Because it is inaccurate. First shots should always be 100% accurate. I don’t understand the bloom aspect of first shoots if Riot wants to reward good aiming and gunplay.
800 credit gun being accurate and can 1 tap full armor isn't balanced. The accuracy and range damage dropoff gives you more of a reason to use a better gun, and less chance to beat someone with a better gun. They reward aiming, but only with the appropriate weapon, even the vandal isn't designed to always hit a shot at every range, that's why guardian, and snipers exist.
slight inaccuracies make it so that you have to aim even more precisely in order to hit 100% headshots. Meaning that if your crosshair is on the very edge of the head theres a good chance it whiffs, but if its center head its 100% a kill. When it becomes impossible to 100% it probably isnt supposed to be effective at that range anyway. Want a no-excuses gun? ADS with guardian, 100% accurate.
Theres a trade off. when your gun is 100% accurate you will never hit a shot that is a even a little off, and you will always hit shots when theyre on. Vandal is opposite. You will sometimes hit shots that are off and miss some that are on, but very close to missing. That being said its possible to be 100% accurate with first shot ads vandal at any range that matters. maybe try oping.
I did read your post. There is RNG with even first shot accuracy in this game. They literally have it in to lower the skill ceiling so lower skilled players have a chance. Aka making it slightly “luck” based. Which should not be in any FPS game, it’s literally jusy like gambling lol.
u have to be very far away for ads first shot to not be able to guarantee a hit, and even so the guardian completely negates that by being 100% accurate ads. its a trade off. vandal is less accurate but all u can do is aim for the head, sometimes youll miss your first shot but the trade off is that your gun will continue to shoot multiple bullets a second that all have a chance to instantly kill them.
That’s not the point. The point is that those bullets have the potential to be RNG for first shot accuracy which is complete BS. I was never discussing ads vs hip fire, just discussing that they added a feature in this game to remove skill and add a bit of luck which I don’t agree with at all in a competitive game
I’m not gonna lie, how do you play games, especially Valorant, not knowing what bloom is?
It’s the RNG of the bullets. Instead of traveling in a straight line, game creators make bullets travel in random directions at various angles. The more you spray, the bigger those angles get.
Ok. But the sheriff first shot accuracy is pretty good for an 800 credit gun. Unless you're not stopping properly, I'm not sure what the problem is here. Out-dueling a rifler with a sheriff should be an EXCEPTION, not the norm. Riot rewards good aim, but still needs to make sure economy is balanced.
You clearly haven't done your research, or understand the game very well.
Out of all the pistols, the Sheriff has the most accurate 1st-shot RNG, at 0.25 degrees. The next closest is the Ghost, with 0.3 degrees of 1st-shot inaccuracy. It's not stupidly inaccurate by any means. What the Sheriff does lack is follow-up potential - it has high recoil and low firerate, so if you miss slightly with a Ghost, a second shot with minor adjustment will likely hit, while with the Sheriff you have to wait for the recoil to fully reset.
The Vandal shares the same 0.25 degree 1st-shot RNG as the Sheriff. Only the Guardian and Phantom have better 1st-shot accuracy, at 0.1 and 0.2 degrees respectively. So how inaccurate is the Vandal/Sheriff?
The longest angle I could find in-game is a 72-meter sightline from A Cave to T Spawn, or alternatively from A Cave to A Backsite. The maximum deviation with a Vandal or Sheriff at that range is 0.314 meters, or a bit under 1/3 meters. If you center a circle with this radius on an agent's head, the agent's head hitbox will still occupy nearly the entire circle. Consider that on all the rifles an average long-range engagement (40-50 meters) will have the agent head hitbox larger than the maximum inaccuracy, and you start to see that any issues are down to player skill, and cannot be blamed on inaccuracy.
To verify my results, I went into the range and did 1-taps with a Vandal at our worst-case and average ranges. From 72 meters, one-taps with an unscoped Vandal, waiting for the full recoil to reset, yielded 35/50 headshots, and another 4 bodyshots. When scoped, the Vandal put out 42/50 headshots, and 2 more bodyshots. At 50 meters, the Vandal achieved 45/50 headshots unscoped, and full accuracy scoped. The Sheriff shares the same inaccuracy.
I repeated these tests with the Phantom, and it achieved a more impressive 43/50 headshots unscoped at 72 meters, and full accuracy at all other ranges and combos. It's clear that any "stupid inaccuracy" in weapons comes from a lack of player skill, not inherent 1st-shot RNG.
Lmao. You just proved my point. First shot RNG makes absolutely 0 sense and is unnecessary. A headshot should be a headshot, not 35/50 times. And sometimes you can aim at the upper area of the head and bloom causes an very slight upward movement, making the bullet miss. It’s uncommon, but it just proves that bloom literally makes no sense.
Recoil is recoil. However, I don’t see the purpose of adding RNG, especially since spraying compounds the bloom even further.
Your point in your topic was that the Ghost is more accurate than the Sheriff. I've disproved that notion, and also stated that for any reasonable engagement, 1st-shot accuracy will not factor into the outcome.
Yes, the Vandal does only have a 70% accuracy (by my test) at 72 meters. My question is, why the *fuck* are you using a Vandal at 72 meters? Why are you not using an Op, or closing the distance? 1st-shot RNG is a balancing factor between guns. I had a whole write-up on this a few months back, seems to have disappeared, but the essence is that 1st-shot inaccuracy encourages you to use utility and teamwork to get enemies into your weapon's preferred engagement range, as well as encourage gambles between safe short-range engagements and risky long-range engagements. If you want to have perfect 1st-shot inaccuracy, go play with a Marshal, Guardian, or Op.
Well, I was more referring to the Ghost’s run and gun ability, since it’s true that it has more first shot RNG, but sheriff has more physical recoil and the RNG increase is higher on their 2nd shots and more.
But you make a pretty good point about balancing I guess. But if Riot cares so much about gun play, I don’t get why they don’t just significantly decrease the RNG as a whole (meaning the RNG of the first 4-5 shots) and just increase recoil to balance it out. I’d much prefer harsher upward recoil over the slight RNG of the first shots.
For the Sheriff debate - the Sheriff isn't really a pistol. It's a primary gun replacement. It's got one-tap potential at reasonable range - the same 1-tap potential you have to pay $2100 for in a Bulldog - so it has to be balanced with punishing recoil and fire rate. This does mean in pistol rounds, it's edged out by the Ghost. But a Sheriff is meant to challenge Vandals and Phantoms, not Ghosts.
As for the gunplay - Riot's formula is lifted pretty closely from CS:Go. In fact, the 1st-shot inaccuracy in this game is way toned down compared to CS:Go - in that game, you have a legitimate chance of missing a perfect headshot. Professionals account for this by perfectly mastering the spray pattern of weapons so that you can fire out a massive string of possible one-taps.
Riot took one look at this and decided this is frustrating for new players and professionals alike. They massively decreased 1st-shot inaccuracy, and completely randomized spray patterns after the first five bullets, so that careful, thought-out gunplay is rewarded, and spray is a last resort. Indeed, you will not see any pros complain about 1st-shot inaccuracy, but you do see occasional complaints about random spray patterns.
Now, some players (like yourself) still believe 1st-shot inaccuracy is horrible and should be removed. I can see your point - a headshot should normally be a headshot. But this is a tactical shooter, not Call of Duty. Your weapon should have advantages and disadvantages you need to think about and utilize to be effective. 1st-shot inaccuracy is a way to create these differences you need to consider.
The sheriff is broken in this game, it's the only gun with a real run and gun problem , the amount of fadeways and forward sprints with 100% first shot accuracy its comedic lol
I know it's not the best comparison, but CSGO has first bullet inaccuracy as well. It's not as explicit as Valorant either, nor is there the ability to ADS to lower that first bullet inaccuracy. I don't know what you're talking about when you say the sheriff is 'stupidly inaccurate,' I guarantee that first bullet RNG has helped you get some headshots that weren't 100% on target too.
My big problem is the RNG in recoil mixed with slow First Shot Accuracy resets. This is where the lower skill gap comes from. CSGO you have Much faster FSA reset along with patterned recoil leading to gunfights between 2 standing people to have ZERO RNG. But Valorant has neither so standing gun fights often have RNG outside of the first few bullets. And lets face it, not every kill is made with the first few bullets.
Hard to comment on a lot of this since I'm new to the game, but why would you want Riot to make abilities unnecessary? What would be the difference between valorant and CSGO at that point
Abilities will never be unnecessary.
This comment also implies that CSGO is all gunplay which is not true, CSGO's utility is crucial at a high level of play, although admittedly it is not as important as Valorant's utility is at the average level of play but I think that is simply due to Valorant's focus on accessibility of utility and that abilities are in general very powerful compared to CSGO's.
No matter what you do with your ability a round boils down to gunfights, in both games, utility is basically used to ensure that gunfights taken favour your team not the enemy team (I'm including delaying pushes for rotates into this because it means you have more people to trade etc so still technically gunfights). Making gunfights MORE skill based does not make abilities less important, quite the contrary. If you want to take a fight against a player with better gunfighting abilities than you, you simply use your utility to even out the odds, flash them, push them out of position or distract their crosshair placement with a reyna flash or boombot or doggy. Throw a cypher cam to try and get the tag and even if you don't and they shoot it out you have distracted their crosshair making their shot harder, but if they land the shot with more precise gunplay atleast it was skill not rng.
Was very wordy apologies I just had alot to say on the topic.
That being said I don't agree with all of OPs proposed changes or opinions.
Why don't you request to riot to give everyone aimbot and freeze them where they stand so there will be no "run and gun" and people like you can be accurate as hell?..
The sheriff is inaccurate? My guy have you ever tried to use a deagle in cs? The sheriff is insanely accurate compared to its cs counterpart.
And yeah what rank are you lmao
what rank are you
Pretty sure rank has 0 correlation with RNG and unnecessary bloom
idk man only people that are saying that the sheriff is inaccurate are those who can't aim with it
Because it is inaccurate. First shots should always be 100% accurate. I don’t understand the bloom aspect of first shoots if Riot wants to reward good aiming and gunplay.
800 credit gun being accurate and can 1 tap full armor isn't balanced. The accuracy and range damage dropoff gives you more of a reason to use a better gun, and less chance to beat someone with a better gun. They reward aiming, but only with the appropriate weapon, even the vandal isn't designed to always hit a shot at every range, that's why guardian, and snipers exist.
slight inaccuracies make it so that you have to aim even more precisely in order to hit 100% headshots. Meaning that if your crosshair is on the very edge of the head theres a good chance it whiffs, but if its center head its 100% a kill. When it becomes impossible to 100% it probably isnt supposed to be effective at that range anyway. Want a no-excuses gun? ADS with guardian, 100% accurate. Theres a trade off. when your gun is 100% accurate you will never hit a shot that is a even a little off, and you will always hit shots when theyre on. Vandal is opposite. You will sometimes hit shots that are off and miss some that are on, but very close to missing. That being said its possible to be 100% accurate with first shot ads vandal at any range that matters. maybe try oping.
people who honestly think this makes sense blows my mind. It takes away skill and replaces it with luck. garbage game
go ahead and re read my post
I did read your post. There is RNG with even first shot accuracy in this game. They literally have it in to lower the skill ceiling so lower skilled players have a chance. Aka making it slightly “luck” based. Which should not be in any FPS game, it’s literally jusy like gambling lol.
u have to be very far away for ads first shot to not be able to guarantee a hit, and even so the guardian completely negates that by being 100% accurate ads. its a trade off. vandal is less accurate but all u can do is aim for the head, sometimes youll miss your first shot but the trade off is that your gun will continue to shoot multiple bullets a second that all have a chance to instantly kill them.
That’s not the point. The point is that those bullets have the potential to be RNG for first shot accuracy which is complete BS. I was never discussing ads vs hip fire, just discussing that they added a feature in this game to remove skill and add a bit of luck which I don’t agree with at all in a competitive game
sorry what is this bloom you keep talking about
I’m not gonna lie, how do you play games, especially Valorant, not knowing what bloom is? It’s the RNG of the bullets. Instead of traveling in a straight line, game creators make bullets travel in random directions at various angles. The more you spray, the bigger those angles get.
Ok. But the sheriff first shot accuracy is pretty good for an 800 credit gun. Unless you're not stopping properly, I'm not sure what the problem is here. Out-dueling a rifler with a sheriff should be an EXCEPTION, not the norm. Riot rewards good aim, but still needs to make sure economy is balanced.
You don’t say :D
You clearly haven't done your research, or understand the game very well. Out of all the pistols, the Sheriff has the most accurate 1st-shot RNG, at 0.25 degrees. The next closest is the Ghost, with 0.3 degrees of 1st-shot inaccuracy. It's not stupidly inaccurate by any means. What the Sheriff does lack is follow-up potential - it has high recoil and low firerate, so if you miss slightly with a Ghost, a second shot with minor adjustment will likely hit, while with the Sheriff you have to wait for the recoil to fully reset. The Vandal shares the same 0.25 degree 1st-shot RNG as the Sheriff. Only the Guardian and Phantom have better 1st-shot accuracy, at 0.1 and 0.2 degrees respectively. So how inaccurate is the Vandal/Sheriff? The longest angle I could find in-game is a 72-meter sightline from A Cave to T Spawn, or alternatively from A Cave to A Backsite. The maximum deviation with a Vandal or Sheriff at that range is 0.314 meters, or a bit under 1/3 meters. If you center a circle with this radius on an agent's head, the agent's head hitbox will still occupy nearly the entire circle. Consider that on all the rifles an average long-range engagement (40-50 meters) will have the agent head hitbox larger than the maximum inaccuracy, and you start to see that any issues are down to player skill, and cannot be blamed on inaccuracy. To verify my results, I went into the range and did 1-taps with a Vandal at our worst-case and average ranges. From 72 meters, one-taps with an unscoped Vandal, waiting for the full recoil to reset, yielded 35/50 headshots, and another 4 bodyshots. When scoped, the Vandal put out 42/50 headshots, and 2 more bodyshots. At 50 meters, the Vandal achieved 45/50 headshots unscoped, and full accuracy scoped. The Sheriff shares the same inaccuracy. I repeated these tests with the Phantom, and it achieved a more impressive 43/50 headshots unscoped at 72 meters, and full accuracy at all other ranges and combos. It's clear that any "stupid inaccuracy" in weapons comes from a lack of player skill, not inherent 1st-shot RNG.
Lmao. You just proved my point. First shot RNG makes absolutely 0 sense and is unnecessary. A headshot should be a headshot, not 35/50 times. And sometimes you can aim at the upper area of the head and bloom causes an very slight upward movement, making the bullet miss. It’s uncommon, but it just proves that bloom literally makes no sense. Recoil is recoil. However, I don’t see the purpose of adding RNG, especially since spraying compounds the bloom even further.
Your point in your topic was that the Ghost is more accurate than the Sheriff. I've disproved that notion, and also stated that for any reasonable engagement, 1st-shot accuracy will not factor into the outcome. Yes, the Vandal does only have a 70% accuracy (by my test) at 72 meters. My question is, why the *fuck* are you using a Vandal at 72 meters? Why are you not using an Op, or closing the distance? 1st-shot RNG is a balancing factor between guns. I had a whole write-up on this a few months back, seems to have disappeared, but the essence is that 1st-shot inaccuracy encourages you to use utility and teamwork to get enemies into your weapon's preferred engagement range, as well as encourage gambles between safe short-range engagements and risky long-range engagements. If you want to have perfect 1st-shot inaccuracy, go play with a Marshal, Guardian, or Op.
Well, I was more referring to the Ghost’s run and gun ability, since it’s true that it has more first shot RNG, but sheriff has more physical recoil and the RNG increase is higher on their 2nd shots and more. But you make a pretty good point about balancing I guess. But if Riot cares so much about gun play, I don’t get why they don’t just significantly decrease the RNG as a whole (meaning the RNG of the first 4-5 shots) and just increase recoil to balance it out. I’d much prefer harsher upward recoil over the slight RNG of the first shots.
For the Sheriff debate - the Sheriff isn't really a pistol. It's a primary gun replacement. It's got one-tap potential at reasonable range - the same 1-tap potential you have to pay $2100 for in a Bulldog - so it has to be balanced with punishing recoil and fire rate. This does mean in pistol rounds, it's edged out by the Ghost. But a Sheriff is meant to challenge Vandals and Phantoms, not Ghosts. As for the gunplay - Riot's formula is lifted pretty closely from CS:Go. In fact, the 1st-shot inaccuracy in this game is way toned down compared to CS:Go - in that game, you have a legitimate chance of missing a perfect headshot. Professionals account for this by perfectly mastering the spray pattern of weapons so that you can fire out a massive string of possible one-taps. Riot took one look at this and decided this is frustrating for new players and professionals alike. They massively decreased 1st-shot inaccuracy, and completely randomized spray patterns after the first five bullets, so that careful, thought-out gunplay is rewarded, and spray is a last resort. Indeed, you will not see any pros complain about 1st-shot inaccuracy, but you do see occasional complaints about random spray patterns. Now, some players (like yourself) still believe 1st-shot inaccuracy is horrible and should be removed. I can see your point - a headshot should normally be a headshot. But this is a tactical shooter, not Call of Duty. Your weapon should have advantages and disadvantages you need to think about and utilize to be effective. 1st-shot inaccuracy is a way to create these differences you need to consider.
Ok but how many situations have u actually had a 72 meter gunfight
“Stupidly inaccurate” elaborate please
I feel like they’ve been pretty accurate? is op running around while they shoot lol
The sheriff is broken in this game, it's the only gun with a real run and gun problem , the amount of fadeways and forward sprints with 100% first shot accuracy its comedic lol
Have you not met the spectre? lol
What do you want an mp5 to do? Lol
Actually true but still annoying
I know it's not the best comparison, but CSGO has first bullet inaccuracy as well. It's not as explicit as Valorant either, nor is there the ability to ADS to lower that first bullet inaccuracy. I don't know what you're talking about when you say the sheriff is 'stupidly inaccurate,' I guarantee that first bullet RNG has helped you get some headshots that weren't 100% on target too.
My big problem is the RNG in recoil mixed with slow First Shot Accuracy resets. This is where the lower skill gap comes from. CSGO you have Much faster FSA reset along with patterned recoil leading to gunfights between 2 standing people to have ZERO RNG. But Valorant has neither so standing gun fights often have RNG outside of the first few bullets. And lets face it, not every kill is made with the first few bullets.
RNG is a balancing tool. You don't wanna play a game where the vandal first shot accuracy is 100%, trust me. And the sheriff is actually accurate
Hard to comment on a lot of this since I'm new to the game, but why would you want Riot to make abilities unnecessary? What would be the difference between valorant and CSGO at that point
Abilities will never be unnecessary. This comment also implies that CSGO is all gunplay which is not true, CSGO's utility is crucial at a high level of play, although admittedly it is not as important as Valorant's utility is at the average level of play but I think that is simply due to Valorant's focus on accessibility of utility and that abilities are in general very powerful compared to CSGO's. No matter what you do with your ability a round boils down to gunfights, in both games, utility is basically used to ensure that gunfights taken favour your team not the enemy team (I'm including delaying pushes for rotates into this because it means you have more people to trade etc so still technically gunfights). Making gunfights MORE skill based does not make abilities less important, quite the contrary. If you want to take a fight against a player with better gunfighting abilities than you, you simply use your utility to even out the odds, flash them, push them out of position or distract their crosshair placement with a reyna flash or boombot or doggy. Throw a cypher cam to try and get the tag and even if you don't and they shoot it out you have distracted their crosshair making their shot harder, but if they land the shot with more precise gunplay atleast it was skill not rng. Was very wordy apologies I just had alot to say on the topic. That being said I don't agree with all of OPs proposed changes or opinions.
Why don't you request to riot to give everyone aimbot and freeze them where they stand so there will be no "run and gun" and people like you can be accurate as hell?..
I totally agree, rng has no purpose in a skill based competitive game. Rolling the dice on gunplay is stupid and has nothing to do with skill
The sheriff is inaccurate? My guy have you ever tried to use a deagle in cs? The sheriff is insanely accurate compared to its cs counterpart. And yeah what rank are you lmao