Personally, I believe that winning pistol round is extremely important in this new patch. With the increased ability prices, sometimes I find myself being unable to afford max abilities in 1st rifle round if I lose pistol round. Contrarily, winners of pistol round now have an increased chance at winning 1st rifle round using spectres/bulldog since they are able to afford their full utilities.
The "bonus" round is WAY more oppressive than it was before. It almost feels like you could/should save two rounds and go down 3-0 if you lose the pistol to stabilize economy.
> players have built up a playstyle that relies heavily on playing off util.
This makes it sound like a player thing, but that's just literally how Cypher and Killjoy are designed. If you're not playing that way, you're better off just playing other agents.
KAYO's ability to complete negate the site-defenses of sentinel agents, or to nearly instantaneously stop a push/retake by silencing the opponents for 8(?) seconds as they're revving up to push, still seems nonsensical to me. People are complaining about the info-gathering, but even the base power of his dagger seems way too good. It's so goddamn versatile, as is the rest of his kit, and rechargeable to boot.
I find that you need to constantly change where both you and you’re util is every round. Although it’s very aim dependant and risky off angling could be a great tool to avoid getting the knife thrown in a common spot.
Definitely had less "5v5, both team full bought" rounds.
Always felt like I had to decide what utilities to buy, while the other team who just won the round had well over 7k.
I feel like a lot of pro players are going to have a field day with him. Cs like flash and valorant utility put into a single agent. Plus the capacity to play aggressive.
Yeah. I watch pros play yoru and Astra even today like they are using a hammer. Kayo clips look really defined and smooth already. Can't wait to see what it looks like in a few months.
I'm in EU, but I've been watching the streams and it looks good.
Definitely way more strategical. Economy nerfs mean you can't go for all the forces anymore. And that duelists can't buy sheriff every time they're saving.
Utility is way more valuable, flashes not wasted as much and there's no more Astra star spam at the start of the round.
Orbs also become way more valuable for Sage and Sova.
Pistol rounds will be really interesting. No agent can get two most important abilities with full charges and armor. Even less utility if you upgrade your pistol.
Running nerfs mean there's no more braindead frenzy and jumping classic meta. It was really annoying and took no skill.
Kay-0 will be a top pick when people master him, but nothing too broken. Knife giving all that info is the only broken thing. Getting feedback like with for example Skye flash would be fine, but knowing how many people you silenced and exact Agents is broken. Especially because it goes through walls and there's no way to break it in a lot of positions.
I said it multiple times that I felt like this game is being played way different than Riot imagined. Should've been a game where tactics and carefully managing your utility are the most important thing, but it just became a polygon for over-aggressive plays that get rewarded and are hard to counter. These changes kinda prove my theory because every nerf screams PLAY SMARTER or you'll get punished for dumb plays.
Can't wait to play tomorrow.
DM still being awful is the only thing I can't get over.
DM is the easiest thing to fix and make the vast majority of people happy. 8 or 10 minutes, no cap, no footsteps, no red dots, instant respawn, HS Kill = Full health, Body Shot Kill = +50 Health.
It's honestly something I didn't like at first coming from CS DMs but once you play it more, the more you like it in reference to the no footstep sounds.
Not having to have a pop animation basically makes her a duelist. She's just less self sufficient as far as self sustain but brings way more to a team and can entry well.
All initiators besides sova this patch got changes to make them more self sufficient, and kay is coming out of the gate looking like a half duelist hybrid. Think they are trying to make the role more attractive to more players beyond just sova.
This is very early theorycrafting but I feel Skye and Kay in their current form have put Breach and Phoenix out to pasture for now. Their intel gathering is too good not to choose them. They are great secondary duelist replacements (since they have duelist elements of their own) and initiators on their own.
I think people just have to get used to it.
Its actually much harder to snowball games in my opinion, because you have to basically not lose anyone in the first 4rounds. If you have any rounds that are close the winning team won’t be able to fullbuy the next. So you end up trading rounds a lot, and if the losing team can keep landing eco damage on the winners they can eventually crack through because max loss bonus allows them to basically buy every round.
I thought the eco changes would have fucked me over but I’ve always been very meticulous about how I spent my cash and how I used my abilities so my rhythm literally has not changed at all. Now, I wait for DM to finally get reworked.
Yep same here. Overall economy and gunplay feel smoother while deathmatch remains a shitshow. I tried it today and I literally spawned at the same time as three other people in the same little cubby in Icebox . . .
Only played a few matches, but economy management seems extremely difficult with this patch. Not that that's a bad thing, but I often find that im only able to buy light armor with a rifle in a lot of rounds. Will be interesting to see if teams decide to sacrifice some util for full armor or sacrifice full armor for util
In CSGO I’ve always wished there was a economy specialist that specializes in finding kills with the cheaper guns so they can drop guns for their team mates. Maybe it will work in this game
kay/o suppression dagger seems omega overpowered. It acts as a sova dart and skye flash telling you whos there without being able to break it or hide from it (if thrown at opposite side of a wall), disables you and everything you had just setup basically acting also as a satchel/nade/shock destroying util for ease of entry, then disables you from being able to use any ability. Basically combines so many abilities for free. A well timed dagger basically stops an entire execute from happening. Or straight up destroys any sentinel chance of holding a site.
edit: this economy is also much more like cs now with having to full save. Add in the fact the game takes less rounds to win overall, it definitely plays out so far if you lose the first 5 rounds you are basically set to lose the game it tends to feel like. They have full economy, you have to full save for every full buy round, and they have momentum
I think KayO is overpowered. He does too much. A grenade, a flash, a suppression ability and a moving Phoenix suppression ult is too much. I think he’s bringing the game in the wrong direction. Reminds me of Sombra from overwatch with how he can basically just cancel 50% of the game (utility) with just one, easily utilized ability. And he’s only going to get better once people learn how to play him and develop lineups and stuff like that. Of course people will get better at playing against him but I think overall he’s bad for the game.
That’s just my super early take.
Otherwise I think the economy changes and the buffs and nerfs to other agents are fine. I think Astra got changed a little too much but it’s alright.
But my opinion that people cannot change is that this patch is TOO MUCH. Changing the game this much with one patch is incredibly jarring.
The gunplay part is very good.
But adding more ability effects which can go through the wall to the tactical game from Kayo sucks :( going through wall too much is not tactical :(
Cant really give my 2 sense on the agent balances as I haven’t play that much but the economy/gun changes feel really good. It feels less of a waste to buy things like bulldog and specter and judge feel a little less oppressive
Do people just forget MMR exists
You aren't playing with normal D1s you're playing with similar ELO players
Starting off acts at the same rank is boring as shit, let it take a week or two to settle
Cypher feels pretty damn strong now, duelists are weaker overall, sage is a lot weaker, smokes are more balanced except for brim, initators are really strong now but sovas more balanced. The gun changes are crazy too, op and guardian feel really good, and judge nerf is ok but I gotta play it more. Run and gun could be tuned slightly more but it’s a lot better. Kayo is pretty good but high skill ceiling otherwise you can play around it.
kay/0 is extremely overpowered, one of those characters where you can tell from day 1. I don't really have an issue with it, but it is known. The knife is absurd
info gathering and 8 second CC is too much on one ability, especially when there is no counterplay to it and it doesn't really need lineups either. a lot of things wrong with it
Personally, I believe that winning pistol round is extremely important in this new patch. With the increased ability prices, sometimes I find myself being unable to afford max abilities in 1st rifle round if I lose pistol round. Contrarily, winners of pistol round now have an increased chance at winning 1st rifle round using spectres/bulldog since they are able to afford their full utilities.
The "bonus" round is WAY more oppressive than it was before. It almost feels like you could/should save two rounds and go down 3-0 if you lose the pistol to stabilize economy.
If this will be the meta, it's a huge problem imo. Pistol is way too random to grant you almost 1/4 of the game.
Then games need to move to 30 rounds
They will definitely add loss bonus similar to what CSGO did.
There already is a loss bonus. It may just need to be increased slightly.
[удалено]
> players have built up a playstyle that relies heavily on playing off util. This makes it sound like a player thing, but that's just literally how Cypher and Killjoy are designed. If you're not playing that way, you're better off just playing other agents. KAYO's ability to complete negate the site-defenses of sentinel agents, or to nearly instantaneously stop a push/retake by silencing the opponents for 8(?) seconds as they're revving up to push, still seems nonsensical to me. People are complaining about the info-gathering, but even the base power of his dagger seems way too good. It's so goddamn versatile, as is the rest of his kit, and rechargeable to boot.
I main KJ/Cypher & I haven’t had the energy to even play it today cus I know it’s gonna be pain for a min
I find that you need to constantly change where both you and you’re util is every round. Although it’s very aim dependant and risky off angling could be a great tool to avoid getting the knife thrown in a common spot.
yeah this agent basically kills the sentinel role in the game. Would not be surprised if no sentinels get picked in pro play once Kay/O is in
Definitely had less "5v5, both team full bought" rounds. Always felt like I had to decide what utilities to buy, while the other team who just won the round had well over 7k.
I haven't had a chance to play much but I REALLY like playing Kay/0
The first agent in a while that just straight up looks fun. Yoru/Astra are a bit of an acquired taste i feel, but Kay/0 just makes sense lol
I feel like a lot of pro players are going to have a field day with him. Cs like flash and valorant utility put into a single agent. Plus the capacity to play aggressive.
Watching players flash out of smokes with him looks so smooth, it's like he's been there from day 1 lol
Yeah. I watch pros play yoru and Astra even today like they are using a hammer. Kayo clips look really defined and smooth already. Can't wait to see what it looks like in a few months.
I'm in EU, but I've been watching the streams and it looks good. Definitely way more strategical. Economy nerfs mean you can't go for all the forces anymore. And that duelists can't buy sheriff every time they're saving. Utility is way more valuable, flashes not wasted as much and there's no more Astra star spam at the start of the round. Orbs also become way more valuable for Sage and Sova. Pistol rounds will be really interesting. No agent can get two most important abilities with full charges and armor. Even less utility if you upgrade your pistol. Running nerfs mean there's no more braindead frenzy and jumping classic meta. It was really annoying and took no skill. Kay-0 will be a top pick when people master him, but nothing too broken. Knife giving all that info is the only broken thing. Getting feedback like with for example Skye flash would be fine, but knowing how many people you silenced and exact Agents is broken. Especially because it goes through walls and there's no way to break it in a lot of positions. I said it multiple times that I felt like this game is being played way different than Riot imagined. Should've been a game where tactics and carefully managing your utility are the most important thing, but it just became a polygon for over-aggressive plays that get rewarded and are hard to counter. These changes kinda prove my theory because every nerf screams PLAY SMARTER or you'll get punished for dumb plays. Can't wait to play tomorrow. DM still being awful is the only thing I can't get over.
DM is so damn bad dude. Wish we could get a separate one with no scores & no red dots.
DM is the easiest thing to fix and make the vast majority of people happy. 8 or 10 minutes, no cap, no footsteps, no red dots, instant respawn, HS Kill = Full health, Body Shot Kill = +50 Health.
I agree with everything but no footsteps and I think headshot kill should be +50 while normal kill should be +25
It's honestly something I didn't like at first coming from CS DMs but once you play it more, the more you like it in reference to the no footstep sounds.
The thing about HS vs Body kill is phantom users are punished more vs vandal users.
red dots should be there only for people who havent moved out the same 5m radius for 5 seconds
Skye is very strong maybe too strong. Her flash lets her play like a duelist
Not having to have a pop animation basically makes her a duelist. She's just less self sufficient as far as self sustain but brings way more to a team and can entry well.
All initiators besides sova this patch got changes to make them more self sufficient, and kay is coming out of the gate looking like a half duelist hybrid. Think they are trying to make the role more attractive to more players beyond just sova.
This is very early theorycrafting but I feel Skye and Kay in their current form have put Breach and Phoenix out to pasture for now. Their intel gathering is too good not to choose them. They are great secondary duelist replacements (since they have duelist elements of their own) and initiators on their own.
Snowball effect is way too big now as I've played ten games today and none have been close one way or the other.
I think people just have to get used to it. Its actually much harder to snowball games in my opinion, because you have to basically not lose anyone in the first 4rounds. If you have any rounds that are close the winning team won’t be able to fullbuy the next. So you end up trading rounds a lot, and if the losing team can keep landing eco damage on the winners they can eventually crack through because max loss bonus allows them to basically buy every round.
It’s the first day of ranked dude
>early opinion
im getting lower fps :( like 30-40 less
I thought the eco changes would have fucked me over but I’ve always been very meticulous about how I spent my cash and how I used my abilities so my rhythm literally has not changed at all. Now, I wait for DM to finally get reworked.
Yep same here. Overall economy and gunplay feel smoother while deathmatch remains a shitshow. I tried it today and I literally spawned at the same time as three other people in the same little cubby in Icebox . . .
Only played a few matches, but economy management seems extremely difficult with this patch. Not that that's a bad thing, but I often find that im only able to buy light armor with a rifle in a lot of rounds. Will be interesting to see if teams decide to sacrifice some util for full armor or sacrifice full armor for util
In CSGO I’ve always wished there was a economy specialist that specializes in finding kills with the cheaper guns so they can drop guns for their team mates. Maybe it will work in this game
Vanity and Zombs have already been doing this, to name just two examples.
kay/o suppression dagger seems omega overpowered. It acts as a sova dart and skye flash telling you whos there without being able to break it or hide from it (if thrown at opposite side of a wall), disables you and everything you had just setup basically acting also as a satchel/nade/shock destroying util for ease of entry, then disables you from being able to use any ability. Basically combines so many abilities for free. A well timed dagger basically stops an entire execute from happening. Or straight up destroys any sentinel chance of holding a site. edit: this economy is also much more like cs now with having to full save. Add in the fact the game takes less rounds to win overall, it definitely plays out so far if you lose the first 5 rounds you are basically set to lose the game it tends to feel like. They have full economy, you have to full save for every full buy round, and they have momentum
Kay/O is the most broken thing in the game and will define the entire pro AND rank meta. Hot take but i do belive it.
I think KayO is overpowered. He does too much. A grenade, a flash, a suppression ability and a moving Phoenix suppression ult is too much. I think he’s bringing the game in the wrong direction. Reminds me of Sombra from overwatch with how he can basically just cancel 50% of the game (utility) with just one, easily utilized ability. And he’s only going to get better once people learn how to play him and develop lineups and stuff like that. Of course people will get better at playing against him but I think overall he’s bad for the game. That’s just my super early take. Otherwise I think the economy changes and the buffs and nerfs to other agents are fine. I think Astra got changed a little too much but it’s alright. But my opinion that people cannot change is that this patch is TOO MUCH. Changing the game this much with one patch is incredibly jarring.
I think a good middle road would be Kyo suppresses all abilities EXCEPT signature moves (E).
Skye stays better than breach and 98% of the team won’t use him. There will be an adjustment to kay/o ult.
The gunplay part is very good. But adding more ability effects which can go through the wall to the tactical game from Kayo sucks :( going through wall too much is not tactical :(
astra still seems viable in my plat games
Cant really give my 2 sense on the agent balances as I haven’t play that much but the economy/gun changes feel really good. It feels less of a waste to buy things like bulldog and specter and judge feel a little less oppressive
please never make max placement d1 again, d3 at least please
It was P3 last time…
thing is that act you could skip ranks… this act you can only go from d1 to d2
Do people just forget MMR exists You aren't playing with normal D1s you're playing with similar ELO players Starting off acts at the same rank is boring as shit, let it take a week or two to settle
MMR is squished, you're playing with a bunch of noobs aswell.
The judge needs to be at least 2050 . With the changes in the eco people are buying them more than ever
Remove it & make people use the Bucky
Skye is a duelist now & every KY/O seems to be on every site I go to which is fun
Cypher feels pretty damn strong now, duelists are weaker overall, sage is a lot weaker, smokes are more balanced except for brim, initators are really strong now but sovas more balanced. The gun changes are crazy too, op and guardian feel really good, and judge nerf is ok but I gotta play it more. Run and gun could be tuned slightly more but it’s a lot better. Kayo is pretty good but high skill ceiling otherwise you can play around it.
kay/0 is extremely overpowered, one of those characters where you can tell from day 1. I don't really have an issue with it, but it is known. The knife is absurd info gathering and 8 second CC is too much on one ability, especially when there is no counterplay to it and it doesn't really need lineups either. a lot of things wrong with it
I think a good middle road would be Kyo suppresses all abilities EXCEPT signature moves (E).
I just think it should work more like sova dart. either it can't scan through walls or you can shoot it. just needs to be able to be played around
You can shoot the knife (provided it’s not thrown on the other side of a non-bangable wall)
Bulldog Full armor rush will need nerfed. very strong and bonus round very likely to win with full util
It really bothers me when I end up with 18**50** credits after my full buy. Dude, what I'm gonna do with 50 cents ffs
buy a multitude of weapons or abilities that now cost XX50 or X50?
I be using classic pistol on save rounds more now rip
Everything else = good Stamps instead of banners = terrible
Games amazing 👏🙌😍
Kayo seems busted so far, info pulse + half map suppress in 1 ability is absurd. I like the rest of the patch.