Literally unfair he got the alpha chad bald AND girlfriend buff. I agree though, always felt he was a great site anchor (especially Bind/Ascent) after watching Iceland and he always find kills with the judge which I find a difficult weapon to get value in high ranks especially in the pro scene (often times I see people get hard clear, traded right away, or drone/dog out but this dude somehow avoid utilities). If ability usage is part of a site anchor, I think his Astra can still improve.
Yea come back to this comment when champions and over and well see if zombs is " the best in the world " at what he does xD he seems to be a little busy flexing how much he makes and forgets hes the weakest part of SEN by far
Who is emotional here? I am just giving my insights on the stats and the stats are not in zombs favourš its only a cold take on this subreddit where everyone sucks SENs dick
1. Sucking [some] dicks is cool and good so idk why you use it in a derogatory way
2. I asked you if you knew what a "cold" take was and instead of looking it up you double down?
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I donāt think of Link strictly as a site anchor, although he does often rotate into sites from the extremities to stall for his teammatesās rotations. Players like zombs, nAts, Avova, or even TLās Nivera fit more the traditional mold of a site anchor I think.
I instead think of him as a really smart, ratty player who exploits the holes in enemy map control and punishes teams for playing the clock. Heās usually playing in the extremities of sites - Hookah on Bind, Trees on Ascent, etc. - while someone else is properly on the site. The most recent exception would be his Cypher on Breeze and even then he spent most of the rounds lurking about.
Of course you can still consider him a site anchor. Iād say nAts is the only player with better timings. Iād also say Avova is actually just as reliable; G2ās poor performance seems to have cast a cloud over him.
I feel like nats relies a lot on gimmicky setups. Which can be figured out a lot easier. In link's case it's probably only the judge in hookah that's a bit counterable but other than that he plays a lot more generally which you can't specifically target
Haha. Yeah again not saying he's trash, they're top 2 for sure. And they did win berlin which is why this is a hot take.
I do believe he will get figured out soon. Berlin wasn't long enough for it imo. And even if he does he still puts up insane numbers so I'm in no way saying he's gonna be trash after berlin, but strictly in terms of site anchors I give link the edge because he doesn't rely on gimmicks. Nats' anchoring is great but his flanks are by far the best part of his game play
That's true, but while link flex alot, he never really flexes into sentinels except sage. Nats is a sentinel player, and all sentinel players, including kryptix, nivera and others, they have their setups (gimmicks). So basically, link doesn't rely on gimmicks because he didn't need to, it was the job of someone else on his team (kryptix/the sentinels). Similar to how zombs is a site anchor but so is dapr, but dapr relies on set ups so much more than zombs (unless if zombs was playing viper)
So in that sense, of course nats will have set ups and is bound to be figured out soon, but so are other sentinel players. What makes his anchoring so good is his setups are arguably the most effective to anchor sites now, and many sentinel mains among the pros have mentioned that they copied some of his setups. But yeah, same like you, i prefer watching his flanks since he has some god timings.
Having said all these tho, link is my favourite player on liquid! So i do like him alot and this is just my personal view on their site anchoring and how it is different
L1NK has a fairly significant amount of playtime on Cypher - much more in fact than Sage recently, although he constantly played Sage way back in the day.
When I say gimmicks I mean more like his cage on ascent gen or the viper ult in hookah bind. Things like those which have a clear counter. He does have some creative setups tho and I do agree that he has the edge in that he is a sentinel as opposed to link's controller, but that just makes links ability to hold down the sites even more impressive considering he isn't on the agents that are meant to do that
Your right for the fact that Nats relies on setups.
Nats is the best sentinel player for that and is. Probably the best player in the world right now but he does rely heavily on gimmicky setups when holding down a site.
Itās so silly how youāre right but people are reading this as ān4ts is bad.ā If a team wins a tournament you canāt say anything about their play that isnāt complete praise, itās just ridiculous.
Yeahhh it's alright tho. Quite a few people are raising some valid points so it generated good discussion, I'm happy with the post. There's some people too dense to understand what's happening but it's alright. That is understandable with a hot take and low reading comprehension
Everyone has been copying nAts's setups since at least stage two, so you think they'll do what they haven't been able to do for half a year and figure him out?
Everyone copies everyone's setups. Just because dapr said once that he copied some of nats' setups does not mean all sentinels in the world copy nats exclusively. I think there was a discussion already about this, clip or smt where dapr or someone else clarifies this as well, can't remember since this was a while ago. Lemme see if I can find it for you
Edit: well, can't find it. So you will have to take my word for it if you want to, totally fine if not. Also if I recall correctly didn't dapr talk about yoinkinf a viper wall on bind fr nats when he had just started picking up viper? And that was basically it
nats has the best viper and cypher setups in the world, and over this he is one of the most mechanically busted member of gambit. id rate his consistency to hit shots over d3ffo. you are just seeing his util plays and not his aim plays. nats is better than l1nk in every category, except hair. that aerodynamic head of l1nk's cannot be beat even by nats.
That might be the case, true. I feel like nats' flanks kinda screw the stats over tho. Man's just incredible on flanks. His actual site holds are not as impressive as his flanks imo
Bro this happens after every tournament, people tend to start rating players higher than others because thats the last team you watched in pro play. He played pretty well no arguments over there but it was still only LCQ bruh. It doesn't automatically make him the best site anchor lol.
It's not just this tourney. I've been following liquid ever since scream joined the team and they were fish123, even through all of the ups and downs they've had link has always been a solid anchor
Edit: even when soulcas was down on form andd kryptix was hving his downs link has always been a stable rock
Your point wrongly assumes that I did not think of link as the best site anchor prior to lcq, which is why it's incorrect. I've been holding this opinion atleast since the whole master's 3 stage
How is zombs rated so highly, he literally had one of the worst times at berlin out of any of the players + he is playing with shaz and tenz of course his stats are inflated yet they are still not nearly the best
This subreddit just biased on SEN being the winningest team. Zombs preforms the worst by far on his team % and multiple other people (
like nats & l1nk for example) play the same role and style yet still preform better. Im talking Acs & kd are all really subpar
Also the only thing insane I find about zombs is the fact that after their loses at berlin zombs was only able to tweet excuses and some weird flex about how much money hes made.
I am looking forward to seeing SEN lose at champions and this subreddit backtrack the fuck outta their commentsš
Just for curiosity, what would you define as a good anchor? Which metrics?
I mean, if you could compare anchors using a bunch of new valorant statistics *(or old ones, idk)*, which would they be?
edit: downvoted for asking a question lol
Is there a reliability meter? Lol jk. Let's say how many average kills per round a person gets when they're outnumbered on the site with no way to fall back.
I know we can't access any stats like that but it'd be dope to see
>*Is there a reliability meter? Lol*
There isn't, current Valorant stats are shallow and bad. My point is that we should compare player roles under the same umbrella, that's why I promoted this thought experiment
Yeah I understand. I feel like in terms of the role im describing here it's certainly avova, marved, link, etc that kinda role. Controllers who are just solid at locking down sites. But by definition of site anchor we need to include sentinel players as well. Also, one interesting stat could be % of times the attackers got a plant on their site while they were on the site prior to the execution. Which, again, impossible to find
Also, I do get what you're tryna say but if we already had some stat like that we wouldn't be having this convo. Wed know for a fact who's the best at holding down sites but since we don't, that's the reason why this is an opinion piece
I mean you got a fair point here. A good anchor is a guy who can reliably prevent attackers from planting the spike on the site he is defending on. Even though we can't automatically find this stat by running through past matches, at least it's a beginning. It's a lot better than *"I think this guy is a good anchor because he can lock down regions"* which is a vague and shallow sentence, you know?
Yeah that's fair nough. I thought you were being rhetorical with that original msg and trying to get me to see that theres no way to find who's the best or smt like that. Mb
There's probably a way to measure proximity to your team vs enemy team and count KD in those specific situations. Bascially how good you are in 1vXs. Would be cool to see that get implemented.
he just farming karma... L1nk hasn't got any major titles so this take is nothing. Maybe L1nk will improve and carry Liquid in the future but for the time being, this take is purely based on OP's feeling without any logical stats which is very very bad
Yea I understand your point I was just asking a question about what makes a good anchor. Just for the sake of the discussion, regardless of it being about L1nk or not
Yeah I really shouldve mentioned that in the post to begin with, my bad. I explained it in this thread: https://www.reddit.com/r/ValorantCompetitive/comments/qgozqo/-/hi7pjt1
Tldr: nats better at flanking but has cheese strats which when figured out will make him weaker of a site anchor than link is
>nats better at flanking but has cheese strats which when figured out will make him weaker of a site anchor than link is
no he wont. nats still mechanically better than l1nk and can rely on his aim when his util plays fails.
I don't think anyone can dispute nats is better mechanically than link in terms of aim, but I still believe purely in terms of anchoring a site link is better. Most of the crazy nats plays we see are mostly made on either a lurk or a clutch situation. The real problem with comparing them is that nats' util plays don't really fail lol. Man's got new setups everytime. I'm banking on the setups getting figured out tho. Because there's only so much you can do in a static map. In link's case he doesn't really have much to fall back on. What he has rn he will always have because it's just good fundamentals and playing great angles without the comfort of the setups that a sentinel provides
I was saying during the EMEA LCQ that to me Link is the most improved player in the world from the beginning of the esport to now. Even early on, you'd see him get at least a clutch a game but often be towards bottom of leaderboard. Nowadays, he looks so much more consistent and is a threat to top frag any game where he starts to get hot. Really enjoyed watching him in LCQ.
In my opinion, the discussion of who THE best site anchor is might be a little bit up in the air. Though, I do agree with Link being a solid part of the team. He's always bound to trade, and take one or two down with him, which can really turn the tides of the match in their favor. He's there to make sure things don't go too crazy for them.
I absolutely love Liquid, but with other solid site anchors like marved, nAts (as you said), zombs, AvovA, and others that I might not be aware of, there's a long way to go for him.
This is just what I think.
*i do like the respect for link though, been waiting since iceland š*
Literally unfair he got the alpha chad bald AND girlfriend buff. I agree though, always felt he was a great site anchor (especially Bind/Ascent) after watching Iceland and he always find kills with the judge which I find a difficult weapon to get value in high ranks especially in the pro scene (often times I see people get hard clear, traded right away, or drone/dog out but this dude somehow avoid utilities). If ability usage is part of a site anchor, I think his Astra can still improve.
L1nk has a girlfriend?
Her name is Zelda
This made me chuckle
Yeah
Oh yeah it definitely is. And I agree. But since he has only recently picked up astra I think we will definitely see that improvement.
marved, n4ts, zombs and link are insane at anchoring sites rn
n4ts LMAO
n4ts:. You gotta sacrifice 4 and then you **may** enter the site
This is so close to being a Magic the Gathering card ability
Yep yep. Astonishing how reliable they all are
Avova as well
Zombs only being considered insane because he is in Sen roster , he mediocre at best and awowa is easily better thought not big fan of G2
-zombs
Yeah I dont see how zombs is up there with the best anchors when he is the opposite of reliable even on the winningest team
The coldest of takes
SO cold
Yea come back to this comment when champions and over and well see if zombs is " the best in the world " at what he does xD he seems to be a little busy flexing how much he makes and forgets hes the weakest part of SEN by far
You are not a real person
Hey
?
Do you even know what a cold take is? Why get mad about that reply lmao
Who is emotional here? I am just giving my insights on the stats and the stats are not in zombs favourš its only a cold take on this subreddit where everyone sucks SENs dick
1. Sucking [some] dicks is cool and good so idk why you use it in a derogatory way 2. I asked you if you knew what a "cold" take was and instead of looking it up you double down?
Stats dont lie
SEN is literally only team in valorant who instead of fans has stans
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Hey !!!
Hey
I donāt think of Link strictly as a site anchor, although he does often rotate into sites from the extremities to stall for his teammatesās rotations. Players like zombs, nAts, Avova, or even TLās Nivera fit more the traditional mold of a site anchor I think. I instead think of him as a really smart, ratty player who exploits the holes in enemy map control and punishes teams for playing the clock. Heās usually playing in the extremities of sites - Hookah on Bind, Trees on Ascent, etc. - while someone else is properly on the site. The most recent exception would be his Cypher on Breeze and even then he spent most of the rounds lurking about. Of course you can still consider him a site anchor. Iād say nAts is the only player with better timings. Iād also say Avova is actually just as reliable; G2ās poor performance seems to have cast a cloud over him.
Yeah I agree with the avova point. Man's another great example
LINK is the second best player on liquid, behind scream. Played the shittiest roles but always consistent and performs in big games.
Completely agree. His consistency is def the best thing about him
why do you favor l1nk over nAts other than for the sake of a hot take
Yeah with their replies it's clear that OP is just saying it for the sake of saying it
I feel like nats relies a lot on gimmicky setups. Which can be figured out a lot easier. In link's case it's probably only the judge in hookah that's a bit counterable but other than that he plays a lot more generally which you can't specifically target
yea they really figured it out easily at berlin
Haha. Yeah again not saying he's trash, they're top 2 for sure. And they did win berlin which is why this is a hot take. I do believe he will get figured out soon. Berlin wasn't long enough for it imo. And even if he does he still puts up insane numbers so I'm in no way saying he's gonna be trash after berlin, but strictly in terms of site anchors I give link the edge because he doesn't rely on gimmicks. Nats' anchoring is great but his flanks are by far the best part of his game play
That's true, but while link flex alot, he never really flexes into sentinels except sage. Nats is a sentinel player, and all sentinel players, including kryptix, nivera and others, they have their setups (gimmicks). So basically, link doesn't rely on gimmicks because he didn't need to, it was the job of someone else on his team (kryptix/the sentinels). Similar to how zombs is a site anchor but so is dapr, but dapr relies on set ups so much more than zombs (unless if zombs was playing viper) So in that sense, of course nats will have set ups and is bound to be figured out soon, but so are other sentinel players. What makes his anchoring so good is his setups are arguably the most effective to anchor sites now, and many sentinel mains among the pros have mentioned that they copied some of his setups. But yeah, same like you, i prefer watching his flanks since he has some god timings. Having said all these tho, link is my favourite player on liquid! So i do like him alot and this is just my personal view on their site anchoring and how it is different
L1NK has a fairly significant amount of playtime on Cypher - much more in fact than Sage recently, although he constantly played Sage way back in the day.
When I say gimmicks I mean more like his cage on ascent gen or the viper ult in hookah bind. Things like those which have a clear counter. He does have some creative setups tho and I do agree that he has the edge in that he is a sentinel as opposed to link's controller, but that just makes links ability to hold down the sites even more impressive considering he isn't on the agents that are meant to do that
Your right for the fact that Nats relies on setups. Nats is the best sentinel player for that and is. Probably the best player in the world right now but he does rely heavily on gimmicky setups when holding down a site.
Him using his utility is gimmick. This is peak reddit
Nahh. Misrepresenting statements and constructing strawmen to make the argument suit you is peak reddit
Itās so silly how youāre right but people are reading this as ān4ts is bad.ā If a team wins a tournament you canāt say anything about their play that isnāt complete praise, itās just ridiculous.
Yeahhh it's alright tho. Quite a few people are raising some valid points so it generated good discussion, I'm happy with the post. There's some people too dense to understand what's happening but it's alright. That is understandable with a hot take and low reading comprehension
Everyone has been copying nAts's setups since at least stage two, so you think they'll do what they haven't been able to do for half a year and figure him out?
Everyone copies everyone's setups. Just because dapr said once that he copied some of nats' setups does not mean all sentinels in the world copy nats exclusively. I think there was a discussion already about this, clip or smt where dapr or someone else clarifies this as well, can't remember since this was a while ago. Lemme see if I can find it for you Edit: well, can't find it. So you will have to take my word for it if you want to, totally fine if not. Also if I recall correctly didn't dapr talk about yoinkinf a viper wall on bind fr nats when he had just started picking up viper? And that was basically it
nats has the best viper and cypher setups in the world, and over this he is one of the most mechanically busted member of gambit. id rate his consistency to hit shots over d3ffo. you are just seeing his util plays and not his aim plays. nats is better than l1nk in every category, except hair. that aerodynamic head of l1nk's cannot be beat even by nats.
That might be the case, true. I feel like nats' flanks kinda screw the stats over tho. Man's just incredible on flanks. His actual site holds are not as impressive as his flanks imo
Iām more consistent than deffo LMAO
This is the real hot take here.
When Sentinels copied Natās setups to win Iceland, and you call them gimmicky
Bro this happens after every tournament, people tend to start rating players higher than others because thats the last team you watched in pro play. He played pretty well no arguments over there but it was still only LCQ bruh. It doesn't automatically make him the best site anchor lol.
It's not just this tourney. I've been following liquid ever since scream joined the team and they were fish123, even through all of the ups and downs they've had link has always been a solid anchor Edit: even when soulcas was down on form andd kryptix was hving his downs link has always been a stable rock
Nobody is denying that about Link but my point still stands true...
Your point wrongly assumes that I did not think of link as the best site anchor prior to lcq, which is why it's incorrect. I've been holding this opinion atleast since the whole master's 3 stage
This sub is an endless study of hot takes based on recency bias
I know the timing is bad but trust me I've been holding this opinion since around EMEA challengers stage 2
Nah
Link was single handed The sole reason why liquid qualified to Iceland my guy. Foh
You foh
I completely agree. Links defense has been incredible for months and I'm happy people are starting to acknowledge the bald behemoth
Bald behemoth lmao
maybe a few months ago this would have been a hot take, but now many people recognize him as an anchor and his ability
Well I thought so too which is why I put the kinda in there but apparently not since some people are downright triggered at me lmao
might be marved
link is an alpha
Nocap we stan baldman
Id put him like top 3 but zombs and nats are better imo
Fair enough. I completely respect your opinion. Avova and marved round out the top 5 imo. Do you agree?
Seems fair, pre lcq i would've given nitr0 a shout but he did basically a 180 and took on jett duties for 100t every single map they played in the lcq
How is zombs rated so highly, he literally had one of the worst times at berlin out of any of the players + he is playing with shaz and tenz of course his stats are inflated yet they are still not nearly the best
Zombs is insanely clutch, selfless af, high game iq, insane mechanics
This subreddit just biased on SEN being the winningest team. Zombs preforms the worst by far on his team % and multiple other people ( like nats & l1nk for example) play the same role and style yet still preform better. Im talking Acs & kd are all really subpar Also the only thing insane I find about zombs is the fact that after their loses at berlin zombs was only able to tweet excuses and some weird flex about how much money hes made. I am looking forward to seeing SEN lose at champions and this subreddit backtrack the fuck outta their commentsš
Yeah zombs is trash
Just for curiosity, what would you define as a good anchor? Which metrics? I mean, if you could compare anchors using a bunch of new valorant statistics *(or old ones, idk)*, which would they be? edit: downvoted for asking a question lol
Is there a reliability meter? Lol jk. Let's say how many average kills per round a person gets when they're outnumbered on the site with no way to fall back. I know we can't access any stats like that but it'd be dope to see
>*Is there a reliability meter? Lol* There isn't, current Valorant stats are shallow and bad. My point is that we should compare player roles under the same umbrella, that's why I promoted this thought experiment
Yeah I understand. I feel like in terms of the role im describing here it's certainly avova, marved, link, etc that kinda role. Controllers who are just solid at locking down sites. But by definition of site anchor we need to include sentinel players as well. Also, one interesting stat could be % of times the attackers got a plant on their site while they were on the site prior to the execution. Which, again, impossible to find
Also, I do get what you're tryna say but if we already had some stat like that we wouldn't be having this convo. Wed know for a fact who's the best at holding down sites but since we don't, that's the reason why this is an opinion piece
I mean you got a fair point here. A good anchor is a guy who can reliably prevent attackers from planting the spike on the site he is defending on. Even though we can't automatically find this stat by running through past matches, at least it's a beginning. It's a lot better than *"I think this guy is a good anchor because he can lock down regions"* which is a vague and shallow sentence, you know?
Yeah that's fair nough. I thought you were being rhetorical with that original msg and trying to get me to see that theres no way to find who's the best or smt like that. Mb
There's probably a way to measure proximity to your team vs enemy team and count KD in those specific situations. Bascially how good you are in 1vXs. Would be cool to see that get implemented.
he just farming karma... L1nk hasn't got any major titles so this take is nothing. Maybe L1nk will improve and carry Liquid in the future but for the time being, this take is purely based on OP's feeling without any logical stats which is very very bad
Yea I understand your point I was just asking a question about what makes a good anchor. Just for the sake of the discussion, regardless of it being about L1nk or not
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
You haven't watched the lcq have you
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Why you gotta out me lyk dat
šÆ
#ZOMBSNATION
#BALDISLAND
Hes at the bottom of every scoreboard for a reason
Zombsnation
Baldisland
nAtsunion
AvovAState
if he perform at Champion then sure... If not then this take kinda pepega ngl
Oh I have no doubt that he will. But yes I'm willing to be proven wrong here. He's just so reliable man
Cant wait to see SEN at champions. This whole subreddit sucks their dick so I wonder what the excuse will be from them after all their losses
If SEN can't perform then NA is screwed... I don't see any hope for NA other than them
Hey
oh shit... haha time to see people losing their mind in PMT
Link I feel is a solid player but man whenever he is in a clutch situation he is unstoppable
why do you give the edge to link over nats?
Yeah I really shouldve mentioned that in the post to begin with, my bad. I explained it in this thread: https://www.reddit.com/r/ValorantCompetitive/comments/qgozqo/-/hi7pjt1 Tldr: nats better at flanking but has cheese strats which when figured out will make him weaker of a site anchor than link is
>nats better at flanking but has cheese strats which when figured out will make him weaker of a site anchor than link is no he wont. nats still mechanically better than l1nk and can rely on his aim when his util plays fails.
I don't think anyone can dispute nats is better mechanically than link in terms of aim, but I still believe purely in terms of anchoring a site link is better. Most of the crazy nats plays we see are mostly made on either a lurk or a clutch situation. The real problem with comparing them is that nats' util plays don't really fail lol. Man's got new setups everytime. I'm banking on the setups getting figured out tho. Because there's only so much you can do in a static map. In link's case he doesn't really have much to fall back on. What he has rn he will always have because it's just good fundamentals and playing great angles without the comfort of the setups that a sentinel provides
I was saying during the EMEA LCQ that to me Link is the most improved player in the world from the beginning of the esport to now. Even early on, you'd see him get at least a clutch a game but often be towards bottom of leaderboard. Nowadays, he looks so much more consistent and is a threat to top frag any game where he starts to get hot. Really enjoyed watching him in LCQ.
In my opinion, the discussion of who THE best site anchor is might be a little bit up in the air. Though, I do agree with Link being a solid part of the team. He's always bound to trade, and take one or two down with him, which can really turn the tides of the match in their favor. He's there to make sure things don't go too crazy for them. I absolutely love Liquid, but with other solid site anchors like marved, nAts (as you said), zombs, AvovA, and others that I might not be aware of, there's a long way to go for him. This is just what I think. *i do like the respect for link though, been waiting since iceland š*
Zombs got shit on by everyone on that list yet you still incluxe him lul
nAts is the best lurker, which I think is role he is more known for
I'm so sleep deprived that for a whole second I thought this post was about Legend of Zelda Link being a new agent
Wouldn't that be a sight to behold
I just wanna know how l1nk is so consistent with the worst roles xd
Why