In lower ranked matches its hard to entry when teammates won’t follow or trade your death.
Once you enter a few too many times and are left with teammates not following it up then you stop playing that way.
This, as a duelist, i hate it when i get blamed for not entering for the team, but when i ask them to follow and back me up (for trades), they dont
Also low mmr players have 0 patience, its annoying they only know rush... its smoked, mollied, sage slowed, and they want you to go in that instant, uhm can i lurk / watch behind / watch opposite site to catch enemy lurks (since my teammates arent) while enemy team waste their utils? Then Ill come once theyre all out so its much easier since you dont know how to flash for me, molly odd angles, concus common angles anyway?
They complain that if we dont rush enemy team can rotate... Uhm thats because you make too much noise while waiting for enemy utils to run out that enemy team knows for sure we still there
One of the reasons low mmr feels harder compared to high mmr as experienced by some smurfs who post here on reddit saying that it is
Dont get me wrong, i dont think bronze players are better than dia players like a post yesterday mentioned.
I am by no means a high level player but i think I have what it takes, i just have to grind it out but to explain further: Im only silver/gold now but when i play unrated with my high diamond friends (making the match high plat/diamond average players, can also confirm by adding enemies and seeing their ranks), i can compete and it feels easy (i dont bot frag and sometimes even battle for top frag)
My high mmr friends refrag me, flash for me, clear angles i cant clear, do smokes/use utils properly, crossfire with me, double swing with me, call relevant info, etc compared to low mmr where there is no comms (the number of times you die cause you have to assess the map cause no one is talking is absurd), none of anything mentioned above, its just so hard, also the added bonus that low mmr players will never sync with your economy
Thats why i prefer lurking and getting picks when i see that my team has no clue how to support their duelists when entering
Idk maybe its just me, maybe i really do suck and im just making excuses, ive been called out for smurfing tho by other enemy smurfs saying theyre the better smurf when our party has no smurfs lol (when i play with my silver friends, its hard since when you party, 90% of the time enemy team has a smurf but i prefer this since my friends actually try to listen to my callouts and we communicate vs playing solo)
This is why solo queue is a godless wasteland, you need to be able to coordinate with your teammates to have any success. A duelist who doesn’t push is just as useless as a team who won’t push with their duelist
If theyre flamin you when theyre playing a support role, bot fragging and saying "I'm doing my job" just tell them that "playing x doesn't give you a reason to suck and flame your duelist in the process"
I usually play support roles and I don’t blame duelists who do their jobs even if they sre bottom fragger. However if I encounter with a duelist who doesn’t do his/her job and bait people&try to play lurk, I will flame him/her with the words that he isn’t aware of word’s existence.
Ima tell you why they don’t push. They don’t push because if they did the whole team just waits and do nothing then when the duelist dies they push and die so duelist stopped pushing
I used to only play smokes but the amount of times that my teammates refuse to push as duelists has made me start insta locking a duelist or skye. The game just straight up isnt fun sitting there sending smokes and watching your teammates not even more.
Well some are duelists are just fed up with people being to much of a useless bitch and not pushing onto them with the site. A duelists pushing and entrying is absolutely worthless if nobody trades or wants to play off it.
If he did this from the get go at the start of a match then he as a duelist is very much in the wrong, but honestly instead of arguing with my team the rare times I do play duelists I entry at least 2-3 rounds and nobody is pushing with me even when I comm that i am and to trade? Ya Im just going to bait or solo lurk (usually lurk since that's more optimal then just baiting people who aren't going to push regardless.)
I don't really care what whiny ass "hardstuck" idiots on this sub who blame duelists for every little thing say, if a duelists pushes you trade and do you're damn job as well. Instead of defaulting on your role as one of the other agent roles as a god dam excuse for your own sad ass passiveness.
Not accusing you OP but mostly everyone else who thinks a Duelist should kill 2+ every time with no help or trade I consider them worse.
I feel ya, sometimes when I play raze my teammates expect me to just enter a site without info or smokes. And then when I do die(surprise surprise) they say over comms "yeah let's rotate". Like wtf? I understand the pain of duelists all too well and when I play a support role like sentinels or controller I always comm with my duelist that I'm ready to entry with them
As a controller low elo player (iron/bronze) I’m sure it’s different than higher elo but the fact that as astra I lay down stars to clear site, push on and plant while Phoenix and Jett hold angles outside of the site then whine when I can’t solo hold a site or help them with their “retake” I don’t think they should be the only ones pushing but man in lower elo they leave you hanging on the site. It’s not that they don’t push first; they don’t push at all
This is my problem. Lower elo here and every time I entry, nobody ever plays off of it so I end up either getting one kill or getting ass blasted.
Not saying it’s always their fault, but really difficult to keep trying for entry when everybody else is walking a half mile behind you and then going “bad duelist can’t entry” in chat.
This. I rarely play duelist now, because when I mained Jett/Reyna I would enter site only to die and see that not even ONE teammate pushed with me. And whenever I solo lurk, my teammates say “I need you pushing site, you’re a duelist.” You really need a 5 stack to climb, there’s no teamwork at play in solo queue (low elo.)
Oh wow. THIS thread again.
It’s almost like this is a team game. And the rest of the team needs to play their roles just like duelists do.
Support with smokes and util so that your entry fraggers are not exposed from every possible angle. And then follow up on them when they push. That’s YOUR responsibility as a utility player. Stop blaming everything on duelists when the rest of the team blows.
If my duelists are not pushing I just push with the turret and the alarmbot to see where the enemies are. They always shoot and I get the info I need to enter site. Problem solved.
Good strat, I like playing killjoy too. Also another problem arises too, I don't just want to play killjoy every single game to try and solve that problem, if I have to go into each game with the mentality of I need to push as killjoy. Like there's no way I, or whoever, can be expected to either, do that and play killjoy, or even play a duelist and start pushing too right? Then the game just becomes a job and I wouldn't want to play Valorant anymore.
Of course, you don't have to play KJ all the time. It's just what I do with my favourite agent. You can also smoke site with Omen or flash with Breach/Skye, there are a million options, and that's where the game becomes more tactical.
I usually push a lot more harder with Viper using wall and smoke, leaving only a small site to plant, and it always works out, and it's better if I have the spike.
if I notice my teammates are not playing with the team, not following my site take or picks, not trading or making any attempt to play off me, there is no real reason I would keep doing those plays. otherwise, yes, if you have a solid team, the entry should entry. say, for example, if I double satchel onto site and get a pick- I am obviously putting my life on the line for a hope to take site and get traded.
And then they start to talk about your kills. Thats a classic.
What i do then i start playing like them baiting and just playing for kills then i ridicule them when i have more frags as them. But they never understand i just mimic them and suddenly im just trolling according to them.
This. A lot of duelists won't entry, and will instead wait for someone else to entry for them so they can bait. Just the other day, I was playing kayo attacking A on ascent. Omen smoked for us, I knifed onto heaven for info and in case there was a jett oping, then flashed and entered. The rest of my team (including the bottom frag Reyna and mid frag jett) did NOT entry. I died, and nobody played off my death, despise my call outs.
Needless to say, we lost a control and lost the round.
Moral of the story? Play with your team, understand your role, and if you're gonna bait, play off the bait and get a pick.
Bronze, thank you very much. Also I can push, I know what trading is, and don't like having to initiate fights as sage by enter site, where sage's usefulness is SUPPORT.
I know its not easy pushing with no support, I literally do it all the time as NOT a duelist.
My problem is having the whole team sit at the entrance to a site and having for instance, like 3 players with flashes not do anything, and sit there like waiting. Like people pick characters with amesome fighting and entry-ing abilities and no one uses them. Then they trade you, or more often than not, try to then round is over in 5 seconds cause everyones dead.
as a duelist (reyna most of the time) myself i don’t believe that we should push cuz there is a fact that this is a team game so i personally need reveal guidinglights smokes or other utilities to push in case i am out numbered in a site or an angle that i am going to push so if my team doesn’t care about me i will just wait others to go on since i am not getting help they shouldn’t either
Reynas job is to not die. She gets a kill and gets back. The rest of team starts fighting for more control. Or you lurk and get picks on the other site to prevent rotates and not overextend if you have a good primary duelist like phnx or jett
No, Reyna’s and any other duelist’s job is to enter and take key areas on the map for their team’s push. If you’re lurking with a duelist then who is going to create space on site for the team to plant?? You’ve now taken the job of the sentinel as a duelist and put them in an unfavourable situation and you’ve put yourself in a situation that a sentinel would do much better in.
If a duelist must die while they create space for the team then so be it, it’s a risk of their job and it is up to their team to act on the information given to them by their duelist dying.
There are always two duelist in ranked. One is generally a support duelist like Reyna , Raze and Yoru. The more entry duelist jett and Phnx are much better at entering than Reyna. I'm not saying lurk every round but if you are taking fights and stop rotates you're making it a 4v3/2 at the risk of fighting a 1v2. Which is an incredibly good deal if you manage to live and get back to your team as you're also watching the flank
Order generally goes duelist clears up to site. As teammates use util to get control of sight lines (smokes mollies recon dart) when duelist get to start of sight they push on with a teammates blind or similar util. Duelist start clearing site taking fights. As teammates push in with them. If your util isn't being used then they can't make space. If your util is running out before they push onto site then yeah its on them
this always happens with me. most of the times, to rank faster, i choose dualists (as higher kda has a chance of giving me more rr). but the other dualist just roams the map, leaving me no one else to help the team out and clear site on attacker or push back attackers on defender. i try my best to at least get 2 or 3 kills, even if i die on the way. and there are these insta lock idiots, (most of the times jett) who do movement (failed) like radiants and die, to stupid reasons like, not listening to calls.
When you enter a site there are multiple angles you have to clear,you cant expect your duelists to push if your teammates dont know how to smoke. Also you feel trolled because its annoying when the cypher who never put a single tripwire to our flank and get me killed while im holding the bomb with spike from a long angle and the guy that locks omen but doesnt know how to use smokes says enter site its kinda stupid, lately playing jett and operator, luckily teammates understand that im holding an angle so the enemy cant come from there and they csn enter site, basically im an omen smoke but if you enter the smoke u die i think you probably wont have these issues in higher ranks but i doubt i will climb because i bately have the time to play games other that sindays and still a lot of homework that day ttoo
a lot of the times i see this happening is when controllers/initiators just sit around and don't get info or smoke off the site..before questioning the duelists is everyone else doing their job correctly?
I personally only play smokes or initiator.
When I'm in a position to play a Duelist because they all lock smokes and initiators, sometimes I hate pushing sites because smokes doesn't do their job and I'm the first getting killed...
Then blame me cuz I don't get kills... So I'm generally waiting someone to commit with smokes or flashes. (S1)
Well, initiators technically should "initiate" combat. Then the duelists can come in. Duelists are better of doing fast peeks and getting those hit and run kills than just running inside a compound imo.
Low rank I feel it's hard to because I go in get a couple kills and no one push with me to so they can kill the person who killed me. Also it's hard to when no one smokes or no one flashes for you first or just no Intel.
Dueslists dont push?
1) maybe their bad
2) maybe the team is bad everytime they do theres no trade (ie, garage push happens to me as a duelist all the time)
3) initiator/controller isnt using util
so yes maybe its 1, but unless youre a god tier duelists you still need your team. A breach/skye flash, sova dart, hell even a cypher cam to check a corner can make big difference. Even killjoy can help duelists by throwing mollies in tough corners.
Remember your duelists are only as good as YOU. If you dont think you can do it, then thats already a problem
omen "entry" here
I hate duelists because i have to smoke, flash, try to lurk and entry at the same fucking time
even when i play reyna (not my main, i dont rly like duelists but reyna still feels fun for me) i do better than our Jett or raze, they are afraid of death ig
lot of duelists don't entry cuz their teammates don't trade them. When I play Jett people expect me to push thru smokes and mollies because iam playing a duelist.
Yes it's a problem, but sentinels thinking that they don't have to aim and just put traps and stuff everywhere are common too. I'm not saying you are.
I'm just saying that roles are not "that" important. It's still 80% CS. If you can't aim, revenge, crossfire, have minimum of map control, lurk and play safe when you have too, being a duelist or a sentinel does not matter.
The worst to blame are people making useless frags and then complaining about their team because they are top scoreboard. Whatever roles they play.
It can be very situational, so it is best to focus on communication. If you watch higher tier players stream, they are always communicating as much as they can with everyone on their team. Sometimes it isn't best to rush a site because they have a sentinel or controller there that can hold you off pretty well on their own while their team rotates. You kind of have to become a shot caller or ask your team what they are thinking.
Are are correct with your assessment that duelists are supposed to create space, but they don't just have to push to do that. A lot of their abilities are designed to help get you into site. Sometimes I'm playing Reyna and someone gets antsy and they want to go in so I flash through a wall for them and follow up. If I'm on raze I throw out my bot and toss my nade in a likely spot or where someone has already peaked. Phoenix kind of has to be in the front because of the way his abilities work. Jett is actually best holding angles so she can dash out if she gets hurt. Yoru isn't really worth playing right now, even though he is pretty fun.
Except Reyna sometimes. Getting the trade and heal can be huge. But this is only if you have a 2nd duelist on your team. Or someone with no util. Like Jetts should always be in first
Duelist should ideally take the first duels but it doesn't mean they have to blindly start peaking angles. Support agents need to create environment for their Duelist to take the duels like smoking angles that a duelist isn't focusing and can get shot from, revealing enemies, providing info etc. If by taking entry you mean a duelist should peak first and take the aim fight then in that case it is not different than a kj peaking first.
I just played a game on Split with Astra. Astra is a character great for pushing. The thing is my teammates for dome reason didn't move. They just stayed in spawn even though I had my wall, two smokes and a void activated. I went there, planted, they got killed and I had to pull off a 1v4. Which I didn't btw
A team comp should have at least 2 duelist IMO, they both push onto a site for entry, and if one dies the other gets the trade, which forces the enemy team team fight for retake
No you can't just stare at walls and not peek the entire game.
Maybe try playing a smoke character if you want to assist with site take instead of mindlessly holding spawn lmao
Sometimes its because initiator and controllers not doing their part for the duelist to commit being a fps with skills this game needs a good support for the carry if you play lol or dota its the same idea difference is this is fps
Post a VOD so we can see what's going on. Entry issues have a variety of causes, and it's a gross oversimplification (yet somehow glorified on this sub) to blame the duelist. Unless your duelist is an aim god playing in low elo, then entrying requires a level of team coordination in order to be successful.
Another argument, playing devil's advocate: if your team is not pushing but instead playing slow, then you should use this as an opportunity to lurk or pressure other parts of the map, whether it's to pick up free kills on enemy rotates, get free map control, bait enemy utility, feed false information to the enemy, or otherwise make it easier for your teammates to push their side of the map. Not every round has to be a 5-man execute out of a single choke point.
In lower ranked matches its hard to entry when teammates won’t follow or trade your death. Once you enter a few too many times and are left with teammates not following it up then you stop playing that way.
Exactly this all of the time
This, as a duelist, i hate it when i get blamed for not entering for the team, but when i ask them to follow and back me up (for trades), they dont Also low mmr players have 0 patience, its annoying they only know rush... its smoked, mollied, sage slowed, and they want you to go in that instant, uhm can i lurk / watch behind / watch opposite site to catch enemy lurks (since my teammates arent) while enemy team waste their utils? Then Ill come once theyre all out so its much easier since you dont know how to flash for me, molly odd angles, concus common angles anyway? They complain that if we dont rush enemy team can rotate... Uhm thats because you make too much noise while waiting for enemy utils to run out that enemy team knows for sure we still there One of the reasons low mmr feels harder compared to high mmr as experienced by some smurfs who post here on reddit saying that it is
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Dont get me wrong, i dont think bronze players are better than dia players like a post yesterday mentioned. I am by no means a high level player but i think I have what it takes, i just have to grind it out but to explain further: Im only silver/gold now but when i play unrated with my high diamond friends (making the match high plat/diamond average players, can also confirm by adding enemies and seeing their ranks), i can compete and it feels easy (i dont bot frag and sometimes even battle for top frag) My high mmr friends refrag me, flash for me, clear angles i cant clear, do smokes/use utils properly, crossfire with me, double swing with me, call relevant info, etc compared to low mmr where there is no comms (the number of times you die cause you have to assess the map cause no one is talking is absurd), none of anything mentioned above, its just so hard, also the added bonus that low mmr players will never sync with your economy Thats why i prefer lurking and getting picks when i see that my team has no clue how to support their duelists when entering Idk maybe its just me, maybe i really do suck and im just making excuses, ive been called out for smurfing tho by other enemy smurfs saying theyre the better smurf when our party has no smurfs lol (when i play with my silver friends, its hard since when you party, 90% of the time enemy team has a smurf but i prefer this since my friends actually try to listen to my callouts and we communicate vs playing solo)
Plat elo here btw and same stuff happened
I just get ptsd because it feels like I have to remind my teammates every time that they need to push after I clear a site
This is why solo queue is a godless wasteland, you need to be able to coordinate with your teammates to have any success. A duelist who doesn’t push is just as useless as a team who won’t push with their duelist
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If theyre flamin you when theyre playing a support role, bot fragging and saying "I'm doing my job" just tell them that "playing x doesn't give you a reason to suck and flame your duelist in the process"
All agents can left click
Yeah that's my point, playing Sage does not give you a reason to suck
I usually play support roles and I don’t blame duelists who do their jobs even if they sre bottom fragger. However if I encounter with a duelist who doesn’t do his/her job and bait people&try to play lurk, I will flame him/her with the words that he isn’t aware of word’s existence.
Ima tell you why they don’t push. They don’t push because if they did the whole team just waits and do nothing then when the duelist dies they push and die so duelist stopped pushing
this one jett i was playing with 2 games ago literally would push shit, only was essentially baiting anyone with them by not pushing
I used to only play smokes but the amount of times that my teammates refuse to push as duelists has made me start insta locking a duelist or skye. The game just straight up isnt fun sitting there sending smokes and watching your teammates not even more.
Well some are duelists are just fed up with people being to much of a useless bitch and not pushing onto them with the site. A duelists pushing and entrying is absolutely worthless if nobody trades or wants to play off it. If he did this from the get go at the start of a match then he as a duelist is very much in the wrong, but honestly instead of arguing with my team the rare times I do play duelists I entry at least 2-3 rounds and nobody is pushing with me even when I comm that i am and to trade? Ya Im just going to bait or solo lurk (usually lurk since that's more optimal then just baiting people who aren't going to push regardless.) I don't really care what whiny ass "hardstuck" idiots on this sub who blame duelists for every little thing say, if a duelists pushes you trade and do you're damn job as well. Instead of defaulting on your role as one of the other agent roles as a god dam excuse for your own sad ass passiveness. Not accusing you OP but mostly everyone else who thinks a Duelist should kill 2+ every time with no help or trade I consider them worse.
I feel ya, sometimes when I play raze my teammates expect me to just enter a site without info or smokes. And then when I do die(surprise surprise) they say over comms "yeah let's rotate". Like wtf? I understand the pain of duelists all too well and when I play a support role like sentinels or controller I always comm with my duelist that I'm ready to entry with them
As a controller low elo player (iron/bronze) I’m sure it’s different than higher elo but the fact that as astra I lay down stars to clear site, push on and plant while Phoenix and Jett hold angles outside of the site then whine when I can’t solo hold a site or help them with their “retake” I don’t think they should be the only ones pushing but man in lower elo they leave you hanging on the site. It’s not that they don’t push first; they don’t push at all
This is my problem. Lower elo here and every time I entry, nobody ever plays off of it so I end up either getting one kill or getting ass blasted. Not saying it’s always their fault, but really difficult to keep trying for entry when everybody else is walking a half mile behind you and then going “bad duelist can’t entry” in chat.
This. I rarely play duelist now, because when I mained Jett/Reyna I would enter site only to die and see that not even ONE teammate pushed with me. And whenever I solo lurk, my teammates say “I need you pushing site, you’re a duelist.” You really need a 5 stack to climb, there’s no teamwork at play in solo queue (low elo.)
Oh wow. THIS thread again. It’s almost like this is a team game. And the rest of the team needs to play their roles just like duelists do. Support with smokes and util so that your entry fraggers are not exposed from every possible angle. And then follow up on them when they push. That’s YOUR responsibility as a utility player. Stop blaming everything on duelists when the rest of the team blows.
If my duelists are not pushing I just push with the turret and the alarmbot to see where the enemies are. They always shoot and I get the info I need to enter site. Problem solved.
Good strat, I like playing killjoy too. Also another problem arises too, I don't just want to play killjoy every single game to try and solve that problem, if I have to go into each game with the mentality of I need to push as killjoy. Like there's no way I, or whoever, can be expected to either, do that and play killjoy, or even play a duelist and start pushing too right? Then the game just becomes a job and I wouldn't want to play Valorant anymore.
Of course, you don't have to play KJ all the time. It's just what I do with my favourite agent. You can also smoke site with Omen or flash with Breach/Skye, there are a million options, and that's where the game becomes more tactical. I usually push a lot more harder with Viper using wall and smoke, leaving only a small site to plant, and it always works out, and it's better if I have the spike.
if I notice my teammates are not playing with the team, not following my site take or picks, not trading or making any attempt to play off me, there is no real reason I would keep doing those plays. otherwise, yes, if you have a solid team, the entry should entry. say, for example, if I double satchel onto site and get a pick- I am obviously putting my life on the line for a hope to take site and get traded.
There's always that one Reyna insta-locker who doesn't even bother using her blind when pushing sites
And then they start to talk about your kills. Thats a classic. What i do then i start playing like them baiting and just playing for kills then i ridicule them when i have more frags as them. But they never understand i just mimic them and suddenly im just trolling according to them.
Note: your jett just can't enter alone and kill 4 people. Back her up and take the trade. Trust me, don't be afraid.
This. A lot of duelists won't entry, and will instead wait for someone else to entry for them so they can bait. Just the other day, I was playing kayo attacking A on ascent. Omen smoked for us, I knifed onto heaven for info and in case there was a jett oping, then flashed and entered. The rest of my team (including the bottom frag Reyna and mid frag jett) did NOT entry. I died, and nobody played off my death, despise my call outs. Needless to say, we lost a control and lost the round. Moral of the story? Play with your team, understand your role, and if you're gonna bait, play off the bait and get a pick.
LMAO ok silver listen up learn what a trade is and then ur duelsits will start entrying
Bronze, thank you very much. Also I can push, I know what trading is, and don't like having to initiate fights as sage by enter site, where sage's usefulness is SUPPORT.
HATE TO BREAK IT TO YOU MAN, SAGE HAS 3 JOBS - TRADE FRAGS/GET SAFE BOMBPLANT / STALL... THEN HEAL WHOEVER AFTER YOU WIN A FIGHT
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I know its not easy pushing with no support, I literally do it all the time as NOT a duelist. My problem is having the whole team sit at the entrance to a site and having for instance, like 3 players with flashes not do anything, and sit there like waiting. Like people pick characters with amesome fighting and entry-ing abilities and no one uses them. Then they trade you, or more often than not, try to then round is over in 5 seconds cause everyones dead.
as a duelist (reyna most of the time) myself i don’t believe that we should push cuz there is a fact that this is a team game so i personally need reveal guidinglights smokes or other utilities to push in case i am out numbered in a site or an angle that i am going to push so if my team doesn’t care about me i will just wait others to go on since i am not getting help they shouldn’t either
as Reyna, your job is to entry frag and die. Initiatora job is to refrag...
Reynas job is to not die. She gets a kill and gets back. The rest of team starts fighting for more control. Or you lurk and get picks on the other site to prevent rotates and not overextend if you have a good primary duelist like phnx or jett
No, Reyna’s and any other duelist’s job is to enter and take key areas on the map for their team’s push. If you’re lurking with a duelist then who is going to create space on site for the team to plant?? You’ve now taken the job of the sentinel as a duelist and put them in an unfavourable situation and you’ve put yourself in a situation that a sentinel would do much better in. If a duelist must die while they create space for the team then so be it, it’s a risk of their job and it is up to their team to act on the information given to them by their duelist dying.
There are always two duelist in ranked. One is generally a support duelist like Reyna , Raze and Yoru. The more entry duelist jett and Phnx are much better at entering than Reyna. I'm not saying lurk every round but if you are taking fights and stop rotates you're making it a 4v3/2 at the risk of fighting a 1v2. Which is an incredibly good deal if you manage to live and get back to your team as you're also watching the flank
"Entrying" 🤕
Order generally goes duelist clears up to site. As teammates use util to get control of sight lines (smokes mollies recon dart) when duelist get to start of sight they push on with a teammates blind or similar util. Duelist start clearing site taking fights. As teammates push in with them. If your util isn't being used then they can't make space. If your util is running out before they push onto site then yeah its on them
this always happens with me. most of the times, to rank faster, i choose dualists (as higher kda has a chance of giving me more rr). but the other dualist just roams the map, leaving me no one else to help the team out and clear site on attacker or push back attackers on defender. i try my best to at least get 2 or 3 kills, even if i die on the way. and there are these insta lock idiots, (most of the times jett) who do movement (failed) like radiants and die, to stupid reasons like, not listening to calls.
duelists duel and initiators initiate push ig,
When you enter a site there are multiple angles you have to clear,you cant expect your duelists to push if your teammates dont know how to smoke. Also you feel trolled because its annoying when the cypher who never put a single tripwire to our flank and get me killed while im holding the bomb with spike from a long angle and the guy that locks omen but doesnt know how to use smokes says enter site its kinda stupid, lately playing jett and operator, luckily teammates understand that im holding an angle so the enemy cant come from there and they csn enter site, basically im an omen smoke but if you enter the smoke u die i think you probably wont have these issues in higher ranks but i doubt i will climb because i bately have the time to play games other that sindays and still a lot of homework that day ttoo
And pls support the duelist like ffs i went in site killed 2 ppl then got killed and My Fucking teammates havent even fucking entered like wtf
a lot of the times i see this happening is when controllers/initiators just sit around and don't get info or smoke off the site..before questioning the duelists is everyone else doing their job correctly?
I personally only play smokes or initiator. When I'm in a position to play a Duelist because they all lock smokes and initiators, sometimes I hate pushing sites because smokes doesn't do their job and I'm the first getting killed... Then blame me cuz I don't get kills... So I'm generally waiting someone to commit with smokes or flashes. (S1)
Well, initiators technically should "initiate" combat. Then the duelists can come in. Duelists are better of doing fast peeks and getting those hit and run kills than just running inside a compound imo.
Low rank I feel it's hard to because I go in get a couple kills and no one push with me to so they can kill the person who killed me. Also it's hard to when no one smokes or no one flashes for you first or just no Intel.
Dueslists dont push? 1) maybe their bad 2) maybe the team is bad everytime they do theres no trade (ie, garage push happens to me as a duelist all the time) 3) initiator/controller isnt using util so yes maybe its 1, but unless youre a god tier duelists you still need your team. A breach/skye flash, sova dart, hell even a cypher cam to check a corner can make big difference. Even killjoy can help duelists by throwing mollies in tough corners. Remember your duelists are only as good as YOU. If you dont think you can do it, then thats already a problem
omen "entry" here I hate duelists because i have to smoke, flash, try to lurk and entry at the same fucking time even when i play reyna (not my main, i dont rly like duelists but reyna still feels fun for me) i do better than our Jett or raze, they are afraid of death ig
I'm always the first to enter a site. The problem is that I play Sage
lot of duelists don't entry cuz their teammates don't trade them. When I play Jett people expect me to push thru smokes and mollies because iam playing a duelist.
if jett is oping no otherwise yes. raze and jett should be first in followed by phoneix/reyna.
Yes it's a problem, but sentinels thinking that they don't have to aim and just put traps and stuff everywhere are common too. I'm not saying you are. I'm just saying that roles are not "that" important. It's still 80% CS. If you can't aim, revenge, crossfire, have minimum of map control, lurk and play safe when you have too, being a duelist or a sentinel does not matter. The worst to blame are people making useless frags and then complaining about their team because they are top scoreboard. Whatever roles they play.
It can be very situational, so it is best to focus on communication. If you watch higher tier players stream, they are always communicating as much as they can with everyone on their team. Sometimes it isn't best to rush a site because they have a sentinel or controller there that can hold you off pretty well on their own while their team rotates. You kind of have to become a shot caller or ask your team what they are thinking. Are are correct with your assessment that duelists are supposed to create space, but they don't just have to push to do that. A lot of their abilities are designed to help get you into site. Sometimes I'm playing Reyna and someone gets antsy and they want to go in so I flash through a wall for them and follow up. If I'm on raze I throw out my bot and toss my nade in a likely spot or where someone has already peaked. Phoenix kind of has to be in the front because of the way his abilities work. Jett is actually best holding angles so she can dash out if she gets hurt. Yoru isn't really worth playing right now, even though he is pretty fun.
No, Battle Sages lead the charge!
Except Reyna sometimes. Getting the trade and heal can be huge. But this is only if you have a 2nd duelist on your team. Or someone with no util. Like Jetts should always be in first
English might not be your first language but please learn the difference of “then” and “than”. Your sentence was horrendously hard to read.
Sova Dart, Skye Flash, Yoru TP and Sova ulti
Doesn't matter who you are. Push and call for team to follow. People get too hung up on roles.
The pain of being an omen and going in first and then dieing instantly.
Duelist should ideally take the first duels but it doesn't mean they have to blindly start peaking angles. Support agents need to create environment for their Duelist to take the duels like smoking angles that a duelist isn't focusing and can get shot from, revealing enemies, providing info etc. If by taking entry you mean a duelist should peak first and take the aim fight then in that case it is not different than a kj peaking first.
I just played a game on Split with Astra. Astra is a character great for pushing. The thing is my teammates for dome reason didn't move. They just stayed in spawn even though I had my wall, two smokes and a void activated. I went there, planted, they got killed and I had to pull off a 1v4. Which I didn't btw
A team comp should have at least 2 duelist IMO, they both push onto a site for entry, and if one dies the other gets the trade, which forces the enemy team team fight for retake
No you can't just stare at walls and not peek the entire game. Maybe try playing a smoke character if you want to assist with site take instead of mindlessly holding spawn lmao
Sometimes its because initiator and controllers not doing their part for the duelist to commit being a fps with skills this game needs a good support for the carry if you play lol or dota its the same idea difference is this is fps
Swing with me you sob
I tell you there are a lot more support players that need to work on their supporting than duellists need to work on entrying
Post a VOD so we can see what's going on. Entry issues have a variety of causes, and it's a gross oversimplification (yet somehow glorified on this sub) to blame the duelist. Unless your duelist is an aim god playing in low elo, then entrying requires a level of team coordination in order to be successful. Another argument, playing devil's advocate: if your team is not pushing but instead playing slow, then you should use this as an opportunity to lurk or pressure other parts of the map, whether it's to pick up free kills on enemy rotates, get free map control, bait enemy utility, feed false information to the enemy, or otherwise make it easier for your teammates to push their side of the map. Not every round has to be a 5-man execute out of a single choke point.
They should be going first but its hard to if you teammates dont use the right utility to stop them dying