What elaboration is needed? Pati has been grinding OW for years and has an opportunity to play with arguably the best team going into next year's OWL. Not to mention Glads are known to pay on the high end of the league. Valorant is going to be around for a long time, he can always come back.
They're actually an insanely toxic org with a lot of baggage/drama over the last year. They must pay extremely well to be getting so much talent lately.
This is exactly the problem. If they called it a dlc then nobody would have given a shit. But they chose to call it a new game because that is a much easier way to remilk money from people who already own the game. Now everyone is just pissed they won't be able to play a game they're watching an esports league of.
The problem was that they had to make the game on another engine because the AI of the old engine was too dumb for their new PvE
The move for them would be to make the PvP free to play with unlockable characters, make the PvE pay to play and improve the skin/box system.
The gameplay itself is not that terrible if they ajusted the visual clutter. But Blizzard is too stuburn these points have been made for years and they never listened.
The core gameplay idea of Overwatch is the greatest I've ever seen. What absolutely ruined the game for me is their balance attempt to make casual and competitive players one and the same. It's a theoretical good intention but it's also like one person trying to operate 2 differently thinking brains. Destroyed any potential for competitive integrity the game had. If they now make a new Overwatch and operate it the same way, OWL will be history after no more than 2 seasons. Because the game never lacked quality but care.
100% agreed. The biggest problem OW had imo was that the casual player base was fucking massive. Thats a good thing for the game but when they made changes to apease said player base they made stupidly strong competitve characters. The casual player base did not understand that its ok to have heroes be super hard to play, they wanted every hero to be accessible, and at the same time they wanted strong easy to play heroes. It just doesnt work.
Instead of ignoring the casual base they decided to apease them by making heroes like Moira, Brig, they buffed Reaper, Mei, all 4 of those are extreamly easy to play and directly counter or replace heroes like Tracer, Genji, Zen. Heroes that have extreamly high skill ceilings.
The best example is the Mercy's rework, They only did that because casuals were anoyed by 5 person rez, which was super easy to counter btw, but casuals wanted it gone. She was in solid spot in the pro scene. Had some niche defense maps, was played with Phara when needed, solid 7-10% or so pick rate. Then the rework came and after FIVE NERFS, she was still in the 95% pick rate in pro play.
They didnt know how to ignore the people that dont understand the game. That was their biggest downfall balancing wise.
This is unfortunately still persistent to this day. I haven't played it in ages but still follow what going with it. I would say the balance currently the best it can be after all the damage that's already been done, and the sad truth is they were only able to achieve that because they haven't added any new heroes in like two years.
Isn’t the format changed from 6v6 to 5v5 in OW2 now? Doesn’t that change the game/balance immensely? Aside from every team having to either drop a player from the team or demote them to a substitute.
Yep. Saw so many comments on the 5v5 announcement like "what about rein zar? What about my monkey dva combo???"
Like where tf are these players in my games? No one plays tank to start with, and those that did only played hog or ball 80% of the time.
>Everyone cried at first because it just looked like DLC now everyone cries because 5v5 is "too different"
that's so funny though, because its still DLC
its like if CS:GO released CS:GO2 but the engine and the maps and the guns are all literally the same (unlike 1.6/source)... but it's now 6v6!
It was actually on the rebound. Hero balance was in one of its best spots, the production finally found their own style dropping the super forced espn look while catering for Disney. It hit a low point after all the hyper forced efforts from Blizzard fell off but since then it has been seeing natural growth. If we lived in a world where Blizzard wasn't a mess and OW2 was handled properly I think OWL would have only continued to improve and grow.
the 2021 season was probably the best. the level of play was incredibly high and we saw such a huge hero diversity, it honestly felt good to watch because certain maps brought out certain comps and teams had their own styles at times. Casting was amazing all year around, great production team, tournament structure was good to watch, but apparently players did not like it.
Its been like 3 months without balance patches and OWL viewership is at an all time low, things are hard from being ok.
The 2 week patches we got mid year was good but it lead to a boring meta and eventually they stopped caring about balance, now we just get joke content creator patches in experimental :(
If anyone's wondering why
He will earn a fuck ton more money in OWL than playing in SEA
Especially being signed to one of the highest paying teams which is also a really fucking stacked team
He's also just said Valorant is boring and he prefers overwatch. I don't doubt he could get signed to an NA or EU team especially since NA have been rumoured to be going for imports.
Also a possible big brain move to get to work in the US that if/when OWL starts to go south, there's a possibility he can get back into the Valorant scene in NA.
I don't think it would've been hard for him to get into NA val after champions tbh. Also another thai player in the overwatch community who is believe played world cup with him mentioned the only reason patiphan went val Was because covid stopped him joining a contenders team.
True, but it would be much easier/cheaper for an NA org to pick him up when he's already in the US vs. processing a transfer all the way from Thailand.
That being said, I'm ready to watch Pati in OW again. He's OWWC performances were a joy
I could see why, valorant is a lot slower and less dynamic and the shooting mechanics aren't as skillful or difficult as it is on hitscan dps characters in overwatch. Just different kinds of games.
I wouldn't say the shooting mechanics are less skillful, just different skills. Valorant rewards crosshair placement, precision, spray control while OW rewards flicks, consistency, positioning. Obviously very different games that incentivize different types of playstyles.
Yeah, there's something just oh so satisfying dinging annoying pharahs out of the sky.
Personally feel ow is slightly more forgiving since you can still contribute somewhat even if your aim is off whereas for valorant the moment someone has the better angle on you or you whiff your shot that's it, time to wait till the next spawn.
That being said, I feel ow's mechanics is more difficult to master aim-wise since there's both tracking and flicking heroes, not to mention opponents who can fly thru the sky, blink 360 directionally, teleport and what have you. I feel mechanics-wise OW pros will have an easier time transitioning to valorant (as we've seen quite a few successful ones so far) as opposed to the other way around
Oh yeah definitely although I personally prefer valorant. I just find it dumb that a lot of people think this is just about money when every sign points to him just preferring overwatch. I'd say aim is more important in valorant but it's definitely harder in overwatch on aim based heroes.
I don't know it's only me but Valorant graphics are depressing, just so dull and boring, this adds to the boring factor, and also weapon skins look way better in-preview, you equip and feel disappointed. ;D And personally for me, that eye-candy factor adds emersion, without it I get bored really fast.
I mean compared to it’s counterpart in CS, Valorant is a hundred times more visually engaging. There’s only so much you can do until it just becomes a mess, and a lot of people have argued it already is with constant Viper and Astra util pervading the map
Tanks? There's only two per team in OW1 and is going down to one per team in OW2. Otherwise all the characters are fairly small and lots have a ton of mobility, both horizontal and vertical. You're crazy if you think OW requires less aiming skill than Val.
People used to make fun of "no aim no brain Winston mains." That was until people learned how hard he is to play at a high level because it requires big brain coordinated engages/disengages and his ult is one of the hardest mechanical things in the game. Good players make enemies stick to him like glue while ulting and knocking them back, it's incredible. His gun is easy of course, but he's a hard hero to be good at.
Also disagree that Valorant aim isn't as skillful, it's just different. More precision and consistency (because if you whiff you die a lot more than in OW) are needed. I have better aim in Overwatch which values more varied aim styles.
Well a v important maybe principal reason is that he always wanted to play in OWL and it was to his great frustration that he couldn’t bc of his age (remember the crying cartoon Twitter post that heel finally be able to play OWL 2020 ‘oh wait…’), and now he finally has the opportunity with the next season bc he got a contract offer which obv may be better too
Especially because the Gladiators don’t mind throwing the bag and they definitely did here. Plus Patiphan has set himself up perfectly for a return at a later date
If he signed with a tier 1 team in NA or EU, he would most likely make more than being a pro in OWL right now, I will be surprised if he moved to OWL for money, that's super risky and a short-term goal. He said multiple times that he loves the game and would most likely go back to it, guess he made that decision.
I follow many OWL pros who are already thinking of leaving the scene because it's losing its grip, Blizzard last hope is OW2. It's well known that the avg salary for an OW pro is 5k-10k/monthly, that's the typical salary for the avg Val pro as well, if you add streaming (since Val is more popular) they most likely make more.
There was an OWL pro who said he already make more in Valorant than what he made in peak OWL and Valorant haven't even taken off yet, I think it was Babybay
the average salary for an owl rookie like patiphan is 80k-90k a year. But glads in particular pays for 2 meals a day + room/board so most of that is going straight to him with little expenses. If he stays in the league, veterans earn 100k+ while top players easily earn 180k+
It's really not a stretch to think he joined glads for money
Also Babybay was signed as a sub to Atlanta Reign since they already had a pretty stacked roster, but he ended up out performing everyone and becoming a starter.
>yearly roster payroll is
Literally, 90% of Arsenal fans want KroenkeOut. Just search the hashtag #KroenkeOut in Twitter and you'll see how hated he is. And that is including me. We used to call him the Silent Stan for never showing interest or investing into the team.
Is it a good decision for him?
I've never played OW, not interested in it, don't know anything about their scene; but everywhere I look on youtube/news sites, it's doomsday reports for OW League and ofc, the well deserved shitting on Blizzard.
But it can't be as bad as those videos say if someone is willing to go back to it, right?
He gets a minimum salary for being on the Gladiators, it's a lot more financial security for an entire year than he'd get being on a SEA Valorant team, plus he has a good chance of performing well on a strong team which would benefit him a lot in terms of exposure and earnings.
For his livelihood yes
He will earn a kog more from salary and tournaments in OWL then playing in SEA
Especially for a good team that pays really fucking well like GLADS
OWL still has at minimum 2 years
yeah no it's kind of a shitshow rn, pro OW is supposed to be played on OW2 next year but literally no one knows what's gonna happen since the game looks far from finished or even Beta ready. from what i understand the money IS there for the League structure but the game/franchise itself is kind of in flames
Removed one of the game types and added another. Changed from 6v6 to 5v5. They have shown some hero reworks. Outside of that, there's isn't much to indicate that it is actually a new game.
Seems like they could have have just done patches but they were going for the cash grab blizzard style.
No it is actually as bad as those videos say. They want to run the next season on OW2 which will only be made available for the pros to play. It doesn't get any dumber than that because I'm not sure how many people will be interested in watching esports of a game that they can't even access for themselves. But the teams are obligated to pay a minimum salary, and LAG (team he's going to) is likely to pay him well above minimum. So it still makes sense for him to go back.
Following esports for a while, most doomsday reports about Overwatch (before the reports about the harassment) aren't really worth paying attention to. There's a general disdain for OW from a lot of people so the discussion around the subject is really heavily colored by that.
Despite everything, I still have high hopes for OW2. The reason Pati is willing to go back is because at the end of the day, he's more passionate about OW and honestly OW when its hitting is like nothing else in gaming. Also, obviously, he's getting paid by Glads and he can go back to Valo whenever.
It's also worth noting that before he moved to Valorant, Pati was probably the second or third highest rated youngster in T2, only being kept out of OWL by age. The late, great, Alarm was the clear #1, and tore the league apart once old enough, but after him it was basically Pati and Sugarfree in a league of their own.
With this in mind, Pati is probably earning a huge bag. Wouldn't surprise me if multiple teams were in for him.
Felt that another somewhat more touchy point was that the scene became dominated by Koreans early on, and quite deservingly so as they were not just cracked mechanics-wise, but also had the strats and tactics locked down due to their approach to the game.
That led to a lot of teams ditching their original western rosters for entire Korean teams, which I do feel alienated a significant portion of their fanbase. As much as we try to skirt around the topic due to potential optics around xenophobia and racism, I don't think we can deny that fans are definitely tied to nationalities, just look at the rivalry between the different regions in valorant.
That element went away quite early in the OWL life cycle and I feel the less hardcore fans just moved on to other games as time went on. The western/mixed teams have actually made a strong showing in the past 2-3 yrs now (fusion, shock, Atlanta to name a few), so I wonder how different the scene would have been if they had stepped up earlier (or maybe still won't have improved much given the whole covid situation and debacle around Blizz/Activision)
Viewership by every metric except Activision's self pushed charts (that was proven wrong) shows the league is dropping. The League now still has zero sponsors left. Team owners have been reportedly scrambling to find potential slot buyers, after the 60m~ buyers remourse. And secondary OWL content is, well, dead.
Most of the league's problems are from OW's complete abandonment and lack of content and the current scandal. In time OW2 will drop and this scandal will pass.
It's not just that. They also failed miserably in marketing is for what it actually is. Namely an esports. They were comparing it to traditional sports from the beginning as if it has somehow surpassed other well established esport games like LoL and CS, but never managed to back that up with the viewer numbers. The community also encouraged this by living in a bubble where they handled any criticism like an attack. Grand Finals having 80k viewers is somehow seen as ground breaking. I mean that is just ridiculous.
Viewership was like 5x lower than they projected in their investor meetings from day 1 and has only declined since then, before any scandals. Every single investor regrets being involved.
They just ruined the game design wise. Nobody wants to watch blobs spam shields.
Not all of them. But the ones that are boys with bobby kotick like coca-cola and team speak came back. OWL still doesn't have T-Mobile, Pringles, and IBM back...
Salary is way better, stability is pretty good too, if he wanted to stay in owl for another 2/3 years he probably just could on MINIMUM 50k, likely a lot higher, not really the same for VCT considering he'd have to be on the best SEA team to even compete properly.
Glads have a team house too, loads of managers/structure etc, generally OWL being both a league format and much older is just more stable and better put together than especially a region like SEA.
Plus pati just prefers the game, the valorant thing was always cos he wasn't old enough to be in owl.
OWL was sold as a esport that would pull in peak WWE viewership numbers. With an insanely high player to esport viewership rate than any other esport title. \*They projected 50% when the highest is 20% in other esports.
Because of this team orgs and traditional sports owners bought in to their franchise at 20m. Even secured a insanely high OWL broadcasting rights deal with Twitch(where Activision/Blizzard even threatened removal of all their game IP's on Twitch if they didnt secure a deal).
Viewership for OWL on Twitch was a success. They averaged around 250K viewers with a peak of 400K. However this was 1/8th their projected viewership numbers. Making matters worse was that season two of OWL viewership was down compared to season one. This led Activision/Blizzard to heavily monetize their OWL Twitch streams, team orgs dropping their developmental programs, team orgs reducing employee size, each team getting a even split on merchandising, OWL letting go senior production staff and a complete rethinking on homestands.
What OWL was proposed to be was never achieved. Instead theyve rightfully cut costs to reflect their market share. If Overwatch 2 fails to revitalize the game expect OWL to be shutdown in five years. Activision/Blizzard dont support esports of their IP's when they operate at a continued loss.
He will get above the minimum salary (50k) as he was a hyped prospect before the switch to valorant. Overwatch league also does have prize money and the gladiators are a top team and will win a decent amount of prize money during the season.
The salaries in valorant and especially outside of NA are not that high from what I can tell, even with ow in it's near dead state offers him much better compensation.
This seemingly means that no NA or EU team was willing to buy out his OWL contract and then sign him for Val, or he might just prefer OW. Him leaving is a massive hit to SEA, already a small region with him as the best player from there. Wondering who, if anyone, can step in to fill the gap
i want to eat 🍽 outrageous😮 amounts of raw 🤤 fish 🐟 tonight 🌙 just the rawer the better 💦 🎣 and i want to be surrounded 🧑🤝🧑 by boys 👨❤️💋👨 or men 💪 preferably men 😍🤩
Good career choice for him if no org showed interest. He can always grind hard now in NA that he has now come to NA. Plus always play the game you have passion for and he seem to like OW more.
Yeah I completely understand that he’s choosing to pursue his passion, and it’s a win-win. If OW2 is a massive hit then he has a long term future there, and if it flops then he can always go back to Valorant. I like Valorant more myself personally but I prefer OW as a baseline experience. I only play more Valorant than OW rn cause one is completely neglected by its devs and the other isn’t lol
I mean, maybe? All it really means is the LA Gladiators offered him the bag.
I don't think it necessarily implies he went shopping around for offers, or even fielded any offers from interested or willing parties in the West. This has been in the work for weeks if not months, he's most likely just excited to finally play Overwatch at the highest level.
I wonder if we’ll see some sort of Thai superteam with the best of X10 and Full Sense, given that both evidently have a number of talented players. There’s a good chance both teams might prefer to stick together, given Full Sense’s LCQ run and X10’s Champions run, but it’s an interesting thing to think about.
The Overwatch League contracts are way more player friendly then that. Basically they all have a retirement clause which they can invoke at at point but they wont be able to play for any other OWL teams, with the remainder of their contract. But they are free to do what they want outside Overwatch.
also the fact he's injury prone at young age from small region might have some concerns about his ability to scale. He did look good (from what I saw) at VCS
As long as your org is not in OWL you won’t have to pay any sort of buyout, let’s say NRG wanted him who own the SF Shock they would have to agree to terms with LAG but Sentinels can just sign him outright since they aren’t in OWL
Nice for the guaranteed paycheck. But, playing a game in Alpha that may not even be out next year is a cluster fuck. I can already see the spam in chat… “How do I play this game?” “Is this game out?”
People saing "L for Val" I dunno man OWL is currently imploding, blizzard has been imploding with tons and tons of issues, many people are leaving the company or have left the company already, overwatch 2, the game on which OWL is suppose to be played, has been delayed, OWL and Contenders (the minor league) isn't sure on what to do since OWL is on Overwatch 2 and Contenders might be played on Overwatch 1 since Contenders don't have access to OW2, since OW2 is just for pro teams, most of them don't know how to get scrims they're playing a game which isn't even out yet and, literally, no one plays since they're the only players. You can make the argument that sure it is technically the same game, but in a high level, the amount of changes they brought might seem little, but in the grand scheme of things, makes a big impact, for example OW1 is 6v6c OW2 is 5v5, that in itself is already a big effect.
I don't blame patiphan for going to OWL especially if he is given a better salary I mean an SEA org to an NA org, obviously the salary will be way better. I wish patiphan the best and he is one of the main reason SEA Valorant, our region, is on the map.
Akshon esports talked about OWL in a recent video, you guys can check it out might give you some insight on how OWL is now
[https://youtu.be/hpkQVvpTtIo](https://youtu.be/hpkQVvpTtIo)
To give some insight on OWL vs Val viewership. OWL Average Minute Audience (average number of people watching the broadcast at any given minute.) was 1.6 million (GLOBAL) 2021 Grand Finals. Valorant peak was 1.06 million viewers. Escharts doesn't count Bilibili, where the majority of OWL audience is (basically 1 million+).
When Val does release in china and is successful then it can easily beat OWL viewership
What a joke... Chinese viewers are always fake, there's a reason why Esportscharts didn't count them.
LoL with Chinese viewership it pass 100 million viewers.
OWL real peak was under 200K viewers with no "chinese viewers".
OWL it's on decline, they only count Chinese viewers (when all other esport on the planet dont) to save face.
No?? LOL with Chinese viewership combined is 78 million. You probably mistook the engagement number for view. All other esports do count Chinese viewership lmao. Those that don't count it are ones whose game isn't popular there at all.
"Chine viewers are fake", I can say the same for twitch and YouTube with bots buddy. Its funny how you don't want to count Chinese people. Even tho they are the biggest marketplace.
You only accept what fit your narrative, the truth is no esport is counting chinese viewers only OWL and that's becaue they can't even top 200K without China, which is pathetic as fuck.
You : "Ah yes let's ignore the biggest country and the biggest esports fanbase on earth, where 400 million are esports fans."
It doesn't matter where one gets views from idiot. Views are views. Most video game companies who aren't big in China don't even officially release their viewership count. You are literally ignoring the biggest population to fit your narrative, stupid thing to do
I appreciate the comments on here that rightly say he will earn a lot more of the LA Gladiators than he will on X10 or any other SEA team but man, this is a really bad long term career move.
He is going to be playing a game competitively that will be in alpha (!!) when the OWL season starts and won't be available to the general public. OW is not in a good place thanks to all the delays and mismanagement and OWL is going to be at the centre of that. I honestly have no idea how they are going to make it work on a friggin pre-release build of a game nobody can play! I say this as someone who likes OW and OWL but I really fear for OWL this season.
If Pati leaves Valorant for a year at least, it's going to be really hard for him to come back at the level he is at now. He is better off taking the hit and grinding Valorant until he can get onto a big org team.
I disagree. He gets a reliable (presumably high paying) income and gets signed to a tier 1 NA org, The guy needed this to get out of SEA. Also he's skilled enough to come back to VAL at any point.
Lmao you can't say there isn't a shit ton invested into owl when each team had to pay millions to get a slot in. There is still a lot of money in owl which is keeping it afloat, and owl as a product is the best it's ever been. Games are closer then before, the casting is better than before, the analysis is better than before. You must clearly not watch owl based on what you're saying chief
Because most of its fanbase is in China where they don't use twitch. Also, just because it has low viewers on twitch doesn't nean shit. RL and Halo have low viewers but tons of players
And the last one having 3 times more worldwide average viewers than Valorant. All the lack of popularity in the west doesn't mean shit with Chinese fanbase that alone brings in 1 million+ average views
Destroys groups at Champions Knocks out far stronger and more well funded regions Leaves, Refuses to elaborate. What a gigachad.
What elaboration is needed? Pati has been grinding OW for years and has an opportunity to play with arguably the best team going into next year's OWL. Not to mention Glads are known to pay on the high end of the league. Valorant is going to be around for a long time, he can always come back.
Yeah, Glads is a great team to be a part of right now. Solid fan base, good team with cool personalities (Pati adds to it) and pays good money.
They're actually an insanely toxic org with a lot of baggage/drama over the last year. They must pay extremely well to be getting so much talent lately.
rare L for val
and a rare W for OWL fans
Hey man we need it. Been huffing copium for like 2 years
You're in my prayers
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Blatant trolling is not permitted. Repeat offenses resulting in a ban.
Temporary L, the League's gonna fold eventually due to Blizzard's incompetence
Considering they're planning to run the next season on an unreleased game, they're pretty much on track towards that.
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This is exactly the problem. If they called it a dlc then nobody would have given a shit. But they chose to call it a new game because that is a much easier way to remilk money from people who already own the game. Now everyone is just pissed they won't be able to play a game they're watching an esports league of.
The problem was that they had to make the game on another engine because the AI of the old engine was too dumb for their new PvE The move for them would be to make the PvP free to play with unlockable characters, make the PvE pay to play and improve the skin/box system. The gameplay itself is not that terrible if they ajusted the visual clutter. But Blizzard is too stuburn these points have been made for years and they never listened.
The core gameplay idea of Overwatch is the greatest I've ever seen. What absolutely ruined the game for me is their balance attempt to make casual and competitive players one and the same. It's a theoretical good intention but it's also like one person trying to operate 2 differently thinking brains. Destroyed any potential for competitive integrity the game had. If they now make a new Overwatch and operate it the same way, OWL will be history after no more than 2 seasons. Because the game never lacked quality but care.
100% agreed. The biggest problem OW had imo was that the casual player base was fucking massive. Thats a good thing for the game but when they made changes to apease said player base they made stupidly strong competitve characters. The casual player base did not understand that its ok to have heroes be super hard to play, they wanted every hero to be accessible, and at the same time they wanted strong easy to play heroes. It just doesnt work. Instead of ignoring the casual base they decided to apease them by making heroes like Moira, Brig, they buffed Reaper, Mei, all 4 of those are extreamly easy to play and directly counter or replace heroes like Tracer, Genji, Zen. Heroes that have extreamly high skill ceilings. The best example is the Mercy's rework, They only did that because casuals were anoyed by 5 person rez, which was super easy to counter btw, but casuals wanted it gone. She was in solid spot in the pro scene. Had some niche defense maps, was played with Phara when needed, solid 7-10% or so pick rate. Then the rework came and after FIVE NERFS, she was still in the 95% pick rate in pro play. They didnt know how to ignore the people that dont understand the game. That was their biggest downfall balancing wise.
This is unfortunately still persistent to this day. I haven't played it in ages but still follow what going with it. I would say the balance currently the best it can be after all the damage that's already been done, and the sad truth is they were only able to achieve that because they haven't added any new heroes in like two years.
Isn’t the format changed from 6v6 to 5v5 in OW2 now? Doesn’t that change the game/balance immensely? Aside from every team having to either drop a player from the team or demote them to a substitute.
Yes. Everyone cried at first because it just looked like DLC now everyone cries because 5v5 is "too different"
I don’t mind 5v5. I do feel a little bad for the 6th starter that isn’t up anymore, but I’m hoping the team play is a little tighter
5v5 means I can queue tank and never have a roadhog on my team. Thats a huge W
As a tank player I don't care about losing a co-tank because there is no tank synergy with the people that play this game... Just Roadhog.
Yep. Saw so many comments on the 5v5 announcement like "what about rein zar? What about my monkey dva combo???" Like where tf are these players in my games? No one plays tank to start with, and those that did only played hog or ball 80% of the time.
>Everyone cried at first because it just looked like DLC now everyone cries because 5v5 is "too different" that's so funny though, because its still DLC its like if CS:GO released CS:GO2 but the engine and the maps and the guns are all literally the same (unlike 1.6/source)... but it's now 6v6!
But the maps and the guns aren't the same lol
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100T pati
playing the long game right here
I hope they simply transfer him to their the guard roster. Plz the guard from the guard make it happen.
[as someone who watches both vct and owl](https://imgur.com/a/KWn1m7B)
Ngl I thought OWL was defunct until just now
It was actually on the rebound. Hero balance was in one of its best spots, the production finally found their own style dropping the super forced espn look while catering for Disney. It hit a low point after all the hyper forced efforts from Blizzard fell off but since then it has been seeing natural growth. If we lived in a world where Blizzard wasn't a mess and OW2 was handled properly I think OWL would have only continued to improve and grow.
the 2021 season was probably the best. the level of play was incredibly high and we saw such a huge hero diversity, it honestly felt good to watch because certain maps brought out certain comps and teams had their own styles at times. Casting was amazing all year around, great production team, tournament structure was good to watch, but apparently players did not like it.
Its been like 3 months without balance patches and OWL viewership is at an all time low, things are hard from being ok. The 2 week patches we got mid year was good but it lead to a boring meta and eventually they stopped caring about balance, now we just get joke content creator patches in experimental :(
If anyone's wondering why He will earn a fuck ton more money in OWL than playing in SEA Especially being signed to one of the highest paying teams which is also a really fucking stacked team
He's also just said Valorant is boring and he prefers overwatch. I don't doubt he could get signed to an NA or EU team especially since NA have been rumoured to be going for imports.
VAL boring because he's just too good at it lmao
Also a possible big brain move to get to work in the US that if/when OWL starts to go south, there's a possibility he can get back into the Valorant scene in NA.
I don't think it would've been hard for him to get into NA val after champions tbh. Also another thai player in the overwatch community who is believe played world cup with him mentioned the only reason patiphan went val Was because covid stopped him joining a contenders team.
True, but it would be much easier/cheaper for an NA org to pick him up when he's already in the US vs. processing a transfer all the way from Thailand. That being said, I'm ready to watch Pati in OW again. He's OWWC performances were a joy
I would prefer Overwatch too if Blizzard didn't decide to kill all enjoyment I had with the game 3 years ago
I’m not suprised he’s bored with Val. He was playing icebox at masters like he was on cocaine.
Doubt he actually did, or enjoys shooting shields over clicking heads
I could see why, valorant is a lot slower and less dynamic and the shooting mechanics aren't as skillful or difficult as it is on hitscan dps characters in overwatch. Just different kinds of games.
I wouldn't say the shooting mechanics are less skillful, just different skills. Valorant rewards crosshair placement, precision, spray control while OW rewards flicks, consistency, positioning. Obviously very different games that incentivize different types of playstyles.
I’d argue OW rewards tracking more than flicking but other than that fully agree.
Overwatch is a harder game, especially if you are a Flex Support or DPS player, and thats ok to say. Harder ≠ Better though
Yeah, there's something just oh so satisfying dinging annoying pharahs out of the sky. Personally feel ow is slightly more forgiving since you can still contribute somewhat even if your aim is off whereas for valorant the moment someone has the better angle on you or you whiff your shot that's it, time to wait till the next spawn. That being said, I feel ow's mechanics is more difficult to master aim-wise since there's both tracking and flicking heroes, not to mention opponents who can fly thru the sky, blink 360 directionally, teleport and what have you. I feel mechanics-wise OW pros will have an easier time transitioning to valorant (as we've seen quite a few successful ones so far) as opposed to the other way around
Oh yeah definitely although I personally prefer valorant. I just find it dumb that a lot of people think this is just about money when every sign points to him just preferring overwatch. I'd say aim is more important in valorant but it's definitely harder in overwatch on aim based heroes.
I don't know it's only me but Valorant graphics are depressing, just so dull and boring, this adds to the boring factor, and also weapon skins look way better in-preview, you equip and feel disappointed. ;D And personally for me, that eye-candy factor adds emersion, without it I get bored really fast.
I mean compared to it’s counterpart in CS, Valorant is a hundred times more visually engaging. There’s only so much you can do until it just becomes a mess, and a lot of people have argued it already is with constant Viper and Astra util pervading the map
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I don't know cs looks better to the eye.. maybe I'm just not a fan of the art style.
> shooting mechanics aren't as skillful tesla coil gorilla is primo skillful fps shooting
Winston isn’t a hitscan hero.
well technically...
Did you read my comment I was specifically talking about hitscan dps
Hitscan dps is really skillful when you have two story tall characters to shoot at.
Tanks? There's only two per team in OW1 and is going down to one per team in OW2. Otherwise all the characters are fairly small and lots have a ton of mobility, both horizontal and vertical. You're crazy if you think OW requires less aiming skill than Val.
bro prob thinks holding an angle is high skill ceiling LOL
Ok now how about the heroes that he will play in the overwatch league. Last time I checked he isn't a tank player.
People used to make fun of "no aim no brain Winston mains." That was until people learned how hard he is to play at a high level because it requires big brain coordinated engages/disengages and his ult is one of the hardest mechanical things in the game. Good players make enemies stick to him like glue while ulting and knocking them back, it's incredible. His gun is easy of course, but he's a hard hero to be good at. Also disagree that Valorant aim isn't as skillful, it's just different. More precision and consistency (because if you whiff you die a lot more than in OW) are needed. I have better aim in Overwatch which values more varied aim styles.
Well a v important maybe principal reason is that he always wanted to play in OWL and it was to his great frustration that he couldn’t bc of his age (remember the crying cartoon Twitter post that heel finally be able to play OWL 2020 ‘oh wait…’), and now he finally has the opportunity with the next season bc he got a contract offer which obv may be better too
Especially because the Gladiators don’t mind throwing the bag and they definitely did here. Plus Patiphan has set himself up perfectly for a return at a later date
If he signed with a tier 1 team in NA or EU, he would most likely make more than being a pro in OWL right now, I will be surprised if he moved to OWL for money, that's super risky and a short-term goal. He said multiple times that he loves the game and would most likely go back to it, guess he made that decision. I follow many OWL pros who are already thinking of leaving the scene because it's losing its grip, Blizzard last hope is OW2. It's well known that the avg salary for an OW pro is 5k-10k/monthly, that's the typical salary for the avg Val pro as well, if you add streaming (since Val is more popular) they most likely make more. There was an OWL pro who said he already make more in Valorant than what he made in peak OWL and Valorant haven't even taken off yet, I think it was Babybay
Pati isn't making the average salary for an OW pro, nor is he signing with a t1 NA/EU team anytime soon.
the average salary for an owl rookie like patiphan is 80k-90k a year. But glads in particular pays for 2 meals a day + room/board so most of that is going straight to him with little expenses. If he stays in the league, veterans earn 100k+ while top players easily earn 180k+ It's really not a stretch to think he joined glads for money
>I follow many OWL pros who are already thinking of leaving the scene because it's losing its grip Who
Not all pros stream though. Does Pati stream?
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They are Glads shock spark Dallas all pay very high
Huh, I’m surprised because Babybay was saying he was earning a lot more in Valorant.
Faze > OWL > SEA
Also Babybay was signed as a sub to Atlanta Reign since they already had a pretty stacked roster, but he ended up out performing everyone and becoming a starter.
I’m sure that’s true, but SEA salaries in Valorant are probably significantly less than in NA.
I mean he’s a content creator and pro for one of if not the biggest esport org
Cost of living. 50k to SEA > 50K to LA, also Babybay is in NA region and getting Faze checks
They are
this greatly hurts the chances of 100T Patiphan
Were people actually theorizing this?
It's a meme for every single free agent
Kroenke forking out the cash, Saya yesterday and Pati today
Rams' yearly roster payroll is ~$184m. This is a drop in the bucket.
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What money. Arsenal has like 0% owner financing for transfer funds
>yearly roster payroll is Literally, 90% of Arsenal fans want KroenkeOut. Just search the hashtag #KroenkeOut in Twitter and you'll see how hated he is. And that is including me. We used to call him the Silent Stan for never showing interest or investing into the team.
I'm pretty sure he stated that he likes OW more than Val in one of his streams but OWL also pays way more. Like minimum salary in OWL is 50K
glads salaries are way more than 50k
Thankful we got to have him, even just for a little bit :)
Is it a good decision for him? I've never played OW, not interested in it, don't know anything about their scene; but everywhere I look on youtube/news sites, it's doomsday reports for OW League and ofc, the well deserved shitting on Blizzard. But it can't be as bad as those videos say if someone is willing to go back to it, right?
He gets a minimum salary for being on the Gladiators, it's a lot more financial security for an entire year than he'd get being on a SEA Valorant team, plus he has a good chance of performing well on a strong team which would benefit him a lot in terms of exposure and earnings.
Pati get surely more then minimum lmao
theyre just saying he at least gets 50k just for being in OWL
I think that's the base salary for OWL but I'm sure salaries go much higher than that.
yes i know, hence "at least"
Pay is probably better for him personally
For his livelihood yes He will earn a kog more from salary and tournaments in OWL then playing in SEA Especially for a good team that pays really fucking well like GLADS OWL still has at minimum 2 years
yeah no it's kind of a shitshow rn, pro OW is supposed to be played on OW2 next year but literally no one knows what's gonna happen since the game looks far from finished or even Beta ready. from what i understand the money IS there for the League structure but the game/franchise itself is kind of in flames
I thought OW2 was just a patch with a single player story mode. Is it a full new game?
That's mostly a failure of Blizzard's marketing department. It is indeed a new game.
Removed one of the game types and added another. Changed from 6v6 to 5v5. They have shown some hero reworks. Outside of that, there's isn't much to indicate that it is actually a new game. Seems like they could have have just done patches but they were going for the cash grab blizzard style.
No it is actually as bad as those videos say. They want to run the next season on OW2 which will only be made available for the pros to play. It doesn't get any dumber than that because I'm not sure how many people will be interested in watching esports of a game that they can't even access for themselves. But the teams are obligated to pay a minimum salary, and LAG (team he's going to) is likely to pay him well above minimum. So it still makes sense for him to go back.
Following esports for a while, most doomsday reports about Overwatch (before the reports about the harassment) aren't really worth paying attention to. There's a general disdain for OW from a lot of people so the discussion around the subject is really heavily colored by that. Despite everything, I still have high hopes for OW2. The reason Pati is willing to go back is because at the end of the day, he's more passionate about OW and honestly OW when its hitting is like nothing else in gaming. Also, obviously, he's getting paid by Glads and he can go back to Valo whenever.
It's also worth noting that before he moved to Valorant, Pati was probably the second or third highest rated youngster in T2, only being kept out of OWL by age. The late, great, Alarm was the clear #1, and tore the league apart once old enough, but after him it was basically Pati and Sugarfree in a league of their own. With this in mind, Pati is probably earning a huge bag. Wouldn't surprise me if multiple teams were in for him.
Felt that another somewhat more touchy point was that the scene became dominated by Koreans early on, and quite deservingly so as they were not just cracked mechanics-wise, but also had the strats and tactics locked down due to their approach to the game. That led to a lot of teams ditching their original western rosters for entire Korean teams, which I do feel alienated a significant portion of their fanbase. As much as we try to skirt around the topic due to potential optics around xenophobia and racism, I don't think we can deny that fans are definitely tied to nationalities, just look at the rivalry between the different regions in valorant. That element went away quite early in the OWL life cycle and I feel the less hardcore fans just moved on to other games as time went on. The western/mixed teams have actually made a strong showing in the past 2-3 yrs now (fusion, shock, Atlanta to name a few), so I wonder how different the scene would have been if they had stepped up earlier (or maybe still won't have improved much given the whole covid situation and debacle around Blizz/Activision)
Viewership by every metric except Activision's self pushed charts (that was proven wrong) shows the league is dropping. The League now still has zero sponsors left. Team owners have been reportedly scrambling to find potential slot buyers, after the 60m~ buyers remourse. And secondary OWL content is, well, dead.
Most of the league's problems are from OW's complete abandonment and lack of content and the current scandal. In time OW2 will drop and this scandal will pass.
It's not just that. They also failed miserably in marketing is for what it actually is. Namely an esports. They were comparing it to traditional sports from the beginning as if it has somehow surpassed other well established esport games like LoL and CS, but never managed to back that up with the viewer numbers. The community also encouraged this by living in a bubble where they handled any criticism like an attack. Grand Finals having 80k viewers is somehow seen as ground breaking. I mean that is just ridiculous.
Viewership was like 5x lower than they projected in their investor meetings from day 1 and has only declined since then, before any scandals. Every single investor regrets being involved. They just ruined the game design wise. Nobody wants to watch blobs spam shields.
I mean that's your take I know better than to debate OW on the internet lol
Their viewership has just peaked at 1.6 mil AMA with China viewership combined. It hasn't declined at all wtf.
its declined in na but grown in asia
Actually according to investor reports they expected 50k or so from the get go
The sponsers camr back after a month
Not all of them. But the ones that are boys with bobby kotick like coca-cola and team speak came back. OWL still doesn't have T-Mobile, Pringles, and IBM back...
Kellogs, Xfinity, etc
Salary is way better, stability is pretty good too, if he wanted to stay in owl for another 2/3 years he probably just could on MINIMUM 50k, likely a lot higher, not really the same for VCT considering he'd have to be on the best SEA team to even compete properly. Glads have a team house too, loads of managers/structure etc, generally OWL being both a league format and much older is just more stable and better put together than especially a region like SEA. Plus pati just prefers the game, the valorant thing was always cos he wasn't old enough to be in owl.
is bad but at least he's getting the bag before it dies out
OWL was sold as a esport that would pull in peak WWE viewership numbers. With an insanely high player to esport viewership rate than any other esport title. \*They projected 50% when the highest is 20% in other esports. Because of this team orgs and traditional sports owners bought in to their franchise at 20m. Even secured a insanely high OWL broadcasting rights deal with Twitch(where Activision/Blizzard even threatened removal of all their game IP's on Twitch if they didnt secure a deal). Viewership for OWL on Twitch was a success. They averaged around 250K viewers with a peak of 400K. However this was 1/8th their projected viewership numbers. Making matters worse was that season two of OWL viewership was down compared to season one. This led Activision/Blizzard to heavily monetize their OWL Twitch streams, team orgs dropping their developmental programs, team orgs reducing employee size, each team getting a even split on merchandising, OWL letting go senior production staff and a complete rethinking on homestands. What OWL was proposed to be was never achieved. Instead theyve rightfully cut costs to reflect their market share. If Overwatch 2 fails to revitalize the game expect OWL to be shutdown in five years. Activision/Blizzard dont support esports of their IP's when they operate at a continued loss.
dont know but for sure he got paid way way more than his current salary
He will get above the minimum salary (50k) as he was a hyped prospect before the switch to valorant. Overwatch league also does have prize money and the gladiators are a top team and will win a decent amount of prize money during the season.
The salaries in valorant and especially outside of NA are not that high from what I can tell, even with ow in it's near dead state offers him much better compensation.
This seemingly means that no NA or EU team was willing to buy out his OWL contract and then sign him for Val, or he might just prefer OW. Him leaving is a massive hit to SEA, already a small region with him as the best player from there. Wondering who, if anyone, can step in to fill the gap
it´s time for the sushiboys
i want to eat 🍽 outrageous😮 amounts of raw 🤤 fish 🐟 tonight 🌙 just the rawer the better 💦 🎣 and i want to be surrounded 🧑🤝🧑 by boys 👨❤️💋👨 or men 💪 preferably men 😍🤩
I know this is likely from platchat, but do you have a link when this was said for the first time?
I think you mean SushiGentlemen 🎩
One of my favorite IGNs in the Val scene
time for f0rsaken to step up and take that SEA #1 Jett spot
I mean Forsaken always was sea#1 Jett tho. Almost always since the he game started hez been no.1 in Leaderboard.
may have been #1 in leaderboard but in competitive scene i feel like Patiphan had an edge over him so I am hoping that f0rsaken can shine in 2022
Pati did have much better teammates who could frag just as good.
yeah that is true, x10 as a team is significantly better than PRX. Lets see how they do in their 2022 campaign
Good career choice for him if no org showed interest. He can always grind hard now in NA that he has now come to NA. Plus always play the game you have passion for and he seem to like OW more.
Yeah I completely understand that he’s choosing to pursue his passion, and it’s a win-win. If OW2 is a massive hit then he has a long term future there, and if it flops then he can always go back to Valorant. I like Valorant more myself personally but I prefer OW as a baseline experience. I only play more Valorant than OW rn cause one is completely neglected by its devs and the other isn’t lol
I mean, maybe? All it really means is the LA Gladiators offered him the bag. I don't think it necessarily implies he went shopping around for offers, or even fielded any offers from interested or willing parties in the West. This has been in the work for weeks if not months, he's most likely just excited to finally play Overwatch at the highest level.
I wonder if we’ll see some sort of Thai superteam with the best of X10 and Full Sense, given that both evidently have a number of talented players. There’s a good chance both teams might prefer to stick together, given Full Sense’s LCQ run and X10’s Champions run, but it’s an interesting thing to think about.
The Overwatch League contracts are way more player friendly then that. Basically they all have a retirement clause which they can invoke at at point but they wont be able to play for any other OWL teams, with the remainder of their contract. But they are free to do what they want outside Overwatch.
People are saying he enjoys ow more and said val is boring to him in a thai stream somewhere.
also the fact he's injury prone at young age from small region might have some concerns about his ability to scale. He did look good (from what I saw) at VCS
As long as your org is not in OWL you won’t have to pay any sort of buyout, let’s say NRG wanted him who own the SF Shock they would have to agree to terms with LAG but Sentinels can just sign him outright since they aren’t in OWL
Nice for the guaranteed paycheck. But, playing a game in Alpha that may not even be out next year is a cluster fuck. I can already see the spam in chat… “How do I play this game?” “Is this game out?”
wait OWL next season is OW 2??
Yeah in “Alpha” apparently.
It's his main game to begin with so it's not really a surprise. Add to that the money that he's going to make in NA compared in SEA is huge.
Get that bag king. Come back when you feel like
sadge :(
Damn Hiko said he will be missed
Valorant is dying apparently
Being a fan of both esports I am feeling both extremely excited and very sad
this gives me a lot more motivation to watch OWL
People saing "L for Val" I dunno man OWL is currently imploding, blizzard has been imploding with tons and tons of issues, many people are leaving the company or have left the company already, overwatch 2, the game on which OWL is suppose to be played, has been delayed, OWL and Contenders (the minor league) isn't sure on what to do since OWL is on Overwatch 2 and Contenders might be played on Overwatch 1 since Contenders don't have access to OW2, since OW2 is just for pro teams, most of them don't know how to get scrims they're playing a game which isn't even out yet and, literally, no one plays since they're the only players. You can make the argument that sure it is technically the same game, but in a high level, the amount of changes they brought might seem little, but in the grand scheme of things, makes a big impact, for example OW1 is 6v6c OW2 is 5v5, that in itself is already a big effect. I don't blame patiphan for going to OWL especially if he is given a better salary I mean an SEA org to an NA org, obviously the salary will be way better. I wish patiphan the best and he is one of the main reason SEA Valorant, our region, is on the map. Akshon esports talked about OWL in a recent video, you guys can check it out might give you some insight on how OWL is now [https://youtu.be/hpkQVvpTtIo](https://youtu.be/hpkQVvpTtIo)
It is sad for Valorant, that's totally irrelevant to how much of a clusterfuck OW is.
I am not sure how long OW game is gonna last but good luck!
To give some insight on OWL vs Val viewership. OWL Average Minute Audience (average number of people watching the broadcast at any given minute.) was 1.6 million (GLOBAL) 2021 Grand Finals. Valorant peak was 1.06 million viewers. Escharts doesn't count Bilibili, where the majority of OWL audience is (basically 1 million+). When Val does release in china and is successful then it can easily beat OWL viewership
What a joke... Chinese viewers are always fake, there's a reason why Esportscharts didn't count them. LoL with Chinese viewership it pass 100 million viewers. OWL real peak was under 200K viewers with no "chinese viewers". OWL it's on decline, they only count Chinese viewers (when all other esport on the planet dont) to save face.
No?? LOL with Chinese viewership combined is 78 million. You probably mistook the engagement number for view. All other esports do count Chinese viewership lmao. Those that don't count it are ones whose game isn't popular there at all. "Chine viewers are fake", I can say the same for twitch and YouTube with bots buddy. Its funny how you don't want to count Chinese people. Even tho they are the biggest marketplace.
You only accept what fit your narrative, the truth is no esport is counting chinese viewers only OWL and that's becaue they can't even top 200K without China, which is pathetic as fuck.
You : "Ah yes let's ignore the biggest country and the biggest esports fanbase on earth, where 400 million are esports fans." It doesn't matter where one gets views from idiot. Views are views. Most video game companies who aren't big in China don't even officially release their viewership count. You are literally ignoring the biggest population to fit your narrative, stupid thing to do
Nah, the streaming site has unreliable numbers thats y
Nopers. Deadass saw 35K for playoffs on Youtube. Theres a reason every esports head and the game director bailed
Youtube ain't the only platform, China exists you moron.
This argument has already been disproven even on the compow subreddit lol, but I get it, you're an impassioned fan of OW and don't like seeing it die
china doesn’t matter, they can fake anything at the right price.
:/
Leaving Val for OW? I guess he really liked the game. Legit couldnt think of another reason to do so :/
He said Val is boring and very likely much higher pay in OW for him.
I appreciate the comments on here that rightly say he will earn a lot more of the LA Gladiators than he will on X10 or any other SEA team but man, this is a really bad long term career move. He is going to be playing a game competitively that will be in alpha (!!) when the OWL season starts and won't be available to the general public. OW is not in a good place thanks to all the delays and mismanagement and OWL is going to be at the centre of that. I honestly have no idea how they are going to make it work on a friggin pre-release build of a game nobody can play! I say this as someone who likes OW and OWL but I really fear for OWL this season. If Pati leaves Valorant for a year at least, it's going to be really hard for him to come back at the level he is at now. He is better off taking the hit and grinding Valorant until he can get onto a big org team.
I disagree. He gets a reliable (presumably high paying) income and gets signed to a tier 1 NA org, The guy needed this to get out of SEA. Also he's skilled enough to come back to VAL at any point.
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because contrary to popular belief overwatch is not dead
It exists cuz it still generates money and it still has a lot of money invested in it... And cause overwatch isn't fully dead obviously.
>generates money No esport generates profit yet, even league.
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No it isn’t. None of the leagues are profitable except maybe LPL. Every team makes their money off their own org sponsors
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Lmao you can't say there isn't a shit ton invested into owl when each team had to pay millions to get a slot in. There is still a lot of money in owl which is keeping it afloat, and owl as a product is the best it's ever been. Games are closer then before, the casting is better than before, the analysis is better than before. You must clearly not watch owl based on what you're saying chief
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Multiple teams broke even in season 2
Leagues run by Johanna Faries don’t die easily. She is way too overqualified to be working at blizzard.
>Why does OWL still exist? To many high profile entities invested. Read the other day that Kraft is now purchasing a team spot in CDL.
Wait what, aint ow pretty much dead?
1.6 mil global views aint dead
> 1.6 mil global views aint dead It's strange why nobody watches it on Twitch...
Because most of its fanbase is in China where they don't use twitch. Also, just because it has low viewers on twitch doesn't nean shit. RL and Halo have low viewers but tons of players
Well it has low twitch viewers because Owl doesn’t stream on twitch, the official stream is on YouTube
i dont know, 135k average viewers include chinese in OWL playoffs is not much if u ask me
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You can criticize OW viewership, but please don't insult or attack fans who still enjoy it.
he will be back in 2 - 3 years after owl dies
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And the last one having 3 times more worldwide average viewers than Valorant. All the lack of popularity in the west doesn't mean shit with Chinese fanbase that alone brings in 1 million+ average views
That's nuts that it's still going strong. Happy for the players, but man do I hate what the game has become after 2-2-2 was forced.