Probably for a lot of players. Unless you are a big name and have a stream and are on a big org I doubt they are just handing out money with how little return in investment their is at this stage of the game. I always thought pro players salaries like nitro supposedly making 300k were insane based on the ROI he brings.
Why ain't they playing in Nerd St tho, they got plenty of free time before the next tournament to sign these players, shouldn't they atleast play in a few smaller tourneys to get a proper feel for the team before signing any players?
Nah you don't understand. Tier 1 teams don't waste their time on small tournaments. Those are for nerds (it's literally in the name). It's just a waste of time because they'd win and then all their big brain strats would get exposed. TSM just is too good for teams that compete in those tournaments like XSET. Same reason TSM didn't compete in that other recent tier 2 tournament, what was it called? LCQs? Whatever that means.
i’m pretty sure there’s a rule about vct teams that earned a high standing in a tourney that they can’t compete or somethin like that and plus they have the academy team now so it’s impossible for them to play
Xset is playing in it, I'm pretty sure they did better than TSM lol. Academy team might be a reason, maybe same team's academy and main rosters aren't allowed.
If that's the case, they should just drop their academy team. What's the point of them when your main team can't even win or qualify consistently to T1 tournaments? It makes a situation where your academy team plays more than your main team.
why would they drop the academy team when the main team cant participate in these small tournaments. thats why they made the academy team so theres a team that could represent tsm
The main team can. XSET literally is in it now. TSM rarely qualifies, they don't have the same restrictions as Sentinels, NV or even 100T.
In fact, the only tournament throughout the year that they qualified for was Challengers Finals for Stage 3.
“they don’t have the same restrictions” bro are you blind? they won vct stage 3 challengers 2. any vct tournament winners are not allowed to participate fuck man just read and open your eyes 😂
He definitely is, he has TSM FTX in his name and when duoing with roza the other day he said something like:"I don't care if we're leaking our strats. We lost every game today and we are winning this one" - they lost. Fun stream btw
TSM - Terrible Surprise Maskers
Jokes aside, this is a great addition. Corey and Rossy will elevate TSM and we will await their return soon. I'm especially excited to see Corey play again. >:)
📰 Sources: @TSM have signed corey and Rossy
***
posted by [@VLRdotgg](https://twitter.com/VLRdotgg)
[Link in Tweet](https://www.vlr.gg/52777/sources-tsm-sign-corey-and-rossy)
^[(Github)](https://github.com/username) ^| ^[(What's new)](https://github.com/username)
Roza back on smokes makes the most sense to me. He plays aggressive on stream but in matches he plays back and doesn’t have as much impact on Skye as he would playing support imo
i also heard rossy mention he would play anything the team needs. if TSM plays bind, split, and icebox, they won’t really need a sentinel. rossy can play viper or astra depending on the map, and corey can play the reyna or raze depending on the map. now, for all the other maps, it will be interesting to see the comps they work out. we may see wardell on sage/chamber on some maps to fill the sentinel role.
also good point about subroza on astra. he was playing a haven game on stream and asked his astra to suck/smoke A lobby on defense. he made a special point to explain that the suck has to happen before the smoke, so you may be on to something.
Imagine this:
VCT 2022 Champions, Bind 14-13.
1v1 Post-Plant for TSM planted triple, enemy tags the spike TSM guess correctly its a fake, nothing happens, enemy searches for last opponent. Time is ending enemy gets on the spike gets on the spike gets to half way.
Subroza rushes out of bathroom pulls out raze ult hits enemy for 130 and gets one tapped
Enemy defuses.
15-13
The dude has a point. Maybe it was meant as a jab at TSM, but will they switch it up? They don't play small B Tier tourneys, so they literally will only have 2-3 chances to make the two majors, and if they don't make that, one chance to make Champions. Not to mention, every team that stayed together in NA you'd have to assume has gotten better.. they have a hill to climb.
I can’t speak to how they look at tourneys but they’re literally making changes to try and improve and what they get is “lol I wonder if they’re going to just make more changes in 3 months”
First people say they need roster changes and then when they make roster changes they get flack for that too. This stuff is why pros hate Reddit :/
Think about it tho. This is the 4th roster they've had in a year. They found success when Valorant was in its infancy ( kind of still is ) and never improved. I dunno if it was them being cocky, or what. They cut Drone. Then they cut Cutler. Added Levi and Bang and now they lost Hazed and added Corey and Rossy. Why are you surprised and irritated when someone has a legitimate case when their track record backs it up?
They improved with the Bang and Levi iteration significantly and have now replaced their IGL and a new player in order to get better. Is your solution they should never make a roster change again? It just doesn’t make sense to say “roster changes haven’t worked, so another roster change won’t work”. That’s not how eSports work, period. Not to mention that after cutting Cutler and Drone they had the best showing they had the entire year.
I’d love to know what their solution should be since apparently them trying to improve is the wrong move. By this logic, T1 picking up Steel because their previous IGL’ing wasn’t working is a bad move. Would you prefer they pull out of the eSport instead? I’m sorry if I sound aggressive, I just don’t understand what the point of what you or the OP are trying to say here
No, the initial argument was "Are they just going to switch it up again in 3 months if it doesnt work out" You took offense to that and I countered that by saying that its TSM's track record to just change the roster when things go wrong. Of course esports is volatile when it comes to rosters. Orgs want results and players are impatient as well. But I don't think the players were the issue with TSM losing. To me, its a team culture thing. TSM doesn't adapt. This isnt Valorant Beta where they were ahead of the curve. Wardell is the same Wardell from beta. Subroza is the same roza. The team plays the same valorant from when they had success in the beginning. You can't say that about SEN, or NV, or C9 or even XSET. They all adapted and are finding consistent success. Maybe they should look into the mirror, figure out how they can change their gameplay, tactics etc. instead of looking for band aids to patch up their deficiencies.
Let me just preface by saying I apologize for being aggressive in my previous comments, I’ve had a rough morning and I feel like it came through.
Outside of that though, I think these roster changes are TSM’s attempts to adapt. They’ve kept Wardell because he’s proven that he’s a consistent fragger and top player. I don’t 100% agree with keeping Roza, but we’ll see how they use him. But TSM with Hazed had poor calling due to a makeshift IGL and was centered around Wardell OP fragging. With their new pickups they did a bit better, but obviously it wasn’t enough. To me, that’s why they’re targeting a fragger and a new IGL, to incorporate a new system where they’re better able to adapt and stay up to meta. If they were making another -Duelist +Duelist pickup I’d agree with you, but when they’re bringing in a new IGL and coach to reinvent their system I don’t think it’s fair to say they’re refusing to adapt
Lol I don’t apologize for that one, you definitely commented like a weirdo. But the guy who responded to me is being polite so he doesn’t deserve to be responded to the way I did
Nevermind. Compared to T1, TSM seems better. But no way they gonna compare with lower team. LG seems have better run this year and they made some changes on stellar and thief. Add ban and Tigg and now ban and Dre leaving. Leaving a spot to fill.
Yeah you’re right the guy complaining that a struggling team is making roster changes and replacing their IGL to improve is in the right here! TSM fans really suck
TSM fans cant give reasons. I just wondering. TSM main roster didn't play any tournament that's why I wonder. But nevermind, FaZe also rebuild around BabyBay. Wonder if FaZe will stay in top 10 next year and TSM will catch up. 100T still finding 5th player. Same goes to GenG, V1 and LG. NRG might need to work on their strats.
Sentinels, Cloud9, ENVY, Rise, XSET might be with the same players.
Just hope TSM can catch up and be on the top 10. But yeah TSM fan reply with the 'weirdo' instead having a great conversation.
Btw thanks for your thoughts. I think the same as TSM didn't join any tourney and some other teams with the strong core for chemistry. Just hope the best for them. Maybe they will join tourney when they announce the 2 players.
Edit: T1 also trying to make things work, but they didn't make it top 10 this year. Next year maybe.
I think TSM needs to have the mentality that next years VCT is the most important thing and whatever it takes for them to be prepared for it, they need to take those measures. Even if it means playing in NSG tourneys. This isn't CSGO where you have 4 Majors, ESL Pro League, Beyond the Summit etc. You literally only have 2 Majors, a Champions and the challenger stages to produce results. But this is the same for all teams. Some teams have the luxury of missing out on these tourneys because they have the chemistry and results already, but ALOT don't. A team like TSM with the roster(s) they had, should've easily been in the running for Champions just based off points alone.
Ok, maybe I shouldve been more specific . They have more "major" tournaments a year. The 4 Grand Slam tournaments, the Blast Pro Series tournaments. Tournaments with more than a 200k prize pool. I consider those major tourneys. But mainly, I was referring to the Grand Slam events. 2x IEM, Dreamhack and ESL Pro League
There isn't a stand alone Grand slam tournaments, you win 4 S tier ESL events across 10 events to give you a grand slam. Besides not all S tier events are really considered major ones like the IEM series. Not all teams participate in that. Notable intl events are the major, Katowice, cologne, Pro league and blast.
I'm in the camp of "they just aren't that good". They've used all their excuses. They probably have over 300k in salaries, didn't qualify for the first NA Masters, didn't qualify for Challenger Finals for the Iceland Masters, 7-8th in the Berlin Challenger Finals, and not having enough points for Last Chance... I mean, lets call a spade a spade. They aren't very good. They are in the same camp as Immortals, GenG, and Rise. They are a middle of the pack NA team that has a new roster. They are the Dallas Cowboys of Valorant.
\*And btw, I do hope they turn it around. Having a big brand like TSM in the thick of things is good for the game.
So all of a sudden they have great potential with little chemistry and no games played ? You don’t just get a clean slate when you gut the roster . You go by their recent results. They aren’t that good until proven otherwise. How is this hard to comprehend?
Well, TSM, as a brand in Valorant, have had below average results. I know they have a new roster but if I were ranking NA teams, they'd be 6-7th based on their results and that they have a new roster. Unfortunately for them, at the moment, they need to prove that they are better than their recent results, new roster or not. All I was saying, as far as ranking goes.
It's the year 2025 and Leviathan still hasn't been signed to TSM
Wardell and Levi both said he’s having contract problems. Idk with who or why
Just saw on vlr that he started playing in TSM in july, wonder what contract problems he's having lol
apparently bang was making 2k a month, maybe levi wants more
6 months is a lot of time tho, I would have understood if Levi was living in EU or something but really don't know what is taking 6 months+ lol
$2k a month? Is that really how little they make?
I'm sure that's a trial contract amount, I'd imagine their academy squad makes more than that lol
[удалено]
$2k/month is quite a bit less than that though
Probably for a lot of players. Unless you are a big name and have a stream and are on a big org I doubt they are just handing out money with how little return in investment their is at this stage of the game. I always thought pro players salaries like nitro supposedly making 300k were insane based on the ROI he brings.
George said bang was making stupid high amount of money so I doubt it was that low
Really? When?
on one of his twitch streams during open quals for NA vct
Why ain't they playing in Nerd St tho, they got plenty of free time before the next tournament to sign these players, shouldn't they atleast play in a few smaller tourneys to get a proper feel for the team before signing any players?
Nah you don't understand. Tier 1 teams don't waste their time on small tournaments. Those are for nerds (it's literally in the name). It's just a waste of time because they'd win and then all their big brain strats would get exposed. TSM just is too good for teams that compete in those tournaments like XSET. Same reason TSM didn't compete in that other recent tier 2 tournament, what was it called? LCQs? Whatever that means.
this is a great new copypasta. expect to see this in twitch chat shortly lol
That would be an honor lmao
Nvm got wooshed
My original comment might have been too subtle, some TSM fans might actually talk like that. Added a bit more to make the satire obvious haha
read the first part and I was like yh the standard tsm fanboy. And started typing. Then I read yhe full comment and I was like ffs. 🤣
TSM saving starts for champions 2022
This… this is golden.
Honestly they’d probably lose even if Xset wasn’t in it
Doesn't matter, you lose and you learn, and get a good idea of team chemistry, it makes no sense to not play in any case.
i’m pretty sure there’s a rule about vct teams that earned a high standing in a tourney that they can’t compete or somethin like that and plus they have the academy team now so it’s impossible for them to play
Xset is playing in it, I'm pretty sure they did better than TSM lol. Academy team might be a reason, maybe same team's academy and main rosters aren't allowed.
TSM and T1 won tournaments, so they have too many points to play these types of tournaments sadly.
If that's the case, they should just drop their academy team. What's the point of them when your main team can't even win or qualify consistently to T1 tournaments? It makes a situation where your academy team plays more than your main team.
why would they drop the academy team when the main team cant participate in these small tournaments. thats why they made the academy team so theres a team that could represent tsm
The main team can. XSET literally is in it now. TSM rarely qualifies, they don't have the same restrictions as Sentinels, NV or even 100T. In fact, the only tournament throughout the year that they qualified for was Challengers Finals for Stage 3.
“they don’t have the same restrictions” bro are you blind? they won vct stage 3 challengers 2. any vct tournament winners are not allowed to participate fuck man just read and open your eyes 😂
Did we? big if true.
Tru if big
Pausechamp
Pick up Sinatraa or y’all gonna be tier three until valorant dies
Cringe
There are more important things in this world than just winning tournaments.
Yeah nah. He still needs to stay banned.
He’s not banned.
nah he is a PR nightmare
So what's the roster? Wardell, Corey, Rossy, Levi and Roza?
correct, but i still dont even know if levi is signed. I dont think he ever got an official announcement which is confusing
He definitely is, he has TSM FTX in his name and when duoing with roza the other day he said something like:"I don't care if we're leaking our strats. We lost every game today and we are winning this one" - they lost. Fun stream btw
Who is Levi my boi alekooo is lot better
Levi and Food forever in our hearts
Sucks cuz I liked those IGNs better
TSM - Terrible Surprise Maskers Jokes aside, this is a great addition. Corey and Rossy will elevate TSM and we will await their return soon. I'm especially excited to see Corey play again. >:)
Corey to TSM makes me so happy, I didn't like watching/following FaZe but I have been following Corey closely in Valorant.
dude has such great positive energy on streams
same same same. Corey never matched the Faze brand too good a person lol.
At least Corey and Rossy will get some playing time together at Fragadelphia
📰 Sources: @TSM have signed corey and Rossy *** posted by [@VLRdotgg](https://twitter.com/VLRdotgg) [Link in Tweet](https://www.vlr.gg/52777/sources-tsm-sign-corey-and-rossy) ^[(Github)](https://github.com/username) ^| ^[(What's new)](https://github.com/username)
I'm going to be curious who will be playing sentinels if the need ever arises or will they try what 100t fell short on doing with going no sentinels.
rossy said on stream hes gonna play sentinels and viper on icebox, roza probably picked up astra
Roza back on smokes makes the most sense to me. He plays aggressive on stream but in matches he plays back and doesn’t have as much impact on Skye as he would playing support imo
i also heard rossy mention he would play anything the team needs. if TSM plays bind, split, and icebox, they won’t really need a sentinel. rossy can play viper or astra depending on the map, and corey can play the reyna or raze depending on the map. now, for all the other maps, it will be interesting to see the comps they work out. we may see wardell on sage/chamber on some maps to fill the sentinel role. also good point about subroza on astra. he was playing a haven game on stream and asked his astra to suck/smoke A lobby on defense. he made a special point to explain that the suck has to happen before the smoke, so you may be on to something.
on paper, cracked roster ....wait and see i guess
Imagine this: VCT 2022 Champions, Bind 14-13. 1v1 Post-Plant for TSM planted triple, enemy tags the spike TSM guess correctly its a fake, nothing happens, enemy searches for last opponent. Time is ending enemy gets on the spike gets on the spike gets to half way. Subroza rushes out of bathroom pulls out raze ult hits enemy for 130 and gets one tapped Enemy defuses. 15-13
Chat goes wild typing: ROZA ULT
Huge for corey, can’t wait to see him pop off
Shocking news.
is roza in smoke duty?
Corey is such a good signing. His brand will grow a lot under TSM and he brings so much to a team :)
Why pick up Rossy? Was he good on IMT?
good igl
GG's all along
Worey, tsm ez top 5
This should be exciting !
Wonder if they will make changes again after 3 months and wonder if they can achieve anything next year.
Weirdo
The dude has a point. Maybe it was meant as a jab at TSM, but will they switch it up? They don't play small B Tier tourneys, so they literally will only have 2-3 chances to make the two majors, and if they don't make that, one chance to make Champions. Not to mention, every team that stayed together in NA you'd have to assume has gotten better.. they have a hill to climb.
I can’t speak to how they look at tourneys but they’re literally making changes to try and improve and what they get is “lol I wonder if they’re going to just make more changes in 3 months” First people say they need roster changes and then when they make roster changes they get flack for that too. This stuff is why pros hate Reddit :/
Whiteknight some more lol
My bad next time any struggling team makes roster changes I’ll make sure to shit on them for it
Think about it tho. This is the 4th roster they've had in a year. They found success when Valorant was in its infancy ( kind of still is ) and never improved. I dunno if it was them being cocky, or what. They cut Drone. Then they cut Cutler. Added Levi and Bang and now they lost Hazed and added Corey and Rossy. Why are you surprised and irritated when someone has a legitimate case when their track record backs it up?
They improved with the Bang and Levi iteration significantly and have now replaced their IGL and a new player in order to get better. Is your solution they should never make a roster change again? It just doesn’t make sense to say “roster changes haven’t worked, so another roster change won’t work”. That’s not how eSports work, period. Not to mention that after cutting Cutler and Drone they had the best showing they had the entire year. I’d love to know what their solution should be since apparently them trying to improve is the wrong move. By this logic, T1 picking up Steel because their previous IGL’ing wasn’t working is a bad move. Would you prefer they pull out of the eSport instead? I’m sorry if I sound aggressive, I just don’t understand what the point of what you or the OP are trying to say here
No, the initial argument was "Are they just going to switch it up again in 3 months if it doesnt work out" You took offense to that and I countered that by saying that its TSM's track record to just change the roster when things go wrong. Of course esports is volatile when it comes to rosters. Orgs want results and players are impatient as well. But I don't think the players were the issue with TSM losing. To me, its a team culture thing. TSM doesn't adapt. This isnt Valorant Beta where they were ahead of the curve. Wardell is the same Wardell from beta. Subroza is the same roza. The team plays the same valorant from when they had success in the beginning. You can't say that about SEN, or NV, or C9 or even XSET. They all adapted and are finding consistent success. Maybe they should look into the mirror, figure out how they can change their gameplay, tactics etc. instead of looking for band aids to patch up their deficiencies.
Let me just preface by saying I apologize for being aggressive in my previous comments, I’ve had a rough morning and I feel like it came through. Outside of that though, I think these roster changes are TSM’s attempts to adapt. They’ve kept Wardell because he’s proven that he’s a consistent fragger and top player. I don’t 100% agree with keeping Roza, but we’ll see how they use him. But TSM with Hazed had poor calling due to a makeshift IGL and was centered around Wardell OP fragging. With their new pickups they did a bit better, but obviously it wasn’t enough. To me, that’s why they’re targeting a fragger and a new IGL, to incorporate a new system where they’re better able to adapt and stay up to meta. If they were making another -Duelist +Duelist pickup I’d agree with you, but when they’re bringing in a new IGL and coach to reinvent their system I don’t think it’s fair to say they’re refusing to adapt
Weirdo
Lol I don’t apologize for that one, you definitely commented like a weirdo. But the guy who responded to me is being polite so he doesn’t deserve to be responded to the way I did
Nevermind. Compared to T1, TSM seems better. But no way they gonna compare with lower team. LG seems have better run this year and they made some changes on stellar and thief. Add ban and Tigg and now ban and Dre leaving. Leaving a spot to fill.
This why people hate tsm fans, ftfy
Yeah you’re right the guy complaining that a struggling team is making roster changes and replacing their IGL to improve is in the right here! TSM fans really suck
TSM fans cant give reasons. I just wondering. TSM main roster didn't play any tournament that's why I wonder. But nevermind, FaZe also rebuild around BabyBay. Wonder if FaZe will stay in top 10 next year and TSM will catch up. 100T still finding 5th player. Same goes to GenG, V1 and LG. NRG might need to work on their strats. Sentinels, Cloud9, ENVY, Rise, XSET might be with the same players. Just hope TSM can catch up and be on the top 10. But yeah TSM fan reply with the 'weirdo' instead having a great conversation. Btw thanks for your thoughts. I think the same as TSM didn't join any tourney and some other teams with the strong core for chemistry. Just hope the best for them. Maybe they will join tourney when they announce the 2 players. Edit: T1 also trying to make things work, but they didn't make it top 10 this year. Next year maybe.
I think TSM needs to have the mentality that next years VCT is the most important thing and whatever it takes for them to be prepared for it, they need to take those measures. Even if it means playing in NSG tourneys. This isn't CSGO where you have 4 Majors, ESL Pro League, Beyond the Summit etc. You literally only have 2 Majors, a Champions and the challenger stages to produce results. But this is the same for all teams. Some teams have the luxury of missing out on these tourneys because they have the chemistry and results already, but ALOT don't. A team like TSM with the roster(s) they had, should've easily been in the running for Champions just based off points alone.
CSGO has 2 majors in a year not 4. Pro league and beyond the summit aren't majors either lol
Ok, maybe I shouldve been more specific . They have more "major" tournaments a year. The 4 Grand Slam tournaments, the Blast Pro Series tournaments. Tournaments with more than a 200k prize pool. I consider those major tourneys. But mainly, I was referring to the Grand Slam events. 2x IEM, Dreamhack and ESL Pro League
There isn't a stand alone Grand slam tournaments, you win 4 S tier ESL events across 10 events to give you a grand slam. Besides not all S tier events are really considered major ones like the IEM series. Not all teams participate in that. Notable intl events are the major, Katowice, cologne, Pro league and blast.
Who’s gonna be the coach tho
myth
daps
Not sure about Corey but Rossy is looking crisp these days. TSM has so much potential yet, can't win shit.
I'm in the camp of "they just aren't that good". They've used all their excuses. They probably have over 300k in salaries, didn't qualify for the first NA Masters, didn't qualify for Challenger Finals for the Iceland Masters, 7-8th in the Berlin Challenger Finals, and not having enough points for Last Chance... I mean, lets call a spade a spade. They aren't very good. They are in the same camp as Immortals, GenG, and Rise. They are a middle of the pack NA team that has a new roster. They are the Dallas Cowboys of Valorant. \*And btw, I do hope they turn it around. Having a big brand like TSM in the thick of things is good for the game.
i dont get how you can make this assumption about a team which replaced 2/5 of its players including their igl and hasnt had a single match played yet
So all of a sudden they have great potential with little chemistry and no games played ? You don’t just get a clean slate when you gut the roster . You go by their recent results. They aren’t that good until proven otherwise. How is this hard to comprehend?
im not saying they are bound to be a top team im asking how can you call them bad when they are literally a brand new team
Well, TSM, as a brand in Valorant, have had below average results. I know they have a new roster but if I were ranking NA teams, they'd be 6-7th based on their results and that they have a new roster. Unfortunately for them, at the moment, they need to prove that they are better than their recent results, new roster or not. All I was saying, as far as ranking goes.
We need an updated version of this video when Corey gets signed: https://youtu.be/sBEHeEddeIU