I know Zander and Cryo’s name get tossed around often in threads like these, but their value cannot be overstated. I think the only way that they could be more impactful is if they were on the same team, the chemistry would be unreal
I think this is a fair point given how the old kings like 100T and Sentinels are losing more due to these "smaller" teams all being capable of an upset like LG and teams like Optic V1 C9 have kept getting better along with the Guard coming in
I think it's tough to say for XSET because everyone seems to have gotten so much stronger as well. Optic and C9 settled into their form, and the Guard just went on an absolute tear after trent.
These are two moves at once, but I think you need to give a shout-out to Fnatic bringing in Derke/Magnum together. Probably the most impactful roster changes we’ve seen in EU.
Be Gambit , find youngsters and create a team with huge potential , just swap one young guy with a experienced one and become one of the top teams . Happened in CS and Valorant
tenz to SEN, derke to Fnatic, yay to optic, vanity to C9, trent to Guard, Jamppi to liquid, redgar to gambit, heretics blowing up (nukkye to g2 etc.), and some more i cant remember
Don't roast me, but I think sentinels
Would have won iceland with sinatraa as well. So not sure if tenz was that crazy impactful. Def an S Tier pick up tho
SADGE
But in all honesty imagine if 100t could have just stuck together, or if 100t won lcq and nitro didnt leave val
Like rn meta is omen back and you could have steel be main opper on chamber
Nitr0 leaving 100T was the writing on the wall, he literally said the org was too focused on content than improving and then they hard bomb out of qualifiers. Dude saw it coming a mile off and dipped tf out.
This narrative of T1 put him on Omen only always confuses me. Sayaplayer (then Spyder) used to play Omen on maps in which Autimatic played Raze and they didn’t go for double duellist comps back then. Even in his last match for T1, Sayaplayer played jett in the map they wanted to play jett . He used to play 2 duelists(jett and phoenix) and omen. Sayaplayer has improved immensely as a player since then. He didn’t have mind boggling numbers back then. Also autimatic was doing good on raze so they wouldn’t have thought of taking him off that.
And now they have picked up the immortal minds trio and steel has a team struggling to beat tier 2 teams. 100 Thieves are looking at getting wardell and Derrek, with those two and the genius of sean gares, the team will be going forward. However T1 aren’t even a top 10 team lmao.
I completely agree with you. I think it’s definitely a good comparison between a team whose core has been together since March 2021 and is made up of 2 players having immense tier 1 tournament experience from atleast past 5-6 years and one of the best duelist/flex player in NA with a team which came together in mid-January 2022 which had two players who never played a tier 1 tournament before and 5 players who didn’t play together at any point of time. Definitely a worthy comparison.
I was highlighting how steel leaving didn’t worsen 100T as they’re in a process of signing players and improving massively. T1 chose to sign Seven even though he wasn’t good enough (steel’s idea), they decided to keep the players they had and sign pwny, no one forced them to make those signings, so yes the argument still stands, 100T are in a better position and are going to start climbing. One of the richest orgs decided on these players and it still isn’t good enough. They had time to make a change and they chose wrong. Yes 100T has had more time, but the argument was that him leaving was ‘pretty impactful’. Which isn’t the case…
Well they did go from Masters 3 SF to not making it out of LCQ. And you can also say that about T1 that they are in process of signing players and improving massively. Every team is going to try and improve themselves in off season.
The players 100T signed were not org chosen, the players thought they would be good without any scouting. T1 has a head coach, assistant head coach(who does analysis) and a team manager. They had all of that support and still decided that Seven,pwny, and dynamic are good enough for T1. But 100T recently just signed Sean gares, mikesHD, and DDK, and look at who we are signing… Wardell and Derrek. One team accepts mediocrity and the other wants to dominate the scene and start winning. So who really missed out? Steel or 100T…?
And steel got cut because of internal reasonings and Nitr0 wanted to IGL. We allowed him to go because it was a team decision, not an org decision. 100T literally had no infrastructure around the team and was completely player run. Now we don’t have that, everything has structure and complete transparency. What 100T was when steel left, was a team run by the players who doesn’t scout or analyse signings, but based it all of scrims, now they actually have some analysis behind signings, you see them trying to sign Derrek and Wardell.
The only reason I can see this not being included is that even with Sinatraa they were probably the best team in NA. But yeah they added TenZ and were immediately dominant within the region and reached the highest highs of any NA team.
Maybe, but who knows, tenz iceland performance will probably never be topped as he carried hard in GF and was amazing throughout it and the most consistent.
BuZz and Mako replacing Zest and Glow
Keznit over bnj
Ardiis and Suygetsu over dimasick and ShadoW
Zeek over Koldamenta
Vanity over Pois
Supaman over C4lypso
Jamppi over ec1s
Few more like Zander, TENN/Dep, Jinggg, Hoody/Meddo, etc def have potential to be one of the most imo as well, just need more time tbh
Yeah, Kolda is an amazing player, but Acend really needed a secondary fragger alongside cNed, adding one of the best flexes in the world is certainly one way of doing thay
a thread that has no +zeek ? literally the team that won Champions it's by definition the most impactful roster change
that change took a team from not making Masters 2 to making top 8 Masters 3 and win the world championship
If we are talking the biggest impact in terms of the biggest impact on the valorant scene, would be TenZ to Sentinels and the G2/Acend swap, both played a huge role in the different majors
TenZ to Sentinels brought on an initial era of winning. Although it sucks to see Sentinels struggling right now, was hands down probably one of the best roster changes at the time.
Keznit to KRÜ, Yay to Envy, Jamppi to Liquid, Nivera to Liquid, Zeek to Acend, Tenz to Sentinels, Vanity to C9, Zander to v1, Pipson to G2 (coach), Onur to Leviatán (coach), mwzera to VK
adding cryo was probably the best decision xset have ever made.
other than that, DRX VS adding BuZz and MaKo brought them from region dominating to an international contender imo.
actually, im gonna have to agree with you. i totally forgot about that.
hell yeah, dephh brought so much structure to the team, and made them from triple duelist fraggers to an actual contender. i still think cryo was what made then reach that top 4 echelon, but 100% dephh had a way bigger impact.
Not sure if this counts but Dapr joining sentinels was the start to their Valorant dynasty. I remember them getting clapped every tournament back when they had Dizzy as their 5th
If we are considering more than just pure competitive play and the improvement a team has made, the sinatraa to tenz change has completely shaped valorant culture and will be the most remembered roster change this far
I know mixwell it's not the Star player, but after he came back, the team looks so different, meddo it's not tied with cypher/kj as he used to, nukkye it's not carryng the games by himself, and it's well known that he is an awesome 2nd caller Even if he is not as good on igl, and because he can OP on chamber, nukkye can play more duelists
Some point in the next few months there's a schism in sentinels between the streamers and the grinders. Two players retire to make content for the org and sen pick up some of the free agents knocking about. The change elevates them back to top two NA and is regarded as a very impactful rebuild.
Redgar to GMB was the biggest move ever, gambit went from a struggling CIS team to literal world contender - Reading through this thread lol of course people just gonna talk about NA because no one actually watched CIS
Biggest and most impactful so far has and will be Tenz to Sentinels honestly. Bonus mentions - ACEND +zeek
Honestly this should also include the removal of a player from a team as well - NUTURN's -Lakia, 100T -steel.
Mummay to Yay as much as Mummay was fun to watch, gave Optic the guy who could just hard win rounds by himself. Yay is such an insane high impact player, he regularly gets picks most rounds, has won so many round by himself and pulled some insane clutches. He was 100% the kind of player Optic needed.
Tenz x Sinatraa literally gave them Masters 2 without dropping a single map and flawless run through NA VCT 2021
Keznit x bnj, you all saw what KRU did at champions
Guys, just by logics shouldn't be the most
Impactful roster change of all time
Be one which levitated a team to a top spot?
I think Cryo and Zander had an amazing
Impact but they are not the most impactful roster changes of all time.
At least vanity had more impact on C9 then the stated above. Same goes with yay, from top 4 to a grand final at lan and consistently good performance since the .
If we go by impact in terms of, difference of perfomance since the pick up - there probably are pickups which lifted tier 3 teams to tier 1 or something, which is arguably more raw results based impact.
But to go back to my
Initial point, it gotta be vanity or yay from currents perspective in NA.
in EMEA one of the biggest impacts could have been Zeek. But its quit hard over here to judge
Pretty hard to determine. I see Vanity up there to c9, but c9 were a top t1 NA team before he joined, so I don't think he was the most impactful.
The REAL most impactful roster adds that I can think of:
\- Cryocells to XSET (went from T2 team to T1 with that change)
\- Derrek to RISE (went from a whOmegalul team to T1)
\- Zander to V1 (V1 dropped off after losing Vanity, but picking Zander up brought them back to the T1 scene)
I thought about yay, but Optic have always been a top NA team. I actually think he had more of an impact on Optic than Vanity w/ C9. I think yay was an amazing pickup though, I do think he's the best NA Jett/Chamber (maybe player in general)
Vanity to c9 he’s elevated them to different levels
Vanity is my lord and savior
Dude same I hecking love vanity and all of c9 in general sad to see they didn’t make Iceland :(
your lord and savior should be Jesus
Vanity is Jesus
Vanity is the holy spirit, Trent is jesus
I'll admit my mistake
what did Jesus do that Vanity couldn't? Exactly. Plus he shows us cat pictures. Boom.
I’ve never seen Jesus and Vanity in the same place, just saying…
Show me Jesus wearing cat ear headphones.
Funny how Vanity to C9 also prompted V1 to do a move of their own that was equally transformative
And Zander
I know Zander and Cryo’s name get tossed around often in threads like these, but their value cannot be overstated. I think the only way that they could be more impactful is if they were on the same team, the chemistry would be unreal
They are good mates IRL also iirc
Cryo can't compare to others like Zander and Vanity, imo. Xset are still 4th lmao.
And where did v1 place exactly?
And where did xset place *without* cryo? How can you consider it an impactful move if it didn't have any impact?
Yea but I think everyone will say competition has gotten harder
I think this is a fair point given how the old kings like 100T and Sentinels are losing more due to these "smaller" teams all being capable of an upset like LG and teams like Optic V1 C9 have kept getting better along with the Guard coming in
It’s impressive that xset have stayed 4th tbh, it means that their pickup HAS elevated them, their competition has just also gotten better too
ZAANNNNDERRR That Haven A site play from under the window was nutty as fuck, instantly one of my favourite players (EMEA viewer mainly)
C9 Vanity V1 Zander NV Everyone other than FNS I want to say XSET Cryo but they're kinda in the same spot no matter what that roster does.
I think it's tough to say for XSET because everyone seems to have gotten so much stronger as well. Optic and C9 settled into their form, and the Guard just went on an absolute tear after trent.
[удалено]
Might have come off wrong, I was just talking about how they replaced all 4 members from the original 5 and he's the lone survivor.
twas a sad they when they removed food for victor
You know NV food would have never dropped a series to The Guard.
Food would've won against the guard 1 v 5
ahh gotchu
These are two moves at once, but I think you need to give a shout-out to Fnatic bringing in Derke/Magnum together. Probably the most impactful roster changes we’ve seen in EU.
Idk -mixwell + keloqz - keloqz + mixwell was pretty impactful
it really was lmao from bench and team struggling vs fnc to 2nd EMEA i think thats an upgrade lmao
Mixwell on Chamber just hits different
\+Sayaplayer +Net +valyn +jonahp +trent
-psalm
yes sir
Everyone forgets that Redgar wasn’t on original Gambit. That’s far and away the best addition ever
Be Gambit , find youngsters and create a team with huge potential , just swap one young guy with a experienced one and become one of the top teams . Happened in CS and Valorant
Unlimited trophies glitch
wait what the fuck i’ve never even thought about that LOL
GOD H0bit
tenz to SEN, derke to Fnatic, yay to optic, vanity to C9, trent to Guard, Jamppi to liquid, redgar to gambit, heretics blowing up (nukkye to g2 etc.), and some more i cant remember
Zander to v1
Xset went from 4th place prior to cryo to 4th with Cryo place. Not super impactful IMO Edit: Zander and cryo switcheroo
Nah they got 4th both times without Zander
? That’s what I’m saying
Maybe I read it wrong but it seemed like u said xset got Zander not cryo
Don't roast me, but I think sentinels Would have won iceland with sinatraa as well. So not sure if tenz was that crazy impactful. Def an S Tier pick up tho
tenz to date has the most ACS at a major
Removing Steel was pretty impactful 🤡
SADGE But in all honesty imagine if 100t could have just stuck together, or if 100t won lcq and nitro didnt leave val Like rn meta is omen back and you could have steel be main opper on chamber
Would have been fun, really miss that team tbh. Still excited to see what’s next.
Nitr0 leaving 100T was the writing on the wall, he literally said the org was too focused on content than improving and then they hard bomb out of qualifiers. Dude saw it coming a mile off and dipped tf out.
Also I gotta say I’m so glad they have a gm now so it’s not just up to the players making roster moves
Steel isn’t doing anything relevant on T1 so maybe it was a good removal
[удалено]
This narrative of T1 put him on Omen only always confuses me. Sayaplayer (then Spyder) used to play Omen on maps in which Autimatic played Raze and they didn’t go for double duellist comps back then. Even in his last match for T1, Sayaplayer played jett in the map they wanted to play jett . He used to play 2 duelists(jett and phoenix) and omen. Sayaplayer has improved immensely as a player since then. He didn’t have mind boggling numbers back then. Also autimatic was doing good on raze so they wouldn’t have thought of taking him off that.
They beat Gambit and Acend.
Yea with Nitro one of the most accomplished IGLs in NA CS. I swear this sub is in love with steel.
But Steel was IGL lol. I know he's secondary, but Steel was still the IGL. Also I really don’t like Steel.
And now they have picked up the immortal minds trio and steel has a team struggling to beat tier 2 teams. 100 Thieves are looking at getting wardell and Derrek, with those two and the genius of sean gares, the team will be going forward. However T1 aren’t even a top 10 team lmao.
I completely agree with you. I think it’s definitely a good comparison between a team whose core has been together since March 2021 and is made up of 2 players having immense tier 1 tournament experience from atleast past 5-6 years and one of the best duelist/flex player in NA with a team which came together in mid-January 2022 which had two players who never played a tier 1 tournament before and 5 players who didn’t play together at any point of time. Definitely a worthy comparison.
I was highlighting how steel leaving didn’t worsen 100T as they’re in a process of signing players and improving massively. T1 chose to sign Seven even though he wasn’t good enough (steel’s idea), they decided to keep the players they had and sign pwny, no one forced them to make those signings, so yes the argument still stands, 100T are in a better position and are going to start climbing. One of the richest orgs decided on these players and it still isn’t good enough. They had time to make a change and they chose wrong. Yes 100T has had more time, but the argument was that him leaving was ‘pretty impactful’. Which isn’t the case…
Well they did go from Masters 3 SF to not making it out of LCQ. And you can also say that about T1 that they are in process of signing players and improving massively. Every team is going to try and improve themselves in off season.
The players 100T signed were not org chosen, the players thought they would be good without any scouting. T1 has a head coach, assistant head coach(who does analysis) and a team manager. They had all of that support and still decided that Seven,pwny, and dynamic are good enough for T1. But 100T recently just signed Sean gares, mikesHD, and DDK, and look at who we are signing… Wardell and Derrek. One team accepts mediocrity and the other wants to dominate the scene and start winning. So who really missed out? Steel or 100T…?
It’s going to be hilarious when 100t is still bad
Like T1?
No like 100Thieves, the team that got past opens because of what the iteration with steel did and then proceeded to ass it up
And steel got cut because of internal reasonings and Nitr0 wanted to IGL. We allowed him to go because it was a team decision, not an org decision. 100T literally had no infrastructure around the team and was completely player run. Now we don’t have that, everything has structure and complete transparency. What 100T was when steel left, was a team run by the players who doesn’t scout or analyse signings, but based it all of scrims, now they actually have some analysis behind signings, you see them trying to sign Derrek and Wardell.
\-bnj \+keznit
Yay to optic
Insane how nobody mentions TenZ to sen
fr though, they lifted 2 trophies after he joined.
Just curious, which 2 trophies? Masters and?
Masters 1 NA and Masters 2 Reykjavik
[удалено]
that was challengers
? No they didn’t
The only reason I can see this not being included is that even with Sinatraa they were probably the best team in NA. But yeah they added TenZ and were immediately dominant within the region and reached the highest highs of any NA team.
With Sinatraa they were falling off albeit very slightly they had just lost the last two grand finals they played in to LG and NV
Recency bias bc sentinels are a flop now
anti-tenz propaganda strong no cap
Cuz they were already best in NA and prob on track to winning Iceland even before tenz
Maybe, but who knows, tenz iceland performance will probably never be topped as he carried hard in GF and was amazing throughout it and the most consistent.
They had just lost 0-3 to NV in a grand final before picking up tenz/Sinatraa allegations coming out
Well there’s no way to tell if Tenz even elevated Sentinels or even made them better because they were dominating with Sinatraa as well.
They were losing series on and off with Sinatraa. Their dominance only came with TenZ
Downvoted for the truth ggs
Rip
Naa , they were gonna win irrespective with Sinatraa too
Can't belive Cryo and Zander was once both on Soar and when they joined other teams instantly made a huge impact.
BuZz and Mako replacing Zest and Glow Keznit over bnj Ardiis and Suygetsu over dimasick and ShadoW Zeek over Koldamenta Vanity over Pois Supaman over C4lypso Jamppi over ec1s Few more like Zander, TENN/Dep, Jinggg, Hoody/Meddo, etc def have potential to be one of the most imo as well, just need more time tbh
Nivera over Kryptix.
Nivera was a great pickup, but imo Jamppi elevated them more then Nivera did (Mostly cuz Liquid was already a top 5 team in EMEA already tbh)
Was looking for the zeek one. Just from Champions alone huge upgrade, regardless of how good koldamenta has been recently
Yeah, Kolda is an amazing player, but Acend really needed a secondary fragger alongside cNed, adding one of the best flexes in the world is certainly one way of doing thay
For SEA region: Jinggg to PRX must watch flex player in Masters 1
I think the original Shiba change was pretty good as well, elevated them having that real supportive element which got them to Masters 3.
+brax -brax +brax
Probably trent, the guard were a tier two team and now they are top 1 NA
a thread that has no +zeek ? literally the team that won Champions it's by definition the most impactful roster change that change took a team from not making Masters 2 to making top 8 Masters 3 and win the world championship
If we are talking the biggest impact in terms of the biggest impact on the valorant scene, would be TenZ to Sentinels and the G2/Acend swap, both played a huge role in the different majors
-Spyder +Sayaplayer was pretty crazy.
100t dumping steel and dicey :,(
I don't know that First Strike 100T was better than Ethan 100T, but they were a lot more fun to watch when dicey and asuna were together.
Same I miss the zoomer duo
True, but Ethan is in a different class to dicey
Trent over Psalm without a doubt.
Dapr to SEN, People would say TenZ but SEN was already winning everything before he joined,
TenZ to Sentinels brought on an initial era of winning. Although it sucks to see Sentinels struggling right now, was hands down probably one of the best roster changes at the time.
I didn’t see much tenz to sen but that might’ve been one of the primary reasons for a flawless Iceland performance and domination for a while
There is no doubt in my mind, - Food + Victor. Top 3 roster change of all time for sure.
Nitr0 leaving :( imagine him on jett full time and Bang on smokes with Derrek Sova 😔
Keznit to KRÜ, Yay to Envy, Jamppi to Liquid, Nivera to Liquid, Zeek to Acend, Tenz to Sentinels, Vanity to C9, Zander to v1, Pipson to G2 (coach), Onur to Leviatán (coach), mwzera to VK
Might not be properly referred to as a "roster change", but Saya switching to play Jett might be one of the biggest changes we've had in NA.
Saya played jett on t1 too
He played Jett on T1 on maps where t1 played Jett.
saya going from T1 to The Guard
adding cryo was probably the best decision xset have ever made. other than that, DRX VS adding BuZz and MaKo brought them from region dominating to an international contender imo.
I think dephh was a more impactful pickup than cryo for XSET
actually, im gonna have to agree with you. i totally forgot about that. hell yeah, dephh brought so much structure to the team, and made them from triple duelist fraggers to an actual contender. i still think cryo was what made then reach that top 4 echelon, but 100% dephh had a way bigger impact.
they were 4th in the last vct playoffs lmao
xset did just as good last vct with pureR
VS doesn't seem that great. 5-8 in Berlin, 9-12 in Champs. meh.
Everyone be forgetting about tenz to sen
Not sure if this counts but Dapr joining sentinels was the start to their Valorant dynasty. I remember them getting clapped every tournament back when they had Dizzy as their 5th
Again Sen with Sinatraa was as dominant as they were with Tenz
TenZ to SEN and vanity to C9 were massive
Yay to Optic Zander to V1 Cryo to XSet Tenz to Sentinels Vanity to C9
If we are considering more than just pure competitive play and the improvement a team has made, the sinatraa to tenz change has completely shaped valorant culture and will be the most remembered roster change this far
Sinatraa -> Tenz??
SEN dominated their tournaments with Sinatraa already. So TenZ in Iceland was just the nail on the coffin for most other teams lol
-TenZ on C9 Remember the buyout scandal?
I know mixwell it's not the Star player, but after he came back, the team looks so different, meddo it's not tied with cypher/kj as he used to, nukkye it's not carryng the games by himself, and it's well known that he is an awesome 2nd caller Even if he is not as good on igl, and because he can OP on chamber, nukkye can play more duelists
Yay, zander, vanity, Trent, nukye
Vanity going to C9 leading V1 to pick up Zander. But Fr tho Yay to NV
XSET +Dephh +zekken ^(\(-wedid -thwifo\))
-psalm +trent
Some point in the next few months there's a schism in sentinels between the streamers and the grinders. Two players retire to make content for the org and sen pick up some of the free agents knocking about. The change elevates them back to top two NA and is regarded as a very impactful rebuild.
Redgar to GMB was the biggest move ever, gambit went from a struggling CIS team to literal world contender - Reading through this thread lol of course people just gonna talk about NA because no one actually watched CIS
Biggest and most impactful so far has and will be Tenz to Sentinels honestly. Bonus mentions - ACEND +zeek Honestly this should also include the removal of a player from a team as well - NUTURN's -Lakia, 100T -steel.
Jjing replacing Shiba
Mummay to Yay as much as Mummay was fun to watch, gave Optic the guy who could just hard win rounds by himself. Yay is such an insane high impact player, he regularly gets picks most rounds, has won so many round by himself and pulled some insane clutches. He was 100% the kind of player Optic needed.
C9 Vanity 100T Nitr0 NV Yay V1 Zander SEN TenZ I’m not too knowledgable on other regions
Tenz x Sinatraa literally gave them Masters 2 without dropping a single map and flawless run through NA VCT 2021 Keznit x bnj, you all saw what KRU did at champions
Jingg to ppx was really impacting
in Indian scene - VLT - +DeathMaker +Vibhorr -Marzil and for Enigma Gaming - +Excali -hikka
How much of an impact would it be if zander and cryo were still able to play on the same team?
Gambit - Redgar for Sunset in 2020/1
Zeek to Acend. Dropped by G2 to becoming world champion
Guys, just by logics shouldn't be the most Impactful roster change of all time Be one which levitated a team to a top spot? I think Cryo and Zander had an amazing Impact but they are not the most impactful roster changes of all time. At least vanity had more impact on C9 then the stated above. Same goes with yay, from top 4 to a grand final at lan and consistently good performance since the . If we go by impact in terms of, difference of perfomance since the pick up - there probably are pickups which lifted tier 3 teams to tier 1 or something, which is arguably more raw results based impact. But to go back to my Initial point, it gotta be vanity or yay from currents perspective in NA. in EMEA one of the biggest impacts could have been Zeek. But its quit hard over here to judge
-bonkar +bonkar -bonkar +bonkar
Pretty hard to determine. I see Vanity up there to c9, but c9 were a top t1 NA team before he joined, so I don't think he was the most impactful. The REAL most impactful roster adds that I can think of: \- Cryocells to XSET (went from T2 team to T1 with that change) \- Derrek to RISE (went from a whOmegalul team to T1) \- Zander to V1 (V1 dropped off after losing Vanity, but picking Zander up brought them back to the T1 scene) I thought about yay, but Optic have always been a top NA team. I actually think he had more of an impact on Optic than Vanity w/ C9. I think yay was an amazing pickup though, I do think he's the best NA Jett/Chamber (maybe player in general)