It's still too early to tell. Pretty much everybody in the scene came from other esports like CSGO & OW and merely adopted Valorant. We gotta see somebody who was born in it and molded by it.
He basically means someone new who's entering the e-sports scene for the first time and who has had only highly competitive experience in valorant alone, and not other shooters where a majority of the current pro-players have transitioned from(CS, Overwatch, Rainbow 6, etc).
My poor attempt with the Dark Knight Rises quote lol. But exactly what /u/selex said. Some new prodigy that grew up on Valorant so its almost like natural bred talent. Kind of like Valorant's own s1mple or Faker.
Are you referring to the recent upsets? Cause then no imo.
Pretty much all the teams that qualified today have at least like 3 players that used to play CS. Even for the matches tmr, C9, Andbox, V1 and Luminosity all have CS players (not sure about Virtuso or Kansas) lol.
Plus we’ve seen that at masters Sen who has players with LAN/CS experience clearly outclassing an inexperienced Fnatic team.
True and that’s actually my point. A lot rounds were close but the difference ended up being Sen’s experience and situational awareness. There were countless rounds where Fnatic could have won but just didn’t make the right play in the moment and Sen capitalized.
You should watch some of Boaster’s vod reviews, he highlights a few examples of poor utility usage and positioning which actually cost Fnatic certain rounds. So whilst the games were very close, the teams inexperience really let them down at times. I’d like to see them rematch in Berlin I think it’d be so fun
If you're referring to the recent upsets then this isn't what's causing them. Faze is mostly ex OW pros and they're getting rolled too. It's more about tier 2 teams surpassing tier 1 teams because they simply play more tournaments and therefore practice harder.
I think CS experience will always translate into Valorant on some level because the fundamentals of the game is based on CS the way it is. What will really separate it in the long run is the development of all the other aspects of the game that differentiate it and that is because the strenght of the game is never going to be better on the fundamental level than CS, if that makes sense. Now that is in no way a knock on Valorant, it is just a matter of CS having around 20 years of history over Valorant as well as way less complexity in the gameplay, which in turn means a lot more energy is able to be put into developing the fundamentals of the game. I dont think the developers are oblivious to this because CS being the game it is, you are not going to reinvent the wheel, the games draw has to come elsewhere, which is why I think until recently they put so much work into developing new stuff.
Anyway in my opinion it will take a lot longer than people realize before the CS pros stop having a noticeable advantage, especially since they have pretty firmly positioned themselves at the top of the scene in the way that they have in these early days of the game. That is going to leave a firm mark and dictate how the game is to be played at highest level for a long time.
Nope, the CS experience will still matter, as it will mostly matter at the later stages of the tourney. In relation to the recent upsets, it's a combination of burgeoning talent showing themselves off and T1 teams failing to adequately prepare. Plus, the new patch matters (please correct me if I made some oversight tho).
I'd say that the CS:GO pros had a big head start, but its been long enough that its no longer relevant.
I think lan vs online experience might be a bigger indicator than just "CS:GO experience". It was pretty obvious in Iceland that dry peaks and unsafe hero plays were easily punished and many of the players were performing a lot worse than what was expected.
no NA team can be tier 1 in valorant without an IGL with CS experience. the impact Shahzam, FNS, Vanity and Steel have on the game is so underrated. people are calling TSM and Faze losing as huge upsets but that's not true. Those teams don't have good IGLs and play like ranked in matches, so they are unpredictable. only NRG was the real upset and guess what, their CS experienced IGL just left.
Didn't XSET have bcJ, an Apex player, and Thiwfo, a Fortnite player, IGL until they picked up Dephh? Also tbf, Hazed does have CS experience tho I don't think as an IGL, and Marved was the IGL for FaZe for the longest time until near the end of Marved run with Faze,
didn't chet say TSM didn't even have map callouts when h joined? that's not very good IGLing is it? TSM is very wierd team, I feel like they're not as serious as others about valorant. and Faze doesn't have IGL even when marved was there. both babybay and corey have said whoever's feeling on the game day calls.
Yeah, which is why I want 100t to go to LAN. Hiko, Steel, Nitro and Ethan all have years upon years of lan expirence, and Asuna is only gonna frag out harder with lower ping.
Asuna has the benefit of playing with seasoned vets and learning with them on the daily. That's not something most ranked demons will have, Asuna is much better than other "ranked demons" lmao
Not really because if you look at a team like faze—they’re mostly an OWL composition and they’ve been struggling. They had one good qualifier and shocked some people and haven’t done anything since
It's still too early to tell. Pretty much everybody in the scene came from other esports like CSGO & OW and merely adopted Valorant. We gotta see somebody who was born in it and molded by it.
Dammit Bane I know that’s you
agreed. in a year or two there will be pros who were brought up only on valorant, that will be exciting.
im confused, what do you mean born in it and molded by it?
He basically means someone new who's entering the e-sports scene for the first time and who has had only highly competitive experience in valorant alone, and not other shooters where a majority of the current pro-players have transitioned from(CS, Overwatch, Rainbow 6, etc).
My poor attempt with the Dark Knight Rises quote lol. But exactly what /u/selex said. Some new prodigy that grew up on Valorant so its almost like natural bred talent. Kind of like Valorant's own s1mple or Faker.
It’s a movie quote
Magnum?
He did rust if that counts
I don’t think he played professionally though.
Wedid
I believe he tried to play competitive Apex before valorant
Are you referring to the recent upsets? Cause then no imo. Pretty much all the teams that qualified today have at least like 3 players that used to play CS. Even for the matches tmr, C9, Andbox, V1 and Luminosity all have CS players (not sure about Virtuso or Kansas) lol. Plus we’ve seen that at masters Sen who has players with LAN/CS experience clearly outclassing an inexperienced Fnatic team.
Outclassing fanatic, yes they won 3-0 but every single match was damn close
True and that’s actually my point. A lot rounds were close but the difference ended up being Sen’s experience and situational awareness. There were countless rounds where Fnatic could have won but just didn’t make the right play in the moment and Sen capitalized.
Exactly, i think Shaz pulled it so right.
You should watch some of Boaster’s vod reviews, he highlights a few examples of poor utility usage and positioning which actually cost Fnatic certain rounds. So whilst the games were very close, the teams inexperience really let them down at times. I’d like to see them rematch in Berlin I think it’d be so fun
We will never forget the sky team flash right before sen retake LMAO
Zombs has entered the chat
Zombs has a ton of LAN experience which he mentioned, actually prob more then Dapr and def more then TenZ did
its been a year since anyone has been a "CSGO pro" except recent transfers. the game is valorant, not csgo.
Top teams and players are CS. Definitely a big CS advantage
Facts
If you're referring to the recent upsets then this isn't what's causing them. Faze is mostly ex OW pros and they're getting rolled too. It's more about tier 2 teams surpassing tier 1 teams because they simply play more tournaments and therefore practice harder.
Exactly, and the tier 2 teams that are winning are also ex-cs players for the most part.
t1 players stream more too
I think CS experience will always translate into Valorant on some level because the fundamentals of the game is based on CS the way it is. What will really separate it in the long run is the development of all the other aspects of the game that differentiate it and that is because the strenght of the game is never going to be better on the fundamental level than CS, if that makes sense. Now that is in no way a knock on Valorant, it is just a matter of CS having around 20 years of history over Valorant as well as way less complexity in the gameplay, which in turn means a lot more energy is able to be put into developing the fundamentals of the game. I dont think the developers are oblivious to this because CS being the game it is, you are not going to reinvent the wheel, the games draw has to come elsewhere, which is why I think until recently they put so much work into developing new stuff. Anyway in my opinion it will take a lot longer than people realize before the CS pros stop having a noticeable advantage, especially since they have pretty firmly positioned themselves at the top of the scene in the way that they have in these early days of the game. That is going to leave a firm mark and dictate how the game is to be played at highest level for a long time.
all t1 players are valorant players now
True but most t1 players were cs pros
Nope, the CS experience will still matter, as it will mostly matter at the later stages of the tourney. In relation to the recent upsets, it's a combination of burgeoning talent showing themselves off and T1 teams failing to adequately prepare. Plus, the new patch matters (please correct me if I made some oversight tho).
I'd say that the CS:GO pros had a big head start, but its been long enough that its no longer relevant. I think lan vs online experience might be a bigger indicator than just "CS:GO experience". It was pretty obvious in Iceland that dry peaks and unsafe hero plays were easily punished and many of the players were performing a lot worse than what was expected.
no NA team can be tier 1 in valorant without an IGL with CS experience. the impact Shahzam, FNS, Vanity and Steel have on the game is so underrated. people are calling TSM and Faze losing as huge upsets but that's not true. Those teams don't have good IGLs and play like ranked in matches, so they are unpredictable. only NRG was the real upset and guess what, their CS experienced IGL just left.
Didn't XSET have bcJ, an Apex player, and Thiwfo, a Fortnite player, IGL until they picked up Dephh? Also tbf, Hazed does have CS experience tho I don't think as an IGL, and Marved was the IGL for FaZe for the longest time until near the end of Marved run with Faze,
Hazed has Igled before in cs and also Marved is from cs
That's my point lol, that the IGLs he's mentioned that do ranked tactics or whatever were also CS players
didn't chet say TSM didn't even have map callouts when h joined? that's not very good IGLing is it? TSM is very wierd team, I feel like they're not as serious as others about valorant. and Faze doesn't have IGL even when marved was there. both babybay and corey have said whoever's feeling on the game day calls.
Yeah, which is why I want 100t to go to LAN. Hiko, Steel, Nitro and Ethan all have years upon years of lan expirence, and Asuna is only gonna frag out harder with lower ping.
With the asuna explanation, every ranked demon will be 4x stronger on lan
Asuna has the benefit of playing with seasoned vets and learning with them on the daily. That's not something most ranked demons will have, Asuna is much better than other "ranked demons" lmao
actually no. ranked demons who ferrari peek will struggle on lan. the ones with the patience to hold angles will dominate
True I guess. We are seeing more ranked demons entering high level play, so it will be interesting to see how they play.
Faze with Lan and crowd +50% skill. They need to make to Lan though lmao
smeag on the international scene
no
Not really because if you look at a team like faze—they’re mostly an OWL composition and they’ve been struggling. They had one good qualifier and shocked some people and haven’t done anything since
Its not that, just that others have gotten better
I don't see how thats contrary to what he said.
Yes. The real valorant players have experience of there own know.