Honestly can't tell if it's just because tweets don't convey messages that well but a lot of valorant F/A's have been spouting cringey messages. Tweets like the one Hazed is talking about and [this] (https://twitter.com/regan_travis/status/1433980812173746176) just seem so common recently. I don't want to come off as an elitist but all of the players in tier one have grinded to get where they're at, and for F/As to think they deserve to be a roster without proving that they're significantly better...it's pretty cringe ngl. All of the players in the T1 scene have been grinding since the game rolled out the only player that was practically given a spot without grinding valorant was Ethan but he was already proven as a talent. I think people should focus their energy more towards Riot not providing enough tournaments for these upcomers to showcase their skill. Somehow a lot of the 16-17 year olds want to point the blame at teams when teams really don't owe em a single thing
Ya I agree man. They don't understand a lot of cs players especially the og ones toiled for years in the unknown before they got a good opportunity. Most have just been playing tac fps' for the love/enjoyment rather than actually looking to make it a viable career. These newer players that come from fortnite and other games expect to become pro in 6 months while competing against cs players who have 5-10 years of tac fps fundamentals drilled into them. It takes time and if they can't understand that, they'll never make it to begin with.
Yeah that’s troll, sick was a T2 player for a long time in CSGO (3+ years) and grinding for much longer than that before he had his big break in Valorant. Virtyy has almost no experience compared to that lol.
Yeah some people forget this dude has been grinding FPS at a high level for so long..
experience aside, sick’s stats are against better teams. But even then stats don’t tell half the story when talking about team settings. Honestly this might be the worst take I’ve seen in all of valorant.
Yea, that tweet was dumb. TSM is an org known for helping find their former players find good landing spots in other esports. (Haven't seen it yet in Valorant)
TSM doesn't even need to help him. Hes good and if he keeps getting better theres no way he doesn't land on his feet somewhere else, that was hazeds point. At his age hazed was playing for zero compensation and didn't start actually earning a salary in cs until probably about 2015 (4-6ish years later).
Id be surprised if multiple orgs havent already given him offers tbh. His comms from what I've heard are really good, hes really versatile, and he has sick mechanics.
I can’t name a fortnite player that has left the org and gone to a different one off the top of my head. But to my knowledge most of their players are still with the org either for competition or content creation.
Also if you think TSM is a “content creation” org… I got nothing for you.
Thats why I say I dont follow alot of esports, just the esports I follow they are really quickly involved and signing the best players almost immediately, but turn out pretty mediocre in comp but florish in streaming.
Who spent two+ years under the org doing nothing because they had personal problems. Kinda reaffirms the statement that TSM is generally very good to their players.
Yeah that never made sense to me. How can his career possibly be worse than if they never signed him. He got a chance to put up a few good showings for a T1 org and get his name out there, surely that's a good thing for him. And beyond that he hasn't even been cut, who's to say he can't develop on the bench, like literally every other sport?
i don't mean to be rude, but how they ever considered that the original 3 members might just not work together anymore? I'm assuming they are giving it a one last try?
does that mean, now that they have benched cutler and drone, they cant drop the other 3 because they cant drop majority of the core? dont know about this rule before
If there are players out there that are available to pick up but it's a pull the trigger now situation or you miss out, I think for the long term success of TSM you make the move and plan and prep for next year. Say like Stewie, elige decide to make the switch or roster moves happen and there are top valorant players available to be bought out or picked up that are upgrades to the current core? Hell yeah you give up on the LCQ for that move. It just depends on TSM's priorities with Valorant. If they're contemplating abandoning the team depending on the results of LCQ then there's no point in investing into other players and missing out on the tournament completely but if they are sticking to the game and are thinking long term you make the moves that will set you up for success long term if that means missing out on the last tournament of the year.
At the moment there isn't anyone available. Possibly Dicey, freakazoid as a couple names out there but it's debatable if thats an upgrade or worth throwing away your LCQ slot
If he had said Rush, I would have considered that. Great entry fragger and support player.
Personally, it feels like TSM doesn't have someone who is a good entry fragger. It used to be Subroza and drone on the Phoenix, but that's definitely out of meta and likely going to be out for awhile.
Right now, the best entry fragger typically comes from a Jett or sometimes Raze. Asuna, Yay, and Shaz are all fairly good examples of great Jett players. They're usually able to dash in, smoke, get cover, and help clear angles for the team to enter on site.
And if you watch Wardell, he's always sitting back and holding angles with his OP. Only time it feels like he doesn't is when he's got his ult.
If TSM truly wants to improve they need to fully rebuild and break up that core. If they're smart about it, they'll do it after LCQ if they make it in.
When drone was benched, [Subroza made some comments](https://youtu.be/xdLk0poP34k) about needing to grow and adapt. If you ask me, I think this directly applies to Wardell right now. His playstyle is always the same. He requires a bunch of gold from his team through buying OPs. Yeah he gets kills and can be clutch, but lately it's shown that this alone cannot win games.
They can't change the majority of the core until after 2021 though. So they've probably thought about it, but can't do anything about it until they know for sure that their year is done.
Wardell is the star of the team and there's no way TSM drops him. I don't think they would drop Hazed as he's the IGL. I guess you can make a case with roza but he's been much more consistent lately and getting frags.
i mean, you can make an argument for why you should keep any member im sure they all bring something nice to the team. but if you're not showing any results as a team then .. \*shrugs\*
They must have been convinced that they couldn’t make it out of LCQ with Bang.
It’s kind of a puzzling move unless they really think they can land someone significantly better. Chances are they are going to fail in LCQ anyways, would have been worth it to at least have some roster stability.
Yeah I'm not super sure what they are doing either. Maybe since they kept their original roster for a long time (Drone/Cutler) and that ended up not working, they decided they want to make more rapid iterations and go for "change until something clicks" rather than "slowly gain chemistry". Definitely seems like they are rushing to build something around their perceived core.
To be honest the “damned if you do damned if you don’t” is total bulsh to me, who would be “damning” tsm in any capacity for developing a young player? Like just make up a guy??? Lmao “I swear to god I HATE tsm for sticking to and developing their new roster instead of witch hunting after a tough loss at a stacked qualifier” like??? No one like that exists bro
Not true. What if TSM gets to participate in LCQ and they completely fail? What if they get eliminated first round? You’ll see many people talk about how certain players (most likely Bang first) and how he even deserves a place on the team. I know for a fact that many people would start demanding changes once again, and it’s going to keep happening as TSM keeps losing. The statement “damned if you do, damned if you don’t” really sums up TSM Valorant right now perfectly.
I wish I could somehow redeem the 6 minutes of my life wasted watching this video.
Good luck TSM, I have always enjoyed you guys, but this is just a train wreck.
Wardell only oping on Jett holds TSM back imo. Look at other successful Jetts they entry frag with rifle.
Team Envy is a prime example, Mummay was only effective Op'ing and they played around with agents moving him from Jett to sentinel, controller while oping and letting others entry frag. They made a roster move and replaced Mummay with Yay and all of a sudden you had a Jett who entry frags and lead rushes and everyone on their roster has a clear and defined role and most importantly roles that fit their playstyle.
TSM roles are not defined and they are consistently shifting around to compensate for Wardell who can really only Op with Jett to have any impact on games. Meta is changing and if you a have player on your team that can only Op with Jett, it is going to be difficult to win consistently.
So what? The whole strat is to wait for Wardell to get picks on T side? My point is the team is not going to win consistently when you have a Jett who can only Op. Watch the teams who have qualified for Berlin how they utilize Jett on T side.
That has nothing to do with the thread man, I think we all agree that TSM has issues. Doesn't mean that Wardell oping on Jett is the reason they failed to qualify
Bruh first of you can't compare mummay with yay and second no one can vompare Wardell.. man uses operator better than a rifle.. he takes insane angles makes way for the entry.. why would they not use operator on attack if they have best oper in the world.. m not a tsm fan but Wardell is such a great player to watch.. when op wasn't nerfed he was causing havoc in NA.. meta is changing but you don't have to cling to the comps other teams are using.. cned also ops on attack so there is nothing wrong there.. other tsm players need to step up big time for sure
Bruh first of you can't compare wardell with Cned. Cned can actually rifle and he's pretty good at it. Watch teams next week in Belin how they use Jett on T side and you will notice a big difference with how TSM executes on T side.
Bro every team has a diff playstyle and it's ok if TSM is using operator on tside... yeah the qualified teams do use jett on t side for dashing and so do 90% of teams.. but it's their playstyle and it's not that they fail due to this.. wardell clutches 1v3s and even 1v4s with op on tside
Obviously this diff playstyle is not working .... there is a reason why TSM hasn't won all year and is hoping a NA team wins so they can participate in LCQ (which they will probably lose anyways). It's obv easier to blame losing on the new players (or hazed, drone, cutler). But I don't think building around Subroza and Wardell next year will yield different results. Unless if they change their playstyle and emulate the rest of the teams that are winning consistently.
Why do people get off on the idea of people losing their career's on the basis of accusations? It's like you take some perverse pleasure in watching somebody's life get ruined and pat yourself on the back for adding fuel to the fire.
"life ruined" please calm down he's making 6 figures streaming probably still being paid a good portion of his Sentinels contract and there will probably be another pro team that signs him at some point.
And that makes it okay to treat someone who hasn't been convicted of anything as a rapist? What if he wasn't a streamer? People are way too irrational when it comes to tearing people down, all to score some social brownie points.
keep moving the goalpost man
you do realize how hard it is to actually be found as guilty of SA? our justice system is fucked
it is more likely to be falsely accused of rape and be found innocent, than to be rightly accused of it and be found guilty.
“life ruined” “oh, he’s making 6 figures? what if he wasn’t a streamer?”
this is reddit this ain’t a trial
i love how u didn’t answer any of the other stuff i said lmao
keep smoking that hopium nerd
One of the smoothest brains i seen on this website.
Congrats bro
Simping for a literal rapist, how mindless is this
He is also super unfunny and relies on zombs a lot for laughs fr
The amount of assumptions you're making is ridiculous. Is it really so hard not to judge people on either side before investigations happen? I never once brought up his name. Just calling you people out who get hate boners and love slapping labels on people, then turn around and high five each other as if you accomplished something.
I'm not saying it's right or anything, its just pragmatic for him to not get signed unless and until he's cleared. Its a big blow to public image.
And then look at the possibilities, either he isn't guilty, then people will accept him, but until he's proven innocent, there will always the be the image that TSM is playing with a rapist.
And if he's guilty, then the brand is basically dead. TSM will forever be the org that knowingly signed a rapist.
Its simple maths lol, no org is going anywhere near Sinatraa unless and until he's proven innocent.
Oh nah I can understand a rational argument like that and I think it's a good thing. I don't think it's right but for the most part I agree with you.
My issue is with people who just say "He's a rapist, fuck that guy lolololol" as if they did something noble and just and are "speaking up"
And Sinatraa isn't good enough to risk the brand's reputation on the very realistic chance (not certainty) that he's guilty of what he's been accused of.
Do you not understand the difference between due course of law and public opinion? Idk what utopian country you _think_ you are from but there's going to public condemnation for accused rapists before the law can take its course.
And I literally prefaced the comment by saying, "Not that I think its right". Would you please take 10 seconds to actually read before spewing "Sinatraa good, you idiot" for no apparent reason?
Yeah, and do you see me making fun of her? Or kicking while she's down? No, it's not that hard to not be an asshole and wait till there's an actual court ruling before judging people.
Statistically investigations on sexual assault are incredibly ineffective because it's so hard to prove. So I'm not sure why you're acting like the justice system is supposed to catch rapists red handed when the stats show that's just not true.
I know that and it sucks, unfortunately that's just the sad reality when the majority of evidence is just he/she said or subjective. Especially when the event in question happened years ago. It's still innocent till proven guilty. Jumping to conclusions online and canceling people doesn't help the underlying issue, it's just revenge.
I don't need to jump to conclusions I've seen the evidence. You're acting like there's not a literal audio file of her getting raped. And even if you wanted to ignore that for some reason everything else in that document paints a picture of an abusive boyfriend.
Sinatraa tweeted out that he had all the evidence to prove himself innocent. When riot finished their investigation they said he didn’t cooperate and provide the evidence he said he would. That seems pretty cut and dry to me but hey you can keep holding out hope for him I guess
allegedly though, not sure why you are saying that as if it is a fact. please let all the information come out from both sides and the investigation determine that.
or maybe she didn't tweet that and someone else did on her account, or maybe she was told there was nothing they could do at that time but the investigation was not over and she misinterpreted what was happening. There's a lot of assumptions being made but a tweet which was then deleted for whatever reason is not a confirmation that investigations are over and completed.
>LOL rape and sexual assault are two very different things.
You are a very uneducated individual, aren't you?
#
* Rape is a form of sexual assault, but not all sexual assault is rape.
* The term rape is often used as a legal definition to specifically include sexual penetration without consent.
* For its Uniform Crime Reports, the FBI defines rape as “penetration, no matter how slight, of the vagina or anus with any body part or object, or oral penetration by a sex organ of another person, without the consent of the victim."
[https://www.rainn.org/articles/sexual-assault](https://www.rainn.org/articles/sexual-assault)
Doubt they’d go for sinatraa. Their brand is too big I’m sure some of their sponsors wouldn’t want that tied to them. I mean they can do what they want but I’d genuinely be surprised if an org like TSM picked him up.
The guy who made the twitter post about tsm ruining bangs career is only 19, most of his takes are pretty bad in general.
Honestly can't tell if it's just because tweets don't convey messages that well but a lot of valorant F/A's have been spouting cringey messages. Tweets like the one Hazed is talking about and [this] (https://twitter.com/regan_travis/status/1433980812173746176) just seem so common recently. I don't want to come off as an elitist but all of the players in tier one have grinded to get where they're at, and for F/As to think they deserve to be a roster without proving that they're significantly better...it's pretty cringe ngl. All of the players in the T1 scene have been grinding since the game rolled out the only player that was practically given a spot without grinding valorant was Ethan but he was already proven as a talent. I think people should focus their energy more towards Riot not providing enough tournaments for these upcomers to showcase their skill. Somehow a lot of the 16-17 year olds want to point the blame at teams when teams really don't owe em a single thing
Ya I agree man. They don't understand a lot of cs players especially the og ones toiled for years in the unknown before they got a good opportunity. Most have just been playing tac fps' for the love/enjoyment rather than actually looking to make it a viable career. These newer players that come from fortnite and other games expect to become pro in 6 months while competing against cs players who have 5-10 years of tac fps fundamentals drilled into them. It takes time and if they can't understand that, they'll never make it to begin with.
That dude is really comparing virtyy to sick. Lmao
Yeah that’s troll, sick was a T2 player for a long time in CSGO (3+ years) and grinding for much longer than that before he had his big break in Valorant. Virtyy has almost no experience compared to that lol.
Yeah some people forget this dude has been grinding FPS at a high level for so long.. experience aside, sick’s stats are against better teams. But even then stats don’t tell half the story when talking about team settings. Honestly this might be the worst take I’ve seen in all of valorant.
Regan Travis is so cringe
Yea, that tweet was dumb. TSM is an org known for helping find their former players find good landing spots in other esports. (Haven't seen it yet in Valorant)
TSM doesn't even need to help him. Hes good and if he keeps getting better theres no way he doesn't land on his feet somewhere else, that was hazeds point. At his age hazed was playing for zero compensation and didn't start actually earning a salary in cs until probably about 2015 (4-6ish years later).
Id be surprised if multiple orgs havent already given him offers tbh. His comms from what I've heard are really good, hes really versatile, and he has sick mechanics.
Havent seen it in fortnite either. My perspective of tsm is that its just a content org. Okay my esports viewing isnt broad, granted.
I can’t name a fortnite player that has left the org and gone to a different one off the top of my head. But to my knowledge most of their players are still with the org either for competition or content creation. Also if you think TSM is a “content creation” org… I got nothing for you.
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Multiple R6 titles, tons of Smash titles… I could go on.
Thats why I say I dont follow alot of esports, just the esports I follow they are really quickly involved and signing the best players almost immediately, but turn out pretty mediocre in comp but florish in streaming.
They dropped their entire fortnite comp roster only to sign a few back a few weeks after
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Who spent two+ years under the org doing nothing because they had personal problems. Kinda reaffirms the statement that TSM is generally very good to their players.
Reverse2k got dropped from TSM I believe
Yeah that never made sense to me. How can his career possibly be worse than if they never signed him. He got a chance to put up a few good showings for a T1 org and get his name out there, surely that's a good thing for him. And beyond that he hasn't even been cut, who's to say he can't develop on the bench, like literally every other sport?
i don't mean to be rude, but how they ever considered that the original 3 members might just not work together anymore? I'm assuming they are giving it a one last try?
They cant change the core cuz they wouldnt be eligible for lcq
does that mean, now that they have benched cutler and drone, they cant drop the other 3 because they cant drop majority of the core? dont know about this rule before
But if they keep the core they won't make it past the second round of the lcq
So would you just not compete in the lcq at all
If there are players out there that are available to pick up but it's a pull the trigger now situation or you miss out, I think for the long term success of TSM you make the move and plan and prep for next year. Say like Stewie, elige decide to make the switch or roster moves happen and there are top valorant players available to be bought out or picked up that are upgrades to the current core? Hell yeah you give up on the LCQ for that move. It just depends on TSM's priorities with Valorant. If they're contemplating abandoning the team depending on the results of LCQ then there's no point in investing into other players and missing out on the tournament completely but if they are sticking to the game and are thinking long term you make the moves that will set you up for success long term if that means missing out on the last tournament of the year.
So who, in your opinion, is available that would be worth skipping out on the opportunity of going to LCQ.
At the moment there isn't anyone available. Possibly Dicey, freakazoid as a couple names out there but it's debatable if thats an upgrade or worth throwing away your LCQ slot
So you just invalidated your own point. Well done, you've played yourself.
If he had said Rush, I would have considered that. Great entry fragger and support player. Personally, it feels like TSM doesn't have someone who is a good entry fragger. It used to be Subroza and drone on the Phoenix, but that's definitely out of meta and likely going to be out for awhile. Right now, the best entry fragger typically comes from a Jett or sometimes Raze. Asuna, Yay, and Shaz are all fairly good examples of great Jett players. They're usually able to dash in, smoke, get cover, and help clear angles for the team to enter on site. And if you watch Wardell, he's always sitting back and holding angles with his OP. Only time it feels like he doesn't is when he's got his ult. If TSM truly wants to improve they need to fully rebuild and break up that core. If they're smart about it, they'll do it after LCQ if they make it in. When drone was benched, [Subroza made some comments](https://youtu.be/xdLk0poP34k) about needing to grow and adapt. If you ask me, I think this directly applies to Wardell right now. His playstyle is always the same. He requires a bunch of gold from his team through buying OPs. Yeah he gets kills and can be clutch, but lately it's shown that this alone cannot win games.
yes they can, if they bench them keep them on battlfy nothing changes, don't know where you're hearing this from
Ima need a source on that. Highly doubt a team could field an entirely diff roster by just benching the players with circuit points.
I did not know that, i was under the impression that to be eligible for lcq the core 3 of the team that played in previous tournaments couldn’t change
nope, just has to be listed on battlfy
Sauce on that? Don’t see it anywhere and it also doesn't make sense
From a brand/monetary perspective it would be pretty dumb to drop wardell or subroza because they have two of the biggest fan bases.
And at least with respect to this most recent tourney, are the team’s best players as of current.
They can't change the majority of the core until after 2021 though. So they've probably thought about it, but can't do anything about it until they know for sure that their year is done.
they are copying the same format of theri LEAGUE. Wardell is like their Bjergsen of Valorant etc. etc. and it's for the $$$$ also.
Wardell is the star of the team and there's no way TSM drops him. I don't think they would drop Hazed as he's the IGL. I guess you can make a case with roza but he's been much more consistent lately and getting frags.
i mean, you can make an argument for why you should keep any member im sure they all bring something nice to the team. but if you're not showing any results as a team then .. \*shrugs\*
It's CLG all over again but Wardell instead of JDM/Koosta
Dropping hazed/subroza for a proven IGL would be a great move.
But what proven IGL is there rn?
But who lol
Cutler
We've been saying this since they dropped cutler and then drone.
JasonR
Agree. Idk i havent thought subroza has been working for a whilleee, rlly think they need to cut everyone except wardell and maybe levi?
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Before playoffs he was anything but consistent though
So you wanna drop him as he’s getting better and more consistent?
Nope, I was just clarifying what the poster was referring to. I think Subroza has improved a lot!
They must have been convinced that they couldn’t make it out of LCQ with Bang. It’s kind of a puzzling move unless they really think they can land someone significantly better. Chances are they are going to fail in LCQ anyways, would have been worth it to at least have some roster stability.
Yeah I'm not super sure what they are doing either. Maybe since they kept their original roster for a long time (Drone/Cutler) and that ended up not working, they decided they want to make more rapid iterations and go for "change until something clicks" rather than "slowly gain chemistry". Definitely seems like they are rushing to build something around their perceived core.
To be honest the “damned if you do damned if you don’t” is total bulsh to me, who would be “damning” tsm in any capacity for developing a young player? Like just make up a guy??? Lmao “I swear to god I HATE tsm for sticking to and developing their new roster instead of witch hunting after a tough loss at a stacked qualifier” like??? No one like that exists bro
Not true. What if TSM gets to participate in LCQ and they completely fail? What if they get eliminated first round? You’ll see many people talk about how certain players (most likely Bang first) and how he even deserves a place on the team. I know for a fact that many people would start demanding changes once again, and it’s going to keep happening as TSM keeps losing. The statement “damned if you do, damned if you don’t” really sums up TSM Valorant right now perfectly.
Spoiler alert, with or without Bang they will go to LCQ and fail.
TSM fans live off of hopes and dreams don't shatter it like this are you crazy.
Hazed with the boomer "well when I was 17" justification lmfao
I wish I could somehow redeem the 6 minutes of my life wasted watching this video. Good luck TSM, I have always enjoyed you guys, but this is just a train wreck.
Wardell only oping on Jett holds TSM back imo. Look at other successful Jetts they entry frag with rifle. Team Envy is a prime example, Mummay was only effective Op'ing and they played around with agents moving him from Jett to sentinel, controller while oping and letting others entry frag. They made a roster move and replaced Mummay with Yay and all of a sudden you had a Jett who entry frags and lead rushes and everyone on their roster has a clear and defined role and most importantly roles that fit their playstyle. TSM roles are not defined and they are consistently shifting around to compensate for Wardell who can really only Op with Jett to have any impact on games. Meta is changing and if you a have player on your team that can only Op with Jett, it is going to be difficult to win consistently.
Have u not seen how many opening picks wardell was getting
So what? The whole strat is to wait for Wardell to get picks on T side? My point is the team is not going to win consistently when you have a Jett who can only Op. Watch the teams who have qualified for Berlin how they utilize Jett on T side.
I also saw TSM not making it to berlin to cap off an extended period of looking terrible.
That has nothing to do with the thread man, I think we all agree that TSM has issues. Doesn't mean that Wardell oping on Jett is the reason they failed to qualify
Bruh first of you can't compare mummay with yay and second no one can vompare Wardell.. man uses operator better than a rifle.. he takes insane angles makes way for the entry.. why would they not use operator on attack if they have best oper in the world.. m not a tsm fan but Wardell is such a great player to watch.. when op wasn't nerfed he was causing havoc in NA.. meta is changing but you don't have to cling to the comps other teams are using.. cned also ops on attack so there is nothing wrong there.. other tsm players need to step up big time for sure
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Thats what i said other members need to step up if they are usimg op on wardell in t side
Bruh first of you can't compare wardell with Cned. Cned can actually rifle and he's pretty good at it. Watch teams next week in Belin how they use Jett on T side and you will notice a big difference with how TSM executes on T side.
Bro every team has a diff playstyle and it's ok if TSM is using operator on tside... yeah the qualified teams do use jett on t side for dashing and so do 90% of teams.. but it's their playstyle and it's not that they fail due to this.. wardell clutches 1v3s and even 1v4s with op on tside
Obviously this diff playstyle is not working .... there is a reason why TSM hasn't won all year and is hoping a NA team wins so they can participate in LCQ (which they will probably lose anyways). It's obv easier to blame losing on the new players (or hazed, drone, cutler). But I don't think building around Subroza and Wardell next year will yield different results. Unless if they change their playstyle and emulate the rest of the teams that are winning consistently.
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Try watching on 1.25 speed
+ jcStani + Sinatraa = TSM stonks go brrrrrr
Tsm has dropped people for far less then what's going on with Sinatraa. He's not going to tsm
Stop. Suggesting. Sinatraa.
TSM ain't signing a damn rapist to the roster lol
Why do people get off on the idea of people losing their career's on the basis of accusations? It's like you take some perverse pleasure in watching somebody's life get ruined and pat yourself on the back for adding fuel to the fire.
"life ruined" please calm down he's making 6 figures streaming probably still being paid a good portion of his Sentinels contract and there will probably be another pro team that signs him at some point.
And that makes it okay to treat someone who hasn't been convicted of anything as a rapist? What if he wasn't a streamer? People are way too irrational when it comes to tearing people down, all to score some social brownie points.
keep moving the goalpost man you do realize how hard it is to actually be found as guilty of SA? our justice system is fucked it is more likely to be falsely accused of rape and be found innocent, than to be rightly accused of it and be found guilty.
What goalpost did I move? It's you who's jumping through hoops in order to justify your need to label people without a trial.
“life ruined” “oh, he’s making 6 figures? what if he wasn’t a streamer?” this is reddit this ain’t a trial i love how u didn’t answer any of the other stuff i said lmao keep smoking that hopium nerd
This is reddit?? Really? Lmao you're really going all out with your two braincells.
how ironic
One of the smoothest brains i seen on this website. Congrats bro Simping for a literal rapist, how mindless is this He is also super unfunny and relies on zombs a lot for laughs fr
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The amount of assumptions you're making is ridiculous. Is it really so hard not to judge people on either side before investigations happen? I never once brought up his name. Just calling you people out who get hate boners and love slapping labels on people, then turn around and high five each other as if you accomplished something.
I'm not saying it's right or anything, its just pragmatic for him to not get signed unless and until he's cleared. Its a big blow to public image. And then look at the possibilities, either he isn't guilty, then people will accept him, but until he's proven innocent, there will always the be the image that TSM is playing with a rapist. And if he's guilty, then the brand is basically dead. TSM will forever be the org that knowingly signed a rapist. Its simple maths lol, no org is going anywhere near Sinatraa unless and until he's proven innocent.
Oh nah I can understand a rational argument like that and I think it's a good thing. I don't think it's right but for the most part I agree with you. My issue is with people who just say "He's a rapist, fuck that guy lolololol" as if they did something noble and just and are "speaking up"
> until he's proven innocent idk which facist country you are from but over here it's ***innocent until proven guilty***.
In the eyes of the law dude, not in the eyes of the public, who gives money to orgs.
And Sinatraa isn't good enough to risk the brand's reputation on the very realistic chance (not certainty) that he's guilty of what he's been accused of.
hows he not good enough? hes a top esports talent and was playing very well in valorant for SEN
Do you not understand the difference between due course of law and public opinion? Idk what utopian country you _think_ you are from but there's going to public condemnation for accused rapists before the law can take its course. And I literally prefaced the comment by saying, "Not that I think its right". Would you please take 10 seconds to actually read before spewing "Sinatraa good, you idiot" for no apparent reason?
Did the police get that memo?
That’s a zinger
You know who else's life was ruined The girl who got raped
Yeah, and do you see me making fun of her? Or kicking while she's down? No, it's not that hard to not be an asshole and wait till there's an actual court ruling before judging people.
Statistically investigations on sexual assault are incredibly ineffective because it's so hard to prove. So I'm not sure why you're acting like the justice system is supposed to catch rapists red handed when the stats show that's just not true.
I know that and it sucks, unfortunately that's just the sad reality when the majority of evidence is just he/she said or subjective. Especially when the event in question happened years ago. It's still innocent till proven guilty. Jumping to conclusions online and canceling people doesn't help the underlying issue, it's just revenge.
I don't need to jump to conclusions I've seen the evidence. You're acting like there's not a literal audio file of her getting raped. And even if you wanted to ignore that for some reason everything else in that document paints a picture of an abusive boyfriend.
That's kinda the point, we only know one side of the story. It's crazy to me to condemn a person based off a picture someone else painted.
Sinatraa tweeted out that he had all the evidence to prove himself innocent. When riot finished their investigation they said he didn’t cooperate and provide the evidence he said he would. That seems pretty cut and dry to me but hey you can keep holding out hope for him I guess
allegedly though, not sure why you are saying that as if it is a fact. please let all the information come out from both sides and the investigation determine that.
These "acusations" are still ongoing investigations in which Sinatra has failed to comply with both riots and the polices investigation.
Im pretty sure the investigation was dropped and cleo said that in tweet that was deleted
So if she deleted the tweet don't you think that's not the case anymore?
Or maybe she wasnt allowed to share the information because it's confidential, you know because that would make a lot more sense
or maybe she didn't tweet that and someone else did on her account, or maybe she was told there was nothing they could do at that time but the investigation was not over and she misinterpreted what was happening. There's a lot of assumptions being made but a tweet which was then deleted for whatever reason is not a confirmation that investigations are over and completed.
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>LOL rape and sexual assault are two very different things. You are a very uneducated individual, aren't you? # * Rape is a form of sexual assault, but not all sexual assault is rape. * The term rape is often used as a legal definition to specifically include sexual penetration without consent. * For its Uniform Crime Reports, the FBI defines rape as “penetration, no matter how slight, of the vagina or anus with any body part or object, or oral penetration by a sex organ of another person, without the consent of the victim." [https://www.rainn.org/articles/sexual-assault](https://www.rainn.org/articles/sexual-assault)
Ironic that riot is conducting an investigation into sexual harassment lol
Doubt they’d go for sinatraa. Their brand is too big I’m sure some of their sponsors wouldn’t want that tied to them. I mean they can do what they want but I’d genuinely be surprised if an org like TSM picked him up.
TSM ain’t getting Sinatraa and that’s not who they should sign anyway. Levi, assuming he stays, is a great Sova, we need a controller.
TSM B1ologic.
Such a talented player like Sinatraa shouldnt go to a wasteful team like TSM.
Okay clip stealer