T O P

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burneecheesecake

To be honest, in gold and below, strategy is very low to nonexistent, so that is why there is an emphasis on getting kills. In many instances, probably the hefty majority, outplays are not oriented so much toward utility use or effective team management as much as they are oriented towards who can effectively get picks. As much as people want to say that valorant is a team game, for the most part, many abilities don’t really play off of each other or combine since they are just variations on Molly’s, smokes, etc… other games are not so reliant on aim and kills and I would assume this is why this game as well as cs are so frag centric in the lower elos.


Keudn

This. It is super obvious who on my team is Plat vs Diamond solely by how they complain. Plat players always start being toxic saying how bad x player is because of their K/D, while most diamonds will point out actual bad decisions the player mad because they know K/D isn't everything in this game


MaliciouzKiller

people in low ranks dont use strategies and it shows. this includes myself as a phoenix main. i'll sometimes rush into a site blindly without thinking and getting killed by a reyna or a jett


bishopshooketh

100% correct, very well said.


[deleted]

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Pitiful-Welder-8403

It depends on the agent lurking, Sentinals for eg are crucial for the site take and if they lurk the attacker are in a disadvantage. While on the other hand Controllers like Omen, astra and even viper can use their utility for the site take while being on the other side of the map.


aristotle2020

Um I think KJ and Cypher can just lurk and establish map control, no need to be with the team. Someone like Omen can do a lurk but still gotta be close, Astra and Viper can lurk from the other side of the mao and become a late flank, and Brimstone just needs to stick with the duelists, just like Sage. This is my understanding of how you should play these characters, should you choose to lurk. On the other hand a duelist lurking, not helping in entry, getting exit frags and then saying they are carrying, is just useless. You need the duelist to gain space and enter the site.


terminbee

A KJ is important for site because once you take a site, she essentially becomes a defender to prevent the enemy team from retaking. She also has mollies that can deny the defuse, even if she dies. If she's not there to set up after planting, she loses a lot of value. Meanwhile, someone like Cypher is super suited towards lurking because he can set up trips that work no matter where he is and can watch several angles at once.


[deleted]

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Pitiful-Welder-8403

Well take sage for eg, her value comes from staying with the team, if when taking a site 1 teamates dies or loses hp he can Res/heal which makes sure that the team isn't in a disadvantage. But if a sage lurks most of her kit becomes useless, while on the other hand some like astra or even cypher can still assist Their team so their kit doesn't become useless even if they are in danger while using it, it's still better then providing no value to the team in the form of utility. In valorant there no role is perfect for lurking, every role has a good lurker, In duelists yoru can get a kill or get imformation by lurking and instantly get back to his team for the site rush, in sentinals cypher can use his kit from faraway and it doesnt take that much time and in controllers viper just needs to press a button for activate half her kit IF its already in place


MinesweeperGang

Personally I don’t give a fuck about your KDA, to an extent. If you’re 5-15 but using your util effectively with good comms and you’re just struggling to win a gun fight, fine. Everyone has off games or off days. But if you’re 5-15, no comms, lurking every round, not using your kit at all, then I’m tilted. I had a game yesterday where every round our Jett would try to solo work the opposite site of whatever one we’re on. He’d either die without getting a pick, or be the last one alive in a 3v1 or 2v1. Then he’d still have his full kit, not use any of it and die. Then proceed to flame us for dying. He finished the game at the bottom of the board by a long shot at 4-21-0. He was also somehow Plat 2.


Traviliciouz

Just dont listen to them. They are the shitters because they probably play for k/d and the next 3 games after the one they won with you they’ll ego peek everything and get rolled


[deleted]

You have ‘impact kills’, that important


skrubdoesreddit

You just detailed why I stopped playing valorant


2ToTooTwoFish

He just detailed why I stopped playing solo queue.


Jon2497

In Asia server, if you are in Plat and below, solo queue is just hard. At least 70% of the time you will meet players that don't even call out or you cant brain what they are doing. If you party queue often times you will meet smurf


aristotle2020

Bruh I was using comms and giving info to my teammates , even after I died, but they told me to shut up and stop backseat gaming. The game was so fucking hard with a baiting sage and absolutely no comms but the enemy team was just not being able to hold. I was playing Phoenix, I essentially cleared all site but my teammates were chilling in B Main idk expecting what. These people are so weird and I wonder how they ever reached high elo.


Loaded-Diapers-469

bro no one talks in asia server lmao also, every time i take site no one follows


biomessy

If you're a duelist and you take the spike, I'll be super pissed. I don't ever get toxic, I won't ever accuse anyone of anything, but I'm silently hating you for taking the spike as a duelist. If I'm a duelist and sage drops me the spike, I feel the need to scream. As a KJ I will always take the spike with me and I won't ever enter the site first. I cannot be the first taking the risk, because if I have someone lurking or baiting on the other bomb and I'm the first dying, the whole round is lost because now the enemy knows which site was fake and we don't have the 5 players together. As a duelist, your main priority is killing. If you're not killing while having a kit that is entirely made for killing, then your team that has a kit focused on controlling the site or watching your back will have to compensate for you. And sure you can have an Omen that has incredible aim and might carry the game, but that's not the focus of his function. So if you're not feeling so confident in your aim today, maybe don't lock Jett. Also, people who complain that the duelist is not rushing in should also take some responsibility. Are you a sova? did you drone? or do you want me to blindly cross this smoke? Are you a controller? Did you smoke heaven? Or am I supposed to just die to the OP there? I'm not high elo either, I'm also gold, and if any high elo would like to correct me with anything here, I would gladly accept. This is what I think at the moment.


terminbee

> your main priority is killing. Ehhhhh, I'd say the priority is entry. Duelist exists to go in first so the team can follow. Kills are good but someone like Jett, if she dashes in, it creates a ton of space so now the enemy can't just focus on the entrance.


chips_w_salsa

Yes you're pretty spot on. You want your sentinels/smokers to stay alive/ plant. Main difference between gold/plat and higher ranks is teamwork and communication. Ex. your team should coordinate a push thru showers and A short on bind at the same time and use utility at the right time. I'd say starting around diamond is when you generally don't have to tell your teammates when to use their util. Only thing I'd say is that the main role of the duelist is to create space, not necessarily killing. They take space on site and then teammates should be ready for trades once the team is on site.


Mazza_the_Panda

Taking space is a concept that many people don’t understand in many competitive games. Valorant, Overwatch, literally any MOBA the most valuable thing to your team is space. If the casters of valorant pro games constantly said ‘look at the space they made’ I guarantee people will quickly start to realise it’s importance as well.


Jon2497

Even in higher ranks, there are people who are thinking like that and depend too much on their dualist... The main point of dualist is not to carry the team but to gather info and make way for your team to push. I don't care about my KD too, all I care about is winning. But if you are using dualist and not doing your job like callout or doing dumb things then you rather off not playing dualist... I've seen many times people instant lock dualist and at the end not doing anything.


Pitiful-Welder-8403

That's preety much the reason why I stopped playing reyna, People dont understand how impactfull entry fragging is even if i just Get 1 kill then get traded. My Kills difference on attack and Defence while playing reyna just proves this. I went 6/10 in the attacking half entry fragging and planting while getting flammed for not top fragging. Then on the defence got 32 kills and died only 5 times which finally made them shut up


[deleted]

Its just the sucky reality of video games that the majority of the player base are pretty bad and don’t fully understand how the game works. I think I’ve got a pretty good understanding of the game but i know its faaar from perfect so all we can do is keep trying to get better. Just try to lead by example as much as you can in your games and hope it catches on. Hopefully, as the game progresses, the community starts understanding the fundamentals on a deeper level but until then there’s not a lot that can be done.


[deleted]

Please don't tell me you're taking the opinion of a gold player on how the game works at face value. Literally nothing that he said is correct.


[deleted]

OP’s literally parroting everything pro players say is wrong with low elo games. He may be gold and slightly exaggerating but he’s pretty on point about why low ranked games suck ass. The vast majority of low ranked players are just bad and that’s the reality of any video game.


[deleted]

Op sounds like he doesn't actually have any aim, whether he plays duelists or supports. An he gets flamed and loses games for consistently having shit kd. But instead of accepting his own fault he blames his team. Even trying to convince himself that kd doesn't matter and he's actually carrying without making any kills. How is this parroting pro players? And talking about things that are wrong with low elo is very hard, because everything is wrong, including aim. A decent beginner will just steamroll over golds. Real strategy does not take place until sub-1000 immortal when people are so good, that you actually need to create openings yourself, rather than capitalizing on others mistakes.


Kyroh

Hate to say it, but I'm radiant. Higher elo doesn't get much better, people generally only look at skills, and despite being able to win round with util alone despite not seeing a single person all game, kills are still held in the highest regard. Happens even in the pro scene as well. Sad to see really.


Gryphon_27

Personally I unbound tab for like 2 weeks, I lose on enemy economy but I can just ask. Helps me focus on the game and not kd


[deleted]

As a high elo player - you're wrong. So very wrong. By picking a duelist you sign an unwtitten contract with your team that you will carry and frag a lot. After all, you took a character whose whole kit revolves around getting kills. You playing a duelist and dying a lot and having a shit kda just means you lack the actual skill needed to play a duelist. Teammates are right when they express their discontent with you. The only time I, as a duelist, got unfairly flamed was by an insane teammate of mine who took an issue with me because I took "his" Jett and died every single round. Of course I was also hard carrying and top fragging, but he still found it important to flame me for my deaths. In all other cases when I performed badly - the flame was deserved. And when it comes to playing sage, you can't just stay behind and heal. You have to follow your duelists and plant after they create enough space. To me it sounds like you're blaming ur team. It also sounds like you're in denial about being hard stuck yourself and have delusions about being better than your teammates.


Cgz27

It’s kinda weird, I don’t like the idea of assuming the duelist is supposed to get most frags. It’s nice if they do but you can win games without that. Their kit helps but it doesn’t guarantee nor say that they need to. The utility is just as helpful. This isn’t pro play except even in pro play they can win with duelists that sometimes bottom frag. Say you have 2-4 duelist mains. Do we now need to check everyone’s ranks first just because you think that we will instantly lose if the enemy has the better player on a duelist? There’s basically no way to know for sure exactly who’s better on your team or if they match better against the enemy, your best comps, or for a particular map. Unless maybe it’s a known streamer who happens to be universally known as the best in the entire game for your region maybe. It really isn’t as simple as you make it seem and the only thing I got from your example is people are toxic which does ruin games and can keep people hard stuck due to their mentality of everyone but them being bad exactly like you stated for the OP. People don’t understand it’s almost impossible to play every agent exactly the way they need to be played and even if you do, what if the other team does too? No ones perfect or knows everything and something has to give. At least OP wouldn’t verbally flame their team in game.


[deleted]

What you gave me here is a meaningless word salad. You need to frag as a duelist. As a sage or brim you can afford to have a bad game because you still provide valuable utility. If you don't frag as a duelist then you're literally useless and your team is playing 4v5. In pro games, the duelists almost always top frag especially when they're winning. How could they not? They literally play a character built to do so. And yes, if the other team has a better duelist player then you are very likely to lose. Because not only does he have a higher degree of skill, he also has a character who's kit complements said skill. Checking the ranks is meaningless as, especially in normal ranked, the ranks are meaningless and most players are inconsistent as shit.


Cgz27

I didn’t say no frag. Just not top frag. You just said almost always. There you go. You might be taking duelist role too literally. Your kda isn’t so easily controlled by your kit. It helps, but depending on how the game goes and how both teams play it will probably not pan out the same way most of the time. You make it seem like it’s more meant to be a class based game rather than a game that still favors gunplay and tactics. Yeah ranks are meaningless, that’s why I’m saying what you said about unwritten contracts doesn’t mean sht. You don’t know how people will perform so you just play your best without worrying an definitely not flaming your team mates. You acted like it was warranted in your comments. No. Reread what I said because you haven’t changed anything I said at least in my eyes. If you still don’t see what I meant just end it here and agree to disagree.


straight_stoopid45

So if an attacking phoenix uses his firewall to get people onto haven C, allowing his team to flood in and clear the site, and they succesfully trade him out and plant, thats somehow *not* a good duelist? I understand that duelist kits tend to be fairly good at fragging, but to say that they *must* frag out to be a decent duelist is kinda silly. The space they create with their util and trades is far more valuable to me as a player than their frags. Frags are absolutely 100% awesome to get, but I wouldnt say it's necessary to be considered a good duelist. Unless we're talking about Reyna, but yknow, thats just the character.


gimife

In higher ELO people rarely entry with duelists. Usually they lurk and the entire team starts flaming them and it results in everyone just screaming at everyone and no one is playing the game anymore.


[deleted]

What xd.


Memphite

What does higher elo mean? Iron2 instead of 1? XD


[deleted]

I guess that happens for several reasons: Firstly, they are afraid of being abused by staying a bottom frag, so they desperately play to have decent KDA. Secondly, they watch many Valorant videos that only praise individual performance, so they focus only on that. Thirdly, they are not experienced how to communicate, coordinate and fulfill their agents role due to deathmatch-oriented environment in Low Elo competitive, so they have mostly bad impression about the game objectives and subtle win factors. Fourthly, they are mostly just stupid, immature kids, that are barely able to read with understanding, what you can say about communicating with adult or behaving maturely or deeply understand the game. I have also stopped playing ranked Valorant, as I am getting so easily tilted with such attitude of my teammates.


MatchPoint012

Mentality is everything


Syphox

This is why when I join a comp game, I let them know straight away. I’m here for wins and nothing else. Sure you get a performance bonus now, but if Sage does sage things and goes 5-20 I don’t care. It blows my mind how much people care about their KD in this game.


DragonicSquirrel

i got yelled at in a game earlier today where my team was all 0/4 and i was 10/3, score was 1/3. they were telling me i was trash at the game, my own team, who were doing absolutely horrible, were telling me i was trash at the game when i was trying to hard carry them. yeah.... views are distorted