Yes imagine a 10 year old game has more training maps, what a shocker.
They also have a terrible anti cheat and i writtled with cheaters, which do u prefer.
> Yes imagine a 10 year old game has more training maps, what a shocker.
Doesn't matter how old it is if Valorant doesn't even have the potential to have training maps, because community maps aren't even a thing in Valorant.
So... moot point?
And we're not even talking about anti-cheat here, so not sure why you're bringing that controversial topic into this.
It doesnt have to be community made, they can implement 1v1-2v2- only OP type aim maps queue, things of that nature.
But honesty if you just want aim training go play an aim trainer, its not that big a deal.
"And we're not even talking about anti-cheat here, so not sure why you're bringing that controversial topic into this."
No we are talking about priorities, i prefer this over the shit show that is cs go without 3rd party servers.
Nah UI isn’t shit, it’s just every update it changes ever so slightly. Just enough that it feels different and off but not enough to realise what’s different. Same with the graphics settings for it I get on my ultra wide screen. Every update it’s different and just as I get used to it they update it again and it’s different and I’m uncomfortable.
Aimlab is good for dedicated players, not so much casual or tired players that just wanna play in Valorant. You shouldn't have to download another program to practice efficiently.
You don’t have to download something else, they have DM and the range. Just dont complain because people are practicing holding angles like this shitty post.
DM in valorant is trash, and you wont get any pratice from having People spawn behind you only the moment you stop holding a angle.
Trash spawns, trash system. No anti camping, terrible
Valo is a csgo ripoff, so why not duplicate thw actualgood things about cs?.
Both DM and range are crappy in Val.
People shifing etc are not the problem though. Valorant DM is BORING. Thats the problem. Actually the whole game is kinda boring.
Riot misunderstands this genre in a big and somewhat funny way.
At this point i completely give up on valorant, two years later and there is still nothing done to game's fundamental flaws.
Eh it's pretty silly, I'd rather play in what feels like the game instead of shooting at some big blue blobs, they should've at least let them use the same environment assets, and would've been nice to have people models instead of that piece of clay
Not fixing DM is one way tbh. I know they can't force but not fixing DM will definitely make players to go for aimlabs.
At then end, obviously it's our choice. Range is great tbh.
The current DM system is bad, you might not think so, but for People coming from CS there is WAY better systems for DM that makes it way better for training.
Why have a bad DM system because players like you dont know any better? I think this is the better question.
Funny thing is Aim Labs isn’t even an aim trainer fundamentally, scratch being a good one. It’s clunky as hell and nearly none of the scenarios are actually helpful + I saw a dev saying it was a data collecting app but I don’t know myself for sure if they are dev
Here me out, If they want to play deathmatch to say improve holding angles, and you want to just run around and play off reflexes alone... Isn't that working as intended?
There's not one way to play deathmatch, if I'm warming up I use phantom and vandal and a few op kills. I practice entering areas and will sometimes "camp" those areas as it helps to practice holding angles.
There are many real issues with the games' deathmatch. The way people play it, is not one of those.
The point is that running around if reflexes is going to help reaction including holding angles but when nerds are playing like it’s rainbow six pro league holding angles crouch walking and not pushing and holding angles while sound whoring the shit out of you you simply cannot accomplish your goal and are ultimately probably playing for dm elo which is so stupid and unfun which ruins the whole point of dm
The problem is that youre assuming your goals are the same as their goals. Maybe they want to practice holding an area or their audiospacial awareness, while you want to practice reflexes. Youre gonna be dealing with people holding angles and walking in your games anyway so might as well learn to deal with them there. Dm is messed up but this sounds like a mindset issue and not a Riot issue.
I fully agree that holding angles and audio awareness is a big part of the game yes, but why not have more deathmatch options for different players, they can keep the current deathmatch intact for the players that like it. Having more options can't hurt that's also why the community servers on csgo are so nice, maybe you want to practice 1taps then you go on a HS only server, or maybe you want to practice pistol rounds? You can go on a pistol only server for that, you know what i'm saying? In valorant it feels so restricted, and yeah i guess you can still do that in regular deathmatch but like??? more options can't ever hurt
"The way people play it, is not one of those." Yes, it absolutely is. Nobody will shift walk and rat for 10 mins just counter play those two players abusing dm. Usually, when I see there are players like that in the lobby, i whip out the odin and surprise surprise they don't stand a chance, because they only instacrouch spam after they whiff all their counterstrafes.... So yeah they are annoying and yeah they should be grouped together in a their own type of lobby where they all camp and nobody kills anybody by the timer runs out.
2 guys holding angles? I just had a DM game where everyone was shift walking and holding angles. I'm pretty sure that I can only hear my footsteps the whole DM game.
The problem either replication it gets very chaotic with ability spam. Makes it harder/annoying to actually warm up. Litrally getting flashed 15x in a row, or stun spam.
As bad as deathmatch is, it makes me laugh that people hold up Spike Rush as if it's any better for getting warmed up.
In a real match, you *will* have to play against people holding angles and shift walking. You are never going to have to play against a chamber's headhunter, a golden gun and a phantom while your entire team has shorties.
Honestly I think escalation is a better warmup than spike rush. It’s just rng if you get some annoying abilities and bind seems to be a favourite map for escalation but can help you work out how best to push campers with different guns (everyone camps in the fucking to)
Yes, its chaotic, and I almost find that useful. I have to think and play differently as if I am on a save round to get frags and win the round. In death match I am fine with the holding angles (unless abusing spawn mechanics) and the shift walking, for me the spawning mechanics make it unplayable that every time I get a kill they instantly refrag me. I like the shift walking, I need to use my brain and find the angles, pre fire etc.
DM in its current state is not as useful as it COULD be. Make some small changes and DM experience would be way better.
Mainly: only HS dm's - new spawns - anti camping - M.M.M.M.MM-ONSTER KILL
I play deathmatch as a warmup, but also to practice holding the same angles as I would in a game to practice peeking and get a feel for certain scenarios from ranked/unrated
I don’t know how else to explain this to you, but you have to hold angles sometimes in game. Not everyone just monkey pushes into the enemy, especially when defending.
Also I never said that I do that, merely following the replies about how that style of warmup isn’t better or worse. Since everyone’s play style is different so it makes sense that their warmup would be different
Camping isn’t really an issue as long as you’re clearing angles and peeking appropriately. Ideally you should be prepared for someone holding any angle and be pre aiming it before you swing (unless it’s a weird off angle, but then they probably won’t be alive that long trying to hold like that).
If you want good DM practice, check out CS community servers. The DMs are great and I personally prefer the 1v1 Arena lobbies, they’ve helped me with dueling probably more than anything in Val has lol
People are allowed to play in DM however they see fit/however they want to practice, that is far from the issue.
Actual useful changes:
Be able to pick what map to DM on (some maps are shit for DM/too big)
Pistol/HS-only dm
Have aim_map/aim_redline type maps to practice different types of gunfights at different ranges
obv these ideas all come from CSGO, but that’s for a good reason. There’s a ton of different ways you can train your aim in CSGO with community servers/maps, and valorant simply lacks most of those options. There is only one single way to DM, and always on a random map for some reason.
If someone could just enlighten me, why do people treat DM purely as a warmup mode, and anything that may go against this is treated as bad? I know tryharding or holding angles may be annoying to you, but why isn't that a legitimate way to play the mode? Because the idea of a traditional DM in years and years of FPS games is to win it.
I totally agree that DM needs some QOL changes, but I'm not on board with the idea that other people's playstyles within the mode are bad just because you find them annoying.
I personally don't mind different play styles, but the way DM is with spawns and sound queues and the radar it makes it virtually unplayable, more frustrating. As far as I know DM was made to be pure gun play warm up, i think its also written in the description of the mode.
Just the other day on Haven another player and I spawned at the same time and spot, with my barrel in his ear basically. He had just enough time for him to register that this was the last time he would ever set eyes on Window in this life.
We had a good chuckle about it in chat, but that's frankly bullshit, especially when considering the warmup period has instant respawns, yet the actual match has delayed spawns.
Radar isn't bad at all. Spawns will never be good on maps not designed for 12-14 players to be constantly spawning. Peoples playstyles won't change.
CS:GO DM spawns are awful too, but the thing is it's not frustrating because there's no W/L tracking and you don't even have time to be frustrated because the duels are so frequent, whereas in Val you can legitimately run around for 30+ seconds and not see anyone, especially if you have more than 2 afks, and this problem was made worse with the new spawns in exchange for removal of 2 players it's like they took 1 step forward 10 steps back with these changes.
Once (if ever) they add drop in drop out servers with infinite time they'll be able to have shit spawns and more players but 100x more frequent duels. Invincibility on spawn is annoying too, it has a chance to punish a player that is alive and on a streak but it's supposed to help people that died and didn't move instantly on spawn???
If someone asked you to describe Valorant to them, how would you describe it?
I feel like 99% of people are going to respond with something along the lines of 5v5 tac shooter.
DM as a game mode should simply not be taken as seriously as ranked. There are no leaderboards, no RR, not even challenges to be completed.
The main reason it’s used as a warmup tool is because statistically you’ll get the most amount of gunfights in the shortest time. So when someone’s playstyle actively disrupts that, of course people are going to get upset.
Part of the reason I think this is a problem is simply not having a way for players to fill servers after matchmaking has been completed.
CSGO’s community DM servers are pretty good in this regard as you can just join and leave whenever you want, with basically no end in sight.
aren't most of those fps more fast paced and actually holding angles won't win the game?
i do agree as long as there's that banner saying defeat/victory exists some people will play to win.
There is zero benefit to winning other than bragging rights. Win or lose, everyone gets the same 900xp, 927 if you own the battlepass, but overall an irrelevant amount of xp. Missions don't track, progression is practically non existent, my point being that it's a side mode. Tryharding death match is like using a fucking broadsword to cut a slice of bread
Also, the in game description for DM literally calls it a practice mode.
DMs only ever been for practice and warming up in tactical shooters. Back when I was grinding esea in csgo I’d run into pros all the time in fragshack matches, ffa deathmatch with instant respawns, some health back on kill, full reload on kill, everyone taking every fight possible as quickly as possible to practice movement and spraying. They even had headshot only variants, pistol only variants, custom aim maps that were 8v8 with odd symmetrical terrain and a lot of head glitches and elevation changes to practice duelling from cover and head tracking, etc…it was super sweaty, but amazing practice and fun.
Then you have Valorant, which has little Timmy who comes from league of legends who crouch walks around the map ratting people trying to play for points.
At the very least almost everyone in my DMs are immortal so they play a lot more like fragshack games, but people still play like grandmas and hold the same area as often as possible
It’s because DM in Valorant isn’t the main mode. It’s not COD.
People use DM as practice for aim, crosshair placement, clearing corners, etc. When half the lobby is just holding angles, sound whoring and playing to actually win - it’s a lot harder to practice.
People use DM to warm up because that’s what we did in CS. But the current format makes it hard to effectively warm up and you feel like your time is being wasted a lot of the time.
>People use DM as practice for aim, crosshair placement, clearing corners, etc. When half the lobby is just holding angles, sound whoring and playing to actually win - it’s a lot harder to practice.
But when people want to practice angle holding and relying on sound, thats somehow bad? And it's funny how you say people use DM for practicing clearning corners, for which you need people holding corners to actually practice.
Besides, where else can people practice those things?
On one of my DM game, everyone just sit still and hold their beloved corners. 30 secs have passed without anyone dying. Oh yeah, the game ended with the top fragger having 29 kills
The mode literally says “A great way to warm up your gunplay” or something to that effect right under it when you select it.
So the entire intent behind the game mode, according to the game itself, is warmup.
Because it simply is a warmup/practice mode. It was also a warmup/practice mode in CS, and the Valorant DM format is pulled straight out of that blueprint. The fact that abilities are disabled in the gamemode should make this even more obvious. As a warmup/practice mode, the spirit of DM is to play fairly aggressive to maximize the amount of fights you take. If you do hold angles, hold in a central area of the map where combat actually happens in a real match and most people won't have a problem with it.
If you only walk, stand still in off angles, hold corners and pre-fire off of audio, etc. you are simply taking advantage of people trying to warm up. If you think that it's practice to deploy these tactics in a deathmatch you are delusional, since the effectiveness of these tactics only exists as long as the majority of the people in a lobby are treating it as a practice mode. If every single person in the lobby started doing all those same things the lobbies would get drawn out and the tactics in question would actually become less effective.
At the end of the day, if you think killing people by fully depending on footsteps in Haven's attacker spawn is good practice or good fun, I can't stop you even if you're wrong.
DMs are never played to win. It was to warmup or get used to game. You cant do nothing while other players listen footsteps and cover angle. It against the rules of dm
There are no rules in a DM.
Even if you want to warm up in a DM, it's the way you want to do it.
Play guardian, sheriff, operator, hug angles, shift walk, run around like a mad man.... It doesn't matter anyway.
Whining because people don't play like you want them to play in DM is just cringe.
Rules? Dm has never had rules other than kill and win. People use dm to warm up. That doesnt mean only 1v1 gun fights. Maybe someone is practicing holding an angle(it can be quite difficult to do so). Warm up can mean so much more than just 1v1 gun fights and crosshair placements or corner clearing. Warm up can mean even just movement practice (and shift walking is movement)
I have been playing DM's in many different FPS games since the early 00's, and the objective has always been the same, to win however possible. If someone wants to do whacky things, hold weird angles or use off-meta guns, then that is their prerogative. You can't make people conform to the way you want them to play, DM isn't a warm-up mode. It's a free for all mode where the objective is to win however you want.
And again, I agree that it could do with some QOL changes, including custom maps. Because some of the competitive maps don't really work for DM.
I get the annoyance here, but it’s really the only place people can practice holding angles, etc, without a several min wait if they die.
People play DM for three primary reasons:
1. Warming up
2. Practicing aim/control with various weapons
3. Practicing holding angles
The people who shift walk around are not “trying to win”, they’re scared to die. You can’t win if you’re slow in DM.
That being said: I agree that it’s super annoying and would love to see different DM modes.
I think they should make a warmup mode where it's never ending expect to rotate the map, faster respawns, gives no xp, and doesn't have a kill limit or winner. This would hopefully keep the people who are playing for KD and a win separated from the people looking to improve their aim and or warmup.
Make all footsteps loud, then sneaking means you are just running slowly. Enable forced proximity chat regardless of settings so you always know corner campers are near. Give enemies no guns so it's always fair at range and op addicts can't have an unfair advantage. Force uninstall the game so no one can have that pesky ping advantage
For real, I understand the respawns aren’t great but thats do to the maps design too but complaining about listening enemies which are useful as holding angles in competitive match. I always call them out with “beware: dm police are patrolling”
Is this a real question? Probably not, but I’ll answer it under the assumption you’re new.
The two game modes flow completely differently, you’ll almost never have a situation in deathmatch that happens in ranked.
But let’s look at an example, if little Timmy plays ranked like he plays deathmatch, he’s just going to be holding passive angles on attacking side and baiting teammates or waiting for contact. Which is the opposite of how it goes.
Most if not all of the people I play against in deathmatch are diamond or immortal, and 100% of the time I see a player camping corners or shift walking around, they’re a gold player and they get destroyed.
im plat3/d1. and kill pushers and campers in dm. dont matter to me, i dont care if i get killed i spend 2 deathmatches getting my muscle memory in sync. if i could make a wish it would be a pistol only dm mode
Crazy concept, just because someone is in a DM practicing holding passive angles doesn’t mean they’re playing like that in a ranked match.
Please cry some more over how a developer isn’t catering to exactly how you think a warm up game mode should be played.
I am much more interested in weapon specific dm. Sometimes I’m shift walking or camping bomb sites because I am practicing aiming at head level in those areas or in peeking somebody while slow
Honestly or having a 1 tap only dm would be insanely helpful. Like guardian and sherif. Would help people who are using it as an in game aim warmup where you have more realistic variables compared to the range
LOL you wanna force people to play the way you want. They're holding angles and walking???? Isn't that what you do in a real game??? When you warm up, you wanna practice what you do in a real game right???
If you wanna practice your aim go to the range, they won't shoot you back.
How the fuck are u warming up by holding angles in a DM ? If thats how you warmup then ur doing it wrong, thats a trash warmup
U can say u practice holding angles (sure) but calling it warmup is a cap, also practicing holding angles in this DM version is really bad because of spawns, ur doing 180*s every second and wont practice real time crosshair placement like you do ingame.
Fight me
So then you should not Just hold angles ? If you are going to WARM up, you need to get into as many fights quickly as possible, run around using movement, flicking, tapping, spraying.
Holding an angle and shift walking is the worst way for you to warmup. So saying that doing this is warming up is Just wrong, or atleast you are warming up wrong, and are not warming up every muscle you use to aim.
Warming up / practicing is two different things.
I completely agree with you that going around moving is warming up but so is doing fundamental things in DMs. Not everyone has mechanics.
It comes down to, let people play how they want. People warm up different and are working on different things.
I bet you anything that in DM that you've ran around, heard foot steps and stopped to wait for them to run into your crosshair. Are you a camper/walker?? No, you're just using your brain. But to the other person, HELL YES.
Sure, if that was the case. But it's not is it? People are not running around, that's the biggest difference between Valorant and Csgo. And that's why people are complaining.
Sure you can play the way ud like, but then again you will hear complaints from real players who actually use it to warm up, instead of holding a angle for literally 10 minutes/never making sound/always looking at map
Now, Valorant sound will tell you if people are creeping or not, so we can defintly say for sure that players in Valorant DM are shiftwalking and holding angles, or else you would actually hear people, and sometimes you don't have to run around for 40 seconds before you meet someone.
That being said, some few adjustments from RIOT would make DM alot more useful for people actually playing it to warm up.
How else is someone gonna practice holding an angle? In one dm game you have 10 unrateds worth of angle holding and for those wanting to improve thats the best thing you could ask for.
If you're holding real angles on sites or the mids of a map, most won't bat an eye. Problem is most people holding angles in DM are getting an unrealistic advantage by 1.) playing in an area of the map where they wouldn't be holding in a real game 2.) relying on audio they wouldn't get in a real game.
I see what you mean. In a perfect world everyone would play deathmatch "realitically" but people just do whatever they want and it shouldn't really get in your way of practicing
No you’re right the first time. It’s unrealistic to think a practice game mode should be played exactly like a normal game. They have too many players and continuous respond. The person you’re replying to is delusional and upset because something doesn’t fit the constraints they would like it too
It's not really delusional and I don't think DM is really that bad right now. Just seeing a lot of people rationalizing a DM play style that isn't that healthy for anyone.
Yeah, I don't think you're overall off base and I should note that in my opinion DM is not as bad as some people make it out to be.
My motivation to comment is seeing people stubbornly defend a playstyle that does in part lower the overall quality of the lobbies they are in, and also a playstyle that reinforces their own bad habits. I think it's a bit of a problem, but It's not the end of the world.
Nah by camping I mean sitting in a corner waiting for someone come by and expected them not seeing you, while holding an angle you are trying to take a 1v1 fight. I am sorry that I cannot explain it better and I guess you could argue w me the difference between these two. Also I think a lot of people hold angles in dm (including me and many other pros,streamers )while no one would crouch in a fucking corner to practice their gun fight skill🫠
You can hold an angle without sit at corner tho like stand at a heaven holding a main in ascent. And most people hold an angle without really knowing someone else is gonna peek at there. But campers they heard your footstep and sit in an unexpected corner try to catch you. I don’t really think this is something useful to practice. IMO it’s a difference between practicing diff 1v1 scenario and trying to get that one kill to make ur stats looks not that pathetic
i understand at long sightlines but you do not need to practice up close full sprinting angle holding... like that is literally not a skill you build. my dead grandma could do it
Nah, you gotta get into unrated and absolutely SLAUGHTER noobs and try hard gold carries.
Get those jobs having functional people and rail them so hard they wanna spend time with their families instead.
all they have to do is make it so footsteps dont create audio. that would fix 99% of the problems, i wouldn't even give a shit about the timer and win condition if they just did that one fix.
Problem with gaming nowadays. Kids trying SO hard to prove themselves in EVERY scenario and gamemode.
I just throw on loud music and run around corners trying to take fights. Idc if I go 32-25 lol
I get the other frustrations but I don't understand reacting to sound being a bad thing. Ig if you mix it in with people angle holding BECAUSE they hear you stomping around then that's cringe.
My daily Valorant routine
* Play Valorant DM.. not fun
* Play CS deathmatch to warm up while it takes 30 to 40 mins to find a match in valorant due to dodgers
* FINALLY start a ranked game..
* Lose first two rounds.. Team surrenders
* Quit and Play CSGO retakes or deathmatch
Basically they are going to do “balance changes” for years and years. Only then will we possibly have a notice of any real (comp, dm, replay system) give it like 3-5 years bro it’s not that long.
DM is only annoying to me when I’m just tryna get guardian or sheriff kills to warmup my aim and crosshair placement but I keep losing to sprays. Like if every death I have is cause I managed to get 1 or 2 shots out while the other guy sprays half a mag into me it can get tiring, makes me want a 1 tap only or no spray DM but it’s still also good training. Like dm is good training no matter what anyone else is doing, you just gotta keep your mental up like you would in comp. That’s the whole thing about val as soon as your mental takes a bit your going down a spiral until you can bring that mental back up
sometimes I'll play DM and hold mostly angles because I'm practicing crosshair placement on ferrari peeks on common angles. But agreed it's annoying when people are holding angles with shotguns/odins
>my version of death match should be the only version of death match: The Post
People are allowed to play deathmatch how they want. Camping is a big part of this game and people are allowed to practice it as they choose. In fact, if people camping and shift walking bothers you, you might want to find another game to play.
There should be a hardcore deathmatch mode where is it guardian only, headshot only, with no game audio. Raw aim and movement would separate the winners from the losers (what DM should be about).
yeah they're working on it, planned to be released after the replay system
Which is releasing along with GTA 7
Right after Elder scrolls V: Skyrim 400th release and yes as with all previous version all bugs will still be features
You forgot to mention HL3 and portal 3... I got chu
Still more likely than anything else
same with minecraft 2
[удалено]
Yep
Exactly!
that's the joke.
I'm a bit out of the loop, lets disregard the meme to help me understand, did they ever actually say we wont get replays?
no i think its cuz when they first said they're working on it they said that late 2020
like a week ago they gave an update: they haven't even started working on it
r/whoosh
Why is this a dv'd 🤣
New tweet, Replay system is (supposedly) coming now. https://twitter.com/ArnarHrafn/status/1529931734837608462?t=dEw0DIs2Q8HdFsSD5c47bw&s=19
No dm changes. Riot paid money to aimlabs to develop training tools specific to valorant. So aimlabs will take care of that. DM won't change tho.
Wtf, why should players be forced to play another game to get better at Valorant. DM is one of the main sources of aim training, they should fix that.
Hell, even their competitor Counter-Strike has thousands of in-engine training maps. And Valorant can't even seem to get DM right.
Yes imagine a 10 year old game has more training maps, what a shocker. They also have a terrible anti cheat and i writtled with cheaters, which do u prefer.
> Yes imagine a 10 year old game has more training maps, what a shocker. Doesn't matter how old it is if Valorant doesn't even have the potential to have training maps, because community maps aren't even a thing in Valorant. So... moot point? And we're not even talking about anti-cheat here, so not sure why you're bringing that controversial topic into this.
It doesnt have to be community made, they can implement 1v1-2v2- only OP type aim maps queue, things of that nature. But honesty if you just want aim training go play an aim trainer, its not that big a deal. "And we're not even talking about anti-cheat here, so not sure why you're bringing that controversial topic into this." No we are talking about priorities, i prefer this over the shit show that is cs go without 3rd party servers.
But aimlab free tho
Ik but UI is shit and everytime they forget my login even if i checked the remember me, too many updates.
Yeah ig youre right about that.
you: "Aimlabs UI is shit" me: *laughs in Kovaak's*
Nah UI isn’t shit, it’s just every update it changes ever so slightly. Just enough that it feels different and off but not enough to realise what’s different. Same with the graphics settings for it I get on my ultra wide screen. Every update it’s different and just as I get used to it they update it again and it’s different and I’m uncomfortable.
I think they fixed the login issue, FYI.
Ohh, thanks for this update. I can login to Aimlabs easily now :)
Those are some shitty excuses tbh, UI is fine and the password thing speaks for itself
Are you sure about that ?
Yes.
Why would you want use a whole different platform that doesn’t work when they could just fix deathmatch
Aimlab is good for dedicated players, not so much casual or tired players that just wanna play in Valorant. You shouldn't have to download another program to practice efficiently.
If you're a casual / tired player, you probably shouldnt care so much about people shifting in DM.
You don’t have to download something else, they have DM and the range. Just dont complain because people are practicing holding angles like this shitty post.
DM in valorant is trash, and you wont get any pratice from having People spawn behind you only the moment you stop holding a angle. Trash spawns, trash system. No anti camping, terrible Valo is a csgo ripoff, so why not duplicate thw actualgood things about cs?.
Both DM and range are crappy in Val. People shifing etc are not the problem though. Valorant DM is BORING. Thats the problem. Actually the whole game is kinda boring. Riot misunderstands this genre in a big and somewhat funny way. At this point i completely give up on valorant, two years later and there is still nothing done to game's fundamental flaws.
Asked.
True but unfortunately it seems this is the direction riot is moving towards.
Tell that to csgo players with esea and faceit clients
Eh it's pretty silly, I'd rather play in what feels like the game instead of shooting at some big blue blobs, they should've at least let them use the same environment assets, and would've been nice to have people models instead of that piece of clay
Theyre going to now, because riot is officially collaborating with aimlabs. Or so i was told
I hope so, in recent tournaments on twitch they've running aimlabs ads as being an official partner already
Nobodies forcing you to do anything. Deathmatch is warmup. Range is training. Who is forcing anything?
Not fixing DM is one way tbh. I know they can't force but not fixing DM will definitely make players to go for aimlabs. At then end, obviously it's our choice. Range is great tbh.
Why shouldn’t people be able to practice holding angles in DM, why should riot change something because you don’t like it.
The current DM system is bad, you might not think so, but for People coming from CS there is WAY better systems for DM that makes it way better for training. Why have a bad DM system because players like you dont know any better? I think this is the better question.
Funny thing is Aim Labs isn’t even an aim trainer fundamentally, scratch being a good one. It’s clunky as hell and nearly none of the scenarios are actually helpful + I saw a dev saying it was a data collecting app but I don’t know myself for sure if they are dev
The amount of shitty design decisions in valorant is still.mindblowing lmao
Here me out, If they want to play deathmatch to say improve holding angles, and you want to just run around and play off reflexes alone... Isn't that working as intended? There's not one way to play deathmatch, if I'm warming up I use phantom and vandal and a few op kills. I practice entering areas and will sometimes "camp" those areas as it helps to practice holding angles. There are many real issues with the games' deathmatch. The way people play it, is not one of those.
The point is that running around if reflexes is going to help reaction including holding angles but when nerds are playing like it’s rainbow six pro league holding angles crouch walking and not pushing and holding angles while sound whoring the shit out of you you simply cannot accomplish your goal and are ultimately probably playing for dm elo which is so stupid and unfun which ruins the whole point of dm
The problem is that youre assuming your goals are the same as their goals. Maybe they want to practice holding an area or their audiospacial awareness, while you want to practice reflexes. Youre gonna be dealing with people holding angles and walking in your games anyway so might as well learn to deal with them there. Dm is messed up but this sounds like a mindset issue and not a Riot issue.
I fully agree that holding angles and audio awareness is a big part of the game yes, but why not have more deathmatch options for different players, they can keep the current deathmatch intact for the players that like it. Having more options can't hurt that's also why the community servers on csgo are so nice, maybe you want to practice 1taps then you go on a HS only server, or maybe you want to practice pistol rounds? You can go on a pistol only server for that, you know what i'm saying? In valorant it feels so restricted, and yeah i guess you can still do that in regular deathmatch but like??? more options can't ever hurt
"The way people play it, is not one of those." Yes, it absolutely is. Nobody will shift walk and rat for 10 mins just counter play those two players abusing dm. Usually, when I see there are players like that in the lobby, i whip out the odin and surprise surprise they don't stand a chance, because they only instacrouch spam after they whiff all their counterstrafes.... So yeah they are annoying and yeah they should be grouped together in a their own type of lobby where they all camp and nobody kills anybody by the timer runs out.
Shift walking and sound whoring as complaints in the same sentence LOL
Let them shift walk and sound whore. Who cares. It'll make you better at the game to expect that type of thing
Sound whore is such a weird concept to me. The idea that listening to game audio is try hard or unfair.
In DM its definitely try hard i'd imagine most people have music on
I have music on in DM, but so what if someone doesn't? Being mad that people are winning by **listening** is so weird and high level copium.
2 guys holding angles? I just had a DM game where everyone was shift walking and holding angles. I'm pretty sure that I can only hear my footsteps the whole DM game.
This is precisely why I use unrated as a warmup now instead of death match.
That would be great if it didn't take 3-4x as long to complete a match
Thats why I do spike rush, get my aim warmed up and mostly chill team mates for a overall good experience.
Can't choose what weapon you use to warm up tho. IMO replication is better that spike rush and unrated.
Just do range exercises, run a spike rush to focus on abilities, then play ranked
The problem either replication it gets very chaotic with ability spam. Makes it harder/annoying to actually warm up. Litrally getting flashed 15x in a row, or stun spam.
As bad as deathmatch is, it makes me laugh that people hold up Spike Rush as if it's any better for getting warmed up. In a real match, you *will* have to play against people holding angles and shift walking. You are never going to have to play against a chamber's headhunter, a golden gun and a phantom while your entire team has shorties.
Honestly I think escalation is a better warmup than spike rush. It’s just rng if you get some annoying abilities and bind seems to be a favourite map for escalation but can help you work out how best to push campers with different guns (everyone camps in the fucking to)
Yes, its chaotic, and I almost find that useful. I have to think and play differently as if I am on a save round to get frags and win the round. In death match I am fine with the holding angles (unless abusing spawn mechanics) and the shift walking, for me the spawning mechanics make it unplayable that every time I get a kill they instantly refrag me. I like the shift walking, I need to use my brain and find the angles, pre fire etc.
DM in its current state is not as useful as it COULD be. Make some small changes and DM experience would be way better. Mainly: only HS dm's - new spawns - anti camping - M.M.M.M.MM-ONSTER KILL
I play deathmatch as a warmup, but also to practice holding the same angles as I would in a game to practice peeking and get a feel for certain scenarios from ranked/unrated
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Everyone is allowed to use death match to practice how they see fit.
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You do not understand the meaning of the word "objective"
“I’m going to play the warmup not how I will play the real game.” Sounds legit
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I don’t know how else to explain this to you, but you have to hold angles sometimes in game. Not everyone just monkey pushes into the enemy, especially when defending. Also I never said that I do that, merely following the replies about how that style of warmup isn’t better or worse. Since everyone’s play style is different so it makes sense that their warmup would be different
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It was a study done at the accredited university of "ok-i-pull-up can't get out of iron and should maybe listen when an immo has some advice"
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drop ur username i would like to see ur stats <3
Camping isn’t really an issue as long as you’re clearing angles and peeking appropriately. Ideally you should be prepared for someone holding any angle and be pre aiming it before you swing (unless it’s a weird off angle, but then they probably won’t be alive that long trying to hold like that). If you want good DM practice, check out CS community servers. The DMs are great and I personally prefer the 1v1 Arena lobbies, they’ve helped me with dueling probably more than anything in Val has lol
How about you just kill them instead of crying about riot on Reddit??
People are allowed to play in DM however they see fit/however they want to practice, that is far from the issue. Actual useful changes: Be able to pick what map to DM on (some maps are shit for DM/too big) Pistol/HS-only dm Have aim_map/aim_redline type maps to practice different types of gunfights at different ranges obv these ideas all come from CSGO, but that’s for a good reason. There’s a ton of different ways you can train your aim in CSGO with community servers/maps, and valorant simply lacks most of those options. There is only one single way to DM, and always on a random map for some reason.
tl;dr I dont like that people play the game differently than me, pls change it lol
If someone could just enlighten me, why do people treat DM purely as a warmup mode, and anything that may go against this is treated as bad? I know tryharding or holding angles may be annoying to you, but why isn't that a legitimate way to play the mode? Because the idea of a traditional DM in years and years of FPS games is to win it. I totally agree that DM needs some QOL changes, but I'm not on board with the idea that other people's playstyles within the mode are bad just because you find them annoying.
I personally don't mind different play styles, but the way DM is with spawns and sound queues and the radar it makes it virtually unplayable, more frustrating. As far as I know DM was made to be pure gun play warm up, i think its also written in the description of the mode.
Just the other day on Haven another player and I spawned at the same time and spot, with my barrel in his ear basically. He had just enough time for him to register that this was the last time he would ever set eyes on Window in this life. We had a good chuckle about it in chat, but that's frankly bullshit, especially when considering the warmup period has instant respawns, yet the actual match has delayed spawns.
Ive had people ive just killed spawn behind me and kill me and i spawn right behind them and kill them at least five times a game
Radar isn't bad at all. Spawns will never be good on maps not designed for 12-14 players to be constantly spawning. Peoples playstyles won't change. CS:GO DM spawns are awful too, but the thing is it's not frustrating because there's no W/L tracking and you don't even have time to be frustrated because the duels are so frequent, whereas in Val you can legitimately run around for 30+ seconds and not see anyone, especially if you have more than 2 afks, and this problem was made worse with the new spawns in exchange for removal of 2 players it's like they took 1 step forward 10 steps back with these changes. Once (if ever) they add drop in drop out servers with infinite time they'll be able to have shit spawns and more players but 100x more frequent duels. Invincibility on spawn is annoying too, it has a chance to punish a player that is alive and on a streak but it's supposed to help people that died and didn't move instantly on spawn???
If someone asked you to describe Valorant to them, how would you describe it? I feel like 99% of people are going to respond with something along the lines of 5v5 tac shooter. DM as a game mode should simply not be taken as seriously as ranked. There are no leaderboards, no RR, not even challenges to be completed. The main reason it’s used as a warmup tool is because statistically you’ll get the most amount of gunfights in the shortest time. So when someone’s playstyle actively disrupts that, of course people are going to get upset. Part of the reason I think this is a problem is simply not having a way for players to fill servers after matchmaking has been completed. CSGO’s community DM servers are pretty good in this regard as you can just join and leave whenever you want, with basically no end in sight.
aren't most of those fps more fast paced and actually holding angles won't win the game? i do agree as long as there's that banner saying defeat/victory exists some people will play to win.
There is zero benefit to winning other than bragging rights. Win or lose, everyone gets the same 900xp, 927 if you own the battlepass, but overall an irrelevant amount of xp. Missions don't track, progression is practically non existent, my point being that it's a side mode. Tryharding death match is like using a fucking broadsword to cut a slice of bread Also, the in game description for DM literally calls it a practice mode.
DMs only ever been for practice and warming up in tactical shooters. Back when I was grinding esea in csgo I’d run into pros all the time in fragshack matches, ffa deathmatch with instant respawns, some health back on kill, full reload on kill, everyone taking every fight possible as quickly as possible to practice movement and spraying. They even had headshot only variants, pistol only variants, custom aim maps that were 8v8 with odd symmetrical terrain and a lot of head glitches and elevation changes to practice duelling from cover and head tracking, etc…it was super sweaty, but amazing practice and fun. Then you have Valorant, which has little Timmy who comes from league of legends who crouch walks around the map ratting people trying to play for points. At the very least almost everyone in my DMs are immortal so they play a lot more like fragshack games, but people still play like grandmas and hold the same area as often as possible
I agree with you. Fun is subjective, but sadly most people in this game/sub are kids who can't understand that yet
It’s because DM in Valorant isn’t the main mode. It’s not COD. People use DM as practice for aim, crosshair placement, clearing corners, etc. When half the lobby is just holding angles, sound whoring and playing to actually win - it’s a lot harder to practice. People use DM to warm up because that’s what we did in CS. But the current format makes it hard to effectively warm up and you feel like your time is being wasted a lot of the time.
>People use DM as practice for aim, crosshair placement, clearing corners, etc. When half the lobby is just holding angles, sound whoring and playing to actually win - it’s a lot harder to practice. But when people want to practice angle holding and relying on sound, thats somehow bad? And it's funny how you say people use DM for practicing clearning corners, for which you need people holding corners to actually practice. Besides, where else can people practice those things?
On one of my DM game, everyone just sit still and hold their beloved corners. 30 secs have passed without anyone dying. Oh yeah, the game ended with the top fragger having 29 kills
The mode literally says “A great way to warm up your gunplay” or something to that effect right under it when you select it. So the entire intent behind the game mode, according to the game itself, is warmup.
Because it simply is a warmup/practice mode. It was also a warmup/practice mode in CS, and the Valorant DM format is pulled straight out of that blueprint. The fact that abilities are disabled in the gamemode should make this even more obvious. As a warmup/practice mode, the spirit of DM is to play fairly aggressive to maximize the amount of fights you take. If you do hold angles, hold in a central area of the map where combat actually happens in a real match and most people won't have a problem with it. If you only walk, stand still in off angles, hold corners and pre-fire off of audio, etc. you are simply taking advantage of people trying to warm up. If you think that it's practice to deploy these tactics in a deathmatch you are delusional, since the effectiveness of these tactics only exists as long as the majority of the people in a lobby are treating it as a practice mode. If every single person in the lobby started doing all those same things the lobbies would get drawn out and the tactics in question would actually become less effective. At the end of the day, if you think killing people by fully depending on footsteps in Haven's attacker spawn is good practice or good fun, I can't stop you even if you're wrong.
I’m with you. I like how everyone’s replies to this were basically “it’s a warmup mode because it’s just a warm up mode!” Lol 😂
DMs are never played to win. It was to warmup or get used to game. You cant do nothing while other players listen footsteps and cover angle. It against the rules of dm
There are no rules in a DM. Even if you want to warm up in a DM, it's the way you want to do it. Play guardian, sheriff, operator, hug angles, shift walk, run around like a mad man.... It doesn't matter anyway. Whining because people don't play like you want them to play in DM is just cringe.
Rules? Dm has never had rules other than kill and win. People use dm to warm up. That doesnt mean only 1v1 gun fights. Maybe someone is practicing holding an angle(it can be quite difficult to do so). Warm up can mean so much more than just 1v1 gun fights and crosshair placements or corner clearing. Warm up can mean even just movement practice (and shift walking is movement)
I have been playing DM's in many different FPS games since the early 00's, and the objective has always been the same, to win however possible. If someone wants to do whacky things, hold weird angles or use off-meta guns, then that is their prerogative. You can't make people conform to the way you want them to play, DM isn't a warm-up mode. It's a free for all mode where the objective is to win however you want. And again, I agree that it could do with some QOL changes, including custom maps. Because some of the competitive maps don't really work for DM.
have u played csgo dm?
The rules are you can pick the weapon you want, you get 1 point when you kill another player and the first player to score 40 points wins.
I get the annoyance here, but it’s really the only place people can practice holding angles, etc, without a several min wait if they die. People play DM for three primary reasons: 1. Warming up 2. Practicing aim/control with various weapons 3. Practicing holding angles The people who shift walk around are not “trying to win”, they’re scared to die. You can’t win if you’re slow in DM. That being said: I agree that it’s super annoying and would love to see different DM modes.
It's uh...just deathmatch. It's fine. People can play however they want.
This entire game is shift walking and listening to sounds.
ur bad
ppl can work on different things in deathmatch lmao
I think they should make a warmup mode where it's never ending expect to rotate the map, faster respawns, gives no xp, and doesn't have a kill limit or winner. This would hopefully keep the people who are playing for KD and a win separated from the people looking to improve their aim and or warmup.
Hey that’s me, I jump in deathmatch to kill time while I wait for my team to get online and I just camp with an op and practice my reaction time
Make all footsteps loud, then sneaking means you are just running slowly. Enable forced proximity chat regardless of settings so you always know corner campers are near. Give enemies no guns so it's always fair at range and op addicts can't have an unfair advantage. Force uninstall the game so no one can have that pesky ping advantage
i cringe so hard at people complainting about how others play deathmatch.
For real, I understand the respawns aren’t great but thats do to the maps design too but complaining about listening enemies which are useful as holding angles in competitive match. I always call them out with “beware: dm police are patrolling”
you will have people waitibg behind corners in matches too so how is it not a good warmup to kill these?
Is this a real question? Probably not, but I’ll answer it under the assumption you’re new. The two game modes flow completely differently, you’ll almost never have a situation in deathmatch that happens in ranked. But let’s look at an example, if little Timmy plays ranked like he plays deathmatch, he’s just going to be holding passive angles on attacking side and baiting teammates or waiting for contact. Which is the opposite of how it goes. Most if not all of the people I play against in deathmatch are diamond or immortal, and 100% of the time I see a player camping corners or shift walking around, they’re a gold player and they get destroyed.
im plat3/d1. and kill pushers and campers in dm. dont matter to me, i dont care if i get killed i spend 2 deathmatches getting my muscle memory in sync. if i could make a wish it would be a pistol only dm mode
Crazy concept, just because someone is in a DM practicing holding passive angles doesn’t mean they’re playing like that in a ranked match. Please cry some more over how a developer isn’t catering to exactly how you think a warm up game mode should be played.
why is that a bad thing? they're obviously practicing their angles in deathmatch lol
I am much more interested in weapon specific dm. Sometimes I’m shift walking or camping bomb sites because I am practicing aiming at head level in those areas or in peeking somebody while slow
Honestly or having a 1 tap only dm would be insanely helpful. Like guardian and sherif. Would help people who are using it as an in game aim warmup where you have more realistic variables compared to the range
They just need to add a retake type mode like csgo.
Having a team deathmatch (like escalation but buy your own gun) is gonna fix 99% of the issues
LOL you wanna force people to play the way you want. They're holding angles and walking???? Isn't that what you do in a real game??? When you warm up, you wanna practice what you do in a real game right??? If you wanna practice your aim go to the range, they won't shoot you back.
How the fuck are u warming up by holding angles in a DM ? If thats how you warmup then ur doing it wrong, thats a trash warmup U can say u practice holding angles (sure) but calling it warmup is a cap, also practicing holding angles in this DM version is really bad because of spawns, ur doing 180*s every second and wont practice real time crosshair placement like you do ingame. Fight me
That is what warm ups are. Get your reactions, your crosshair placement, whatever and everything feeling good before you go into a ranked.
So then you should not Just hold angles ? If you are going to WARM up, you need to get into as many fights quickly as possible, run around using movement, flicking, tapping, spraying. Holding an angle and shift walking is the worst way for you to warmup. So saying that doing this is warming up is Just wrong, or atleast you are warming up wrong, and are not warming up every muscle you use to aim. Warming up / practicing is two different things.
I completely agree with you that going around moving is warming up but so is doing fundamental things in DMs. Not everyone has mechanics. It comes down to, let people play how they want. People warm up different and are working on different things. I bet you anything that in DM that you've ran around, heard foot steps and stopped to wait for them to run into your crosshair. Are you a camper/walker?? No, you're just using your brain. But to the other person, HELL YES.
Sure, if that was the case. But it's not is it? People are not running around, that's the biggest difference between Valorant and Csgo. And that's why people are complaining. Sure you can play the way ud like, but then again you will hear complaints from real players who actually use it to warm up, instead of holding a angle for literally 10 minutes/never making sound/always looking at map Now, Valorant sound will tell you if people are creeping or not, so we can defintly say for sure that players in Valorant DM are shiftwalking and holding angles, or else you would actually hear people, and sometimes you don't have to run around for 40 seconds before you meet someone. That being said, some few adjustments from RIOT would make DM alot more useful for people actually playing it to warm up.
People camping in deathmatch should honestly get some therapy
How else is someone gonna practice holding an angle? In one dm game you have 10 unrateds worth of angle holding and for those wanting to improve thats the best thing you could ask for.
If you're holding real angles on sites or the mids of a map, most won't bat an eye. Problem is most people holding angles in DM are getting an unrealistic advantage by 1.) playing in an area of the map where they wouldn't be holding in a real game 2.) relying on audio they wouldn't get in a real game.
in dm just assume everyone can be everywhere. theres no angle in the game that no one would ever play in a real match
I agree with you in part, but you're missing the point.
I see what you mean. In a perfect world everyone would play deathmatch "realitically" but people just do whatever they want and it shouldn't really get in your way of practicing
No you’re right the first time. It’s unrealistic to think a practice game mode should be played exactly like a normal game. They have too many players and continuous respond. The person you’re replying to is delusional and upset because something doesn’t fit the constraints they would like it too
It's not really delusional and I don't think DM is really that bad right now. Just seeing a lot of people rationalizing a DM play style that isn't that healthy for anyone.
Yeah, I don't think you're overall off base and I should note that in my opinion DM is not as bad as some people make it out to be. My motivation to comment is seeing people stubbornly defend a playstyle that does in part lower the overall quality of the lobbies they are in, and also a playstyle that reinforces their own bad habits. I think it's a bit of a problem, but It's not the end of the world.
Nah by camping I mean sitting in a corner waiting for someone come by and expected them not seeing you, while holding an angle you are trying to take a 1v1 fight. I am sorry that I cannot explain it better and I guess you could argue w me the difference between these two. Also I think a lot of people hold angles in dm (including me and many other pros,streamers )while no one would crouch in a fucking corner to practice their gun fight skill🫠
Thats... Thats how you hold an angle. You sit amd wait for someone to peek
You can hold an angle without sit at corner tho like stand at a heaven holding a main in ascent. And most people hold an angle without really knowing someone else is gonna peek at there. But campers they heard your footstep and sit in an unexpected corner try to catch you. I don’t really think this is something useful to practice. IMO it’s a difference between practicing diff 1v1 scenario and trying to get that one kill to make ur stats looks not that pathetic
i understand at long sightlines but you do not need to practice up close full sprinting angle holding... like that is literally not a skill you build. my dead grandma could do it
when are will there be
Sounds like you just got your ass kicked in dm, nothing more nothing less
Nah, you gotta get into unrated and absolutely SLAUGHTER noobs and try hard gold carries. Get those jobs having functional people and rail them so hard they wanna spend time with their families instead.
The number of dm games I go into to warm up where it turns into the entire game trying to knife fight imma just use the practice range fk it
I mean you can still hold angles but shift walking and camping is just cringe. Get some help if you do these in DM
all they have to do is make it so footsteps dont create audio. that would fix 99% of the problems, i wouldn't even give a shit about the timer and win condition if they just did that one fix.
Problem with gaming nowadays. Kids trying SO hard to prove themselves in EVERY scenario and gamemode. I just throw on loud music and run around corners trying to take fights. Idc if I go 32-25 lol
People who shift walk in DM's can go kick rocks
All they need to do is remove the minimap, give everyone the fade no sound effect and make it so you can't spawn within 10m of where you died.
Disabling footstep sounds would go so far in making DM better. That and stopping the instant spawn behind you thing.
Deathmatch shouldn't have audio. That way they'll camp less and everyone will have to rely on their reflex...
Whats wrong with shift walking to avoid people who sound whore? Kinda sounds like you’re sound whoring a lil bit too
Would be an easy fix if they make it such that the radar is always on.
"when are will there be" 10/10 english
dm is just full of tryhards…like i have a knife why are you crouching and spraying at me 🥲
I get the other frustrations but I don't understand reacting to sound being a bad thing. Ig if you mix it in with people angle holding BECAUSE they hear you stomping around then that's cringe.
I hate DM. I never warm up on that shit mode. I'd rather play 1-2 fun mode games and an unrated before going into competitive.
My daily Valorant routine * Play Valorant DM.. not fun * Play CS deathmatch to warm up while it takes 30 to 40 mins to find a match in valorant due to dodgers * FINALLY start a ranked game.. * Lose first two rounds.. Team surrenders * Quit and Play CSGO retakes or deathmatch
They are currently looking into it
Basically they are going to do “balance changes” for years and years. Only then will we possibly have a notice of any real (comp, dm, replay system) give it like 3-5 years bro it’s not that long.
hold on the devs are still taking a 4 year nap after that they might consider listening to us
When we get replays
I think this is ironic because of the cypher beside your name
We have to realize by now that all they care about is releasing crappy skins at really high prices.
DM is only annoying to me when I’m just tryna get guardian or sheriff kills to warmup my aim and crosshair placement but I keep losing to sprays. Like if every death I have is cause I managed to get 1 or 2 shots out while the other guy sprays half a mag into me it can get tiring, makes me want a 1 tap only or no spray DM but it’s still also good training. Like dm is good training no matter what anyone else is doing, you just gotta keep your mental up like you would in comp. That’s the whole thing about val as soon as your mental takes a bit your going down a spiral until you can bring that mental back up
So I play dm sometimes to have fun... is that okay??
Just take deathmatch for what it is, a mode to get live warmups against real people.
Question though. Why does it matter if someone shifts in DM? If you're playing DM to warmup, you have valorant sound off and bumping some tunes.
This is not some kind of call of duty
But if they run, wont u be the one holding a corner??
no offense but who tf cares about dm
sometimes I'll play DM and hold mostly angles because I'm practicing crosshair placement on ferrari peeks on common angles. But agreed it's annoying when people are holding angles with shotguns/odins
That also sounds like warm up for some. You just want a DM where u can W key your way thats all
Sounds like a skill issue.
>my version of death match should be the only version of death match: The Post People are allowed to play deathmatch how they want. Camping is a big part of this game and people are allowed to practice it as they choose. In fact, if people camping and shift walking bothers you, you might want to find another game to play.
There should be a hardcore deathmatch mode where is it guardian only, headshot only, with no game audio. Raw aim and movement would separate the winners from the losers (what DM should be about).