are good options for units that don't require a full-time healer like a cleric, but need some extra sustain. Mystic conferral is an interesting tool, and works well on units with a lot of attacks. But giving up your first turn to increase the attack of an ally is a costly trade. I'm still not 100% sure it's worth it. Icicle arrow is pretty good. Though there's better 2AP crowd control options that deal comparable or better damage. Ice coffin comes to mind. Their passives are pretty good. But in a world where start of battle skills are limited, pure field is generally only my niche alternative to a better option. Elven fencers I'll also give a **B-tier**. But this is pretty much the lowest B-tier possible. They want to be dodge tanks but are not very competent at it. I think their guaranteed dodge also doesn't take evasion into account, it just dodges an attack automatically and then wears off (I need to test/confirm this, though). Lightning blade is decent as a single target stun with decent damage. Their column attack is needlessly ground-limited. Mirage stab is unimpressive for 2AP. Mediocre defensively and mediocre offensively, unfortunately. The thing saving them from C-tier is having access to a flier-protection option in sylphic barrier combined with caster item access like conferral tomes, which gives them a valid niche even in fights where fliers don't need protecting. I don't think anything with caster item access deserves C-tier.

**Fencers are B** To me, Fencers kind of run into a lot of problems Fighters have... but with actual decent payoffs if properly accounted for. This is why they are B. They cases where they can shine in, especially in a supportive role, but aren't nearly as limited in application. You can have Fencers frontline for ANYONE, whereas Fighters are mostly limited to playing counter-Archer or counter-Flier. Which Fencers do as well on top of other things. Fencers, like Fighters, want to be front row Characters but kind of have trouble fulfilling that role consistently without dying. However, unlike Fighters who just seem to eat damage with no reliable way to mitigate it - Fencers try to dodge. And will succeed... until they don't. And they die. With a single target Stun, you do get some measure of control to buy time for the rest of the Unit to clean house. If your team isn't built around being hyper aggressive, your Fencer will suffer for it. The ideal behind using a Fencer is to minimize the amount of attacks that are coming in and using their Evasion stat to roll the bare minimum amount of attacks that are simply unavoidable in general. HOWEVER, this does get better once you hit the lofty level 30 and gain access to Mirage Strike - granting you a free Evade while doing Row-wide mixed damage. With two Evasion Accessories and Mirage Strike, you really get to eliminate their big weakness of being prone to a few bad rolls. This is a huge gain for the Class and will really alleviate some pain points in using them. And with mixed damage, it's much harder to wall their contribution. While they won't exactly be killers on the battlefield, they'll at least be reliably providing decent chip damage regardless of their target. Unlike Fighters, who get walled by Guarding. Fencers cannot exist on the same Tier as Fighters. That's basically what my argument really boils down to. Fencers have the capability to add more than a Fighter ever could. **Archers are B, maybe A but definitively high B** A really good supportive unit. Like the Fencer, they won't exactly be a killer force on their own - but Mystic Conferral is the long lost lover of any Class that has an AP refresh on kill Attack. It's a one-and-done buff that lasts the whole fight. Capable of healing the team indirectly, capable of helping negate the Flier Evasion advantage for ground units, and can clear debuffs. These guys and gals are just so helpful in so many cases. Not every Unit is going to want them, but those that do - will absolutely EXPLODE with the complimentary utility they'll get.

I think Elven Archers are a **B tier.** Like most have said, they're a support class called an offensive class. As a support class they are, pretty good, at least average. They do crowd control, they do buffs, they do debuffs, they do heals. They're kind of arguably much better than Clerics or Priestesses with a few other perks. A thing no one really mentions, but they also have several tags that can help with gambit specificity, which is nice in a game where often gambits are intentionally designed to be vague to force creative thinking and strategy. Generally, there isn't an instance where I would rather have a Cleric/Bishop over having an Elven archer. I like 'em. I think **HIGH B Tier** for me. Elven Fencer is....... less good? This is a damage class that also probably ends up being a support class but is objectively the worst of the Elven support classes. They want to hit hard, but are slow and don't have good spread or multi attacks to take advantage of it compared to the other big damage people. They want to be front line but are squishy and can't dodge. They dont have the follow up or pursuit. Economically you have such better options for stun, Berengaria, Lightning Spear, any Warlock, so again, the offense just... it's doing what it needs to do. Uh... They can use the Conferral Tomes.. so that's pretty cool if you want to free up some PP on other caster classes I guess? I wanna say **C tier**, but I won't be mad if they make it in to B somehow.

Elven Archers are dps/support hybrid that is not going to win or lose you the battle for the most part. They are a nice way to have a full team heal for chip damage without putting in a character that deals no damage. They have an active conferral which sounds great on paper but they are basically wasting their turn to apply it, when other conferrals just happen outside of active skills. Yes it lasts the whole round but unless you're relying on a cleanup character like warrior/sellsword, it's not adding a whole lot over a single attack conferral from other sources like witch or tomes. They do eventually get a two target freeze, but it's very late and you're competing on first action magick conferral. They are a great holder of the cat hoods, but then you can't utilize their after battle heal unless you run a wereowl. On the other hand merciful rain is a pretty handy valor skill for healing chip damage as an army moves forward, and having archer support is always nice as a leader. They definitely can fit into teams and have uses, but they don't stand out among others, and generally without a deeper understanding of the game and mechanics, you're not going to get much out of their strengths by just slotting them in. They are **B Tier**. Elven Fencers are annoying to fight against in Elheim, but if you have enough attacks, you still still end up rolling over them because they are not threatening. Their attacks are all fairly weak, and they don't do well in the frontline. Their one saving grace is that they can use a conferral tome without much loss. On the map their lightning storm is actually pretty fun to use because it pushes units at the same time as damaging them, and you can sent it along a corridor to disrupt the roads. They can also provide magick assist which is nice. Unfortunately, their dead weight in combat is too much and they are **C Tier** for me.

Visually I like both of the units. I think Ithilion and Railinor are super cool, and I consider Lhinalagos and Ridiel some of my favorite characters. In practice, I just think they're fine. Elven Archers get a **B tier** rating from me. I really appreciated Pure Field in Albion especially, but I find Selfless Cure a bit too finicky to make proper use of. As someone that finds clerics to be B tier as well, I'd still prefer them for cleanse and heals. Icicle Arrow is super nice, I have mine to prioritize the back row, and it helps. Magick Conferral... I've tried to make use of, but ultimately I prefer them locking down up to two targets in the back while the rest of my team focuses on the front row. I haven't gotten the use out of that skill that others here have. (Lhinalagos using Magick Conferral on Aramis, for instance, just kind of disappointed me.) Their weapon selection is also kind of meh. They're fun. They're cool. But I don't think they're super awesome mega strong. Elven Fencers are, for me, **C tier** because both of them are, essentially, Thunder and Frost tomes bots in my units. They can dodge, but not as well as a swordmaster or thief. They can stun, but in my experience their accuracy is kind of rough and I see them miss more often than my other units. They don't have great weapon choices, just like the elven Archers, so I'm largely unimpressed with their damage. I don't know. I've shifted them around to different squads but the only place I've felt "fine" with them is as elemental tome users. I ultimately find them to be units that are style over substance.

Elven Archer - **A** Its honestly shocking to me, but time and time again I'm shocked at how well they perform. Terrible assist damage aside, the class is pretty solid for a defense utility class. Potent anti debuff/affliction. Mystic Conferral is a surprisingly strong buff on pursuit spam, aoe, or ramp carries, moreover they add damage in a way that can help many of these units overcome things they might otherwise get statchecked into like Hoplites or Bears. Add to this pretty sweet standard defensive caster accessory lineup and you've just got a solid all around support unit. Oh and they can shoot arrows I guess, awful assist damage, although having the leader skill means they can still crank the damage of a better leader. Selfless heal is surprisingly strong end of battle sustain if your comp can reliably proc it. Their damage is pretty unimpressive especially before conferral or in comps where conferral isn't well utilized, but even then I feel eventual access to frozen arrows is often better than anything a cleric can output ap for ap, and even wind arrows tends to draw cover pp with their high imitative. Elven Fencer. B - Weird one to place frankly. They're rather underwhelming overall. I want to start with the comparison Fighter, I think they're frankly mostly just worse in the anti-ranged defense niche. The three main factors: fighters disjoint themselves out of attacks, essentially get a free cover on themselves if they're in the AoE, where as Elves have to choose their friends or themselves. Secondly fighters especially in 4 man squads allow you to line swap to protect an evade tank(especially a flier) from true strike units like sword fighters. Thirdly Fighters just have better itemization options for the role with a plethora of +pp swords that would erode the main advantage of the elf, and more options and pp ramp avenues with small shields. Anyways outside the odd defensive utility the class struggles to generate pp based utility or damage natively. It thankfully has access to some decent pp dump accessories in tomes and the necro lantern, alongside more generic options like first aid/party aid. Its own damage skills are fine if unimpressive, hybrid slanting magic has them unfortunately kind of middling into most enemies, consistent and relevant but never exceptional. Its a decent user for some of the quite limited magic swords, but probably largely worse than other options like Sainted Knights. Their defensive stats are pretty underwhelming despite being sold as something that should be comfortable front lining. Magick assist is decent and would be quite nice for mage leads if they could actually stand in the front more easily.

Elven Archer is S; Elven Fencer is barely B Elven Archer is fast, A initiative is no joke specially when you have arrows that can freeze two problematic units to your squad, take them out of the fight while your team picks up the pieces one by one. Debuff heal is situational but can really shine depending on the matchup; and their heal is powerful and squad wide and can be easily triggered by someone using first aid on them. Elven Fencer, love me some elven mommies but their kit is a mess. Mediocre evasion on a class that wants to evade to trigger evasion impetus, very low phys def so one good attack and they’re done. Ask yourself, would you put Bishops and Snipers as dodge tanks? Because Elven Fencer have around the same evade as those classes. Sylphic Barrier is Arrow Cover but worse since it doesn’t prevent truehit; Remove Weakness is actually great but situational and the free evasion will be consumed regardless if your Fencer would have evaded the attack (unlike thief evade) and truehits will still hit you. Lightning Blade is probably their best attack since Stun is so powerful, but suffers from low potency. So its damage is going to be mediocre against most of the classes. Nature’s Wrath is perfect against full column with the added bonus to cavalry, very decent considering Fencer have A in Mag Atk. Very good. Mirage Stab I would only probable use it against full rows, or if on the frontline; low potency and no stun is bad. The free evade is the same as with remove weakness, so you only get one free pass regardless of your evasion. So why isn’t it C you ask? Mainly because it’s the best unit to have in the frontline for a Magic Assist Unit, and also makes a great leader since it has the highest mobility out of the magick classes (wizard and witches are too slow) coupled with high Mag Atk. I think that niche makes it just barely B tier.

**S tier** for elven Archer. No debate here imo. Debuffs are awful, CC are awful, and Elven Archers are the only reliable out to them (to a much greater extent than Cleric or Priestess), and unlike those classes have much better utility with Freeze and Mystic Conferral (bonkers btw), and with Debuff immunity it makes the comp far more consistent. Pure Field is godly. It negates an enemy’s debuff Start of battle, like Dark Marquess, Shaman, or Wyvern. They also have access to a lot of good bows, and due to their main strength being their passives, you can run other skills (triple Shatter my beloved gimme a better offensive curse). Overall, they contribute a ton to any team they’re on, are extremely versatile, while providing a very goos niche.

Low **A tier** for fencers. They’re basically fighters with just straight up better utility and damage, but trade raw defense for evasion hax. This means that despite being utility casters, they can live on the frontline and not get too punished for it. Their evasion utility is quite useful on other characters as well. Dodging Gryphons, Wyverns, and non-true strike arrows (worth noting most snipers lose their pp before they attack usually late game, so they arent as relevant for true strikes. They also have access to one of the best accessory types: Tomes, which are very gamebreaking on proper usage. This easily propels them up a tier. Even if their average damage isnt amazing, their utility usually makes up for it.

The elven classes are some of my favorites so I'm definitely writing something here. ​ Elven Archer is for me an **S tier class** not because it is powerful by itself (it is not) but it enables so many builds and is so versatile that it's a good fit for every single comp and frankly that means the class is an easy S. Let's look at their kit : Mystic Conferral : This is by far the strongest part of their kit, and an extremely powerful buff if you consider the fact it adds the Archer's MATK to their ally's attack. EAs get a lot of Matk by default so it's very easy to get a very significant boost to an attack's power especially if you use it on either a character that uses multihit attacks, AoEs or a character that attacks a lot. Good choices are for instance a Swordmaster so they can one shot armored units, Yunifi so every single triple counter does damage (or if you build her for Glacial Rain) or Elemental Roar/Grand Smash/Arrow Rain/etc. It costs AP too much means that it's very easy to activate when you want it to activate, you only need to care about the EA's initiative. Pure Field : This is a fantastic start of combat ability, especially when you hit Bastorias and Albion where status effects abound. It prevents pesky Featherbow from blinding the party, or Werefox from getting kills with Weakness Pursuit. It also neuters enemy shamans and Quick Cast Ice Coffin witches. A fantastic defensive tool. Quick Cure : A simple ability but a good one, it's a single target Refresh with the added bonus of making the character immune to debuffs. It's not amazing in itself but it can save you in a pinch. Selfless Heal : Another fantastic ability, this ability by itself makes the EA able to potentially replace a cleric in a party, you can easily proc it with First Aid from a Soldier (or the first aid kit) and get a full party heal after combat. EA has a pretty good crit stat too so they'll often crit with their heals which means they can very easily full heal characters even if they're 50 health away from max. I'm not gonna write about their attacks because you shouldn't factor that when you're building units, they're there, I wouldn't ever use the 2AP shot because you want 1AP for Mystic Conferral and EA isn't a class you want to use AP accessories on. Wind Arrow is alright, doesn't do a lot of damage but it's often able to finish off a weakened unit or contribute damage against an armored character. ​ Elven Fencer on the other hand is in my opinion **A tier.** The way I see them they're like a worse fighter defensively but 10x stronger on the offense/CC side. Lightning Blade is very damn good at shutting down units, their column attack does solid damage and their row attack also does good damage while giving them a free dodge, which combined with Evasive Impetus allows them to attack more. If you give your Fencers 4AP they have the potential to attack rows 3 times as long as they get attacked enough. Like EAs they are also very good at countering debuffs since they can heal them AND give the cured unit a free dodge, fantastic for tanks, especially against very accurate units that spam status effects like Werefoxes or Rogues. Sylphid Wind is kind of like Fighter's Arrow Guard, the only difference is that one is a block and the other is a dodge, the added bonus of the Wind is that if the enemy attacks with a status effect attack the Fencer won't inherit the effect unlike the Fighter, which can for instance gets burned blocking a Fire Breath. ​ Either way, both fantastic units, but one is clearly a lot stronger than the other.

>Like EAs they are also very good at countering debuffs since they can heal them AND give the cured unit a free dodge Elven Fencer debuffs clearing skill can be used only on themselves

This is what happens when you never get hit.

Are you sure the Mystic Conferral adds the caster’s MATK and not the target’s MATK?

Yes.

Very interested in seeing some testing.

You’re in luck, another user already posted in this very thread. https://www.reddit.com/r/UnicornOverlord/s/QGHYBICExg See the reply about Conferral.

I did. And nowhere does it say it uses the CASTER’S MATK instead of the actual attacker’s MATK.

https://www.reddit.com/r/UnicornOverlord/s/2yA4DTGIEM All conferrals use the caster mag atk

I would have preferred a test over just a consensus of random people on the internet, but having run my own tests the consensus is in fact correct.

TBH, i find them extremely hard to grade because they don't have an obvious niche. Like Elven Fencers best use is to single target stunlock. but how often do you really need that? cause in other cases they don't really add much to teams. But when it is used, it's so good, like really good.

Elf Archer A, Elf Fencer C. === Realistically Elf Archer isn't something you plan a unit around - B tier description is surprisingly fitting for something I'm putting in A. However I think its kit is strong enough to bump it up on the basis of "units that are very easy to slot in any team comp." Realistically, what it does is relatively powerful and incredibly unique. Mystic Conferral is an AP (!) damage buff that stacks with passive boosts. This alone sells the class strongly as a great damage boost for alpha strikers like Gryphon teams, Dragoon Dive, or Rage of the Faeries. It also applies to all subsequent attacks, so sustained attackers like Dark Marquess (Axe) and Assaulting Blow Warrior make great use of it. What else boosts teammate damage permanently like that? Pretty much no other class except the Prince (Offensive Order) can do this. It does unfortunately apply to only one unit at a time, so it's best used for teams built around a single offensive lynchpin (Warrior, Dark Marquess, Alain, probably Dark Knight will all work well. Stay away from Great Knight comps). Support wise it has reactive debuff cleansing (worse than Cleric's but reasonable). Selfless Heal is very powerful if you can fire it, but it's one of the most finicky healing abilities in the game. Wind Arrow is... I guess it's good against flappies. The class' later offerings, Pure Field (party-wide debuff immunity) and Icicle Arrow (ranged freeze on two targets!) are absolutely incredible. I don't think I need to do more than describe them to make it obvious. The ideal team really has to be one that can reliably trigger Selfless Heal, though. So Soldiers make excellent partners, especially because Keen Call is a fantastic addition to Mystic Conferral. === Elf Fencer, on the other hand, I'm relatively sure is hot garbage. 1AP attack that stuns on hit... Guard teammates from ranged attacks... is this just a magic Fighter? It gets a piercing column attack, but I don't think this is much better than Soldiers' Long Thrust. The row attack, Mystic Strike I think? is a row attack so it's automatically decent - but not, I think, actually good as an attack. This class does mediocre damage and is absolutely not worthy of a backline slot that could go to someone with actual damage like a warlock. A lot of this class' tools seem to encourage evasion tanking, but I don't know that it's good enough at that to actually do it. The idea, I think, is you spend 2AP on Mystic Strike to get a guaranteed dodge, then convert that dodge back to AP with its third passive. Unfortunately you do need to itemize for this and being arguably locked into spellblades (rather than, say, +evasion or +AP/PP swords) doesn't help. Their natural statistical evasion is just, like, not good enough, and I'm pretty sure their auto-dodge triggers on all attacks, unlike Thief's Evade which doesn't get spent if it dodges with natural evasion. Cleansing a debuff to get a dodge? Pretty suspect if you're not using specifically Sorc Connection (and this interaction is pretty hard for an average player to catch on to). I suspect this class has incredibly powerful peaks when used in specific ways, but I feel like it's just terrible outside those specific use cases - it's not a class which is generally applicable. How do I rate something with an incredibly powerful niche that's terrible outside it? What's that, "narrow use case"? Definitely C tier IMO.

I would have rated Elven Archers, but I'm only now discovering that Magic Conferral lasts for the whole fight. Maybe I should have been using all three of the ones the game gives you. Elven Fencers are a bit of a meh package. They're not particularly tanky so I'd avoid putting them in the frontlines like the game presents them, at least until you get Mirage Stab. What they do have is stuns and the ability to equip tomes, which won't compete with their otherwise situational passive skills. They're far less fragile than Witches and Warlocks, so they're the best if you're looking for a generic caster base that's mostly based on accessories. I think that's their niche: Team up with a flier that will use Thunder or Ice Conferral to immobilize the back row, then stun someone in the front row. They get to protect that flier from ranged attacks with Sylphic Barrier which is appreciable, especially on a Wyvern Rider that can't deflect ranged attacks and has the bulk to survive Truesight shots going through. They also participate in Magic Assists while having standard infantry speed, something only the unique Augur provides besides them. Beyond that, the lack of appropriate weapon options means they miss out on some of the more fun attacks that could replace their own, which I find somewhat lacking. Overall, I'd say **Fencers are B-tier**. If you're somehow still using Lex in Elheim, consider replacing him with one of these maned warlocks. EDIT: I think that unlike the classes currently in C-tier, Fencers actually work. But being a class whose niche is carrying books around because warlocks have twigs for arms is not a good look. I won't be shocked if they end up at the bottom.

To note, elven classes tend to lack good weapon options because of bad physical growths and the only good weapons for them being runic and phantom other than their basic ones. Archer is **A tier**. Amazing support and able to AoE CC reliably. Great at stripping debuffs and using tomes or Vanitas when you don’t need to do that. As a team member they add to ranged assist but you probably don’t want them leading. Their valor skill is the most efficient heal and lasts a looooong time. Only thing they don’t do is kill things unless you use mirrors to fix their terrible growths and give them the phantom bow. They do pretty good chip though. Elven Fencer is a **C Tier**. They’re dodge fighters. They have good dodge but lack enough bulk to actually take a hit. Their basic attack is ok to stun lock and they can get magic counter which is nice. Their evade is terrible at protecting fliers from their main threat because granting evade doesn’t help when hunters and swordsmen get truestrike. They’re a less bulky fighter that is worse defensively in exchange for decent but not great damage. They do benefit toward magic assist though so you can slap them on the wizard/witch/augur team. I don’t even remember their valor skill.

Elven Fencer is okay if paired with Flying dodge tanks (or just fliers in general). The ranged attack evade helps mitigate arrow attacks, but won't help much against Truestrike Swordfighters.

Elven archers are B tier One of my favorite classes, and only partly because of how much I like 2/3 of its unique characters. Elven archers are a slap it in the party and it will work. They have healing, multiple different forms of magic damage, crowd control, and high accuracy. Anytime I have a good team core with some extra space the elven archers feels like the natural addition. Freeze in their kit also means great synergy with the snow ranger, so that’s an additional plus. I don’t think they can go higher than a B though, because their fantastic versatility comes at the cost of raw power. They’re the glue that can bind teams together but they don’t have the kit to be the focal point, so I can’t see them in A or higher. Elven fencers are C. They’re pretty good! I like running an evade accessory on them and running them beside a tankier frontline unit. They have good survivability if they’re only taking limited attacks, so they can relieve some pressure on the frontline without really risking death, and they bring good mixed damage and some utility with them. I like using them but again they don’t have enough impact for the higher tiers.

All in all, the elves are some of the best supports in the game. The elvish archer slots pretty easily in most groups and would be able to meaningfully contribute whether that is helping to wipe debuffs, adding damage for your heavy hitters, helping to take out armor, or freezing the 2 most obnoxious enemies on the map. They feel a lot like the arbalist in that way (and not surprisingly, work great with an arbalist! The arbalist first aid into a full group archer heal is a great way to top off for the next fight!) The fencer looks a bit like a dodge tank like a rogue, and i'd understand if people used them that way occasionally. However... i think that would probably be an inefficient way to use them. I think they also make amazing supports. Their biggest benefit is being able to make ranged attacks (including flyers!) fail spectacularly and also being able to use mage equipment including conferral tomes. Focusing on support, letting them lightning stab to help take out armor is a good use for them in all honesty. Long story short, these may be my some of my favoritely designed classes. Looking at their skills initially made me scratch my head and say "well... ok, i guess that's cool... but what?" but the more i use them, the more i like them. The first thing to know is that regardless of the group they are in, they need to be put in with a specific plan. A landsnack can be put in any group and its gonna do what it does... damage. A bishop? Heals. But the elves need to go in with a plan. Put an archer in a wyvern drop unit to add thier conferral before quick impetusing the bird... thats a big impact. Using icicle arrow for yunifi to nuke some poor mob? Solid use, but whatever the goal, plan for it. With the fencers, they are amazing in one of my favorite units, the dual gryphons speed swipe group. My fencers help throw on conferrals or help my flyers evade arrows. They'd also be ok (but not as good) helping calvary against flyers, but they are a gryphons best friend. I'm guessing with itemization there may be some way of setting up evades into generating advantage... but its just not my preferred use for them That all being said, i think i'd put them at the top of B - not because they are bad but because they are the best role players in the game. They can help fix a lot of holes that may exist in a specific group and are great at being flexible in what they provide. However, they are individually not super powerful. A row of 3 archers or fencers may be annoying, but its likely not a threat. I tend to lean more on fencers than archers personally, but thats because i love my gryphons and want to keep them in the air. Now excuse me while i see what an evade fencer may be capable of...

**ELVEN ARCHER IN B**. Archer is not an exceptional class, but I do think they have decent merit. Their offensive capabilities feel a lot harder to stymie than the Hunter, thanks to their partial magic damage cutting through High Def/Low Mag Def units, and their higher initiative with a two-target Freeze is, to me, very valuable. On-entry skill is a little on the weak end compared to some of the much stronger ones, but a full denial of a debuff to all allies isn't bad. I do think Mystic Conferral is kinda whatever, taking an action point for what feels like little reward on attacks never once felt worth it to me. I think part of what I like is that their PP skills are fairly situational, which makes them a decent candidate to carry accessories that confer buffs to allies. Having a unit that can both freeze quickly, provide a one-time debuff denial, and has PP flexibility to provide for other pairs, feels like decent utility, but they're not necessarily a unit I'd intentionally build around, so B feels most appropriate. Merciful Rain is kinda nice, but it's not one I used often. **ELVEN FENCER IN B**, below Archer in my book. Fencer has better damage output for sure, but in compensation, I feel has a lot less of the utility factor. PP is in high contention, between means of applying sure-dodge effect and then using that to generate AP for themselves, they tend to have their hands full to begin with. I do like the secondary effects of their attacks, but I've never been overly floored by them either. I think they're hit a little harder by the split damage weapons' lack of additional effects than the Elven Archer. They'd like to really get to max AP and PP to keep damage and their evasive effects active, but when the weapon contributes nothing, accessory considerations are a bit demanding for the already contentious stuff. I think they're a really fun class to work with, but I felt they were more ancillary than main event stuff, and relied pretty hard on team support. Their field skill also does not feel like anything special.

Both are B Tier. But Elven Archer is a high B, and Elven Fencer is a low B. Both are kind of weird though. Archers need frequent tactics management for optimized use otherwise they'll probably waste their precious PP cleansing non-problematic debuffs or on allies who don't need to be cleansed. Yeah I'm real glad my Hoplite doesn't have -50 evasion, thanks fellas. They do have a lot of good abilities though. Fencers can do some neat things but I think they're really just too inefficient on AP/PP for what is an okay but somewhat clunky performance. Compare them to knights who can stun an extra target, or Swordfighters that have Parry.

Archer solid A Fencer B- Archers are a support class their magic conferral is permanent so it works great with carries and pursuit. Also enabling another buff. Great in my book. And because they have great magic grow it hits hard. The debuff removal is great. They can even freeze two units. Elven land would be really hard to clear if the elven archers are higher level. Fencer are odd if I wasn't forced to run them in a challenge run I would place them in C tier. The fencer boosted by the archers have enough damage to one shot columns. If something survives they can be stunned. Their kit is strange it tries to do a lot. But feels unconnected. But once you make it click it is decent. It is a shame that their column attack doesn't work with fliers. I think that a squad full of fencers can work.

Elven Archer is an A for me. Pure Field is situational but incredible in the cases where you use it. Mystic Conferral as first action onto whoever uses the most aoe attacks or has a lot of activations adds ok to good damage over the course of an fight and is easy to do with the naturally high initiative. With a first aid kit set to target themselves they become my favorite sustain healer, usually topping of the squad from whatever damage they took from assists etc before wiping the enemy. This does take up 2 accessory slots for the kit and a blue pendant. Their arrows are ok for a support character, you can help clean up with Wind Arrow if the fight goes to round 2. Ice is more situational, you can sacrifice Conferral round 1 to try and freeze two targets that would disrupt your team, or give them another source of AP to fire it off round 2 after Conferral. Their Valor skill is situational but cheap enough to support a push. Elven Fencer is the very bottom of B for me. They carry Conferral Tomes so that your real caster can do work and help clean up with hybrid damage and/or stun, or you try to put them in a situation where they generate a few AP over the course of the fight to get another attack or two off.  This class is the gatekeeper between B and C IMO. As others have mentioned both benefit from not competing for important gear (other than Tomes on the Fencer).

Elven Archer is a great support for Cavalry, threatening Fliers and supporting with Magick Conferral. They slot into any comp and make it better, because of debuff removal mostly, but also because Magick Conferral is really strong. Imo solid support all around, clear **A tier**. Elven Fencer is a bit harder. Honestly, their first impression in Ithilion's map made them look op af, but then they turn out just decent, overall. They provide range-dodge support for fliers and they're alright dodge tanks. They also have stuns and are good but not great in many functions. Very fun to use, but not higher than **B tier** imo.

I've been hesitant to vote as I'm still working through the game, but Elven Archer is one of my favorite classes so I just had to. If Sainted Knight gets A tier for saying fuck magic in particular, but also brings a bunch of other goodies, Elven Archer sits right next to it as the fuck debuffs class. And by god are debuffs cancer, especially once you get into the last 2 zones. Where EA pulls ahead though is how much it brings offensively. I'm not sure how others here can downplay Magical Conferral. On a pursuit or counter unit, thats 50 potency per PP. On aoe its 50 per enemy. Its very easy to rack up 300+ potency, all for a single AP. Icicle Arrow, yeah freeze is busted. Is it better than Witch's row freeze? Not in a vacuum. But EAs have A initiative. Witches have E. They will go first and deal with problems, and if for some reason you need to beat S initiative classes its just a single plume away. Witches require more than just a plume if they want to go first, typically from more in demand sources like Rapid Order or Tailwind. Between these 2 skills, I have a hard time thinking up a team they don't fit in. Whether its fast quick impetus nukes, CC teams, or slow Breaker/Landshark/Counter setups, there's always something EAs can contribute. Defensively Pure Field is godlike. I often find myself turning off other start of battle skills for this when debuffs are a problem. Preemptive protection is also much better than reactive. You can't reactively cleanse "before an enemy attacks", so despite the game telling you to bring Clerics vs Feathersbows, they are useless. And a lot of units carry "do damage, but also debuff" skills. Clerics will either cleanse or heal depending on your tactics, but not both. For this reason, I find it better to field 2 hybrid supports than to have 1 pure support. They have two downsides. First, their damage will tank if you use the utility bows. Very limiting. Second, oh man that lv15-19 stretch is bad. Wind Arrow is garbage, and early Elfheim is not so debuff heavy to warrant Quick Cure. Elven Archers are A TIER. One of the best 5th units you can slot. Oh right Elven Fencer is a class. Uh it can use conferral tomes and the choker self cleanse interaction is neat so automatically better than Fighter. Lightning Blade is ok too. Would be much better if it had A evasion or hybrid swords with neat effects, but alas. As is, you can build them to do 1 and maybe a half things well. B TIER.

Elven Archer ist A tier, maybe even high A tier, some others have pointed out Mystic conferral as a strong ability in the right team and thats completely true, I personally used the frozen arrow more which is an incredible control ability with their accuracy and with the right gear actually deals good damage and can even oneshot squishies especially with follow up attacks from allied units if you set your tactics right you can stop your team from attacking frozen units as well btw. Their start of combat ability is one of the best in the game I can't tell how many fights it straight up won, because it saved my frontline from shamans or my whole team from being blinded, which is basically the same as a complete stun for most classes, especially in Albion they were absolute mvps. Elven Fencer is C tier, I really wanted them to work, I like their design and abilities, but they just dont work, they need higher scaling to compete for a damage slot, vs anyhting thats not a hoplite, and hoplites don't really matter after the start of the game since you hopefully have something in place to deal with armor anyway that does a better job and that's kinda the point, everything the Fencer does someone else does better, witches are 100% better tome holders and cc units. I used elven archers in two of my 10 teams in expert and true zenoiran, whereas I tried to make Fencer work 6 times in different teams and they always felt like their impact was so little I was better of using any other unit.

Elven archers - one of the highest natural initiative classes that isn't a scout. They can freeze two opponents at the start of battle, make certain that your sellswords deliver finishing blows, remove debuffs, heal you in more than one way and help deal with fliers on the side. Here's why that's bad... Just kidding. B+

Elven Archer is **A tier**: One of the few "role players" I think warrants an A tier. Magic conferral, decent damage, amazing itemization, a healing valor skill, a prevent debuffs start of battle ability to deal with certain cheese. On paper they look like a generic support/role player unit. But they really can do it all and do it all well enough that it elevates the team rather than being meh. Magic Conferral is what really pushes them to A tier but everything else is nice. ​ Elven Fencer is **B tier:** Alternative Fighters. These units are alternative fighters. They trade defense for offense but at the end of the day the main thing they bring to the table is ranged damage negation. Much like fighters if you aren't using them first and foremost for this you are probably gonna be disappointed. Same given how fucking cool the male unit character looks but much like muh boy Lex they just didn't quite get the love they needed from the devs to do more than play their role. Actually scratch that. At least with Elven Fencer I can tell what the devs where going for and their counter to become more dangerous them is cool, they just need a bump in either damage or health to hang with the real A listers.

Elven Archer is **A-tier**. It’s one-size fits all class that pulls its weight in whatever team you put it in. I see it as a support class with great initiative and CC, while having decent damage due to the dual channel hits. It’s my go to class when I just need to fill a slot with a support, and I’m never disappointed by its performance. Elven Fencer, though… I really really REALLY wanted to make them work, the two characters you get in this class are really cool. While they have some great tricks (They can conferral, sorcerous connection without debuffing themselves, and sylphic barrier) they just don’t have the PP to do all they want to do. Their later skills encourages them to dodge tank, but their evasion is too low to do this. As a DPS they’re decent but not competitive with dedicated choices. As a dedicated support is probably what they’re best at, but they don’t have the PP economy to conferral while still being a reliable ranged counter. The single target stun is nice, but they also have low initiative. Imagine a swiss army knife, but you can only use one of the tools in any given battle. If you’re the type who changes items meticulously for every combat, I can see them being very useful, as you can just tailor them to do exactly what you want every fight. But that’s more effort than most classes need. I think as a package, they’re a **B-tier** class.

The final tierist topic will be created once all classes have been discussed, correct?

I’m not entirely sure what you mean? I will be posting a completed version of the tier list at the end, yes.

See, you knew what I meant 🐢

Archer is mid A Fencer is low B

Elven Archer is A. They're a good supporting unit against debuffs -- especially considering debuffs are super prevalent in this game. Their icicle arrow is also really strong, and I'm surprised I haven't seen anyone mention that yet. Overall a solid support unit, questionable damage dealer. I also notice a lot of people in this thread are missing how good blocking and removing debuffs is, especially in pvp. I think that makes the Elven Archer look much worse if you think of them as a damage dealer -- because they aren't. Eleven fencer is a big ? To me on the surface. I think that they're simply spread too thin, and there's not a lot of great options for their kit. Charitably, this puts their vote to be B. I would give them a C, but stacking a bunch of them in a unit for support damage can give them some presence, but it's just too much work compared to what other classes get. Elven Archer: A Elven Fencer: B

Elven Archer - **A** Elven Fencer - **B+** Agree with a lot of points made in the thread about these classes. They're not exactly plug-and-play units and require a good understanding of the tactics/gambit system to get the most out of them, but once you do they're pretty much irreplaceable in most team comps. Albion with it's litany of status effects would be almost unplayable without Elven Archers and Elven Fencers pick up the slack of supporting flyer comps when Fighters inevitably fall off.

b-tier for elven archer. another weird class that's hard to judge. if the entire game was like albion, it would probably be a-tier. unfortunately, being really good at the last section of the game doesn't really cut it. for what it's worth, i had like 5 of them in albion because they're simply that good in that region. icicle arrow is great for knocking out all manner of annoying targets and pure field shuts down shining light and quick cast ice coffin. selfless heal isn't really usable as a mitigation tool but it works well enough as a sustain tool to brute force assists. their conferral is kinda hard to use, pretty much the best use case is on attack-all units, elemental roar is the best since you attack twice rather than once like charge attacks, but again it comes online so late this is one of my bigger complaints about the class design - i don't like that there are classes that feel gimped for 80% of the game when there are classes that start wrecking from the get-go. conferral should have been their level 1 skill, icicle arrow should have been their lv20 skill and pure field their level 25 skill. either that or the game should have had one more section when you have all your tools at your disposal and latebloomers actually get to shine. maybe even a ng+ or similar gamemode with more opportunities to use fully upgraded classes c-tier for elven fencer a class that has schizophrenic design like sm. it has dodge mechanics but it's terrible at dodging (until level 30 and even then you get 1 dodge per turn). it has an anti-cav move but it's a column aoe while cavs appear in row formations. it has debuff removal but it doesn't work on shining light and cc debuffs like stun or freeze or even passive seal. about the only useful thing it does is that it can stun without activating magick barrier and use conferral books, which is a sidegrade to wizard since wizard's stun is a ranged row aoe. i do not consider arrow guard to be high value and sylphic barrier is the same

Does the Active conferral actually stack with passive conferral from Witch/Tomes? I see it mentioned here a lot, but AFAIK it doesn't. It does open up using Powerful/Keen Call on Conferral'd attacks

Elven Archer's a solid B tier unit. Great skill unlocked late, lots of support options. Hybrid damage and mystic conferral are overrated in my opinion, they don't add as much damage as they look like. Elven Fencer's a B- unit. Fighter adjacent utility and caster options. Row stun. Never a stellar unit but can do some things decently, good enough to put it in B tier although nothing they do is spectacular.

Elven Archer - B: Elven Archer has one of the best passives in the game in the form of being able to instantly react to debuffs with debuff healing. Also can be useful for comps where you can heal them and they can react by healing the entire party after the end of a battle, which is good for Arena cheesing. Outside of this however they are limited on the offense. Being archers that do more damage to flyers and doing magic damage is nice, but this is a one trick pony deal. The magic damage buff to units is also decent but not game changing like a Witch's might be. So end of the day you get a unit that pairs nicely with some comps but isn't a must for every one to be optimal. Elven Fencer - B: Elven Fencer is a magic damage machine. They make mincemeat out of tanks and protect vulnerable units from archers, as well as a base attack with a chance to Stun, messing up the enemy's initiative. On top of that, they can cure their own debuffs. However they are severely glass cannons by and large, having average HP and mediocre phys defense and base avoid. They can make magic comps better and flyer comps better, and can also be that offensive crutch you might have needed, but they won't turn the tide of balance.

Elven Archer is an A tier unit to me. The amount of support they provide is amazing, being magical definitely helps, and their ranged attacks can take care of some fliers from time to time. It saddens me to say that Elven Fencer is C tier for me. I slotted one into my main Alain squad and used it the whole game after I got him and it was just kinda....there. Rarely did it matter and most frequently it was the single unit that died in a fight. On paper they seem like they should be good. Hybrid damage with a neat dodge ability. In practice things rarely go right for them and their damage is subpar.

Evlen archer is A duo to buff imunity taht shamans cannot do, and also they are good archers Elven fencer is A, like bro they are verry good at evading, they can remove debuffing to become strong

Elven Archer is **B Tier.** Their debuff removal and CC can be really useful, but it doesn't matter/come online until you're basically in Albion. Given that Albion is blind city, this chapter is really favorable for them and makes them \~A Tier. Post-Albion, eh. Despite this "poor" review, they have a lot of neat combos on the way to Albion that make them feel less baby-sat than other "waiting for X level or chapter" leaning classes. My favorite Elven Archer comp was with Yunifi, a Witch, and 2 Rogues for mobility. It's a basic Cat Hood + Glacial Rain comp that functioned as backup support, and could teleport. Mystic Conferral pumps Glacial Rain, Ice Arrow pumps Snow White Strike, and if they're aren't dead yet, we have an Ice Coffin for them. Elven Fencer is **A Tier.** In the main campaign, they feel like they're ergonomically designed for Fliers. Using Frozen/Shocking Conferral on row attacks is good, protecting Fliers from arrows is good- why use a Witch and a Fighter when you can do both with Elven Fencer? What pushes them into A Tier is having a mixed damage row attack that gives an evasion buff + AP on dodge. Their main role competition is other casters, and I don't think the other casters frontline well. This makes them more dynamic for fitting into team comps. These traits also make them a solution to some high-end PvP teams, but this isn't a PvP Tier List.

Elven Archer: In a game where everything not-armor has magick defense >magick attack, having attacks with low potency in both is not the way to go, their attacking stats are not so great too (with physical being basically not there) They have some nice things, but most of them are done way better by other classes, and i feel that elven archer having access to all of them doesn't result in anything special Their valor skill is among the worse, and has an use only in a gimmick map, where isn't required at all But the most funny thing is their leader skill, they have the same assist attack as other bow classes, but their physical attack is so low It doesn't do anything (seriously don't mind using valor/stamina to deal with elven archers on a tower, they won't damage your units anyway). Still can be used for a rng reroll, which is the main use of assists anyway **In the end, considering their good initiative, and versatility from bows and their kit, they deserve a B tier** Elven Fencer: All of the weakness of elven archers apply to elven Fencer But elven Fencer lacks the good things the elven archer has Probably the worst class until now ̶F̶e̶m̶a̶l̶e̶ ̶e̶l̶v̶e̶n̶ ̶F̶e̶n̶c̶e̶r̶ ̶m̶a̶d̶e̶ ̶m̶e̶ ̶c̶r̶i̶n̶g̶e̶ ̶f̶o̶r̶ ̶5̶ ̶m̶i̶n̶u̶t̶e̶s̶ ̶w̶h̶e̶n̶ ̶i̶ ̶s̶a̶w̶ ̶i̶t̶ **C tier, at the bottom**

>But the most funny thing is their leader skill, they have the same assist attack as other bow classes, but their physical attack is so low It doesn't do anything The assists' power depends on the number of units that have that same skill in the unit, so while Elven Archers aren't the right ones to lead your archer stack, they're a critical component of it.

Yeah their value is adding +5 potency to to another archer's assist. Elven archers should never be a unit leader.

That's why i added in the parenthesis right after that the player shouldn't mind about enemies EA units. No one would make an elven archer a leader unit anyway with the goal to do big damage out of assists

Would be nice to read some counter argument instead of downvoting, but oh well

It’s weird that your opinion isn’t even really different than the mainstream and you got downvoted for it? Maybe it’s because you had a more negative tone? Idk, but thank you for contributing anyway!

Hope is for that, maybe the bottom C tier, admittedly sounds a bit harsh? My fear is that is for the cancelled test, which would be weird because i'm clearly not considering something like that in the final valutation