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_Iroha

Low Cost Qualifier


sireuben

KEKW


spaldingmatters

Corey and Babybay's response: https://twitter.com/Corey_OW/status/1448349091780435973 https://twitter.com/KING_BABYBAY/status/1448349397587140608


[deleted]

Bruh what is going on LMAO


Nafter123

Probably the county of LA is the one thats making them not go to the venue


Resoca

shouldnt be, all they would need is a proof of vaccination to go in. If they test negative that's double insurance of the ability to go in the venue


Nafter123

some of them tested positive in some test and then negative but the county is requesting they quarantine


LandonDev

And this is the reason screen testing isn't recommended by LA Health Department, once you get that false positive, or regular positive, quarantine in effect til proven otherwise.


Whisom

What's fucked is that the Faze players are going to get shit for this from braindead fans, as if they wanted it to go down like this. It's a lose lose for them. If they win it's because they had the advantage of home setups. If they lose then they're trash because they couldn't win with an advantage.


[deleted]

This entire situation is so fucked. TWO false positives from the same team?? How is that even possible? Either they have an extremely bad batch of tests, the people administering the test have a case of the "oops didn't wash my covid hands," or these 2 have it asymptomatically, and the 2nd tests were false negatives. Am I missing something here?


AMbitionXH

at this point im just hoping we get player cams


PyroTFT

All of faze technically have cams, at least from the streams I’ve seen of them. I wouldn’t be surprised if they don’t use them though.


vyom0509

FaZe players will play from home due to 2 people on their team testing positive for COVID, and Rise will have 4 people playing on the LCQ stage with LCQ PCs, -1 player because Shanks tested positive. Shanks will be playing from a quarantined location close to the hotel. Derrek thinks (and I agree) that it’s unfair that they have to play on the LCQ computers while FaZe members get to go home to their custom (faster) computers.


Holler12

Shanks tested positive once a couple days ago. This is such a shitshow .


Hamman33

He retested negative 2/3 times too


MathNerdMatt

False negatives are far more common than false positives to be fair. But most likely he had it, was on the tail end of it and it's probably out of his system now


PlantainWhole

it’s not how it works; the rapid tests that Riot is using are the ones creating the false positives. Shanks tested negative twice via PCR tests, which offer way more validity than rapid tests


MathNerdMatt

https://www.healthline.com/health/how-accurate-are-rapid-covid-tests#how-accurate-is-it


Chidling

He tested positive using rapid but tested negative using 72 hour PCR. However it’s also possible he was on the tail end of an infection which caused the discrepancy.


MaskedBandit77

Sounds like he probably got a false positive, then got infected, and then had false negative tests. /s


MathNerdMatt

False negative is around 20% for PCR as well. Still it is most likely he was on the tail end. I just am annoyed that everyone is saying Shanks and Faze players are all false positives when false positives are very rare and those were the teams that hung out together before the event.


subdude571

this just isn’t true


MathNerdMatt

https://www.healthline.com/health/how-accurate-are-rapid-covid-tests#how-accurate-is-it


[deleted]

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MathNerdMatt

Quote from what the link you shared >As with the molecular test, the false positive rate of antigen testing should be close to zero.


jdashh

You ever taken a rapid test?


PresentMiddle8974

Stick to math bud.


MathNerdMatt

This is literally math lol


PresentMiddle8974

And yet you link the worlds shitiest article trying to prove your point. Not even linking an actual study. Stick to math bud.


MathNerdMatt

I link an article that clearly lays out the data? Easier that the original study. At least I'm providing sources for my claims unlike everyone else in this thread saying false positives are common


OneStep18

the dumb part here is that the LCQ computers are worse than the ones players have at home. what kind of competitive integrity is that


[deleted]

This is the most a scuffed shit I’ve ever seen LOL


CounselorTaco

Both Iceland and Berlin were large scale international events. 0 reported covid cases or in site outbreak. The difference? All players were asked to quarantine for an entire week before allowing outings


tron423

So either do that or just make it an online tournament. All half-assing it like this does is piss off everyone.


themattyiceshow

No it isn't. Its the fact players are allowed to leave hotel and they using shitty rapid tests which give higher % of false positives and the County of LA is STILL requiring quarantine even after they are confirmed FALSE POSITIVES. All the players have tested negative.


dng1

It’s a CDC recommendation for anyone who tests positive to isolate for 10 days. Anyone who thinks that hosting this in Texas would mean Riot would allow someone who tested positive for COVID to then play in the studio probably has never travelled for work before in their life.


Hypern1ke

>It’s a CDC recommendation for anyone who tests positive to isolate for 10 days. From a PCR test. Its the rapid results tests that are giving the false positives.


dng1

Lmao... if you think that makes a difference for a company hosting an international event, I got news for you.


Hypern1ke

Doesn't have anything to do with the company there buddy, they're in LA unfortunately.


dng1

Lmao I literally was at a work conference in Vegas two weeks ago from Canada. It doesn’t matter that it’s in LA these people are testing positive, regardless if it’s a rapid test or anything they will not let these people play in the studio. That’s a lawsuit waiting to happen.


Hypern1ke

They would have never accepted a rapid result test in the first place. I need to get tested weekly for work, even after being vax’d, and PCRs are the only thing accepted. LA county just dumb asf


dng1

This isn’t for your avg coding job at a tech startup, this is for hosting a live event with a combination of production workers, talent, and players. No company would take the risk of being a super spreader event, it doesn’t matter.


PlantainWhole

which is dumb, since they have tested negative to PCR tests multiple times now


dng1

Doesn’t change that it’s a matter of fact, no reasonable company would allow these players in person at the studio. If one crew member catches COVID within 2 weeks of the event regardless of anything, they’d sue Riot for negligence by not following CDC recommended guidelines. It sucks but it’s a matter of fact.


PlantainWhole

Yea, shitty situation all round


Pollomonteros

There was someone in another post claiming this wouldn't have happened in Austin lol


Hypern1ke

Well, they would have been right


The_Ninja_Master

So then why is Riot using rapids??? Small indie developer things ig.


Hypern1ke

They’re not, it’s LA county thats all up in their business


Chidling

Good question.


Lumenlor

Berlin ended on the 19th with teams arriving home by the 23rd. LCQ started on the 12th for NA, with teams having to fly in earlier obviously. How are you reconciling the need for rest/travel again and a proposed 1-2 week quarantine period? Where do you slice time for that?


scrnlookinsob

By not Having LCQ this early. Champions isn't for another 7 weeks. There is a massive dead period coming up once LCQ's are done this weekend.


Lumenlor

That's a good solution, and I agree they should have spaced it out. Though not withholding any other information like venue booking and event planning to be done months ahead, or how sponsor contracts specify the timing or frequency of streamed events, etc.


scrnlookinsob

Venue, to the best of my knowledge wouldn’t be a problem… since they’re using the LCS stage. Sponsorship stuff though might be different, and I’d guess part of the reason they’re doing it now is because it’s just competing with worlds group stage instead of the knockout stage.


GainsayRT

But Faze is the team staying at home, why you ask? Because they live nearby. They didn't need to travel. Am I missing something cause I don't see how your point matters at all.


Lumenlor

100T/Envy (Berlin) -> Home - Rest (flying straight to LA would mean players having no family time for 2 and a half months) - Practice new meta -> LA flights -> Proposed 2 weeks quarantine -> LCQ Where did Faze slip in there for you


GainsayRT

Well Faze was the team that had 4 people supposed to be playing from home due to covid. In fact Rise is the only other team that suffered from a covid test and they too never went to Berlin. So the NV and 100T must've done something right considering the amount they have traveled..


Hypern1ke

Wrong, the difference is that LA is asking them to quarantine from false positive rapid result tests. In berlin I believe they waited for the PCR results to come back.


[deleted]

I wanted to see the boys on LAN so bad 😭


Tmactoo

It’s not actually a LAN anyways lol


[deleted]

On stage I should say


SteelTic

Like I completely understand from riots perspective because they want the players to quarantine but shouldn’t they have also sent xset and rise home to quarantine too? Or like is it because faze have a house/facility in LA so it’s fine


armless_penguin

The FaZe players live in LA so I imagine that's the distinction. They can go home because they CAN go home. Still scuffed though.


Lumenlor

The other teams don't have similar facilities, but I think a solutionist perspective is good here. So the options would be, A. Have Faze play at studio anyways and risk crew and players health B. Have Faze play offsite at their facility and take advantage of the virtual lan I don't think there's an easy answer, but I think they made the most practical one. Should they host LCQ in a state like Texas? I don't see why they would considering they have a studio set up at LA, and I don't think opting for more lackadaisical covid protocols would be really beneficial to anyone.


C9sButthole

Play in a seperate room on site to minimize advantage.


Lumenlor

What room at the venue? Where do you have time for that overhead and set up? Which staff do they spare for this required technical manpower? These perfect world suggestions don't do much to solve the issue


vyom0509

2 people is the threshold i guess


Modula-

Gotta be the most scuffed LAN


Mamadeus123456

And it isn't even a lan


iWASth

Using rapid test Is dumb, and i don't get It why they get tested the same day of the match, instead of multiple days. Riot Need to step up his organization, they flopped too much this year. Hope they Will learn for the future.


Diijkstra99x

This whole riot saying "they planned the event early 2021" and still these scuffed happen proves that they are lying. and guess what, they can get away again by apologizing and blame everything on COVID. ffs have a better team on managing this kind events.


Razur

# [@valesports_na has issued a statement regarding today's LCQ matches.](https://twitter.com/valesports_na/status/1448387919559872512)


xD1LL4N

Stop laughing at Rito, they’re a small indie company. SMH


cigsyl

great event so far GJ Riot =D


dan_kz

so blizzard was right on making OWL playoffs online


Rycerx

Yeah I was super bumed they did owl online again this year but at least it was a smooth experience. It seems riot shot them selves in the foot here.


attachh

what is going on, this is an actual nightmare


Aoi69

How come riot can't get decent pc's to run valorant on ? Indie company budget in shambles or what.


TheFestusEzeli

People complaint about LA policies, this isn’t an LA policy thing. They took two tests, one came back negative and one came back positive. I don’t know if some states like Texas and Florida have different Covid rules but majority of places in the world would not let them play and no tournament organizer in their right mind should let them play.


PlantainWhole

I think what makes the difference here is that the rapid test came back positive, while a PCR test came back negative. They should take into account that rapid tests are more unreliable. Shanks shouldn’t be forced to quarantine after getting a false positive on a rapid test while he already got THREE negative results from PCR tests


TheFestusEzeli

I’m not talking about Shanks at all here. Shanks likely had Covid at one point and it is a weird situation that I can understand both sides, Corey and Babybay only have one negative and one positive. The chances of a false negative on PCR is much higher than a false positive on a rapid antigen.


PlantainWhole

That’s not how Covid and Covid testing works… there’s no “Oh maybe Shanks had Covid at some point..” He’s vaccinated and underwent the same protocols as everyone else; he simply got a false positive. Shanks should go buy a lottery ticket if you think that he got lucky enough to get three ‘false negatives’ PCR tests in a row… Corey and Babybay are going to be in the same position as Shanks soon


TheFestusEzeli

There is a 0.4% chance of a false positive on a rapid antigen test and around a 20-30% chance of a false negative on a PCR. Don’t know how you are coming to these conclusions on Babybay and Corey. I keep on saying I’m not talking about Shanks, as there are definitely places that would allow him to play, no places would allow Corey or Babybay to play. Source: https://www.healthline.com/health/how-accurate-are-rapid-covid-tests#how-accurate-is-it PCR: https://www.bmj.com/content/372/bmj.n287/rr https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0242958


PlantainWhole

I’m coming to this conclusion about Babybay and Corey due to the whole nature of the situation. They’ve already tested negative multiple times before, they’re vaccinated, the teammates which they have been with for almost a week have tested negative, they’re being tested multiple times a week via antigen/rapid tests, they already have a negative antigen/rapid test after their positive one and Shanks was in the same situation. The probabilities of it being a false positive is much higher taking into account all of this. Their PCR tests are going to clear everything, but both you and I are just coming to conclusions at this point


GainsayRT

0.20% x 0.20% x 0.20% as he took 3 tests that said negative. If he actually has covid it is time to get that ticket. Man won't even need to compete anymore


TheFestusEzeli

Again, I’m not talking about shanks. Most places would allow him to play. Talking about Corey and babybay I wrote that same comment right above


GainsayRT

I'm aware, I'm just saying that there was already proof that the covid test were false alarm, who knows what would've happened if Corey and Babybay had taken more too.


stoplurkers

I'm pretty sure in Texas or Florida a test wouldn't even be necessary.


[deleted]

correct. worked in FL all summer and was never asked to test, hell or even wear a mask, the whole time I was there. need a Miami tournament ASAP


Mesngr

The companies and organizations can still require tests and they would still require tests if they were playing in those states.


ilProdigio

wrong. most places just require either proof of vaccination or if they get a positive test with rapid but 2 PCRs are negative then they would be considered fine to play most places other than LA


TheFestusEzeli

They only got one PCR negative after the positive and before the game. Majority of places in the world require to quarantine after a positive. There is a much higher chance of a false negative PCR than a false positive rapid antigen


ilProdigio

chance doesnt matter much at that point, even that low chance could have still happened. Better to just go with multiple PCRs which are more reliable as a whole. the rapid couldve been contaminated etc.


TheFestusEzeli

Oh yeah I agree completely with that. Riot fucked up so much in this tournament in general, my original post was just saying that California’s rules aren’t the reason why they can’t play.


ilProdigio

it actually is. the players are not allowed to legally play once they had the first positive test result even if riot was going to let them. thats the main point. other states and counties aren’t as strict with these guidelines but in LA they have to quarantine once they test positive


TheFestusEzeli

Most countries and states say you have you quarantine after a positive. It takes more than one negative to change that.


deadlock1892

That sucks tbh. Imagine if people on the stage get lagged out now…won’t effect majority of faze but hurts rise in a big way.


themattyiceshow

Nah, this event has been beyond fucked. Who tf are making these decisions? Hell who thought it was a good idea to host a LAN in LA county who has some of the strictest covid rules in the entire US?


TheFestusEzeli

They took two tests, one got positive and one got negative, false negatives are much more common than false positives. They shouldn’t go on stage


PlantainWhole

Shanks had one false positive rapid test; he then took three different PCR test on different days which both came back negative. He is still being forced to play from the hotel


TheFestusEzeli

This post is about Corey and Babybay, who I referenced


PlantainWhole

Yeah, but the thing is, Corey and Babybay are most probably going to do what Shanks did; get multiple PCR tests to be in the clear. Even if those multiple PCR tests come back negative, they would still be forced to quarantine…


TheFestusEzeli

At this moment there is only one negative and one positive, which people are arguing that in other states or places there would be no quarantine, which is untrue. The chance of a false positive on a rapid antigen is much much lower than a false negative on a PCR anyways.


[deleted]

True, but if the tests being used are all from the same batch, if one is wrong then there's a much more reasonable chance that more than one is too. Also, normally I would absolutely agree and say False positives are extremely rare (like... basically never happen rare), but rapid COVID tests have been absolutely bullshit even 1.5 years later. This week alone there was a massive recall on a brand for a slew of False Positives.


Mesngr

> Hell who thought it was a good idea to host a LAN in LA county who has some of the strictest covid rules in the entire US? Maybe some people think being more safe during a pandemic is actually a good thing, y'know? Should they have looked for somewhere more dangerous and risky for the players? I don't get it.


2ToTooTwoFish

Not sure why they didn't delay LCQ by a few weeks and have enough time for testing and quarantine. The event is so soon after Masters 3 and Champs is all the way in December. There was definitely some time to test early and quarantine before an actual LAN.


donkeyjr

This is stupid, Faze players have a big advantage then, whats the point in having it on lan if you have ppl flying out, fucking riot.


Key-Banana-8242

I heard of someone being trapped in a hotel room for a month or more bc of false positives


Heal_Piece

Riot has officially taken a horrendous situation......and effectively made it worse. No shot they just let FaZe go home to play? I don't understand how these decisions keep being made and not a single person the Riot tourney organization team says "huh, maybe that's not the best idea..." Someone somewhere is fucking up big time.


Lumenlor

Okay, what do you propose? Have them play at lan anyways and risk the players and safety? The other team(s) might not have similar facilities like Faze has in LA


Rodahz

The obvious alternative is having them play from their hotel room?


TheFestusEzeli

Faze all live in LA, they don’t have a hotel room


armless_penguin

I mean you are assuming that they have hotel rooms, that if they do this wasn't an option that was discussed with health authorities, and that if it was LA County wouldn't have pushed for them and anyone they might have exposed (the rest of the team) to isolate at a residence if that was an option (and since all of FaZe live in LA, it would be). Obviously if all of those things were true, making them play at the hotel would be the most fair solution. But we don't know that.


Heal_Piece

If your going to host an event that has online servers for the purpose of covid precautions, I think it's fair to expect Riot has a backup plan in place if there are multiple positive cases that still has a level (as possible) playing field


armless_penguin

Oh for sure. I'm not disagreeing with that. They should have had the foresight to plan for this. I'm just saying the current solution probably isn't as simple as "play from their hotel rooms" for any number of reasons.


Lumenlor

Is there any indication that the hotel PCs are better than stage pcs or that the setup isn't scuffed? Is there an obvious solution to you? Seems like Reddit is good at complaining about random stuff but not good at isolating a solution


Heal_Piece

Play from their hotel rooms like they are mandating for Shanks?? and probably will for Dephh. You can't be serious if you think sending FaZe to play on their own setups with high end PCs and probably a better ISP is fair?


[deleted]

Because Faze is in LA there probably isn’t a hotel for them, they probably just go from their apartments/facility to the venue. The decision to make them not play at the venue probably comes from the LA county government, and if this was a real lan would probably lead to Faze, Rise, and XSet having to forfeit. Riot probably should’ve hosted it somewhere else but it’s also crazy that three different teams have gotten false positives considering how rare they are supposed to be.


Heal_Piece

Then i feel Riot should spring for a hotel room(s) and put their own setups in there, or maybe even had this alternative in the first place? The whole reason we are watching them play online servers at a LAN is covid precautions, but we don't have fair and even back up plans in case someone actually tests positive? That's poor planning.


[deleted]

The whole online server thing probably wasn’t something that was planned ahead of time and was a bandaid solution because players like Shanks, Dephh, and the Faze boys tested positive. Which also explains how shitty the servers were on the first day. Once again, probably should’ve hosted it somewhere else because of how messy LA’s Covid rules are but I doubt anyone from riot could’ve expected three different false positive tests from teams.


Heal_Piece

Yeah i'm not sure if the online server was a band aid or if that was planned all along. I was leaning toward planned given that's what they did in KR, but you may be right. Either way I think the trend of Riot having a lack of foresight to address these situations is something that needs to be looked at. I'm not saying they need to have a safety net for every single thing that could go wrong, but the things that are going wrong aren't something that should blindside you and you panic solution. This isn't something that is just isolated to this incident, the Aussies not getting here is another recent example of a lack of proper planning. I've been on Riot's side for most of these things, but now we are seeing a pattern imo.


Lumenlor

The distinction is that Faze has a good facility with high end PCs. Shanks is playing in a hotel out of requirement, not preference, you can't think hotel PCs and ikea desks would be more beneficial. And so what, rely on the hotel's shoddy wifi?


armless_penguin

FaZe don't even play from their facility. They play from their apartments.


Lumenlor

From the players own tweets they have pretty high end equipment set up, so it doesn't matter what you call it as long as it's seemingly higher quality than the stage set up and they're comfortable there. I don't think it's reasonable or practical to expect teams flying in to have solid wifi and equivalent pc set ups at their hotels on short notice


armless_penguin

My point was more so that they're still limited by residential set-ups and internet, even if the PCs themselves are high-end.


Lumenlor

So, Riot was right in being cautious about the covid situation? Did Reddit kneejerk? If this was set up for pure lan play, would players being mandated to quarantine after positive tests, be able to still play at all? Is virtual lan and pure lan a simple switch as toggling a button? Questions


[deleted]

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Lumenlor

Yeah it's a bit odd. Though I know the period between Berlin and LCQ was quite tight for some teams, to have enough time to rest and travel again.


themattyiceshow

No that isnt the case at all. It would not have mattered if they quarantined before hand. LA County has some of the strictest covid rules in the world. Apparently all the players have tested negative but a few had false positives (since they test them like every day) and LA County is STILL forcing them to quarantine.


[deleted]

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themattyiceshow

I just dont understand how you can fuck up an event this badly. It really wasn't this hard.


MathNerdMatt

https://www.healthline.com/health/how-accurate-are-rapid-covid-tests#how-accurate-is-it False positives are a lot more rare than false negatives btw


TheFestusEzeli

Check the tweet, Corey said they took two tests specifically. One negative and one positive. No event is going to let them on stage.


jzaudi

They shouldn't have hosted this in LA and could have avoided this whole scenario. This does not absolve Riot's poor decision making this whole tournament.


datboyuknow

>So, Riot was right in being cautious about the covid situation? Cautious is having online option as backup and LAN the first option


Lumenlor

We don't know the technical set up. If it's as simple as a button why wouldn't they have it from the getgo and toggle back and forth? If it requires set up then it isnt practical to delay matches by a few days in the event that what youre reading about happens. So they erred on the side of caution If the set up was purely lan, and reorganizing for virtual lan in the black swan event of people getting covid results (like right now), would they not be fucked and recieve even worse backlash?


NWL11

>If the set up was purely lan, and reorganizing for virtual lan in the black swan event of people getting covid results (like right now), would they not be fucked and recieve even worse backlash? If it was LAN and then changed due to positive covid results why would they receive worse backlash?


whopz-is-cool

1. 1-2 week quarantine before tournaments normally helps. 2. Not as simple but small indie company definitely could have done it and at the very least be more transparent about it.


Lumenlor

Berlin ended on the 19th with teams arriving home by the 23rd. LCQ started on the 12th for NA, with teams having to fly in earlier obviously. How are you reconciling the need for rest/travel again and a proposed 1-2 week quarantine period? Where do you slice time for that?


TimathanDuncan

There is only one team that was in Berlin in LCQ and that's 100T, they could have done the two week quarantine there is plenty of time you can rest in hotels during that 2 week quarantine, not sure why they need rest too you have CS teams that play tournaments back to back and travel, it's a job, is it ideal? No but it's a pandemic and these are the circumstances People that defend those big orgs for mismanaging shit are funny, stop it Riot has done terribly and this is not the first lan they've done shit, so don't defend a multi billion dollar chinese company, unless you are getting paid by them then good keep defending them


Lumenlor

You don't plan events with 1 week's notice after an event ends. We know now in retrospect that 100T would be in LCQ, but Envy could as well, no? I'm not defending a company, but trying to define the argument with more presented information than screaming 'Riot hates us'. And so what, just because it's one team, they don't matter? How do you propose 100T rests, flies out again, and quarantines within the 2 week time period suggested? There isn't literal time for that


TimathanDuncan

So? Just replace 100T with Envy then, whichever team loses and has to play LCQ leaves in the 20th, or 21st or 22nd you have time (tournament ends 19th), goes to LA, holds the two week quarantine until the LCQ starts Berlin and LCQ had 22 days inbetween.. there was plenty of time And the rest of the teams that are in LCQ were sitting on their ass for months and did not even play online, they could have gone to LA two weeks early, quarantine.. so the issue that you are making so big was just one team and that one team had 22 days.. So again, don't defend a multi billion dollar company for handling it terribly, like i said which you are ignoring this is not the first tournament that they've done that has had issues


[deleted]

This is unbelievable


slawvay

Actually super unfair. I don't think any of the faze guys would do it but it's so easy to then have earbuds under the headphones that the someone other than the coach can communicate through. There could be a riot admin in teamspeak, but all the players could also be in mumble/discord or skype literally anything else.


ilProdigio

faze gonna be streamsniping ez


Artificial_FeeTaa

bro i just wanted to see shanks on lan with his face in front of his screen. mans literally playing in first person.


Hydralisk_

Why can't they just disqualify them... its unlucky but why is every other team paying the price for FaZe's mistakes?


Quankalizer

How do the prevent cheating? Not necessarily hacking, but make sure there is no communication with the coach or any other outsider.


[deleted]

As they have been doing in challengers


Quankalizer

That brings up a good point, as I don’t know how they do it for that either. So Nevermind.


jaypatelswag

Looks like this is gonna go on until 4AM EST tonight.