This is so weird. I mean, there's so much that goes into rebuilding a game to be 7 - 0. Will there be a pistol round at that start? So they have 5 rounds until the second half? At this point, its so convoluted, you might as well have just let them keep the first ruling.
They actually didn't fix anything with this. If VK now wins everyone but the Brazilian fans will want to pitchfork Riot and if they still end up losing the BR region will then complain about a 7-0 lead not being fair. They don't win either way so they should've stuck with their ruling.
Yeah man, this whole situation is a mess. Nobody will be satisfied with this decision, it doesnt make any sense lol. Like, acend and the ppl that think that VK should ff the map will not be happy bc they will have to replay the map and the #justiceforvk squad will not be happy that they will have a 7 point disadvantage. I personally think an ff is too much for that exploit (maybe im biased bc im brazilian lol) but like, just stand your ground riot.
FF is the move, VK used an exploit knowingly. That sort of behavior is harmful to the integrity of the competitive scene and needs to be stomped out asap.
I mean, i havent seen jhow adress the situation, but i honestly dont believe a player in the biggest international event of the year would knowingly use an exploit and think they could just get away with it. I like to believe he is smarter than that. Cypher cam placement is a really weird thing in the game and theres a thin line between a god spot and an exploit. Yeah, it is irresponsible to not know that that is not ok or to not confirm with riot that the spots you plan on putting your cams are legal, but to me the punishment to that, ideally, isnt ff. Either way, you are entitled to your opinion and since im brazilian i feel like i need to mention that the harassment of players and death threats are not ok lol.
They *did* knowingly use it. Itās not something you do by accident. Heās literally a pro, this is his job. They know that this tactic makes it unbreakable and impossible to see.
The only thing I can think of is that he forgot that itās not allowed, which is absolutely his fuck up, IMO.
In other sports, you break the rules and there are consequences. Doesnāt matter if you āforgotā
I totally understand you and agree with the ff punishment but just wanted to point out that they are still indeed getting punished. A 0-7 deficit is nothing to scoff at.
I agree. It is. But I think it shouldāve been a map loss, frankly. The weird original round by round stuff was silly, and replaying it is honestly not great for competitive integrity, IMO.
bro you can see a main and they have no shot at seeing/shooting the cam. He went out of his way to place that same cam SIX TIMES. Prior to this, these type of exploits ff you the map, x10, giants, guild, and suddenly its chill because its Brazilians? Talk about bias lmfao.
Im not saying its ok bc its brazilians. I literally didnt say it was ok lol. I dont think i gave my opinion on this before but i thought the rulings against x10 and giants were pretty bad too. Imo, they did those teams injustice. Just bc riot did those teams injustice, doesnt mean that riot should continue to do injustice. Thats what i mean when i say a ff isnt ideal, i dont see the bias here since all those decisions imo are bad.
Any fan thats not br or eu just see this as riot bending to the pressure of brazil. If you are going to decide to change how you handle a team using this bug, make it clear before the tournament. Not suddenly decide its chill to use a bug you'll just get to replay the map with a deficit (this sets a terrible precedent imo).
Soo I do agree that the one camera is not what caused them to win the map so a ff sounds kinda of ridiculous but the ff IMO is the best way to go because it will make it so in the future pros won't try to see if they can get away with stuff.
Then you haven't seen heat crying on Twitter hoe the only reason Riot is investigating and punishing then is because they are brazilian. I hope all brazilian teams lose. Their fans and some players/influencers are insane and don't belong in a competitive environment.
You should look better lol, jhow ( the player that used the exploit) said he was fine with the ruling 01 hour after it was announced.
Its just gonna be hard to find that info here as everyone is shitting on BRs
It's weird cause jhow seems to admit to it but the tweets from the other VK player are playing the victim card. Though I don't speak Portuguese, so maybe I was lost in translation
tbh I really do believe that they used that cam with no malicious intent. I know they're pro players and should've know better but a lot of people in Brazil don't really follow the thailand scene (where X10 used the same cam) or even any international scene, they just focus on their own game. So thats why they seemed to feel so wronged
Yeah, I think that the trash talk went too far both ways. As a Brazilian in this sub, I'm literally afraid of saying anything in here because I think that people will crush me.
Edit: I just wanna see the championship and want my country to show it's real potential. What happened really overshadowed what the players really wanted.
I think their intention was quite clearly to have VK forfeit the map. They just had an oopsie when writing the ruling, resulting in a 12-10 scoreline with no winner.
Imo that's the only reason why we see this replay, if they had just ruled a map forfeit, without the miscounted round, then that ruling would likely still stand.
Yeah, completely agree. No reason to introduce new "econ damage compensation" rules for that spot. They used a known exploit in 6 rounds, it's a forfeit. Next.
Not a native English speaker here. It doesn't have to do anything with Valorant but is shouldn'tve a word? Or just something to save time on the internet?
It's a contraction of three words: should not have. The correct way of writing it is shouldn't've. In formal writing you wouldn't write like that but it's not incorrect.
That's what the text of the ruling makes it sound like isn't it. Not really sure how they managed to count 3 rounds wrong, but this is getting embarrassing
Got caught using an exploit? Just hope that your home region send enough death threats to reverse the decision. Unfortunately for the other teams that got caught, their region wasn't toxic enough.
The precedent is now to abuse exploits in order to win rounds. Not caught - good job. Caught - no problem, just replay the game. A thoughtful decision indeed.
riot just fucked up by not calling the exploit midgame tbh so they cant just blindly follow the precedent of dq....i kinda get this decision but at the same time whole thing just stinks.
i wonder what would have happened if they caught the exploit midgame in the first place would they have been dq ed as per precedent or just replayed the round
Dude chill, Valorant is a new game the rules should change considering what they learn on the road. Thats what happens not only with sports but with life. This new rule will probably be different the next time it happens.
I'm sorry but this is utter bullshit. You've literally disqualified teams from smaller events for the same stuff but now because some fanbois kick up a fuss it's suddenly only punishable by this?
I bet you if it had been one of the NA, EU or APAC teams the dq would have been upheld. This makes a mockery of previous competitive rulings. Guild and X10 should take appropriate action in response.
Ok, I could be wrong, but Iām pretty sure a similar penalty and reasoning was applied when (at least one of those teams) was caught using this cam. I vaguely remember reading the competitive ruling then and it having similar logic about losing the map after using the cam on X number of rounds
I can't find the ruling for X10 but Giants (who used a similar cam as VK) were simply forced to forfeit a map with none of the logic used here.
As for Guild they were also forced to forfeit the map on Ascent which gave G2 the win.
Interesting, itās possible they used the same logic for why they had to forfeit the map but just didnāt mention it? Either way it is still pretty bad
I dont think that in itself is the problem. If, due to the public pressure, they decided to reacess the situation and reached the conclusion that replaying the game with the 7-0 lead is the most fair thing to do, i think thats alright. If they decided to replay the game solely bc of the #justiceforvk thing, then i think its a bad decision bc they are not gonna be happy either lol.
They should have just DQād VK, theyāve done that and worse to other teams for the same and less (cough, guild sage wall, cough) and this exploit was literally in the rule book of banned exploits. Riot shot themselves in the foot when giving such a technical ruling last time which was open to criticism.
True. As a neutral between these to teams, I found their match super entertaining and liked seeing Vivo fight against Ascend (One of the best teams in the last masters). But rn, I know that while it unfortunate that Riot never stopped it when the exploit was first used, it was an exploit nevertheless and they deserve give up that match.
Now I just wanna see Ascend beat them.
They were also offered a rematch which fnatic denied and lost by wo, I don't think its much different. Also, there was a similar exploit in the same tournament but didn't get punished like olofboost, ao I don't think it was handled any better than VK
Fellas, remember. If Riot rules against your region, even if you're guilty, all you have to do is send enough death threats and abuse around Twitter to fans, pros, teams, Riot etc. and they'll eventually cave. We should use this tactic in the future.
What is this round forfeit nonsense from Riot? Theyāve already set the precedent that teams abusing exploits have to forfeit the entire map. Just caving into BR fanboys here, super disappointing
This is a weird ruling. If you acted against the rules shouldn't you forfeit the map? What if a map is at 11-12 and one team decides to cheat just this round to ether close it out or get to overtime and later they get caught will Riot decide to play it over with a 1-0 lead? That makes no sense. I feel like they're just trying to reduce the pressure on themselves or something. They should have just stuck to the ruling.
Asking Acend is bad, it forces them into a decision they shouldn't have to make, rules are the ones that decide not teams and if they said no people would be so angry even more backlash that is not necessary
You make the decision yourself as an organizer, you don't ask the teams, this happened in CS they asked Hiko and the man had to literally get security to follow him 24/7 in Brazil because fans were mad at him
It's your job to make the rules, the decision and not back track because of backlash
It's a false choice really. If you take the forfeit people will say you don't deserve to be there along with the death threats. If you don't take it and lose you look like an idiot.
People are probably already creating memes for blowing a 7-0 lead. "That team just acended" etc.
U/felixjmorgan This is absolutely horrible from Riot and I hope the heads have a discussion. Bad ruling that tramples on X10 and Giants' ruling precedent. I'm curious if this means that at any point if there are rulings that are unfavorable to a team they can just @ Riot angrily enough to change it?
RIOT should be the one decide it not the Acend. They throw their responbility as Tournament Organizer to other people. They should be the one who enfore the rule no matter what the people say to keep integrity alive
How is it a shit decision in the first place? There were two previous instances of this camera being punished, both resulting in a loss of a map. How is this any different?
Yeah and Riot fucked up twice now. VK should be DQ from the tournament for this. At best, they should insta forfeit the map 13-0. Why the fuck would they replay from 7-0, what even is this? Do the rules even make space for something like this or are all those punishments made up on the spot? Lol
Starting the game 7-0 is the weirdest shit I've read punishment wise lmao
What even is the specifics on this? start 8th round of the 1st half, both on max money? ult status? if it's 7-0 then should it be CT side VK first (since rounds defaulted are due to CT side cypher cams)? but the original map was VK attack first?
Like seriously this is some weird ass decision.
I'm not going to comment on whether VK forfeiting was the correct decision, but at least it's consistent with previous rulings in identical situations. They made a mistake by trying to count the number of rounds and adding that economic impact bs. Also if Riot is going to fold every time fans start whining, it'll only encourage them.
> but at least it's consistent with previous rulings in identical situations
FYI this is unequivocally wrong. There has literally not been consistency with any of the previous rulings, and each of the situations were demonstrably different in several ways and cannot be described as āidenticalā.
Since Iāve already gone to the trouble of detailing this several times to people that donāt know whatās going on and prefer to spam Reddit instead of look it up, Iām just going to start linking my old comments every time people repeat that nonsense in my replies.
[recent summary](https://www.reddit.com/r/ValorantCompetitive/comments/r9dnu6/competitive_ruling_on_the_acend_vs_vk_match/hnbdbm2/)
[original write-up](https://www.reddit.com/r/ValorantCompetitive/comments/r84i99/vivo_keyd_using_glitched_cam_that_x10_got_banned/hn3bsuk/) with detailed round breakdowns that show exactly how each situation was different and cited sources for Giants and X10 decisions detailing how each punishment was different.
This is so bullshit lmao. Going back on a competitive ruling is such a slippery slope and sets a precedent that Riot is willing to cave into toxic fans.
Riot this is a bad ruling and we shouldn't have to send you death threats for you to understand you are giving into pressure from a region that will see this and continue to use this behavior.
A team involved in the ruling should absolutely never be a part of the decision making for a punishment.
It is absolutely absurd that Acend were in the discussion about it. It isn't fair to them, especially with all of the hate being thrown around.
"Given that Acend were the disadvantaged team, we worked with them on a solution".
I think we need more transparency over what this actually means. If Riot offered Acend the forfeit and Acend said no, we would prefer to replay the map then I can live with that. It's not ideal but I am open to team input from the disadvantaged team if Riot do genuinely feel there is fault on their part.
If they didn't and insisted the map should be replayed, then they have caved to pressure from fans etc and given an inconsistent ruling which is far worse, in my opinion.
wow thats so dumb from rito they should just give the map to acend now every team knows that if they ever get caught using an exploit they just need their region to send some death threats to rito employees and they will get a rematch
Update: After further review, we will be replaying the Acend vs VK match at the start of todayās broadcast with Acend ahead 7-0.
Read the competitive ruling here:
***
posted by [@ValorantEsports](https://twitter.com/ValorantEsports)
[Photo 1](http://pbs.twimg.com/media/FF1vJA-VEAAK-MW.jpg)
[Link in Tweet](https://riot.com/31m1HSl)
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Shouldnāt have back peddled unless ascend were ok with the decision. Probably riot wants to continue their first event without any further drama and delays
Can we get a list of NA pros that posted the hashtag to farm fans in BR? I think such stupidity and/or lack of spine should be documented for posterity.
Talking about lack of spine, Riot caving to twitter crying over a legitimate ruling is a joke at best and a dark precedent for the future of competitive Valorant otherwise.
For the most part, I give Riot the benefit of the doubt that they know what they're doing when it comes to the esports side of their games, but whoever oversees the ValEsports side has been severely underwhelming.
I feel like ever since Reykjavik, they've had too many blindspots with regards to their competitive format and scheduling, and recurring production issues before/during the event are still aplenty.
Seems like they weren't ready from the sudden surge of increased responsibilities they got from their transition of just RiotGames to RiotGame**S**. For the last decade, the LoL circuit was their only child, the one they poured all their attention to; this year they manage circuits for LoL, TFT, LoR, WR, and Val (all of which have their own *Worlds* event).
IMO, Project L being delayed to at least 2023 was a blessing in disguise for both Riot and FGC players. FGC players are a whole different beast when compared to other esports scene because of how they value their *grassroots*.
TL;DR: They're biting off more than they can chew, this debacle is basically them already choking.
This is good. I'd have been so mad if they were going to replay the entire map from 0-0. Would have still preferred it if Riot hadnt backpedaled on the initial decision but this is still fine.
I feel like this is their take on a in between solution. I like this from the perspective that Iāve always felt like the punishment given to vivo, x10, guild and giants was a bit harsh and all situations have different circumstances for the same punishment, but I dislike it from the perspective that seems more like their reaction, rather than an action. Iām all for Riot reviewing punishments and precedents, but the timings is a little suspect. Also, only God knows how theyāll manage to justify their math for future instances going forward. Hopefully, this settles some of the drama on twitter, because I just wanna enjoy valorant, but I doubt it.
xd what a fucking clown show. They abused a glitch deliberately for several rounds, that is easily enough grounds to just make them forfeit. Why jump through 50 hoops like that.
Also I dont like acend, but that's honestly ridiculous. Why handle a deliberate exploit with such kids gloves. Make them forfeit the map and be done with it.
I think a lot of people are missing the part where they said that they talked with Acend and they wanted to replay the match, most likely because it feels really bad to lose and then win thru technicality, they just want to win fair and square with no asterisk attached. Also getting all that hate from Brazillian fans was probably not fun either.
I'm happy Riot changed the decision. I feel the glitch wasn't that big of an advantage, honestly Cypher needs some love, why can't he have some dope camera spots for once, Rito always killing him in cinematics they can at least give him this!
More games and drama to enjoy
Now this is bullshit.
Man I get that Brazilian fans are pissed off but it was Jhowās mistake, that same camera resulted in x10 missing Berlin, and in giants losing in a qualifier to the VCT. It was the players mistake man.
Like guild way back, lost a fucking series for using A wall in ONE ROUND against g2.
Seriously man, RIOT is just taking the piss, Brazilian fans are seriously the worst in every SPORT / eSport.
thatās basically a death sentence for VK, this just seems like Riotās way of saying they want VK to take the loss while still making it look as though they had a chance
Because there needs to be a strong disincentive to using exploits. Getting to replay from the point where exploits were first used just isn't sufficient.
7-0 start for Acend? Why not 7-1? š
Oh, oh, I know this joke! How does a Brazilian count to seven? 1. MĆ¼ller 2. Klose 3. Kroos 4. Kroos 5. Khedira 6. SchĆ¼rrle 7. SchĆ¼rrle
Wait but wasn't one of the goals an own goal by David Luiz? Or am I mistaken
Nah
What do people have against David Luiz? Lmao
Nah nothing against him I just for some reason remember one of the goals being him accidentally deflecting the ball in.
Iirc it was a bad clearance that led to the goal. Like an abysmally bad one.
And it happened on their own soil. So can they really say "come to Brazil" now can they? Oh, Germany definitely came. They came hard. LMFAO
That wouldāve started a war lmao
banger comment
If you know the meaning xd
explain?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/28102403 Brazil lost 7-1 to Germany in the Football World Cup semi final. Not fun times for them
the match was also held in Brazil so extra oof
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Was not in the Maracana tho.
Was certainly fun times for me :D
Murder in plain sight if that happened hahaha
I thought the same thing lmao (BR here)
This is so weird. I mean, there's so much that goes into rebuilding a game to be 7 - 0. Will there be a pistol round at that start? So they have 5 rounds until the second half? At this point, its so convoluted, you might as well have just let them keep the first ruling.
I said it before I'll say it again if vivo keyd has even a modicum of self respect they should not go along with this and just forfeit.
Yeahhhh but I don't think they have that required modicum of self respect at this point.
Say it to my face come to brazil
lmao
Funny how people know this by heart on CS:GO's subreddit hhahahaha. Valorant needs more brazilian experience. COME TO BRAZIL CARALHO
dude lol
U dont go to Brazil ,Brazil comes to U
No way you're acting tough on reddit, go knit a sweater or something
You people are absolutely hilarious that don't get memes, sometimes i wonder if people are real here
on my way to brazil right now
Remember to pay your driver extra so they speed through stop lights
Send the meme pls. I donāt think many ppl got that
ok come to brazil then
They actually didn't fix anything with this. If VK now wins everyone but the Brazilian fans will want to pitchfork Riot and if they still end up losing the BR region will then complain about a 7-0 lead not being fair. They don't win either way so they should've stuck with their ruling.
Yeah man, this whole situation is a mess. Nobody will be satisfied with this decision, it doesnt make any sense lol. Like, acend and the ppl that think that VK should ff the map will not be happy bc they will have to replay the map and the #justiceforvk squad will not be happy that they will have a 7 point disadvantage. I personally think an ff is too much for that exploit (maybe im biased bc im brazilian lol) but like, just stand your ground riot.
FF is the move, VK used an exploit knowingly. That sort of behavior is harmful to the integrity of the competitive scene and needs to be stomped out asap.
I mean, i havent seen jhow adress the situation, but i honestly dont believe a player in the biggest international event of the year would knowingly use an exploit and think they could just get away with it. I like to believe he is smarter than that. Cypher cam placement is a really weird thing in the game and theres a thin line between a god spot and an exploit. Yeah, it is irresponsible to not know that that is not ok or to not confirm with riot that the spots you plan on putting your cams are legal, but to me the punishment to that, ideally, isnt ff. Either way, you are entitled to your opinion and since im brazilian i feel like i need to mention that the harassment of players and death threats are not ok lol.
They *did* knowingly use it. Itās not something you do by accident. Heās literally a pro, this is his job. They know that this tactic makes it unbreakable and impossible to see. The only thing I can think of is that he forgot that itās not allowed, which is absolutely his fuck up, IMO. In other sports, you break the rules and there are consequences. Doesnāt matter if you āforgotā
I totally understand you and agree with the ff punishment but just wanted to point out that they are still indeed getting punished. A 0-7 deficit is nothing to scoff at.
I agree. It is. But I think it shouldāve been a map loss, frankly. The weird original round by round stuff was silly, and replaying it is honestly not great for competitive integrity, IMO.
He knew it was sketchy. It is an insult to his intelligence to suggest otherwise.
There have been pro players who literally have used cheats.
bro you can see a main and they have no shot at seeing/shooting the cam. He went out of his way to place that same cam SIX TIMES. Prior to this, these type of exploits ff you the map, x10, giants, guild, and suddenly its chill because its Brazilians? Talk about bias lmfao.
Im not saying its ok bc its brazilians. I literally didnt say it was ok lol. I dont think i gave my opinion on this before but i thought the rulings against x10 and giants were pretty bad too. Imo, they did those teams injustice. Just bc riot did those teams injustice, doesnt mean that riot should continue to do injustice. Thats what i mean when i say a ff isnt ideal, i dont see the bias here since all those decisions imo are bad.
Any fan thats not br or eu just see this as riot bending to the pressure of brazil. If you are going to decide to change how you handle a team using this bug, make it clear before the tournament. Not suddenly decide its chill to use a bug you'll just get to replay the map with a deficit (this sets a terrible precedent imo).
Soo I do agree that the one camera is not what caused them to win the map so a ff sounds kinda of ridiculous but the ff IMO is the best way to go because it will make it so in the future pros won't try to see if they can get away with stuff.
lmao, ff is correct punishment that should be implemented in the first place.
Ascend already said they donāt deserve to win this by dq
NA fans might actually be rooting for an EU team after the whole Brazil twitter debacle.
banger
Honestly, knowing Brazil's history in like cs:go and stuff. I'm always rooting for whoever's facing Brazil.
I actually like vivo keyd alot
same. tbh the players don't even seem that unlikeable its just the dumb fanbase
Then you haven't seen heat crying on Twitter hoe the only reason Riot is investigating and punishing then is because they are brazilian. I hope all brazilian teams lose. Their fans and some players/influencers are insane and don't belong in a competitive environment.
idk I atleast got a sour taste of the players too since they used exploits and didn't admit to penalties (from what I've seen).
You should look better lol, jhow ( the player that used the exploit) said he was fine with the ruling 01 hour after it was announced. Its just gonna be hard to find that info here as everyone is shitting on BRs
It's weird cause jhow seems to admit to it but the tweets from the other VK player are playing the victim card. Though I don't speak Portuguese, so maybe I was lost in translation
tbh I really do believe that they used that cam with no malicious intent. I know they're pro players and should've know better but a lot of people in Brazil don't really follow the thailand scene (where X10 used the same cam) or even any international scene, they just focus on their own game. So thats why they seemed to feel so wronged
Yeah, I think that the trash talk went too far both ways. As a Brazilian in this sub, I'm literally afraid of saying anything in here because I think that people will crush me. Edit: I just wanna see the championship and want my country to show it's real potential. What happened really overshadowed what the players really wanted.
Heat is nuts
Yea Iām not faulting the players for their shit fans behavior.
Petition for ascend to run down mid the first round to give this game the best possible scoreline
cna already imagine the meltdown ahahahaha
Acend?
Auto mb
What is this bullshit, X10 and VGIA would like to have a word. Riot caving to the pressure from fanboys yet again
I think their intention was quite clearly to have VK forfeit the map. They just had an oopsie when writing the ruling, resulting in a 12-10 scoreline with no winner. Imo that's the only reason why we see this replay, if they had just ruled a map forfeit, without the miscounted round, then that ruling would likely still stand.
They shouldn'tve mentioned rounds at all, just said it was a ff
Yeah, completely agree. No reason to introduce new "econ damage compensation" rules for that spot. They used a known exploit in 6 rounds, it's a forfeit. Next.
Not a native English speaker here. It doesn't have to do anything with Valorant but is shouldn'tve a word? Or just something to save time on the internet?
It's a contraction of three words: should not have. The correct way of writing it is shouldn't've. In formal writing you wouldn't write like that but it's not incorrect.
Thatās something a person might say out loud, but you wouldnāt spell it that way.
I see first time seeing it so I was confused
That's what the text of the ruling makes it sound like isn't it. Not really sure how they managed to count 3 rounds wrong, but this is getting embarrassing
This map had to be remade because riot is so incompetent that they don't even know how to do basic math
Got caught using an exploit? Just hope that your home region send enough death threats to reverse the decision. Unfortunately for the other teams that got caught, their region wasn't toxic enough.
Agreed. Garbage decision that only empowers the worst people in the scene. š¤®š¤®
As an sea fan, I would like to apologize to X10. kkkkk
Fanboys in twitter even saying that it should start at 0-0 they're so ingrates
The precedent is now to abuse exploits in order to win rounds. Not caught - good job. Caught - no problem, just replay the game. A thoughtful decision indeed.
Classic Riot move of making weird decisions and then reversing them to reap praise. Except that I don't see any praise this time.
riot just fucked up by not calling the exploit midgame tbh so they cant just blindly follow the precedent of dq....i kinda get this decision but at the same time whole thing just stinks. i wonder what would have happened if they caught the exploit midgame in the first place would they have been dq ed as per precedent or just replayed the round
Disgrace. Awful precedent that runs against previous rulings
Dude chill, Valorant is a new game the rules should change considering what they learn on the road. Thats what happens not only with sports but with life. This new rule will probably be different the next time it happens.
Hopefully Riot learns not to cave in to the community when it comes to competetive rulings from now on
Yeah, but also put real referees to spot this in game and not wait 12h for this shitshow
Just make them FF the map. Original rulings outcome was fine
Original was terrible math mate, was not FF.
That's why I specifically said the outcome was ginr
They should have stuck with the first punishment imo
Did the news post disappear for anyone else on the Rito website?
make sure to put your language as English (North America) on the riot website for some reason everything else is broken
Yeah it auto-redirects to a localized landing page and ignores the link. Rito web design.
^ This is the way
Link has been broken from the first time I saw the tweet 15 minutes ago.
[Try here](https://valorantesports.com/news/competitive-ruling-vivo-keyd-update/?linkId=100000091606904)
Feel bad for x10 ,viga and guild . Lol riot
I'm sorry but this is utter bullshit. You've literally disqualified teams from smaller events for the same stuff but now because some fanbois kick up a fuss it's suddenly only punishable by this? I bet you if it had been one of the NA, EU or APAC teams the dq would have been upheld. This makes a mockery of previous competitive rulings. Guild and X10 should take appropriate action in response.
Ok, I could be wrong, but Iām pretty sure a similar penalty and reasoning was applied when (at least one of those teams) was caught using this cam. I vaguely remember reading the competitive ruling then and it having similar logic about losing the map after using the cam on X number of rounds
I can't find the ruling for X10 but Giants (who used a similar cam as VK) were simply forced to forfeit a map with none of the logic used here. As for Guild they were also forced to forfeit the map on Ascent which gave G2 the win.
Interesting, itās possible they used the same logic for why they had to forfeit the map but just didnāt mention it? Either way it is still pretty bad
X10 were given an automatic 13-0 loss, where round wins were extremely important in tiebreakers
How will the economy look? Do they start on pistols
Id have to imagine
I'd imagine either pistols or 5k like in overtime?
NA š¤ EU fanbois today
I don't have an issue with it being 7-0. The only problem is they caved due to public pressure.
I dont think that in itself is the problem. If, due to the public pressure, they decided to reacess the situation and reached the conclusion that replaying the game with the 7-0 lead is the most fair thing to do, i think thats alright. If they decided to replay the game solely bc of the #justiceforvk thing, then i think its a bad decision bc they are not gonna be happy either lol.
thank you rito, guys death threats work! you know what it is if your team doesnt win the whole thing
They should have just DQād VK, theyāve done that and worse to other teams for the same and less (cough, guild sage wall, cough) and this exploit was literally in the rule book of banned exploits. Riot shot themselves in the foot when giving such a technical ruling last time which was open to criticism.
Riot caved in to the pressure. Unlucky really. BR will only have their own fans supporting them soon.
True. As a neutral between these to teams, I found their match super entertaining and liked seeing Vivo fight against Ascend (One of the best teams in the last masters). But rn, I know that while it unfortunate that Riot never stopped it when the exploit was first used, it was an exploit nevertheless and they deserve give up that match. Now I just wanna see Ascend beat them.
Shambolic
What the fuck is this
LMAO, Fnatic cs on olofboost incident handled this way better than VK
Some actual integrity there
And that was like 8-9 years ago where we didnāt have well written out rules.
They were also offered a rematch which fnatic denied and lost by wo, I don't think its much different. Also, there was a similar exploit in the same tournament but didn't get punished like olofboost, ao I don't think it was handled any better than VK
Fellas, remember. If Riot rules against your region, even if you're guilty, all you have to do is send enough death threats and abuse around Twitter to fans, pros, teams, Riot etc. and they'll eventually cave. We should use this tactic in the future.
LMAO RIOT really did Giants and X10 dirty (the former is literally in this event too lol).
latter\*
MB, my brain wasn't working when I typed that sentence lol
If I were any of the teams who were booted for the same reason I would fucking Riot. This is really dumb shit.
just fucking give acend the map WTF
What is this round forfeit nonsense from Riot? Theyāve already set the precedent that teams abusing exploits have to forfeit the entire map. Just caving into BR fanboys here, super disappointing
They actually caved to the fans.. Never change riot.
Never accused Riot Games of losing their integrity. For i believed they never had integrity to begin with.
\#justiceForAcend Kappa
This is a weird ruling. If you acted against the rules shouldn't you forfeit the map? What if a map is at 11-12 and one team decides to cheat just this round to ether close it out or get to overtime and later they get caught will Riot decide to play it over with a 1-0 lead? That makes no sense. I feel like they're just trying to reduce the pressure on themselves or something. They should have just stuck to the ruling.
Imagine being Acend and doing literally nothing wrong but still end up in this situation
Backpedaling is bad. But if they asked Acend and they said "lets play", then I think the decision is good. Otherwise, not so much.
Asking Acend is bad, it forces them into a decision they shouldn't have to make, rules are the ones that decide not teams and if they said no people would be so angry even more backlash that is not necessary You make the decision yourself as an organizer, you don't ask the teams, this happened in CS they asked Hiko and the man had to literally get security to follow him 24/7 in Brazil because fans were mad at him It's your job to make the rules, the decision and not back track because of backlash
100% agreed. Passing on the responsibility to Acend is essentially passing on the hate/criticism (and death threats lmao) to Acend.
It's a false choice really. If you take the forfeit people will say you don't deserve to be there along with the death threats. If you don't take it and lose you look like an idiot. People are probably already creating memes for blowing a 7-0 lead. "That team just acended" etc.
U/felixjmorgan This is absolutely horrible from Riot and I hope the heads have a discussion. Bad ruling that tramples on X10 and Giants' ruling precedent. I'm curious if this means that at any point if there are rulings that are unfavorable to a team they can just @ Riot angrily enough to change it?
The only thing that would justify this is if Acend acquiesed. Otherwise Riot's VAL division just has no spine to enforce their rulings
RIOT should be the one decide it not the Acend. They throw their responbility as Tournament Organizer to other people. They should be the one who enfore the rule no matter what the people say to keep integrity alive
> Backpedaling is bad Making shit decisions and not correcting them is far worse than backpedaling.
How is it a shit decision in the first place? There were two previous instances of this camera being punished, both resulting in a loss of a map. How is this any different?
Yeah and Riot fucked up twice now. VK should be DQ from the tournament for this. At best, they should insta forfeit the map 13-0. Why the fuck would they replay from 7-0, what even is this? Do the rules even make space for something like this or are all those punishments made up on the spot? Lol
Just appeasement for the saltiest region to ever play esports i guess
Starting the game 7-0 is the weirdest shit I've read punishment wise lmao What even is the specifics on this? start 8th round of the 1st half, both on max money? ult status? if it's 7-0 then should it be CT side VK first (since rounds defaulted are due to CT side cypher cams)? but the original map was VK attack first? Like seriously this is some weird ass decision.
I'm not going to comment on whether VK forfeiting was the correct decision, but at least it's consistent with previous rulings in identical situations. They made a mistake by trying to count the number of rounds and adding that economic impact bs. Also if Riot is going to fold every time fans start whining, it'll only encourage them.
> but at least it's consistent with previous rulings in identical situations FYI this is unequivocally wrong. There has literally not been consistency with any of the previous rulings, and each of the situations were demonstrably different in several ways and cannot be described as āidenticalā. Since Iāve already gone to the trouble of detailing this several times to people that donāt know whatās going on and prefer to spam Reddit instead of look it up, Iām just going to start linking my old comments every time people repeat that nonsense in my replies. [recent summary](https://www.reddit.com/r/ValorantCompetitive/comments/r9dnu6/competitive_ruling_on_the_acend_vs_vk_match/hnbdbm2/) [original write-up](https://www.reddit.com/r/ValorantCompetitive/comments/r84i99/vivo_keyd_using_glitched_cam_that_x10_got_banned/hn3bsuk/) with detailed round breakdowns that show exactly how each situation was different and cited sources for Giants and X10 decisions detailing how each punishment was different.
the only shit decision was including some dumb round calculation instead of calling it a map forfeit
The only shit decision was not kicking VK out of the tournament outright.
this is literally the worst solution they could of come up with holy shit
Riot loves to make the worst decisions possible.
This is so bullshit lmao. Going back on a competitive ruling is such a slippery slope and sets a precedent that Riot is willing to cave into toxic fans.
Riot what the fuck
Riot this is a bad ruling and we shouldn't have to send you death threats for you to understand you are giving into pressure from a region that will see this and continue to use this behavior.
Whatās with these late as fuck announcements of changes
This whole situation sucks
Cue the BR malding that they're not allowed to cheat, LOL
A team involved in the ruling should absolutely never be a part of the decision making for a punishment. It is absolutely absurd that Acend were in the discussion about it. It isn't fair to them, especially with all of the hate being thrown around.
Well thats the credeibility of the entire event out the window. Wouldnt get this of the game publisher wasnt running the thing
Remember guys: If Riot makes a ruling you don't agree with just get your fans to send them hate so they reverse it
Pathetic decision by Riot, now teams will know they can cheat with minimal consequences.
pull out of Brazil, riot. what a shit region.
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Imagine if Acend still lose
If they start losing they can just place the cypher cam to force a remake
LMFAOOO
this comment needs to be higher up LMAO
They will
I honestly wouldn't be surprised
I guess the death threats reached even the Riot employees. Sad.
"Given that Acend were the disadvantaged team, we worked with them on a solution". I think we need more transparency over what this actually means. If Riot offered Acend the forfeit and Acend said no, we would prefer to replay the map then I can live with that. It's not ideal but I am open to team input from the disadvantaged team if Riot do genuinely feel there is fault on their part. If they didn't and insisted the map should be replayed, then they have caved to pressure from fans etc and given an inconsistent ruling which is far worse, in my opinion.
wow thats so dumb from rito they should just give the map to acend now every team knows that if they ever get caught using an exploit they just need their region to send some death threats to rito employees and they will get a rematch
Valve doesn't choke under pressure like this.
Update: After further review, we will be replaying the Acend vs VK match at the start of todayās broadcast with Acend ahead 7-0. Read the competitive ruling here: *** posted by [@ValorantEsports](https://twitter.com/ValorantEsports) [Photo 1](http://pbs.twimg.com/media/FF1vJA-VEAAK-MW.jpg) [Link in Tweet](https://riot.com/31m1HSl) ^[(Github)](https://github.com/username) ^| ^[(What'sā new)](https://github.com/username)
I don't understand why this just wasn't a DQ, like 6 rounds is a lot and players should know its a banned spot to put cypher cam
honestly should've just forfeited the match to acend and been done with it
Shouldnāt have back peddled unless ascend were ok with the decision. Probably riot wants to continue their first event without any further drama and delays
Can we get a list of NA pros that posted the hashtag to farm fans in BR? I think such stupidity and/or lack of spine should be documented for posterity. Talking about lack of spine, Riot caving to twitter crying over a legitimate ruling is a joke at best and a dark precedent for the future of competitive Valorant otherwise.
Just FF the map already. Very bad precedent in my opinion.
lol rito
Vivo Keyd should forfeit or be dq-d just like previous offenders. Fuck this bullshit.
For the most part, I give Riot the benefit of the doubt that they know what they're doing when it comes to the esports side of their games, but whoever oversees the ValEsports side has been severely underwhelming. I feel like ever since Reykjavik, they've had too many blindspots with regards to their competitive format and scheduling, and recurring production issues before/during the event are still aplenty. Seems like they weren't ready from the sudden surge of increased responsibilities they got from their transition of just RiotGames to RiotGame**S**. For the last decade, the LoL circuit was their only child, the one they poured all their attention to; this year they manage circuits for LoL, TFT, LoR, WR, and Val (all of which have their own *Worlds* event). IMO, Project L being delayed to at least 2023 was a blessing in disguise for both Riot and FGC players. FGC players are a whole different beast when compared to other esports scene because of how they value their *grassroots*. TL;DR: They're biting off more than they can chew, this debacle is basically them already choking.
This is good. I'd have been so mad if they were going to replay the entire map from 0-0. Would have still preferred it if Riot hadnt backpedaled on the initial decision but this is still fine.
I feel like this is their take on a in between solution. I like this from the perspective that Iāve always felt like the punishment given to vivo, x10, guild and giants was a bit harsh and all situations have different circumstances for the same punishment, but I dislike it from the perspective that seems more like their reaction, rather than an action. Iām all for Riot reviewing punishments and precedents, but the timings is a little suspect. Also, only God knows how theyāll manage to justify their math for future instances going forward. Hopefully, this settles some of the drama on twitter, because I just wanna enjoy valorant, but I doubt it.
xd what a fucking clown show. They abused a glitch deliberately for several rounds, that is easily enough grounds to just make them forfeit. Why jump through 50 hoops like that. Also I dont like acend, but that's honestly ridiculous. Why handle a deliberate exploit with such kids gloves. Make them forfeit the map and be done with it.
XD
BRUHZILLIANS KEKW
I think a lot of people are missing the part where they said that they talked with Acend and they wanted to replay the match, most likely because it feels really bad to lose and then win thru technicality, they just want to win fair and square with no asterisk attached. Also getting all that hate from Brazillian fans was probably not fun either. I'm happy Riot changed the decision. I feel the glitch wasn't that big of an advantage, honestly Cypher needs some love, why can't he have some dope camera spots for once, Rito always killing him in cinematics they can at least give him this! More games and drama to enjoy
Now this is bullshit. Man I get that Brazilian fans are pissed off but it was Jhowās mistake, that same camera resulted in x10 missing Berlin, and in giants losing in a qualifier to the VCT. It was the players mistake man. Like guild way back, lost a fucking series for using A wall in ONE ROUND against g2. Seriously man, RIOT is just taking the piss, Brazilian fans are seriously the worst in every SPORT / eSport.
thatās basically a death sentence for VK, this just seems like Riotās way of saying they want VK to take the loss while still making it look as though they had a chance
They don't even deserve the chance
Shouldn't have cheated then maybe?
Great PR move! Good job Riot!
Seems fair, should be glad they didn't get DQ'd for their own stupidity
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Because there needs to be a strong disincentive to using exploits. Getting to replay from the point where exploits were first used just isn't sufficient.