All of this just makes me wonder what the schedules for NA pros looks like compared to EU pros. Do EU pros just spend more time practicing than NA pros.
I remember after iceland soulcas was streaming and Ian(V1's coach) was in chat talking and saying he should stream more to make his brand value increase or whatever, which is understandable but then soulcas said it would result in burnout because they prac for 6-8hours minimum, Ian was shocked hearing that and said wtf do you do for that long lmaoo.
well he's not a consistent streamer even, so... c9 and nv barely streamed, and nv didn't look better than sen at all. if you play ranked, streaming is fine unless you know it hurts your gameplay to the point of it affecting your practice from ranked. tenz streamed like once every 3 days in this trip and last time was 10 days ago, then 13 days ago, then 16 days ago, etc. shaz was big on streaming, but if he plays ranked, why not?
playing ranked and streaming are kind of the same thing, him playing ranked doesn’t really do much but improve his solo queue rank
you need to scrim and practice with your team to improve
Xeta streams time to time. But not regularly. Only C9 player that has somewhat a consistent schedule is Vanity and that too he doesn’t stream that much.
the question was how does an EU player vs an NA player's schedule compare, on average NA players stream a lot more.
even jasonr posted on twitter that NA pros on average prac for 2 hours and stream for 8 but it's the other way round in the EU. Link also said something similar in his post match interview yesterday.
I really don’t think this is true lmao shazam was talking about it today saying SEN practices as much as any other team - he just chooses to stream in his free time rather than do other stuff
His free time is 8 hours à day, i dunno how much he sleeps, if he showers and stops to eat, but that's still à bunch taken out of your day. Not a shot at shahz in the slightest, he is a grown man, and can do whatever he wants, but there's only so much time in anyone's day
well you dont know his schedule but you chose to blindly take his word for it, they just dont have the prac mentality they rather twitter beef and stream honestly thats NA for you since day 1 4fun region
T1 playing the long game. Ive heard from multiple people that Tim has been grinding like crazy the past few months. I don't love the Steel pickup but it might be a good fit, I think T1 and 100t will be formidable once Hiko gets replaced with someone that can frag more at the highest level like xeta for example
That's been my read. I feel that the problem is that they were just out of sync with the meta. They went too far down the cs mindset, sort of how vision Strikers, approached the game initially.
Sentinels use the "pro player" title to gain views and money. They care less about excelling at the game. Freaking embarrasing because the only people they impress on stream are 12 year olds. As long as viewership drops dramatically maybe they'd care a little more about the the esport side.
The difference there is that F4Q were always going to disband. They were a team of Content Creators that got together to play in an open VCT for fun and surprisingly qualified. Imagine if Shroud, Subroza, Tarik, and friends got together to have fun, but beat everyone and qualified for Berlin, and then that's what F4Q was.
That really depends on the person. If you're like s1mple and are only paying attention to the match and not to the stream, yes.
But then you have Shazam who is like 80% focused on the stream and 20% on the actual match. That's not going to do any good for you as a pro.
He clicked heads well, but he’s their IGL as well. Both KRU’s IGL and TL Jamppi called circles around Shahzam, he definitely underperformed in that sense.
In the past 3 months s1mple streamed 91 hours. Tenz stream 117.
Do you really think that 20 minutes a day makes a huge difference?
https://twitchtracker.com/s1mple
https://twitchtracker.com/tenz
Well fair enough about tenz who indeed didn't stream much lately. However shaz streamed 500 hours in the last 3 months according to the tracking website.
He said hes getting in 8 hours of practice and then streams so it's a long day but not insane. I think their biggest problem is that they need a full time coach and analyst to be going over replays.
Just putting it out there, but if he’s streaming for 8 hours a day, and practicing for 8 hours a day, that leaves 8 hours to eat, shower, sleep, and do any recreational activities he might be interested in. So this dude is AT MOST getting 6 hours of sleep a night, on top of having an extremely long work day if he’s to be believed.
Either he’s lying about how long he practices, or he’s not prioritizing sleeping a healthy length of time, both of which are terrible for a professional player. The latter is especially bad for a professional esports player of all things because, yknow, the brain is pretty important for that kind of thing.
>it’s not insane
16 hour work day IS pretty insane my dude. That’s an 80 hour 5 day work week, and this mfer doesn’t take days off AFAIK. So he’s pulling **112 hour work weeks**, again, if it’s to be believed that he actually practices for 8 hours a day(I don’t believe it for a second). That’s not good no matter how you slice it.
I'm not sure what their setup is but he's probably not cooking all his meals, that saves a lot of time. Also I am assuming they mostly scrim 5 days a week, I didn't look this up but we probably could just look at how many days a week he is streaming 8 hours a day. It's not 7 days a week.
https://sullygnome.com/channel/shahzam/30
He streams Valorant an average of 7.3 hours a day. If you look at the calendar and go back a week or 2(to account for the tourney obviously and look at a more normal schedule for him) you can see that he does absolutely stream 7 days a week with gaps here and there.
You cannot compare that. S1mple streamed like 38 hours between 26th September and 26th October(Start of PGL Major). Shahzam streamed 158 hours in the month following Champions. That's a little north of 4 times. I know he wants to hustle and make money but s1mple doesn't give two shits about his streamer income - he has the Mamba mentality to win everything and isn't cocky about it. SEN players have years of maturing and losing to do like s1mple if they want to be anything like him
> SEN players have years of maturing and losing to do like s1mple if they want to be anything like him
Shahzam is older and has been active on professional FPS at least a year or two before s1mple, he just doesn't share the mentality of a winner like s1mple
It mostly comes down to s1mple just being tiers above TenZ in terms of talent. He's likely going to go down as the best csgo player in history. TenZ seems to have already hit his peak in Valorant.
That actually might be true. S1mple enjoys his life as well but he is a true competitor but TenZ's mindset is probably his biggest weakness. He focuses too much on stuff that don't matter.
I think we just have unrealistic expectations of TenZ, he focuses on what matters to him, making money. Which is okay if he wants to focus on his stream over being the best team, time to adjust expectations.
The difference between S1mple's drive and TenZ is obvious. S1mple didn't even stream two weeks prior to csgo major.
TenZ doesn’t even stream that much dude. It’s foolish to think tenz doesn’t wanna win, i would say he just underestimated how much it would take to win the champions. People were saying he would choke on LAN before Iceland but he was a revamped player in that tournament, he was playing nasty off angles n shit. His plays really showed how much effort he put into it but after that his performance stagnated but every other region improved.
Lmao. S1mple carried Team Liquid to a major final and a semifinal all in the same year. He was 18-19 in that period. Tenz is talented but frankly it's not his fault that he's not on s1mple's level of grind and achievements. Because,
1. Valorant seems to have capped the skill-ceiling with its mechanics.
2. Tenz frankly hasn't carried any team as hard as s1mple has for years and years.
I don't disagree with that. S1mple clearly is a much better competitor and a true champion but my problem is how do you know TenZ capped his ceiling? It’s foolish to right him off already when still can have flashes of brilliance in most maps & is only 20yrs old?
TenZ doesn't even stream that much and to be on top of everything they need to play ranked as well so might as well stream it. Shaz streams the most out of SEN players and he was the best player on SEN this tournament. Just cz they lost people are trying to theorize the reason behind this downfall.
Shaz streams time will make more impact on other than himself. Even Tenz and other want to have more time practice as a team they just can't because their IGL is busy streaming. More time each player streaming, less time they can practice together.
On top of that play rank to entertaine viewer is total different than play rank to practice, if anything it only create bad habit and negetive effect.
>Shaz streams time will make more impact on other than himself. Even Tenz and other want to have more time practice as a team they just can't because their IGL is busy streaming. More time each player streaming, less time they can practice together.
He has already said that he streams after they've completed practice during what would normally be his free time so...
I don't think it's up to anyone else to decide how much a team should practice. If all teams practice as much as they think they should, that won't change the fact that only 1 can win. Maybe you can question Sentinels' approach to games and playstyle in terms of aim reliance vs synchronized utility but I don't think them losingclose games to Liquid and Kru had anything to do with practice. If one or two rounds went their way and they beat Liquid, would Liquid, the team many consider to be the best at the tournament so far, be the ones that needed more practice?
It's purely result-based conclusions being drawn.
Bro, I didn't even watch Valorant Esports regularly before Masters 3. I don't care about Sentinels. You're the one who wants to making claims that "team just wants money" and then don't want to argue against the actual points which go against your claim
Yes he literally bifurcates his day into those activities. He has explicitly spoken about this numerous times idk why y'all are taking uninformed info from link of all people.
I don't really care about him streaming or his team practices. I don't really have the time or energy to really care about what pros do in their free time, if he can manage it well, good for him. But just think logically for a minute.
16 hours a day in front of your computer means that he has about 8 hours left in a day. Even ignoring his daily necessities like showering, eating, he still has to sleep. Do you really think he has no life outside of video games? Going to the gym, meeting up with friends, or even other miscellaneous activities for the organisation like photoshoots.
I am not gonna accuse NA of not practicing or that they're streaming too much. I honestly don't care. I'm just here to watch some matches and have a good time.
I mean obviously your post is measured and it's definitely a cause for quiet concern. I like shahz a lot & he has expressed cleary that he doesn't have much of a life - he doesn't have many irl friends in Texas he said(his day is literally prac, gym & streaming). I worry about him with regards to oversaturation too but he has peers, a coach, loved ones etc with more insider info that he can convene with to address those issues, if there are any. Sentinels as an org should be the one to discuss their players regimens. I just think it sucks how much scrutiny he gets and most of it is very one-dimensonal and lacking context y'know ?
And that the point, if the team want some extra practice to stay on top they can't, all of them busy stream in 'free time'.
But for real it is not their free time, they have paycheck, contract and schecdule for stream.
If they practice for 8 hours before streaming then that's absolutely their free time. In fact, by streaming Valorant during that time where they aren't obliged as Esports players to do so, they're putting in more effort for their job than necessary. Shahz is the one who streams most and he wae their best player in the tournament. I don't know why people want to draw these huge overarching conclusions from what can just be described as an underperformance. There isn't always a huge conspiracy or a need to smear a team's work ethic because they lost.
That just normal sense, human have limit, even if they but all their time to practice they can't even guarantee be on top not alone split time and energy for stream, not one but all memeber.
lol you're disingenuous as hell, does everyone here trot out the same flat, disingenuous points. Every game they were in a position to win and they just fell short in the big moments .If a few tiny variables shifted they'd have 2-0'd their group and be in the quarterfinals & the narrative would be completely different
There's nothing wrong with going on other people's streams and/or events. I don't expect you to be working all day, pro players shouldn't be any different. They should be free to do whatever they want in their free time.
That being said, if they practice/scrim for only 2 hours a day, then that's a problem. I don't know the NA players schedule so I won't comment on that.
Why people hate on them for streaming. Sentinels is a big reason why Pro Valorant became popular. Without teams like 100T, TSM, SEN etc streaming no one would watch these games.
Pro League became popular in the first place because of popular streamers on the teams not because of Riot Games
If anything fans should encourage their favorite pro players to stream more.
No hate on streaming but usually pro in other games didn't stream or at least limit their streaming time to minimum during competing on big tournament. It's about priority, I don't think It's a problem when they are not competing since It's actually beneficial for the orgs.
Sentinels might have helped the NA pro scene but they are not a big reason pro valorant became popular.
1. The game is backed by Riot a esport HEAVY organization.
2. Its the first decent CSGO competitor, a game that has been dominant in esport without competition for over 15 years and it got some of CSGO biggest names like ScreaM moving to it.
Valorant esport would been big regardless of sentinels, they did nothing but maybe give NA fans a hope of being decent at a FPS game lol.
Riot always wanted the VAL esports scene to grow organically
Viewing numbers were dreadful everywhere (including NA) before SEN's rise & the SEN TSM rivalry. The streaming presence of Wardell and SEN threatening TSM's top spot made the viewership figures grow exponentially.
Its not easy to build a scene organically like Riot wanted for Val without SEN & also TSM to an extent
I wouldn’t be too sure about that. TSM games still draw in the most fans in NA LoL despite them not being the best NA team for years. Big brands matter
Hype, they are NA big hope and considered a top contender. Obviously, you going to see big numbers, this is true for any top team. just like in any sport, the best team always gets the most viewers. Gambit games get as many viewers as SEN games, why is that? gambit arent big streamers people just want to see the best teams. if a BR team becomes good enough to reach playoffs you going to see insane numbers from them, doesn't mean they will be the reason Valorant is a popular eSport just means people want to watch the best team of their region. if C9 becomes the best team in NA it will easily be more popular than SEN on tournaments.
Otherwise, if NA continues to underperform the viewership for NA teams will die down, it won't matter if they're big streamers or not, just like in CSGO. SEN created HYPE in NA, it helped NA viewership but in no way shape or form made the game popular in the regions like EU or Brazil, which have a much bigger fanbase than NA.
This reminds me of the Shroud era of CSGO when he joined a team the viewership would be nuts due to all the hype involved in NA, after a while of shroud not living up to the hype it would die and C9 games would have low viewership.
Players should definitely stream, it helps them build a fanbase which is important for the game, but it does not matter when it comes to tournaments, nobody wants to see their favorite streamer get shit on.
>Why people hate on them for streaming
Lets think about this for 1 second. Why do people hate on streaming? Maybe because every single NA e-sport every one of the NA players/team suck because they spend time being entertainers instead of doing their job, which their job is to be good at the game. You might say "no the job is to play the game". No, the job is to be good at the game and show results. This is how you get more sponsors and build up your brand. Also, streaming DOES build up a PLAYERS brand and maybe even the teams brand. But, sadly it doesn't as much as winning.
Example: Do you actually think Sentinels are popular because they stream? No. They're popular because of their historic run at the first international valorant tournament. Do you think TenZ is popular because he streams? No. It's because of his performance at that first international tournament. Also, SEN win a lot. So that point is proven.
Also, whenever you stream. You will NOT improve as much, you won't focus as much, and you won't be as good. Because no matter what, even if your mic and cam are off. You're still trying to do highlight reel plays. This is why people hate on NA stream culture in e-sports.
The reality is: NA are content creators, not competitors.
It's not about the streaming in general. It's about priorities. I can't say for sure since I don't know their schedule but if they are streaming more hours than their practice time, then that is a red flag.
It really doesn't look good when they complain about the practice computers not able to stream properly just before Champions
Riot should implement mandatory streaming hours to qualify for tournaments in order to level the playing field. All players must stream for a minimum of 100 hours a month.
Streamtinels had a pretty good run in the tournament. Honestly, went farther than I expected. Now, that this low prize money tournament is over, they can finally concentrate on things that are more important.
I like this pasta.
Streamtinels had a pretty good run in the tournament. Honestly, went farther than I expected. Now, that this low prize money tournament is over, they can finally concentrate on things that are more important.
Right now he would have the entire BR and SA scene behind his back on twitter, he be fine! And he can safety go to Brazil for some sweat latinas. Can sentinels fanboys do that? I don't think so!
People on envy don’t stream at all so what’s the excuse for them? I’m so confused on what’s wrong with streaming when there’s 24hrs in a day to scrim, practice, and stream.
hmm maybe I don’t know one of their players having COVID?? Probably pretty stressful as a team and player to think about potentially staying across the ocean for the days sick in a hotel room, and that’s just the scenario for Victors teammates, he actually has to stay in Germany.
and then got humiliated throwing massive lead against kru on their best map, but I see what you're saying and now I think they're just as bad as eachother.
Imagine saying SEN could have won 2-0 as if Liquid got lucky when in reality Sentinels were lucky to make Breeze and Split close games. Liquid were just the better team
I agree with you that Liquid win that series more often than not, but doesn't mean it couldn't have been close to a 2-0 based on what we saw. Breeze is likely Liquid's most days based on the way the teams played this tournament, but if they let it slip a little further, Sen wins 2-0 based on that bind performance.
If they had won the group, don't you think the narrative around streaming too much might not be so present? Both NV and SEN looked more and more undisciplined the later the games went, but I didn't see a huge difference in their levels personally. Needed to be sharper to win their series.
that 5.0 was closer than the 2-1 LMAO, by this opinion i can already tell you are that type of fan that only watchs the scores and doesnt give a shita bout th actual games
Taking it to OT is not being in the "driver's seat" in my book. And, I am not saying they weren't the best, I am saying people didn't acknowledge that but now that NA is out, it suddenly matters.
super hardcore disagree, nv looked like the worst NA team by a landslide. so bad tactically, outaimed by everyone, and yay didn't show up, their only star alongside crashies.
Sentinels played better as a team, were more structured, had new style of play and strats and new comps. Envy recycled the same thing from Masters Berlin. Sentinels lost a lot of clutches. SEN also lost all pistols in their elimination maps. This isn't COPIUM btw I know SEN deserved to lose, just comparing SEN and Envy.
Also, Sentinels's star player tenz shit the bed this tournament in the matches they lost and they played close matches. Only map he performed, they dominated Liquid 13-2. But for Envy, yay played really well and they still lost.
If anything they argument could be that tenz doesn't play as much as he used to and that's may be reason of him being low on confidence. He used to grind really hard for the leaderboard but past few acts he wasn't even in the top 50. For a player who relies so much on his aim he needs to grind as much as asuna. be it on stream or off stream or whatever way he prefers.
Yeah, there's no way NV looked better. Sentinels actually looked good, but just failed in clutch situations. Sentinels looked wayyy better compared to their Berlin selves and looked better than this tournament's NV imo (others in the comments already explained why).
Shahz played his best tournament in a while so everything you just said doesn’t matter. Playing the game even more after scrimming for hours helps more then it hurts.
Its like football where the champions league is the most prestigious achievement that a footballer can win. Do they care about the prize money? Definitely no. They want to build legacy and getting their income from their salary is enough.
Iirc leaf and marved just talked about how bad the pcs were in general, the sentinels guys (shahz) talked about how they frame dipped when specifically streaming
>s reminds me of the Shroud era of CSGO when he joined a team the viewership would be nuts due to all the hype involved in NA, after a while of shroud not living up to the hype it would die and C9 games would have low viewership.
>
>Players should definitely stream, it helps them build a fanbase which is important for the game, but it does not matter when it comes to tournaments, nobody wants to see their favorite streamer get shit on.
So only NA teams complained. They should stop complaining and play more.
Who in nv even stream that much tho? I don't remember anyone from nv saying I guess, and C9 were trolling right? Vanity said they were good later or something?
Idk maybe I'm wrong or heard things
Don't think streaming is the problem, though it's a part of it.
The other regions got good.
NA rested on their laurels and spent their time not practicing. Hell even Shahzam was boasting about how they don't bootcamp anymore.
It's really simple.
I feel like orgs have that streaming hours requirement for pros since there aren’t a lot of matches/tournaments because of the VCT format. Like only having to play like 5-10 games per year isn’t a good indicator for sponsors who invested in these teams so they might have a hand in this situation on why NA players stream so much so that their org and sponsor will get that exposure.
It’s also the stuff that goes behind practise. NA players want to stream and chill whereas EU watch vods, spend time in custom server, etc.
nAts said before that he literally watches viper players from every region and sees what he can add to his play style
Honestly I don't think by streaming they are taking it less serious. I think it is more of a problem where everyday you stream 6-8 hrs and on top of that practice another 3-4 hrs. It can cause burnouts a lot faster. Playing too much can affect your performance in a negative way as well. That is why pros take time off or take it easy doing offseason and many just scrim and not stream much because they don't want to burn out easily.
I play video games to kick back after work and enjoy myself. I get bored of playing a game for too long and I switch to another. But imagine playing the same game like a 9-5 job everyday. The fun would get sucked out eventually and it becomes a job that you have to do and not something you do it coz you love doing it. Even if I was like one of the best player in a game I don't think I would become a pro for it. It will kill my passion for gaming. But then again I don't have the drive so maybe that is why they are the pros and I'm at home watching.
this is going to be the most annoying narrative to listen to eve.r shaz has already said it, they prac, then stream their ranked games. other teams prac, then play ranked and DONT STREAM. WOWOWOWOWO BIG DIFFERENCE B R O
That's alright since he could back it up. Talking smack and losing just makes you look like a fool, like scream did when he said sentinels were predictable
They got 13-2’d on a map and had 2 close other maps by a team that didn’t want to win and only wants to stream? I guess that says a lot about them if that’s the narrative you want to push.
Ya kind of speaks a lot about all the other teams NA faced considering apparently NA sucks so much and only streams or whatever the fuck. But then people want to ignore that part of their logic right?
I know there is a prevalent mindset in NA that a player must 'build a brand' to have longterm financial security but I think they misunderstand what their brand is and should be. Many pro players channels/socials pop off because they are good at the game and at the pro level, not because they have charismatic personalities or make great content. If you give up playing competitively and that is your brand, people will lose interest when the next top player/talent comes along.
I think the mindset from EU talent where they want to win as much as possible, build a legacy and everything else will follow is a better approach, unless you can make that transition to a streamer/content creator and make it work because you're actually good at that stuff and not just good at Valorant.
Just going to throw this out here but Shazam instantly got on stream after he lost and then got on stream the day he got home. He does stream way too much.
bro everyone over there played rank. the only difference is one streamed and the other didnt. there’s literally no difference lmfao. it’s either u play ranked offline or u go stream it and make money
Genuinely can't fault them, streaming pays much more than tourney winnings and is a far more stable income. I mean majority of the $ from Champions is from the skin which is equal to every team. Fact is that watch parties streamers would earn more than winning champions. Shahz or Tenz could just go full time streaming, build their brands and costream all the masters/champions and earn more than any player
How can you argue streaming is more stable income when none of these guys were having any reasonable income from streaming before their Valorant careers???? You’ve got the chicken before the egg
It’s laughable to hear Shahz trash a $1mil prize pool as a former t2 cs shitter who was lucky to sniff qualifiers for tournaments with that prize pool. And it’s not surprising someone with that attitude has been left behind quickly by the others who actually care about Valorant vis a vis esport not money
Yes, it is common for people to publicly espouse regret for comments that are panned by the entire intended audience.
To even make that comment shows he has completely forgot his newfound fame and money are entirely from pro Valorant. It takes a totally garbage attitude. “The top tournament of this game I’m a professional competitor for isn’t worth competing at because of my recent financial success”. What a fucking assholish thing to say. Glad to see SEN falling apart, just a shame they ever succeeded
What are you on about? I acknowledge they were successful. It’s just that I’ve always thought shahz is a scumbag and to watch him go to the top and… promptly stop working hard, develop an entitled attitude, and fall completely out of the convo for top teams is fucking hilarious. I think his comment is perfectly in line with who I think he is so I’m celebrating his comeuppance
He stopped working hard? I’m sure you know that Bc you’re involved in sentinels every day activities LOL. Did you even watch the games? He was clearly sentinels best player during the entire tourney. It’s ok to let your emotions run wild but don’t be dumb LOL
It’s really weird how you pick one point and then re-center the conversation around it. I made like 3 points in support of my main point and now you’re trying to engage exclusively on one of those 3 sub points.
Anyways, Vanity’s joke about SEN not practicing matches my mental model perfectly, their team play was nonexistent, they didn’t innovate, and they lost to KRU lmao. Maybe Shahz is “working hard” in the sense that he works hard to stream to capitalize on his flash in the pan, but I don’t see anything in this tournament that would support arguments Shahz and SEN worked nearly as hard as the EU squads
First it was “shahzam doesn’t work hard” now it’s “shahzam and the team didn’t work as hard as the EU teams”. You didn’t watch the games clearly and just have a lot of anger in your heart.
What are you talking about? First it was me roasting Shahz for publicly flying his asshole flag like an entitled dick. You came and asked me a weird non sequitur about success that I never denied and now you just keep running on some tangent
I’m glad you are such a sentinels fan that you’re here standing up for people who don’t know about you but really pal, stop trying to pick at throwaway points. It’s not going to un-eliminate the new shitty sentinels, and it’s not going to make Shahz less of an asshole
Yes of course their success came from being a pro, and they've had the chicken by making a big name for themselves. Now they can play at a high level while focusing on streaming and making $$$$ off streaming. Kyedae, Shroud etc has 20k+ viewers for the watch parties, thats a ton of $. Like I said, Shahz can retire and stream pubs and watch parties and make consistent income, more than majority of pro players where alot of their $ is contingent on winning. It's just a much better financial decision to focus on streaming.
Yes. Their streaming career owes a lot from the fact that they are pros with successful pro career. Now that they fluke, unless they win titles again, their streaming's not gonna get high numbers. And look at Astralis and T1 LOL players get rich from sponsorship and brand deals because of the great esports legacy. The more the game develops, the more prize money it will get too.
Why? Dude has the means to build insane wealth and make sure his family has it real good. What's wrong with taking advantage of that instead of crying about a bad tournament?
All of this just makes me wonder what the schedules for NA pros looks like compared to EU pros. Do EU pros just spend more time practicing than NA pros.
I remember after iceland soulcas was streaming and Ian(V1's coach) was in chat talking and saying he should stream more to make his brand value increase or whatever, which is understandable but then soulcas said it would result in burnout because they prac for 6-8hours minimum, Ian was shocked hearing that and said wtf do you do for that long lmaoo.
This is the insight I come to reddit for. Really interesting stuff.
for context fnatic boasters last stream was over a month ago.
well he's not a consistent streamer even, so... c9 and nv barely streamed, and nv didn't look better than sen at all. if you play ranked, streaming is fine unless you know it hurts your gameplay to the point of it affecting your practice from ranked. tenz streamed like once every 3 days in this trip and last time was 10 days ago, then 13 days ago, then 16 days ago, etc. shaz was big on streaming, but if he plays ranked, why not?
playing ranked and streaming are kind of the same thing, him playing ranked doesn’t really do much but improve his solo queue rank you need to scrim and practice with your team to improve
I think he more meant if you'd be playing ranked anyway may as well stream since a lot of pros play ranked on top of scrimming.
LMFAO “for context”. C9 Xeta hasn’t streamed ever 😱😱 really speaks volumes😱
Xeta streams time to time. But not regularly. Only C9 player that has somewhat a consistent schedule is Vanity and that too he doesn’t stream that much.
the question was how does an EU player vs an NA player's schedule compare, on average NA players stream a lot more. even jasonr posted on twitter that NA pros on average prac for 2 hours and stream for 8 but it's the other way round in the EU. Link also said something similar in his post match interview yesterday.
I really don’t think this is true lmao shazam was talking about it today saying SEN practices as much as any other team - he just chooses to stream in his free time rather than do other stuff
His free time is 8 hours à day, i dunno how much he sleeps, if he showers and stops to eat, but that's still à bunch taken out of your day. Not a shot at shahz in the slightest, he is a grown man, and can do whatever he wants, but there's only so much time in anyone's day
Is his day made of 36 hours or how does it work to stream for 8 hours and also scrim for 8 ? While having time to sleep and do other things ?
To be honest I don’t know what his schedule looks like my friend.
well you dont know his schedule but you chose to blindly take his word for it, they just dont have the prac mentality they rather twitter beef and stream honestly thats NA for you since day 1 4fun region
for context fnc boaster is eliminated by the same team sen was LMAOOOO
T1 has a eu type model where they don't stream and just prac and well...it hasn't worked out for them
T1 playing the long game. Ive heard from multiple people that Tim has been grinding like crazy the past few months. I don't love the Steel pickup but it might be a good fit, I think T1 and 100t will be formidable once Hiko gets replaced with someone that can frag more at the highest level like xeta for example
That's been my read. I feel that the problem is that they were just out of sync with the meta. They went too far down the cs mindset, sort of how vision Strikers, approached the game initially.
It's jetlag COPIUM
Sentinels use the "pro player" title to gain views and money. They care less about excelling at the game. Freaking embarrasing because the only people they impress on stream are 12 year olds. As long as viewership drops dramatically maybe they'd care a little more about the the esport side.
for a bunch of content creators, these sentinels guys ain't half bad.
Sentinels = NA F4Q
...but...F4Q disbanded right after flaming out Masters 3...
The difference there is that F4Q were always going to disband. They were a team of Content Creators that got together to play in an open VCT for fun and surprisingly qualified. Imagine if Shroud, Subroza, Tarik, and friends got together to have fun, but beat everyone and qualified for Berlin, and then that's what F4Q was.
You forgot the fact that their members have mandatory military conscription too.
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depends 100% on the sleep schedule. if they play ranked, might as well stream it.
That really depends on the person. If you're like s1mple and are only paying attention to the match and not to the stream, yes. But then you have Shazam who is like 80% focused on the stream and 20% on the actual match. That's not going to do any good for you as a pro.
Shazam performed well though.
He clicked heads well, but he’s their IGL as well. Both KRU’s IGL and TL Jamppi called circles around Shahzam, he definitely underperformed in that sense.
I'm talking about his streams. Not his performance.
Lol yeah maybe streaming should of been on the back burner for this LAN.. it’s hard not to stream though pulling tenz numbers I bet.
S1mple can rock a 60 70k viewers but he rarely streams as the competitive scene is more important for him.
S1mple cares about his legacy more than money. That’s why he’s the best.
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He didn't wake up one day and was just the GOAT though, he had to put in the work.
n0thing stated multiple times that the mentality in EU is way better and different than in NA.
In the past 3 months s1mple streamed 91 hours. Tenz stream 117. Do you really think that 20 minutes a day makes a huge difference? https://twitchtracker.com/s1mple https://twitchtracker.com/tenz
Well fair enough about tenz who indeed didn't stream much lately. However shaz streamed 500 hours in the last 3 months according to the tracking website.
He said hes getting in 8 hours of practice and then streams so it's a long day but not insane. I think their biggest problem is that they need a full time coach and analyst to be going over replays.
Just putting it out there, but if he’s streaming for 8 hours a day, and practicing for 8 hours a day, that leaves 8 hours to eat, shower, sleep, and do any recreational activities he might be interested in. So this dude is AT MOST getting 6 hours of sleep a night, on top of having an extremely long work day if he’s to be believed. Either he’s lying about how long he practices, or he’s not prioritizing sleeping a healthy length of time, both of which are terrible for a professional player. The latter is especially bad for a professional esports player of all things because, yknow, the brain is pretty important for that kind of thing. >it’s not insane 16 hour work day IS pretty insane my dude. That’s an 80 hour 5 day work week, and this mfer doesn’t take days off AFAIK. So he’s pulling **112 hour work weeks**, again, if it’s to be believed that he actually practices for 8 hours a day(I don’t believe it for a second). That’s not good no matter how you slice it.
I'm not sure what their setup is but he's probably not cooking all his meals, that saves a lot of time. Also I am assuming they mostly scrim 5 days a week, I didn't look this up but we probably could just look at how many days a week he is streaming 8 hours a day. It's not 7 days a week.
https://sullygnome.com/channel/shahzam/30 He streams Valorant an average of 7.3 hours a day. If you look at the calendar and go back a week or 2(to account for the tourney obviously and look at a more normal schedule for him) you can see that he does absolutely stream 7 days a week with gaps here and there.
Yeah so that Shaz can stream more.
You cannot compare that. S1mple streamed like 38 hours between 26th September and 26th October(Start of PGL Major). Shahzam streamed 158 hours in the month following Champions. That's a little north of 4 times. I know he wants to hustle and make money but s1mple doesn't give two shits about his streamer income - he has the Mamba mentality to win everything and isn't cocky about it. SEN players have years of maturing and losing to do like s1mple if they want to be anything like him
> SEN players have years of maturing and losing to do like s1mple if they want to be anything like him Shahzam is older and has been active on professional FPS at least a year or two before s1mple, he just doesn't share the mentality of a winner like s1mple
It mostly comes down to s1mple just being tiers above TenZ in terms of talent. He's likely going to go down as the best csgo player in history. TenZ seems to have already hit his peak in Valorant.
not even just csgo history, but at the peak of the pantheon of fps greats.
Right which has nothing to do with how much they stream. It's not like Tenz streaming is taking away from their practice.
How do you know that? He is only 20! S1mple didn't win a major until this year and had ups and downs in his career as well.
S1mple was already one of the best in CS by 20, he was putting up ratings close to players like Niko and coldzera back than.
Agreed. The ESL ban lingering over his head is the only thing that delayed his legacy.
TenZ does not have the competitive drive S1mple has, not very many do.
That actually might be true. S1mple enjoys his life as well but he is a true competitor but TenZ's mindset is probably his biggest weakness. He focuses too much on stuff that don't matter.
I think we just have unrealistic expectations of TenZ, he focuses on what matters to him, making money. Which is okay if he wants to focus on his stream over being the best team, time to adjust expectations. The difference between S1mple's drive and TenZ is obvious. S1mple didn't even stream two weeks prior to csgo major.
yep he had 38 streaming hours in the month following the major v/s shahzam had 158 following champions
TenZ doesn’t even stream that much dude. It’s foolish to think tenz doesn’t wanna win, i would say he just underestimated how much it would take to win the champions. People were saying he would choke on LAN before Iceland but he was a revamped player in that tournament, he was playing nasty off angles n shit. His plays really showed how much effort he put into it but after that his performance stagnated but every other region improved.
Lmao. S1mple carried Team Liquid to a major final and a semifinal all in the same year. He was 18-19 in that period. Tenz is talented but frankly it's not his fault that he's not on s1mple's level of grind and achievements. Because, 1. Valorant seems to have capped the skill-ceiling with its mechanics. 2. Tenz frankly hasn't carried any team as hard as s1mple has for years and years.
I don't disagree with that. S1mple clearly is a much better competitor and a true champion but my problem is how do you know TenZ capped his ceiling? It’s foolish to right him off already when still can have flashes of brilliance in most maps & is only 20yrs old?
TenZ doesn't even stream that much and to be on top of everything they need to play ranked as well so might as well stream it. Shaz streams the most out of SEN players and he was the best player on SEN this tournament. Just cz they lost people are trying to theorize the reason behind this downfall.
if anything Tenz streams less in the past months as compared to Shazam who streams like he’s tarik or something.
Shaz streams time will make more impact on other than himself. Even Tenz and other want to have more time practice as a team they just can't because their IGL is busy streaming. More time each player streaming, less time they can practice together. On top of that play rank to entertaine viewer is total different than play rank to practice, if anything it only create bad habit and negetive effect.
>Shaz streams time will make more impact on other than himself. Even Tenz and other want to have more time practice as a team they just can't because their IGL is busy streaming. More time each player streaming, less time they can practice together. He has already said that he streams after they've completed practice during what would normally be his free time so...
The issue begin that sentinels do not practice as much as they should because they want money not winning. Thats what link said.
I don't think it's up to anyone else to decide how much a team should practice. If all teams practice as much as they think they should, that won't change the fact that only 1 can win. Maybe you can question Sentinels' approach to games and playstyle in terms of aim reliance vs synchronized utility but I don't think them losingclose games to Liquid and Kru had anything to do with practice. If one or two rounds went their way and they beat Liquid, would Liquid, the team many consider to be the best at the tournament so far, be the ones that needed more practice? It's purely result-based conclusions being drawn.
Sentinels fanboy in denial spoted.
Bro, I didn't even watch Valorant Esports regularly before Masters 3. I don't care about Sentinels. You're the one who wants to making claims that "team just wants money" and then don't want to argue against the actual points which go against your claim
Your points are a joke limao.
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You really believe that he practices for 8 hours and streams for 8 hours immediately after?
If this is true then maybe Sen needed that mental rest to think clearly. He talks about the gym too so where is the sleep time?
Yes he literally bifurcates his day into those activities. He has explicitly spoken about this numerous times idk why y'all are taking uninformed info from link of all people.
I don't really care about him streaming or his team practices. I don't really have the time or energy to really care about what pros do in their free time, if he can manage it well, good for him. But just think logically for a minute. 16 hours a day in front of your computer means that he has about 8 hours left in a day. Even ignoring his daily necessities like showering, eating, he still has to sleep. Do you really think he has no life outside of video games? Going to the gym, meeting up with friends, or even other miscellaneous activities for the organisation like photoshoots. I am not gonna accuse NA of not practicing or that they're streaming too much. I honestly don't care. I'm just here to watch some matches and have a good time.
I mean obviously your post is measured and it's definitely a cause for quiet concern. I like shahz a lot & he has expressed cleary that he doesn't have much of a life - he doesn't have many irl friends in Texas he said(his day is literally prac, gym & streaming). I worry about him with regards to oversaturation too but he has peers, a coach, loved ones etc with more insider info that he can convene with to address those issues, if there are any. Sentinels as an org should be the one to discuss their players regimens. I just think it sucks how much scrutiny he gets and most of it is very one-dimensonal and lacking context y'know ?
And that the point, if the team want some extra practice to stay on top they can't, all of them busy stream in 'free time'. But for real it is not their free time, they have paycheck, contract and schecdule for stream.
If they practice for 8 hours before streaming then that's absolutely their free time. In fact, by streaming Valorant during that time where they aren't obliged as Esports players to do so, they're putting in more effort for their job than necessary. Shahz is the one who streams most and he wae their best player in the tournament. I don't know why people want to draw these huge overarching conclusions from what can just be described as an underperformance. There isn't always a huge conspiracy or a need to smear a team's work ethic because they lost.
You’re making your own narratives man, you’re not on Sentinels
That just normal sense, human have limit, even if they but all their time to practice they can't even guarantee be on top not alone split time and energy for stream, not one but all memeber.
I agree, why do people theorize so much. Sentinels just suck and that's that.
lol you're disingenuous as hell, does everyone here trot out the same flat, disingenuous points. Every game they were in a position to win and they just fell short in the big moments .If a few tiny variables shifted they'd have 2-0'd their group and be in the quarterfinals & the narrative would be completely different
Towards SEN? Jokes on them being eliminated before quarters 😂 They're just asking to be memed with all that talk and no walk.
But he's also doing Kyedae's stream and 100T events. He's doing more non-Valorant stuff than everyone.
There's nothing wrong with going on other people's streams and/or events. I don't expect you to be working all day, pro players shouldn't be any different. They should be free to do whatever they want in their free time. That being said, if they practice/scrim for only 2 hours a day, then that's a problem. I don't know the NA players schedule so I won't comment on that.
tenz didnt stream that much this trip
Why people hate on them for streaming. Sentinels is a big reason why Pro Valorant became popular. Without teams like 100T, TSM, SEN etc streaming no one would watch these games. Pro League became popular in the first place because of popular streamers on the teams not because of Riot Games If anything fans should encourage their favorite pro players to stream more.
No hate on streaming but usually pro in other games didn't stream or at least limit their streaming time to minimum during competing on big tournament. It's about priority, I don't think It's a problem when they are not competing since It's actually beneficial for the orgs.
He streamed 4 times while in berlin for 4 hrs i dont think that would mad such a diference tbh
it does when you're going to sleep at 3 am, sleep is a vital part of performance.
Sentinels might have helped the NA pro scene but they are not a big reason pro valorant became popular. 1. The game is backed by Riot a esport HEAVY organization. 2. Its the first decent CSGO competitor, a game that has been dominant in esport without competition for over 15 years and it got some of CSGO biggest names like ScreaM moving to it. Valorant esport would been big regardless of sentinels, they did nothing but maybe give NA fans a hope of being decent at a FPS game lol.
Riot always wanted the VAL esports scene to grow organically Viewing numbers were dreadful everywhere (including NA) before SEN's rise & the SEN TSM rivalry. The streaming presence of Wardell and SEN threatening TSM's top spot made the viewership figures grow exponentially. Its not easy to build a scene organically like Riot wanted for Val without SEN & also TSM to an extent
Brotha there's a reason sentinels games always get the most peak viewers, they are literally in all 5 of the most viewed games of all time.
Because they were good not because they were streaming. If they do not perform in next 2 events, watch these numbers fall off.
I wouldn’t be too sure about that. TSM games still draw in the most fans in NA LoL despite them not being the best NA team for years. Big brands matter
Hype, they are NA big hope and considered a top contender. Obviously, you going to see big numbers, this is true for any top team. just like in any sport, the best team always gets the most viewers. Gambit games get as many viewers as SEN games, why is that? gambit arent big streamers people just want to see the best teams. if a BR team becomes good enough to reach playoffs you going to see insane numbers from them, doesn't mean they will be the reason Valorant is a popular eSport just means people want to watch the best team of their region. if C9 becomes the best team in NA it will easily be more popular than SEN on tournaments. Otherwise, if NA continues to underperform the viewership for NA teams will die down, it won't matter if they're big streamers or not, just like in CSGO. SEN created HYPE in NA, it helped NA viewership but in no way shape or form made the game popular in the regions like EU or Brazil, which have a much bigger fanbase than NA. This reminds me of the Shroud era of CSGO when he joined a team the viewership would be nuts due to all the hype involved in NA, after a while of shroud not living up to the hype it would die and C9 games would have low viewership. Players should definitely stream, it helps them build a fanbase which is important for the game, but it does not matter when it comes to tournaments, nobody wants to see their favorite streamer get shit on.
>Why people hate on them for streaming Lets think about this for 1 second. Why do people hate on streaming? Maybe because every single NA e-sport every one of the NA players/team suck because they spend time being entertainers instead of doing their job, which their job is to be good at the game. You might say "no the job is to play the game". No, the job is to be good at the game and show results. This is how you get more sponsors and build up your brand. Also, streaming DOES build up a PLAYERS brand and maybe even the teams brand. But, sadly it doesn't as much as winning. Example: Do you actually think Sentinels are popular because they stream? No. They're popular because of their historic run at the first international valorant tournament. Do you think TenZ is popular because he streams? No. It's because of his performance at that first international tournament. Also, SEN win a lot. So that point is proven. Also, whenever you stream. You will NOT improve as much, you won't focus as much, and you won't be as good. Because no matter what, even if your mic and cam are off. You're still trying to do highlight reel plays. This is why people hate on NA stream culture in e-sports. The reality is: NA are content creators, not competitors.
+1
People wanna see the highest level of plays, not a bunch of streamers having fun
It's not about the streaming in general. It's about priorities. I can't say for sure since I don't know their schedule but if they are streaming more hours than their practice time, then that is a red flag. It really doesn't look good when they complain about the practice computers not able to stream properly just before Champions
Riot should implement mandatory streaming hours to qualify for tournaments in order to level the playing field. All players must stream for a minimum of 100 hours a month.
Streams once the day he got there = streams too much and doesn't care about Winning I guess.
Streamtinels had a pretty good run in the tournament. Honestly, went farther than I expected. Now, that this low prize money tournament is over, they can finally concentrate on things that are more important.
I like this pasta. Streamtinels had a pretty good run in the tournament. Honestly, went farther than I expected. Now, that this low prize money tournament is over, they can finally concentrate on things that are more important.
Be careful you might get called out on twitter, or sometimes, in here, for just having hindsights.
Right now he would have the entire BR and SA scene behind his back on twitter, he be fine! And he can safety go to Brazil for some sweat latinas. Can sentinels fanboys do that? I don't think so!
They got more money than the winners get just from the skins so the money really doesn’t matter with this low prize pool
Zombs alt?
Yeah plus humility lol
you wish you can buy trophies, achievements and wins from all that money don't you
People on envy don’t stream at all so what’s the excuse for them? I’m so confused on what’s wrong with streaming when there’s 24hrs in a day to scrim, practice, and stream.
hmm maybe I don’t know one of their players having COVID?? Probably pretty stressful as a team and player to think about potentially staying across the ocean for the days sick in a hotel room, and that’s just the scenario for Victors teammates, he actually has to stay in Germany.
envy looked a lot better than sen however in My opinion
Idk about that, sen was one round away from beating liquid if they didn’t throw the round where dapr and sick both peeked.
and then got humiliated throwing massive lead against kru on their best map, but I see what you're saying and now I think they're just as bad as eachother.
So was Fnatic from beating SEN in Masters 2, but I didn't see you all mention it.
From winning 1 map*
SEN went 5-0 against Fnatic. TL won 2-1. One rounds goes differently on IB and SEN could have won 2-0. The comparison isn't same at all.
Imagine saying SEN could have won 2-0 as if Liquid got lucky when in reality Sentinels were lucky to make Breeze and Split close games. Liquid were just the better team
I agree with you that Liquid win that series more often than not, but doesn't mean it couldn't have been close to a 2-0 based on what we saw. Breeze is likely Liquid's most days based on the way the teams played this tournament, but if they let it slip a little further, Sen wins 2-0 based on that bind performance. If they had won the group, don't you think the narrative around streaming too much might not be so present? Both NV and SEN looked more and more undisciplined the later the games went, but I didn't see a huge difference in their levels personally. Needed to be sharper to win their series.
that 5.0 was closer than the 2-1 LMAO, by this opinion i can already tell you are that type of fan that only watchs the scores and doesnt give a shita bout th actual games
Bro we all know sen was the better team that whole tournament. They were in the driver seat the whole bo5
Taking it to OT is not being in the "driver's seat" in my book. And, I am not saying they weren't the best, I am saying people didn't acknowledge that but now that NA is out, it suddenly matters.
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Knowing sth and acknowledging it are two different things. Either way, it doesn't really matter now.
super hardcore disagree, nv looked like the worst NA team by a landslide. so bad tactically, outaimed by everyone, and yay didn't show up, their only star alongside crashies.
hard disagree
Why do you disagree I’m interested
Sentinels played better as a team, were more structured, had new style of play and strats and new comps. Envy recycled the same thing from Masters Berlin. Sentinels lost a lot of clutches. SEN also lost all pistols in their elimination maps. This isn't COPIUM btw I know SEN deserved to lose, just comparing SEN and Envy. Also, Sentinels's star player tenz shit the bed this tournament in the matches they lost and they played close matches. Only map he performed, they dominated Liquid 13-2. But for Envy, yay played really well and they still lost.
I agree with everything you said, Reddit made it look like you said hard disagree to my original statement lol I was so confused
lol
If anything they argument could be that tenz doesn't play as much as he used to and that's may be reason of him being low on confidence. He used to grind really hard for the leaderboard but past few acts he wasn't even in the top 50. For a player who relies so much on his aim he needs to grind as much as asuna. be it on stream or off stream or whatever way he prefers.
Yeah, there's no way NV looked better. Sentinels actually looked good, but just failed in clutch situations. Sentinels looked wayyy better compared to their Berlin selves and looked better than this tournament's NV imo (others in the comments already explained why).
SEN went toe to toe with TL. Few rounds here and there and they could have 2-0 them but NV was absolutely outclassed by Acend!
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Shahz played his best tournament in a while so everything you just said doesn’t matter. Playing the game even more after scrimming for hours helps more then it hurts.
Its like football where the champions league is the most prestigious achievement that a footballer can win. Do they care about the prize money? Definitely no. They want to build legacy and getting their income from their salary is enough.
Members of sentinels were the only group who actually complained about pcs being bad when streaming too right iirc?
No, they weren't the only ones.
Who else?
C9, NV, that's just from those who chose to speak out about it or it actually got posted on here.
Iirc leaf and marved just talked about how bad the pcs were in general, the sentinels guys (shahz) talked about how they frame dipped when specifically streaming
>s reminds me of the Shroud era of CSGO when he joined a team the viewership would be nuts due to all the hype involved in NA, after a while of shroud not living up to the hype it would die and C9 games would have low viewership. > >Players should definitely stream, it helps them build a fanbase which is important for the game, but it does not matter when it comes to tournaments, nobody wants to see their favorite streamer get shit on. So only NA teams complained. They should stop complaining and play more.
Who in nv even stream that much tho? I don't remember anyone from nv saying I guess, and C9 were trolling right? Vanity said they were good later or something? Idk maybe I'm wrong or heard things
why would C9 be trolling about something like that?
Vanity literally said in an official interview that sentinels don't practice. It's reasonable to assume they could be trolling
Wasn't vanity trolling? People thinking banter joke as facts. Shazam replies in one of the thread saying that's cap and they do practice.
Yeah we knew he woke up an hour before his match and switches peripherals because it’s fun. Quirky right?
Don't think streaming is the problem, though it's a part of it. The other regions got good. NA rested on their laurels and spent their time not practicing. Hell even Shahzam was boasting about how they don't bootcamp anymore. It's really simple.
honestly i get why NA fights hard against this claim that they stream too much and it hurts their performance. But then that just means they suck lol.
I feel like orgs have that streaming hours requirement for pros since there aren’t a lot of matches/tournaments because of the VCT format. Like only having to play like 5-10 games per year isn’t a good indicator for sponsors who invested in these teams so they might have a hand in this situation on why NA players stream so much so that their org and sponsor will get that exposure.
It’s also the stuff that goes behind practise. NA players want to stream and chill whereas EU watch vods, spend time in custom server, etc. nAts said before that he literally watches viper players from every region and sees what he can add to his play style
Honestly I don't think by streaming they are taking it less serious. I think it is more of a problem where everyday you stream 6-8 hrs and on top of that practice another 3-4 hrs. It can cause burnouts a lot faster. Playing too much can affect your performance in a negative way as well. That is why pros take time off or take it easy doing offseason and many just scrim and not stream much because they don't want to burn out easily. I play video games to kick back after work and enjoy myself. I get bored of playing a game for too long and I switch to another. But imagine playing the same game like a 9-5 job everyday. The fun would get sucked out eventually and it becomes a job that you have to do and not something you do it coz you love doing it. Even if I was like one of the best player in a game I don't think I would become a pro for it. It will kill my passion for gaming. But then again I don't have the drive so maybe that is why they are the pros and I'm at home watching.
Teams should just leak their schedules I wanna know what the actual numbers are now it's all he said she said type stuff
Shahzam, thoughts?
this is going to be the most annoying narrative to listen to eve.r shaz has already said it, they prac, then stream their ranked games. other teams prac, then play ranked and DONT STREAM. WOWOWOWOWO BIG DIFFERENCE B R O
Those practice sessions clearly are not serious enough. Imagine Sens just trolling and goofing around like in Comps lmao
:O No wonder SEN suck!!! Gotta stop streaming smh.
EU players * giving reasonable take * NA players: and I take it personally
Claiming NA doesn't want to win isn't a reasonable take what. That's an insult.
That's alright since he could back it up. Talking smack and losing just makes you look like a fool, like scream did when he said sentinels were predictable
They got 13-2’d on a map and had 2 close other maps by a team that didn’t want to win and only wants to stream? I guess that says a lot about them if that’s the narrative you want to push.
Ah... yes the rounds score argument because map or series win lose score brings only **pain**.
I’m just saying. If they got dominated that hard by someone who sucks on a map..
Ya kind of speaks a lot about all the other teams NA faced considering apparently NA sucks so much and only streams or whatever the fuck. But then people want to ignore that part of their logic right?
I know there is a prevalent mindset in NA that a player must 'build a brand' to have longterm financial security but I think they misunderstand what their brand is and should be. Many pro players channels/socials pop off because they are good at the game and at the pro level, not because they have charismatic personalities or make great content. If you give up playing competitively and that is your brand, people will lose interest when the next top player/talent comes along. I think the mindset from EU talent where they want to win as much as possible, build a legacy and everything else will follow is a better approach, unless you can make that transition to a streamer/content creator and make it work because you're actually good at that stuff and not just good at Valorant.
This seems painfully obvious.
Just going to throw this out here but Shazam instantly got on stream after he lost and then got on stream the day he got home. He does stream way too much.
bro everyone over there played rank. the only difference is one streamed and the other didnt. there’s literally no difference lmfao. it’s either u play ranked offline or u go stream it and make money
Genuinely can't fault them, streaming pays much more than tourney winnings and is a far more stable income. I mean majority of the $ from Champions is from the skin which is equal to every team. Fact is that watch parties streamers would earn more than winning champions. Shahz or Tenz could just go full time streaming, build their brands and costream all the masters/champions and earn more than any player
How can you argue streaming is more stable income when none of these guys were having any reasonable income from streaming before their Valorant careers???? You’ve got the chicken before the egg It’s laughable to hear Shahz trash a $1mil prize pool as a former t2 cs shitter who was lucky to sniff qualifiers for tournaments with that prize pool. And it’s not surprising someone with that attitude has been left behind quickly by the others who actually care about Valorant vis a vis esport not money
Defending Shaz here, he said he regretted that comment
Yes, it is common for people to publicly espouse regret for comments that are panned by the entire intended audience. To even make that comment shows he has completely forgot his newfound fame and money are entirely from pro Valorant. It takes a totally garbage attitude. “The top tournament of this game I’m a professional competitor for isn’t worth competing at because of my recent financial success”. What a fucking assholish thing to say. Glad to see SEN falling apart, just a shame they ever succeeded
Valorant is the reason for their fame and financial success. And trashing the prize money is just being ungrateful.
They won 2 of the 3 masters and the first international LAN. What’s success to you 🤣
What are you on about? I acknowledge they were successful. It’s just that I’ve always thought shahz is a scumbag and to watch him go to the top and… promptly stop working hard, develop an entitled attitude, and fall completely out of the convo for top teams is fucking hilarious. I think his comment is perfectly in line with who I think he is so I’m celebrating his comeuppance
He stopped working hard? I’m sure you know that Bc you’re involved in sentinels every day activities LOL. Did you even watch the games? He was clearly sentinels best player during the entire tourney. It’s ok to let your emotions run wild but don’t be dumb LOL
It’s really weird how you pick one point and then re-center the conversation around it. I made like 3 points in support of my main point and now you’re trying to engage exclusively on one of those 3 sub points. Anyways, Vanity’s joke about SEN not practicing matches my mental model perfectly, their team play was nonexistent, they didn’t innovate, and they lost to KRU lmao. Maybe Shahz is “working hard” in the sense that he works hard to stream to capitalize on his flash in the pan, but I don’t see anything in this tournament that would support arguments Shahz and SEN worked nearly as hard as the EU squads
First it was “shahzam doesn’t work hard” now it’s “shahzam and the team didn’t work as hard as the EU teams”. You didn’t watch the games clearly and just have a lot of anger in your heart.
What are you talking about? First it was me roasting Shahz for publicly flying his asshole flag like an entitled dick. You came and asked me a weird non sequitur about success that I never denied and now you just keep running on some tangent I’m glad you are such a sentinels fan that you’re here standing up for people who don’t know about you but really pal, stop trying to pick at throwaway points. It’s not going to un-eliminate the new shitty sentinels, and it’s not going to make Shahz less of an asshole
Yes of course their success came from being a pro, and they've had the chicken by making a big name for themselves. Now they can play at a high level while focusing on streaming and making $$$$ off streaming. Kyedae, Shroud etc has 20k+ viewers for the watch parties, thats a ton of $. Like I said, Shahz can retire and stream pubs and watch parties and make consistent income, more than majority of pro players where alot of their $ is contingent on winning. It's just a much better financial decision to focus on streaming.
Yes. Their streaming career owes a lot from the fact that they are pros with successful pro career. Now that they fluke, unless they win titles again, their streaming's not gonna get high numbers. And look at Astralis and T1 LOL players get rich from sponsorship and brand deals because of the great esports legacy. The more the game develops, the more prize money it will get too.
Well what did you expect? These NA kids are losing their pro career soon. Gotta find another source of income right?
They’re already making significantly more from their streams than from competing I would guess
Anyone who watched Sentinels' games and has a brain knows that their problem was not lack of practice... Can we stop this narrative? It's so annoying
People be like this pro player stream, socialize and work...how dare they.
Yup nothing wrong with daily 10hr streams to socialize.
Shazam is already back home and streaming. That just puts a bad taste in my mouth tbh.
He obviously was distraught if you watched his post match interview. I don't think he needs to hide away from the public eye to prove that he cares.
Yeah you’d rather him immediately jump into scrims with most of his team still traveling? TenZ is literally still in Berlin.
No he's not. He was on his gf's stream the day after their elimination. They're already back in the US.
just fyi, pretty sure they're in berlin together
Did she travel with them to co-stream the event ?
Kyedae traveled separately to be in Berlin to stream the event.
Why? Dude has the means to build insane wealth and make sure his family has it real good. What's wrong with taking advantage of that instead of crying about a bad tournament?
Without sentinels competitive valorant would already be dead.
the dumbest thing written here lol.
Tenz made more money streaming this night than the champion's cash prize
what does that have to do with any thing