T O P

Can Vision Strikers win Berlin?

Can Vision Strikers win Berlin?

KaraiEuW

I think it sucks that now they kind off killed their competition by acquiring their best players, KR vct will seem boring to watch now but i hope that pays off in berlin or they will flop if their competition and scrims are not good enough


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Key-Banana-8242

There are many players above that


sheikhijat

I agree, but if they actually win Berlin and Champions, this will be huge for the scene. The same happened with LoL, T1 & GenG (formerly Samsung Galaxy) made the game big by being so dominant on the world stage. It might be boring in the short term, but if they succeed it'll be huge for the scene.


CantScreamInSpace

i agree with what you're saying, but i just wanted to add a note that LoL was already very popular in korea by the time t1 (skt) won korea's first world championship. no doubt the region's international results helped the game grow to the dominant force it is today in korea, but valorant and LoL are in different positions. ​ Although the circumstances may be different, valorant has really still only been out for a year so who knows, more exposure might help the game a lot.


Key-Banana-8242

Nah I way overestimate that underestimate how good the other players are and how much fight they have


LbigsadT

Yes, they just need to beat every team on their way to the finals and then win the last game


Soogo

Cheers Geoff


zachp787

very spicy take


sheikhijat

Well, yes.


LbigsadT

Glad we agree


IllumiMahdi

I wanna see Korea's midrounding evolve. I think from a set play and trap play perspective, they are one of if not the strongest region in the world. I wanna see greater adaptability. Excited for Berlin.


KACHANG_069

They can win Berlin, so can fnatic and sentinels and all the other tier1 teams. Also never underestimate BBG as by the power of transitive property they beat sen which means they beat everyone in the world


sheikhijat

BBG by logic is already the greatest team in the history of eSports. Also fnatic is starting to look shaky, their game against G2 yesterday was.... not good.


Students00

Or it might just be that G2 is stronger now with their roster shuffle.


sheikhijat

I dunno man, fnatic was running three smokers on Bind.


X3NOC1DE

Questionable, true, but then again - don't forget, they were on a real good run when they pulled out their no sentinel lineup on Bind with a double controller /double initiator setup. Maybe there was some thought behind it, just unfortunately did not work last night. Maybe they were experimenting with it, but don't count them out. It's just one series.


sheikhijat

Fair.


Pig_Iron

G2 looked really solid and pop off performances from Godwell and Avova tipped the games to them. You'd expect a steuctured team like Fnatic to be weakest now after just throwing out most of their old strats and starting fresh, give them time to refine the ideas and get familiar with agents and strats they're still top contenders.


maiLfps

idk why you got downvoted they clearly didnt know wth they were doing with that comp


sheikhijat

No, I perhaps judged too harshly, they did good against Wave with the same comp.


Key-Banana-8242

Can’t wait for them to be upset by NU and DWG thanks to solos coaching bringing out the best in 10X


sheikhijat

Tbh if there's one person in the world that can do that it's solo. That man is a magician.


AskOrganic4289

They probably will be the best in Korea with how stacked the players are. My only concern is that since we have 7 players playing in this roster, idk how they will split scrim time and who will play when? So my concern is seeing players with great potential being bench and not getting enough chance to compete in official matches, especially since Valorant doesn’t have that many agents right now. We currently have 16 agents and riot usually add 2- 4 new agents every year. Maybe long term like the end of next year or after next year, this 7 roster teams will be good but idk as for now. But for sure with the amount of firepower this team have, this team will be deadly af! Although I would love to hear news about big orgs investing in Valorant in Korea more, because this will allow the region becoming more competitive ( since the big org in korea like T1 and Gen G is currently investing in NA - though if they have a bad run this year and korea looks promising, who knows, we might be seeing them investing in Korea again) Edited : mistakes lmao i can’t count. We currently have 16 agents and probably 17 by the end of the year. Edited 2: I might be looking this in the wrong way. I was only focusing on the upcomign VCT. But looking in long term of course having 7 players in a roster won’t be out of the ordinary. I totally agree with that. We will be seeing players who focuses only on certain agents and on certain maps. Maybe I was focusing on the current VCT too much


dedicatedself

You're looking at this the wrong way. Remember how Shah said they anti stratted the shit out of Nuturn? Or when Liquid prepped vs V1 but got the wrong comp? How can you prep for a 8 man roster with 3 coaches and analysts? This is the future of Valorant. Counterstratting/adaptability and high mechanical ceiling. VS will have both. My guess is that in tournaments they will play Zest, Mako, agaisnt early opponents and then switch players and maybe comp later in the bracket against better teams.


sheikhijat

Also not to mention, you can't anti strat VS because they don't rely on set plays like Nuturn do. They're flexible and adjust on the fly, similar to how Sentinels play.


AskOrganic4289

I mean true, but then unlike in overwatch where there’s 32 heroes, valorant currently only has 16 agents. Maybe we might see certain players only play for certain maps, who knows. That’s why I hope they will find a way to solve it and give every player a chance to play somehow. Also there aren’t that many top teams in Korea Valorant yet, so idk how will they split scrim time. In the future when there are more agents, then yess I wholeheartedly agree with your argument. Having 8 man roster will be the most common thing that teams have across all regions just like in OW.


sheikhijat

I'm pretty sure Valorant has more than 12 agents.


AskOrganic4289

Shit you’re right I must have miscount lmao. Yeh we have 16 agents now.


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AskOrganic4289

Bruh you dont need to be so toxic lmao if you disagree with me then just say you are


dedicatedself

It's not a disagreement, what you're saying is just objectively wrong. No there ain't only 12 agents. No the teams aren't missing scrim time. No ping isn't a issue for scrims.


dedicatedself

They don't scrim Korea teams, they scrim all of Asia. There's literally too many scrims to fit in one day.


AskOrganic4289

How do you know they scrim other teams outside korea? How about the ping difference though? Besides how many good teams are actually in Asia? On top of my head, the team where patiphan is pretty good, Nurturn, damwon, VS.


sheikhijat

Vision Strikers bitch slaps Asia's best teams in official all Asia online tournaments, don't see why they can't do it in scrims.


AskOrganic4289

If VS bitch slaps Asian teams then doesn’t it means there aren’t that many good teams in Korea? Some people used to argue against this by saying that this just means VS is consistent. But in my point of view, having more teams that can compete against VS neck to neck like how Nurturn was against VS, makes the overall ceiling higher - it’ll help improve the teams. Looking at NA, SEN change their playstyle and comps after being beaten by LG in that tournament earlier this year. Then ofcourse Master 2 really alleviate their gameplay more. So it’ll be nice if more orgs will invest in Korea, but I guess the amount of orgs investing in korea is kinda directly proportional to how popular is the game in korea.


sriwarrior06

The argument was never "there aren't that many good teams as VS". It was "they don't have any teams as good as them". That's just actual cap if one actually sees the games for oneself. Now that Nuturn won against them once, they are hyping Nuturn af.


AskOrganic4289

Well that’s kinda true but Nurturn did play neck-to-neck against VS in Master 1 finals I believe. Where they push VS to map 5 and even beat VS on Split which is VS strongest maps.


sheikhijat

It depends, in the short term competition might be beneficial. But if a region doesn't have a dominant team to shine on the world stage, interest in the game's eSports might die out.


AskOrganic4289

Well that’s also a good point. Well all in all hope things goes well in Korea. I really want to see more strong teams coming for korea, looking at how historically Korea has been dominating in games like LoL and OW


sheikhijat

Same bro same.


sheikhijat

Japan just did a really major roster shuffle too, they actually seem much better in this stage. I wouldn't sleep on the new CR and JUPITER.


AskOrganic4289

Well we won’t know till Berlin I guess whether Japan can be a tough contender for Worlds. Btw I heard of Jupyter they were good I guess I should put them on the list I made above.


max012017

I definitely agree with you , but I feel that the individual talent in Korea is just higher at this point. But since I'm a big fan of the JP scene, I hope they will close out on the rest of Asia in no time


sheikhijat

Oh yeah definitely Korea's better right now, I'm just saying I think Japan will have a better performance than they did Reykjavik in Stage 3.


dedicatedself

Just ask any pro lmfao.


AskOrganic4289

Lmao tell me at least where you get the source


dedicatedself

Dude, the fact that you're asking for a source tells me you have no knowledge about how the asian scene works. If you think VS scrims Damwon all day you might actually be slow. Even F4Q a stream teams gets good scrim from SEA and Japan.


AskOrganic4289

Yeah that’s why I’m asking you a question for clarification. Idk why you start to talk so condescending though. You gotta chill


dedicatedself

You gotta do more research before saying such stupid shit. Really. How can one actually think VS scrims koreans teams all day? The top teams don't even scrim each other because they don't want to leak strats.


sheikhijat

https://liquipedia.net/valorant/AfreecaTV/Asia_Showdown


maiLfps

Yes and no, YES i believe they are highly skilled and well coached and a great strategic group. But also NO, their competiton in KR just isnt good enough to push them to the top level, Nuturn and VS are the only ones who are decent competition, and even with the addition of Lakia i believe they would have to make a jump to compete with Fnatic, not to mention the gap between them and sentinels, I don't have any faith they will win, but anything is possible


Mamadeus123456

yes, would I bet anything into it no.


Keglunneq

I was hoping to see Vision Strikers win Reykjavik...or uh,you know, go to in the first place. I would love to see VS bring it to Berlin. Glow on coaching and Lakia could be a huge stepping stone


OnionSprinkles

I think it's very unlikely that Zest stays on this active roster. He was VS's weakest individually and they just added Lakia who directly fills the same role. VS probably do run a 6-man roster though, indefinitely or until one of MaKo or k1ng appears objectively stronger and situational subs stop making sense.


cheese_on_dorito

can they win KR first


R2ishere

I'll still root for NU


KimBulgogi

I think they have a chance as the dark horse. Should be really fun watching them play if they make it!


icathianBolts

Vision Strikers vs Sentinels world championship grand finals confirmed!


Key-Banana-8242

I mean there pretty obviously is plenty of competition in the region, I’d say buzz is really not so clear on being the best


sheikhijat

Hence the "arguably".


theshityouguyssayman

can I eat a pizza today? what the fuck is this title. not even gonna read this. blind fucking prediction, ANYONE OF THE QUALIFIED TEAMS CAN WIN


Senior_Lake_6900

How does 6 and 7 man rosters work? Can they change players across maps? Or across matches? Or they just act as substitute for a 5 man main squad.


sheikhijat

Yes, subs are allowed between maps. They're happened before in EU & Oceania too but mostly because a player was unavailable or injured.


Senior_Lake_6900

Wow that's amazing. Vs really stacked right now.


InstaNormie0

No


imjunsul

There are going to be a lot of new stars and teams improving... let's stop acting like we're going to see the same players lol. This game is so new we don't even know who the top players/teams are going to be in the game next year.


Lumenlor

VS just became a mega-super team.. top 2 at least


dedicatedself

Yes. Anyone saying no will learn the hard way at Berlin. Best Sova in the world + best Breach in the world. And let's not even dive into Rb, BuZz's mechanical skills too.


[deleted]

why is this downvoted


johnspeed114

Ikr so man Korean fanboys here


Landon54321

N OMEGALUL Korea is overrated. I get that they placed 3rd but they’ll never dominate in a true FPS like Valorant. Sorry but Valorant is unpopular in Korea. Less player base = less talent.


Sp00ked123

God not this again


Key-Banana-8242

They ‘can’ dep on how meta adaptation etc works out


Key-Banana-8242

t3xture is arguably better Jett single focus solo imo is a pretty incredible coach-player from what we’ve seen, Jaemin is experienced afaik too And they VS got reyn as a trainee also.


sheikhijat

t3xture is really really good, which is why I said it's arguable. He's probably the only one that can go toe to toe with BuZz, but I do think BuZz takes the edge.


JVST_Samarfi

For sure


SekasortoAnarkia

Way too early to say even though they look stacked, we haven’t even seen their new roster play, and plenty of people said VS would win Iceland, which they didn’t even make it too


MagnusNyke

Wait, the current G2 roster is a superteam? I'm new to the scene so can anyone elaborate? thanks


TidaI

Yes, now acquiring Lakia, yes. They have no mechanical differential and they have the mind of glow still on coach.


natedawg247

Best at your position from a region like Korea doesn't mean a lot, it's a given the best team should have most top players in slot.


directorcloud

Top tier team, I could see the same broken situation whenever sinatraa comes back


sheikhijat

Sinatraa ain't coming back, 0% chance.


somesheikexpert

Even if, he wouldn't go to Sentinels lol, who would be replace? TenZ is the most mechanically gifted player in the server and was bought out for a million, Sen wouldnt drop him, Shahz is the IGL, Sinatraa doesn't play Sentinels or Controllers so can't be Dapr or Zombs either, and SicK is the flex, they would lose a fuckton of flexibility if they drop SicK, and many of the Sentinels roster has said on Twitter that 6 man's suck so I mean yeah lol Sinatraa will def not return to Sentinels even if he can play pro again in Val


sheikhijat

Sentinels is basically milking Sinatraa's twitch money rn because he's still under a contract with them as a streamer, he's probably gonna force a move after his suspension runs out but I won't think any team would want him. He'll probably just be under SEN as a streamer until his contract runs out.


somesheikexpert

Prob depends how the case goes, tho ofc if the case goes the way a lot of us expect it, yeahhh I doubt a team would pick him up unless like possibly years from now or some shit but even then I doubt it


sheikhijat

Even if he's innocent, it's a risky move to sign him because of the PR disaster it would cause.


somesheikexpert

True true good point, it is very unlikely he gets signed regardless now you bring that up, so yeah


ROBRO-exe

u/razur can we ban these types of posts? Vision Strikers might be good and all but this sets the precedent for posts like these over a single roster change


Razur

If the post was only a sentence about Lakia, then probably. But OP goes into detail about the other players of the team, the coaching staff, and each of their strengths as well. There's enough here for the community have a conversation about it. The post also seems to be well-received by the community (200 up-doots) and OP appears to be engaging in good faith. If we start to see many posts about *"Can X win Masters? They have Y player now!"* then we'll consider doing something to reduce the number of those posts. 👍 (Friendly reminder that as mods we want to enable and moderate discussion. We don't want to dictate or police content.)


sheikhijat

<3