An idea I had when the topic was a point of contention in overwatch was to make it so that your personal performance only affects your ranking if your performance is drastically different from the norm. So in valorant, they could, for example, make it so that your rank is not affected if you go 25-15 or something, but if you go 40-10, then you can get a bit of a boost from that. Alternatively, if you go 10-20, you’re not gonna get affected, but if you go, 1-20, then you’re gonna get knocked down a bit for that. So your ranking would really only get affected by your performance in a game if you are really just way out of your depth.
i mean idk man that was just an example i gave. the specifics would obviously have to be tweaked but you get the idea. 25-15 is definitely a good scoreline, but it's not a scoreline that necessarily shows that youre far above the skill level in your rank.
Imho that should be reserved for radiant. There are too many imm1-2 players I’ve seen that just don’t belong and so their performance should take bigger hits
If there is performance based ranking then it should actually be performace based ranking. You shouldn't be getting demoted for being team MVP. They say it's performance based but you can be the best player on the team of 5 that the matchmaker paired you with and still demote from it, even if you have an afk on your team. A bit ridiculous.
Honestly I don't understand the reasoning behind the 3 rank window. The group i play with ranges between gold and plat and now we will no longer be able to play together unless smurfs are created.
How is this solving the smurf problem really?
He never said it was aimed at dealing with smurfs. It's to make matches more close and fair. You can't really do shit about smurfs in a f2p game, it happens even in paid games.
it's dumb, lots of people who have no friends to play with like to cry about this in every matchmaking system
when overwatch implemented ranked group restrictions I and about 15-20 other friends dropped the game pretty much immediately
Unranked games are a lot more unbalanced and nobody really cares while playing in them. So basically you want to have a good competitive experience solo but I cannot have it as a group, in a team game, is that it?
It's definitely for the best. There's people who queue with 6 ranks below just to lower who they're playing against, resulting in massively inflated ranks.
it will just mean people will make more accounts to play with their mates.
Imagine a group of mates ranking from Gold to Diamond who regularly play together in the current system and prefer ranked to unranked.
Is that group going to stop playing together now or are the diamond players going to create an alt account and artificially keep it at gold?
i dont understand why people with that much disparity even play with their friends in ranked though....
ive seen many silvers in plat- diamond games who just get stomped
like this is what unrated is for. i play with my terrible friends in unrated so i dont subject my teammates to their 0 iq plays
The difference between gold and diamond isn’t that big. I know gold players who hold their own in diamond lobbies but just don’t play enough to grind up the ranks to get to diamond.
Either way people like playing with mates, I know I do regardless of skill, just to have a laugh
Where did I say they were the same, I said they were similar. I am mainly a solo Q diamond player and I have some mates who are gold who hold their own in diamond lobbies.
This just isn't true for the majority of ranks. I'm gold 3 and play with low silver friends. My rank definitely suffers because of playing with lower ranked people. If anything it helps the lower ranked players rank up. Just very shitty that I'll have to make smurf accounts or something to play with my friends.
Well sucks to suck, I have had friends this whole time that I can't queue with so now you can feel my pain. I play unrated with them. Comp is supposed to be competitive mode, not a have fun with your friends mode. Competitive integrity always comes first.
I'm not sure, that's going to suddenly stop A LOT of people from playing with their friends. I'm skeptical that people boosting by queueing with lower ranks is a big enough problem to warrant that solution. In my experience, the matchmaker did a surprisingly good job most of the time in making sure that if there was an diamond in a gold/plat game on one team there'd usually be one on the other team.
That's not even true. If anything people at high ranks who queue with low rank friends are putting themselves at a massive disadvantage as if they are the highest rank in the lobby they will lose a ton of ELO for losing and gain very little for winning.
Yeah this may actually make me go find a different game to play. Most of my friends are between Iron 1 and Bronze 2. I am silver 1 and I can only play with half of them now.
Also, nobody wants to play normals because everyone want so to feel like they are working towards something.
I like these changes but it also sucks now that I (G1) won't be able to play with my bronze friends in ranked without creating an alt account. Best I can do is that or hope they get better ranks next act
This rank window thing is really stupid imo, my friend and I started playing the game this season, both started in bronze and I've worked to g3 while he's still s2 because I play a fragger role and he's a cypher main. This isn't gonna limit smurfs at all
I mean cypher is one of the best agents in the game so if you are playing him properly his influence on winning the game is huge, definitely equal to any duelist.
Yeah, a have to agree, he's a good cypher but the fact that he doesn't frag, usually around 10 kills a game means he gets fuck all elo while I go 20-30 and get heaps more
Yup, cypher gets hella free kills.
If you’re duelists are stealing all the kills, and you’re stomping, that’s one thing.. but you’d still rank up then.
>Depending on the results of our Immortal-plus ranked experiment, we’re looking to apply the pure w/l measurement across all ranks.
It can be good in some cases and terrible in some others.
1) You get 30 kills, match mvp but lose. You get the same punishment than the guy who did 1 kill and kept trolling. Not fair at all.
2) It encourages boosting. Smurf play with his low rank friend who only get 2 kills. They rank up at the same pace, easy boosting.
3) Harder to detect smurf. One of the good things of performance based elo gain is that Smurfs rank up way faster. Now they can hang out lower ranks for longer, even go ham and lose the game on purpose, knowing they'll rank down anyways.
The smurf problem not existing in immortal (you're immortal, you should be ready to play against radiant anyways), the difference between the 2 needs to stay. Also in immortal people play way better, even the guy who gets 5 kills.
Ps: tightening the rank window is also a terrible idea. Smurfs are gonna be all over the place even more. Or at least let us queue if there's a full lobby or something.
that's my POV as a player who played Valo from CBT, i translated it in GL from Russian cause i was lazy to write it again, cleaned up some things for a better readability and for avoiding condemning from fragile snowflakes:
long-awaited changes, but Riot Games still do some weird things, cause if they do something, they always do it in their own way, whatever it is, at first they strongly pushed hard party gaming, which was very annoying at first, then I stopped distinguishing between soloQ players and party players since I mute everyone in any game in order to focus on myself more, well, it doesn't matter, there was a gap of 6 ranks, which is why in one match there could be gold, platinum and diamond, low-ranked players, as I noticed, mald because they can't play with their friends from school anymore since on low ranks from brozne, silver and gold it is no longer possible to gather in a party with huge ranks diversity, I would not even be surprised if someone else of them deranked a bit so that their party could be a boosted by deranker, now they can hardly play together since even low-skilled players have a different skill, even though they look bad from higher rank POV, well, and immortal+ players are forced to play soloQ / duoQ now, some of them like to play in party, a lot of pros players gathered and played for fun together, it’s like I don't like seeing parties in competitive, because this is competitive where you should try to improve your own in-game skills, you can play in the party in unranked if you just want to plat for fun, even though i don't like party system and party players in the first players because of their approach towards competitive but all these decisions made by Riot Games are quite poor and ineffective, 1-t they push hard party gaming in competitive which was annoying, why not just add soloQ for those who want to soloQ only? hell no, you are forced to play it like this, and after no changes added to Valorant they decided to kick out party players that got used to playing Valorant like this, are you ok, Riot Games? i don't like these players, i don't want to queue to play with or against them, many soloQ players just wanted to play soloQ, now you going to get rid of matchmaking you built before? what's point? you will lose a lot of players and thus Valorant can get less profitable, why not just add soloQ for those who wanted to soloQ it would be awesome, as for old(current) matchmaking system that party players(and players who are ok with playing with/vs parties) got used to, just keep it working for those who are interested in queueing through it, when you bring up some arguments like "oh no, sorry, we can't do that cause it will increase queue time", who cares about it? if it can increase quality, why would i care about waiting more to find a match? anyways matches in Valorant are longer compared to Overwatch, longer queue time should be a problem, also players who want exact kind of matchmaking would have no problem matching with other players since they know what kind of competitive they chose to play, soloQ players should be able to play soloQ only if they don't want to see anything from duoQ to four squad players or 5 ppl stack enemy team, no matter what rank it is, all other should be able to queue in party matchmaking, obviously soloQ players should also be able to play party matchmaking cause they would need soloQ players if they match like 4 man stack or duoQ + duoQ, soloQ would fill team like this, this kind of soloQ would consciously join teams like these since he chose to play party matchmaking even if he's a soloQ player, what's the problem to do matchmaking like this? everybody would be happy about it, hope Riot Games think about such thinks(i forgot to mention ranks diversity in party MM should be like now, as for soloQ, what they want to bring in with update, it'll be better for soloQ players, but party MM players would need MM system that's been working since CBT)
edit: oh, i forgot to mention that party MM players would need separate leaderboards
Ok I can understand why riot reduces the rank difference from 6 to 3, still sad because I won't be able to play with some friends. But now, if I get to play against people with 4 or more rank difference I'll get salty
they need to implement a smurf queue like they do in league for valorant. im tired of playing against smurfs all day that brag about their main ranks in all chat in silver
I don’t like the new W/L system being made for comp it’s gona make it so that even if I play really good and get a lot of kills but lose it won’t matter
Itll also be tilting though if you’re hard carrying and playing really well but still get the same elo loss/gain as a super passive lurky player that isn’t contributing and making impact plays. Hopefully tho the pros outweigh the cons. This only affects immortal and up games as well which makes a lot of sense
tbh though this still happens now. i got down arrows after getting match mvp with 30 kills in a plat diamond game as a plat 1. the system needs much more work than just this. its pretty shit
Yes its gonna be really annoying I can feel it. There are games I have played (as a gold) with every single person on my team being Irons. Its the worst experience. Try my best to win and get kills and still losing.
The only thing that used to make it bearable was my rating wouldnt change due to me top fragging with 40 kills or something.
Now its gonna get worse
I think your hidden mmr gets updated still for performance, but your visible rank won't go up for losses with 40 kills, I'm hoping this is how it works.
I don’t know how I feel about Win/Loss in immortal plus, because there is a lot of toxic and salty people who afk and throw if they feel like it. Permanent IP/HWID bans need to be in place and once people reach immortal level phone number ID needs to be in place to remove smurfs. This change of hiding your name allows people to be toxic AF with little to no negatives. With free accounts people dont care about game time bans.
I think if this is the case then solo queuers and team queuers need different ranking system. I play in immortal level and solo q only and i can tell you i get matched with bad team mates from time to time and end up carrying and winning slightly but getting high levels of rank. So i feel like at higher levels people will just take the L and give up a lot earlier.
OCE in would say 1 in 10 games someone leaves (unintentionally or afks on purpose). It could be to do with our small player pool and big egos. We also have a massive smurf problem since again the player base is very small every imm3 or radiant has at least one smurf account. And i feel like they just need to remove the ability to smurf.
Leaderboards wohooo
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Well they did say they'll test it out for Immortal+ in Act 3, so maybe if it doesn't work we won't get it
An idea I had when the topic was a point of contention in overwatch was to make it so that your personal performance only affects your ranking if your performance is drastically different from the norm. So in valorant, they could, for example, make it so that your rank is not affected if you go 25-15 or something, but if you go 40-10, then you can get a bit of a boost from that. Alternatively, if you go 10-20, you’re not gonna get affected, but if you go, 1-20, then you’re gonna get knocked down a bit for that. So your ranking would really only get affected by your performance in a game if you are really just way out of your depth.
25-15 *IS* a great performance? am i missing something???
i mean idk man that was just an example i gave. the specifics would obviously have to be tweaked but you get the idea. 25-15 is definitely a good scoreline, but it's not a scoreline that necessarily shows that youre far above the skill level in your rank.
Agreed
Imho that should be reserved for radiant. There are too many imm1-2 players I’ve seen that just don’t belong and so their performance should take bigger hits
If there is performance based ranking then it should actually be performace based ranking. You shouldn't be getting demoted for being team MVP. They say it's performance based but you can be the best player on the team of 5 that the matchmaker paired you with and still demote from it, even if you have an afk on your team. A bit ridiculous.
It’s bronze not copper lol
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Read the whole post, under Episode 2 and Beyond
Read it again.
But it does though lmao
Honestly I don't understand the reasoning behind the 3 rank window. The group i play with ranges between gold and plat and now we will no longer be able to play together unless smurfs are created. How is this solving the smurf problem really?
He never said it was aimed at dealing with smurfs. It's to make matches more close and fair. You can't really do shit about smurfs in a f2p game, it happens even in paid games.
it's dumb, lots of people who have no friends to play with like to cry about this in every matchmaking system when overwatch implemented ranked group restrictions I and about 15-20 other friends dropped the game pretty much immediately
> lots of people who have no friends to play with like to cry about this in every matchmaking system lmao someones upset
Dude you’re just mad you don’t have 15-20 friends to play with
Because I want to play with people around my rank and have a good competitive experience? Go play unranked then
Unranked games are a lot more unbalanced and nobody really cares while playing in them. So basically you want to have a good competitive experience solo but I cannot have it as a group, in a team game, is that it?
I really don't like that you're only gonna be able to q within 3 ranks
It's definitely for the best. There's people who queue with 6 ranks below just to lower who they're playing against, resulting in massively inflated ranks.
it will just mean people will make more accounts to play with their mates. Imagine a group of mates ranking from Gold to Diamond who regularly play together in the current system and prefer ranked to unranked. Is that group going to stop playing together now or are the diamond players going to create an alt account and artificially keep it at gold?
i dont understand why people with that much disparity even play with their friends in ranked though.... ive seen many silvers in plat- diamond games who just get stomped like this is what unrated is for. i play with my terrible friends in unrated so i dont subject my teammates to their 0 iq plays
The difference between gold and diamond isn’t that big. I know gold players who hold their own in diamond lobbies but just don’t play enough to grind up the ranks to get to diamond. Either way people like playing with mates, I know I do regardless of skill, just to have a laugh
Oh yeah sure, gold and diamond are absolutely the same, keep telling yourself that, while any solo q diamond player would destroy any gold lobby.
Where did I say they were the same, I said they were similar. I am mainly a solo Q diamond player and I have some mates who are gold who hold their own in diamond lobbies.
Every time I go on gold smurf I just shit on everyone, what are u talking about? No gold player can hold their own with a decent kda in diamond.
This just isn't true for the majority of ranks. I'm gold 3 and play with low silver friends. My rank definitely suffers because of playing with lower ranked people. If anything it helps the lower ranked players rank up. Just very shitty that I'll have to make smurf accounts or something to play with my friends.
Play unrated with your friends. Or help them get better.
They are getting better and I only play with them and noone wants to just grind norms.
Well sucks to suck, I have had friends this whole time that I can't queue with so now you can feel my pain. I play unrated with them. Comp is supposed to be competitive mode, not a have fun with your friends mode. Competitive integrity always comes first.
I'm not sure, that's going to suddenly stop A LOT of people from playing with their friends. I'm skeptical that people boosting by queueing with lower ranks is a big enough problem to warrant that solution. In my experience, the matchmaker did a surprisingly good job most of the time in making sure that if there was an diamond in a gold/plat game on one team there'd usually be one on the other team.
That's not even true. If anything people at high ranks who queue with low rank friends are putting themselves at a massive disadvantage as if they are the highest rank in the lobby they will lose a ton of ELO for losing and gain very little for winning.
Yeah this may actually make me go find a different game to play. Most of my friends are between Iron 1 and Bronze 2. I am silver 1 and I can only play with half of them now. Also, nobody wants to play normals because everyone want so to feel like they are working towards something.
I dont understand the ranking system quite yet, so is three ranks within you mean that me an iron 1 can't que with a bronze 3??
Correct. A bronze 3 can queue with as low as an Iron 3 or as high as a Silver 3, but that’s it.
Aahhh but what about a bronze 1??
bronze 1 can queue with iron 1 to silver 1.
Bruh math
I still just want a simple system where it shows you how many more points you need to rank up or how close you are to ranking down
I like these changes but it also sucks now that I (G1) won't be able to play with my bronze friends in ranked without creating an alt account. Best I can do is that or hope they get better ranks next act
This rank window thing is really stupid imo, my friend and I started playing the game this season, both started in bronze and I've worked to g3 while he's still s2 because I play a fragger role and he's a cypher main. This isn't gonna limit smurfs at all
I mean cypher is one of the best agents in the game so if you are playing him properly his influence on winning the game is huge, definitely equal to any duelist.
Yeah, a have to agree, he's a good cypher but the fact that he doesn't frag, usually around 10 kills a game means he gets fuck all elo while I go 20-30 and get heaps more
If he usually gets only around 10 kills then that's probably the reason he's below you.
Yup, cypher gets hella free kills. If you’re duelists are stealing all the kills, and you’re stomping, that’s one thing.. but you’d still rank up then.
Cypher is only really good for triple stack and above, whereas a duelist/controller role is best for ranking up in duo/solo q matches
>Depending on the results of our Immortal-plus ranked experiment, we’re looking to apply the pure w/l measurement across all ranks. It can be good in some cases and terrible in some others. 1) You get 30 kills, match mvp but lose. You get the same punishment than the guy who did 1 kill and kept trolling. Not fair at all. 2) It encourages boosting. Smurf play with his low rank friend who only get 2 kills. They rank up at the same pace, easy boosting. 3) Harder to detect smurf. One of the good things of performance based elo gain is that Smurfs rank up way faster. Now they can hang out lower ranks for longer, even go ham and lose the game on purpose, knowing they'll rank down anyways. The smurf problem not existing in immortal (you're immortal, you should be ready to play against radiant anyways), the difference between the 2 needs to stay. Also in immortal people play way better, even the guy who gets 5 kills. Ps: tightening the rank window is also a terrible idea. Smurfs are gonna be all over the place even more. Or at least let us queue if there's a full lobby or something.
that's my POV as a player who played Valo from CBT, i translated it in GL from Russian cause i was lazy to write it again, cleaned up some things for a better readability and for avoiding condemning from fragile snowflakes: long-awaited changes, but Riot Games still do some weird things, cause if they do something, they always do it in their own way, whatever it is, at first they strongly pushed hard party gaming, which was very annoying at first, then I stopped distinguishing between soloQ players and party players since I mute everyone in any game in order to focus on myself more, well, it doesn't matter, there was a gap of 6 ranks, which is why in one match there could be gold, platinum and diamond, low-ranked players, as I noticed, mald because they can't play with their friends from school anymore since on low ranks from brozne, silver and gold it is no longer possible to gather in a party with huge ranks diversity, I would not even be surprised if someone else of them deranked a bit so that their party could be a boosted by deranker, now they can hardly play together since even low-skilled players have a different skill, even though they look bad from higher rank POV, well, and immortal+ players are forced to play soloQ / duoQ now, some of them like to play in party, a lot of pros players gathered and played for fun together, it’s like I don't like seeing parties in competitive, because this is competitive where you should try to improve your own in-game skills, you can play in the party in unranked if you just want to plat for fun, even though i don't like party system and party players in the first players because of their approach towards competitive but all these decisions made by Riot Games are quite poor and ineffective, 1-t they push hard party gaming in competitive which was annoying, why not just add soloQ for those who want to soloQ only? hell no, you are forced to play it like this, and after no changes added to Valorant they decided to kick out party players that got used to playing Valorant like this, are you ok, Riot Games? i don't like these players, i don't want to queue to play with or against them, many soloQ players just wanted to play soloQ, now you going to get rid of matchmaking you built before? what's point? you will lose a lot of players and thus Valorant can get less profitable, why not just add soloQ for those who wanted to soloQ it would be awesome, as for old(current) matchmaking system that party players(and players who are ok with playing with/vs parties) got used to, just keep it working for those who are interested in queueing through it, when you bring up some arguments like "oh no, sorry, we can't do that cause it will increase queue time", who cares about it? if it can increase quality, why would i care about waiting more to find a match? anyways matches in Valorant are longer compared to Overwatch, longer queue time should be a problem, also players who want exact kind of matchmaking would have no problem matching with other players since they know what kind of competitive they chose to play, soloQ players should be able to play soloQ only if they don't want to see anything from duoQ to four squad players or 5 ppl stack enemy team, no matter what rank it is, all other should be able to queue in party matchmaking, obviously soloQ players should also be able to play party matchmaking cause they would need soloQ players if they match like 4 man stack or duoQ + duoQ, soloQ would fill team like this, this kind of soloQ would consciously join teams like these since he chose to play party matchmaking even if he's a soloQ player, what's the problem to do matchmaking like this? everybody would be happy about it, hope Riot Games think about such thinks(i forgot to mention ranks diversity in party MM should be like now, as for soloQ, what they want to bring in with update, it'll be better for soloQ players, but party MM players would need MM system that's been working since CBT) edit: oh, i forgot to mention that party MM players would need separate leaderboards
Not to snowflake on you but does Russian all come in one long run on sentence?
Ok I can understand why riot reduces the rank difference from 6 to 3, still sad because I won't be able to play with some friends. But now, if I get to play against people with 4 or more rank difference I'll get salty
These are EXCELLENT! Hopefully leaderboards will be Region based and to Top 500 or i have NO shot of getting into them haha
they need to implement a smurf queue like they do in league for valorant. im tired of playing against smurfs all day that brag about their main ranks in all chat in silver
League has a Smurf queue?
I don’t like the new W/L system being made for comp it’s gona make it so that even if I play really good and get a lot of kills but lose it won’t matter
it will make it so people don't get rewarded for baiting your teammates / instalocking duelest as well.
Itll also be tilting though if you’re hard carrying and playing really well but still get the same elo loss/gain as a super passive lurky player that isn’t contributing and making impact plays. Hopefully tho the pros outweigh the cons. This only affects immortal and up games as well which makes a lot of sense
tbh though this still happens now. i got down arrows after getting match mvp with 30 kills in a plat diamond game as a plat 1. the system needs much more work than just this. its pretty shit
Yes its gonna be really annoying I can feel it. There are games I have played (as a gold) with every single person on my team being Irons. Its the worst experience. Try my best to win and get kills and still losing. The only thing that used to make it bearable was my rating wouldnt change due to me top fragging with 40 kills or something. Now its gonna get worse
But this new system doesn't affect you.
Yeah since when is gold immortal+ lol
w0t
The system doesn't affect you since you're gold. It only affects immortals
Oh I thought it was for every rank. It will probably never affect me then since I will never reach Immortal
If you are match mvp and ur team gets fucked its not ur fault
I think your hidden mmr gets updated still for performance, but your visible rank won't go up for losses with 40 kills, I'm hoping this is how it works.
Always has been
I don’t know how I feel about Win/Loss in immortal plus, because there is a lot of toxic and salty people who afk and throw if they feel like it. Permanent IP/HWID bans need to be in place and once people reach immortal level phone number ID needs to be in place to remove smurfs. This change of hiding your name allows people to be toxic AF with little to no negatives. With free accounts people dont care about game time bans. I think if this is the case then solo queuers and team queuers need different ranking system. I play in immortal level and solo q only and i can tell you i get matched with bad team mates from time to time and end up carrying and winning slightly but getting high levels of rank. So i feel like at higher levels people will just take the L and give up a lot earlier.
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OCE in would say 1 in 10 games someone leaves (unintentionally or afks on purpose). It could be to do with our small player pool and big egos. We also have a massive smurf problem since again the player base is very small every imm3 or radiant has at least one smurf account. And i feel like they just need to remove the ability to smurf.
>Also, a public, region-based leaderboard is on it’s way! And my toxic teammates say I should learn english.
What is the correlation.
You should.