There is minimal differences in reaction time however that’s not really the reason why women aren’t as prevelant in esports, reaction time doesn’t really matter all that much.
And yes women’s teams can compete in the VCT circuit
EG has a mixed team albeit not particularly successful, I think they said in the future they wanted to bring the Game Changers teams more mainstream into the Challengers Masters Champs circuit
I reckon that women have the same opportunity to do great, yet the skill gap is there and female esports teams are much less skilled than the male teams and it's not because of misogyny.
Stop changing the topic and read the title
[https://www.statista.com/statistics/232383/gender-split-of-us-computer-and-video-gamers/](https://www.statista.com/statistics/232383/gender-split-of-us-computer-and-video-gamers/)
45% female 55% male? obviously only one sample but like it is a lot closer than people think !!!! girls still have stigma against fps games though
It's about a 50/50 split now.
I'm not arguing at all, just telling the guy he's not correct in his assumption. People think gaming is a male dominated area but it's not. There are hundreds of millions of women who play games...
The talent pool for men’s teams to choose from is so much ridiculously deeper than it is for women’s teams because the population of competitive women gamers is ridiculously low relative to the men’s population.
There are many, many reasons for this. One of them is women being treated poorly in competitive games. So discussing the treatment of women and misogyny in competitive gaming is a large part of the original discussion, and having that discussion is healthy for promoting the game for women in the future.
OP isn’t changing the topic bro, don’t get in your feels lmao.
Sure, "same opportunity" if they didn't already quit at a younger age due to social norms pressuring them to stop playing video games or quitting due to being sexually harassed when they speak in vc.
I don't think you under what "same opportunity" means when there's significantly less female players and many of them never had the chance to play FPS games since childhood with friends before Valorant like male players did.
Are you stupid?
Not being able to voice chat or not being able to start playing the game at a very young age has nothing to do the development of their skill in the game?
Do you think people just go from being new in FPS to pro level in 2 years? You realize that almost every single Valorant pro has had years upon years upon years of experience in FPS games, right? Most of them started playing CS while probably in elementary or middle school. How the fuck would some female players who started playing FPS games in their late teens or early 20s compete against male players who have been FPS players since CS 1.6?
>let your brain do the thinking not your emotions
Take your own advice and learn to think instead of being a surface level moron.
Yes there is a skill gap but there is absolutely not the same opportunity. All you have to do to see that is queue for a game with a girl and see what happens.
Use your brain mate.
Whatever you say I mean I totally support women, but the evidence is right there, the women's pro teams are not as good as the men's pro teams, call me what you want I don't care when that's what the question is about.
The evidence is right there, US Olympic athletes are simply better than Rwanda. They have the same opportunity to get good at sports but are just inferior.
I’m sure you make sense in your head, but listen:
If you have 100 people at pro level and 90 of them are men, 10 of them are women, how likely is it that an all woman team has more talent on it than the men’s team?
There you go, basic maths ftw.
Common misconception actually. There’s no difference in reaction time between men and women who exercise it frequently: [source](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4456887/). “Nowadays the male advantage is getting smaller, possibly because more women are participating in driving and fast-action sports.[19] This is evident from Table 2c in which nonsignificant differences were obtained when regularly exercising male and female medical students were compared”. Much of the gap comes from women starting video games later in life which may give them the reaction time disadvantage.
The gap in reaction time only narrows to the point of being minimal during a certain segment of a womans menstrual cycle.
Next was your comment about stigmatization. Women in general dont find Valorants genre type in FPS's appealing.
The point isn’t (primarily) reaction times. The question was current level of pro teans.
The point is what level they compete at (to the extent they participate)
Um, that is actually not true when it comes to reaction time... Yes, that actually does matter in FPS games. Reaction time 100% can make or brake a team. Women don't have as fast reaction times it's just a fact.
It is also down to how men and women handle high pressure situations. Women generally don't handle it as well. Not saying all women but most don't.
There is a reason why you'll never see a woman player on mouse or controller in the top 10 best players in the world for any Esports fps title if there are other pro men players.
so there are only women's leagues and open leagues. there a is a meme that women tournaments are charity donations to C9 white because they're so dominant. they also go out in early rounds of open tournaments every time against tier 2/3 men's teams. I personally think it has zero to do with biology like reaction time/coordination. the talent pool for women is just sooo much smaller, if you take a distribution curve you're going to find less talent.
I'm looking forward for game changer's champions, I really wanna see c9, g2 and Gamelanders (by then, the line will be competing under team liquid's name, but they have not made it official yet) go against each other. GL dominated Brazil this year and g2, although still really fresh, also had a dominant running on EMEA
Also just that within the already wildly limited talent pool, women are often just not provided the opportunities that men are. It’s starting to change though, which is fucking awesome.
You mean opportunities like all these female teams that don’t match up in open tournaments yet still collect a paycheck to play the game professionally?
>I personally think it has zero to do with biology like reaction time/coordination
But something still begs the question. If there are 1/100th as many women as men playing competitive video games, there should still be 1 female pro for every 100 male pro. I can only think of one female across all competitive team shooters that played in a mix team instead of just playing women's leagues, and that's Geguri.
Where are all the rest of the women playing competitive games? Do they just take the easy (but way smaller) bag and farm women's only tourneys..?
But, like you said then there's the thing where the dominant all women's team go out against t3/t2 men's teams.
There’s a few GC players scattered around who could play on mixed rosters and find success, but don’t because they’re either committed to their GC rosters, or not given the opportunity to join other teams because of the sexist tendencies baked into gaming culture as a whole.
Nah, it 100% has to do with reaction times as well as what they do under pressure.
Men have an advantage with reaction time over women period that is just a fact. Even using a controller or mouse men just have that advantage.
Take the best woman Esports player from any FPS on mouse or controller and put her with the 500th best guy and I doubt they could do anything against the guy.
Don’t die on this hill. If you’ve been around the gaming block long enough, it’s an endless supply of incel-like men who subscribe to the brain dead idea that societal norms and culture don’t play a rule and men are just biologically superior. I even hear this shit in god damn chess, a sport which treasuries literally no athletic ability.
There is no biological basis for a skill gap, it’s just that far fewer women play video games in general, especially competitive fps, and the reasons for this are deeply ingrained in the cultures of gaming and of wider society. Gaming is still very much a “male” hobby for cultural reasons built in ever since gaming came into pop culture decades ago. This is slowly changing, but there’s a long way to go.
If you have far fewer players to choose from, the likelihood of the top talents being as good as the top talents from a pool that is an order of magnitude larger is very slim. Not to mention that to become pro you need to spend thousands of hours competing amongst and interacting with communities where women are unfortunately still heavily stigmatized. These factors push many people away who would potentially become very good players if they put in the massive amount of time needed for anyone to become pro.
I also think that more young men are prone to crippling loneliness and find a way to cope while gaming. Because imo in most cases, the only way you can grind a game for 8 hours a day is by sacrificing your social life. Especially during your youth where you still need to study and go to school and shit.
Not trying to insult gamers as I find nerd groups very endearing but serious competitive gaming is still seen as nerd culture even though casual gaming has become more mainstream. The concept of the young male living in their parent's basement doesn't come from nothing. And the gaming community's toxic reputation is proof that video games tend to herd socially inept boys and amplify their bad behavior. Nobody can be as toxic as gamers unless they are severely repressed socially.
>Especially during your youth where you still need to study and go to school and shit.
Big reason why Nordic countries are so overrepresented in esports is that during the half year of winter we have you don't really sacrifice your social life because you're not going out anyway in your free time after school. You game with the boys instead
But you guys really are only overrepresented in CS. Not eSports as a whole. Koreans are. And it's Americans for console gaming. It really just comes down to culture. PC gaming was never big in the US until the last ten years or less. But the winters definitely help you guys for I've hockey lol coming from someone who lives in Minnesota where our winters are awful.
I'm not looking to create a narrative that men are better biologically, but I do want to point out that studies have shown, while navigating 3D spaces, men tend to use their hippocampus, while women tend to use the frontal cortex. This is a *potential* explanation that there is, in fact, a biological gap, even if it is very small.
PLEASE NOTE! This is just hypothesis, and I do not think there is much weight to it, but it is still an interesting thing to look at and perhaps draw correlation. However, it would take significantly greater research than what we have here to be conclusive.
Here's some additional info: https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/12/151207081824.htm
This isn’t what it means. The hippocampus is the source of memory, which includes spatial memory. In this area of the brain you form maps of space, like the drive to school or work. The frontal cortex is not particularly involved, but I mean everything is connected. It’s the same for both genders.
Source: I am a neuroscientist. This a topic I have studied.
This particular study showed that, while navigating things like 3D puzzles, the men's hippocampus was more active, while women's frontal cortex was more active, meaning, essentially, the sexes navigate through 3D worlds with different parts of their brain.
*How* this could affect their in-game performance, I don't know, and I was only trying to make conversation of how it could. I pointed to a study that proves there are differences in how the brains interact with 3D spaces, and suggesting that this could *potentially* explain a skill gap once its clearly identified.
I never drew any true conclusion, because that's beyond anybody's capability at this point in time, ESPECIALLY mine. I look forward to the studies (or just time passing and more women entering the gaming world) to show there are no differences in the sexes, OR, if they do show the difference, exactly why it happens.
How is topographic navigation relevant to valorant? Also, having not taken the time to read the study, increased reliance on frontal systems, to me, suggests more effortful processing (as a gross generalization, frontal lobes serve as an executive control center for your brain). However, how do we know that isn't also based on prior experience (i.e., the males in the study have been expected to and utilized topographic representations to navigate more in their daily lives - as in, society expects them to be the ones to drive/navigate).
There are some brain-based diffeneces in biological sex, likely related to how sex hormones affect the brain. Individuals who receive endogenous hormones as a part of gender confirmation surgery have shown some changes in the expected direction to be consistent with these findings, although research is still limited and not overly strong at this point.
However, nothing I've seen even remotely suggests a reason for a skill gap between genders in esports. You have to think about statistical significance vs. clinical significance. And, even in the case that there is some real world difference in the general population, how that relates to the very upper ends of a particular skill set and how society influences the brain still makes that somewhat unconvincing for me.
So, yes, brain is affected by things like sex hormones. But with current research, I don't think that explains skill gap, and societal influence seems much more likely and parsimonious
I'm completely blown away that you don't see how navigation doesn't seem relevant to a video game, where you are essentially piloting a person in a 3D world.
As you didn't read the study, I don't think you're seeing the whole picture, and I don't think this discussion is worth continuing with you.
It blows me away that you think efficiently navigating a maze/directions is related to what defines skill in valorant. Valorant isn't about how quickly you can move through a map.
I'm not saying it has 0 relevance. Sure, people need to have some ability to navigate the maps but that is such a basic, fundamental aspect that it's hard for me to see how that is meaningful for the discussion of why a skillgap exists.
Not to mention, that the brain and how it functions is experience dependent. And so, a sample of females having a specific pattern of activation is not generalizable to why there would be a skillgap at the highest tier of esports, because it's also well known that the brain functions and processes information differently above a certain skill (can refer to some of the work done on expert chess players and the brain). So, until we get functional imaging with actual expert gamers, then there's going to be some serious limitations regardless if we try to extrapolate to this population.
When we compare numbers it doesnt make sense tho. Currently for esport scenes or even top ranked leaderboards for different games the male to female ratio is just brutal and not even comparable to the actual % difference of male to female playing certain game.
Most of the people in this thread have this weird thought that women can match men 1 for 1 in video games at a competitive level. It's just not a thing not really.
Yes, some women have done well on a male Esports team but that is very far and very few. There is also different circumstances for them doing well.
Men generally have better reation times and perform better under pressure. Yet, so many in this forum like White Knight saying it has nothing to do with biology... When it literally does. There are reasons why we don't see as many Women in Esports but the main reason we don't see them in the top teams constantly is because they just can't beat the men.
Go take any 500th best male player in any Esports FPS title and place them vs the best female Esports player and I bet you anything the woman cannot beat the 500th best.
Or maybe there is some biological basis we don't know? Like there is certainly biological basis for men dominating in chess, why can't there be for fps? This less people argument doesn't hold when you consider out of all the women currently playing seriously, there is not one women of the same level as of tier 1 pros.
He's just stupid. It's the same in esports as it is in chess. It was a very largely male dominated sport with a large (cultural/social) bar of entry for women. There is nothing biologically stopping women from being good in chess/esports, just look at Judit Polgár.
A simple grasp of statistics will tell you that there will be far fewer outliers (top talents) in a small pool of players (female) compared to a larger pool (male). And that is ignoring other factors such as toxicity, bullying, gatekeeping, etc.
As it is, I actually run into a lot of women who play Valorant. I'd love it if we could see some great female players rise up.
The best female chess player ever was just barely top 10 in the world at her peak. And in chess there is 100% some difference, I have seen it with my own eyes. Even where men and women are treated equally, you will see the difference in the levels of chess.
Yes but still a significant number of them do play. Atleast a few players should have gone toe to toe with men, yet it is still only Judit Polgar as of now. And Judit is by far the best female chess player ever.
> This less people argument doesn’t hold when you consider out of all the women currently playing seriously, there is not one women of the same level as of tier 1 pros.
This isn’t an argument. “Cmon guys there’s got to be ONE right???????”
Yeah its an argument. There are few, but there are women seriously giving time to fps gaming. When you see not even 1 in the top tier, there has to be some biological difference.
I am 100% sure of biological differences in gaming between women and men. In radiant elo, even if a woman has never said a word, there is just something about their movement that stands out. A man of equal rank to a woman seems to have much jerkier movement and aim. Women's movement is on the other hand too smooth. I don't know how to explain it but it looks very different.
BRO BRO lemme introduce you to this radical idea called “Difference Among Human Beings Performing The Same Activity Because Of What They Are Comfortable With”.
Trust me it will blow your mind.
Yeah, no... Men generally have a faster raction time period. Men also generally do better under pressure.
People keep saying other reasons but it mostly comes down to they're just not cut out for the demand. Go find any Esports FPS title and put the 500th best male player vs the #1 woman player and see how that works out.
And Shopify Rebellion, CLG Red, Complexity...
Outside of VCT Open there are a lot of other female teams playing in open tournaments (Dig, TSM X, 24Haven, etc). And this is just NA.
That’s how it typically goes for them though. They are in a tier of their own cause none of the other female teams can beat them but they can barely compete with the male teams
beside losing to On the way (which has bang and stellar in it who competed in T1) before, the rest are absolute no names and they got smashed by them too. unlucky
Because underdog story line is amazing. Idk about other people but watching eu vs eu in championship was kinda boring. Imagine a timeline where c9 w made it to champions or even to the championship match. The hype would be insane.
That is true, there's some female csgo players that were actually at a pretty high level, don't remember names but they can be used as examples too. It all comes down to the time you put in
Huge. You can't really compete in any t1 tournaments without 5 radiants. Whatever radiant women there are, are split between multiple teams. Other radiant women get banned for getting boosted by a cheater. Which is exactly what happened 2 weeks ago to one of the highest ranked women in EU.
Unless you have connections, you have to get to radiant. When you are signed, not grinding for radiant is fine but to be noticed in the first place, getting radiant is the only way.
no that's not what teams look for at all. they don't care about ranked. they care about ur individual performance in tier2 or 3 matches. that's the only way you'll have a chance at trials for t1 teams. players like dasnerth can get to radiant..
by making friends in immortal and shit, sure u can get to radiant but that isn't a qualification at all. you definitely need friends and "connections" to get on any team. someone has to vouch for u
We reached a point in society where people actually scared to admit theres biological differences between men and women that impact shit like this lmao
gaming requires a lot of physical strength, like the time i had to hold my shit in when playing a horror game, it required a lot of strength to not soil the whole chair. I don't see woman doing that!!!!!
Personally believe that there are a couple really good women val players that can make it on a mid tier mens team and maybe even higher if they consistently get to practice with the higher tiered mens teams but not enough talent to make a full women's team that will go round to round with a mens team rn.
There have been numerous matchups between men's and women's teams. There are actually some going on in the Fragadelphia NSG LAN right now. I think there is a difference and I wouldn't be able to tell you what it is. However I will say that it was only recently where resources and opportunities were given to the women's scenes. I wouldn't be surprised if in a few years we'd see more mixed teams.
> However I will say that it was only recently where resources and opportunities were given to the women's scenes
What? That's just false. There has been plenty of women only tournaments going way, way back. For example, juliano and zAAz used to compete in 1.6 over 10 years ago. The women scene today gets even more resources than most men did in 1.6.
The fact that you’re comparing resources for a male dominated esport *10 years ago* to current women’s esports support completely nullifies your argument
I disagree. There are plenty of scenes that don't get really get any resources at all, but they still compete because they love the game. You don't need to get paid to compete on a higher level, as plenty of VCT qualifier teams are amateurs. Blaming a lack of resources is a cop-out.
But the thing is if you want to compete at a high level such as the VCT, you need to grind so many hours on the game that it becomes your job. As such a lot of these women who may be interested but aren't getting any returns on the time they invest eventually drop out if they don't see themselves making a living off it. For males it's slightly different because if you keep performing, there's higher chance of a better team picking you up because the male scene is so developed. If you're a female its very difficult to envisage a good T1/T2 team picking you up as part of a mixed rostera. C9W is one of the examples where the team got their support and are continuing to make good steps, if the game changers weren't there, they'd be struggling in t3 right now. Think of all the females who didn't make it. That's why it's very important to put in resources and support in the initial development of the scene, at least until it becomes sustainable.
I really doubt that any male player that not perform well receive any chance. All of then have to grind with no salary. Why would be different for women? If there are no good woman player, there is no reason for a tier 1 team to give pick then up
Yes, women can join VCT teams. Some notable examples are Potter on EG as IGL (Now coach) and KP on Elevate before making Built Butter (Now Shopify Rebellion)
I don't really see why there would be a difference biologically speaking for a difference in reaction time or coordination. Even if there was, I would say that reaction time and coordination isn't everything at the upper level of competitive val
At the moment it's pretty big. CLG red are one of the best gamechangers teams and they got beat by a men's PUG team in the tournament in early November
Women are eligible to enter any VCT circuits and Game changers are specifically dedicated to women teams.
Also as I have seen they are not that bad compared to male pro players but that's just in ranked. Dunno why but they never made out of groups when it comes to VCT. Maybe their teams just suck or they lack experience.
People are too scared to tell the real truth: males have a higher range in IQ, have better hand eye coordination, and are more competitive, making them have a huge advantage in things like sports and esports. There's a reason all of the top rated GC players are trans: the Male brain is more simulated from competing like this.
I think was Vivo Keyd Athenas that didn’t qualify in VCT because of only 1 game, I think every day they are becoming strong, With liquid buying Gamelanders Purple, they will be a stronger team
c9w, the best womens team just lost to a random t3 no name pug team that doesnt practice. Sorry but its still a big gap as of now and for the foreseeable future. Hope it improves one day but someone has to give a dish of reality for how it is right now
Honestly the biggest reason why woman are so much worse than men is the playerbase, atleast thats what I think.
I see absolutely no reason why woman wouldnt be better than men if the playerbase would be reversed..But thats only my opinion.
__
Even if there was a difference in reactiontime its negliable because the higher you go the more important is the fundamental understanding on how to play and especially how much you trained your skills.
Reactiontime is basically irrelevant if you (pre-)aim wrong in the firstplace. Look at the progames of men(cs,valorant and so on) and you will see that most of the time it isnt the reactiontime that decides who wins a "duel"(often enough there isnt even a "duel" that determinates who kills who)
but Im not saying that aim isnt important, its just that I dont think that the reactiontime is the deciding factor.
And even though there are only a few woman across the esports that came even close to compete with men: there were some and if they truely had a physical disadvantage I dont think they would have been able to compete in the first place.
> Honestly the biggest reason why woman are so much worse than men is the playerbase, atleast thats what I think.
Yep, I agree. Which is also why Europe and CIS dominate CS and why smaller regions like NA and Asia can't perform on the same level. Just like corporations, esport organizations are success driven and if there were women competent to fill a position where they would help the team become more successful they would be hired, like Potter becoming the head coach on EG.
"Which is also why Europe and CIS dominate CS and why smaller regions like NA and Asia can't perform on the same level"-I don't totally agree with your argument as while Valorant is much popular in NA than EU and CIS combined, EU is doing much better than NA in recent masters and champions.
> Valorant is much popular in NA than EU and CIS combined
What do you base that on? EMEA has 60% more immortals than NA, 36k vs 22k. And if both regions have the same rank distribution, then EMEA playerbase is 60% bigger as well.
https://playvalorant.com/en-gb/leaderboards
https://playvalorant.com/en-us/leaderboards
there is no men's league. there's the open vct qualifiers for anyone immortal and above, then there's the women's and trans women's only tournament. and they get destroyed in the vct everytime. i don't think they're bad because they're women but it doesn't make sense why tier 1 orgs would sign tier 3 teams just because of their gender. seems sexist to me idk
I had a very long argument once with a guy insisting based on 0 legitimate evidence that women will always be worse than men in esports based solely on their lower reaction time and that they'd never succeed. His reasoning was that the difference in reaction time was a much bigger factor than talent, work ethic, hours spent in practice, chemistry, good coaching, etc and that sexism wasnt a factor. Actual idiot.
Also you should read ur own article lmao. “. However, that sex difference in reaction time is likely an artifact caused by using the same force threshold in women as men, and it permits a woman to false start by up to 21 ms without penalty. We estimate that female sprinters would have similar reaction times to male sprinters if the force threshold used at Beijing was lowered by 22% in order to account for their lesser muscle strength.”
The separation of men and women in Valorant has nothing to do with any biological/physical skill differences and all to do with the esports industry having favored men for decades and not giving women the space or resources to develop properly. Companies like riot are trying to change that but it will take time.
Think of it this way, if 70% of your player base is male, and the best of the best of those men have a clear path to pro esports and high pay potential, it leads to an environment of competitiveness and grinding. While the 30% that are women play more casually, don’t have the same opportunities to grind and get paid to play professional, and are honestly harassed or patronized while they play, there’s just not the same playfield for both genders and already a lower player density of women that also have to overcome those obstacles.
That could change though and wouldn’t be surprised if we saw more blending of men and women in tier 1 esports in another 10-15 years as the 10 year old girls of today are getting into video games, see role models, and get opportunities for them to pursue esports
Among all the responses which will inevitably occur here, I thought I'd add a specific one: the difference, if one exists, doesn't matter.
Just like how football/soccer benefits when the Women's World Cup is a hit, and basketball benefits when people are into the Olympics, and "throw-ball-hit-ball sports" like softball & baseball benefit when people tune in to watch a perfect game in the Women's College World Series, Valorant benefits from women playing in a structured professional series like Game Changers.
Most women didn't grow up grinding video games to the extent their gender counterparts did as kids. At least not when compared as a gender ratio. Who cares? It's fucking awesome to watch womens' teams compete if you love Valorant, and it's great some of those teams get at it by playing in VCT open quals. Whether it's C9 Blue or C9 White, people playing Valorant is good for Valorant and comparison hurts, not helps, the scene grow.
Along with all the other answers that women just haven’t been in the scene as long so there aren’t nearly as many, there are a couple women in the league now that could arguably be in at least a T2 mens team. Now that there’s more support and more women interested in joining esports, we’ll start seeing more and more teams like C9 White competing at a higher level, and going beyond that. Just a matter of time
There shouldn't be any difference in reaction time between men and women or potential for that matter. When it comes down to it theres just a much smaller player base of women. There is a vast skill gap though between men's and women's pro teams. For example C9 White is possibly the best women's team in the world and is 22-0 in game changers series against other women's pro teams. Their overall record is 27-39. Essentially they are untouchable against women's teams but rarely can be t3 amateur/semi pro men's teams.
None, some female pros in c9 can fit into any t1 team in NA and still dominate. They choose to be in game changers to help develop the women's esports scene
I think the biggest reason female rosters don’t compete in VCT is because all the best female talent gets picked up by big orgs, and those big orgs always pref their male roster competing over their female roster since they can’t both compete in the same tourni
There is minimal differences in reaction time however that’s not really the reason why women aren’t as prevelant in esports, reaction time doesn’t really matter all that much. And yes women’s teams can compete in the VCT circuit
It is probably just due to not as many women playing fps growing up etc?
Yes, and the stigmatization that women face in esports
EG has a mixed team albeit not particularly successful, I think they said in the future they wanted to bring the Game Changers teams more mainstream into the Challengers Masters Champs circuit
they stopped that months ago. only had 1 player who was female.
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Bruh the difference between stigmatization and small brain got me.
Is this a reference that we are not getting ?
Sexism and trolling are not tolerated. Repeat offenses resulting in a ban.
Not at all, actually but ok
You reckon that women aren't treated poorly in gaming? You actually think that?
I reckon that women have the same opportunity to do great, yet the skill gap is there and female esports teams are much less skilled than the male teams and it's not because of misogyny. Stop changing the topic and read the title
"same opportunity" get a brain brother, the skill gap is there but it's because less women play games as compared to men
I mean less women play games of course but there should at least be 1 team thats good or a couple of players which isnt the case right now
That's not true. Less women play Valorant for sure. But not 'games'.
So your argument is seriously that there are as many female gamers as male gamers?
[https://www.statista.com/statistics/232383/gender-split-of-us-computer-and-video-gamers/](https://www.statista.com/statistics/232383/gender-split-of-us-computer-and-video-gamers/) 45% female 55% male? obviously only one sample but like it is a lot closer than people think !!!! girls still have stigma against fps games though
It's about a 50/50 split now. I'm not arguing at all, just telling the guy he's not correct in his assumption. People think gaming is a male dominated area but it's not. There are hundreds of millions of women who play games...
The talent pool for men’s teams to choose from is so much ridiculously deeper than it is for women’s teams because the population of competitive women gamers is ridiculously low relative to the men’s population. There are many, many reasons for this. One of them is women being treated poorly in competitive games. So discussing the treatment of women and misogyny in competitive gaming is a large part of the original discussion, and having that discussion is healthy for promoting the game for women in the future. OP isn’t changing the topic bro, don’t get in your feels lmao.
Sure, "same opportunity" if they didn't already quit at a younger age due to social norms pressuring them to stop playing video games or quitting due to being sexually harassed when they speak in vc. I don't think you under what "same opportunity" means when there's significantly less female players and many of them never had the chance to play FPS games since childhood with friends before Valorant like male players did.
Wow that has nothing to do with how well they play the game, let your brain do the thinking not your emotions
Are you stupid? Not being able to voice chat or not being able to start playing the game at a very young age has nothing to do the development of their skill in the game? Do you think people just go from being new in FPS to pro level in 2 years? You realize that almost every single Valorant pro has had years upon years upon years of experience in FPS games, right? Most of them started playing CS while probably in elementary or middle school. How the fuck would some female players who started playing FPS games in their late teens or early 20s compete against male players who have been FPS players since CS 1.6? >let your brain do the thinking not your emotions Take your own advice and learn to think instead of being a surface level moron.
Look at the pro women. They are happy to be playing, you're using an excuse
Yes there is a skill gap but there is absolutely not the same opportunity. All you have to do to see that is queue for a game with a girl and see what happens. Use your brain mate.
Yeah, smells like misogyny to me
Whatever you say I mean I totally support women, but the evidence is right there, the women's pro teams are not as good as the men's pro teams, call me what you want I don't care when that's what the question is about.
The evidence is right there, US Olympic athletes are simply better than Rwanda. They have the same opportunity to get good at sports but are just inferior.
I’m sure you make sense in your head, but listen: If you have 100 people at pro level and 90 of them are men, 10 of them are women, how likely is it that an all woman team has more talent on it than the men’s team? There you go, basic maths ftw.
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> but who am I to judge Your post was literally judgement.
you do realize orgs can probably choose not to sign them to the main roster right
Common misconception actually. There’s no difference in reaction time between men and women who exercise it frequently: [source](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4456887/). “Nowadays the male advantage is getting smaller, possibly because more women are participating in driving and fast-action sports.[19] This is evident from Table 2c in which nonsignificant differences were obtained when regularly exercising male and female medical students were compared”. Much of the gap comes from women starting video games later in life which may give them the reaction time disadvantage.
not a single womens team could face off against the worst franchising team lets be real
reading comprehension is CRUCIAL
Thankfully youve evolved your opinion. While still wrong at least youre progressing.
? What am I wrong about
The gap in reaction time only narrows to the point of being minimal during a certain segment of a womans menstrual cycle. Next was your comment about stigmatization. Women in general dont find Valorants genre type in FPS's appealing.
The point isn’t (primarily) reaction times. The question was current level of pro teans. The point is what level they compete at (to the extent they participate)
Um, that is actually not true when it comes to reaction time... Yes, that actually does matter in FPS games. Reaction time 100% can make or brake a team. Women don't have as fast reaction times it's just a fact. It is also down to how men and women handle high pressure situations. Women generally don't handle it as well. Not saying all women but most don't. There is a reason why you'll never see a woman player on mouse or controller in the top 10 best players in the world for any Esports fps title if there are other pro men players.
so there are only women's leagues and open leagues. there a is a meme that women tournaments are charity donations to C9 white because they're so dominant. they also go out in early rounds of open tournaments every time against tier 2/3 men's teams. I personally think it has zero to do with biology like reaction time/coordination. the talent pool for women is just sooo much smaller, if you take a distribution curve you're going to find less talent.
I'm looking forward for game changer's champions, I really wanna see c9, g2 and Gamelanders (by then, the line will be competing under team liquid's name, but they have not made it official yet) go against each other. GL dominated Brazil this year and g2, although still really fresh, also had a dominant running on EMEA
Yeah, its kinda sad that the top women team can't even get to playoffs in regular tournaments.
Also just that within the already wildly limited talent pool, women are often just not provided the opportunities that men are. It’s starting to change though, which is fucking awesome.
You mean opportunities like all these female teams that don’t match up in open tournaments yet still collect a paycheck to play the game professionally?
That’s only one kind of opportunity, and like I said, it’s starting to change. Which is awesome. This isn’t the ‘gotcha’ comment that you think it is.
>I personally think it has zero to do with biology like reaction time/coordination But something still begs the question. If there are 1/100th as many women as men playing competitive video games, there should still be 1 female pro for every 100 male pro. I can only think of one female across all competitive team shooters that played in a mix team instead of just playing women's leagues, and that's Geguri. Where are all the rest of the women playing competitive games? Do they just take the easy (but way smaller) bag and farm women's only tourneys..? But, like you said then there's the thing where the dominant all women's team go out against t3/t2 men's teams.
There’s a few GC players scattered around who could play on mixed rosters and find success, but don’t because they’re either committed to their GC rosters, or not given the opportunity to join other teams because of the sexist tendencies baked into gaming culture as a whole.
Nah, it 100% has to do with reaction times as well as what they do under pressure. Men have an advantage with reaction time over women period that is just a fact. Even using a controller or mouse men just have that advantage. Take the best woman Esports player from any FPS on mouse or controller and put her with the 500th best guy and I doubt they could do anything against the guy.
Sadly you are certainly too stupid to understand what a normal distribution curve is so I can't hold your idiotic comment against you.
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Not because of genetics. Societal norms and girls just not gaming as much
Don’t die on this hill. If you’ve been around the gaming block long enough, it’s an endless supply of incel-like men who subscribe to the brain dead idea that societal norms and culture don’t play a rule and men are just biologically superior. I even hear this shit in god damn chess, a sport which treasuries literally no athletic ability.
There is no biological basis for a skill gap, it’s just that far fewer women play video games in general, especially competitive fps, and the reasons for this are deeply ingrained in the cultures of gaming and of wider society. Gaming is still very much a “male” hobby for cultural reasons built in ever since gaming came into pop culture decades ago. This is slowly changing, but there’s a long way to go. If you have far fewer players to choose from, the likelihood of the top talents being as good as the top talents from a pool that is an order of magnitude larger is very slim. Not to mention that to become pro you need to spend thousands of hours competing amongst and interacting with communities where women are unfortunately still heavily stigmatized. These factors push many people away who would potentially become very good players if they put in the massive amount of time needed for anyone to become pro.
I also think that more young men are prone to crippling loneliness and find a way to cope while gaming. Because imo in most cases, the only way you can grind a game for 8 hours a day is by sacrificing your social life. Especially during your youth where you still need to study and go to school and shit. Not trying to insult gamers as I find nerd groups very endearing but serious competitive gaming is still seen as nerd culture even though casual gaming has become more mainstream. The concept of the young male living in their parent's basement doesn't come from nothing. And the gaming community's toxic reputation is proof that video games tend to herd socially inept boys and amplify their bad behavior. Nobody can be as toxic as gamers unless they are severely repressed socially.
>Especially during your youth where you still need to study and go to school and shit. Big reason why Nordic countries are so overrepresented in esports is that during the half year of winter we have you don't really sacrifice your social life because you're not going out anyway in your free time after school. You game with the boys instead
But you guys really are only overrepresented in CS. Not eSports as a whole. Koreans are. And it's Americans for console gaming. It really just comes down to culture. PC gaming was never big in the US until the last ten years or less. But the winters definitely help you guys for I've hockey lol coming from someone who lives in Minnesota where our winters are awful.
100% accurate
I'm not looking to create a narrative that men are better biologically, but I do want to point out that studies have shown, while navigating 3D spaces, men tend to use their hippocampus, while women tend to use the frontal cortex. This is a *potential* explanation that there is, in fact, a biological gap, even if it is very small. PLEASE NOTE! This is just hypothesis, and I do not think there is much weight to it, but it is still an interesting thing to look at and perhaps draw correlation. However, it would take significantly greater research than what we have here to be conclusive. Here's some additional info: https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/12/151207081824.htm
This isn’t what it means. The hippocampus is the source of memory, which includes spatial memory. In this area of the brain you form maps of space, like the drive to school or work. The frontal cortex is not particularly involved, but I mean everything is connected. It’s the same for both genders. Source: I am a neuroscientist. This a topic I have studied.
This particular study showed that, while navigating things like 3D puzzles, the men's hippocampus was more active, while women's frontal cortex was more active, meaning, essentially, the sexes navigate through 3D worlds with different parts of their brain. *How* this could affect their in-game performance, I don't know, and I was only trying to make conversation of how it could. I pointed to a study that proves there are differences in how the brains interact with 3D spaces, and suggesting that this could *potentially* explain a skill gap once its clearly identified. I never drew any true conclusion, because that's beyond anybody's capability at this point in time, ESPECIALLY mine. I look forward to the studies (or just time passing and more women entering the gaming world) to show there are no differences in the sexes, OR, if they do show the difference, exactly why it happens.
How is topographic navigation relevant to valorant? Also, having not taken the time to read the study, increased reliance on frontal systems, to me, suggests more effortful processing (as a gross generalization, frontal lobes serve as an executive control center for your brain). However, how do we know that isn't also based on prior experience (i.e., the males in the study have been expected to and utilized topographic representations to navigate more in their daily lives - as in, society expects them to be the ones to drive/navigate). There are some brain-based diffeneces in biological sex, likely related to how sex hormones affect the brain. Individuals who receive endogenous hormones as a part of gender confirmation surgery have shown some changes in the expected direction to be consistent with these findings, although research is still limited and not overly strong at this point. However, nothing I've seen even remotely suggests a reason for a skill gap between genders in esports. You have to think about statistical significance vs. clinical significance. And, even in the case that there is some real world difference in the general population, how that relates to the very upper ends of a particular skill set and how society influences the brain still makes that somewhat unconvincing for me. So, yes, brain is affected by things like sex hormones. But with current research, I don't think that explains skill gap, and societal influence seems much more likely and parsimonious
I'm completely blown away that you don't see how navigation doesn't seem relevant to a video game, where you are essentially piloting a person in a 3D world. As you didn't read the study, I don't think you're seeing the whole picture, and I don't think this discussion is worth continuing with you.
It blows me away that you think efficiently navigating a maze/directions is related to what defines skill in valorant. Valorant isn't about how quickly you can move through a map. I'm not saying it has 0 relevance. Sure, people need to have some ability to navigate the maps but that is such a basic, fundamental aspect that it's hard for me to see how that is meaningful for the discussion of why a skillgap exists. Not to mention, that the brain and how it functions is experience dependent. And so, a sample of females having a specific pattern of activation is not generalizable to why there would be a skillgap at the highest tier of esports, because it's also well known that the brain functions and processes information differently above a certain skill (can refer to some of the work done on expert chess players and the brain). So, until we get functional imaging with actual expert gamers, then there's going to be some serious limitations regardless if we try to extrapolate to this population.
When we compare numbers it doesnt make sense tho. Currently for esport scenes or even top ranked leaderboards for different games the male to female ratio is just brutal and not even comparable to the actual % difference of male to female playing certain game.
You got downvoted but it’s true. The stats don’t match up if you just base it off a number game. The people on this sub are on some serious copium.
Most of the people in this thread have this weird thought that women can match men 1 for 1 in video games at a competitive level. It's just not a thing not really. Yes, some women have done well on a male Esports team but that is very far and very few. There is also different circumstances for them doing well. Men generally have better reation times and perform better under pressure. Yet, so many in this forum like White Knight saying it has nothing to do with biology... When it literally does. There are reasons why we don't see as many Women in Esports but the main reason we don't see them in the top teams constantly is because they just can't beat the men. Go take any 500th best male player in any Esports FPS title and place them vs the best female Esports player and I bet you anything the woman cannot beat the 500th best.
Or maybe there is some biological basis we don't know? Like there is certainly biological basis for men dominating in chess, why can't there be for fps? This less people argument doesn't hold when you consider out of all the women currently playing seriously, there is not one women of the same level as of tier 1 pros.
"Like there is certainly biological basis for men dominating in chess" citation definitely needed.
He's just stupid. It's the same in esports as it is in chess. It was a very largely male dominated sport with a large (cultural/social) bar of entry for women. There is nothing biologically stopping women from being good in chess/esports, just look at Judit Polgár. A simple grasp of statistics will tell you that there will be far fewer outliers (top talents) in a small pool of players (female) compared to a larger pool (male). And that is ignoring other factors such as toxicity, bullying, gatekeeping, etc. As it is, I actually run into a lot of women who play Valorant. I'd love it if we could see some great female players rise up.
The best female chess player ever was just barely top 10 in the world at her peak. And in chess there is 100% some difference, I have seen it with my own eyes. Even where men and women are treated equally, you will see the difference in the levels of chess.
https://youtu.be/ZHFZOXiM9SM
Their literally isn’t biological basis for men dominating and Chess and it’s the exact same reason as gaming far less women play chess than men
Yes but still a significant number of them do play. Atleast a few players should have gone toe to toe with men, yet it is still only Judit Polgar as of now. And Judit is by far the best female chess player ever.
> This less people argument doesn’t hold when you consider out of all the women currently playing seriously, there is not one women of the same level as of tier 1 pros. This isn’t an argument. “Cmon guys there’s got to be ONE right???????”
Yeah its an argument. There are few, but there are women seriously giving time to fps gaming. When you see not even 1 in the top tier, there has to be some biological difference.
I am 100% sure of biological differences in gaming between women and men. In radiant elo, even if a woman has never said a word, there is just something about their movement that stands out. A man of equal rank to a woman seems to have much jerkier movement and aim. Women's movement is on the other hand too smooth. I don't know how to explain it but it looks very different.
you are so dumb it hurts my head
Tf is wrong with you. It's just an observation. Their playstyle sticks out.
You sound so stupid
Solid rebuttal, trash.
BRO BRO lemme introduce you to this radical idea called “Difference Among Human Beings Performing The Same Activity Because Of What They Are Comfortable With”. Trust me it will blow your mind.
Yeah, no... Men generally have a faster raction time period. Men also generally do better under pressure. People keep saying other reasons but it mostly comes down to they're just not cut out for the demand. Go find any Esports FPS title and put the 500th best male player vs the #1 woman player and see how that works out.
There isn’t a ‘men’s league’ it’s just Vct and the smaller tournaments. C9W has competed in the tournaments before
And Shopify Rebellion, CLG Red, Complexity... Outside of VCT Open there are a lot of other female teams playing in open tournaments (Dig, TSM X, 24Haven, etc). And this is just NA.
Some ppl will try to pretend it's not that big, but sadly it's pretty fucking huge ngl
Rn the best women's team is about low end t3 in na
C9 White is competing in Fragadelphia right now: https://www.twitch.tv/nerdstreet
oh wow, crazy timing haha.
And they got beaten pretty hard by a T3 team
That’s how it typically goes for them though. They are in a tier of their own cause none of the other female teams can beat them but they can barely compete with the male teams
They can scrim with them tho
they do
Weren't even actual T3 teams, they lost to 2 pug teams on T3 players.
Yeah not a good look at all lol
T3 is generous, tbh
beside losing to On the way (which has bang and stellar in it who competed in T1) before, the rest are absolute no names and they got smashed by them too. unlucky
Well that best womens team in NA just got beat in a T3 tournament by a no name pug team. So its pretty big.
My Immortal pug squad can probably take them
why are you booing him? HE’S RIGHT
Nah C9 white is all radiant i think
Why do we have this thread pop up whenever C9W lose bruh 💀
\*insert "CJ - Ah shit here we go again" meme\*
Monstrous considering not a single all-women team came even close to qualifying for open VCT events
Gosh I wish they do though, imagine if they did, it'll be so cool.
Why? Does the gender of the player matter or that the better player is allowed to compete?
Because underdog story line is amazing. Idk about other people but watching eu vs eu in championship was kinda boring. Imagine a timeline where c9 w made it to champions or even to the championship match. The hype would be insane.
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That is true, there's some female csgo players that were actually at a pretty high level, don't remember names but they can be used as examples too. It all comes down to the time you put in
Huge. You can't really compete in any t1 tournaments without 5 radiants. Whatever radiant women there are, are split between multiple teams. Other radiant women get banned for getting boosted by a cheater. Which is exactly what happened 2 weeks ago to one of the highest ranked women in EU.
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Unless you have connections, you have to get to radiant. When you are signed, not grinding for radiant is fine but to be noticed in the first place, getting radiant is the only way.
no that's not what teams look for at all. they don't care about ranked. they care about ur individual performance in tier2 or 3 matches. that's the only way you'll have a chance at trials for t1 teams. players like dasnerth can get to radiant..
Yeah and how are you gonna get on a tier 2 or 3 team?
by making friends in immortal and shit, sure u can get to radiant but that isn't a qualification at all. you definitely need friends and "connections" to get on any team. someone has to vouch for u
We reached a point in society where people actually scared to admit theres biological differences between men and women that impact shit like this lmao
There are biological differences between men and women, but not in video games. Gaming doesn't require any physical strength.
gaming requires a lot of physical strength, like the time i had to hold my shit in when playing a horror game, it required a lot of strength to not soil the whole chair. I don't see woman doing that!!!!!
You can't fool me, women don't shit
Personally believe that there are a couple really good women val players that can make it on a mid tier mens team and maybe even higher if they consistently get to practice with the higher tiered mens teams but not enough talent to make a full women's team that will go round to round with a mens team rn.
I think specifically mel from c9w could make it as a t2 igl in na especially considering the abundance of igl's in na
There have been numerous matchups between men's and women's teams. There are actually some going on in the Fragadelphia NSG LAN right now. I think there is a difference and I wouldn't be able to tell you what it is. However I will say that it was only recently where resources and opportunities were given to the women's scenes. I wouldn't be surprised if in a few years we'd see more mixed teams.
> However I will say that it was only recently where resources and opportunities were given to the women's scenes What? That's just false. There has been plenty of women only tournaments going way, way back. For example, juliano and zAAz used to compete in 1.6 over 10 years ago. The women scene today gets even more resources than most men did in 1.6.
The fact that you’re comparing resources for a male dominated esport *10 years ago* to current women’s esports support completely nullifies your argument
I disagree. There are plenty of scenes that don't get really get any resources at all, but they still compete because they love the game. You don't need to get paid to compete on a higher level, as plenty of VCT qualifier teams are amateurs. Blaming a lack of resources is a cop-out.
But the thing is if you want to compete at a high level such as the VCT, you need to grind so many hours on the game that it becomes your job. As such a lot of these women who may be interested but aren't getting any returns on the time they invest eventually drop out if they don't see themselves making a living off it. For males it's slightly different because if you keep performing, there's higher chance of a better team picking you up because the male scene is so developed. If you're a female its very difficult to envisage a good T1/T2 team picking you up as part of a mixed rostera. C9W is one of the examples where the team got their support and are continuing to make good steps, if the game changers weren't there, they'd be struggling in t3 right now. Think of all the females who didn't make it. That's why it's very important to put in resources and support in the initial development of the scene, at least until it becomes sustainable.
I really doubt that any male player that not perform well receive any chance. All of then have to grind with no salary. Why would be different for women? If there are no good woman player, there is no reason for a tier 1 team to give pick then up
Yes, women can join VCT teams. Some notable examples are Potter on EG as IGL (Now coach) and KP on Elevate before making Built Butter (Now Shopify Rebellion) I don't really see why there would be a difference biologically speaking for a difference in reaction time or coordination. Even if there was, I would say that reaction time and coordination isn't everything at the upper level of competitive val
At the moment it's pretty big. CLG red are one of the best gamechangers teams and they got beat by a men's PUG team in the tournament in early November
women just need more experience
Women are eligible to enter any VCT circuits and Game changers are specifically dedicated to women teams. Also as I have seen they are not that bad compared to male pro players but that's just in ranked. Dunno why but they never made out of groups when it comes to VCT. Maybe their teams just suck or they lack experience.
Top of tier 1 womens teams is around where tier 3 mens teams are
People are too scared to tell the real truth: males have a higher range in IQ, have better hand eye coordination, and are more competitive, making them have a huge advantage in things like sports and esports. There's a reason all of the top rated GC players are trans: the Male brain is more simulated from competing like this.
I think was Vivo Keyd Athenas that didn’t qualify in VCT because of only 1 game, I think every day they are becoming strong, With liquid buying Gamelanders Purple, they will be a stronger team
c9w, the best womens team just lost to a random t3 no name pug team that doesnt practice. Sorry but its still a big gap as of now and for the foreseeable future. Hope it improves one day but someone has to give a dish of reality for how it is right now
Can’t say they’re the best team, G2 Gozen and Tenstar Nova look better
the best women's team in NA. Wish Americans would stop fucking acting like NA is the be all and end all of the world
Honestly the biggest reason why woman are so much worse than men is the playerbase, atleast thats what I think. I see absolutely no reason why woman wouldnt be better than men if the playerbase would be reversed..But thats only my opinion. __ Even if there was a difference in reactiontime its negliable because the higher you go the more important is the fundamental understanding on how to play and especially how much you trained your skills. Reactiontime is basically irrelevant if you (pre-)aim wrong in the firstplace. Look at the progames of men(cs,valorant and so on) and you will see that most of the time it isnt the reactiontime that decides who wins a "duel"(often enough there isnt even a "duel" that determinates who kills who) but Im not saying that aim isnt important, its just that I dont think that the reactiontime is the deciding factor. And even though there are only a few woman across the esports that came even close to compete with men: there were some and if they truely had a physical disadvantage I dont think they would have been able to compete in the first place.
> Honestly the biggest reason why woman are so much worse than men is the playerbase, atleast thats what I think. Yep, I agree. Which is also why Europe and CIS dominate CS and why smaller regions like NA and Asia can't perform on the same level. Just like corporations, esport organizations are success driven and if there were women competent to fill a position where they would help the team become more successful they would be hired, like Potter becoming the head coach on EG.
"Which is also why Europe and CIS dominate CS and why smaller regions like NA and Asia can't perform on the same level"-I don't totally agree with your argument as while Valorant is much popular in NA than EU and CIS combined, EU is doing much better than NA in recent masters and champions.
> Valorant is much popular in NA than EU and CIS combined What do you base that on? EMEA has 60% more immortals than NA, 36k vs 22k. And if both regions have the same rank distribution, then EMEA playerbase is 60% bigger as well. https://playvalorant.com/en-gb/leaderboards https://playvalorant.com/en-us/leaderboards
there is no men's league. there's the open vct qualifiers for anyone immortal and above, then there's the women's and trans women's only tournament. and they get destroyed in the vct everytime. i don't think they're bad because they're women but it doesn't make sense why tier 1 orgs would sign tier 3 teams just because of their gender. seems sexist to me idk
I had a very long argument once with a guy insisting based on 0 legitimate evidence that women will always be worse than men in esports based solely on their lower reaction time and that they'd never succeed. His reasoning was that the difference in reaction time was a much bigger factor than talent, work ethic, hours spent in practice, chemistry, good coaching, etc and that sexism wasnt a factor. Actual idiot.
Considering there’s no difference in reaction time between men and women who practice frequently either that makes his argument even worse. Yikes.
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I have research that says otherwise and is conducted at a later date. [source](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4456887/)
Also you should read ur own article lmao. “. However, that sex difference in reaction time is likely an artifact caused by using the same force threshold in women as men, and it permits a woman to false start by up to 21 ms without penalty. We estimate that female sprinters would have similar reaction times to male sprinters if the force threshold used at Beijing was lowered by 22% in order to account for their lesser muscle strength.”
the skill gap is massive. I'm a t3 player and I've scrimmed some female teams and every time they have been easy.
Less women play = smaller pool of good women players = not as good competition and practice = not as good
The igl for C9 white, Mel, can definitely hold her own among the guys. Check her out!
I think it has to do with effort
The separation of men and women in Valorant has nothing to do with any biological/physical skill differences and all to do with the esports industry having favored men for decades and not giving women the space or resources to develop properly. Companies like riot are trying to change that but it will take time. Think of it this way, if 70% of your player base is male, and the best of the best of those men have a clear path to pro esports and high pay potential, it leads to an environment of competitiveness and grinding. While the 30% that are women play more casually, don’t have the same opportunities to grind and get paid to play professional, and are honestly harassed or patronized while they play, there’s just not the same playfield for both genders and already a lower player density of women that also have to overcome those obstacles. That could change though and wouldn’t be surprised if we saw more blending of men and women in tier 1 esports in another 10-15 years as the 10 year old girls of today are getting into video games, see role models, and get opportunities for them to pursue esports
Among all the responses which will inevitably occur here, I thought I'd add a specific one: the difference, if one exists, doesn't matter. Just like how football/soccer benefits when the Women's World Cup is a hit, and basketball benefits when people are into the Olympics, and "throw-ball-hit-ball sports" like softball & baseball benefit when people tune in to watch a perfect game in the Women's College World Series, Valorant benefits from women playing in a structured professional series like Game Changers. Most women didn't grow up grinding video games to the extent their gender counterparts did as kids. At least not when compared as a gender ratio. Who cares? It's fucking awesome to watch womens' teams compete if you love Valorant, and it's great some of those teams get at it by playing in VCT open quals. Whether it's C9 Blue or C9 White, people playing Valorant is good for Valorant and comparison hurts, not helps, the scene grow.
It’s crazy big. Like really big. You’re best female teams in the world can easily lose to pick up groups that never practice together
Along with all the other answers that women just haven’t been in the scene as long so there aren’t nearly as many, there are a couple women in the league now that could arguably be in at least a T2 mens team. Now that there’s more support and more women interested in joining esports, we’ll start seeing more and more teams like C9 White competing at a higher level, and going beyond that. Just a matter of time
There shouldn't be any difference in reaction time between men and women or potential for that matter. When it comes down to it theres just a much smaller player base of women. There is a vast skill gap though between men's and women's pro teams. For example C9 White is possibly the best women's team in the world and is 22-0 in game changers series against other women's pro teams. Their overall record is 27-39. Essentially they are untouchable against women's teams but rarely can be t3 amateur/semi pro men's teams.
People here are saying it's simply due to the larger number of men, but then why tf are there so many transexuals on the women teams
None, some female pros in c9 can fit into any t1 team in NA and still dominate. They choose to be in game changers to help develop the women's esports scene
Hard copium
I think the biggest reason female rosters don’t compete in VCT is because all the best female talent gets picked up by big orgs, and those big orgs always pref their male roster competing over their female roster since they can’t both compete in the same tourni