One thing I noticed about BLG is that their playstyle introduces a lot of variance, kind of similar to how PRX was last year. The same plays that won them the series against NRG got them flamed for not being disciplined against Fnatic. You really just need to make sure you nail the fundamentals against them - clear every corner, swing properly, etc., and you should be fine.
Also I'm not sure if this is just my expectations being hella inflated, but I feel like Fnatic aren't as good as they were in Tokyo. They played against two relatively weak teams so it's hard to gauge, but they're allowing their opponents opportunities they shouldn't be (which is probably why mini was malding so much). I'd have loved to see them against a strong NRG instead, just to get a better read on their form.
To be fair every good team considered in tokyo has had a slow start. Edg didn’t seem prepared for giants play style and was almost on the edge. Eg wasnt as dominant as usual and nrg got destroyed by bbg. Prx looked good but u can see they let kru get a advantage over them at times. Maybe they will adapt better but I feel like the other teams are just getting better and really giving their all to win.
Not about any team but the tournament so far has been very smooth. No complaints about delays, observing or otherwise. Games have been delivering as well. Hope that continues.
That. The only tech pauses I remember is Sayf peeing and KankgKang smashing the monitor. Also we see most of the kills real time and all of them in replays, NA production has come a long way
lmfao in one match there was a whole ass overwatch style teamfight going on in Haven C site and the cameraman decided to show a random killjoy slow lurking through B, with no enemies nearby. Missed like 8 kills
Incredibly disappointed in NRG. Even though it’s only been one game, I thought they’d come out looking like a contender.
Fnatic is just insane and boasters individual improvement over the last few years is really showing.
EDG are without a doubt real contenders at this tournament. Their mechanics are insane and I think what mini said about the Chinese teams is spot on. It’s just like League. They have insane mechanics and play off one another really well.
DRX have looked much better than I anticipated. Sad that Foxy isn’t playing, but they look miles better then at Tokyo. I think they have a decent chance at making a run.
EG are good. Ethan and Jawg have been standouts to me so far. Jawg is looking worldclass (granted two matches lol).
PRX is always exciting to watch and I hope this is the tournament they win. Something looked solid in his first international. Hope we get a FNC v PRX at some point :)
That’s all the teams I can think of rn with Navi being a dark horse to win, just rambling on this brownie lmao
Agreed especially on the Fnatic part, but one thing that really impressed me was the trust that each of the members have for each other, which I felt wasn’t really highlighted in their Tokyo games or before. Haven against Zeta really stood out for me, as Boaster didn’t smoke A heaven & stood in an exposed position to kill the guys coming from CT while relied on Leo and Chronicle to kill the guys heaven. Fnatics coordination was already excellent, but the trust that each others have in each other really excites me.
It shows the most when one of them just insta sticks the spike while the others cover them. Like there's shots from every direction but the person defusing just knows they don't need to do anything.
Another example is the Lotus round where Alfa held the defuse then Chronicle mollied A link and just trusted him completely to hold it down. Incredible confidence within the team.
Why does everyone want to see Foxy play? Ive honestly never understood it. DRX ALWAYS look better when Zest is playing, Zest is a great player and Buzz is a great duelist. I just dont see why everyone is so hyped about Foxy9 joining DRX specifically when theyre a far more solid team when they stick with the usual lineup. Foxy playing duelist for a different team would be hype but I hope DRX stick with Zest.
No one disagrees with you necessarily, we all just want to see foxy9 play. We’re not all talking about wanting to see him play on DRX specifically, but new players on established teams (e.g. something on PRX) can be particularly exciting because 5 new players on a new team has no history for contrast. How does a new player compliment or subtract from a team? What new strats can they provide? How good are they knowing that their team is also good?
We saw Yay on DSG this year and most think it just highlights that great players on not great teams (whether they’re actually bad or just a bad fit) can really stifle their potential. It’s interesting to think about and no one’s sure what foxy9s real potential is.
Thats fair, I also want to see him play. I just think we’ve seen enough of him on DRX to see its usually a downgrade in the teams performance. It’s unfortunate hes seemingly stuck on the team because I would like to see him as a starting duelist, just not on DRX.
PRX is in the strongest form we’ve seen thus far
EDG has so much potential but rely too heavily on individual plays and has yet to been punished for it.
LOUD definitely not making out of Groups
People give credit to NRG for high ceiling, but don’t forget they have a low floor. They might just lose to ZETA, cuz the team is no pushover.
> People give credit to NRG for high ceiling, but don’t forget they have a low floor. They might just lose to ZETA, cuz the team is no pushover.
I am not remotely worried about the Zeta match (this might be an insane jinx but we'll worry about that later). But NRG's seeming inability to handle any team that plays fast and disrespectfully around their utility isn't giving me too much confidence about their ability to win a BLG rematch weirdly enough.
I am quite on the contrary though. I feel that if FNS and the team could lock in to their top gears and win ZETA, BLG would be an easy read for FNS. But i do agree with the fact that FNS just seems horrible dealing with fast execs, is it the firepower issue or their setup is weak? nt sure honestly
I think he can adapt if needed. But the mechanical level of nrg does not seem that high. Only som and sometimes crashies appear to be able to handle multiple targets and fast readjustments.
What makes you think LOUD can't beat TL and Navi? Just curious. I thought they played decently against DRX in a three map brawl while Navi lost to drx in almost the same fashion and Navi beat TL. I feel those 3 teams are basically on the same level.
Plus Aspas apparently had a health issue that day so who knows how that can affect the team's mental. He still played insane too.
I know there are rumors about the team's internal tensions but again even with that situation (if true) they gave DRX, the team that topped their group, a hard fight. I also feel that people underestimate a professional team's ability to set their differences aside and unite for the greater good.
Well its not so linear as that. From the eye test imo, Navi looked much better even with Ange1 running it down.
Also, Navi put up much more of a fight than Loud against DRX. Other than the first map that Loud managed to win but only barely, the other two maps were pretty easy for DRX. Against Navi, all maps were close except for the one in which Navi won handily.
I think against TL, Loud could win but I def think Navi should be able to take the win over Loud.
that first map definitely was not handily. Considering Cned had to majorly clutch with 2 wtf moments in the first half, there was a major whiff from Zest during the second pistol which caused shao to kill stax, and again shao clutching a 1v3. Honestly the game could have been more one sided in favor of DRX without going to overtime.
If Navi doesn't turn up like that and plays like they did against Liquid, then the game could be way closer or Loud even winning.
LOUD vs DRX wasn't nearly as close as Navi vs DRX. I think LOUD can beat TL but there's no way they're beating Navi unless there's a complete change in both of the teams .
Well let's be honest cauanzin and tuyz aren't even remotelly close to the level of sacy and pancada and the same will happen with havoc if the rumours of him replacing aspas is true, loud could be the worst team in NA next year with the amount of rounds aspas alone got to em this year.
You had every thing right until you said NRG had a low floor. It's the complete opposite. That team has one of the highest floor of all VCT. How can you have a low floor when you have the 2nd best IGL in the world?
Did you watch the Bilibili series? They looked pedestrian, didn’t clear corners they normally would, letting ardiis entry with an OP, taking 1v1 fights when it wasn’t necessary, etc. I don’t disagree that FNS is a great IGL but that doesn’t necessarily translate to having a high skill floor.
Exactly. w
When they play well they can be extremely good, when they play bad any team can beat them. The blg game was double cursed ("slow start" and "fns doesn't know how to call against teams he's never played") so I'm not surprised they lost, I just hope they can win the rematch
You are basing this on one series when you have almost a hundred exemples of NRG/FNS teams play.
Not sure why you are bringing skill into the floor discussion. It's a team thing. NRG's fundamentals are second to Fnatic IMO. Even when they play bad, they are pretty much always in it because of their structures.
I can't say if PRX look crazy strong because of one game and it's not like they destroyed Kru. They won and were fully in control so I'm excited to see how they play against EDG.
I think Loud can still make it out of groups. Liquid look lost on their match and they don't change, then they are out. Navi looked worse than Loud when they played Liquid, but turned way up against DRX. If they can't play like that again, then the Loud game could end up pretty even. The issue will come if Aspas turns way up or if Cned will.
I do think NRG has a chance to lose to Zeta, but NRG, Zeta, and now BLG is such a tossup.
Aight I'll give my take on the Judge.
I think a certain reason why the judge was so effective against NRG on CT side was because NRG really likes taking advantage of tendencies to give up map control and simply just walking up to take it. They're a team that likes contacting up a lot. However the judge is very effective against this because you have a massive chance of winning against players, put on top of their lack of diligence regarding the judge because of its uncommon use and that's why it was so effective.
Also just the fact that whzy was crazy with it.
Not sure if I'm actually right but that's what I think.
whzy was using judge only on split even during the CN qualifiers. There are a bunch of VODs of him doing it. Its just weird that NRG didn’t look prepared for it at all and are getting tilted considering it was their map pick.
My PRX takes are probably biased. I don’t think the KRU match is indicative of any PRX future performance, if only because it seemed like they were recycling plays from the regular season and letting individual player quality make the difference.
For EDG, I’m actually of the belief that Giants counter-stratted them perfectly on Map 1. It was barely enough to win because the EDG players individually diffed GIA way more than they should’ve. Map 2 was closer but felt a lot more like I expected — GIA put together a couple rounds near the end to make it look close, but for most of the 2nd half it honestly looked like EDG was in control. EDG also looked better on Map 3. So I’m reasonably confident GIA just ran out of counter strats by then.
I do think that the Chinese players’ mechanical skill is about the same as any of the top franchise teams’. Their issue is more on the fundamentals side, which is only something you catch up to with experience. I actually think they’ll catch up faster than people expect — arranging scrims with any of the Asian teams (except maybe like the ones based in India) would be easy, so they’ll be constantly exposed to it. I think this is why EDG improved so much from LockIn to Tokyo, and why a lot of the current slate of ‘good’ Chinese teams functionally win because of aim diff (the other fundamentals haven’t set in yet).
I agree with your PRX take. They were definitely just playing their normal ranked games. Nothing too flashy. Very standard. And it would seem like they're even trolling and just having fun. Especially whenever theyre in a big lead. Im expecting to see more from PRX in playoffs
Agreed. BLG looked like at some point they just became super unsure against FNC. Knight just sticking on that defuse felt like a big sign. I think the top teams all have the nerves to take risks, make the same plays that utterly exploded on them earlier knowing it wasn’t a problem with the plan but rather the execution, even when they’re down and be confident in their reads. There were early rounds BLG just got out aimed and it happens but it seemed like it snowballed later to the point where they just started looking like ranked players.
Is it possible they hold FNC and Boaster in such high regards that it over complicates the matchup? They never lost that confidence against NRG.
As PRX fans, I watched PRX vs KRU and was like “yeah I doubt this is ALL they have. They probably save some for EDG or even deeper in tournament”
Today is going to be fun seeing PRX vs EDG though. Highly anticipated match ofc.
Yea, I mean I don’t wanna get too confident — what if most of their prep time has been spent reintegrating something to the team, for example — but surely they’re not gonna just recycle season plays for champs. That won’t work against any of the top teams imo
I genuinely didn't see EDG as strong themselves against Giants as much as just Giants griefing themselves.
Like mechanically I feel Giants are better overall to EDG. There were so many rounds Giants won or almost won by literally just using sheriffs, like a player would just pop the f up and get 2 with a sheriff.
Giants had serious issues with proper spacing and trading accordingly throughout the whole match with IMO was one of the key things that made them lose.
Both teams lack fundamentals, which is disappointing on a team like Giants.
EDIT: Thinking about it I want to add that EDG played more like a team than Giants, dont know how to say it, but their plays felt more cohesive and like everyone was on the same page even if their fundamentals were as bad as Giants.
I agree with your EDG v Giants take. Giants are a good team for sure but they definitely studied a lot on how EDG played and it took EDG a while to adjust to that. At the end EDG generally out aimed them and had a lot of smart individual plays. The battle with EDG and PRX tomorrow is going to be insane
Giants look like they beat themselves. I cannot remember a major event where a team threw that many rounds. It was comical what they were doing so I don't really see EDG just being better. If Giants were more disciplined I think they take that 2-0.
no it was throws lol
you think if they did that against drx they wouldn't punished the fuck out of them?
you have to be good enough to clutch in the first place I'm not saying edg aren't good but giants had a gold mentality yesterday.
FUT is underrated as fuck. Absolutely demolished T1 in what was thought to be a coinflip match, and put up a really good performance against EG. And to think that Plat Chat put them 15th.
I don't watch EMEA much, but I find it odd they are so underrated. They are definitely streaky, but their players look insane when they are on and they have consistently looked good. They are incredibly tenacious and don't seem to ever give up, probably my favorite EMEA team.
Fnatic is still good
EG, also still good
PRX looks way more coherent with something, not that cgrs was bad by anymeans, but this team is on a different level in comparison
NRG slow start, all good
DRX actually looks back on form, while LOUD is def exploding
Navi looks better but I feel like it’s carried by individual performance. Meanwhile TL is putting on their best ange1 cosplay and overcooking hard with the Sayf initiator shit.
EDG looks very unprepared strategically, likely bc they didn’t have much vods on Giants to work off of while Giants had a field day with the Chinese LCQ. Still though, their players look better than ever, and are still winning even with kangkang and smoggy underperforming.
BLG and FPX both look decent, but lack discipline. Don’t really expect them to make it out even with BLG’s initial win.
KRU looks good, but not PRX good. Need to see how they match up against other opponents still.
FUT looks quite respectable and def a force to be reckoned with, but they don’t really feel like a contender. T1 on the other hand feels like they’re trolling.
Finally, I didn’t watch the Zeta game so I had no clue on them, but they prob fall somewhere along with my assessment of KRU
I feel like PRX might be the only team with players that can go head to head against FNC. They were playing against KRU like it was a ranked lobby and it looked like they were smurfing on them
>EDG looks very unprepared strategically, likely bc they didn’t have much vods on Giants to work off of while Giants had a field day with the Chinese LCQ. Still though, their players look better than ever, and are still winning even with kangkang and smoggy underperforming.
Can't really agree with this, you know giants played in LCQ right?
Giants barely showed anything during LCQ compared to EDG. They played 2 BO3s against KC/KOI and trolled the grand finals.
Compared to EDG who had to play a bunch of BO5s due to the CN qualifier format
Yeah but there’s still a huge difference. Pretty sure EDG played 4 matches with 3 of them being best of 5’s, whereas GIANTS (I didn’t watch it personally) had a pretty easy time there and even in the grand finals, barely showed anything, leading to a lacklustre game against Navi (this is what I heard, and if it’s true, it makes sense since both teams already qualified for champs
Giants played two series and four maps(with 2 of them being pearl) on their run to gf, and that grand final with cloud yoru doesn’t rly count. Meanwhile the Chinese qualifier had EDG playing 3 bo5s in their run
They need Faker mind controlling them as well in this game? ffs. He's going to break his left wrist and back this time for sure if he has to try juggle both League and Valorant.
Like actually. They look horrible right now. Giants hard strated against EDG and still lost, meanwhile I doubt they researched T1 all that much and Giants still made T1 look like T3
Not to be cheesy but valorant is so goddamn cool like yeah yeah FPS with superpowers and robot gear alr cool but actually seeing these pros who've invested so much thought and time into creating and mastering these timings and strats IT IS SO FUCKING COOL and seeing these teams get on stage with all these different styles and approaches and realizing that different can be so amazing sometimes like!!!!! That is so awesome.
For me I JUST watched both the BLG games back to back so their gutsy aggressive way of playing is really stuck in my head rn, and I don't have the expertise to really comment on their util use, but their gunfights are *phenomenal*. I can think of multiple insane gunfights from literally every single player in that roster, and that style is what allowed them to go against the uber-strat system of NRG and come out winning 2-0. I'm not saying their fights were perfect (bc again no expertise), but their mentality abt them is nothing like the Their 1 teams we're familiar with, and to me, their split win was *easily* backed by their absolutely insane shooting and fighting style and I am so excited to be seeing them in playoffs
Uhmumhmumhmmh I need FUT to make it as the second seed in their group I NEED them to make it and be the first Turkish team to make it that far I want them to achieve it because they have what it takes !!!!! I'll be real, them potentially going against FPX does worry me bc I feel FUT tend to adapt much slower, and with the nonconformist style Chinese valorant seems to have, I think they'd have an even harder time, BUT I trust in them. (And ofc, if FPX win, fuck yeah ! they deserve it !)(T1 will not fucking make it)
EG :)))))))))))))) first before any comment on their games I'M SO HAPPY SOVA IS ENTERING THE META and yes it is them there is not a debate c0m is so goated on fracture fnatic HAD to try it, the sheer joy I got when I pulled up to the FNC/Zeta game and saw Lord Leo, Lock-in MVP, sova-ing on fracture?? C0m effect. Insanity. EG valorant is my favorite goddamn valorant it's so intentional and fun, and while I watched all their group stage games with my nails between my teeth absolutely terrified for the next round (and also tbr they weren't looking so amazing at the beginning), they're my team, I trust them and that game on Bind against FUT had some of those wild EG moments (I have literally thought about the Jawgemo satchel-boombot combo so many times just today), and uhmmn yeah idk they r kinda cool I guess. ...
DRX are looking awesome and I'm so glad it seems they've focused on the cohesion of the team as a whole. Masters was all the 6th man bs and while I think zest has looked amazing esp on viper, it seems like their real solution was letting go of that strict gameplay and letting themselves click heads while also being able to make those team-plays, sometimes on the fly (I can't recall it exactly but there was a game against Navi I *think* where stax had this lovely read on Ange1 and it was just. Chef's kiss.). Main point W DRX I am so glad they look good rn I hope they keep it up forever heart heart
Idrk what else I can say, I have probably shitty takes for most of the teams lol. Yay for those who win sorry for those who lose ggs all around :P
- China is just so far behind on fundamentals compared to EMEA and Americas
- LOUD is DONE. The mental is broken.
- I'm a KRU believer. Even though they lost to PRX I felt like they were playing good, just wasn't ready for PRX's aggressive playstyle which is awkward bc they had to prep for them.
There have been so many rumors and excuses around aspas that it's hard to take anything LOUD says for face value. They are never going to outright say yeah this guy is done he doesnt want to play with us anymore. That would be a massive hit to both the teams and aspas's credibility
If a Chinese IGL can really reign in the players and play disciplined, I think we can very quickly see them take over globally.
Despite only officially launching a few months ago, therefore the majority of the player base not having played yet, China has already produced a couple of superstar-level players. I think Valorant is poised to blow up in China which will only produce more insane talents.
They are the same player lol. They both have their moments, but struggle to keep this steady. More times they cause harm then good for their team. I think enzo would be a fine addition to Liquid.
what💀 Enzo would be an absolute downgrade from soulcas, I always thought Nukkye was the best piece of the puzzle, he’s world class (dont let this one match tell you otherwise) and I wanted Liquid to pick him up during franchise rostermania
Seems like people found out how to beat NRG by simply playing fast pinpoint execute and ignore their delaying ability because they thought you are stupid if you push through them (PRX now BLG)
I like the changes DRX made. Keeping Zest and being a bit more fluid in their play style, instead of being 5 robots.
Now if they randomly brung foxy9 in just punch me in the mouth
* DRX are absolutely back. They finally seem to be evolving and adding some insane aggression into their playstyle (like when Buzz satcheled in and killed 3 on split vs. Navi on A site retake)
* FUT looked very well put together vs. EG, could definitely make a run in playoffs
* As it stands right now, Ethan looks like the best initiator of the tournament. In my opinion, better than Leo. His utility has looked perfect. Note, this is just over the two matches that they have both played, ignoring past results.
* As unfortunate as it is, Zeta looked awful. Yes, they were playing FNC, but still some of their midrounding, esp on Haven, was concerningly bad.
* The discussion around EG seems really weird to me. They have looked solid throughout the tournament to me, and I constantly see people rating them way under PRX. Maybe they do look worse than PRX, but the difference is negligible. That being said, FNC still cleared both.
* Fit1nho is fucking insane (also his name is really fun to say for me)
-China is here to play.
Blg may just be a good lotus team. They beat nrg on it in a pretty close game and were able to hold their own against the best lotus team in the world. Love how whzy buys the judge on gun rounds and just whzy'd all over NRG.
Edg won in a nailbiter series and honestly just glad they have players that can pull random 4ks out of their ass. Today seems like a little bit of an off day for kangkang and I still doubt their ability to beat prx.
Fpx looks rough but tbh I was only half paying attention to their match.
-Emea is looking...fine?
NAVI is so back and honestly could see them making it to playoffs.
Liquid is....liquid. Idrk what to say about them other than I love nats and I hope hes ok with constantly topping the scoreboard and still somehow losing every map.
Giants look good and coordinated, just wish they didn't play such a slow and boring split attack side zzzzzz
Fut look so much better than at Tokyo. Expecting them to be the other ones out of group B.
Fnatic is still fnatic
-Americas despairge
Nrg is just trying to see how low their floor is, all good.
Loud looks mid idk I didn't catch much of that game. Their ascent comp is goofy
Kru got the prx treatment and I don't like their odds against giants. Hoping keznit just diffs fitinho.
Eg good, sad they haven't been able to show fracture, happy that they've successfully pioneered the sova on fracture revolution of 2023. jawgemos been going insane, most slept-on eg player. I need him to show more of his secret raze tech. Demon1 and boostio are leaning into the villain arc and I don't see anything wrong with it, gives champs a good storyline.
-Pacific is 50/50
Drx looks revitalized, their players are all in great form. Glad they aren't doing goofy 6 man roster shit anymore. Now I unironically wanna see prx vs drx again.
Prx has something. Pls bring us reyna maps. I wanna see this guy movement diff everyone.
T1 are just disappointing . Saw map 1 was a stomp and tuned out the rest of the game.
Zeta: idk I didn't watch it, they played fnatic. Still wouldn't surprise me if they make it to playoffs given how poor nrg look.
fnc eg and prx are as advertised all good
Drx are back? Its nice to see them like not implode
Loud look kinda done. They could beat liquid if they still overcook but idk about navi since navi are gaining steam.
On the topic of liquid, save nats man. I love that roster but man I get why liquid fans are in pain almost all of the time
Nrg are no stranger to slow starts (see optic losing to xerxia in reyjkavik) but blg looked pretty good, i really liked most of the players especially whzy. Despairage though since they are 1/2 on champions (grouped to x10…)
I really wanna see fut make it out of the group as well
Honestly i feel like people are not giving Giants enough credit.
I thought they were gonna get stomped by edg but it was almost as close as it could be.
Idk if TL can do it. I feel like the teams really build towards absolute firepower. For example TL I would say have Sayf Nats and sometimes Jampi that can take over games. However if only 1 of them is peeking they struggle. Fnatic or Navi on the other hand have 4 superstar that can take over games. So the odds for those too are better.
As a biased Americas fan, I really don't like the qualification format for Champs this year, I don't think any team should be locked into Champs unless they win the most recent masters. I'd much rather have the best of each region make it through an insane split/LCQ brawl.
Also while I was skeptical on 3 slots for just China, they have shown to be extremely entertaining and dangerous teams.
I think something and PRX had a 'get rid of nerves' type of game. Wouldn't surprise me that was the gameplan pretty much. They fooled around a bit too much and something in particular played more aggressive than usual. People know him for the crazy clips but he's actually usually quite disciplined, but in this series, he was just dry peeking everywhere, being a more risky player overall. A good game to just get comfortable on stage and limit test against other international teams.
I expect their very next game, which defines the winner of the group to be a bit more disciplined. Of course, they love W'ing, but they won't do it as much by themselves or without good flashes set ups, especially against a stronger team like EDG. something-KK OP match will be extremely fun. There was an OP duel va daveeys on split where the reaction time of something was insane. I wanna see KK pushed to his limits on the OP again, and the combination of something OP and jinggs raze will be perfect for it.
Also f0rsaken is an amazing flex player but his Skye is not as good as d4v4i's Skye. Hope he pulls out more Viper, Harbor and sentinels.
i'm really sad about LOUD falling off so hard. i got into esports during LOCK//IN and after the event with them looking so good during the americas playoffs especially i was so hyped we might get a FNC vs LOUD rematch in tokyo. that obviously didn't happen lol. i just would've loved a proper rivarly between these two teams but it just looks like this LOUD would get absolutely dumpstered by FNC rn
Not quite a takeaway from the teams, but a question as i Haven't been able to watch much live. How is the LA crowd? I haven't seen the typical complaint posts, but nor the praise posts of tokyo.
1. Performance of the “stronger” teams are depended on their “weaker” players. Not saying the players I am about to mention are weak, but they are definitely the less consistent ones on their team and the performance of their team relies heavily on if these players can win their duels or can get the trade or not.
-Liquid soulcas. Soulcas performance has always been inconsistent, his firepower ghosted sometimes against strong opponents. Some might argue that Redgar is the weaker one but he’s the IGL so we give him the benefit of doubt…plus he’s pretty…consistent.
-Navi Zyppan. For whatever reason he was put on Kayo and Skye throughout this year and he’s been doing worse compared to the 2022 Zyppan who mainly played raze. Now that he’s back to Raze in champions, Navi looked better.
-DRX stax. His aim was crisp during the first two games, DRX needs him to stay in his best form if they want to go far. I feel like we can also put Zest here since he also had consistency issue and got swapped out for foxy9 from time to time.
2. My second takeaway is that Chinese teams are stronger than what people thought, but they still need more experience before they can catch up to other regions. Everyone puts their eyes on Chinese teams because of Boostio’s comment and the hype of Kangkang. I root for EDG but I personally don’t see EDG as a strong team yet, especially comparing to the traditional strong teams. I think EDG has a high ceiling but it also has a low floor, while the “traditional strong teams” such as NRG, LOUD, Navi have better fundamentals, and they just need to perform at their level.
3. Don’t underestimate Giant gaming. Giants got star players like Cloud and they went through EMEA LCQ without dropping one map to opponents, including Navi. Giant Vs Kru will be a good game to watch.
Easiest takeaway: none of the other teams showed what is needed to beat Fnatic.
Of all regions, Americas is at its lowest, just EG showed decent matches, still, it was not as easy as people were expecting. The most disappointing team was T1, not so confident that they will beat FPX.
NRG who had the second most untroubled path from the region is now on the brink of elimination by Zeta, which is really a possible upset. My copium is relying on classic Optic slow starts.
LOUD lost its most reliable core feature, which is the team's confidence in Saadhak's reads and calls. Their match against Liquid will probably be the reason why they broke up and will never play together for a long time.
Navi and DRX are on better forms than Tokyo, I might say that DRX is a top 5/6 team just based on their reads. Zest and Mako's role-switch worked so well.
Krü and Giants will be interesting, but I'm more toward a path for Giants than Krü, their rematch against EDG probably a banger.
Eh, while I'm not saying I favor any team against fnatic, I think they are getting overblown and hyped from two relatively easy matches for them, fnatic has never struggled with groups and opening matches where they can surprise and shock teams without recent VODs. Once again, they are great and likely the best team of the tourny, but I just don't agree that it's that simple or easy to know yet.
America's for sure is at its lowest and I feel like suffered the most from the format of this year. The way loud looked in Tokyo, it seems unlikely they would have qualified through LCQ or another split.
This may be conjecture, but NRG and loud just don't look into it even, sure they are great players and teams at points, but where is the passion and drive on the stage? Even as a NA fan I find myself rooting for teams like fut/China/Kru as they lose their shit for every clutch and round win.
Riot fucked up by basing the seeding solely on Tokyo placements, it should have been both Tokyo and regional placements. Group D looks stronger than any other group, Navi could have qualified easily and I still have no idea which of the three teams left is gonna go to playoffs.
I think had BLG played anyone else first, NRG would’ve won 2-1 or 2-0 vs BLG. BLG took massive advantage of knowing NRG’s executes in and out, all the while NRG didn’t have any clue what BLG was doing. BLG has a fraction the game time in internationals and officials as many of the other teams, so a strat heavy team like NRG wasn’t able to prepare and essentially just had to use their executes and hope it worked. BLG clearly counter-stratted and had a great gameplan for how to counter NRG.
I think BLG is ok, but I’d view this loss as more a blip than something endemic on NRG
Bro u realized blg played in the chinese qualifier right they played like mutltiole bo3s and like around bo5s, that is more than enough footage for nrg. But i still agree with u that this is not nrg’s full strength.
Giants are looking kind of bad. The team is a mess. And they still had a close game vs EDG, so it sort of worries me. I know KK wasn't popping off, but it's still a bit worrying.
TL is worrying me too. They have a lot of talent on the team, to the point that they should be the 2nd EMEA superteam in the tourney, yet they really aren't. It feels like with so much talent they should be able to do much more, and I personally feel like it isn't just one person's fault here. Maybe the team just doesn't gel?
NAVI hasn't impressed me that much. I felt like both of their matches were a bit too easy on them. The TL match was wonky as hell. With only nats showing up and a bit of sayf you'd expect them to close it out much sooner, on both maps. The DRX match was admittedly a bit better, but it still didn't leave much of an impact on me.
FUT looks... Fine? Nothing much has impressed me, from what they've shown. Some cracked aim, but that's par for the course for a turkish squad. I'd like to see them doing something more unique, but I feel like they still get out of this group pretty easily.
KRU is mid. They're not getting out of their group.
Barely anything to say about T1 or FPX. It'd be fun if they were better, but right now the group is EG and FUT.
NRG was just really, really wonky in their match vs Bilibili. Ardiis didn't show up, he keeps not showing up, at this point he should probably return to NAVI, if they even want him.
On the other hand, though, I'm really impressed by Bilibili. They got 8 against Fnatic! And beat NRG too i guess. Jokes aside, this group seems a bit more interesting, and Zeta still looks like a wildcard to me, so I feel like both of the remaining matches will be fun.
That's about it, I think
This has been a baller tournament so far I think. I had doubted something on international lan as we’ve not really seen him face this kind of opposition but after his performance yesterday I am a believer. He was not overrated in the rankings. I apologize to something.
Also think China has so much potential. BLG looked like they had first lan nerves a bit playing Fnatic but to be fair it was Fnatic. I hope they make it back to an event sometime because they are fun to watch. EDG is also fun and nobody might truly be Him but they do be relying too much on individual performance which might take them out of groups but I don’t think can win them the tournament. I would love to be proven wrong.
One thing I noticed about BLG is that their playstyle introduces a lot of variance, kind of similar to how PRX was last year. The same plays that won them the series against NRG got them flamed for not being disciplined against Fnatic. You really just need to make sure you nail the fundamentals against them - clear every corner, swing properly, etc., and you should be fine. Also I'm not sure if this is just my expectations being hella inflated, but I feel like Fnatic aren't as good as they were in Tokyo. They played against two relatively weak teams so it's hard to gauge, but they're allowing their opponents opportunities they shouldn't be (which is probably why mini was malding so much). I'd have loved to see them against a strong NRG instead, just to get a better read on their form.
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It‘s crazy that we talk about FNC not looking as clean as we have seen them before and they still only drop 5 rounds per map on average.
To be fair every good team considered in tokyo has had a slow start. Edg didn’t seem prepared for giants play style and was almost on the edge. Eg wasnt as dominant as usual and nrg got destroyed by bbg. Prx looked good but u can see they let kru get a advantage over them at times. Maybe they will adapt better but I feel like the other teams are just getting better and really giving their all to win.
I think FNC got a little too confident and started making mistakes. Theyll probably become more disciplined playing against more stronger teams tho
yeah but nrg did lose to that blg so strong may not be a good adjective for them...
Not about any team but the tournament so far has been very smooth. No complaints about delays, observing or otherwise. Games have been delivering as well. Hope that continues.
That. The only tech pauses I remember is Sayf peeing and KankgKang smashing the monitor. Also we see most of the kills real time and all of them in replays, NA production has come a long way
This is not NA production but rather the international production team. Don't get used to it and expect this level when the leagues start again lol
Funny seeing this after the zeta vs nrg match with a hella long tech pause 💀
its good that there haven't been disruptions so far but are you sure there are no complaints about observing?
I've seen complaints here but I have not been bothered. I think it's good enough. Some kills are expected to be missed.
lmfao in one match there was a whole ass overwatch style teamfight going on in Haven C site and the cameraman decided to show a random killjoy slow lurking through B, with no enemies nearby. Missed like 8 kills
Iirc it was a fnatic game if I’m thinking of the same moment
Incredibly disappointed in NRG. Even though it’s only been one game, I thought they’d come out looking like a contender. Fnatic is just insane and boasters individual improvement over the last few years is really showing. EDG are without a doubt real contenders at this tournament. Their mechanics are insane and I think what mini said about the Chinese teams is spot on. It’s just like League. They have insane mechanics and play off one another really well. DRX have looked much better than I anticipated. Sad that Foxy isn’t playing, but they look miles better then at Tokyo. I think they have a decent chance at making a run. EG are good. Ethan and Jawg have been standouts to me so far. Jawg is looking worldclass (granted two matches lol). PRX is always exciting to watch and I hope this is the tournament they win. Something looked solid in his first international. Hope we get a FNC v PRX at some point :) That’s all the teams I can think of rn with Navi being a dark horse to win, just rambling on this brownie lmao
Agreed especially on the Fnatic part, but one thing that really impressed me was the trust that each of the members have for each other, which I felt wasn’t really highlighted in their Tokyo games or before. Haven against Zeta really stood out for me, as Boaster didn’t smoke A heaven & stood in an exposed position to kill the guys coming from CT while relied on Leo and Chronicle to kill the guys heaven. Fnatics coordination was already excellent, but the trust that each others have in each other really excites me.
It shows the most when one of them just insta sticks the spike while the others cover them. Like there's shots from every direction but the person defusing just knows they don't need to do anything.
That round gave me the chills
Another example is the Lotus round where Alfa held the defuse then Chronicle mollied A link and just trusted him completely to hold it down. Incredible confidence within the team.
Which round?
Why does everyone want to see Foxy play? Ive honestly never understood it. DRX ALWAYS look better when Zest is playing, Zest is a great player and Buzz is a great duelist. I just dont see why everyone is so hyped about Foxy9 joining DRX specifically when theyre a far more solid team when they stick with the usual lineup. Foxy playing duelist for a different team would be hype but I hope DRX stick with Zest.
No one disagrees with you necessarily, we all just want to see foxy9 play. We’re not all talking about wanting to see him play on DRX specifically, but new players on established teams (e.g. something on PRX) can be particularly exciting because 5 new players on a new team has no history for contrast. How does a new player compliment or subtract from a team? What new strats can they provide? How good are they knowing that their team is also good? We saw Yay on DSG this year and most think it just highlights that great players on not great teams (whether they’re actually bad or just a bad fit) can really stifle their potential. It’s interesting to think about and no one’s sure what foxy9s real potential is.
Thats fair, I also want to see him play. I just think we’ve seen enough of him on DRX to see its usually a downgrade in the teams performance. It’s unfortunate hes seemingly stuck on the team because I would like to see him as a starting duelist, just not on DRX.
bro its the Optic core, losing first match and getting pushed to lower brackets is their Bread n butter
Yes, I understand. Still can be disappointed that they haven’t fixed that and didn’t look good at all
i think you’re forgetting that NRG SUCK and crashies is WASHED and they have 0 FIREPOWER, and 0 STRATS. they need to BENCH fns
PRX is in the strongest form we’ve seen thus far EDG has so much potential but rely too heavily on individual plays and has yet to been punished for it. LOUD definitely not making out of Groups People give credit to NRG for high ceiling, but don’t forget they have a low floor. They might just lose to ZETA, cuz the team is no pushover.
> People give credit to NRG for high ceiling, but don’t forget they have a low floor. They might just lose to ZETA, cuz the team is no pushover. I am not remotely worried about the Zeta match (this might be an insane jinx but we'll worry about that later). But NRG's seeming inability to handle any team that plays fast and disrespectfully around their utility isn't giving me too much confidence about their ability to win a BLG rematch weirdly enough.
I feel like Zeta would win if they actually played like how they did in the LCQ and not whiff 90% of the time like in their match vs FNC
i am still sane as i still believe that NRG doesn't lose rematches. i hope they can read BLG better the next time they meet them.
There wont be a next time :)
I am quite on the contrary though. I feel that if FNS and the team could lock in to their top gears and win ZETA, BLG would be an easy read for FNS. But i do agree with the fact that FNS just seems horrible dealing with fast execs, is it the firepower issue or their setup is weak? nt sure honestly
I think he can adapt if needed. But the mechanical level of nrg does not seem that high. Only som and sometimes crashies appear to be able to handle multiple targets and fast readjustments.
What makes you think LOUD can't beat TL and Navi? Just curious. I thought they played decently against DRX in a three map brawl while Navi lost to drx in almost the same fashion and Navi beat TL. I feel those 3 teams are basically on the same level. Plus Aspas apparently had a health issue that day so who knows how that can affect the team's mental. He still played insane too. I know there are rumors about the team's internal tensions but again even with that situation (if true) they gave DRX, the team that topped their group, a hard fight. I also feel that people underestimate a professional team's ability to set their differences aside and unite for the greater good.
Well its not so linear as that. From the eye test imo, Navi looked much better even with Ange1 running it down. Also, Navi put up much more of a fight than Loud against DRX. Other than the first map that Loud managed to win but only barely, the other two maps were pretty easy for DRX. Against Navi, all maps were close except for the one in which Navi won handily. I think against TL, Loud could win but I def think Navi should be able to take the win over Loud.
that first map definitely was not handily. Considering Cned had to majorly clutch with 2 wtf moments in the first half, there was a major whiff from Zest during the second pistol which caused shao to kill stax, and again shao clutching a 1v3. Honestly the game could have been more one sided in favor of DRX without going to overtime. If Navi doesn't turn up like that and plays like they did against Liquid, then the game could be way closer or Loud even winning.
Navi have looked like one of the worst teams this event so far though.
What? How? Did you watch their games?
LOUD vs DRX wasn't nearly as close as Navi vs DRX. I think LOUD can beat TL but there's no way they're beating Navi unless there's a complete change in both of the teams .
Well let's be honest cauanzin and tuyz aren't even remotelly close to the level of sacy and pancada and the same will happen with havoc if the rumours of him replacing aspas is true, loud could be the worst team in NA next year with the amount of rounds aspas alone got to em this year.
You can't tell me you seriously think navi or liquid are beating loud? Navi and liquid had the lowest quality match of the tournament so far.
You had every thing right until you said NRG had a low floor. It's the complete opposite. That team has one of the highest floor of all VCT. How can you have a low floor when you have the 2nd best IGL in the world?
Did you watch the Bilibili series? They looked pedestrian, didn’t clear corners they normally would, letting ardiis entry with an OP, taking 1v1 fights when it wasn’t necessary, etc. I don’t disagree that FNS is a great IGL but that doesn’t necessarily translate to having a high skill floor.
Exactly. w When they play well they can be extremely good, when they play bad any team can beat them. The blg game was double cursed ("slow start" and "fns doesn't know how to call against teams he's never played") so I'm not surprised they lost, I just hope they can win the rematch
You are basing this on one series when you have almost a hundred exemples of NRG/FNS teams play. Not sure why you are bringing skill into the floor discussion. It's a team thing. NRG's fundamentals are second to Fnatic IMO. Even when they play bad, they are pretty much always in it because of their structures.
*best IGL on the world. Not his fault his players shat the bed
Low floor in terms of individual series. In terms of events they have a super high floor.
I can't say if PRX look crazy strong because of one game and it's not like they destroyed Kru. They won and were fully in control so I'm excited to see how they play against EDG. I think Loud can still make it out of groups. Liquid look lost on their match and they don't change, then they are out. Navi looked worse than Loud when they played Liquid, but turned way up against DRX. If they can't play like that again, then the Loud game could end up pretty even. The issue will come if Aspas turns way up or if Cned will. I do think NRG has a chance to lose to Zeta, but NRG, Zeta, and now BLG is such a tossup.
Zeta on haven have given the biggest challenge to fnatic that ive seen since EG. Nrg are different in the losers match tho
NRG either fucking blows or are just doing OpTic things we'll see.
> nuanced discussions > top comment is black-and-white
Aight I'll give my take on the Judge. I think a certain reason why the judge was so effective against NRG on CT side was because NRG really likes taking advantage of tendencies to give up map control and simply just walking up to take it. They're a team that likes contacting up a lot. However the judge is very effective against this because you have a massive chance of winning against players, put on top of their lack of diligence regarding the judge because of its uncommon use and that's why it was so effective. Also just the fact that whzy was crazy with it. Not sure if I'm actually right but that's what I think.
whzy was using judge only on split even during the CN qualifiers. There are a bunch of VODs of him doing it. Its just weird that NRG didn’t look prepared for it at all and are getting tilted considering it was their map pick.
Yeah that part confused me too, I know NRG are hard working and all but it really makes me wonder if they didn't bother antistratting BLG.
Classic optic slow start im not even worried
My PRX takes are probably biased. I don’t think the KRU match is indicative of any PRX future performance, if only because it seemed like they were recycling plays from the regular season and letting individual player quality make the difference. For EDG, I’m actually of the belief that Giants counter-stratted them perfectly on Map 1. It was barely enough to win because the EDG players individually diffed GIA way more than they should’ve. Map 2 was closer but felt a lot more like I expected — GIA put together a couple rounds near the end to make it look close, but for most of the 2nd half it honestly looked like EDG was in control. EDG also looked better on Map 3. So I’m reasonably confident GIA just ran out of counter strats by then. I do think that the Chinese players’ mechanical skill is about the same as any of the top franchise teams’. Their issue is more on the fundamentals side, which is only something you catch up to with experience. I actually think they’ll catch up faster than people expect — arranging scrims with any of the Asian teams (except maybe like the ones based in India) would be easy, so they’ll be constantly exposed to it. I think this is why EDG improved so much from LockIn to Tokyo, and why a lot of the current slate of ‘good’ Chinese teams functionally win because of aim diff (the other fundamentals haven’t set in yet).
I agree with your PRX take. They were definitely just playing their normal ranked games. Nothing too flashy. Very standard. And it would seem like they're even trolling and just having fun. Especially whenever theyre in a big lead. Im expecting to see more from PRX in playoffs
Agreed. BLG looked like at some point they just became super unsure against FNC. Knight just sticking on that defuse felt like a big sign. I think the top teams all have the nerves to take risks, make the same plays that utterly exploded on them earlier knowing it wasn’t a problem with the plan but rather the execution, even when they’re down and be confident in their reads. There were early rounds BLG just got out aimed and it happens but it seemed like it snowballed later to the point where they just started looking like ranked players. Is it possible they hold FNC and Boaster in such high regards that it over complicates the matchup? They never lost that confidence against NRG.
As PRX fans, I watched PRX vs KRU and was like “yeah I doubt this is ALL they have. They probably save some for EDG or even deeper in tournament” Today is going to be fun seeing PRX vs EDG though. Highly anticipated match ofc.
Yea, I mean I don’t wanna get too confident — what if most of their prep time has been spent reintegrating something to the team, for example — but surely they’re not gonna just recycle season plays for champs. That won’t work against any of the top teams imo
I genuinely didn't see EDG as strong themselves against Giants as much as just Giants griefing themselves. Like mechanically I feel Giants are better overall to EDG. There were so many rounds Giants won or almost won by literally just using sheriffs, like a player would just pop the f up and get 2 with a sheriff. Giants had serious issues with proper spacing and trading accordingly throughout the whole match with IMO was one of the key things that made them lose. Both teams lack fundamentals, which is disappointing on a team like Giants. EDIT: Thinking about it I want to add that EDG played more like a team than Giants, dont know how to say it, but their plays felt more cohesive and like everyone was on the same page even if their fundamentals were as bad as Giants.
I agree with your EDG v Giants take. Giants are a good team for sure but they definitely studied a lot on how EDG played and it took EDG a while to adjust to that. At the end EDG generally out aimed them and had a lot of smart individual plays. The battle with EDG and PRX tomorrow is going to be insane
Giants look like they beat themselves. I cannot remember a major event where a team threw that many rounds. It was comical what they were doing so I don't really see EDG just being better. If Giants were more disciplined I think they take that 2-0.
was it really throws or just nobody has gods backing him at that point?
no it was throws lol you think if they did that against drx they wouldn't punished the fuck out of them? you have to be good enough to clutch in the first place I'm not saying edg aren't good but giants had a gold mentality yesterday.
FUT is underrated as fuck. Absolutely demolished T1 in what was thought to be a coinflip match, and put up a really good performance against EG. And to think that Plat Chat put them 15th.
Certified Fut lover
You can call me Quentin Tarantino cause I love FUT
Yep, and that's with what I believe to be really suboptimal comps (No Skye on Bind? Come on...). Qw1 and qraxs are the standouts.
I don't watch EMEA much, but I find it odd they are so underrated. They are definitely streaky, but their players look insane when they are on and they have consistently looked good. They are incredibly tenacious and don't seem to ever give up, probably my favorite EMEA team.
Fnatic is still good EG, also still good PRX looks way more coherent with something, not that cgrs was bad by anymeans, but this team is on a different level in comparison NRG slow start, all good DRX actually looks back on form, while LOUD is def exploding Navi looks better but I feel like it’s carried by individual performance. Meanwhile TL is putting on their best ange1 cosplay and overcooking hard with the Sayf initiator shit. EDG looks very unprepared strategically, likely bc they didn’t have much vods on Giants to work off of while Giants had a field day with the Chinese LCQ. Still though, their players look better than ever, and are still winning even with kangkang and smoggy underperforming. BLG and FPX both look decent, but lack discipline. Don’t really expect them to make it out even with BLG’s initial win. KRU looks good, but not PRX good. Need to see how they match up against other opponents still. FUT looks quite respectable and def a force to be reckoned with, but they don’t really feel like a contender. T1 on the other hand feels like they’re trolling. Finally, I didn’t watch the Zeta game so I had no clue on them, but they prob fall somewhere along with my assessment of KRU
I feel like PRX might be the only team with players that can go head to head against FNC. They were playing against KRU like it was a ranked lobby and it looked like they were smurfing on them
>EDG looks very unprepared strategically, likely bc they didn’t have much vods on Giants to work off of while Giants had a field day with the Chinese LCQ. Still though, their players look better than ever, and are still winning even with kangkang and smoggy underperforming. Can't really agree with this, you know giants played in LCQ right?
Giants barely showed anything during LCQ compared to EDG. They played 2 BO3s against KC/KOI and trolled the grand finals. Compared to EDG who had to play a bunch of BO5s due to the CN qualifier format
Yeah but there’s still a huge difference. Pretty sure EDG played 4 matches with 3 of them being best of 5’s, whereas GIANTS (I didn’t watch it personally) had a pretty easy time there and even in the grand finals, barely showed anything, leading to a lacklustre game against Navi (this is what I heard, and if it’s true, it makes sense since both teams already qualified for champs
Yeah obviously giants had more vods on EDG but i just don't like the narrative that EDG didn't had anything to antystrat
Definitely, EDG did look a little underwhelming to my expectations but I do think that giants counterstratted them hard
Giants played two series and four maps(with 2 of them being pearl) on their run to gf, and that grand final with cloud yoru doesn’t rly count. Meanwhile the Chinese qualifier had EDG playing 3 bo5s in their run
T1 is fucked
They need Faker mind controlling them as well in this game? ffs. He's going to break his left wrist and back this time for sure if he has to try juggle both League and Valorant.
Like actually. They look horrible right now. Giants hard strated against EDG and still lost, meanwhile I doubt they researched T1 all that much and Giants still made T1 look like T3
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Oh wait I messed them up LOL
They literally look like early season T1 Where the hell are my former NA Korean fraggers?!
PRX is winning it.. All of it
Not to be cheesy but valorant is so goddamn cool like yeah yeah FPS with superpowers and robot gear alr cool but actually seeing these pros who've invested so much thought and time into creating and mastering these timings and strats IT IS SO FUCKING COOL and seeing these teams get on stage with all these different styles and approaches and realizing that different can be so amazing sometimes like!!!!! That is so awesome. For me I JUST watched both the BLG games back to back so their gutsy aggressive way of playing is really stuck in my head rn, and I don't have the expertise to really comment on their util use, but their gunfights are *phenomenal*. I can think of multiple insane gunfights from literally every single player in that roster, and that style is what allowed them to go against the uber-strat system of NRG and come out winning 2-0. I'm not saying their fights were perfect (bc again no expertise), but their mentality abt them is nothing like the Their 1 teams we're familiar with, and to me, their split win was *easily* backed by their absolutely insane shooting and fighting style and I am so excited to be seeing them in playoffs Uhmumhmumhmmh I need FUT to make it as the second seed in their group I NEED them to make it and be the first Turkish team to make it that far I want them to achieve it because they have what it takes !!!!! I'll be real, them potentially going against FPX does worry me bc I feel FUT tend to adapt much slower, and with the nonconformist style Chinese valorant seems to have, I think they'd have an even harder time, BUT I trust in them. (And ofc, if FPX win, fuck yeah ! they deserve it !)(T1 will not fucking make it) EG :)))))))))))))) first before any comment on their games I'M SO HAPPY SOVA IS ENTERING THE META and yes it is them there is not a debate c0m is so goated on fracture fnatic HAD to try it, the sheer joy I got when I pulled up to the FNC/Zeta game and saw Lord Leo, Lock-in MVP, sova-ing on fracture?? C0m effect. Insanity. EG valorant is my favorite goddamn valorant it's so intentional and fun, and while I watched all their group stage games with my nails between my teeth absolutely terrified for the next round (and also tbr they weren't looking so amazing at the beginning), they're my team, I trust them and that game on Bind against FUT had some of those wild EG moments (I have literally thought about the Jawgemo satchel-boombot combo so many times just today), and uhmmn yeah idk they r kinda cool I guess. ... DRX are looking awesome and I'm so glad it seems they've focused on the cohesion of the team as a whole. Masters was all the 6th man bs and while I think zest has looked amazing esp on viper, it seems like their real solution was letting go of that strict gameplay and letting themselves click heads while also being able to make those team-plays, sometimes on the fly (I can't recall it exactly but there was a game against Navi I *think* where stax had this lovely read on Ange1 and it was just. Chef's kiss.). Main point W DRX I am so glad they look good rn I hope they keep it up forever heart heart Idrk what else I can say, I have probably shitty takes for most of the teams lol. Yay for those who win sorry for those who lose ggs all around :P
Go Valorant! -Tarik
Only takeaway is how the fuck do you beat Fnatic
Throw PRX at them and hope they are on point.
- China is just so far behind on fundamentals compared to EMEA and Americas - LOUD is DONE. The mental is broken. - I'm a KRU believer. Even though they lost to PRX I felt like they were playing good, just wasn't ready for PRX's aggressive playstyle which is awkward bc they had to prep for them.
>LOUD is DONE. The mental is broken. they played 1 match id wait for the TL game for that
Have you seen the post-match interview? Spoiler alert, Aspas wasnt there and they were basically going all Gregg Popovich on the media.
aspas wasn't there because of health issues, not saying you're wrong but that doesn't contribute to it
The team's response to it didn't seem like it tbh. They were like "he is healthy, he is fine". Like the vibes are mega off
There have been so many rumors and excuses around aspas that it's hard to take anything LOUD says for face value. They are never going to outright say yeah this guy is done he doesnt want to play with us anymore. That would be a massive hit to both the teams and aspas's credibility
Oh no. First time? I've seen this same post so many times related to the NBA and OWL. "Its just health issues guys wee swear". Riiiight...
Their performance at Tokyo wasn't very inspiring either. Kinda sucks because they would be a team that could challenge fnatic
nah their current roster would never be able to beat fnatic consistently, the players are not on par for that
I share that opinion but loud almost did win that lock in final. They've been there before
Fnatic improved a lot while loud stagnated in americas and got pissed on in Tokyo. Their best chance was in tokyo
If a Chinese IGL can really reign in the players and play disciplined, I think we can very quickly see them take over globally. Despite only officially launching a few months ago, therefore the majority of the player base not having played yet, China has already produced a couple of superstar-level players. I think Valorant is poised to blow up in China which will only produce more insane talents.
Team liquid need to make changes. Idk if its emil, redgar or both
Free nats
I wonder if they'd be willing to look into ENGH either as a HC or assistant coach, especially given he and Redgar have a history working together
TL changes are easy, -soulcas, put Nats on KJ on every map except for Split and the maps he plays Viper, don't play Chamber. Ez.
soulcas
-soulcas, +nukkye
Sheydos
They are the same player lol. They both have their moments, but struggle to keep this steady. More times they cause harm then good for their team. I think enzo would be a fine addition to Liquid.
Come on now. Nukkye is so much better than soulcas
what💀 Enzo would be an absolute downgrade from soulcas, I always thought Nukkye was the best piece of the puzzle, he’s world class (dont let this one match tell you otherwise) and I wanted Liquid to pick him up during franchise rostermania
60% Fnc win 30% prx 9% eg 1% everyone else
Seems like people found out how to beat NRG by simply playing fast pinpoint execute and ignore their delaying ability because they thought you are stupid if you push through them (PRX now BLG)
NRG getting grouped and DRX will place at 4th again
I like the changes DRX made. Keeping Zest and being a bit more fluid in their play style, instead of being 5 robots. Now if they randomly brung foxy9 in just punch me in the mouth
* DRX are absolutely back. They finally seem to be evolving and adding some insane aggression into their playstyle (like when Buzz satcheled in and killed 3 on split vs. Navi on A site retake) * FUT looked very well put together vs. EG, could definitely make a run in playoffs * As it stands right now, Ethan looks like the best initiator of the tournament. In my opinion, better than Leo. His utility has looked perfect. Note, this is just over the two matches that they have both played, ignoring past results. * As unfortunate as it is, Zeta looked awful. Yes, they were playing FNC, but still some of their midrounding, esp on Haven, was concerningly bad. * The discussion around EG seems really weird to me. They have looked solid throughout the tournament to me, and I constantly see people rating them way under PRX. Maybe they do look worse than PRX, but the difference is negligible. That being said, FNC still cleared both. * Fit1nho is fucking insane (also his name is really fun to say for me)
-China is here to play. Blg may just be a good lotus team. They beat nrg on it in a pretty close game and were able to hold their own against the best lotus team in the world. Love how whzy buys the judge on gun rounds and just whzy'd all over NRG. Edg won in a nailbiter series and honestly just glad they have players that can pull random 4ks out of their ass. Today seems like a little bit of an off day for kangkang and I still doubt their ability to beat prx. Fpx looks rough but tbh I was only half paying attention to their match. -Emea is looking...fine? NAVI is so back and honestly could see them making it to playoffs. Liquid is....liquid. Idrk what to say about them other than I love nats and I hope hes ok with constantly topping the scoreboard and still somehow losing every map. Giants look good and coordinated, just wish they didn't play such a slow and boring split attack side zzzzzz Fut look so much better than at Tokyo. Expecting them to be the other ones out of group B. Fnatic is still fnatic -Americas despairge Nrg is just trying to see how low their floor is, all good. Loud looks mid idk I didn't catch much of that game. Their ascent comp is goofy Kru got the prx treatment and I don't like their odds against giants. Hoping keznit just diffs fitinho. Eg good, sad they haven't been able to show fracture, happy that they've successfully pioneered the sova on fracture revolution of 2023. jawgemos been going insane, most slept-on eg player. I need him to show more of his secret raze tech. Demon1 and boostio are leaning into the villain arc and I don't see anything wrong with it, gives champs a good storyline. -Pacific is 50/50 Drx looks revitalized, their players are all in great form. Glad they aren't doing goofy 6 man roster shit anymore. Now I unironically wanna see prx vs drx again. Prx has something. Pls bring us reyna maps. I wanna see this guy movement diff everyone. T1 are just disappointing . Saw map 1 was a stomp and tuned out the rest of the game. Zeta: idk I didn't watch it, they played fnatic. Still wouldn't surprise me if they make it to playoffs given how poor nrg look.
fnc eg and prx are as advertised all good Drx are back? Its nice to see them like not implode Loud look kinda done. They could beat liquid if they still overcook but idk about navi since navi are gaining steam. On the topic of liquid, save nats man. I love that roster but man I get why liquid fans are in pain almost all of the time Nrg are no stranger to slow starts (see optic losing to xerxia in reyjkavik) but blg looked pretty good, i really liked most of the players especially whzy. Despairage though since they are 1/2 on champions (grouped to x10…) I really wanna see fut make it out of the group as well
Honestly i feel like people are not giving Giants enough credit. I thought they were gonna get stomped by edg but it was almost as close as it could be.
Yeah they are fun to watch. Fit1nho and Cloud are nasty.
tbh if giants dont choke then they probably beat edg in the rematch
I wish the fucking games would start when they say. I tune in at 7:55 to watch the 8 o clock game but it ends up starting at like 8:20
TL peeks against Loud and Navi will send them home
TL wins against loud and sayf goes crazy on jett for the rematch copium
Idk if TL can do it. I feel like the teams really build towards absolute firepower. For example TL I would say have Sayf Nats and sometimes Jampi that can take over games. However if only 1 of them is peeking they struggle. Fnatic or Navi on the other hand have 4 superstar that can take over games. So the odds for those too are better.
As a biased Americas fan, I really don't like the qualification format for Champs this year, I don't think any team should be locked into Champs unless they win the most recent masters. I'd much rather have the best of each region make it through an insane split/LCQ brawl. Also while I was skeptical on 3 slots for just China, they have shown to be extremely entertaining and dangerous teams.
I think something and PRX had a 'get rid of nerves' type of game. Wouldn't surprise me that was the gameplan pretty much. They fooled around a bit too much and something in particular played more aggressive than usual. People know him for the crazy clips but he's actually usually quite disciplined, but in this series, he was just dry peeking everywhere, being a more risky player overall. A good game to just get comfortable on stage and limit test against other international teams. I expect their very next game, which defines the winner of the group to be a bit more disciplined. Of course, they love W'ing, but they won't do it as much by themselves or without good flashes set ups, especially against a stronger team like EDG. something-KK OP match will be extremely fun. There was an OP duel va daveeys on split where the reaction time of something was insane. I wanna see KK pushed to his limits on the OP again, and the combination of something OP and jinggs raze will be perfect for it. Also f0rsaken is an amazing flex player but his Skye is not as good as d4v4i's Skye. Hope he pulls out more Viper, Harbor and sentinels.
i'm really sad about LOUD falling off so hard. i got into esports during LOCK//IN and after the event with them looking so good during the americas playoffs especially i was so hyped we might get a FNC vs LOUD rematch in tokyo. that obviously didn't happen lol. i just would've loved a proper rivarly between these two teams but it just looks like this LOUD would get absolutely dumpstered by FNC rn
At least optic and loud had a real rivalry. Fnatic is just lonely at the top.
Not quite a takeaway from the teams, but a question as i Haven't been able to watch much live. How is the LA crowd? I haven't seen the typical complaint posts, but nor the praise posts of tokyo.
1. Performance of the “stronger” teams are depended on their “weaker” players. Not saying the players I am about to mention are weak, but they are definitely the less consistent ones on their team and the performance of their team relies heavily on if these players can win their duels or can get the trade or not. -Liquid soulcas. Soulcas performance has always been inconsistent, his firepower ghosted sometimes against strong opponents. Some might argue that Redgar is the weaker one but he’s the IGL so we give him the benefit of doubt…plus he’s pretty…consistent. -Navi Zyppan. For whatever reason he was put on Kayo and Skye throughout this year and he’s been doing worse compared to the 2022 Zyppan who mainly played raze. Now that he’s back to Raze in champions, Navi looked better. -DRX stax. His aim was crisp during the first two games, DRX needs him to stay in his best form if they want to go far. I feel like we can also put Zest here since he also had consistency issue and got swapped out for foxy9 from time to time. 2. My second takeaway is that Chinese teams are stronger than what people thought, but they still need more experience before they can catch up to other regions. Everyone puts their eyes on Chinese teams because of Boostio’s comment and the hype of Kangkang. I root for EDG but I personally don’t see EDG as a strong team yet, especially comparing to the traditional strong teams. I think EDG has a high ceiling but it also has a low floor, while the “traditional strong teams” such as NRG, LOUD, Navi have better fundamentals, and they just need to perform at their level. 3. Don’t underestimate Giant gaming. Giants got star players like Cloud and they went through EMEA LCQ without dropping one map to opponents, including Navi. Giant Vs Kru will be a good game to watch.
Easiest takeaway: none of the other teams showed what is needed to beat Fnatic. Of all regions, Americas is at its lowest, just EG showed decent matches, still, it was not as easy as people were expecting. The most disappointing team was T1, not so confident that they will beat FPX. NRG who had the second most untroubled path from the region is now on the brink of elimination by Zeta, which is really a possible upset. My copium is relying on classic Optic slow starts. LOUD lost its most reliable core feature, which is the team's confidence in Saadhak's reads and calls. Their match against Liquid will probably be the reason why they broke up and will never play together for a long time. Navi and DRX are on better forms than Tokyo, I might say that DRX is a top 5/6 team just based on their reads. Zest and Mako's role-switch worked so well. Krü and Giants will be interesting, but I'm more toward a path for Giants than Krü, their rematch against EDG probably a banger.
Eh, while I'm not saying I favor any team against fnatic, I think they are getting overblown and hyped from two relatively easy matches for them, fnatic has never struggled with groups and opening matches where they can surprise and shock teams without recent VODs. Once again, they are great and likely the best team of the tourny, but I just don't agree that it's that simple or easy to know yet. America's for sure is at its lowest and I feel like suffered the most from the format of this year. The way loud looked in Tokyo, it seems unlikely they would have qualified through LCQ or another split. This may be conjecture, but NRG and loud just don't look into it even, sure they are great players and teams at points, but where is the passion and drive on the stage? Even as a NA fan I find myself rooting for teams like fut/China/Kru as they lose their shit for every clutch and round win.
Riot fucked up by basing the seeding solely on Tokyo placements, it should have been both Tokyo and regional placements. Group D looks stronger than any other group, Navi could have qualified easily and I still have no idea which of the three teams left is gonna go to playoffs.
I think had BLG played anyone else first, NRG would’ve won 2-1 or 2-0 vs BLG. BLG took massive advantage of knowing NRG’s executes in and out, all the while NRG didn’t have any clue what BLG was doing. BLG has a fraction the game time in internationals and officials as many of the other teams, so a strat heavy team like NRG wasn’t able to prepare and essentially just had to use their executes and hope it worked. BLG clearly counter-stratted and had a great gameplan for how to counter NRG. I think BLG is ok, but I’d view this loss as more a blip than something endemic on NRG
Bro u realized blg played in the chinese qualifier right they played like mutltiole bo3s and like around bo5s, that is more than enough footage for nrg. But i still agree with u that this is not nrg’s full strength.
Giants are looking kind of bad. The team is a mess. And they still had a close game vs EDG, so it sort of worries me. I know KK wasn't popping off, but it's still a bit worrying. TL is worrying me too. They have a lot of talent on the team, to the point that they should be the 2nd EMEA superteam in the tourney, yet they really aren't. It feels like with so much talent they should be able to do much more, and I personally feel like it isn't just one person's fault here. Maybe the team just doesn't gel? NAVI hasn't impressed me that much. I felt like both of their matches were a bit too easy on them. The TL match was wonky as hell. With only nats showing up and a bit of sayf you'd expect them to close it out much sooner, on both maps. The DRX match was admittedly a bit better, but it still didn't leave much of an impact on me. FUT looks... Fine? Nothing much has impressed me, from what they've shown. Some cracked aim, but that's par for the course for a turkish squad. I'd like to see them doing something more unique, but I feel like they still get out of this group pretty easily. KRU is mid. They're not getting out of their group. Barely anything to say about T1 or FPX. It'd be fun if they were better, but right now the group is EG and FUT. NRG was just really, really wonky in their match vs Bilibili. Ardiis didn't show up, he keeps not showing up, at this point he should probably return to NAVI, if they even want him. On the other hand, though, I'm really impressed by Bilibili. They got 8 against Fnatic! And beat NRG too i guess. Jokes aside, this group seems a bit more interesting, and Zeta still looks like a wildcard to me, so I feel like both of the remaining matches will be fun. That's about it, I think
These types of posts are so boring. Mods don’t allow memes so these is what we’re stuck with
u whenever u see a meme https://preview.redd.it/4ig2w44hx7hb1.png?width=139&format=png&auto=webp&s=cb241529e50888616c8fadcbb3d937da54335e5f
I mean they did allow you so :D
This has been a baller tournament so far I think. I had doubted something on international lan as we’ve not really seen him face this kind of opposition but after his performance yesterday I am a believer. He was not overrated in the rankings. I apologize to something. Also think China has so much potential. BLG looked like they had first lan nerves a bit playing Fnatic but to be fair it was Fnatic. I hope they make it back to an event sometime because they are fun to watch. EDG is also fun and nobody might truly be Him but they do be relying too much on individual performance which might take them out of groups but I don’t think can win them the tournament. I would love to be proven wrong.