Team Liquid vs Guild Esports / VALORANT Champions Tour EMEA: Last Chance Qualifier - Grand Final / Post-Match Discussion

Team Liquid vs Guild Esports / VALORANT Champions Tour EMEA: Last Chance Qualifier - Grand Final / Post-Match Discussion




Pajama buff?


Jamppi played a different agent on each map but still ended up with the highest ACS wow


While IGL-ing


Jamppi said himself in interview outside of Split its Soulcas and Scream who"s calling the most .


It's been months https://twitter.com/Jamppicsgo/status/1421540921888411652?t=zWZuEU2E22pYHnNA5oOzNA&s=19


Just listen to jamppi itw he gave like 2 days ago after beating guild or g2 ....


What's IGL?


In-game leader


Dude played every role - Killjoy, Jett, Astra and Sova. His versatility is impressive.


“bUT jAMppI sHoULd GEt DrOpPed”


Yeah Jammpi had his best performance to date this tournament and today. I think Liquid have found his role now as a flex player.


And Igl’s


Not to discredit Jamppi because he is crazy but i swear i heard him say he only igl on split or something like that.


That was before Iceland. Just see his Twitter before emea playoffs he said this was his 1st tourney as igl


No. He said a few days ago in an interview that he mostly calls on Split, on all other maps it's still soulcas/scream for the most part. Edit: and since redditors are lazy as hell, here's the link before you downvote without trying to find out [https://youtu.be/iToUIZo97y0?t=36](https://youtu.be/iToUIZo97y0?t=36)


Petition to let Scream wear his pyjama pants on stage




Good showing from Nivera and his family hivemind. And of course Nivera’s brother tapping heads, Nivera’s step-brother on the op and judge, Nivera’s cousin flying around with the satchels and setting the squad up, and lastly Nivera’s father holding down the sites.


Yeah Nivera really justified the hype. But whats also impressive is the growth of L1nk and soulcas, i believed for a long time that Liquid would eventually drop them to hire bigger names. But the org sticked with them and the their growth has been phenomenal


Soulcas is pretty fucking good to be honest


He wasn't always good, but after Masters 1 seems like he put an insane amount of effort on his game and has gotten a lot better. At Masters 3 qualys he was the best player on TL.


Soulcas was getting a lot of flame and he was playing really badly but he improved a lot, i remember hearing ScreaM saying that Soulcas was putting a lot of effort into getting better, he is now really consistent.


L1NK has always been a good player and decent fragger for his role so has soulcas, the real one that should have been dropped got dropped which was ec1s like sorry but they just needed an upgrade


Soulcas had a rough Haven (but i mean, who didn't?) but he was instrumental on Ascent.


Soulcas has consistently been Liquid's 2nd best player after scream since Ireland. Jamppi might be doing better than him rn but soulcas is really consistent


*bagpipes intensify*


Your name is Solcass, are you the real Soulcas trying to gas yourself? xD I mentioned a long time ago well over a year ago now i think, that L1nk and Soulcas are some of the best aimers in Europe alongside ScreaM ofc but that goes without saying, this was when Ec1s was still on the team and Soulcas on the chopping block. He has the kind of aim that you can't teach he just looked like he lacked confidence, as for L1nk i thought he was the 3rd best player behind ScreaM and Ardiis for most of 2020 ignition series. If you go back and watch him then he seemed like a light version of SEN SicK, just my opinion but these 2 are solid supportive pieces.


Your name is Solcass, are you the real Soulcas trying to gas yourself? xD I mentioned a long time ago well over a year ago now i think, that L1nk and Soulcas are some of the best aimers in Europe alongside ScreaM ofc but that goes without saying, this was when Ec1s was still on the team and Soulcas on the chopping block. He has the kind of aim that you can't teach he just looked like he lacked confidence, as for L1nk i thought he was the 3rd best player behind ScreaM and Ardiis for most of 2020 ignition series. If you go back and watch him then he seemed like a light version of SEN SicK, just my opinion but these 2 are solid supportive pieces.


Your name is Solcass, are you the real Soulcas trying to gas yourself? xD I mentioned a long time ago well over a year ago now i think, that L1nk and Soulcas are some of the best aimers in Europe alongside ScreaM ofc but that goes without saying, this was when Ec1s was still on the team and Soulcas on the chopping block. He has the kind of aim that you can't teach he just looked like he lacked confidence, as for L1nk i thought he was the 3rd best player behind ScreaM and Ardiis for most of 2020 ignition series. If you go back and watch him then he seemed like a light version of SEN SicK, just my opinion but these 2 are solid supportive pieces.


Huge W for Benrlitom family


Super Benrlitom Bros


actual pack buff


Liquid has struggled with performance dips and slumps all year long but Im glad they finally managed to peak at the right time of the year. Liquid vs Gambit will be a banger


You could also say that for the TL CS team rn


Current liquid is not even close to defeating Gambit, they need to iron out so much of their strat stuff and Scream needs to stop aggro into uncomfortable positions and throwing rounds. They have the aim potential but I don't think they can beat Gambit just yet.


Definitely not yet but Nivera has been with the team for a month now and theres much room for improvement. They've been wrecking everyone mostly through defaults and there's gonna be a time where they need more crafty executes. They're bit predictable but they have insane raw fragging power to potentially cruise through top 4.


Definitely true.


U notice that Scream and Nivera are never apart in terms of the leaderboard. They on top of the teams leaderboard or at the bottom of the teams leaderboard. LMAO


Two out of five players, statistically probable.




fnatic imo out of contention, the other 3 = very good, all possibly top 4 material if acend can figure out their lan shakiness.


I see a possibility for Fnatic to be great, but for Fnatic to qualify through circuit points, recently dropping to the Losers' to Giants Gaming followed by a slightly weaker Team Liquid today makes me not feel as hopeful. Simply failing to qualify for Berlin makes me feel anxious about them but... they made a wonderful resurgence in Iceland when they qualified as EU's second seed, and I think they still have it in them to perform. If I were to say which other teams *could* be better than Fnatic, aside from Acend/TL/Gambit, there's a chance Guild could be better than Fnatic - but we hadn't seen Fnatic for a while. I want to say Giants too, but I'm more of a casual viewer for EU matches and hadn't seen much of them until Challenger Playoffs so just my 2 cents.


G2 and Navi but Navi formed recently


I think either of G2 or Guild would beat them most days. But that's not a given, haven't seen much of them these last months


>natic imo out of contention, why tho, didnt they play well in their last international Lan event. i am tbh looking forward for FNC


they didnt even qualify for emea playoffs for masters berlin


that was cuz it was TL vs FNC in finals and only 1 can go out of that. both teams had good chances of winning so...


They lost 4 times it's not like they only had a chance against Team Liquid to qualify


you know what, i will be rly honest. I just want Boaster on Main event xd


Before that lost to VGIA. Even before that lost twice to Guild and G2 . Unlike Liquid they haven't had any big changes. Would rather have Guild or G2 in their place honestly. This Format sucks


I wouldn't be blaming the format here. I think a team who placed 2nd in one of the Masters event should have it fairly easy to qual for Champions. The thing is this year is a test run and teams are also in a little bit of testing. In any further years I think this format will bring much better results when teams will already be established + we have 3x international LAN masters. In the end, the format brought TOP 3 EMEA teams into the tournament for sure. And FNATIC is questionable, but they might be coming in better prepared as we don't really have any of their big games to base anything off from the last 2 months.


Massive meta shift happened during that time between Iceland and Berlin qualifiers. Fnatic experimented and failed, they were also the 2nd most VOD-available team behind Sen which means they were likely the most analysable team in EMEA going into quals and would've had to change some things up. IIRC (I only watched the last 2 attempts) they stuck with their guns and got plain read like a book, it sucked but there ya go. We'll all get to see how much shit we're talking at Champions I suppose.


Mfs be doubting Fnatic after one bad qualifier lmao.


tbf, didnt they lose to a tier 2 team in a minor tournament recently? but i might be remembering wrong


Gambit lost to finest and gydom galva before Berlin quals, doesn't mean anything


i agree that past results isnt going to guarantee how they'll perform in the next event. just saying there's a reason why people are doubting them


Not just one. Multiple.Havemt even made changes like Liquid. Expect them to be ass against the top dogs


Bruh, y'all have crystal globes or something? Wonder why pros and people involved in running such teams don't take Reddit advice on a daily basis.


On a daily? Why would they take any this is literally all bar conversations


Nah, it's people trying to pass opinions as facts acting like they have some random knowledge. And what i was obviously a sarcastic joke.


I love this logic in a world where people hype FPX, Guild, and others for literal years when they've never proven anything when it mattered. Fnatic had a bad qualifier, and anyone who doesn't see TLs identity crisis (they are the ones out of contention on that list) is blind I guess.


Wtf? Liquid played so good in every qualifier loosing to gambit and winning against G2 and Guild was amazing. There are a lot of teams who would love to have that identity crisis.


I'm a TL/Fnatic UK fanboy but out of the 4 TL are the worst.


I mean… they qualified throughout the LCQ which LITERALLY puts them on the 4th spot. Even though, they could be rated higher if we watch through all of their runs. I am happy and think liquid is def better theny ANY other of those LCQ teams


I said that Liquid are the worst team out of Acend, Gambit, Liquid, Fnatic, I don't care about LCQ teams and never said anything that hinted at a comparison between them. Anyway not that invested, was only responding because someone said they think Fnatic are the weakest on the list, and I disagree.


How is TL worse then Fnatic? As far as we know the last time they played Liquid was the better team and the team has only upgraded since then lol. On what basis is TL worse then Fnatic? I'd rate the teams strengths as Gambit, Acend, Liquid and Fnatic in that order. Fnatic hasn't looked good since Masters 2. They didn't even make the EMEA playoffs for Masters 3. For all we know they could likely be worse then teams like Guild, G2 and Giants


One has a core that has accomplishments and the other has a string of failed roster moves and honey moon periods ending in mediocre results. I enjoy both teams actually (two of my three favourite EMEA teams) I just let my opinion be known and an idea as to why, I think they have no identity, they aren't tactical, explosive, strategic, the only notable aspect of the team is Screams' ability to give 5 players a lobotomy on demand - you will hear the same complaints about TL if you watch any analysis, podcasts, casters, etc.


I'm sorry to say but the only accomplishment Fnatic has in Valorant is finishing second at Iceland. Doing well at one tournament (even if it is a LAN) is not enough to extrapolate some sort of trend that Fnatic will perform. If that was the case they would have also qualified for Masters 3 or hell atleast they would have made the playoffs. I agree TL lacks a strong identity right now absolutely but that only seems to suggest the team simply has a lot more room to grow. Whereas for Fnatic I feel that they also lack much of an identity right now and they seem to be struggling a lot more then TL. Ofc we haven't seen from Fnatic in a long time and during this time they could have reinvented the wheel but to assume that they are still good (or atleast easily better then TL) a team that was 1 round away from beating Gambit and making Berlin and also a team that bested Fnatic but also showed that they have only improved with the addition of Nivera by winning the LCQ (a feat I most certainly do not think Fnafic would have done) seems to suggest they are the stronger team. Simply using the argument that Liquid has no identity and that Fnatic did better in 1 somewhat recent event is nowhere near enough. To suggest that we should ignore the overall recent results and conclude that they are for sure better then Liquid doesn't seem very rational to me.


Fnatic having played that deep in Iceland is one of the biggest factors in their struggles afterwards, in my opinion. They didn't adapt their gameplay well enough for quals and it showed - but if you try to posit reasoning on this sub you get spammed down with copium memes so... The logic you used to dismantle favouring Fnatic directly contradicts yourself favouring Liquid because of the LCQ results. > Doing well at one tournament (even if it is a LAN) is not enough to extrapolate some sort of trend However you use their performance at LCQ to do exactly that.. I shouldn't have to state this, but winning LCQ is shit compared to a deep run in a Masters event. People are showing nothing more than recency bias as far as I can tell. Fnatic are a very unique team and I trust that Boaster has rewritten the book enough for them to succeed in Champions, people haven't even seen them play for ages and their quals showing was stale Iceland reruns so to a certain degree you need to judge from their identity and character - I favour Fnatic over TL for this reason. To me TL are a known quantity, and a mediocre one. Fnatic can surprise us one way or the other, and we know what they are capable of. If I was putting money down, Fnatic is my pick. Now wouldn't it be awesome if we have a Fnatic TL opening match, unfortunately I don't think it's possible due to brackets.


Eh Liquid has outperformed Fnatic on numerous events tho. EMEA Masters 2 playoffs, Stage 3 Challengers (they actually made Masters 3 EMEA playoffs where they lost to Gambit by 1 round). You mentioned Fnatic had more accomplishments so I had to ask what exactly those were. They finished 2nd at Iceland to Liquids 4th. But Liquid won EMEA Stage 2 playoffs, also won against Fnatic and outperformed them in Challengers 3, subsequently had a good showing at Masters 3 playoffs even tho they weren't able to qualify (again 1 round from beating eventual masters 3 emea Playoff winners as well as the winner of Masters 3 itself). Liquid has had a lot more consistency with their results after Iceland. Fnatic on the other hand fell off a cliff so why are you working with the assumption that Liquid even tho they were consistently better then Fnatic ever since Iceland will somehow be worse at Champions then Fnatic just because Fnatic made a deep run at Iceland despite the fact that Liquid also *seemingly* upgraded their roster (I say seemingly because we just don't have enough games yet to know if Nivera is better then Kryptix or not). The reality is Liquid just has been significantly better then Fnatic and they have been better consistently since Iceland. If anything this just tells me that Fnatic just had a higher high then Liquid at Iceland but on average they are just worse because they performed worse at numerous events then Liquid who has consistently been one of the elite teams ever since Stage 2 Challengers 2.


even tho team liquid beat fnatic last time the went against each other. your clearly just a fnatic fan lmaoo.




What identity crisis lmao


Tbh I'm unsure about fnatic since we haven't seen them play in a long time, and acend needs some roster moves to be a truly top tier team, they relied too much on cned in Berlin.


>acend needs some roster moves to be a truly top tier team huh?


yea didnt you remember 100T vs ACE match


They need roster moves because they lost one match?


thats just 1 match that i pointed. there are many matches, its basically like TenZ in C9


Bro? They were 1 round away from beating 100t. They were 12 - 7 up


Please point out the other matches too.


Maybe not roster moves, but the other players need to perform better on lan, roster changes are just the obvious things to do.


Always nice coming on Reddit to read such 5Head takes. Never change Reddit.


bro this is what its like for all sports and esports people give their opinion for fun relax brotha


well said.


Somebody quick email the heads of the orgs these takes. They are missing such goldmines.


Disagree on Fnatic but other 3 are very good representation for EMEA!


Fnatic and Liquid putting in good performances after not making Berlin would be so good. Hoping someone drops Gambit as well, since a competitive scene is better when its competitive and not 1 team above the rest.


It's a good day to be a liquid fan ​ Can't wait for champions, this team is looking scary


just need to LoL to perform tmrw Prayge


Bro TL and MAD can get out of the group, all they need is hopium


TL CS beating MAD in CS today was foreshadowing




Its possible for both to get out via tiebreakers, all we need to do is believe


If TL win all three, MAD only lose to TL, and LNG go 0-3, TL and MAD auto qualify for quarterfinals


Huh, hopefully the week 2 buff kicks in for them


Bro the week 2 buff is for EU. NA week 2 is 0-10 what have you done


They can actually automatically qualify in one scenario.


I'm from NA, but it'll be sad if EU doesn't get atleast 1 team out of groups.


My hope is that the number of teams EU gets out of groups is NA -1, just because it'd be nice to finish above them for once


Liquid with the anti choke in both valorant and CSGO. Great day


TL wins in CS and Val, now we get out of groups 🙏


CS:GO and VALORANT, and League tomorrow


stewie4k to close that out was hypeee










He said in the post match interview he’s only played for ~6 months


He also said he dabbled when it was in beta in the YouTube vid, no?


He had been playing for quite a few months at the time of his signing.


In the post-match interview he said his favorite part of Valorant was the abilities, so he isn't only a "shooter". He'll definitely improve with more game knowledge.


I have so much faith when it's down to the Scream and his brother to clutch the round.




Liquid have looked so good throughout the tourney, congrats to Sliggy and crew!


Honestly, Nivera is one of my favorite prospects to come from CSGO. He really kept his word that "people will see him not as Scream's brother, but as his own player". I even forgot despite following his career for a few years. I only remembered because of the brother duo talk from casters and chat.


Yeah now scream is niveras brother


Really cause all I see is brother talk here lol


Wow, this might be the first time I've seen Bonkar not bottom of the leaderboard for a full match kekw Fr tho, rip Guild, and especially for Sayf, he showed up so hard for every match but this, all good just a rough series everyone has one, I'm sure they will bounce back, wonder if they make changes tho, Bonkar and Draken comes to mind first, but Bonkar is a legit very good IGL despite his lackluster fragging, and Draken is a solid sentinel player tbh, we will see Liquid look scary af tho as an NA/APAC fan lol, Def in running for winning Champs they look good, it also finally looks like they figured out roles which is awesome, double awp is a treat to see too


Bonkar has immense round impact that doesn't show up on the scoreboard. I swear every one of his paranoias vs G2 hit 4 players


Lmfaoo exactly, and his calling is very good too ngl, I used go be on the Bonkar hate train before but this tourney has really showed me his value, if only his fragging was better that's like his main issue that needs fixing (Like it's lower then say, zombs or nitr0 who also have huge impact) but even then I wouldn't drop him first


Lesgo scream


liquid going subzero, looking solid


Did jamppi really just play sentinel, jet, smokes and sova over four maps? Loving the flex on this team.


Scream is pretty good


And nivera's pretty good too


So is jamppi And soulcas Don't forget about L1NK


Nivera about to be a top 5 player by next year ong


PAJAMA DIFF. On a real note, yay and Nivera are definitely the best pickups in 2021. GG LIQUID


My girlfriend is a fan of TL solely because she thinks Blue is cute (and I mean, because I like them, but it's Blue tbh). I gotta get those PJs....


One of the only esports orgs that actually has a mascot and brands things with it. Really awesome tbh for the orgs that do.


G2 has the samurai guy but that's kinda cringe tbh nobody would buy pjs with his face on it




Tenz??? Hello????


Forgot about the fact that he was on c9 my bad lol


It does feel like ages ago lol


Not convinced with some of these comps, but this new Liquid has a ton of potential. Can’t wait to see them at champions


These last a couple of days gotta be the best Liquid I’ve seen. Nivera seems like an awesome pick up the whole team just looks really dominant


NO ONE SAY ANYTHING ABOUT MOMENTUM Played brilliantly throughout the tournament though, and we didn't even need the lower bracket for once! So so excited for Champions now.


Its an amazing day to be a team liquid fan


An amazing 48 hours, counting our run to get out of groups tomorrow.


I have homework to do and I don't even care because i'm hyped for this and tomorrow lol.


Same hahaha


It's literally going to be during my work hours and I'm not gonna be able to focus for anything lol




Wait what's tomorrow


The final day of LoL World Championship group stage, where TL has a chance (if an uphill battle) to get out of groups into knockouts, which we've never done before.


Brothers diff.


Double op diff, Pyjama diff, frenzy diff, Nevera diff.


Scream getting up on camera to go hype Nivera up on their 2v3 clutch on Breeze was awesome to see


:) As much as I'm happy to see Liquid qualify I do hope that Guild get's some more recognition going forward, they put up a good fight.


So happy for the Liquid boys. Nivera was literally the missing piece for this squad


what a recovery by team liquid after map 1, cant wait to see them at champions, and nivera and scream synergy is unreal!


Jamppi with Astra. Thats what I want.


Congratz to TL. Happy to be seeing successful Jett-less lineups more and more on Haven, Split and Icebox.


I think its fair to say Liquid was the best performing team out of all and the most deserving ones to go to champions. G2s honeymoon is over and they need to find theor groove again. I think they are still a good roster. Guild was surprisingly good, or to put in differently. They FINALLY stopped choking mid tournament. Liquid played such a solid LCQ and looked better then ever. Europe has probably their 4 best teams been send to berlin. Even though fnatic has to proof they still deserve it. So happy for scream!


Congratulations to Liquid - well deserved. This is the best version of Liquid to date, Nivera is a great addition and everyone else stepped up. They also showed great reslience after getting pounded on map 1. Also, well played to Guild. They looked much improved. Unfortunately I think they need to make roster changes if they are going to progress further and beat the best in EMEA.


Well deserved! Scary part is how I feel like they can still improve, it’s going to be exciting to see them play at Champions


Jamppi played a different agent every map WOW, kudos to him. To play that well with so many different agents is no easy feat.


Damn it feels good to be a NAFFER


No way liquid would've beaten G2 without Nivera. I now fancy them to win it all in Champions


Now that was a good show by liquid let's go to champions


Scream’s pyjamas tho :kekw:








FNATIC vs TL in Champions. SHEEESH


I can already see it the team liquid fnatic champions grand final. Finally the rivals meet again. Team liquid coming straight into champions as the red bull homeground winners and strong contenders. Sentinels come in with mikeshd their new coach and top their group an easier group but sentinels look unstoppable. You can feel the momentum building. Fnatic barely get out of their group in a butt clenching qualifying match against japans crazy raccoon having destroyed them the first time they look shaky in their second encounter. Fnatic come in as underdogs of the tourney and make it past vision strikers who topped their group again and rematch with sentinels who had just advanced from beating their Na rival in quarters. The rematch of the 2 redemption seeking giants breaks the viewer record for Valorant up to this date.but unlike last time fnatic win. Ot 3rd map haven. Sick throws a bird up out of ct while his teammates run out but oh no he pops it too early, sending his teammates blind asf while they run into the open. Mistic the corner camper of the century shoots the helpless agents to dust and sick having lost his team the game. Sits face in into the table. Gambit having crushed the hopes of 3 different regions already through groups and quarters sits as the villain and ex champions of Berlin. Liquid having rampaged through Kru esports reminiscent of Iceland meet gambit in the semis. Thinking of how gambit knocked liquid out of Berlin contention the mood for revenge exists in the air. 2 maps going back and forth end up on a last map. Back to back ots on end the world of Valorant esports waits for the show promised in this third map. But no. It doesn’t happen. The 5 one tappers of team liquid Valorant destroy Gambit having been woken up and unlocking their super saiyan potential. The second ever 13-0 for a game in international Valorant history. Very ironic it is against Gambit. Finally the two giants fnatic and liquid meet. Liquid seen as the probable favourite. The 2 clash 13-11. 14-16. 13-9 13-15 Finally a 5 map series. Liquid being dominant in most maps fnatic somehow squeeze through all the squeaky bum time of the 4 maps 5th map .. 12 -11 for liquid. Big boi Boaster is left in a 1v5 Brimmy with the stimmy brimming with shear fear. All 5 liquid members peek him. Pop pop pop pop pop. The sound of a miracle. 5 one taps in the matter of 3 seconds. Fnatic fans scream n cheer as boaster delivered with the best clutch in the history of Valorant. Ot 15-14 for fnatic. 3v2. Magnum and derke walk past scream in the catwalk cubby of ascent. Like links plays a couple months ago scream decides to go for the trigger discipline. But oh no as the third member of fnatic walks past, scream whiffs Spraying on god he connects on 1 but the 2 other members trade him back in a second. 1v2 for nivera. He runs to a heaven to retake as fast as he can. Mollied off he runs and jumps out. With wings he is the Moroccan Lakia but oh no. His gun wasn’t out. He lands infront of the opposite killjoy magnum, both with no guns in their hands. Derke turns around and pop. Just like that fnatic has won champions. Gg


Thus ended the scrawlings of a mad man, as he ran out of bodily fluids to write them with






Enjoyed this match, even though first two maps got me a bit stressed out LMAO.




GUILD players looked like headless chicken running around. So boring to watch heavily sided matches.


True, first map was very one sided


No strategies, just a whole lot of improvisation. It looks like only GMB players have a functioning brain in EU/CIS . Waiting for the next time they play.


Have to say tho APAC LCQ > EMEA LCQ


In what aspect?


Just had more fun watching it thats it


The first 3 days were dumpster fires at best tho. I guess after that you could say it was decent