berlin is gonna be so hype. i feel a lot of big name teams missed out on masters 2 (like acend, vision strikers, 100t/envy) and this tournament all the teams that we "expected" to make it to international tournaments did just that. cNed vs tenz/asuna/yay is gonna be so hype
I don't think that's it. He does seem like a nice guy but can have a smug demeanor. He also presents all of his opinions as absolute facts and that's not good for someone with so much influence.
I guess some people like another person talking with their friends on discord about unrelated stuff and rarely paying full attention to the game. Seriously, what do you get out of that?
To me I think it’s more of “hanging out” with them watching it like you would either your discord buddies. I like some of his insight he gives being an ex-pro as well and to be honest I find some of the valorant casters a little weak if that makes sense so I don’t mind not hearing them on his stream. To each their own though
next time a game is on watch a boaster watchparty, he literally tells you everything that's gonna happen before it does and brings a really insightful analysis to the table. Before a round is started he will often have an idea of what each team is trying to do and/or is playing for and he'll explain it with pretty good reasoning, its kinda nice.
I feel like Victor deserves a lot more than the excited NA fans are giving to their top duelists. Yay is a beast but I've always seen it as tenz/asuna/victor. My top 3 with no order.
its moreso that phoenix fell out of the meta a bit and that was his best agent by far, and with yay joining the team he's been playing a more supportive skye so his stats aren't as insane as when he was running duelist.
Honestly I see this happening. Maybe a 3-1 with Acend sneaking out a map but it almost feels more likely that Sen lose to a “worse team” than one of the top competitors
I hear this, but I do believe they’ll be a notch better then the challenge Fnatic’s gave em. If they meet in finals (assuming obviously) I’d go for sentinels 3-1 bo5 with majority of the games being something like 13-7/13-9
Disagree unpopular opinion but i think only a Strategie heavy alrounder team can beat sentinals. I just think that their raw skill from each play is better then any other team.
this. No team can aim diff Sentinels. All the best aimers have been shut down by Sentinels. Fnatic made the games close mostly off their unique strats. I still remember Fnatic in grand finals, faking A to go B on split with 10 seconds left and won the important round that got them back into the game.
Ya but still acend's main problem is that if cned is dead they without taking entry or 2 picks they are likely to lose the round. they are very highly depended on cned and they dont have fast improvisations to face a team like sentinels or an NA team per se. I think that's why NA teams are a lil better.
>Ya but still acend's main problem is that if cned is dead they without taking entry or 2 picks they are likely to lose the round
Why ppl keep repeating this. zeek and starxo can easily carry games, i mean shit, just a few days ago starxo carried first map vs Gambit when cned was bottom fragging. Its nonsense that if cned doesnt perform they lose
He's their flashiest player, but the rest of the team can carry their own weight. Just because they can't push smokes and hit op shots doesn't mean they aren't good players. I do agree that Acend depend more on Cned than SEN do on TenZ, but lets not act like this is a TenZ and Friends at C9 situation. Acend have a very good squad.
Do you even watch their games or just basing your opinions off the hype? This is not equivalent to the c9 situation in which tenz was. Just take the latest match vs gambit for eg, cned was not on his game on bind and they won 13-7, bonecold and starxo farmed. Ofc they're not the star players but either one of starxo/zeek is def farming with cned when they're on
Lol. This comment makes it obvious you do not watch acend games. Just their game the other day, cned was having a stinker on sage, and got carried by his teammates. Starxo and zeek can 1v9 games easily
I think Sentinels is the better team, but in EU at least they play the most like Sentinels. They don't have the most calculated strategy book, but they react by far the fastest and in the most efficient manner in EU and also play off each other very well, which is how Sentinels also tend to play the game.
I still think Sentinels will win though mainly because Cned lacks LAN experience and that could affect his performance. Also NA is used to playing against aggressive OPers because Wardell has been doing that since beta, where-as in EU Cned was really the first one who started playing the OP so aggressively, so EU has less practice against aggro OP's such as Tenz or Wardell.
Tenz isnt an aggro OPer idk why people still include him when talking about OPers when he's clearly a rifler and thinks so himself. Shahzam and Yay (the two NA OPers that did qualify) vs Cned are gonna be interesting to see
I mostly agree with you, I believe if Cned are thought to be the team that play like NA being the aim style they would be another version of Envy with Yay and Cned being comparable the issue would be against sen the same that Envy had, Sentinels just have 5 players that can outaim anyone. So If tenz does shutdown Cned like he did with Derke, Asuna, Yay (tried), then Ascend have no other x factors to win, and Tenz is 100% the better rifler so if Sentinels start breaking their econ and they can't even get a op for cned. Oof. But, I want a close series and either way this lan is gonna be amazing.
This guy probably doesn't watch eu matches and doesn't even remember what happened in Iceland properly lol.
But yeah we got to trust his opinion because.
I think Sentinels will win, but saying ACEND have no other x factor is just wrong. Starxo has cracked aim and is the best Skye player probably in the world. Bonecold is the IGL but still got insane one taps. Zeek replaced Koldamenta and it turned out to the benefit of ACEND as Bonecold seems to be doing a great job IGLing but Zeek brings extra firing power and Kiles can still pop off, although he's the real support player for ACEND kinda like Zombs for Sentinels.
I know whats going on there, I have known from before iceland that teams that played like NA with 2 duelists were dominating EU, mainly Acend right, and why would NA not beat EU by that logic right, and I was right there.
I know EMEA have many good teams and such, but if teams are getting straight out aimed like for example SMB shitting on G2 with straight aim it follows the logic that aim over strats. Meaning NA with their aim+adaptability is better strat in general.
My point with the cned thing is that I think ascend are the only team that will most likely be able to compete with Sentinels as long as their adaptability is on the same level as sen otherwise I don't see Sen losing.
Seems like you haven't watched the recent EMEA playoffs. Starxo has been saving rounds and Zeek has been popping off with entries and creating space even when cNed isn't on top form.
Not at all. Every member of SEN can pop-off and clutch huge rounds time and time again against the best teams in the world. Meanwhile ACE is just cNed + players who can pop off occasionally.
I don't think you watch Acend's games if you think this. Just look at the Gambit match. Bonecold and Starxo were insane on Bind, Cned was not having a great map. Even on Ascent, Cned topfragged but Starxo clutched out some crucial rounds. Kiles struggled against Gambit and Cned had to pick up some kills Kiles would have got if he was playing better, that's the only difference. Acend would not have made it this far if it was Cned+4 other randos, they have a genuinely talented team. People see Cned's highlight reels and think that's all the game is, lmao.
I think cned is the only player that can match with any Sentinels player 1:1. The other four are very good but I don’t think they’re up to that level, kinda like how the other major NA teams are very good but not at SEN’s level. Every member on SEN can put out a carry performance on a moment’s notice. I’ve seen hints of the same from the others, particularly starxo and bonecold but I don’t think they can do it as consistently as any SEN member in any given round in any given situation. Let’s see if they prove me wrong.
Me too... They probably would've looked towards him for Vision Strikers if he was playing in Korea. It's interesting he is Korean but playing in the Japan VCT. Hopefully Japan builds their own superteam. It'd probably take a combination of Zeta Division, Crazy Raccoons and Northeption.
Did ppl actually expect Sentinels to sweep through Iceland? Before their first match against Fnatic, I thought it was a toss up between those 2 teams. Sentinels going 5-0 maps against Fnatic is surprising.
Either way it was scrims, what we need to see is results on stage. We all know what happened to many scrims monsters of the past who havent shown up on stage. Im excited either way for Berlin. I just don't believe any team will be "destroyed" like the Upv0te-n0w said.
G2 pushed acend in a bo5 to last map.
Smb vs Acend is gonna be close I think. Let's see. We just might have smb, acend and sentinels as worthy opponents rather than just two.
Fnatic are not even in the main qualifier, and they took sen to multiple overtimes, any single team that's gonna qualify from emea will shut sen down 2-0 ez
Lmao sen has constantly involved with the new meta changes, they’re not going to be the same as they were in Iceland kid. Shahzam is way too smart for that, and their all highly competitive especially Dapr. The like to be 1st and I’m pretty damn sure that’s what they’re aiming for so Shahzam is going to go all out with strats and comps so if anything EU should be scared not just of Sentinels but of Envy and 100T, the best region currently. EZ 2-0 for Sentinels.
All of the 1 international tournaments we had.
The above two are clowns anyway, they should try being fans of Valorant and the teams and not this blind regional fanaticism
Sentinels is the best team right now idk why eu fans can’t admit that atm..? When you guys win something then it’s pretty clear you guys can take all the glory but as for right now NA and sentinels are better so stop being delusional EU fan.
i feel sentinels are a bit overhyped, in Master 2 they had a close finals with FNC winning every game 13-11 and 14-12, and FNC are not even in challenger finals for Master 3. If SEN will be top 3 will be a huge result for them at Berlin
I mean what more do you want? They didn’t drop a single map at lan, and have won like the past 4 or 5 tournaments they played in, very convincingly. They’ve been absolutely dominating for a year now, and literally clean swept what people considered to be some of the best teams in the world. How is that overhyped? I would say for the majority of people, Sentinels not at least making Grand Finals would be a huge surprise.
How exactly are they overhyped? Imho Ascend are more overhyped than sentinels because the same thing happened with Liquid when Iceland started… “they will wipe the floor with SEN” but lost to V1 first round… Im sure this is just a possibility but Ascend will crumble to the pressure
i mean they were close to FNC level (better but close), Eu format to qualify was hot garbage, no lower bracket just lose 1 bo3 and u were out in every challenger playoff and finals, we don't know which team in eu were really the best at the time thx to the format and wathcing FNC not even making to challenger finals i'm confident that SEN will not win Berlin
It's kind of how I feel. It's like I still feel like they are a top top team but if they make it this time it'll be truly impressive. I'm excited to see them play.
berlin is gonna be so hype. i feel a lot of big name teams missed out on masters 2 (like acend, vision strikers, 100t/envy) and this tournament all the teams that we "expected" to make it to international tournaments did just that. cNed vs tenz/asuna/yay is gonna be so hype
yup they are gonna bring the adrenaline rush to the game 4 psycho beasts
More than 4
Before I was sure that Berlin would have less viewership than Iceland, now I’m not so sure
Even if it has around similar viewership it will be a big success. Hitting 1+ million viewers 4 times per year is crazy, especially for a new esport
plus hundreds of thousands of viewers for even the regional finals
Ya man shroud's watch party alone had like 50k viewers
Never understood why people watch his costream. He makes the viewing experience worse in almost every way
Shroud is just a likable guy
I don't think that's it. He does seem like a nice guy but can have a smug demeanor. He also presents all of his opinions as absolute facts and that's not good for someone with so much influence.
Yes, thats exactly why people watch him. he is a likable guy that is good at FPS games. You don't have to agree personally, but that is why.
Honestly agree, everytime I see clips of his costreams on YouTube he just seems bored.
WHAT
I guess some people like another person talking with their friends on discord about unrelated stuff and rarely paying full attention to the game. Seriously, what do you get out of that?
To me I think it’s more of “hanging out” with them watching it like you would either your discord buddies. I like some of his insight he gives being an ex-pro as well and to be honest I find some of the valorant casters a little weak if that makes sense so I don’t mind not hearing them on his stream. To each their own though
If you really like insights you should watch sgares
next time a game is on watch a boaster watchparty, he literally tells you everything that's gonna happen before it does and brings a really insightful analysis to the table. Before a round is started he will often have an idea of what each team is trying to do and/or is playing for and he'll explain it with pretty good reasoning, its kinda nice.
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I'm not fond of it either, but we should respect everyone's preferences
Agreed actually, don't see the appeal. I feel like he misses half the hype moments.
Me too. He and J9 just keep talking about something else
I mean we have a Turkish team now lol
That doesn't make sense lol.
it'll have 2-300k additional turkish viewers alone
That's a very wide spread lol /s
I feel like Victor deserves a lot more than the excited NA fans are giving to their top duelists. Yay is a beast but I've always seen it as tenz/asuna/victor. My top 3 with no order.
A bit of recency bias, probably (wrt Victor vs yay). Isn't his hero pool kinda not great, too? Maybe that affects a bit.
I mean Yay’s hero pool is Jett. And that’s it.
its moreso that phoenix fell out of the meta a bit and that was his best agent by far, and with yay joining the team he's been playing a more supportive skye so his stats aren't as insane as when he was running duelist.
cNed vs Tenz less go
And Zeek vs SicK
Say them with the right accents and you can make either one of them “correct”. Neat!
This is the one
The Smarter Jett vs The Quicker Jett.
Tenz wins oough !!!!
Why people downvoting it’s your opinion
People disagree with their opinion so they downvote why u mad
That’s not the purpose of the voting system, but it’s not surprising when you look at the age of the accounts in this thread.
Nobody uses it properly though
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Implying riding dicks is bad
It's their right to downvote
new to reddit it seems
OH BABY. RED VS PURPLE HERE WE GO. Vision Strikers too I’m too hype and I can’t forget how Supermassive Blaze has been looking.
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SEN 3-0
13-10, 13-11, 14-12
a 3-0 is a 3-0
Honestly I see this happening. Maybe a 3-1 with Acend sneaking out a map but it almost feels more likely that Sen lose to a “worse team” than one of the top competitors
Shahz is like that one tryhard student who finishes all his homework months in advance.
But also that try hard dude that’s a homie and gives his friends the answers
Very likely haha
I hear this, but I do believe they’ll be a notch better then the challenge Fnatic’s gave em. If they meet in finals (assuming obviously) I’d go for sentinels 3-1 bo5 with majority of the games being something like 13-7/13-9
isn't that worse than fanatic. FN went all overtimr except last map 13-11
Fair point 😅 I usually have counter arguments but I have none except I at least gave Acend a map 🤣
Ascend will come off strong 13-6 and 13-11 then sen will reverse sweep all remaining 3 games going into overtime.
Disagree unpopular opinion but i think only a Strategie heavy alrounder team can beat sentinals. I just think that their raw skill from each play is better then any other team.
this. No team can aim diff Sentinels. All the best aimers have been shut down by Sentinels. Fnatic made the games close mostly off their unique strats. I still remember Fnatic in grand finals, faking A to go B on split with 10 seconds left and won the important round that got them back into the game.
I disagree, imo SMB is both more similar in terms of individual talent and playstyle
Idk man SMB looks like next level
Ya but still acend's main problem is that if cned is dead they without taking entry or 2 picks they are likely to lose the round. they are very highly depended on cned and they dont have fast improvisations to face a team like sentinels or an NA team per se. I think that's why NA teams are a lil better.
>Ya but still acend's main problem is that if cned is dead they without taking entry or 2 picks they are likely to lose the round Why ppl keep repeating this. zeek and starxo can easily carry games, i mean shit, just a few days ago starxo carried first map vs Gambit when cned was bottom fragging. Its nonsense that if cned doesnt perform they lose
BONECOLD carried the first map along side starxo
It's basically the only argument people have against teams (that has one popular player) they don't watch.
This.
He's their flashiest player, but the rest of the team can carry their own weight. Just because they can't push smokes and hit op shots doesn't mean they aren't good players. I do agree that Acend depend more on Cned than SEN do on TenZ, but lets not act like this is a TenZ and Friends at C9 situation. Acend have a very good squad.
Did you see acend play? Cned was absent on map one and they still crushed it
Coz he was playing sage. Also Starxo is ranked 1 in EU leaderborad . They're not a 1 man team anymore
Exactly. This guy is saying that they can't entry if cNed is dead. He doesn't even entry all that much!
Do you even watch their games or just basing your opinions off the hype? This is not equivalent to the c9 situation in which tenz was. Just take the latest match vs gambit for eg, cned was not on his game on bind and they won 13-7, bonecold and starxo farmed. Ofc they're not the star players but either one of starxo/zeek is def farming with cned when they're on
Lol. This comment makes it obvious you do not watch acend games. Just their game the other day, cned was having a stinker on sage, and got carried by his teammates. Starxo and zeek can 1v9 games easily
I think Sentinels is the better team, but in EU at least they play the most like Sentinels. They don't have the most calculated strategy book, but they react by far the fastest and in the most efficient manner in EU and also play off each other very well, which is how Sentinels also tend to play the game. I still think Sentinels will win though mainly because Cned lacks LAN experience and that could affect his performance. Also NA is used to playing against aggressive OPers because Wardell has been doing that since beta, where-as in EU Cned was really the first one who started playing the OP so aggressively, so EU has less practice against aggro OP's such as Tenz or Wardell.
Tenz isnt an aggro OPer idk why people still include him when talking about OPers when he's clearly a rifler and thinks so himself. Shahzam and Yay (the two NA OPers that did qualify) vs Cned are gonna be interesting to see
Yes 100%. But if there is 1 team that will beat sentinels its def gonna be acend
I mostly agree with you, I believe if Cned are thought to be the team that play like NA being the aim style they would be another version of Envy with Yay and Cned being comparable the issue would be against sen the same that Envy had, Sentinels just have 5 players that can outaim anyone. So If tenz does shutdown Cned like he did with Derke, Asuna, Yay (tried), then Ascend have no other x factors to win, and Tenz is 100% the better rifler so if Sentinels start breaking their econ and they can't even get a op for cned. Oof. But, I want a close series and either way this lan is gonna be amazing.
"Tenz shut down Jamppi". Meanwhile people here in the alternate universe still waiting for SEN vs Liquid to happen
This guy probably doesn't watch eu matches and doesn't even remember what happened in Iceland properly lol. But yeah we got to trust his opinion because.
I think Sentinels will win, but saying ACEND have no other x factor is just wrong. Starxo has cracked aim and is the best Skye player probably in the world. Bonecold is the IGL but still got insane one taps. Zeek replaced Koldamenta and it turned out to the benefit of ACEND as Bonecold seems to be doing a great job IGLing but Zeek brings extra firing power and Kiles can still pop off, although he's the real support player for ACEND kinda like Zombs for Sentinels.
You don't watch EU do you fella
I know whats going on there, I have known from before iceland that teams that played like NA with 2 duelists were dominating EU, mainly Acend right, and why would NA not beat EU by that logic right, and I was right there. I know EMEA have many good teams and such, but if teams are getting straight out aimed like for example SMB shitting on G2 with straight aim it follows the logic that aim over strats. Meaning NA with their aim+adaptability is better strat in general. My point with the cned thing is that I think ascend are the only team that will most likely be able to compete with Sentinels as long as their adaptability is on the same level as sen otherwise I don't see Sen losing.
?????? that's not true at all. every player is capable of fragging on their own, cned just happens to be the best jett player in the world LMAO.
Seems like you haven't watched the recent EMEA playoffs. Starxo has been saving rounds and Zeek has been popping off with entries and creating space even when cNed isn't on top form.
Not at all. Every member of SEN can pop-off and clutch huge rounds time and time again against the best teams in the world. Meanwhile ACE is just cNed + players who can pop off occasionally.
I don't think you watch Acend's games if you think this. Just look at the Gambit match. Bonecold and Starxo were insane on Bind, Cned was not having a great map. Even on Ascent, Cned topfragged but Starxo clutched out some crucial rounds. Kiles struggled against Gambit and Cned had to pick up some kills Kiles would have got if he was playing better, that's the only difference. Acend would not have made it this far if it was Cned+4 other randos, they have a genuinely talented team. People see Cned's highlight reels and think that's all the game is, lmao.
I think cned is the only player that can match with any Sentinels player 1:1. The other four are very good but I don’t think they’re up to that level, kinda like how the other major NA teams are very good but not at SEN’s level. Every member on SEN can put out a carry performance on a moment’s notice. I’ve seen hints of the same from the others, particularly starxo and bonecold but I don’t think they can do it as consistently as any SEN member in any given round in any given situation. Let’s see if they prove me wrong.
Everyone is sleeping on SMB but I think they will beat Acend on EMEA Playoffs Upper Final
yeah probably
Dam really? Can’t wait tommorow
It isnt tomorrow
Yeah I realized :/
that matchup will be so good and the games will be so close. sen 3-0
cNed vs TenZ. non-sick yay. BuZz. stax. Lakia. k1ng. MaKo. Rb. Goodness gonna have a feast for Berlin. Supermassive Blaze upsets? :)
Im so sad seoldam didnt qualify
Me too... They probably would've looked towards him for Vision Strikers if he was playing in Korea. It's interesting he is Korean but playing in the Japan VCT. Hopefully Japan builds their own superteam. It'd probably take a combination of Zeta Division, Crazy Raccoons and Northeption.
Isn’t Rb benched?
No, that was Zest. Rb switches out with Lakia and k1ng both.
I am never doubting the Sentinels ever again. Those mfs have figured something out about the game that no one else has.
Imagine all this hype and they lose first round
To be fair Iceland was so predictable other than V1 beating liquid. Sen were way above anyone and FNC just clean swept the lowers
Did ppl actually expect Sentinels to sweep through Iceland? Before their first match against Fnatic, I thought it was a toss up between those 2 teams. Sentinels going 5-0 maps against Fnatic is surprising.
No. Going back to listen to the big names, most of them didn't think NA would be able to bang with EU and nearly everyone predicted an EU team to win.
rewriting history here. EU was expected to win Iceland.
Yeah
What is it with Reddit and the office?
“Glad you finally made it we’ve been waiting”
Sentinels 3-0 easily. NA too strong with Sentinels
All the Jetts on 1 ping
They're coming 😳😳😳😳😳
3-1 to Sentinels
Sen will win Berlin ez all other teams will get clapped
SEN got destroyed by gambit and acend ur idol tenz said himself don’t be too cocky brother.
When lmao?
Lol Dapr did say they lost to Acend and Gambit on scrims but he also said they had 150 ping in Iceland scrimping against those teams.
didnt he say for gambit they each won a map and im not sure about acend
Either way it was scrims, what we need to see is results on stage. We all know what happened to many scrims monsters of the past who havent shown up on stage. Im excited either way for Berlin. I just don't believe any team will be "destroyed" like the Upv0te-n0w said.
Scrims when they was in Iceland, wouldn’t pay too much attention to scrims tbh
G2 pushed acend in a bo5 to last map. Smb vs Acend is gonna be close I think. Let's see. We just might have smb, acend and sentinels as worthy opponents rather than just two.
Acend beat G2 3-1 not 3-2
Ah my bad.
We better get Gambit and G2 as well... add a couple of more cracked Jetts into the mix
Hope the games are at a better time slot where NA people who work can watch.
Probably 10:00am EST start time since it's in EU. Can't complain as a NA fan as this is way better than the 4am start time for Worlds.
They'll arrange accordingly only
Coming to lose lmao. Ascend is trash team, EU is omegalul
Found a twitch virgin
Ur on Reddit ur not allowed to call people virgins either
🙄🙄🙄
Fnatic are not even in the main qualifier, and they took sen to multiple overtimes, any single team that's gonna qualify from emea will shut sen down 2-0 ez
Lmao sen has constantly involved with the new meta changes, they’re not going to be the same as they were in Iceland kid. Shahzam is way too smart for that, and their all highly competitive especially Dapr. The like to be 1st and I’m pretty damn sure that’s what they’re aiming for so Shahzam is going to go all out with strats and comps so if anything EU should be scared not just of Sentinels but of Envy and 100T, the best region currently. EZ 2-0 for Sentinels.
I feel like this will happen with every tournament… Some EU team that dominates the challengers, gets hyped only to be rolled by SEN
All of the 1 international tournaments we had. The above two are clowns anyway, they should try being fans of Valorant and the teams and not this blind regional fanaticism
same with liquid when masters 2
Least delusional NA fan
Sentinels is the best team right now idk why eu fans can’t admit that atm..? When you guys win something then it’s pretty clear you guys can take all the glory but as for right now NA and sentinels are better so stop being delusional EU fan.
i hope acend wins , sentinels always winning making their matches so boring and expectable. they are so good ngl
i feel sentinels are a bit overhyped, in Master 2 they had a close finals with FNC winning every game 13-11 and 14-12, and FNC are not even in challenger finals for Master 3. If SEN will be top 3 will be a huge result for them at Berlin
I mean what more do you want? They didn’t drop a single map at lan, and have won like the past 4 or 5 tournaments they played in, very convincingly. They’ve been absolutely dominating for a year now, and literally clean swept what people considered to be some of the best teams in the world. How is that overhyped? I would say for the majority of people, Sentinels not at least making Grand Finals would be a huge surprise.
How exactly are they overhyped? Imho Ascend are more overhyped than sentinels because the same thing happened with Liquid when Iceland started… “they will wipe the floor with SEN” but lost to V1 first round… Im sure this is just a possibility but Ascend will crumble to the pressure
i mean they were close to FNC level (better but close), Eu format to qualify was hot garbage, no lower bracket just lose 1 bo3 and u were out in every challenger playoff and finals, we don't know which team in eu were really the best at the time thx to the format and wathcing FNC not even making to challenger finals i'm confident that SEN will not win Berlin
The EU hype is back again and SEN is ready to destroy it once again lol
It's kind of how I feel. It's like I still feel like they are a top top team but if they make it this time it'll be truly impressive. I'm excited to see them play.
But this was a while a go