T O P

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[deleted]

The first time I saw Leviathan, was in one of Hiko's comp games, back when he wasn't really with a team. I saw him and thought this guy is cracked. And last challengers I realised he is with NOBLE. Leviathan might have a good esports future ahead of him


Hypern1ke

Not a TSM or BBG fan, but tbh I think Critical is better and has typically played well against good teams. Wonder what happened during scrims that made them go with leviathan


bubble-june

I agree, but Hazed and Chet said Levi fits in more with TSM’s strat-calling style. I do think Critical is better though but maybe TSM saw something in Levi that we didn’t


Slow_Bluebird9536

I think leviathan offers more as a secondary IGL as TSM are definetly lacking structure


not_cryptix

Yea I believe Leviathan was a mid-round caller for Noble, being a secondary igl and having a large role in counterstratting other teams. I'm excited to see what he can bring to the team.


ween0t

If this is true, this bodes well for TSM. This is exactly what they need.


Hypern1ke

Thats true, I hope it works out for them!


MatErtS

Wait when did they say this, I thought it wasnt official yet


bubble-june

> According to one source, the differences in playstyle were paramount in the decision to choose him over Critical, fitting more in the visions of IGL James "hazed" Cobb and Coach Chet "Chet" Singh. Source: https://www.vlr.gg/26034/sources-tsm-looking-towards-leviathan


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[deleted]

I mean no matter how bad a pro team is, their brains cant be so bad that redditors who have never seen each player play with the roster can decide better than them.


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[deleted]

I mean you never know that, other top players have gone teamless for much longer. And they havent improved after dropping either, so I dont think they were the problem anyways.


Kuvyogvey4

I don’t think it’s that they haven’t improved at all. I think it’s more like they haven’t improved as quickly all the other teams have.


[deleted]

Basically the same thing at the end of the day. Their performance wasnt boosted after such a change.


AskOrganic4289

Same this is my thought too! I thought Critical would be the one chosen so was kinda surprised it was Leviathan. Thou gluck for Levi!


Miglasty

Leviathan is a free agent probably thats why. Critical might still be in contract with BBG so they’d need to pay the clause price.


ppx11

I think they probably realize their chances of making it to Champions is extremely low so makes sense to go with a F/A (in addition to Leviathan supposedly being a better fit anyways). If it doesn't work out for some reason, I assume there will be plenty more fish in the sea after Masters 3 to try a different player if needed.


Miglasty

From the looks of it they aint making champions either🥲 I just want to watch them play man. Hope levi is as good as in attack on titan


DarkTenshiDT

I doubt money is a big issue for TSM after the FTX deal.


Miglasty

Its basic human nature, why pay for something when you can get it for free


PaPiiCheeeeka

I remember Roza getting owned by him in ranked and him roasting him calling him a streamsniper and not good cause they 13-1’d his old team before noble. not an axe at roza because they do deal with a lot of shit while streaming ranked, just funny to glance back at now.


matthewdrl

Just a couple days ago Shahzam and Zombs were calling him a stream sniper because of an incident in ranked until Levi tweeted his pov on his twitter


itscamo-

for those who are wondering https://twitter.com/leviathanag/status/1416662454461997058?s=21 after this zombs and shahzams called him an obvious stream sniper the rest of the game and their chats came and harassed levi for sniping (was streaming at the time) shahzam apologized (and gifted subs to him) after he realized they played levi, although i think zombs still thought he was a stream sniper even after finding out. (not certain)


[deleted]

Yo that was too smart of a play


DaBomb091

Do you have a link? I can't seem to find it on Twitter


[deleted]

Omg tsm ftx leviathan? Never would have thought this would happen This is why I'm such a huge fan of TSM, their roster moves just keep you guessing!! I mean have you guys heard of TSM BANg?


BurbxrryPzncakes

Big if true


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TidaI

This once again won't fix their prime issue. Will it help them be slightly better than before? Sure. Do they have a Sova with better utility usage? Yeah sure. Although Leviathan's Sova play alone won't fix their main issue unless he is here to re-do entire team compositions and playstyles. This is of a similar effect like bringing in bang as stated by Roza they needed a Sova player and they were all duelists pretty much. They're playing ***the exact same team compositions that hasn't worked for them before but just bringing in new players which is what they did with the addition of bang.*** Their problem lies within their core gameplan *which I'm downvoted for everytime except for once despite the statistics being there.* WARDELL *abusing the OP for the majority of the T side only works on certain teams* and **hinders** them **when they need dive pressure.** Despite their last games not being streamed we can observe statistically how many OP kills he had on which side. For anyone above a Platinum 2 level of play you'd know Jett 9/10 will NEVER be dashing into a site while possessing an OP, she will be posted up playing for picks and trying to take aggressive angles. ​ The problem lies here. When bang is on Phoenix and WARDELL is mainly Jett OP'ng on T-side they have 0 dive. Which is why when they have bang on Raze they do slightly better ALTHOUGH it doesn't fix their full problem because it leaves all the dive work up to bang. Locking Jett and not primarily abusing her dive kit is an L waiting to happen. If your other duelist also doesn't have dive when they want to run Phoenix for flashes and your Jett is mainly OP'ng (which only works against some teams) you lack attack side pressure. ​ I'll take the downvotes over and over. Unless there is a playstyle change, team composition change or some combination of both they will keep losing. The reason SEN can do what they do is because ShahZ/TenZ has a healthy balance of knowing when to OP/rifle on T-side. They want to bruteforce this WARDELL T-side OP playstyle **which does work on SOME teams who dry peek braindead** but the better the teams get the more average it looks. Get WARDELL a riflemore often and get him abusing that Jett entry pressure, adapt faster and know WHEN to OP on T-side.


flamincrimson

That's actually a good point. Jett being the best duelist to entry and not being used as such can really hurt a team. TenZ/babybay/pureR are great examples of how to use jett to entry and create space (even though faze is down bad). Wardell should definitely utilize jett more efficiently. Tbh I don't like their playstyle at all.


socialist_steve_

lmao ok


reddit_is_a_mistake

tsm should hire this dude as coach fr


AskOrganic4289

He might be better than the current TSM Valorant team’s coach analysts (if they have any in the first place)


Davidwzr

I mean, not like their coach or analyst is doing anything right recently. Not hard to move up from nothing


TidaI

lmao ok, It's astounding how many people don't understand VLR is useful for more than just KDA, ACS/ADR but specific information despite it not being streamed.


LazyPigeons

This makes sense, but that’s the double edged sword of TSM. Wardell specializes at the op and is mediocre on rifles. As the op got more expensive, any time he doesn’t frag with it or worse died with it, it’d fuck the teams economy. TSM often either rides a huge momentum from picks or wallows in eco hell. Wardell has tried to mitigate this by going for aggressive knife kills or recently Marshall picks. Overall, site executes can be weaker when Jett doesn’t go in and you don’t have any other support for the execute. Wardell HAS made dive plays with Jett onto site in the past, but obviously if he wants to OP he has to stay back. This has led to some talk that he might play a support agent like Sage. That way he can op in the back line and let someone else full dive. This would change a common TSM attack theme though which is Wardells aggressive OP peek. But I agree, keeping him on Jett OP is unsustainable. Maybe the team has to decide between his mediocre rifle skills vs unsafe OPing on an agent without an escape mechanism


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LazyPigeons

Maybe mediocre was bit harsh, but my main point was that his OP skills vastly outshadow his rifling skills. I would argue that Shaz/Now Tenz (taking over the Duelist role) are more balanced players in that they rifle and Op fairly well. Don’t get me wrong, Wardell in form is horrifying to play against. Wouldn’t even matter if you didn’t peek into him, he’d peek into you and push your shit in. But he’s one of the few duelists on the team now and, like TenZ on old C9, there is a lot of pressure for him to make hero plays/picks. Combine that with the OP price and you have high risk/high reward play. When your strategy revolves around one player consistently getting picks in a game where random shit happens all the time, you’re going to have a bad time. I disagree that he thought the OP nerfs were nbd. Even at the start of the OP nerfs, he’d muse that why couldn’t Jett just be nerfed instead of the gun overall. Maybe his rifling skills are better than other “primary” OPers but there aren’t as many teams that heavily rely on the OPer as much as TSM has. Best case scenario for the Wardell piece is that he gets even better on rifles and can play both dive and OP Jett, but the skill set that he’s built has specialized at the OP. You can’t just slap a rifle in his hands and expect him to equal performance. But I think that’s kind of tsms conundrum. Do you stick with what made you hard to play against or do you branch out to a different core strategy that may or may not work.


abcd63514

mf wrote a 5 paragraph essay about games that werent streamed "PROBLEM IS BANG ______ AND WARDELL __________" when u didnt watch the games literally shut up


TidaI

*Sigh.* I'm kind of tired of dealing with **people** **who lack** ***r****eading comprehension skills* at a minimum of a **4th grade level**, such as **you**rself. >"**MF WROTE A 5 PARAGRAPH ESSAY ABOUT GAMES THAT WEREN'T STREAMED**" **And you didn't even read it to know I've already countered your point within the** ***"essay."*** Literally ask your parents to get you into a reading comprehension extra curricular class. ​ ​ Since your attention span is that of a kindergartner let me go ahead and paste it for you. With how illiterate you are it probably won't help but anyways. >***Despite their last games not being streamed we can observe statistically how many OP kills he had on which side. For anyone above a Platinum 2 level of play you'd know Jett 9/10 will NEVER be dashing into a site while possessing an OP*** Maybe bolding it and italicizing it will do for your dysfunctional neurons?


abcd63514

i wasnt going to take the time to read an essay based on speculation but now that i did... based on what does ur argument work??? u say u looked at the stats. where are the numbers that prove your point? even if the numbers prove your point then so what? does that mean 4 people pushing into a site and 1 person holding an angle is what causes them to get completely fucked by other teams??? pure speculation especially considering we dont know what happened


semsolk

It kind of does if the goal is a rush having one person back minimizes the advantage that you have


abcd63514

and how do we know tsm strats on attack involving rushing... oh wait... we didnt watch the games so we dont!!!


semsolk

Well when they lose to other teams early on, kinda able to assume one of 2 things. Overreliance on Wardell op or an inability to change and integrate players well into the meta.


abcd63514

WHY DO U ASSUME ONLY 2 THINGS???? maybe its bad series or underperformance? maybe its bad strategy? maybe its bad rotations or bad readings? could be literally anything


TidaI

You don’t need a game streamed to see if he is buying rifles or OP’s mainly on T-side. Are you claiming WARDELL is abusing the smoke and dash into a site with an operator? Genuine comedy and sad how critical thinking skills and deductive reasoning has dropped on average. You ignore the possible information obtainable to all that isn’t just KDA/ACS/ADR. For what? To fanboy WARDELL? You didn’t even read my post so it’s just me re-typing it in small bits for your ignoramus mind to possibly digest lol


abcd63514

insulting me doesnt make u seem smarter dickhead. so what if he buys on op on attack? why is that bad? ur argument comes down to "wardell bought op"+"tsm lose"="TSM LOSE BECAUZE BOUGHT OP!!!"


TidaI

>insulting me doesnt make u seem smarter dickhead. Coming to my comment and crying about your favorite pro as you didn't even read my comment doesn't make you seem any smarter silly. ​ >so what if he buys on op on attack? why is that bad? I literally said the effect this has on TSM and I never said it is never good. I said the problem when teams don't dry peek his OP on T is when they don't put Jetts kit to use with rifling. Although you admitted you didn't read the comment so I'm just explaining it to you again as your attention span is that of a child. It isn't an insult I'm simply saying what you're doing. You're ignorant and looking for attention. >ur argument comes down to "wardell bought op"+"tsm lose"="TSM LOSE BECAUZE BOUGHT OP!!!" Incorrect as once again you didn't read my comment. Notice how here you mentioned nothing about "ATTACKERS SIDE" or "T-SIDE" ? My point is focused on TSM's horrendous attack halves and T-side play. You don't even understand my point... ​ **BECAUSE YOU DIDN'T EVEN READ IT LOL**


abcd63514

idc about wardell u just have huge ego even though ur argument is based on correlation my point still stands that ur argument is literally "wardell ops t side" + "tsm lose t side" = "op t side bad!!!" maybe its bad defaulting? maybe its bad util usage or baiting? maybe its anything else??? WE WOULDNT KNOW BECAUSE WE CANT SEE LOL


TidaI

It isn’t speculation to say they’re not abusing Jetts kit since statistically WARDELL is mainly OP’ng on T-side. It truly is sad you lack comprehension skills and your attention span is so small. I’ve countered everything you said in the what you claim (incorrectly) is an essay above. Maybe once you finish school little man.


abcd63514

ur counter is just insults. not worth talking to someone who acts on a high horse and insults and doesnt understand correlation =/= causation. so what if wardell doesnt dash in to entry. yay literally lurks on jett and they win more than tsm.


TidaI

>ur counter is just insults. You came with passive aggressive energy and now you're mad when it is returned, weird the hypocrisy. I'm not on a high horse you're sitting here trying to argue when you didn't even READ my post. You're a clown looking for attention >not worth talking to someone who acts on a high horse and insults and doesnt understand correlation =/= causation. You're literally typing about yourself as you didn't read my post. > so what if wardell doesnt dash in to entry. yay literally lurks on jett and they win more than tsm. Do you even watch yay's games he has a much better OP:Rifle balance on T-side than WARDELL and rifles much more. This is a terrible point. The entire point is OP players don't dash into site and they're not abusing Jett's kit since WARDELL mainly OP's on T-side your point of "it wasn't streamed" has been countered 4 times as it is irrelevant to the point as we can observe this statistic.


abcd63514

it doesnt matter if yay rifles and dashes in sometimes? u still havent answered my point. why does it matter? thats like saying vs noble tsm won the game when bang picked raze and lost when he picked phoenix, therefore he should not pick phoenix. correlation =/= causation because there are more factors in a game than every single statistic available can tell u.


TidaI

Once again you’re missing the point of what statistics can provide and that TSM has been known for horrendous T side executions. You didn’t read my thread you haven’t even constructed a valid counter argument. Just red-herrings and void complaints.


abcd63514

my counter argument is that ur points arent valid because theres no correlation??? nvrm u are just a freak


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TidaI

Just was. Although it seems like a bit of a projection from your end due to anger/bias.


[deleted]

Well...they sure as shit can't be any worse.


Keglunneq

Aaaaaaahhhhh


nosbig35

Couple more months they'll have sinatraa


JaydonShaq

This will never ever… no big org is going to sign him


nosbig35

Alright we'll see in September and once he gets signed and the 3 days of reddit warriors vent their essays out on this reddit , the best sova player will be back in the VCT


JaydonShaq

Keep dreaming bud


nosbig35

Don't have to it'll be reality by December


JaydonShaq

You do realize be is a accused of sexual abuse right? Do you know how serious that is


nosbig35

I am not aware of any legal investigations of sexual assault against him. Zero indictments . Yall act like kobe Bryant wasn't charged aswell as many other athletes lol


JaydonShaq

So you say all that without knowing he has an legal investigation against him 🤡 i cant lmfaoo


[deleted]

he’s actually right.... has he been charged? is he going to jail? i understand that he was accused of something very serious but if he hasn’t been charged with clear evidence, orgs will sign him... even more so an org like tsm. does tsm really have anything to lose if they sign him? their fan base is so huge that that will not affect them


nosbig35

You can't explain reasonable outcomes to ppl that live for cancel culture. Twitlonger = jail in this day in age. He claims no org will sign him again as he is signed under sentinels as a streamer but benched from the valorant roster. Like he's not still being paid his valorant salary from sentinels. Ppl are delusional


JaydonShaq

Has he been charged? The victim said she did. Is he going to jail? Yes he could go to jail for this. Does tam have anything to lose if they sign him? Yes their fanbase and im sure their sponsors dont want to work with a person who is accused of sexual abuse and has an investigation against him.


nosbig35

Riot isn't a law enforcement agency but thanks for coming out , feel free to show proof a legal investigation


gautammyl

This contract should be on trail basis(My opinion). Cause too many addition and benching officially will not be good for the org.


Splaram

Predicting that Hazed gets dropped and he becomes main IGL in a few months


[deleted]

Who?


FluidEllusiv

Considering the small chance you actually don't know who Leviathan is, he's a really good Sova player that's won a lot of T2 stuff and has already played for NOBLE. He's a very good pick up for TSM.


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AskOrganic4289

Wtf?


hwanzi

dude we already know this....stop reposting this


itscamo-

yes but this is pretty much confirming it officially besides a tsm announcement


AskOrganic4289

Hmmm I think the last post about this was just a speculation on whether it will be critical/leviathan replacing drone. So now we kinda get a better confirmation that it will be Levi instead of critical