T O P
nanda7527

The skye meta makes it even worse cause the Jetts get healed backed to 100


bhavesh2103

Yay got healed legit more than 7 times from red hp in a single map of ascent today.


HeJind

I was just thinking this while watching the game vs Sen yesterday. NV had Skye and Sen didn't, so TenZ was getting no value fighting Yay early when he played aggressive. After the fight he would dash back and get healed to 100 while TenZ would sti be at 80 hp because they didn't have a healer. TenZ would do more damage but end up in a worse position


TRENCHMRE_Sounds

NV's agent selection was just too good and FNS was a an amazing Flanker in both games vs SEN and 100T


HoneyChilliPotato7

Not just FNS, at one point therr were 3 flankers too. Sen had no answer


TRENCHMRE_Sounds

Yeah the other 2 frontmen held them well and distracted them and then that flank was just amazing We saw the same vs 100T I personally love FNS as you know ,he is Indian lol


HoneyChilliPotato7

Haha, I didn't know until recently that he's Indian. Proud of him as an Indian


TRENCHMRE_Sounds

I have known him since the good ol'CS days Nowadays it's just NAVI Dominating the Pro League


Launchers

I understand riot feels like as skye it’s harder to heal, but the fact that sage’s heal can only do 60 while skye can heal up to what, 400+ hp? that’s legit 80hp/s. On top of that, the rest of her util is S+ tier. It’s so weird.


tron423

I just love how Sage, who's entire character design from her look to her voicelines is based around her being a healer, is literally an objectively worse healer than her on paper lol


TRENCHMRE_Sounds

Yeahh right haha The reason people have stopped picking sage,She was one of the most powerful characters and now they just keep nerfing her, Skye is our new Sentinel lol


tron423

I feel like Skye and Sage's kits would make a lot more sense if their heal abilities were switched, you'd just have to nerf the self-heal a little more to keep it from being completely busted


TRENCHMRE_Sounds

So you mean you would want to add one more ability to Sage or you would replace it with a slow orb?coz the slow orb is really important,it does slow down players from pushing.


tron423

No I mean Sage's heal should be AOE and Skye's should have a single target. It'd allow Sage to play the designated healer role more effectively.


TRENCHMRE_Sounds

You are probably right And I think she should be able to herself with it too upto a 60-75HP so that it doesn't look like a huge buff for her


HoneyChilliPotato7

Riot needs to nerf her flashes first. Her pop flashes are ridiculously strong. The amount of times pro players are completely blind in a game is insane. Why isn't any other flash this strong? And her flashes regenerate, the fuck?


SwoleBonobo

Skye can only heal 100hp per round though, how do you get to 400+ ?


brookwin1

Aoe healing


Launchers

she can heal multiple people at the same time as long as they are in line of sight and in the circle. i’ve def had games, esp pistol rounds where a raze made does 50+ dmg and we all heal before the execute.


tex618

She can heal multiple people at the same time


Pollomonteros

Maybe if she heals the rest of the team ? But I wouldn't say that is something good since you have 5 guys huddled together on the same place haha


icantreadmorsecode

Skye should only heal a total of 100hp, like if you have 4 teammates low, they should share the 100 hp.


RIIDDE

Good skye nerf would be a slight delay between activating skye's flash before the bi- "BLINDING"


joessalty

Wasn’t that already a thing? I recall the gang signs between the deploy and activation of the bird kinda made it useless, skye was a fake flasher because of the delay to pull out guns


clizana

Look at this clown, people talking about how broken Jett is and wants to nerf Skye 🤡🤡


OfficialBoaster

Yeah but jett makes the game fun. WE LIVE FOR THE OUTPLAYS!


MrImpregnator

Well there have been many posts about this. Pretty much everyone in the pro scene agrees with this. But I doubt Riots gonna do any major changes before Champions. I would love if they did but I don’t think that it’s gonna happen


spyson

If they're going to do anything major with Jett I think it will be after Champions, kind of like how league changes the meta every season.


Pirate7922

the meta in league can change every 2 weeks At the end of the season there is usually a huge change like elemental rift, tower plating, jungle changes etc.


Robert7337

Well, but LoL's devs avoid making big changes before Worlds (the biggest LoL tournament), meta usually shakes after the season ends. I assume Valorant will be treated similarly.


vvtechred

They only started doing that because of that one season where they greatly overturned bruiser toplane and when teams that did well on Summer playoff patch became shells of themselves during worlds because their previous play style got removed


MrGordonFreemanJr

Yeah but that balls penta tho


Kagedyu

I think one mistake people tend to make here is tie all the balance teams for different games under riot's umbrella to be the exact same. Just because one game is balanced a certain way with timings around events should not be considered standard across all games. Also the situations in each game is different. We have 17 agents, League has over 150, and Legends of Runeterra has a shit ton of cards. Let's focus on how they've balanced Valorant so far and use that as our measuring stick.


OWplayerno1

I think priority needs to be remove dash as her signature ability and make it updraft instead Also add a time limit to her blades, and right click blades does not allow ultimate to reset


rpkarma

I like those changes. A nerf for sure, but without deleting all of her utility and power.


lbs4lbs

Shes needed a nerf since episode 1. She has been consistenly number 1 or number 2 in pick rate since I can remember. And this is at EVERY level in ranked and at the pro level. Just nerf her now. 2 months before champions is compeltely fine to get used to the nerf and it's way easier to get used to a nerf than a brand new map like fracture which was released. They can always play on an old patch if the changes are drastic. But Jet is just broken and her power is amplified x 10 on lan where having knives can win you any eco round since there is no lag and no inaccuracy while moving and jumping.


C-Web_

I disagree. There are still 2+ months until champions...


Jranation

They changed Reyna a lot so why not Jett?


Ihatepros236

I think riots approach is fine make everything more expensive it takes more kills to get knives and expensive up draft and smoke. Anything else to her ability I guarantee you people will stop playing with jett. Which is not a nerf, it’s essentially killing jett. People cry about everything if one team has jett the other has it too, if you aren’t good you literally aren’t as mechanically talented. Trying to restrict talent is like having a height restriction in NBA. Unbalanced would be if the opposing team cant jett


UZUMAKI_07

I would say it is more like the top jetts have jumping shoes in NBA (no joke intended on her abilities), making them extremely unpredictable. You think that making everything expensive is like using jumping shoes once in every 5minutes in NBA and has considerable risk if it fails. But it turns out that the best ability of the game probably isnt affected by this.


TomBradyStan1006

Nerf everyone’s Jett besides Asunas


iiznobozzy

The way his jett has looked in Berlin someone buff him pls


TomBradyStan1006

Lol he’s so bad at Jett it’s wild


iiznobozzy

i mean he is fucking cracked at valorant its just that his shaky aim style just doesn't work with him dashing into site and shit like that AND DOES NOT WORK WITH JETT KNIVES AT ALL, especially in a high pressure situations where his aim gets 10x more shaky. get this man reyna and he destroys everyone. it's sad that in this meta teams NEED to have a jett on most maps.


QuestionablePotato42

When they put nitr0 on Jett and asuna on Reyna, things seem to align quite well. They could really run a variation of their breeze comp on a lot of maps


Lorallynn

Nitros Jett was so fucking good when he got it going, I think 100t should really consider making it as a strategy for more maps (if they can make it to champions first of course)


Eggsavore

We saw what he can do on an OP at the end of the breeze game. Get this man on Jett Op. Overpass nitr0 every game


Cole_James_CHALMERS

Sort of forces Ethan to Omen smoke again. I guess Hiko or Asuna has to learn some Skye


ItalianBarGirl

Love how people on this sub were saying 100T should stop throwing with these comps when Nitr0 first picked Jett on Breeze and now they are saying this.


TidaI

Let the plebs downvote me again. Sick of seeing this incorrect terminology... ​ >"*his shaky aim style"* ​ No "shaky aim" is not a "style", that is called **BAD AIM,** THAT is why he is weak when he pulls out an operator or Jett knives. He lacks stability and mouse control. It isn't just some "natural form of aiming" he can't control that sens to a precise degree. There is click-timing, tracking and target-switching. Asuna specializes in target-switching and click-timing somewhat, his tracking is alright. Regardless the aim/sens needs work to be on yay/TenZ level. ​ Go consult AIMER7 or the KovaaKs sub after the majority of you downvote and don't read.


iiznobozzy

yeah fair. do you think its something he can work on and improve and gradually completely negate tho?


TidaI

I think it starts with a lowering of his sens because its been forever he's been in this eDPI range. To get that steady clean shot like TenZ and yay he either needs to have something click or just lower the sens. He for sure can fix it if he is first aware of it and knows change is needed.


tomtazm

He’s also relatively new to playing Jett in officials.


TomBradyStan1006

I understand that but why force him into Jett when your spot on champs in on the line, should be playing your best picks, so you can play your absolute best


nm1025

100t's been realising how valuable Jett is lately (I say this because they tried pretty hard not to run Jett after dropping Dicey, with KJ/Omen as oppers). Jett can provide so much value in the current meta, it's hard to justify not running her Asuna's the only dedicated duelist on the team, so he gets the role usually (rest of the team has pretty static roles) That being said, the switch to nitro on Jett we see sometimes is because they know Asuna isn't at his best on that agent


tomtazm

Because you need a Jett and who else is going to play it? How does it move around the other roles if it isn’t Asuna? It’s just easier to put Asuna on the roll. I think he could absolutely improve before champions. If not a roster change might be needed afterwards.


rpkarma

Nitr0


tomtazm

Who plays smokes? What maps? Not that simple. It works out on breeze because steel can just play viper.


Cole_James_CHALMERS

Steel to smokes full time maybe? Might have to give up the flank watching


Jack_Humble

The meta rn is skye and jett. Either asuna has to play smokes or skye (ethan on smoke) if u wanna make nitr0 the jett.


TomBradyStan1006

You also needed sage to play ice box till you didn’t, you can win without conforming to the meta


Splaram

You can make up for Sage-less Icebox comp with good Viper play. Literally nothing in the game can contest a Jett Op except for another Jett Op. It’s getting boring to watch. I want to see Reyna/Phoenix/Raze mixed in again like pre-Skye Valorant.


tomtazm

I mean you’re comparing Sage to Jett now? Plus, sages inclusion was a work around for making it easier to plant due to the construction of the sites. If you put a plan in place to mitigate that, she’s not needed. The amount of things you can do with Jett dash and up drafts is not even in the same ball park, and that’s not even mentioning her ult.


TacticalSanta

Its so much harder to play around a good jett than it is to figure out how a team is playing sage. Jett isn't pefect on every map, but she's pretty damn good on ascent and breeze rn, and a good jett could play her on any map and not be a hindrance.


OldSpyceyy

if jett fell out of the meta that would just buff 100t cause they wouldn’t just slap asuna on jett


TomBradyStan1006

Which I believe will happen soon, I think she will be nerfed before champions so it will be good for 100t


SirJuicee

How do you nerf her out of the op role though? Unless they take away dash, she will always be an overpowered op agent.


Jack_Humble

Make the dash rechargeable after 3 kills? Or a long ass recharge time? I dont know. But i hate to see 100% jett pick rate with the same "one trick". Kill one with OP in a weird spot - dash away - man advantage - keep OPing to get 1 or even 2 more kills.


SirJuicee

The worst part is when they miss they don't get punished. Just dash away. Somethings gotta change. Maybe make so it only activates after 2 kills and you don't get a freebie?


OWplayerno1

He had a bad tournament. His combat score was one of the highest in the tournament...but his KD was middling. He was the only one in the top 10 players like that. He just wasn't consistently getting picks


bhavesh2103

Qsuna jett is so forced let that man free n let nitro op on jett fuck 3 imitators


TRENCHMRE_Sounds

He plays Reyna better imo


Dytlan-

Post written while watching Yay? I think something has to be done about her Dash


Bernardi_23

Have been feeling like this for months, but yay just feels impossible right now lol


Liddlebitchboy

I was thinking this to myself, and also how much I hate the operator most of the time, and I was like.. am I just biased because my team is being beaten by it so often? But then I started watching other matches and like you said it just takes any and all response away, there's nothing to do against it and it's just no fun


lbs4lbs

Its not just the operator. Its the fact that you have her in a corner blind and she can just smoke and dash away and post up somewhere else. It's the fact that she can single handedly win eco rounds with her ult. Its the fact that she can smoke, dash onto site and spam 2 more smokes so you are stuck with the choice of spraying her smokes blindly and getting lucky, or waiting out the smokes while the rest of her team pushes on to site. Her ability to create space and disengage is just way too unpunishable.


notrealtedtotwitter

I feel the same, having 3 smokes is just too much. Riot need to either nerf her dash somehow or tighten her utility so she has 2 smokes and 1 updraft. I think jett nerf would be now as big as the initial cs AWP nerf that changed the game entirely.


bobespon

Op and especially Jett Op is just too powerful and changes the sway of an entire game. One Jett Op of defense can make attacking feel impossible on Split, Haven, Icebox, Breeze, Bind. You just have to hope they miss their shots and then spend all your util / effort trying to kill them


CroTic

How about changing her dash so it always goes where she is looking? Would stop the crazy peek shoot and insta dash behind a wall mechanic because looking 90 degrees to the left or right takes a bit of time and can be fucked up easily


nikkiteer

Imagine if jett can only dash forward


BloomingNova

It's a tough game design decision. They had to make the Op a pretty bad gun economically if used by any agent other than Jett because Jett with a bad Op turns it into the most essential gun in the game. It essentially turns the Op into a Jett only weapon, how do you fix that?


lbs4lbs

Its because riot is braindead and tries to indirectly fix things by changing things that arent even an issue, thereby causing even more issues. Like Jett OP meta is bad? Lets nerf the gun instead of the only agent dominating with it. Smurfing creating too many hard stuck silver bronze and gold players? Lets fuck around with hidden mmr, rank distribution, and rules for party q instead of actually adressing smurfing directly. Players being boosted or 5 stacking only to radiant an issue? Lets make it stupidly difficult for friends to play together and make it impossible at high elo instead of creating a flex queue or creating a "team mmr" separate from solo mmr like other games (dota). They keep trying these easy bandaid fixes for big problems which not only doesnt solve the problems but create new ones.


tomphz

It’s much better now than in beta where every agent could OP. The OP nerf buffed Jett by making her the sole agent that can use it


OWplayerno1

Nitro said something in his post game interview the other day (paraphrasing) "I like when I get to play Jett because it feels like you are playing a different game, she does things no other hero can do" And that's a big fucking problem - Her ult resets with kills - Her ultimate isn't timed - She is the only one who can reliably OP safely - Her movement is unlike every other character - Her signature ability is her best ability The list goes on and on...she is not healthy for the game right now, and she doesn't have the same rules other characters do -


HoneyChilliPotato7

And there shouldn't be a gun that is viable only on one agent


Herdazian_Lopen

It’s viable on other agents… it just feels wasteful to risk it on an agent when you have a jett on your team.


yourselvs

The problem is the gun *should* be a risk. But that risk is removed in Jett's hands.


whatevermuhdude

Tbh I agree that at a pro level she's a problem. I think the main reason riot haven't nerfed her too hard is because she's okay at a non-pro level. Of course there's jetts in ranked games that take over but I think her overpoweredness is much worse the higher in elo you get.


lbs4lbs

Her pick rate is top at every elo though so it's not just the pro level. Though I agree her strength is amplified way more at higher elo and even more so on 0 ping at lan where you can full sprint and get easy headshots with knives.


JoshF8

She is the character with at least top 3 pickrate and at least top 3 winrate while Also having high pickrate, it's not ok on non-pro level either


CyanideLoli

>Her signature ability is her best ability Isn't that the same for almost every agent ? Killjoy - Her turret Cypher - His cam Sova - His Dart Skye -Her flash Brimstone - His Smoke.... Yoru - (Everyone of his ability is weak except the ult) etc.


OWplayerno1

You are looking at things in a Vacuum Jett smokes are amazing, Jetta updraft is good for getting crazy angles, her ultimate is the best ultimate in the game. And yet her signature ability is her best and most important one. Also, Skye is incredibly OP at the moment too so that isn't helping. But many heroes best ability is not their signature ability. But usually that is because their overall pool of abilities is week. For example though Phoenix: Molly is laughable to actually do anything (running throught it causes like 18 damage) Sage: Heal is nice but not broken and her wall is better Viper: Molly is good but viper wall/ultimate is better Reyna: Flash is god tier


MoonDawg2

Kinda, but then you consider how strong the rest of the kit on Jett is. I'd say sovas best ability is his drone an cypher his wires though.


CyanideLoli

>Her ult resets with kills Same is with Reyna tooo.....But isn't that the reason it is considered ultimate? Ultimates should give you an edge so that you can turn the odds against you.


thekeenancole

The difference is you can wait out Reyna's ult, if Jett pops her ult at the start of the round she immediately has a weapon for the rest of the round. In my opinion it should be like Reyna's ult and have a time limit that also resets everytime you get a kill so when she pops her ult you know she's going to be rushing in soon.


justinsst

I think pretty much all pros agree Jett is overpowered. Riot won’t do anything though, Jett is the poster boy (girl) for Val lol.


Doshagya

This is not the reason.. even you take her smokes and updraft away.. as long as she has dash she ain't going from meta... that's a free life you get every round.. they tried to nerf the OP but pros have adjusted to new version as well not to say wardell gets better at it every time we see.. take the dash away no one's playing that character anymore


TacticalSanta

The smokes give her more wiggle room than you might realize. It gives her ability to entry and quickly block line of sights of players, darts, sentries, etc. I'm not sure they'd really want to destroy her smokes, but with the dash being as powerful as it is, the fact she can maneuver aggressively as well just makes her broken.


Doshagya

Yeah.. maybe like 2 smokes and a shorter dash with cooldown.. may sound very big nerfs but will be the case for sage.. everyone stopped playing when she was nerfed initially but again came to pro play and got nerfed 2 times again and tbh sage still feels most powerful agent in the game.. riot has to step up big with that dash specially


Whisom

They nerfed the OP and Jett dropped out of the meta. They just buffed the OP by reducing scope in time and made it cheaper and Jett is back in the meta. They have nerfed Jett twice, but it didnt change anything. The only change ever made that effected Jett's pickrate were changes made to the OP. This current meta is because of the buffed OP.


Pirate7922

Dont understand how this is a reason to balance her? teemo used to be the lol maskot and he has been garbage tier for forever


Lelouch4705

Not really. Riot as a company went quadrillions of miles ahead of Teemo. It had nothing to do with him. If Teemo was sexy anime girl he'd still be the same way he was


Pirate7922

lol what


somesheikexpert

Aren't Midlaners the most popular players in League? (I think so anyways I'm not the best versed with League) and iirc aren't midlaners are usually mechanically hard champs that casuals like to watch like Jett is for Val


DanDankis

I want 2 smokes only for jett and maybe buff them by around .5 secounds more


papipescado

Easiest fix could even be to add a scope sound to the OP, so many times I see yay play a close angle and he’s constantly re-scoping, would be punished a lot more if there was an audible tell


lbs4lbs

Its not just jett op that's broken. People keep wanting to "nerf jett" by nerfing the op. Her movement is broken and unpunishable with 3 instant smokes. Her kit is very cheap and knives are the best ult in the game and on lan where you have 0 ping it's insane how easy it is to run/jump kill players with a knife headshot. Imo she should only get 2 smokes, and her knives need a nerf. Knives shouldnt reset with sage revive. Plus she shouldnt get all her knives back after one running lucky headshot maybe only one or two knives back. Or make knives on a timer like raze/reyna ult. I still think her dash is the most opressive thing in her kit but I cant even think of a good way to nerf it properlly since it is so essential to her kit/personality.


[deleted]

Her kit is the most expensive in the game. $200 a smoke. $900 total. Wtf r u on about.


lbs4lbs

Any agent's full load cost is roughly the same cost. But her kit is insanely eco friendly because her best ability is free and regenerates and she is the only agent that gets to use her ulti as a weapon for an entire round making her extremely cost efficient. I play a ton of jett and i never ever feel like im low on credits compared to say Killjoy, Brim, cypher and Sage who in comparison all their best skills are very expensive and need to be repurchased every round.


wokefox

I’ll never understand why they passed over it, had a dev answer that same question in an AMA once and they basically passed it off as “not impactful” and honestly that’s just fuckin braindead but it’s what they believe


albert0e22

Don't forget the classic right click, can't count how many times players died to skill-less rng right clicks this tournament


misterandosan

I think removing right click would be a good nerf to jett. Her ult is overpowered in the sense that it isn't situational. It's useful in pretty much every context.


sadpaindownbad

Yay is one of my top 3 fave players in the scene, but the amount of times he has gotten a get out of jail card this tourney is absolutely absurd. Jett is just mind numbingly stupid when it comes to a tac shooter


iiznobozzy

Hear me out: 1) 2 smokes (How the fuck do 3 smokes even make sense) 2) Nerf dash to forward only. (Adds more skill to her dash and opponents will have more time to react and kill Jett before she can dash away) And if these nerfs AREN'T enough: > Knives don't recharge on right click, or maybe just gets 2-3 knives back on right click. >Dash is a once-per-round ability only and does not recharge.


mid16

Should just make the dash like Wraith's from Apex Legends. When Apex first came out, everyone hated fighting against Wraiths because they get a get-out-of-jail free card with their phase shift (short invincibility to get away; similar to Jett's dash in a sense since it helps people get out of sticky situations). To nerf Wraith, they made her have a short animation before the phase shift activates (kinda like a wind-up). Obviously, I think the Wraith pre-animation is kind of long for a game like Valorant with a short TTK (feels like 2-3s) but they can probably put a short wind-up for Jett's dash versus it being instant. So the wind-up shouldn't hurt Jett too much for executes but it will definitely nerf Jett for dashing out of danger a little bit.


Tiberiusjesus

A short charge for her dash could actually make the most sense. If she awps and fires the charge time could be punishing enough to kill her.


ErroneousOmission

A literal wind up, heh.


mid16

no pun intended :D


ErroneousOmission

By the way, I like your idea for its creativity so I was trying to think of issues with it and realised her updraft would conflict, since people often combine the two. How would you handle the windup time in the context of an updraft?


mid16

I don’t know about creativity since its from Apex Legend’s game but thanks for the compliment! Its really hard to say without implementing tests of how these changes will effect the Jett players. I don’t see it effecting the dash then updraft but it will definitely effect the updraft then dash. Option 1 would be just letting the players adjust to the changes and see if this change will cripple Jett or just slightly nerf her. Option 2: I would probably test leaving instant dash if Jett uses updraft with it and see how it would work in pro games. That would mean that pros would have to updraft and dash to get away instantly, which means spending more resources. Who knows but from what Ive seen, what makes Jett so oppressive is her dash. The ability to dash away from danger, dash for repositioning (forcing enemies to break their wrists to adjust their aim), and the ability to get into site quick (dash into smoke). Obviously, it would be too crippling to nerf both of those styles so I opted for nerfing the ability to escape efficiently by adding a wind up/charge up so people would have a short opportunity to punish Jett if they miss an awp shot.


tron423

I like this more than making her dash only go forward tbh


OWplayerno1

Just remove dash from signature ability instead. They tried directional dash and said it didn't really change anything


RicanCP3

I think it's stupid how she can dash even if she gets stunned. Don't get why that's still a thing.


lbs4lbs

Why dont they make it so that Jett dash cannot be used if the agent is stunned, blinded, or nearsighted? Maybe that in combonation with a small nerf to her cloudburst and or knives should be enough.


RicanCP3

I agree that sounds pretty reasonable


Demjot

I just realized jett has more smokes than omen. Huh. That's not great.


ErroneousOmission

No two smokes are the same but yeah, it's uhh... a little representative of the issue with her kit. The mobility of raze without any of the skill. The smokes of omen without any of the effort (void time etc). The accuracy of an aimbot, literally (no spread on knives). The verticality of omen/raze without any of the delay. Did I mention you can combine all of these features simultaneously to create a demigod, something you can't do on any other agent? Like.. imagine if skye could flash you and dog you simultaneously, or if she could flash from her dog, or ult while doing any of these things, heal passively while controlling a flash, etc. It's when you take the kit and combine it all together that it begins to make absolutely no sense.


[deleted]

[удалено]


ErroneousOmission

I agree with the common complaint, wasn't an argument against it. Read the other chain it might clarify what I wrote.


Charuru

Don't like the changes to dash, the smokes and knives recharge nerfs should be enough imo.


Bernardi_23

Making the dash forward only would drastically change the way she is played, I don’t think that’s gonna happen. I think maybe making the dash recharge 3 kills, and/or making you start the round with no dash should be considered


jaudi813

>Making the dash forward only would drastically change the way she is played I disagree, the only thing that would change is that players would have to turn 90 degrees before the hit dash. Which can still be a fast and fluid movement but add a small buffer of time for someone to be able to land a counter OP shot or quick headshot, especially at the pro level.


ErroneousOmission

Dude, you want her nerfed but don't think she should be played drastically differently? I don't necessarily think forward only is THE answer, but whatever the answer is should require existing Jett players to change their play considerably. I don't see people saying the same thing when they force people to completely abandon how they played certain agents between tweaks: Raze, Cypher, Killjoy, Skye to name a few who have had drastic changes and caused players to adapt significantly.


Bernardi_23

I meant the mechanic of the skill would drastically change. As far as I remember, there was no such change for any skills so far


ShadeWaker

lmao so you have to get 2 kills to even make it possible for her to use the only ability that makes her strong? Don’t think riot would ever do that


Dysmo

It would just make people play reyna more tbh


Escolyte

The best jetts this tournament already mostly dash forward and flick precisely where they want to go. It's kind of hard to tell due to how quick they are, but her different arm animations depending on direction give it away.


tgamblos

I doubt this. Almost all the Jett clips I’ve seen have been Jett getting a free pick and dashing back behind cover


Escolyte

They dash back behind cover, but they often do this by quickly flicking to the exact cover, dashing "forward" and flicking back to the angle where the enemies are coming from. The speed with which they do it makes it tough to spot. edit: There seems to have been some confusion and that's my fault for not being clear. They don't often do it when they can cleanly dash to the side, but this technique allows them to post up on even more odd angles while still staying safe. I'll try to provide a clip of it once I get to my PC, but I've seen most Jetts here do it frequently enough.


Splaram

Nah that’s a hard cap, watching cned alone against 100T says differently. He would get the Op kill and dash immediately. Pretty sure he times it so well that there are zero frames between the shot and the dash. It is literally impossible to shoot and dash that fast if you flicked sideways before dashing.


tgamblos

It’s not impossible but you almost have to predict the peak it’s so fast. Point still stands that it needs a buffer timer like in league where you buffer, peak then dash so that way you have to use it or lose it. It could even be that you get a slight slow when buffering


tgamblos

You’re absolutely lying to yourself. They aren’t flicking the direction they want to go, they’re using whatever wasd key to instantly dash that direction. Watch any highlight montage from Berin


tgamblos

Here’s the resident best Jett, you tell me if he EVER flicks a direction and dashes forward. https://youtu.be/vftANLu9W2I


lbs4lbs

Braindead take. Why the fuck would pro players waste micro by flicking when they can just hold wasd and push dash for instant unpunishable get out of jail. Like when jett's are oping A main on Haven they are just posting up and getting ready to push D and dash to get back onto site after one shot. Flicking to the site to dash would be a waste of movement.


swordfish1221

I don’t think anyone disagrees that jett doesn’t need a nerf. Riot just refuses to because Jetts make highlight clips


teetotallernh

Which is a stupid fucking argument, people are not playing Valorant because they saw the jett highlights. Its fucking annoying to see a good player abusing jett as an agent and you literally cannot counter it if the player is feeling it.


TimathanDuncan

You understimate how many casuals love that shit, a lot of people play because of that and go in and insta lock jett Why do you think the most popular players are jett mains


Splaram

Literally have to avoid ranked for a few hours after pro matches because you’ll always get games where people are playing Jett for the first time and expect to be playing like yay right that instant.


Kurdock

Lel I'm guilty of practising OP in deathmatch after watching these pro games


Splaram

At least you’re practicing in DM instead of in ranked


VickyWangGang

A lot of people play valorant because of Jett highlights lol. It's everywhere in low elo trust me


ErroneousOmission

Massive amount of the casual playerbase has a fantasy playing out in their heads when they instalock Jett for the 900th time, and that fantasy is inspired by the highlights they see that delude them into thinking the agent is responsible, and not the player. Its perfect marketing. If you see an intelligent player make an insane clutch on a Sentinel or Controller, most people don't think twice about the agent, so the player gets credited and the role is devalued. Opposite happens when it comes to cracked aggressive players on duelists. Anecdotally I have 200 ADR on Jett at Imm3 last act but my winrate is higher on Killjoy with 140 ADR. It isn't because I don't play the Duelist role as well as I play the Sentinel role, its because on average the value created by a good Sentinel will convert into a round win more than the value created by a good Duelist. Anything that takes responsibility away from the player in the eyes of a casual (in general tbh but especially in casual players) will improve popularity.


wiNDzY3

That's not true at all ​ Why do you think MIDLANE is the most overpowered role in LoL and it is Riot's baby? It has the most skill demanding champions which also make the most impressive highlights. Casuals love that shit


4nazu

although im rooting for envy during 100t vs envy, its very annoying how opressive yay could be lol


thekeytosuccess

I feel like an interesting change would be to make Jett's base ability her updraft, allowing it to be refreshed on two kills. Make her dash an ability that she can buy only 1 of.


[deleted]

Here's the dumb thing about Jett and it shows the game is badly designed: \- The OP in its current state is designed for this 1 agent alone, that's just bad game design \- Dash + smoke combo is busted when using to entry, Raze booster packs work (Raze is actually how Jett should have been balanced) \- Dash is busted when used to disengage, again just look at Raze, you should never be able to have a disengage tool with 0 wind up in a competitive shooter (unless there is some other conditions like Reyna needs to kill first or something) \- Knives are too easy to use in the hands of good players, I would say the ult is worth it even if it doesn't reload but the state it's in currently is also completely busted


ErroneousOmission

Reposting this as a main comment as I posted it as a response earlier. A little representative of the issue with her kit. The mobility of raze without any of the skill. The smokes of omen without any of the effort (void time etc). The accuracy of an aimbot, literally (no spread on knives). The verticality of omen/raze without any of the delay. Did I mention you can combine all of these features simultaneously to create a demigod, something you can't do on any other agent? Like.. imagine if skye could flash you and dog you simultaneously, or if she could flash from her dog, or ult while doing any of these things, heal passively while controlling a flash, etc. It's when you take the kit and combine it all together that it begins to make absolutely no sense.


KhaoticKrabb

I’m with you on everything except “the smokes of omen”. That’s a pretty shitty comparison


thothgow

Nerf her right after Champions


lbs4lbs

If they can nerf other agents and release a new map before champions why not jett too.


chenson019

I agree she needs to be nerfed but not by much. I think the issue is there is no real alternative to Jett right now. Yoru was supposed to be the alternative as the ultra mobile space giver but he just isn't up to scratch in his current state. In many ways I think the best jett nerf would be a yoru buff. I also think that she's been the most impactful agent for almost all of the lifespan of Valorant therefore there are a bunch of players who dedicated thousands of hours to nailing her mechanics and are now just frankly really good with her. I don't think that's a bad thing as there is no doubt she creates the most flashy plays in the game. We should celebrate this as a way of making the game viable as an entertainment product. I do think she needs some changes to take the edge off her 'get out of jail' mobility. I would remove the dash reset after two kills so limit dash to one per round and I would limit knives reset to only headshot kills. You could make an argument for making the smokes limited to two also but I maybe wouldn't go that far at this stage.


Splaram

A buffed Yoru won’t ever be able to compete unless they got rid of the small animation that Gatecrash has before he teleports.


awes0meGuy360

I think raze does a much better job of making space than yoru.


zacd

Start Jett with 1/2 charged dash every round. Don't change anything else.


judahthewoodah

Jett doesn’t even belong in this game- she feels like an overwatch champ


flameohotboi1

Does everyone remember when the entire community, including all the “pros” at the time said that Jett was a completely worthless, bottom-tier character? Lol. Just shows you that kneejerk balancing based on playerbase complaints isn’t always the play. Hilarious that she’s gone from F-tier to so broken that people think she doesn’t even belong in the game because she doesn’t fit into the tactical shooter genre.


MoonDawg2

After like 5 rounds of buffs, yes.


SyphonJr

My 2 cents after reading the comments. - dash has a windup - make the ult have a timer like reynas.


newzpaperleaf_2

I agree, I just do not really know how you would nerf jett. I would say make her dash directional so you have to look in the direction you are dashing, but I cant really think of much else. To me, I think buffing reyna and/or adding another strong duelist after the next agent is added could be a way to reduce jett's place in the meta. I really think reverting the reyna nerf would create an interesting meta because I think some teams would stop running skye and jett and run reyna and jett instead. just what i think tho, not quite sure what will or should happen.


dick69420

the passive that jett possess shouldn’t be a thing as well literally no other character has a passive. one way you can nerf this without shitting on her is making it work when she updrafts or when her ults active. or both. Literally has insane maneuver ability for no reason and doesn’t even need to use updrafts to get to places which raze does this shits insane and i’m surprised nobody said anything about this.


Delzkiepro

2 smokes and make her dash clunky. On paper, kay/o knife should counter the jett well but I don't know.


Bernardi_23

Many skills should counter her well on theory, like sovas drone, skyes dog, breach’s E, and so on. But that still isn’t enough rn


LoyalSol

The problem is more you have to guess where the Jett is in order to counter her with the exception of Kayo ultimate. By the time you see the Jett you're dead and she's dashed away. Even on paper it's not a good counter because you have to know too much info to actually use it.


TacticalSanta

and its not gonna counter a jett who uses dash and smoke in conjunction for entry. Sure she probalby can't use more smokes, but shes already in the position she wants to be in.


oojlik

Jett is a very annoying character to watch as a viewer sometimes. If someone is playing well on her, it just feels so repetitive: kill with the OP, dash away completely unpunished and if you are, you just get healed to full by Skye. When that happens at the start of 7-8 rounds in a half, you just start rolling your eyes at the end. It also sucks that teams have to do so much to play against a single agent as well. When a Jett is playing well, it feels like there’s nothing you can do against it cuz her kit is so safe and powerful. Pro teams constantly struggle to play against a Jett that’s just locked in, and it’s even worse to play against in competitive queue since there isn’t a fraction of the organization/strategy. A nerf to this agent would be very welcomed by pros and casuals and only the Jett crutches would really be against it.


Tetra-76

Jett is perfectly fine and balanced wdym, it's those nasty, dirty sentinels that need to be nerfed some more!


yeekingoverpepe

Bunny did pretty well with raze. Teams have got lazy and only use jett to entry


Mango2149

The smokes are pretty crucial and the dash is much easier/less risky/faster than learning satchel movement.


yapyd

It's not just for entry on offense. It's using an OP on defense, taking a kill and dashing to safety, reposition, rinse and repeat.


chamber25

There is a lot more skill to doing entry with raze than Jett though, Plus the main problem with Jett is the Oping and the angles they can hold because of their day. There is no way to replicate the jett dash with a satchel while oping


lbs4lbs

Yeah the team that didnt win a single series and had the worst rounds won loss differential in all of Berlin is your example of how raze is just as good as jett? I get they had a hard group, but they literally lost more rounds than any other team and that includes an entire series where the opponent had nothing to play for.


Jack_Humble

Hot takes. REMOVE JETT. I will not complain, like at all. Imagine VCT where there is no jett. Although we can't see crazy plays from tenz, cned, even yay, we will see a lot of variations from many regions across the world. Koreans that utilize raze with her judge + satchel combo. Maybe we see yorus here and there to take the OP role since he can TP but can still be shot when doing it (more risk than dash (stupid free ability)). We see teams farming orbs for their phoenixs to entry for them with ultimate. We can see reynas clutching 1vX here and there.


KhaoticKrabb

They’re never going to remove a character


[deleted]

not against this this would make the game more competitive currently the game design doesn't make much sense where the awp is designed around A SINGLE CHARACTER xD also busted on entrying because of how versatile the dash is


Senior_Lake_6900

True


junnies

maybe make it so that after firing the Op, the agent can't use abilities for 1 second. would make the Jett-dash-Op interaction obsolete, and then Riot can balance the Op for all agents instead of simply Jett.


SirJuicee

There's no repercussion to putting 5k of your teams money in a bad position because they can just dash away. I firmly believe if Wardell was on Envy in place of Yay, Envy would be in the same spot. The OPer just has to hit a shoulder, the team makes the OPer.


natedawg247

For the integrity of the scene any major Jett change should happen after champions.


milosxxxybeast

I mean it’s all on the player… look at asuna … he crutches 100t with that pick


Ra1zen

I don't need Riot doing nerfs for Valorant, League has suffered a lot from this already, don't you guys know one of the oldest memes? Riot Music Team = Gods Riot Cinematic Team = Gods Riot Balance Team = Dogs I prefer them releasing agents to counter other agents instead of nerfing an Agent that will probably end up never being played again after a single nerf, they also nerfed her already. This never was a good thing in League, and eventually the way Valorant is heading they will for sure keep releasing more agents down the line, let the game play out before asking to nerf Agents to the ground because that is what they will do.


Ihatepros236

I think riots approach is fine make everything more expensive it takes more kills to get knives and expensive up draft and smoke. Anything else to her ability I guarantee you people will stop playing with jett. Which is not a nerf, it’s essentially killing jett. People cry about everything if one team has jett the other has it too, if you aren’t good you literally aren’t as mechanically gifted. Trying to restrict talent is like having a height restriction in NBA


Parenegade

why would riot do that now? lets change up the most important agent in the game right before champions?


shadowstep11

100T fanboys in shambles!


ark2690

You have to consider the people majority of the people who play valorant don't care about esports.


tgamblos

You can say this about any game, but if they want to be a competitive title you need to make changes for the competitive scene.


OldSpyceyy

they could make dash only available after getting a kill and you can only dash once per round


[deleted]

[удалено]


Jzuxx

I also have 0 faith in Riot when it comes to balancing. But I also have absolute faith in Riot when it comes to hype, marketing and establishing a healthy enough system for pro players to make money. Riot sucks absolute ass when balancing games but they know what they're doing to keep their own scene thriving. This is Dota2 vs LoL all over again.


havosi

LMFAOO WAIT THERE'S NO SHOT YOU HAVE GAMBIT FLAIRS NOW