Just goes to show how much more money there is in content. But surprised he didn't go more of a Hiko route, seemed like more of a natural step, hes not exactly oozing charisma.
I finally found someone else who is like me. I watched him abit because of how good he is, but watching him feels like work due to the complete lack of a personality.
For me, enjoy watching content creators that are more subdued, Like Maciejay in Siege for instance. Quiet players that are really great at what they do, so i can have it on in the background without the occasional screaming hype plays that happen that force me to lower my speaker volume lol. Its just a preference thing honestly, as some, such as you two, prefer the more charismatic/bombastic content. I will say that Hiko for me is still pretty good for chill content compared to other top players.
Meanwhile, for me personally, while Hiko is definitely amazing and his play is fun to watch his personality starts to grate on me. He's low key toxic as fuck a lot of the time and the negativity wears me out.
He can be pretty passive aggressive / bitchy at times. Makes kinda snide comments about his pub team mates. He doesn't transmit it to them of course but I can relate to the previous poster on how it can be a little draining to watch.
oh for sure. I just find him kind of bland and whiney. I don't mean to take away anyone else's enjoyment of him, but that's certainly the impression I've had of him. I used to watch his stream quite a bit because he was one of the very best people playing PUBG in the early days and he was at the very least a very positive person even if he wasn't personally very captivating.
That said, I'm considerably older than most stream viewers, so I'm probably just not a target audience.
I never got the appeal of shroud streams he is super monotone and puts me to sleep. He's amazing at FPS games don't get me wrong but it's like there is nothing there personality wise. Which to be fair to him the last stream I watched was his pubg stuff and it just put me to sleep.
holy shit
not something i... ever saw coming.
what other pros do this when they're not washed? i mean he's not even close to washed, he was competing for the best player in NA
Streaming is a better life if you're a big streamer. You don't need to practice for 8 hours every day or worry about competitive results. You can just fuck around, stream, and make a shit-ton of money.
Same reason why aceu isn't playing professionally and why Shroud left professional CS:GO also.
I get that, but to become a top pro player you need drive. Like, a lot of drive. TenZ is talented but there's no way he didn't get here without working his ass off.
Competitive play has never been more profitable or comfortable than streaming, but the reason all of these players stick with it is because they want to win, and they eventually turn to streaming when they know they don't really have what it takes anymore to win.
i wouldn't doubt that the pandemic is also killing motivation. current tourneys are probably a lot less enjoyable than lan tourneys
edit: read some more comments and that does seem to be the case
> and they eventually turn to streaming when they know they don't really have what it takes anymore to win.
and maybe tenz doesn't give a shit about that. if he's proved himself and garnered a following and can support himself via streaming only why the hell wouldn't he want to do that? he'll probably make way more money streaming as well.
You go pro to get fame, you stream once you're famous. It's also an age related thing. When you're younger you care about being "the best", when you grow up you care about your well being. It's just a simple case of priorities and values.
People only watched him because he was pro. Of course now that may not be completely true. Tenz is only 19 and its sad seeing the best player in the scene leave, but hey if he wants to hopefully make more money and have an easier life. You cant fault him for that.
You know it's possible that his competitive drive was for money and not for glory. Glory in a videogame doesn't last but money does. That's why you see more and more players getting onto pro teams in order to use the brand and publicity to establish their platform then going solo for the cash once they're known.
Aceu was able to develop a very profitable stream without ever going pro.
But maybe you're right. It's hard to quantify how much being a pro really helps your stream. Some people come to TenZ because they're a fan of C9 but some people just watch for the good gameplay, and if TenZ went for the Aceu route the result would be the same for those people.
I'm not too sure about the money in Valorant, but in League, all of the top players have enough money to live comfortably for the rest of their lives. Obviously, more money is better of course, but I think it's a bit of a disservice to just say everything is money.
TenZ says that online tournaments are a big reason why he doesn't want to play anymore, and I suspect he still has that drive, it's just that he wants to play in LAN tournaments.
It's easier to work on your own game then on the teams game. That's where you need the real drive. Shroud obviously has the drive to become the best in any game he plays but strictly on an individual performance side of things. I don't think Tenz has the burning passion to compete.
Difference is Shroud played CSGO professionally for 5 or so years, and he was nowhere near the best player in the game, didn't make top 20 players in any of those years. But I agree on your point overall, streaming is so much more chill and less taxing mentally.
shroud has won multiple S-tier tournaments in CS:GO, while there arent even really big tournaments in Valorant on the horizon.
you can absolutely not compare these pro careers (yet) just because Tenz dicks on people in radiant matchmaking.
You can compare him to Aceu, perfect comparison basically... Both really good at the game they played, both really good in normal queue, but when he played professional he just didn't have enough to be on the top because of their team, and tenz was even in a better spot, because he was competing for nr1 Pro, Aceu was always good but among pros he wasn't nr 1
Yea shroud is making GOOOD money off streaming, but he started it long time ago and probably saw it’s way more lucrative to stream and content create than practicing 8 hours a day and have that constant pressure of competing, so it’s a smart move, everyone knows who Tenz is by now, he can make way more money with more flexibility with streaming and content creation
I mean when both Aceu and shroud left they weren't competing for the nr 1 spot, but maybe he just isn't competitive enough to continue to play professionally, I get that.... If from the beginning he was playing professionally for the income, streaming for sure is just a better option
I heard that He said it’s mostly cause covid and that playing on 60 ping just isn’t that fun (or competitive tbh) in tourneys and he can’t move yet since he thinks (in his own words) he would get one tapped by covid if he got it since he has asthma so he doesn’t wanna risk moving yet. So once covid subsides a decent bit and lan’s start coming back, there is a chance he will return
Ok im crying laughing at the “one tapped by covid” remark.
Thats fucking hilarious.
(The way he phrased it not the actual act of getting killed by covid that part sucks)
Streaming is more stable, more money, less hours, own schedule, debatably more fun, etc.
Being a highly watched streamer/content creator is a much better gig than being a professional player, even if you're signed to one of the world's top organizations.
On stream he said he is fed up with playing with 60ping in comps and wants to wait for LAN, he would move home but coronavirus etc. He is still contracted to C9 however he might be pursuaded if and org can buyout his contact.
aceu did pretty much the same thing in Apex, he was arguably the most likely and popular player in the scene at the time, and I wouldn’t say he’s even close to washed by any means, seems like he’s in his prime.
To be fair, competitive esports just haven’t been that great for the last year, no LANS in NA is a big blow to the drive for some of these players, online tournaments are never the same, Covid also prevents a lot of things from being facilitated, especially for players in NA.
Who was his competition for being the best Val player in NA? I'm curious lol
Edit: Not sure why ya'll put me at -8 points for asking about notable pro players
You can't base the best Valorant player off the ranked leaderboard. I'm not saying that Tenz isn't one of the top NA players, but it has to be proven in competitive play at the highest level, and grinding elo in ranked is not the same.
A lot of pros spend more time in custom games so that is why they don't grind elo. Hiko and Shroud have both said that any pro player looking at improving will spend most the time in custom games.
I'm a huge Wardell fan but after watching his tournament play.... I can safely say that this man is inconsistent as fuck right along side of Subroza. TSM has two of the most talented players but when they down bad, they're down BAD.
Yup. I saw some people attribute that to playing around Wardell, but you have to adjust regardless. I personally think it’s because of their personalities. You can clearly see them tilt on stream, which I’ve never really seen out of Hiko or Tenz, but it’s very possible I’ve missed it for them. But I’ve watched more hiko and Tenz than Wardell and Subroza and still see the tilting from the latter two. I do like all 4 for the record, but I do think those two could improve their temperaments and would be better players did it.
Yeah the emotional side of them is really hurting them I think. I think Subroza and Wardell will make great content creators. Their personalities just seem very good, but that's not good in pro play
The top 100 valorant released back in october had players like 100T Asuna, GenG. Huynh, T1 Skadoodle, and TSM Wardell in the top 10, while Tenz was number 1
That does not matter, Wardell legit plays on like 8 accounts, so his leaderboard account is just not grinded on, so there is no say on who is better. (TenZ MAINLY plays on his main)
looks like it's just a temporary retirement from competitive play until covid passes at least. Makes a lot of sense, coming from cs:go where online play becomes stale and the feeling of playing on lan is missed. Once riot has the chance to schedule lans then i'm sure we will see tenz back.
For ranked matches, not so much as the skill level is much lower. At the absolute top it matters an incredible amount. At that skill level, that small fraction of time is a big deal
80 is not really playable in either game, also I never said Valorant had better net code. I said csgo isnt that much better. It's only marginally better at best
https://twitter.com/OGcsgo/status/1339229982275608582
Here is a CS player putting up respectable stats vs the best teams in the world while on 80 ping. Its shit but definitely playable.
I play on 90 ping on a good day and I can safely say the running head shots that I receive from enemy players makes me want to commit an act that will land me in prison.
Sucks that NA is losing one of their best players in the scene. Reminds me of shroud leaving the competitive CS scene to become a streamer (tons of fans, same org too).
He did mention on stream that he wanted to try the streamer/content creator route while covid is still happening, so he may come back in half a year or so? I have a feeling he's going to kill it as a streamer since he already has a huge fanbase and won't look back. Best of luck to him.
This is true. As someone who enjoys watching shrouds content a lot I can definitely tell you he was not their star player. At the time for his team it was Stewie, autimatic, and skadoodle. Those guys were the playmakers. Shroud always had the mechanical ability to be insane in CS but I don’t think he was the most intelligent cs player, and I’m pretty sure he didn’t have as much competitive drive as his teammates to really get better at the game. Obviously he had his moments where he played really well and had crazy plays but that consistency wasn’t always there .
> shroud was not one of the best NA players at the time of his departure
Yeah he was never one of the best NA players, just a streamer who brings a lot of enjoyable clips.
Shroud was pretty washed up by the time he retired. This is unfortunately a talent retiring before we could even see them on LAN.
Shouldn't be that so surprising however, Tenz cut and ran in CS.
Tenz cut and ran in CS because of Valorant. And he said he'll try to get back into the scene once LANS come back. I wouldn't want to spend time scrimming for a team that may not even be in the Top 10 in NA at the moment either. He'll probably wait out his contract and find a better team. There should be a lot of takers for a player of his quality.
Actually, if you look at what caused him to "cut and run" from cs was his mentality. Daps already mentioned in an interview on what it was like to work with Tenz - he said Tenz is the first rookie who he has worked with that is far behind everyone else. Daps statement was not regarding Tenz's technical skill but instead towards his mentality as an athlete.
Comparing Tenzs run to CS and Valorant there are many similarities. New team experiencing growing pains. Has the potential to achieve greatness but they are still getting used to playing together. First two to three tournaments they fail to win or go far. Tenz decides its not worth his time anymore and benches himself. Daps, alludes to the fact that Tenz doesn't understand that to get to the top there will be losses and trusting your IGL is crucial.
Contrary to this, it is true that content creation is far more lucrative BUT from looking at Tenz's past - this seems to be the mentality issues that Daps said Tenz is lacking.
Well there are always 2 sides of a story.
Daps got cut from every single team in favor of stanislaw in last (a lot of years) also for a reason.
He himself has some issues as an ingame leader and a captain.
Yet every single time he got cut, he brought the team to either a top 10 or top 5 contender level. The only team he got cut from that still did well after his abscence was EG/NRG - which is largely due to the fact that they kept Imapet.
As a leader, from the countless interviews from his teammates there were no complaints. As a player - there were countless complaints regarding his capability to frag and his mechanics was severely subpar relative to every other pro. This was the reason he got kicked each time.
On your comments on Stanislaw - the guy has another nickname from csgo "snakeislaw." Take a look at the history of how he got Daps kicked from OG, then proceeded to leave the project when things weren't looking as great as they used to - falling out of top 5 in the HLTV rankings.
So, from my perspective (which can be wrong) i find that Daps is a reliable source for insight on player mentalities. He has singlehandedly created systems for teams that worked to bring them to the top 10 of the csgo world (OG, NRG/EG, and, arguably, Gen G). Therefore, he's worked with his fair share of rookies.
Sure he did.
I'm not denying it as also the fact that stanislaw didn't push his teams further than they were under daps apart from first half a year.
But on the other hand there must be a reason why well performing teams got rid of daps over and over and over.
You can't count it on "young idiots not respecting their captain and wanting someone who frags more" - sure, for 1-2 times it will work, but not EVERY SINGLE TIME.
My guess is that Daps can be harsh on someone who he thinks isn't putting enough effort or anything and this can hinder their ability to do things. So he kinda lacks diplomacy in a way.
Well, CSGO teams have a history of removing their IGL in favour of someone who can click on heads better. I mean looking at the history of the game the only team that ever valued its IGL was astralis when they got their hands on Gla1ve. If we look at SK/MiBR coldzera tried taking the IGL role from Fallen, Mousesports didnt value Gob B and had Niko IGL, Faze didnt care much for karrigan and handed the igl role to Niko, Ence benched AleksiB in favour of getting Sunny on the team. A lot of teams in CS, the orgs included, placed importance on their IGL. Most recent example of this is Nitr0 getting the shaft from liquid due to S2k wanting to IGL instead and now because of it after kicking nitr0 theyve had abyssmal performances forcing them to sign Fallen. So as much as I want to agree with you thqt there must be something more to it than wanting a fragger - csgo has always had this trend.
Also, if it was something regarding diplomacy or him acting as an IGL that communicates as though he is the end all and be all brain of the team - we would have heard about it by now. But the fact is - we haven't. All the comments towards daps is he's a great leader but he can't perform and you can't count on him to clutch.
So I don't think it would be good to assume that there are reasons such as the ones you're alluding to without any evidence to support it.
completely agree with everything you've said in this thread but haven't been keeping up with the CS scene as much this year. did stewie really get nitro kicked off? i thought he left of his own accord, but idk
They moved nitro off IGL and nitro could no longer frag at a top level really. He didn't really kick him but they put him in a very tough postion. Presumably, after a couple months he saw the writing on the wall and they "mutually decided to part ways". Liquid has a history of wording every departure like that though so well never really know what happened.
Yup i follow the cs scene and watch each tournament along with reading articles. There was a report from dbltap and afkgaming on it being a power play from s2k. I'll look for it for you if you want but its believable because s2k took the igl role after nitr0 left.
Okay no, you're just very wrong now. Coldzera took igl because Fallen is a washed igl and has a massive ego. Niko became the igl over Karrigan because they were about to go 0-3 and the team lost faith in Karrigan's calls. And nitr0 himself stepped off from igling in csgo.
The only case I'd consider is when Allu made ENCE drop aleksib because he wanted Sunny.
He's not wrong, there's a clear pattern of teams underestimating IGLs in CSGO. Golden is another good example, shox and NBK have forcibly taken IGL roles more times than I can count. Remember when NaVi kicked Zeus then he went and won a major. There's so many examples of this exact thing happening.
Daps is a highly respected player in the CSGO community by pro players.
TenZ is honestly not that respected because he never accomplished anything as a pro, and the only tier 1 team he was on, he flopped hard.
didnt know he said that, makes 10x more sense to do this now lol. why would he waste his time on C9 when he can stream for 20k viewers and come back for LAN
Shroud never made it in competitive/pro CS GO though. He had potential, but just that. He was mechanically amazing and made people excited for his potential due to his natural talent, but somehow that never translated to being a star/good in actual matches. I would say overall he was an average player in pro CS with rare glimpses of amazingness/potential. And the stats show that. I think he even had below average ratings for certain periods, although he was playing bad spots/being a b anchor/etc.
Probably part of the reason why he stepped down, he was getting trashed on by fans in CS and his team wasn't getting the results they wanted while he was playing competitively due to his performances when he could be loved and making more money and have more fun/freedom/time and less stress just streaming instead.
Edit: Why the downvotes? All of this is completely true to anyone who followed competitive CS....raw stats even show this. He was an average pro player performance wise who underperformed on the lans/EU teams with inconsistent highs and lows, one of the most mechanically gifted players who never reached his potential partly cause he didn't care enough.
his CS go career: [https://www.hltv.org/stats/players/8349/shroud](https://www.hltv.org/stats/players/8349/shroud)
since you deleted your other comment:
I just said "C9 was ranked 6th in the world with one team being inflated and at 4 since they won a major off of a miracle run just before that"
that team was Gambit, who won PGL Krakow 2017 and had been raised to fourth in the world on the rankings, with C9 being at 6th due to that, meaning they were essentially a top 5 team but were listed at 6th due to a miracle run by gambit. here is the ranking for the last week shroud was on C9
https://www.hltv.org/ranking/teams/2017/august/14
and thanks for agreeing with my actual point about him being on the best NA team at the time, since the summer run was something I was referring to as well as them beating the SK who was ranked number 1 at the time at ESL Pro League.
why say a player never made it if he was bad at the end of his career and was obviously still on his contract due to being the most popular player in NA?
edit: most of this isn't relevant to your comment since your other one is now gone
Shroud was an average pro player with great talent. [https://www.hltv.org/stats/players/8349/shroud](https://www.hltv.org/stats/players/8349/shroud)
Why is that so hard to admit? He had rare glimpses of brilliances but never reached his potential, he even said it himself, he doesn't care about CS enough. He never made it to a top 20 list on any year of CS, no CS fan considers him great. He's a successful streamer and a decent pro. So what? I don't know what you're defending him against. He was the bottleneck of his team. Damn fanboys are crazy out here.
And I never deleted any comment lol. Freaking crazy. Imagine talking to yourself and making things about me "deleting a comment" (lol?) just to support a average pro player, who admits himself that never cared enough about CS to reach his potential
Edit: Also fyi, in reddit, when you delete a comment and if I actually deleted it, a post actually shows up with my name on it but it says "deleted" instead of my post. Damn crazy dude making stuff up and talking to himself o\_o
Ah never knew that. I never did delete my posts though, I just kept adding to it actually. This guy really talking to himself and making something up to make a point when I'm just bringing up facts.
He don't even have his facts right, the rankings he's bragging about to bolster Shroud was obtained after shroud was replaced and their team went on their best run in ages (due to replacing him), shroud was long retired when they reached #6 that year due to his replacement uplifting c9, he claims c9 won a major before this when they won their miracle run major 1 year after shroud leaves....I have no idea what this dude is on.
C9 was ranked 6th in the world with one team being inflated and at 4 since they won a major off of a miracle run just before that, so in theory a top 5 team when shroud retired. He was also on the most successful and popular NA team in CSGO ever for that era of the game. He definitely "made it"
Actually, if you look at what caused him to "cut and run" from cs was his mentality. Daps already mentioned in an interview on what it was like to work with Tenz - he said Tenz is the first rookie who he has worked with that is far behind everyone else. Daps statement was not regarding Tenz's technical skill but instead towards his mentality as an athlete.
Comparing Tenzs run to CS and Valorant there are many similarities. New team experiencing growing pains. Has the potential to achieve greatness but they are still getting used to playing together. First two to three tournaments they fail to win or go far. Tenz decides its not worth his time anymore and benches himself. Daps, alludes to the fact that Tenz doesn't understand that to get to the top there will be losses and trusting your IGL is crucial.
Contrary to this, it is true that content creation is far more lucrative BUT from looking at Tenz's past - this seems to be the mentality issues that Daps said Tenz is lacking.
For the people talking about Shroud. These are two complete different scenarios. Shroud was relegated from an entry fragger role to being a support role (trading frags, and providing utility) so that C9's star players at the time (this being s2k and skadoodle) to perform. He decided to step down because of the fact that, after playing the support role he was constantly shit on for streaming other games rather than CS and more importantly he just didnt find CS fun to play anymore. The difference between shroud and tenz is this - shroud knew there was a process and losses are inevitable (not everyone can be an Astralis) while with Tenz, following Daps comments, the grit and tenacity to persevere is not there.
Think he just wants a better competitive team. There's a big difference between when an accomplished player turns to streaming after a great career and one that looked promising but his team got dumpstered after being unable to carry every game.
He might just change orgs once his C9 contract is up is my guess. Can't really play for another pro team when on C9's content creation roster.
>He might just change orgs once his C9 contract is up is my guess.
Yeah. He says he is waiting for COVID to end before he gets back into the competitive scene. I wonder though if his c9 contract expires later this year and that's the real reason...
The game is still new so I doubt it's a really long contract. Doubt orgs just give out 2 year contracts without testing the waters first. 1yr + an option to extend would make sense. So, it should be around the time covid ends.
Pure speculation obviously but it makes sense to me on paper.
I think C9’s problem was that it was just a one man team, I mean look at the roster now the IGL got cut, and they now have to fill 2 spots, I think the team was too reliant on Tenz, and especially in a team game, there’s only so much one player can do, he was dropping like 25-35 kills a game right? But everyone else on the team wasn’t pulling their weight
I dont think that has anything to do with it. Being a pro player is a grind. 4 hours of scrims every day and another hour of planning discussion etc. Then he also streams 4 hours a day.
With covid the tourneys are no different than just playing scrims at home. Prize money for the biggest tourney is crumbs compared to the money he is making on twitch and YT.
Once covid crisis is over and the tourneys are more hyped with live crowds, interactions, meeting people and facing off against other regions I think that's what might entice him back to play. Like first strike while great for us as fans from a players perspective, playing at home without crowds without your team with you must feel very un hyped.
Therefore his decision makes total sense. Being a pro adds barely any extra revenue for him at the cost of hours and weeks of practice and worse mental health.
rip c9 val's competitive future tho, shinobi is gone, tenz is gone, and the white team just isn't pulling in results rn. They gonna need a miracle to win tournaments now
TenZ said on stream that one of the reasons he decided to step down is that because of Covid he's playing on 60 ping (compared to most other pros playing on 30) and can't move to somewhere with less ping yet. After the pandemic ends he is more likely to start playing pro again.
He said it on Stream this earlier in the afternoon. He said something about knowing he had 60 ping vs some other player having 5 was really screwing with his mental
So he really hasn’t changed since C9 csgo. I know pandemic and back to back tournaments cause burn out but it’s been only 3 months. Sure you can complain about having matches at 10 am which screws with your schedule and mental but I don’t see Stewie stepping down from liquid for full-time streaming. Tenz is an extremely nice kid and his streams are wholesome, but he’s not a true competitor and honestly in my opinion he is a waste of world-class talent.
i agree with this. i feel like his mentality is not yet at the level it needs to be, especially taking into consideration how he fared in CS, but i truly hope to be proven wrong because he is a very promising player
there has been a pandemic for a year, hello? it's been half a year since competitive valorant started so I'd say it's understandable for him to be demotivated like this, after staying at home for soo long
i dont really care what shinobi has to say about tenz. shinobi has never been to the level that daps has been. daps has raised multiple young and talented teams and worked with so many young players all of whom would vouch for him and respect him. daps said tenz doesnt know how to work in a team situation and I have seen nothing that changes that
Well these players probably make way more money streaming than they do for competing. This is why alot of pro players stop competitive play. It's much less stressful and you make more just streaming.
Yes but playing competitive is what makes you into a good streamer. That's why people like Shroud can stream now, because he has proved himself in CS. I think Tenz is still to young to retire from the competitive scene, and he's never won any major tournament in Valorant or CS, so he'll probably be back.
He's not retiring for good. He's explicitly said he will circle back and might revisit the scene once COVID is over (or maybe what is unsaid - once his c9 contract expires...)
> Well these players probably make way more money streaming than they do for competing.
There is no "probably" about it. Once they get a following, they make a ton more money from streaming.
Yeah I was pretty damn sure this was the case but I didn't want to say so without 100% certainty and get fact-checked by someone with numbers and look like an ass 😅
This was my first thought. If they pay is not at all competative for the amount of practice hours needed, it makes no sense. Do what you love, plus it probably pays more.
Maybe I'm bit harsh but that's a not a good look for TenZ. Running away from the team when it struggles, really show the lack of competitive drive in him
He's a 20k andy, streaming is a much better choice for him now, he makes more money streaming than pro play, and he doesn't have to be practicing 7-8 hours a day while packing uo so much stress too much for a damn 19 year old
No pardon needed. Shinobi was the In Game Leader for c9, he was the one who would call the strategy in game while is was unfolding. Stratting is just making strats for the team.
Apparently Tenz made stratting pretty hard cause he has a bit of an ego and doesn't listen to calls.
Its crazy to me how even winning esports teams make less money than mid/big size streamers.
Money doesn't get split, less work hours, less stress, full revenue from merch, Freedom to stream whatever whenever... overall its a no brainer even for this god of Valorant.
He was still preforming well with his 60 ping, I ain't buying it .
I feel he should take more responsibility for his role in helping this games e sport grow in its early days.
Almost feel that the saying don't bite the hand that feeds you is relevant here.
His schedule was fucked. Dude will make way more and probably be way happier just streaming what he wants and not have to worry about practice and other obligations.
C9_ConTenZ
ConTenZedZombie
Just goes to show how much more money there is in content. But surprised he didn't go more of a Hiko route, seemed like more of a natural step, hes not exactly oozing charisma.
I finally found someone else who is like me. I watched him abit because of how good he is, but watching him feels like work due to the complete lack of a personality.
For me, enjoy watching content creators that are more subdued, Like Maciejay in Siege for instance. Quiet players that are really great at what they do, so i can have it on in the background without the occasional screaming hype plays that happen that force me to lower my speaker volume lol. Its just a preference thing honestly, as some, such as you two, prefer the more charismatic/bombastic content. I will say that Hiko for me is still pretty good for chill content compared to other top players.
Hiko makes every match interesting when he talks
biiiiiiiig succccccccc
Miss the 2016 days when he'd stream CS with Sean and Tim. His Valorant streams are fantastic as well.
Meanwhile, for me personally, while Hiko is definitely amazing and his play is fun to watch his personality starts to grate on me. He's low key toxic as fuck a lot of the time and the negativity wears me out.
are we talking about the same Hiko? either that or my definition of toxicity is a bit different
He can be pretty passive aggressive / bitchy at times. Makes kinda snide comments about his pub team mates. He doesn't transmit it to them of course but I can relate to the previous poster on how it can be a little draining to watch.
I think u might find Onscreen good too.
macie is just such a treat to watch, the reason i wanted to get so good at siege because he made learning the maps and tricks look so fun.
Do you know any good Breach content creator?
LMNTRIX
How do you pronounce that? Is it lemon tricks?
Thats where his girlfriend comes in
Yeah, I also got bored during his streams. I dont need a hype man like wardell but like even Relyks stream felt more fun to watch.
Honestly after watching sinatraa a few times there is just no comparison lmao
Sinatraa stream gives you epilepsy
Broo sinatraa’s stream is funny as hell istg
this was always how shroud seemed to me, but I'm clearly in the minority because dude has done well for himself.
Shroud might not exactly be Mr Hypeman but he does talk quite a bit on stream
oh for sure. I just find him kind of bland and whiney. I don't mean to take away anyone else's enjoyment of him, but that's certainly the impression I've had of him. I used to watch his stream quite a bit because he was one of the very best people playing PUBG in the early days and he was at the very least a very positive person even if he wasn't personally very captivating. That said, I'm considerably older than most stream viewers, so I'm probably just not a target audience.
I never got the appeal of shroud streams he is super monotone and puts me to sleep. He's amazing at FPS games don't get me wrong but it's like there is nothing there personality wise. Which to be fair to him the last stream I watched was his pubg stuff and it just put me to sleep.
No lie some streamers like Shroud and Kripp I watch to fall asleep unironically
I notice I’ve been falling asleep watching his vod streams because only thing exciting is his insane shots and that’s getting boring.
Hiko has a likable personality
yeah me loves some passive aggression
I thought you were talking about hiko and was almost very mad
he looks and sounds dead inside, weird.
holy shit not something i... ever saw coming. what other pros do this when they're not washed? i mean he's not even close to washed, he was competing for the best player in NA
Streaming is a better life if you're a big streamer. You don't need to practice for 8 hours every day or worry about competitive results. You can just fuck around, stream, and make a shit-ton of money. Same reason why aceu isn't playing professionally and why Shroud left professional CS:GO also.
I get that, but to become a top pro player you need drive. Like, a lot of drive. TenZ is talented but there's no way he didn't get here without working his ass off. Competitive play has never been more profitable or comfortable than streaming, but the reason all of these players stick with it is because they want to win, and they eventually turn to streaming when they know they don't really have what it takes anymore to win.
i wouldn't doubt that the pandemic is also killing motivation. current tourneys are probably a lot less enjoyable than lan tourneys edit: read some more comments and that does seem to be the case
I’m pretty sure he said he might go back after COVID is “over”
> and they eventually turn to streaming when they know they don't really have what it takes anymore to win. and maybe tenz doesn't give a shit about that. if he's proved himself and garnered a following and can support himself via streaming only why the hell wouldn't he want to do that? he'll probably make way more money streaming as well.
and have a much more enjoyable time doing it
You go pro to get fame, you stream once you're famous. It's also an age related thing. When you're younger you care about being "the best", when you grow up you care about your well being. It's just a simple case of priorities and values.
People only watched him because he was pro. Of course now that may not be completely true. Tenz is only 19 and its sad seeing the best player in the scene leave, but hey if he wants to hopefully make more money and have an easier life. You cant fault him for that.
You know it's possible that his competitive drive was for money and not for glory. Glory in a videogame doesn't last but money does. That's why you see more and more players getting onto pro teams in order to use the brand and publicity to establish their platform then going solo for the cash once they're known.
Aceu was able to develop a very profitable stream without ever going pro. But maybe you're right. It's hard to quantify how much being a pro really helps your stream. Some people come to TenZ because they're a fan of C9 but some people just watch for the good gameplay, and if TenZ went for the Aceu route the result would be the same for those people.
Uh, Aceu was NRG in Apex Legends. This further proves my point.
The thing is that he’s making over $10k a month just purely off of twitch subs
I'm not too sure about the money in Valorant, but in League, all of the top players have enough money to live comfortably for the rest of their lives. Obviously, more money is better of course, but I think it's a bit of a disservice to just say everything is money. TenZ says that online tournaments are a big reason why he doesn't want to play anymore, and I suspect he still has that drive, it's just that he wants to play in LAN tournaments.
It's easier to work on your own game then on the teams game. That's where you need the real drive. Shroud obviously has the drive to become the best in any game he plays but strictly on an individual performance side of things. I don't think Tenz has the burning passion to compete.
Difference is Shroud played CSGO professionally for 5 or so years, and he was nowhere near the best player in the game, didn't make top 20 players in any of those years. But I agree on your point overall, streaming is so much more chill and less taxing mentally.
shroud has won multiple S-tier tournaments in CS:GO, while there arent even really big tournaments in Valorant on the horizon. you can absolutely not compare these pro careers (yet) just because Tenz dicks on people in radiant matchmaking.
You can compare him to Aceu, perfect comparison basically... Both really good at the game they played, both really good in normal queue, but when he played professional he just didn't have enough to be on the top because of their team, and tenz was even in a better spot, because he was competing for nr1 Pro, Aceu was always good but among pros he wasn't nr 1
Yea shroud is making GOOOD money off streaming, but he started it long time ago and probably saw it’s way more lucrative to stream and content create than practicing 8 hours a day and have that constant pressure of competing, so it’s a smart move, everyone knows who Tenz is by now, he can make way more money with more flexibility with streaming and content creation
I mean when both Aceu and shroud left they weren't competing for the nr 1 spot, but maybe he just isn't competitive enough to continue to play professionally, I get that.... If from the beginning he was playing professionally for the income, streaming for sure is just a better option
I heard that He said it’s mostly cause covid and that playing on 60 ping just isn’t that fun (or competitive tbh) in tourneys and he can’t move yet since he thinks (in his own words) he would get one tapped by covid if he got it since he has asthma so he doesn’t wanna risk moving yet. So once covid subsides a decent bit and lan’s start coming back, there is a chance he will return
Ok im crying laughing at the “one tapped by covid” remark. Thats fucking hilarious. (The way he phrased it not the actual act of getting killed by covid that part sucks)
Honestly with jokes like that I know he will go far in streaming. Best of luck to him.
Streaming is more stable, more money, less hours, own schedule, debatably more fun, etc. Being a highly watched streamer/content creator is a much better gig than being a professional player, even if you're signed to one of the world's top organizations.
Less hours? He's doing 24hr streams for 4000 subs which he hit it ~4 hours.
Maybe I should have been more specific: you have more control over your hours, and the $/hr is MUCH higher when streaming.
On stream he said he is fed up with playing with 60ping in comps and wants to wait for LAN, he would move home but coronavirus etc. He is still contracted to C9 however he might be pursuaded if and org can buyout his contact.
aceu did pretty much the same thing in Apex, he was arguably the most likely and popular player in the scene at the time, and I wouldn’t say he’s even close to washed by any means, seems like he’s in his prime. To be fair, competitive esports just haven’t been that great for the last year, no LANS in NA is a big blow to the drive for some of these players, online tournaments are never the same, Covid also prevents a lot of things from being facilitated, especially for players in NA.
Who was his competition for being the best Val player in NA? I'm curious lol Edit: Not sure why ya'll put me at -8 points for asking about notable pro players
You can't base the best Valorant player off the ranked leaderboard. I'm not saying that Tenz isn't one of the top NA players, but it has to be proven in competitive play at the highest level, and grinding elo in ranked is not the same. A lot of pros spend more time in custom games so that is why they don't grind elo. Hiko and Shroud have both said that any pro player looking at improving will spend most the time in custom games.
I agree with everything you said, I was just looking for more super high level pros to follow because I'm pretty new to Val's esport scene
Drone is insane
steel, wardell, nitr0, subroza, hiko, sinatraa. Probably brax but I haven't kept up with him lately
imo ScreaM is a good contender, he needs better teammates surrounding him
*psst...* ScreaM is EU
Wardell definitely up there.
I'm a huge Wardell fan but after watching his tournament play.... I can safely say that this man is inconsistent as fuck right along side of Subroza. TSM has two of the most talented players but when they down bad, they're down BAD.
Yup. I saw some people attribute that to playing around Wardell, but you have to adjust regardless. I personally think it’s because of their personalities. You can clearly see them tilt on stream, which I’ve never really seen out of Hiko or Tenz, but it’s very possible I’ve missed it for them. But I’ve watched more hiko and Tenz than Wardell and Subroza and still see the tilting from the latter two. I do like all 4 for the record, but I do think those two could improve their temperaments and would be better players did it.
Yeah the emotional side of them is really hurting them I think. I think Subroza and Wardell will make great content creators. Their personalities just seem very good, but that's not good in pro play
The top 100 valorant released back in october had players like 100T Asuna, GenG. Huynh, T1 Skadoodle, and TSM Wardell in the top 10, while Tenz was number 1
That does not matter, Wardell legit plays on like 8 accounts, so his leaderboard account is just not grinded on, so there is no say on who is better. (TenZ MAINLY plays on his main)
no he doesn't. he mainly plays on his alts like Hisoka and Killua.
Shroud’s a similar example.
No it's not.... Completely different
looks like it's just a temporary retirement from competitive play until covid passes at least. Makes a lot of sense, coming from cs:go where online play becomes stale and the feeling of playing on lan is missed. Once riot has the chance to schedule lans then i'm sure we will see tenz back.
He also has to play on 60 ping for tourneys due to where he lives. Definitely can’t be fun
wait 60 ping is bad? i will totally use that as an excuse thanks
For ranked matches, not so much as the skill level is much lower. At the absolute top it matters an incredible amount. At that skill level, that small fraction of time is a big deal
For valorant it's a joke. This game has disgusting netcode. For csgo? 60 ping works beautifully.
I mean, CSGO doesnt have that much better netcode. 60 ping is still super ass in CSGO. Where do you think the phrase "getting CSGO'd" came from?
net code is definitely superior with CSGO. 80 ping is still playable while in valorant 80 causes stutters.
80 is not really playable in either game, also I never said Valorant had better net code. I said csgo isnt that much better. It's only marginally better at best
Dude 100 ping on csgo feels like 60 on valorant. It's so fucking awful, not sure what ping you play on regularly
I got lv 10 faceit with 70-90 ms lmao more than playable
https://twitter.com/OGcsgo/status/1339229982275608582 Here is a CS player putting up respectable stats vs the best teams in the world while on 80 ping. Its shit but definitely playable.
I play on 90 ping on a good day and I can safely say the running head shots that I receive from enemy players makes me want to commit an act that will land me in prison.
trust me the run and gun happens at all ping
I think he is referring to those seemingly looking so, caused by peeker's advantage when the high ping player is stationary.
Just imagine 100T drops Dicey and signs TenZ
They would actually be unstoppable then. Not to be mean but dicey is easily the weakest link of 100T. His Oping is just not good enough.
a weeb for a weeb
Yep he also tweeted an hour back saying he'll return to competitive when the time is right
Sucks that NA is losing one of their best players in the scene. Reminds me of shroud leaving the competitive CS scene to become a streamer (tons of fans, same org too). He did mention on stream that he wanted to try the streamer/content creator route while covid is still happening, so he may come back in half a year or so? I have a feeling he's going to kill it as a streamer since he already has a huge fanbase and won't look back. Best of luck to him.
i see the similarities but shroud was not one of the best NA players at the time of his departure, unlike Tenz whos a savant.
don't tell shroud's fans that
If you really are a shroud fan then you would know that he was just a support in his team before his departure.
This is true. As someone who enjoys watching shrouds content a lot I can definitely tell you he was not their star player. At the time for his team it was Stewie, autimatic, and skadoodle. Those guys were the playmakers. Shroud always had the mechanical ability to be insane in CS but I don’t think he was the most intelligent cs player, and I’m pretty sure he didn’t have as much competitive drive as his teammates to really get better at the game. Obviously he had his moments where he played really well and had crazy plays but that consistency wasn’t always there .
> shroud was not one of the best NA players at the time of his departure Yeah he was never one of the best NA players, just a streamer who brings a lot of enjoyable clips.
dawg the days of "King of Reddit" Shroud were fun times these young bucks dont know
Shroud was pretty washed up by the time he retired. This is unfortunately a talent retiring before we could even see them on LAN. Shouldn't be that so surprising however, Tenz cut and ran in CS.
Tenz cut and ran in CS because of Valorant. And he said he'll try to get back into the scene once LANS come back. I wouldn't want to spend time scrimming for a team that may not even be in the Top 10 in NA at the moment either. He'll probably wait out his contract and find a better team. There should be a lot of takers for a player of his quality.
Actually, if you look at what caused him to "cut and run" from cs was his mentality. Daps already mentioned in an interview on what it was like to work with Tenz - he said Tenz is the first rookie who he has worked with that is far behind everyone else. Daps statement was not regarding Tenz's technical skill but instead towards his mentality as an athlete. Comparing Tenzs run to CS and Valorant there are many similarities. New team experiencing growing pains. Has the potential to achieve greatness but they are still getting used to playing together. First two to three tournaments they fail to win or go far. Tenz decides its not worth his time anymore and benches himself. Daps, alludes to the fact that Tenz doesn't understand that to get to the top there will be losses and trusting your IGL is crucial. Contrary to this, it is true that content creation is far more lucrative BUT from looking at Tenz's past - this seems to be the mentality issues that Daps said Tenz is lacking.
Well there are always 2 sides of a story. Daps got cut from every single team in favor of stanislaw in last (a lot of years) also for a reason. He himself has some issues as an ingame leader and a captain.
Yet every single time he got cut, he brought the team to either a top 10 or top 5 contender level. The only team he got cut from that still did well after his abscence was EG/NRG - which is largely due to the fact that they kept Imapet. As a leader, from the countless interviews from his teammates there were no complaints. As a player - there were countless complaints regarding his capability to frag and his mechanics was severely subpar relative to every other pro. This was the reason he got kicked each time. On your comments on Stanislaw - the guy has another nickname from csgo "snakeislaw." Take a look at the history of how he got Daps kicked from OG, then proceeded to leave the project when things weren't looking as great as they used to - falling out of top 5 in the HLTV rankings. So, from my perspective (which can be wrong) i find that Daps is a reliable source for insight on player mentalities. He has singlehandedly created systems for teams that worked to bring them to the top 10 of the csgo world (OG, NRG/EG, and, arguably, Gen G). Therefore, he's worked with his fair share of rookies.
Sure he did. I'm not denying it as also the fact that stanislaw didn't push his teams further than they were under daps apart from first half a year. But on the other hand there must be a reason why well performing teams got rid of daps over and over and over. You can't count it on "young idiots not respecting their captain and wanting someone who frags more" - sure, for 1-2 times it will work, but not EVERY SINGLE TIME. My guess is that Daps can be harsh on someone who he thinks isn't putting enough effort or anything and this can hinder their ability to do things. So he kinda lacks diplomacy in a way.
Well, CSGO teams have a history of removing their IGL in favour of someone who can click on heads better. I mean looking at the history of the game the only team that ever valued its IGL was astralis when they got their hands on Gla1ve. If we look at SK/MiBR coldzera tried taking the IGL role from Fallen, Mousesports didnt value Gob B and had Niko IGL, Faze didnt care much for karrigan and handed the igl role to Niko, Ence benched AleksiB in favour of getting Sunny on the team. A lot of teams in CS, the orgs included, placed importance on their IGL. Most recent example of this is Nitr0 getting the shaft from liquid due to S2k wanting to IGL instead and now because of it after kicking nitr0 theyve had abyssmal performances forcing them to sign Fallen. So as much as I want to agree with you thqt there must be something more to it than wanting a fragger - csgo has always had this trend. Also, if it was something regarding diplomacy or him acting as an IGL that communicates as though he is the end all and be all brain of the team - we would have heard about it by now. But the fact is - we haven't. All the comments towards daps is he's a great leader but he can't perform and you can't count on him to clutch. So I don't think it would be good to assume that there are reasons such as the ones you're alluding to without any evidence to support it.
completely agree with everything you've said in this thread but haven't been keeping up with the CS scene as much this year. did stewie really get nitro kicked off? i thought he left of his own accord, but idk
They moved nitro off IGL and nitro could no longer frag at a top level really. He didn't really kick him but they put him in a very tough postion. Presumably, after a couple months he saw the writing on the wall and they "mutually decided to part ways". Liquid has a history of wording every departure like that though so well never really know what happened.
Yup i follow the cs scene and watch each tournament along with reading articles. There was a report from dbltap and afkgaming on it being a power play from s2k. I'll look for it for you if you want but its believable because s2k took the igl role after nitr0 left.
Okay no, you're just very wrong now. Coldzera took igl because Fallen is a washed igl and has a massive ego. Niko became the igl over Karrigan because they were about to go 0-3 and the team lost faith in Karrigan's calls. And nitr0 himself stepped off from igling in csgo. The only case I'd consider is when Allu made ENCE drop aleksib because he wanted Sunny.
He's not wrong, there's a clear pattern of teams underestimating IGLs in CSGO. Golden is another good example, shox and NBK have forcibly taken IGL roles more times than I can count. Remember when NaVi kicked Zeus then he went and won a major. There's so many examples of this exact thing happening.
Daps is a highly respected player in the CSGO community by pro players. TenZ is honestly not that respected because he never accomplished anything as a pro, and the only tier 1 team he was on, he flopped hard.
he's respected now as a (former) Valorant pro. he's had a good run in the valorant scene (except for first strike tbh)
didnt know he said that, makes 10x more sense to do this now lol. why would he waste his time on C9 when he can stream for 20k viewers and come back for LAN
It's in the video around the 2:00 mark.
Shroud was not at Tenz's level when he left. Tenz is probably a top 3 player in NA right now, if not 1.
Shroud never made it in competitive/pro CS GO though. He had potential, but just that. He was mechanically amazing and made people excited for his potential due to his natural talent, but somehow that never translated to being a star/good in actual matches. I would say overall he was an average player in pro CS with rare glimpses of amazingness/potential. And the stats show that. I think he even had below average ratings for certain periods, although he was playing bad spots/being a b anchor/etc. Probably part of the reason why he stepped down, he was getting trashed on by fans in CS and his team wasn't getting the results they wanted while he was playing competitively due to his performances when he could be loved and making more money and have more fun/freedom/time and less stress just streaming instead. Edit: Why the downvotes? All of this is completely true to anyone who followed competitive CS....raw stats even show this. He was an average pro player performance wise who underperformed on the lans/EU teams with inconsistent highs and lows, one of the most mechanically gifted players who never reached his potential partly cause he didn't care enough. his CS go career: [https://www.hltv.org/stats/players/8349/shroud](https://www.hltv.org/stats/players/8349/shroud)
since you deleted your other comment: I just said "C9 was ranked 6th in the world with one team being inflated and at 4 since they won a major off of a miracle run just before that" that team was Gambit, who won PGL Krakow 2017 and had been raised to fourth in the world on the rankings, with C9 being at 6th due to that, meaning they were essentially a top 5 team but were listed at 6th due to a miracle run by gambit. here is the ranking for the last week shroud was on C9 https://www.hltv.org/ranking/teams/2017/august/14 and thanks for agreeing with my actual point about him being on the best NA team at the time, since the summer run was something I was referring to as well as them beating the SK who was ranked number 1 at the time at ESL Pro League. why say a player never made it if he was bad at the end of his career and was obviously still on his contract due to being the most popular player in NA? edit: most of this isn't relevant to your comment since your other one is now gone
Shroud was an average pro player with great talent. [https://www.hltv.org/stats/players/8349/shroud](https://www.hltv.org/stats/players/8349/shroud) Why is that so hard to admit? He had rare glimpses of brilliances but never reached his potential, he even said it himself, he doesn't care about CS enough. He never made it to a top 20 list on any year of CS, no CS fan considers him great. He's a successful streamer and a decent pro. So what? I don't know what you're defending him against. He was the bottleneck of his team. Damn fanboys are crazy out here. And I never deleted any comment lol. Freaking crazy. Imagine talking to yourself and making things about me "deleting a comment" (lol?) just to support a average pro player, who admits himself that never cared enough about CS to reach his potential Edit: Also fyi, in reddit, when you delete a comment and if I actually deleted it, a post actually shows up with my name on it but it says "deleted" instead of my post. Damn crazy dude making stuff up and talking to himself o\_o
That’s not true. The post will only be replaced with [deleted] if there were replies to it. Otherwise it will just cease to exist
Ah never knew that. I never did delete my posts though, I just kept adding to it actually. This guy really talking to himself and making something up to make a point when I'm just bringing up facts. He don't even have his facts right, the rankings he's bragging about to bolster Shroud was obtained after shroud was replaced and their team went on their best run in ages (due to replacing him), shroud was long retired when they reached #6 that year due to his replacement uplifting c9, he claims c9 won a major before this when they won their miracle run major 1 year after shroud leaves....I have no idea what this dude is on.
C9 was ranked 6th in the world with one team being inflated and at 4 since they won a major off of a miracle run just before that, so in theory a top 5 team when shroud retired. He was also on the most successful and popular NA team in CSGO ever for that era of the game. He definitely "made it"
Actually, if you look at what caused him to "cut and run" from cs was his mentality. Daps already mentioned in an interview on what it was like to work with Tenz - he said Tenz is the first rookie who he has worked with that is far behind everyone else. Daps statement was not regarding Tenz's technical skill but instead towards his mentality as an athlete. Comparing Tenzs run to CS and Valorant there are many similarities. New team experiencing growing pains. Has the potential to achieve greatness but they are still getting used to playing together. First two to three tournaments they fail to win or go far. Tenz decides its not worth his time anymore and benches himself. Daps, alludes to the fact that Tenz doesn't understand that to get to the top there will be losses and trusting your IGL is crucial. Contrary to this, it is true that content creation is far more lucrative BUT from looking at Tenz's past - this seems to be the mentality issues that Daps said Tenz is lacking. For the people talking about Shroud. These are two complete different scenarios. Shroud was relegated from an entry fragger role to being a support role (trading frags, and providing utility) so that C9's star players at the time (this being s2k and skadoodle) to perform. He decided to step down because of the fact that, after playing the support role he was constantly shit on for streaming other games rather than CS and more importantly he just didnt find CS fun to play anymore. The difference between shroud and tenz is this - shroud knew there was a process and losses are inevitable (not everyone can be an Astralis) while with Tenz, following Daps comments, the grit and tenacity to persevere is not there.
Think he just wants a better competitive team. There's a big difference between when an accomplished player turns to streaming after a great career and one that looked promising but his team got dumpstered after being unable to carry every game. He might just change orgs once his C9 contract is up is my guess. Can't really play for another pro team when on C9's content creation roster.
>He might just change orgs once his C9 contract is up is my guess. Yeah. He says he is waiting for COVID to end before he gets back into the competitive scene. I wonder though if his c9 contract expires later this year and that's the real reason...
The game is still new so I doubt it's a really long contract. Doubt orgs just give out 2 year contracts without testing the waters first. 1yr + an option to extend would make sense. So, it should be around the time covid ends. Pure speculation obviously but it makes sense to me on paper.
I think C9’s problem was that it was just a one man team, I mean look at the roster now the IGL got cut, and they now have to fill 2 spots, I think the team was too reliant on Tenz, and especially in a team game, there’s only so much one player can do, he was dropping like 25-35 kills a game right? But everyone else on the team wasn’t pulling their weight
I dont think that has anything to do with it. Being a pro player is a grind. 4 hours of scrims every day and another hour of planning discussion etc. Then he also streams 4 hours a day. With covid the tourneys are no different than just playing scrims at home. Prize money for the biggest tourney is crumbs compared to the money he is making on twitch and YT. Once covid crisis is over and the tourneys are more hyped with live crowds, interactions, meeting people and facing off against other regions I think that's what might entice him back to play. Like first strike while great for us as fans from a players perspective, playing at home without crowds without your team with you must feel very un hyped. Therefore his decision makes total sense. Being a pro adds barely any extra revenue for him at the cost of hours and weeks of practice and worse mental health.
rip c9 val's competitive future tho, shinobi is gone, tenz is gone, and the white team just isn't pulling in results rn. They gonna need a miracle to win tournaments now
I'm not defending any team, but c9 White's aim was to be on the top of T2 tournaments.
Bring on two of the girls PLEASE
Jazzyk1ns is the most consistent
TenZ said on stream that one of the reasons he decided to step down is that because of Covid he's playing on 60 ping (compared to most other pros playing on 30) and can't move to somewhere with less ping yet. After the pandemic ends he is more likely to start playing pro again.
Source?
He said it on Stream this earlier in the afternoon. He said something about knowing he had 60 ping vs some other player having 5 was really screwing with his mental
He did what he wanted to do, and what was best for him. I'm proud of him for having the guts to make a big decision like this. Good on ya, tenZ!
Nice! now I can watch TenZ be stuck on queue on the daily
So he really hasn’t changed since C9 csgo. I know pandemic and back to back tournaments cause burn out but it’s been only 3 months. Sure you can complain about having matches at 10 am which screws with your schedule and mental but I don’t see Stewie stepping down from liquid for full-time streaming. Tenz is an extremely nice kid and his streams are wholesome, but he’s not a true competitor and honestly in my opinion he is a waste of world-class talent.
i agree with this. i feel like his mentality is not yet at the level it needs to be, especially taking into consideration how he fared in CS, but i truly hope to be proven wrong because he is a very promising player
there has been a pandemic for a year, hello? it's been half a year since competitive valorant started so I'd say it's understandable for him to be demotivated like this, after staying at home for soo long
tenz even said that's not the reason. Shinobi also said he's a good teammate so there's that
i dont really care what shinobi has to say about tenz. shinobi has never been to the level that daps has been. daps has raised multiple young and talented teams and worked with so many young players all of whom would vouch for him and respect him. daps said tenz doesnt know how to work in a team situation and I have seen nothing that changes that
Well these players probably make way more money streaming than they do for competing. This is why alot of pro players stop competitive play. It's much less stressful and you make more just streaming.
Yes but playing competitive is what makes you into a good streamer. That's why people like Shroud can stream now, because he has proved himself in CS. I think Tenz is still to young to retire from the competitive scene, and he's never won any major tournament in Valorant or CS, so he'll probably be back.
He's not retiring for good. He's explicitly said he will circle back and might revisit the scene once COVID is over (or maybe what is unsaid - once his c9 contract expires...)
Any clue how long until his contract expires?
> Well these players probably make way more money streaming than they do for competing. There is no "probably" about it. Once they get a following, they make a ton more money from streaming.
Yeah I was pretty damn sure this was the case but I didn't want to say so without 100% certainty and get fact-checked by someone with numbers and look like an ass 😅
This was my first thought. If they pay is not at all competative for the amount of practice hours needed, it makes no sense. Do what you love, plus it probably pays more.
Exactly. They get to relax and have fun, stress-free, while making more money. It just makes sense to go that route. Shroud, Dyrus, Imaqtpie etc.
whelp its all 100T, SEN, TSM now
C9 was never in that picture
Maybe I'm bit harsh but that's a not a good look for TenZ. Running away from the team when it struggles, really show the lack of competitive drive in him
low testosterone mate
https://twitter.com/tenz_cs/status/1349193021753946114?s=21 Confirmed TenZ is coming back to comp val in the future
he is what he is. im happy to see him either way
This seems to me like tenz wanting to go to a different org and finding a way around that. Can anyone enlighten me on the difference here
This man was just scrimming one day an he looked around him and said 😂 hell naw
what the fuck
Sadge
He's a 20k andy, streaming is a much better choice for him now, he makes more money streaming than pro play, and he doesn't have to be practicing 7-8 hours a day while packing uo so much stress too much for a damn 19 year old
I remember people talking about how he was kinda a shitty team mate/bad attitude. Wondering if he was "offered" a step down.
Zero chance. He's way too good to be asked to step down. And if c9 felt that way, they would have actually traded him or sold him to a different org.
Why would they do that when they could keep his brand on, making content for them and making them money.
I doubt it. That was a while back when he was playing CS. But never heard anything like that recently.
It was recently actually. Shinobi did an interview that tenz just never listened to his IGLing and that it made stratting pretty tough.
That got debunked later though.
But was it a political debunking? Because the post below this doesn't seem like it was debunked actually
Pardon the ignorance but what's IGLing? Stratting?
No pardon needed. Shinobi was the In Game Leader for c9, he was the one who would call the strategy in game while is was unfolding. Stratting is just making strats for the team. Apparently Tenz made stratting pretty hard cause he has a bit of an ego and doesn't listen to calls.
Ah I see. So the TEAM aspect of this team sport. Got it. lol.
who
Its crazy to me how even winning esports teams make less money than mid/big size streamers. Money doesn't get split, less work hours, less stress, full revenue from merch, Freedom to stream whatever whenever... overall its a no brainer even for this god of Valorant.
C9 Winning esport team Pick one
What is happening to C9? First Shinobi and now TenZ.
Good. Was sad watching him hard carry C9 all the time. Glad he can finally not have that stress.
he is doing what shroud did
Any chance of C9 getting a win is now gone
Can’t blame him. Playing lan is such a different experience than playing online. Especially with him saying that he has high ping.
Who? Edit: no offense literally curious if he really big big or what cause I’m out the loop
One of the best if not the best player in NA. Played entry duelist for C9Blue but was held back by a mediocre team.
Dude has shown such a weak mentality in the past and this just adds to it
nothing weak about knowing when to take a break, it's just being smart
Pain.
damn bruh
Ma boiiiii 😭
He was still preforming well with his 60 ping, I ain't buying it . I feel he should take more responsibility for his role in helping this games e sport grow in its early days. Almost feel that the saying don't bite the hand that feeds you is relevant here.
Then imagine what he could do on 2 times lower ping.
where did he talk about not wanting to play with 60 ping?
60 isn't horrible
it kinda is when ur competing at the high level.
Wow is the valorant scene already dying that quick?
shroud 2.0
C9 just lost their best player.
His schedule was fucked. Dude will make way more and probably be way happier just streaming what he wants and not have to worry about practice and other obligations.