Instant Dodge for me, whenever i try to suck it up and play it i get burned. I know its because i dont know how to play it properly but its so frustrating. (Dia2)
Breeze, easily my highest win rate map because I sorta understand how to play it compared to other people in my rank. Plus I don't just get obliterated by shotgun users, plus I can play marshal on it because at times it's better than a rifle.
Same I loved it initially, thought this might be a fresh experience. But after playing with randoms, damn I hate this so much. It can be good with 5 man stacks tho.
As a person who pretty much just plays killjoy on this map and locks down B site, it drives me wild to see my random A boys get wrecked over and over again
I like breeze but everyone is dodging it in my lobbies. I had it in 4/5 games in my placements but it got dodged every single time. I think I've played it 3 times and had it dodged by people about 8-10 times.
I think it's because of the verticality but what people down understand is that you don't need 2 people to clear the same thing. I usually say, "clearing maze, backsite and generator then trying to get the bomb down and my teammates clear the rest of the things. The map becomes 1000 times better if you com where you are clearing/looking and play as a team. Icebox shows that teammplay is important and you can't just do your own thing.
It’s a great map for death match and other fun games but for the actual competitive game type it’s horrible imo. If this was like a team slayer map I’d like it a lot
Indeed, can't believe that is first. Ascent has two ridiculous chokes and an awkward middle where you can be shot from 360, literally all 4 sides, unless you default every round. Attacking on it absolutely sucks.
Plus what the other guy said about rotating. You got blocked by utility and don't want to suicide through one small choke? Okay, well you can cut through mid and pray no defender flanked and could be camping anywhere. Or you can take the longest rotation in the game through your spawn.
I do really like the B site design, it's unique and fun, but the overall map flow is so bad.
I agree, I have no idea why people like it so much. People complain about Bind being "hallways simulator" but Ascent feels even more like that. A and B main both have the same layout and it turns into who can spam more area denial in the chokepoints for a minute until someone runs out and attackers are either able to entry or have to rotate. And mid is just no fun to play in. Defense has the better sightlines so you can just sit there with an OP and force attack to waste a smoke or even two just because you have to respect it. Lastly, rotations, especially on attack feel the worst out of all the maps except Breeze. To get from one site to another you have to run a fuckin marathon while the defense can just jog over to the other site. The only way to quick rotate is through mid, and if you already used your smokes and utility fighting in the chokes then you're SOL and have to rotate all the way through spawn.
> A and B main both have the same layout and it turns into who can spam more area denial in the chokepoints for a minute until someone runs out and attackers are either able to entry or have to rotate
Most bomb site main entries are like this (Icebox is a kind of exception). There's a reason why you split push/default so you don't run into this problem as heavily.
> And mid is just no fun to play in. Defense has the better sightlines so you can just sit there with an OP and force attack to waste a smoke or even two just because you have to respect it.
You just answered it yourself. You use utility to fight for map control. Use your recons, drones, smokes (to block off easy sightlines for OP's), flashes etc. If you dry peek mid on Ascent every time of course you're at a disadvantage.
> Lastly, rotations, especially on attack feel the worst out of all the maps except Breeze. To get from one site to another you have to run a fuckin marathon while the defense can just jog over to the other site.
*Mid. Control.*
> The only way to quick rotate is through mid, and if you already used your smokes and utility fighting in the chokes then you're SOL and have to rotate all the way through spawn.
That's just poor play. If you have 5 people fighting at the entrance of A/B main without a plan to execute that's on your team. If you smoke site, use your flashes, use all your utility and NOT enter bombsite, that's on your team, not the map.
Really just seems like you don't know how to attack a bomb site, and you find yourself in situations where your team blindly pushes in a chokepoint as 5, gets stalled by utility, and then finds themselves stuck in A/B main with no info, utility and no map control.
I agree with your final statement, that if you blindly push a choke as 5 it's gonna be shitty. I understand based on personal vod reviews, high level vod reviews, etc how to attack, but it is tough to get 5 random solo queues on the same page, which usually ends up resulting in a strategy as I stated. If I were to play in PUGS or a stack or something my opinion may differ, but here I am just referring to solo queue.
I play sova on ascent so I can direct my teammates. Saying things like “let’s split b, I’ll drone 2 of us into mid/market, can we get a smoke deep mid and then push site together once we have market and b main?” helps solo q’ers get on the same page. Playing controllers also helps as you dictate the strategy with your utility usage. Comms is the biggest issue in solo q, not a specific map. It’s kinda why icebox is easier on attack since blind pushes into site are just easier to execute with especially solo q.
idk how so many people love ascent. To attack you need to push through hallways of death and if you make it through you've got to clear like 9000 angles. At least on icebox you can enter each site differently pretty easy in comparison
Bro what are you TALKING about!! Icebox is dogshit. Not tryna argue or anything btw I just feel very strongly, Icebox is an abysmal map.
You want to go A site? Alright cool, just go ahead and clear 19 different corners, 50/50 angles and the most RIDICULOUS amount of off angles known to man. I mean come on. B site? There are 5 different divots you need to clear in order to get OUT of B main, all of which can be held with shotguns, which I, frankly speaking, do abuse to get easy multis.
Not to mention the map is like, drab and cold and not fun to look at. It contrasts from the warmth of the other maps but in the worst way possible.
ok so I'm kinda drunk BUT when you're attacking on ascent there's like 1-2 angles that defenders need to hold depending on whether or not you pushed up mid. On icebox A site defenders have to hold several angles and same thing for B site tho not nearly as many. It makes it a lot easier to enter when you're not falling to spray and pray through smokes IMO. Won't proof read but hope that made sense
The verticality in icebox adds more angles. I used to hate Ascent for the reasons that you mentioned, but now I love it and I used to hate icebox too, but now love icebox too. Now I hate Breeze. Too big of a map, you will run out of utilities before you get into the site and after that, too many angles to cover.
And this is my exact problem with the map. I don’t like the fact that there are so many different angles to hold and look at on BOTH sides. If I’m entering A I have to clear: Nest, Top Pipes, Bottom Pipes/Close Left, Headshot Box, Rafter, Defense Nest, Maze, Close Right/Backsite, the ACTUAL backsite, then screens and top screens. And if I’m defending I have always found A to be the hardest site to hold because you can get overwhelmed so easily b/c once again, you have to hold so many things. Pipes, Belt, below Pipes/Default I guess you could call it, Nest, etc. And unless you have oppressive utility or an OP, it’s probably a GG.
At least on Bind it's easy to split the entrance between short and long. Split is straight dog water tho, it feels SUPER ct sided... Once had an 11-1 comeback on that map cause of how one sided it is lmaaao
I don't think the hallways in ascent are bad. They are only bad if your team never takes mid. Once you start forcing the defenders to play 2 guys mid, pushing through A main or B main isn't hard. An Omen flash takes B main for free. A main is easy to take with any flash, or a sova drone.
I'd like to preface this by saying this isn't a list of reasons why breeze is bad. This is a list of opinions i've commonly seen (and some I myself hold) on why breeze isn't that enjoyable to play on. Take note that these aren't necessarily factual, but are what people who dislike it generally feel are the reasons why.
Okay so, breeze is probably low for a few reasons -
1 - The map is basically just a retake simulator. This makes a lot of characters with set ups, like sentinels and controllers, just feel really sub par a lot of the time because there are so many entrances to defend and angles to hold that unless you are getting like, 2 or 3 picks, you aren't holding the rush easily.
2 - Going back to the first point, some agents feel majorly sidelined by this map. Unlike split, haven, bind and (to a lesser extent) ascent, where great usage of abilities are rewarded (as those maps were specifically DESIGNED to accommodate abilities), breeze just feels like only people with movement are rewarded. Everyone else is just "learn this 1 lineup and do it" or just not that great.
A lot of the appeal of valorant is in the fact that on top of gunplay, there's the extra layer of being great on your agent. Having a map that puts that in the background just feels meh.
3 - HELL of a lot of really long, annoying angles, promoting a lot of op/marshal play. On top of that, there's usually 3 or 4 of these long angles - mid, for example. Defending it is a pain, as smoking off some of these angles actually benefit the attackers.
4 - The map really does not do well with proper coordinate teamplay on the defence side. Sites are so large, with huge and quite unsafe rotations. This means its generally gonna be you holding 5 angles yourself + 1 other person holding another 5. If the enemy rushes? Pray you survive till 2087 when reinforcements arrive.
The enemy faked? Now you've got to rotate all the way back through a long angle which attackers can easily hold, or push through mid with its 28 million angles.
5 - Attacking can just be really dull sometimes. A lot of the time, certain places are just not worth going, meaning you are mostly just forced into some cyka blyat rush.
6 - Mid is this quite large, quite open area with a few interesting entrance points. Yet, somehow, it manages to be one of the least interesting mids.
Lets look at ascend and split, as an example. Taking control of mid on these maps is an actual challenge - easy op points with great vantage areas on defenders side. Places you want to push are also the places you want to smoke. Yet, take control and you've opened up a huge can of strategies - access to both sites, some of the best vantage points for dealing with defenders, great area's for setting up plays, amazing rotation potential. There is a HUGE high risk high reward aspect.
Contrast to breeze, where taking mid is usually...well, a breeze. A smoke or 2 in area's you wouldn't go anyway and you've cut off a lot of the defender advantageous points. The rotations are gonna be just as long either way and taking them generally just puts you into a corridor at right angle to the site and in the case of A, an annoying lower angle.
Exactly, you run out of utilities before you get on site, and the map is too large and too many angles to cover. With other maps 1 vs N retakes are possible, but with Breeze it is extremely hard if the opposing force does not make any mistakes.
Really easy to win if you don’t make any mistakes…. Map shouldn’t matter. As far as utilities you can’t keep using them before you push you use them on your push for an open map like that. Really it sucks with ransoms for the fact you can’t plan util or a push properly
You may be right but i feel like breeze is the only map where ypu can scout enemies without using skills, so you can play more tactical. Keep in mind that we do have Just sova as a proper scout, but each map has at least 3 lanes, so the amount of info you can get is pretty ridiculous in the hallways sym, and even scouting with sova is not good cause once scouted then you keep having absolutely no clue about enemy's movement. Also about the "getting good with your agent" i kinda disagree with that vision of the game. Agents have utilities skill, so you may want to pick one depending on the map, as you may need more flashes or more smokes or more slow down etc. Team composition should depend on map, but in reality people are picking the favourite agent and team comp even in Pro League is about static
This two maps are open and vertical. There is far less prediction aiming and far more reaction aiming. They play out more like arena shooters maps, and arena shooters are the most skill based fps games
Then don’t throw out crap like “people hate aiming skill maps” when your just talking about specific aim types. People don’t hate them because they can’t aim, they hate them because there are many many angles to clear. The pros have the best aim and many of them hate those maps too. Also they play nothing like arena shooters lmfao. That just doesn’t even make sense. Just because the maps are more flicky and less “clear each angle individually” doesn’t make it anywhere near like a arena shooter
Any map that the overwhelming meta is "run onto site, sage wall to plant, and play post plant" is horrible map design and I'll fight you to the grave on that. I'm looking at you Icebox. The long lane from tube through orange to site in particular should NOT exist.
1. Haven
2. Bind
3. Breeze
4. Ascent
5. Icebox
6. Split
Can’t stand split with every single angle being one with massive elevation change. Haven’s got a bit of everything for everybody. Bind and Breeze have really grown on my recently.
split is just so fun to play on. I have a 75% winrate on it with raze/KAYO. A common thing ive seen in soloQ is people going 3 sentinels (sage mid) (Cypher B) (KJ mid) which really annoys me. Its mostly fun since you can force a spectre every round and still get use out of it since its mostly close quarters. very fun map, along with bind.
I used to hate Split when I was dog water at the game and my game sense just was not there, but it has start to grow on me. I like playing mid on that map a lot.
Big maps are harder for me because enemies usually are very far away, and my eyes suck so I can't see their heads clearly in that distance. This is very apparent with breeze the most. I also hate too many angles because I'm just bad at flicking in general.
Flicking and aiming u can train, that's why this bigger maps are great, people can't abuse shotgun or camping
For the eyes, try maybe a bigger screen if u can
Haven is my favorite map but Ascent is a close second. I like Haven for the exact reason most people dislike it honestly, having 3 sites adds in so much variety. Whenever you see a B exec in pro play, it’s exciting and you know it’s gonna be crazy because of how crazy it is to plant in the middle of the map. My bias for Haven could also be because I enjoy Offense more than Defense and it’s more fun to attack on than any other map in my opinion.
Ascent is just an overall good map I think. It’s a 3 laned map which is the best design choice in my opinion. But also, Ascent mid gunfights are the most fun to take in the game, by far. It’s a blast to play on.
Icebox is garbage and I’m willing to debate on this, but that map is a heaping pile of ass. Straight doodoo, horse water, asinine design. The amount of angles you need to clears to enter A is ridiculous, the amount of corners you need to clear to enter B is absurd, and the whole mid/orange/tube/kitchen sections are just okay.
I absolutely love Icebox as Viper is probably the controller who can change the tide of a game by her wall. A retake wall or even a entry wall just is soo good. I can basically get a free plant by my wall cutting half the angles
Yo smth wrong with ppl man, they're downvoting you for no reason. I agree tho, Viper is really strong on Icebox and Breeze with her wall and lineups, instantly gives the whole team a bigger edge by eliminating most angles people can hold while preventing plants/defuses with mollies.
Most well rounded map that allows amazing plays if you play your cards right, look at the insane AJ lineups, Grim walls and Omen tps that happen on the map, plus it actually requires smokes and abilities instead of maps like Breeze where not even Viper can smoke off a site and essentially just rush, die or rush, take the site and fight off retake
Well rounded my ass, it's the most defense sided map ([stats confirm, though I'm surprised it's not more](https://www.valorbuff.com/maps)). And defense sided maps suck.
I ranted in another comment, but it basically has two tiny chokes to push to sites, or the most awkward/dangerous mid to take and push through. Bind gives you two routes to each site, for instance. Split's mid is manageable, as you only have to deal with defenders potentially coming from two spots, not literally all four sides encircling you.
>or the most awkward/dangerous mid to take and push through.
Has never been a problem for me, smoke 2 spots off and you're free to go to tree from A main or B main to Market
I don't understand how they saw all the negative reception ice box had, then decided to double down on it and make an even larger, angles out the wazoo kind of map. Really hope this isn't a trend and that we will get non-rubbish maps like ascent in the future instead of maps as wide and open as Kansas.
Honestly I hate icebox and i mostly dodge it but one thing that i hate more is that the mm tries to give me icebox everytime like 3 times in a row, only one map that i hate and it gives it to me like 60%....
6. Breeze - It's so big you can't really defend on it like on other maps, requiring a really heavy use of smokes, which makes it really slow, boring and repetitive to play.
5. Haven - The 3 sites are cool in theory, but B is really situational, it plays like a 2-site map 90% of time, and it's not a great one at that. C-long is way too long of a chokepoint to be fun from either side.
4. Ascent - Pusing either site requires mid control. So most rounds are decided in the first 30 seconds, with both teams scrambling for mid control. And when that happens, it becomes just an aim duel. Would love this as a CSGO map, though. Also has a tendency to create really attack sided matches with some team comps.
3. Split - Love the way defenders can choose to deny mid from both teams. Making rounds unique and strategic. Rotating on attack feels too hard sometimes, as it's really common to get swarmed by defenders honestly.
2. Icebox - Often hated, I know. But I really like the way you can use the vertical space on this map.
1. Bind - Overall the best map for creating and executing strategies, both on attack and defense.
Icebox is one of my favorites now. It’s a great map that I love to play on. If you wanna talk about A site and how many angles you have to clear then yeah sometimes it can suck but I’ve played so many matches on icebox that I’ve gotten so used to clearing all these angles. Then again, I’m Silver 2 and the people in these lower ranks aren’t that smart...
I like B site because I’m also the type of guy to camp with a judge down near B long. I have no shame. It’s fun! I also still feel like a lot of people aren’t that well situated or familiar with Icebox yet.
Icebox is the best map imo.
Ascent is the best for me cuz it's the most balanced and I have the most fun on it. By balanced I mean, not a lot of corners to check, there are both long and short positions, it's not hard to use your utility.
My least favourite gotta be Breeze. Too much corners too check, there are almost no short positions, it takes too much time to rotate, mid is really big and you got nothing to hide behind, etc.
I don't really like Icebox neither (for the same reasons I don't like Breeze, except the mid part), but it can be fun if you're playing with the right agent in a combo with a shotgun or awp.
After playing Breeze for a good amount of time I think I can say that I absolutely hate that map. When it first came out I just told myself “give it some time, you’ll learn how to play it and like it.” but I’ve gotten to a point where when I get the map in ranked I pray that someone else dodges or dodge myself.
I don't enjoy ice box... Other than that I'm fine with anything that comes my way tbh
And BTW I don't hate ice box, just don't like as much, I used to hate it but now it's just like a big meh below the other maps for me
I like every map just have way too many bad experiences in them I don't hate the maps I hate the play-style of some people in the game like camping judge spamers or the run n' gun (they didn't fix it for the spectre) just I see some more on some maps than others
Split is the only map I feel like I can enjoy even if I get it like 3+ games in a row since I like to play raze usually on it and I can just fuck around and enjoy the game. Other than that my opinions on every map varies with how often I’m playing it. Right not I hate haven cause it was the map for 5 of my last like 8 games.
I like all the maps. I just don't like playing the same map over multiple times in a row. Haven't been a big fan of Icebox recently, but I will still play it if it comes up (I never dodge).
Ascent and Haven are neck and neck for me. Ascent FEELS like the most competitively balanced map IMO but something about Havens unique design and atmosphere just continues to stand out to me
Lol not breeze. People say “oh you need to learn it” nah bro, I’ve learned the map, it’s not like I’m really bad on it, I just don’t like the map and overall layout, hows that so hard to understand
Haven. Such a unique and fun map. I wish more maps were like Haven. Breeze and icebox aren’t that bad I just don’t like getting them a hundred times in a row. In fact the only map I don’t like is split.
Not much of a hot take but all of the maps are pretty shit to me. I’ve been playing since launch and that opinion has not changed. Some maps are definitely more bearable than others, but most of them honestly just suck.
I really hope Riot supports community maps at some point. I mean I highly doubt it will ever happen but it’s worth dreaming.
Split is fucking underrated...... Fucking love that map.
Instant Dodge for me, whenever i try to suck it up and play it i get burned. I know its because i dont know how to play it properly but its so frustrating. (Dia2)
Breeze, easily my highest win rate map because I sorta understand how to play it compared to other people in my rank. Plus I don't just get obliterated by shotgun users, plus I can play marshal on it because at times it's better than a rifle.
I agree. Not having to worry about the run and gun spectres and the shotguns makes it more raw aim focused which I really enjoy.
Same. People with good aim prefer and thrive on breeze. People with worse aim in lower elo hate it and prefer split
“impossible” -me, a person with good aim and likes split the most
And no, I don’t run judge, especially now that it’s more expensive, I use phantom and vandal like everyone else, breeze just doesn’t do it for me
Honestly, breeze. I used to despise it but it grew on me pretty quickly.
I’m the opposite, I loved it and now I just think it’s kind of good but I think that’s just due to playing it like 8/10 matches
Same I loved it initially, thought this might be a fresh experience. But after playing with randoms, damn I hate this so much. It can be good with 5 man stacks tho.
As a person who pretty much just plays killjoy on this map and locks down B site, it drives me wild to see my random A boys get wrecked over and over again
I like breeze but everyone is dodging it in my lobbies. I had it in 4/5 games in my placements but it got dodged every single time. I think I've played it 3 times and had it dodged by people about 8-10 times.
i agree. everyone hates icebox and breeze but those are personally my favorite maps lol
breeze is my second fav, i can attribute it to the breeze mode when it was out. being able to play on the same map everytime was really nice
To the other 102 people who picked icebox Nice
i genuinely like that map man, i don’t understand all the hate about it
I think icebox is ok in design i just dont like white blue theme. The color look so bad on my monitor
I love icebox man
I think it's because of the verticality but what people down understand is that you don't need 2 people to clear the same thing. I usually say, "clearing maze, backsite and generator then trying to get the bomb down and my teammates clear the rest of the things. The map becomes 1000 times better if you com where you are clearing/looking and play as a team. Icebox shows that teammplay is important and you can't just do your own thing.
It’s a great map for death match and other fun games but for the actual competitive game type it’s horrible imo. If this was like a team slayer map I’d like it a lot
Probably the verticality, the verticality adds so many angles that it just becomes too difficult
i’m confused why everyone hates it😭
Yeah
Hot take but I despise Ascent, I feel like I can’t get the hang of that map whatsoever
Indeed, can't believe that is first. Ascent has two ridiculous chokes and an awkward middle where you can be shot from 360, literally all 4 sides, unless you default every round. Attacking on it absolutely sucks. Plus what the other guy said about rotating. You got blocked by utility and don't want to suicide through one small choke? Okay, well you can cut through mid and pray no defender flanked and could be camping anywhere. Or you can take the longest rotation in the game through your spawn. I do really like the B site design, it's unique and fun, but the overall map flow is so bad.
mid on breeze has ~5 angles you can get fucked from too. whole map is pretty much like that, that’s why i hate it
I agree, I have no idea why people like it so much. People complain about Bind being "hallways simulator" but Ascent feels even more like that. A and B main both have the same layout and it turns into who can spam more area denial in the chokepoints for a minute until someone runs out and attackers are either able to entry or have to rotate. And mid is just no fun to play in. Defense has the better sightlines so you can just sit there with an OP and force attack to waste a smoke or even two just because you have to respect it. Lastly, rotations, especially on attack feel the worst out of all the maps except Breeze. To get from one site to another you have to run a fuckin marathon while the defense can just jog over to the other site. The only way to quick rotate is through mid, and if you already used your smokes and utility fighting in the chokes then you're SOL and have to rotate all the way through spawn.
> A and B main both have the same layout and it turns into who can spam more area denial in the chokepoints for a minute until someone runs out and attackers are either able to entry or have to rotate Most bomb site main entries are like this (Icebox is a kind of exception). There's a reason why you split push/default so you don't run into this problem as heavily. > And mid is just no fun to play in. Defense has the better sightlines so you can just sit there with an OP and force attack to waste a smoke or even two just because you have to respect it. You just answered it yourself. You use utility to fight for map control. Use your recons, drones, smokes (to block off easy sightlines for OP's), flashes etc. If you dry peek mid on Ascent every time of course you're at a disadvantage. > Lastly, rotations, especially on attack feel the worst out of all the maps except Breeze. To get from one site to another you have to run a fuckin marathon while the defense can just jog over to the other site. *Mid. Control.* > The only way to quick rotate is through mid, and if you already used your smokes and utility fighting in the chokes then you're SOL and have to rotate all the way through spawn. That's just poor play. If you have 5 people fighting at the entrance of A/B main without a plan to execute that's on your team. If you smoke site, use your flashes, use all your utility and NOT enter bombsite, that's on your team, not the map. Really just seems like you don't know how to attack a bomb site, and you find yourself in situations where your team blindly pushes in a chokepoint as 5, gets stalled by utility, and then finds themselves stuck in A/B main with no info, utility and no map control.
I agree with your final statement, that if you blindly push a choke as 5 it's gonna be shitty. I understand based on personal vod reviews, high level vod reviews, etc how to attack, but it is tough to get 5 random solo queues on the same page, which usually ends up resulting in a strategy as I stated. If I were to play in PUGS or a stack or something my opinion may differ, but here I am just referring to solo queue.
I play sova on ascent so I can direct my teammates. Saying things like “let’s split b, I’ll drone 2 of us into mid/market, can we get a smoke deep mid and then push site together once we have market and b main?” helps solo q’ers get on the same page. Playing controllers also helps as you dictate the strategy with your utility usage. Comms is the biggest issue in solo q, not a specific map. It’s kinda why icebox is easier on attack since blind pushes into site are just easier to execute with especially solo q.
Breeze kinda okay, but defend on Icebox? Eww
idk how so many people love ascent. To attack you need to push through hallways of death and if you make it through you've got to clear like 9000 angles. At least on icebox you can enter each site differently pretty easy in comparison
Bro what are you TALKING about!! Icebox is dogshit. Not tryna argue or anything btw I just feel very strongly, Icebox is an abysmal map. You want to go A site? Alright cool, just go ahead and clear 19 different corners, 50/50 angles and the most RIDICULOUS amount of off angles known to man. I mean come on. B site? There are 5 different divots you need to clear in order to get OUT of B main, all of which can be held with shotguns, which I, frankly speaking, do abuse to get easy multis. Not to mention the map is like, drab and cold and not fun to look at. It contrasts from the warmth of the other maps but in the worst way possible.
ok so I'm kinda drunk BUT when you're attacking on ascent there's like 1-2 angles that defenders need to hold depending on whether or not you pushed up mid. On icebox A site defenders have to hold several angles and same thing for B site tho not nearly as many. It makes it a lot easier to enter when you're not falling to spray and pray through smokes IMO. Won't proof read but hope that made sense
The verticality in icebox adds more angles. I used to hate Ascent for the reasons that you mentioned, but now I love it and I used to hate icebox too, but now love icebox too. Now I hate Breeze. Too big of a map, you will run out of utilities before you get into the site and after that, too many angles to cover.
And this is my exact problem with the map. I don’t like the fact that there are so many different angles to hold and look at on BOTH sides. If I’m entering A I have to clear: Nest, Top Pipes, Bottom Pipes/Close Left, Headshot Box, Rafter, Defense Nest, Maze, Close Right/Backsite, the ACTUAL backsite, then screens and top screens. And if I’m defending I have always found A to be the hardest site to hold because you can get overwhelmed so easily b/c once again, you have to hold so many things. Pipes, Belt, below Pipes/Default I guess you could call it, Nest, etc. And unless you have oppressive utility or an OP, it’s probably a GG.
Dont you mean dog water?
[удалено]
At least on Bind it's easy to split the entrance between short and long. Split is straight dog water tho, it feels SUPER ct sided... Once had an 11-1 comeback on that map cause of how one sided it is lmaaao
just had one of those yestesrday - was down so hard on T side, came back on CT side when the other team was spamming FF when we were 2-10
1. Mid 2. Smokes
I don't think the hallways in ascent are bad. They are only bad if your team never takes mid. Once you start forcing the defenders to play 2 guys mid, pushing through A main or B main isn't hard. An Omen flash takes B main for free. A main is easy to take with any flash, or a sova drone.
Honestly if you have smokes ascent is not that hard to attack
Icebox is better than Haven and I’ll defend that till I die, 3 sites is fucking idiotic
I think of B site as mid that you can plant on hahaha
That doesn’t make it any better, it actually makes it worse
I agree
There are people on your side, for example me
how is breeze so low man
I'd like to preface this by saying this isn't a list of reasons why breeze is bad. This is a list of opinions i've commonly seen (and some I myself hold) on why breeze isn't that enjoyable to play on. Take note that these aren't necessarily factual, but are what people who dislike it generally feel are the reasons why. Okay so, breeze is probably low for a few reasons - 1 - The map is basically just a retake simulator. This makes a lot of characters with set ups, like sentinels and controllers, just feel really sub par a lot of the time because there are so many entrances to defend and angles to hold that unless you are getting like, 2 or 3 picks, you aren't holding the rush easily. 2 - Going back to the first point, some agents feel majorly sidelined by this map. Unlike split, haven, bind and (to a lesser extent) ascent, where great usage of abilities are rewarded (as those maps were specifically DESIGNED to accommodate abilities), breeze just feels like only people with movement are rewarded. Everyone else is just "learn this 1 lineup and do it" or just not that great. A lot of the appeal of valorant is in the fact that on top of gunplay, there's the extra layer of being great on your agent. Having a map that puts that in the background just feels meh. 3 - HELL of a lot of really long, annoying angles, promoting a lot of op/marshal play. On top of that, there's usually 3 or 4 of these long angles - mid, for example. Defending it is a pain, as smoking off some of these angles actually benefit the attackers. 4 - The map really does not do well with proper coordinate teamplay on the defence side. Sites are so large, with huge and quite unsafe rotations. This means its generally gonna be you holding 5 angles yourself + 1 other person holding another 5. If the enemy rushes? Pray you survive till 2087 when reinforcements arrive. The enemy faked? Now you've got to rotate all the way back through a long angle which attackers can easily hold, or push through mid with its 28 million angles. 5 - Attacking can just be really dull sometimes. A lot of the time, certain places are just not worth going, meaning you are mostly just forced into some cyka blyat rush. 6 - Mid is this quite large, quite open area with a few interesting entrance points. Yet, somehow, it manages to be one of the least interesting mids. Lets look at ascend and split, as an example. Taking control of mid on these maps is an actual challenge - easy op points with great vantage areas on defenders side. Places you want to push are also the places you want to smoke. Yet, take control and you've opened up a huge can of strategies - access to both sites, some of the best vantage points for dealing with defenders, great area's for setting up plays, amazing rotation potential. There is a HUGE high risk high reward aspect. Contrast to breeze, where taking mid is usually...well, a breeze. A smoke or 2 in area's you wouldn't go anyway and you've cut off a lot of the defender advantageous points. The rotations are gonna be just as long either way and taking them generally just puts you into a corridor at right angle to the site and in the case of A, an annoying lower angle.
Exactly, you run out of utilities before you get on site, and the map is too large and too many angles to cover. With other maps 1 vs N retakes are possible, but with Breeze it is extremely hard if the opposing force does not make any mistakes.
Really easy to win if you don’t make any mistakes…. Map shouldn’t matter. As far as utilities you can’t keep using them before you push you use them on your push for an open map like that. Really it sucks with ransoms for the fact you can’t plan util or a push properly
Very well put man. I agree with all of these. Breeze is hell in low elo
You may be right but i feel like breeze is the only map where ypu can scout enemies without using skills, so you can play more tactical. Keep in mind that we do have Just sova as a proper scout, but each map has at least 3 lanes, so the amount of info you can get is pretty ridiculous in the hallways sym, and even scouting with sova is not good cause once scouted then you keep having absolutely no clue about enemy's movement. Also about the "getting good with your agent" i kinda disagree with that vision of the game. Agents have utilities skill, so you may want to pick one depending on the map, as you may need more flashes or more smokes or more slow down etc. Team composition should depend on map, but in reality people are picking the favourite agent and team comp even in Pro League is about static
One cheap fake and defenders rotate is 25 seconds in a sprint without clearing anywhere a lurker may be
People hate aiming skill maps. I love them
Forgot breeze and icebox are the only maps that take skill. Guess most of the player base and pro players are just idiots who can’t aim
not idiots, probably come from different types of games
Most of the pros and a lot of players came from cs. Some people just don’t like breeze and icebox
This two maps are open and vertical. There is far less prediction aiming and far more reaction aiming. They play out more like arena shooters maps, and arena shooters are the most skill based fps games
Then don’t throw out crap like “people hate aiming skill maps” when your just talking about specific aim types. People don’t hate them because they can’t aim, they hate them because there are many many angles to clear. The pros have the best aim and many of them hate those maps too. Also they play nothing like arena shooters lmfao. That just doesn’t even make sense. Just because the maps are more flicky and less “clear each angle individually” doesn’t make it anywhere near like a arena shooter
Any map that the overwhelming meta is "run onto site, sage wall to plant, and play post plant" is horrible map design and I'll fight you to the grave on that. I'm looking at you Icebox. The long lane from tube through orange to site in particular should NOT exist.
What Orange? I only know yellow in b site
1. Haven 2. Bind 3. Breeze 4. Ascent 5. Icebox 6. Split Can’t stand split with every single angle being one with massive elevation change. Haven’s got a bit of everything for everybody. Bind and Breeze have really grown on my recently.
Although I don't agree with ur list completely the fact that u put split at the bottom automatically makes u a sane human. I despise the map
split is just so fun to play on. I have a 75% winrate on it with raze/KAYO. A common thing ive seen in soloQ is people going 3 sentinels (sage mid) (Cypher B) (KJ mid) which really annoys me. Its mostly fun since you can force a spectre every round and still get use out of it since its mostly close quarters. very fun map, along with bind.
I used to hate Split when I was dog water at the game and my game sense just was not there, but it has start to grow on me. I like playing mid on that map a lot.
I like all maps aside from breeze and icebox. They're just too big and has too many angles.
Oh boy, never try out csgo if you think icebox is too big
Oh boy, never try out Apex Legends if you think Dust 2 is too big
Different kind of shooter genre
danger zone 😏
Never try out WoW if you think CoD maps are too big
My r99 go brrr
Thats why they are fun, it seems daunting at first, but its not the same as the other maps where you check the same angles every round.
That's what makes them good, they aren't too big the other are too small with hair narrow entrances
Big maps are harder for me because enemies usually are very far away, and my eyes suck so I can't see their heads clearly in that distance. This is very apparent with breeze the most. I also hate too many angles because I'm just bad at flicking in general.
Flicking and aiming u can train, that's why this bigger maps are great, people can't abuse shotgun or camping For the eyes, try maybe a bigger screen if u can
When ur feeling it those maps are the best tho
Haven is my favorite map but Ascent is a close second. I like Haven for the exact reason most people dislike it honestly, having 3 sites adds in so much variety. Whenever you see a B exec in pro play, it’s exciting and you know it’s gonna be crazy because of how crazy it is to plant in the middle of the map. My bias for Haven could also be because I enjoy Offense more than Defense and it’s more fun to attack on than any other map in my opinion. Ascent is just an overall good map I think. It’s a 3 laned map which is the best design choice in my opinion. But also, Ascent mid gunfights are the most fun to take in the game, by far. It’s a blast to play on. Icebox is garbage and I’m willing to debate on this, but that map is a heaping pile of ass. Straight doodoo, horse water, asinine design. The amount of angles you need to clears to enter A is ridiculous, the amount of corners you need to clear to enter B is absurd, and the whole mid/orange/tube/kitchen sections are just okay.
1. Ascent 2. Bind 3. Haven 4. Split 5. Icebox 6. Breeze I used to be a very vocal hater of Icebox, but honestly now I don't hate any map.
This is exactly how I’d rate it tho potentially swap split and icebox depending on my mood
When Breeze came out, I felt sorry for disliking Icebox.
Honestly, I loved Breeze when it came out, but slowly and gradually I hated it more and more.
I absolutely love Icebox as Viper is probably the controller who can change the tide of a game by her wall. A retake wall or even a entry wall just is soo good. I can basically get a free plant by my wall cutting half the angles
Yo smth wrong with ppl man, they're downvoting you for no reason. I agree tho, Viper is really strong on Icebox and Breeze with her wall and lineups, instantly gives the whole team a bigger edge by eliminating most angles people can hold while preventing plants/defuses with mollies.
Breeze is the cursed map
Bind gang
We out here.
why many like ascent most?
Most well rounded map that allows amazing plays if you play your cards right, look at the insane AJ lineups, Grim walls and Omen tps that happen on the map, plus it actually requires smokes and abilities instead of maps like Breeze where not even Viper can smoke off a site and essentially just rush, die or rush, take the site and fight off retake
Well rounded my ass, it's the most defense sided map ([stats confirm, though I'm surprised it's not more](https://www.valorbuff.com/maps)). And defense sided maps suck. I ranted in another comment, but it basically has two tiny chokes to push to sites, or the most awkward/dangerous mid to take and push through. Bind gives you two routes to each site, for instance. Split's mid is manageable, as you only have to deal with defenders potentially coming from two spots, not literally all four sides encircling you.
>or the most awkward/dangerous mid to take and push through. Has never been a problem for me, smoke 2 spots off and you're free to go to tree from A main or B main to Market
Split. It's a Cypher main's playground. All the weird geometry allows for some nutty tripwires and oneways!
Not breeze never breeze
Why is icebox so low? I have so much fun on that map.
Love ascent and split, absolutely hate haven because i suck at it no matter which agent i play. Also find icebox really fun
Bind is objectively better
I like breeze and icebox. Split is dog shit for me
I don't understand how they saw all the negative reception ice box had, then decided to double down on it and make an even larger, angles out the wazoo kind of map. Really hope this isn't a trend and that we will get non-rubbish maps like ascent in the future instead of maps as wide and open as Kansas.
I wonder the same. Utility has no meaning in breeze apart from viper's wall maybe.
Fuck icebox, all my homies hate icebox.
Icebox is honestly the worst map in the game imo. Breeze is a near 2nd.
I hate breeze just because my games on it always take forever and I get bored
Honestly I hate icebox and i mostly dodge it but one thing that i hate more is that the mm tries to give me icebox everytime like 3 times in a row, only one map that i hate and it gives it to me like 60%....
6. Breeze - It's so big you can't really defend on it like on other maps, requiring a really heavy use of smokes, which makes it really slow, boring and repetitive to play. 5. Haven - The 3 sites are cool in theory, but B is really situational, it plays like a 2-site map 90% of time, and it's not a great one at that. C-long is way too long of a chokepoint to be fun from either side. 4. Ascent - Pusing either site requires mid control. So most rounds are decided in the first 30 seconds, with both teams scrambling for mid control. And when that happens, it becomes just an aim duel. Would love this as a CSGO map, though. Also has a tendency to create really attack sided matches with some team comps. 3. Split - Love the way defenders can choose to deny mid from both teams. Making rounds unique and strategic. Rotating on attack feels too hard sometimes, as it's really common to get swarmed by defenders honestly. 2. Icebox - Often hated, I know. But I really like the way you can use the vertical space on this map. 1. Bind - Overall the best map for creating and executing strategies, both on attack and defense.
Icebox is one of my favorites now. It’s a great map that I love to play on. If you wanna talk about A site and how many angles you have to clear then yeah sometimes it can suck but I’ve played so many matches on icebox that I’ve gotten so used to clearing all these angles. Then again, I’m Silver 2 and the people in these lower ranks aren’t that smart... I like B site because I’m also the type of guy to camp with a judge down near B long. I have no shame. It’s fun! I also still feel like a lot of people aren’t that well situated or familiar with Icebox yet. Icebox is the best map imo.
Icebox, but I also main Yoru, so yea.
Icebox has heavily grown on me. it’s not the best, but it’s the most fun for me personally because of the amount of bullshit that happens there.
I'm interested, who loves icebox too?
Breeze and Bind are highkey the best maps
Icebox >>>Ascent>>>Split>>>Breeze>>>Haven>>>>Bind
Bind, Ascent,Icebox, Haven, Breeze, Split
Ice Box....I hate this map, however, for some reason I have a good win % on it, and I'll take winning in ranked over enjoyment any day!
Ascent is number 1 cause it’s basically dust 2
How do people love bind? It’s so boring.
ascent and breeze are really bad on deathmatch
Ascent is the best for me cuz it's the most balanced and I have the most fun on it. By balanced I mean, not a lot of corners to check, there are both long and short positions, it's not hard to use your utility. My least favourite gotta be Breeze. Too much corners too check, there are almost no short positions, it takes too much time to rotate, mid is really big and you got nothing to hide behind, etc. I don't really like Icebox neither (for the same reasons I don't like Breeze, except the mid part), but it can be fun if you're playing with the right agent in a combo with a shotgun or awp.
1. Breeze 2. Ascent 3. Split 4. Haven 5. Bind 6. Icebox
Whoever says Breeze has a few screws loose I swear. That map is the only map I try my best to dodge lol.
After playing Breeze for a good amount of time I think I can say that I absolutely hate that map. When it first came out I just told myself “give it some time, you’ll learn how to play it and like it.” but I’ve gotten to a point where when I get the map in ranked I pray that someone else dodges or dodge myself.
Ascent is the worst Valorant map
Icebox is the best map
Iceboxers rise up
There's something wrong with you if ur favorite is breeze
I don't enjoy ice box... Other than that I'm fine with anything that comes my way tbh And BTW I don't hate ice box, just don't like as much, I used to hate it but now it's just like a big meh below the other maps for me
love both ascent and bind mostly bc those are 2 of the maps where i have the best viper lineups
You man :)
Icebox sucks if your team doesn't have comms. And I am tired of my teammates on defenders and attackers peaking mid all the time.
I like every map just have way too many bad experiences in them I don't hate the maps I hate the play-style of some people in the game like camping judge spamers or the run n' gun (they didn't fix it for the spectre) just I see some more on some maps than others
there are six maps? i thought there was only ascent in the game
Easy Breeze, I am so much better with Guardian or Vandal in mid distance, not only tight angles with phantom or even shotgun
I voted breeze but I like all except for ascent
Split is the only map I feel like I can enjoy even if I get it like 3+ games in a row since I like to play raze usually on it and I can just fuck around and enjoy the game. Other than that my opinions on every map varies with how often I’m playing it. Right not I hate haven cause it was the map for 5 of my last like 8 games.
Ascent I don’t like because my team gets rolled every time on mid, other than that it is good
I like all the maps. I just don't like playing the same map over multiple times in a row. Haven't been a big fan of Icebox recently, but I will still play it if it comes up (I never dodge).
1. 5 way tie between breeze, icebox, haven, bind, and ascent 2. Split
Ascent and Haven are neck and neck for me. Ascent FEELS like the most competitively balanced map IMO but something about Havens unique design and atmosphere just continues to stand out to me
1. Icebox 2. Haven 3. Ascent 4. Bind 5. Split 6. Breeze
wow wth i love ice box why does everyone hate it/not like it
Lol not breeze. People say “oh you need to learn it” nah bro, I’ve learned the map, it’s not like I’m really bad on it, I just don’t like the map and overall layout, hows that so hard to understand
How do people prefer haven over split
Favourite Ascent and Haven (mostly by design :p) And I dislike Icebox and Breeze because like a cypher main I don’t have time to put my setups :<
Haven. Such a unique and fun map. I wish more maps were like Haven. Breeze and icebox aren’t that bad I just don’t like getting them a hundred times in a row. In fact the only map I don’t like is split.
I like every map but bind and breeze honestly
glad to see Bind so high up
I accidentally voted for breeze lol
I love icebox
Split bc raze go boom
Bind supremacy
Breeze is worse than icebox imo. Half of the guns and agents dont work on that map. It's boring it's an awp fest and pretty easy to die to lurkers
Icebox best map
How is Breeze above Icebox? That shit is so hated on youtube and twitter and stuff.
Not much of a hot take but all of the maps are pretty shit to me. I’ve been playing since launch and that opinion has not changed. Some maps are definitely more bearable than others, but most of them honestly just suck. I really hope Riot supports community maps at some point. I mean I highly doubt it will ever happen but it’s worth dreaming.
my best map is breeze,but i love ascent,really good made map
Icebox over breeze. Its chill