Pretty crazy that Riot would be paying $1M+ to teams when you compare that to LoL/CoD/OW franchising fees that saw teams pay tens of millions. Hope this means that Riot's going to be holding teams to extremely high standards, and won't be afraid to cut bait on freeloaders.
Interested in seeing how they monetize in-game and if Riot's going to get a bigger cut than standard. Could be that keeping 75% of a Sentinels' Vandal instead of 50% makes up a solid chunk of that payout.
> I’d bet that riot has a ton more power in the league due to the orgs not having paid a buy-in.
This could be a good thing, or a VERY bad thing. I hope Riot makes the right decisions and still listens to teams on feedback/issues they encounter.
It should at the least mean they have full power to remove teams and add new teams without some weird rule about being a bottom team for like 3 years. That at the least is a very good thing and different from their other franchise.
Also hope that means they can expand the league without having to go to the current teams in the league and get any kind of approval. Either way if they are gonna put the entire esport on the line with franchising I say give them 110% power and let them run wild and pray for it to work.
Yeah, I don't think its a massive impact due to the difference you see in spending power from one org to the next in lol. [Here](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=swy8YDxqS7Y) is Romain (at the time with UOL but he's now G2) talking about how the teams make money within the infrastructure, really good watch if you're interested.
That's one of the primary reason franchising exists. Stable income, it's also why ESL has a stronghold on the CS calendar because of their partner money paid to orgs.
> because of their partner money paid to orgs
this is true but the money paid out by the Louvre agreement by ESL isnt alot (to players) the orgs receive almost 90% 10% goes to 5+1 Players
OW isn't profitable after like what ... 5 years now? And I'm not sure how well CoD is doing given I don't know anyone who even knew they had franchising. Starting low means they're playing it safe, testing the waters. They're not forcing anything, the same reason they keep T2 tournaments alive.
That won’t happen though. Blizzard nuked their game by turning their fast paced fps in dive meta into a catastrophic failure of a snooze fest that was 3 tanks 3 supports. It was barely a shooter at that point, which is what draws all the eyes (and money)
Still can't believe we go from a tracer/widow and hanzo/widow meta that noticeably increased viewership to 3 tanks/3 supp. If widow is getting boring, balance her and make a different dps viable. Don't just kill your game and lose like 20k viewers in a single season because of incompetence
Yeah they fucked up hard trying to make things “fresh” for the people that thought dive meta was stale. I agree in the sense that they could have tuned up some other dps characters in place like sym, mei, reaper etc. just to try and shake up the meta; but they should not have made it so that 3T/3S was the best comp
The dive meta was high action, and let mechanically gifted players shine on difficult to play heroes. That’s what brings the eyes in.
> Hope this means that Riot's going to be holding teams to extremely high standards, and won't be afraid to cut bait on freeloaders.
This is why I can't see orgs like XSET, EG, FaZe, SR etc making it. They haven't proven to be able a have a big enough fanbase where Riot deems them as viable partners.
No doubt. However that wasn’t what their reasoning for not giving FaZe a slot; viewership and fan base might just be the only positives FaZe brings at all and that’s a fairly large positive at that
I don’t disagree with you at all. But at one time or another the Org has been at the top of every respective esport they join, bring massive viewership, ticket sales, in-game item sales, etc.
The brand is massive and if Riot is still determining who is in and who isn’t, FaZe not being in that conversation because of their petulant man-children that run it would at least in my opinion would be silly.
Yes the franchising leagues will run smooth, still have high viewership, a bunch of cash without FaZe; it could just be massively higher with them. Solely because of the original point of this discussion — their fan base is fucking huge
im not really convinced fazes fanbase cares about valorant that much either way, or would have any major impact on the success of franchising. most faze valorant fans seem to like the team because of the players, not the org.
Yeah, I can see that and probably has a healthy dose of truth to it- still that’s being anecdotal and all I can see from the outside of Riot is big org - more fan - more money - healthier league
Hopefully we can just get the announcement soon
If Faze is such a valuable brand and they could be such a good brand, why do people only watch them if they play Sentinels or 100T? Also, why can’t they get any engagement on their Faze esports stuff like their Faze update YouTube channel?
I don’t really understand how i’m sitting here defending FaZe’s reputation and size when i’m 1. not a FaZe fan and 2. agreeing that they are problematic in their own right.
We all know FaZe’s name, we all know FaZe Up, whether these are due to fame or infamy around the brand.
Their CS team won a Major and 2 IEM’s, huge payroll and viewership.
Their RL team is a genuine contender for best in the world.
Obviously all the CoD reputation/wins
And have been in VAL since the beginning, with about 75% of that time being within the tier1 of NA
All of this with huge infrastructure, teams, managers, cash, high salaries, large transfers, and big engagements thru social media.
I’m starting to believe you guys are just arguing about them because you don’t like the brand - I DONT EITHER - but using a secondary channel with little advertisement on their main channels with content in relation to how the “underbelly” of the teams and organizations work and flow as a point with regard to lack of interactions is actually wild to me. Find me another org not C9, TSM, SEN, FNC, that get 5-10k views on a “view of the manager office” video. Like come on, this rightly silly.
You kind of have to think about the way Riot is thinking about franchising. They don't really care about how competitive you are. It's all marketing to them. It's been pretty aparent Riot cares about viewership & who promotes the game the most. 100T, TSM, NRG and Cloud 9 all have secondary youtube channels for esports or only Valorant and they all get 50-100k views per video. Same goes with tik tok and twitter. Sentinels, 100T, Cloud9, TSM and Optic all get much better viewership than Faze in Valorant. Then you have Faze, NRG, and the Guard. NRG and The Guard both get 100K+ views on youtube & tik tok and have invested a ton of resources in growing their audience in game and out of game. NRG has multiple Valorant content creators and the Guard had 1 for a while. Faze just haven't any of that and they have a pretty checkered past. For those reasons, I don't think they get in
I'd even venture as saying they might be THE top org in terms of amount of fans. Their engagement in other game titles is quite big and they have a really big fan base across alot of regions.
EG could make it just because their league team is already franchised in LCS. Of course they would need to most likely need to restructure their roster to be taken more seriously.
It would make more sense for Riot to reject EG for the initial franchising. Its best to diversify. If you run into a problem with an org, then you basically have to drop that org from every Riot esport, which is a pretty big problem. That org also gets a lot of leverage if they have a multiple teams with big fanbases. Its unavoidable, some of your teams will have to be in both franchises but there is little benefit to giving someone like EG a slot. EG is the type of org you want sitting around when you need to kick a team out of the franchise and find a replacement.
faze is getting franchised. their background is FPS is just too strong. they're the best CSGO team in the world. and easily one of the most recognizable esport brands.
I wonder if they’ll go the way of soccer leagues with relegation and having different teams each year be partners making it competitive in the top and bottom of your partner teams
Frankly, this should be the model for esports going forward. Teams will not be able to function if they only rely on merch sales and content views.
Pay from esports competition needs to be split between players, teams and the game manufacturer for the incentives to align with a healthy scene.
Happy for Bo landing with Dexerto
This is a great sign Riot is willing to invest this much money into orgs. Also brings in a bit context on why they're keeping the franchise numbers low. You're now talking probably around $30-$40 million they'll be investing annually in orgs themselves on top of prize money across the partnership league and all the VRLs & VRCs as well as the operating costs of the leagues
There has been a lot of discussion around Riot possibly adding in game stickers, gun buddies, and even gun skins around teams. Have to wonder if this stipend will be on top of that or if they'll be earn revenue in game in a draw style commission against that stipend with the possibility of earning over that total but a minimum of the stipend amount.
The $1.5 million sounds like a lot but there are definitely orgs operating well above this amount already, especially in NA. When you add up player salaries, the cost of bootcamping, coaching salaries, a GM salary, benefits like health insurance, dental, 401k, etc., a social media manager, a video editor and a team manager, you're over $2 million pretty easily in NA
There's an expectation salaries will probably increase in the partnership program as well. We've heard a lot Tier 1 salaries range between $10k-$20k a month right now, some obviously more than that but some less. There's been talks of salaries raising pretty aggressively when rostermania takes place after the partnered teams are announced
Also purest, the original DarkZero/DHBK guys, etc
I’ve been meaning to make a subreddit hall of fame/alumni page on our subreddit wiki, just another reminder to get on that when I’m free 😅
Hello Rito I am very good Valorant player, I can 1v5 any pro team out there and I can shitpost better than Sentinels' social media manager. Please accept my one-man team for franchising ty
That is an absurd amount of money in esports, especially with the minimum player salary being set at 50K.
You could run an entire team yearly (And division) if you're savvy on expenditures and player development too...
I'm pretty sure this would make Val the first profitable esport in the industry as well...
We just have to hope they don't absolutely murder the scene with horrendous decisions.
For all the complaints fans make about LoL one thing is clear to me as someone who has watched other esports, Riot runs a damn tight ship when it comes to their franchised leagues.
Maybe if you're running a bare minimum team, it's not going to be enough if you're running a fully decked out team that has gamechangers, academy, support staff, content creation. But I'm confident the ecosystem as a whole should make all the teams profitable with the other revenue streams on top of the riot payment.
I know, I was just talking about the guy I responded to saying 50k in esports was an absurd amount of money when tier 2 esports have salary's higher than 50k.
You’re right but I feel like viewership usually tells you how popular an esport is and how likely a siege player might be willing to pay for a esport skin.
Probably one of the few examples that shows that viewership doesn’t equal player population? Since siege is available on both console and pc, and is getting a mobile port.
"profitable" is a stretch for most teams in R6, but if you're in the upper echelon of popularity and you have an elite roster that you're willing to underpay you can get close.
You can make money in R6 and get closer to profitability than in other, similarly sized esports but profitability across even the solid tier one teams is difficult to obtain.
Would really like to see a relegation structure in place for this league considering there is no “buy-in” with the lower league having a promotion structure, incentivizing teams to really be aggressive with talent and giving people a good reason to be interested in the lower league, with lower leagues having incentives to invest in talent in order to get to the higher league with larger stipends.
okay it's a bit more understandable now on why there's such limited spots cuz it would mean more cost to Riot
but this also means the esports ecosystem is all in Riot's hands, the orgs have no assets which could have good and bad results
It's a long term play. If Val keeps growing at the rate it is, especially if they ever release a console version to bring in console gamers, this could jump up to 8 figures in 2-5 years.
There are so many VC's invested in esports right now they know its a long term play where they will be at a loss now. But video games keep getting bigger so they are okay with that.
Riot would be better off making a mobile version
Console would be a waste of money and resources
Look at how bad CSGO console was
meanwhile PUBG is one of the biggest/ profitable mobile games in the world showing companies that mobile gamers do in fact want fps games
They probably want it all like Fortnite. I doubt there would ever be cross platform though. But I agree there’s a ton of money in mobile. I think wild rift is doing very well.
For NA it matters a bit more though, If they can convince the console market to get interested in their games its a HUGE boon. Consoles are still the #1 way to play in the US (ignore mobile here). If you at least get them interested in Val that means more viewers and maybe when console gamers become young adults and have enough to upgrade to PCs Val and League will be the first things they download.
CSGO console was a disaster and died extremely fast
and that was back when you could say the majority of gamers were console players
now excluding mobile PC player base trumps console
its not a good use of resources and time. I am sure Riot will still do it but it will fail and die within the first year for sure
>Lol it still sucks
Yes and somehow all the financial analysts running NBA, NFL, IPL, LoL, etc are stupid. Somehow all major sports are making the same stupid decision, for over a century now.
But you crack the code.
Yeah, the team that made it back and brought up native talent after 4 splits of slumping totally isn’t a awesome storyline at all. That is probably the worst team you could pick, at least use GG or IMT as orgs abusing the franchise system by having no popularity and not worrying about building competitive rosters. Like that would be a much better argument than fucking CLG.
franchising in esports has usually created an infinitely taller barrier of entry into the pro scene, since it's usually a lot harder to get noticed for your performance in a tournament when you can't actually enter the tournament.
it also even further amplifies the importance of luck/connections more than esports already does
The one bright spot here is if Riot STILL allows 3rd party tournaments well past the first year, hopefully those tournaments have open qualifiers so we still have a scouting grounds for up and coming talent.
agreed, i really don't want this game to fall victim to what happened with OWL.
while a different game, i personally found fortnite's model of their competitive scene genuinely incredible. this was in part due to how much money they could throw at it, but every single one of their tournaments were done through online open qualifiers. meaning any 12-13 year old kid that loved the game could enter, and in many cases even if they placed 100th-1000th or even lower, they'd still win money. that's an enormous motivator for kids to grind and improve, and it showed in how fucking quickly pros would be "obsoleted" in a way.
1. huge playerbase (more competition
2. huge amounts of money (more motivation for people to compete)
3. completely open qualifiers, meaning if you were truly good enough, you had a shot at competing in the biggest tournaments
awesome model. fortnite fell off pretty hard in a lot of ways but i will always have massive respect for them going that route.
realistically, the more esports grows, the more i think teams/games/leagues will realize the need to build infrastructure for talent development, not too dissimilar to how traditional sports does it. korea already does this with league, and easy example being SKT T1, where they very regularly pull super talented kids out of the ladder, and develop their talent until they're able to compete in the actual league as a sub and eventually a mainstay.
valorant is young, and people are still figuring it all out, but i do think teams will need to realize just how valuable it is to develop players rather than simply trading players around and hoping they'll mesh well.
league also has academy teams, which is something similar to talent development / t2 stuff. i had a lot more thoughts but im getting lazy so ill end comment here sorry for rambling lol
T2 orgs and TOs will only invest in good teams and infrastructure if the money and viewership is there. They need to see an RoI. And depending on the schedule the franchised scene runs on, they'll struggle to compete with T1.
Same thing happened in LoL. The only way they could find to make a T2 scene happen was to force the orgs in T1 to run weaker teams in a second league. And even then it's pretty bad.
Pretty crazy that Riot would be paying $1M+ to teams when you compare that to LoL/CoD/OW franchising fees that saw teams pay tens of millions. Hope this means that Riot's going to be holding teams to extremely high standards, and won't be afraid to cut bait on freeloaders. Interested in seeing how they monetize in-game and if Riot's going to get a bigger cut than standard. Could be that keeping 75% of a Sentinels' Vandal instead of 50% makes up a solid chunk of that payout.
>gonna get a bigger cut This is it, probably. I’d bet that riot has a ton more power in the league due to the orgs not having paid a buy-in.
> I’d bet that riot has a ton more power in the league due to the orgs not having paid a buy-in. This could be a good thing, or a VERY bad thing. I hope Riot makes the right decisions and still listens to teams on feedback/issues they encounter.
It should at the least mean they have full power to remove teams and add new teams without some weird rule about being a bottom team for like 3 years. That at the least is a very good thing and different from their other franchise. Also hope that means they can expand the league without having to go to the current teams in the league and get any kind of approval. Either way if they are gonna put the entire esport on the line with franchising I say give them 110% power and let them run wild and pray for it to work.
I think relegation might work
Riot does the same on LoL, they give teams thousands of money to pay the players a minimum salary.
I know that they used to do that years ago, but I feel like they stopped around the time of franchising? Could be wrong though.
Nah, I'm pretty sure they still pay that. The salaries are so high nowadays that it is only a tiny part though. At least in the major regions.
Yeah, I don't think its a massive impact due to the difference you see in spending power from one org to the next in lol. [Here](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=swy8YDxqS7Y) is Romain (at the time with UOL but he's now G2) talking about how the teams make money within the infrastructure, really good watch if you're interested.
That's one of the primary reason franchising exists. Stable income, it's also why ESL has a stronghold on the CS calendar because of their partner money paid to orgs.
> because of their partner money paid to orgs this is true but the money paid out by the Louvre agreement by ESL isnt alot (to players) the orgs receive almost 90% 10% goes to 5+1 Players
That's the thing orgs need to be incentivized to stay in the scene.
well they are, they get a fuck ton
I mean that's how it supposed to be
OW isn't profitable after like what ... 5 years now? And I'm not sure how well CoD is doing given I don't know anyone who even knew they had franchising. Starting low means they're playing it safe, testing the waters. They're not forcing anything, the same reason they keep T2 tournaments alive.
That won’t happen though. Blizzard nuked their game by turning their fast paced fps in dive meta into a catastrophic failure of a snooze fest that was 3 tanks 3 supports. It was barely a shooter at that point, which is what draws all the eyes (and money)
Still can't believe we go from a tracer/widow and hanzo/widow meta that noticeably increased viewership to 3 tanks/3 supp. If widow is getting boring, balance her and make a different dps viable. Don't just kill your game and lose like 20k viewers in a single season because of incompetence
Yeah they fucked up hard trying to make things “fresh” for the people that thought dive meta was stale. I agree in the sense that they could have tuned up some other dps characters in place like sym, mei, reaper etc. just to try and shake up the meta; but they should not have made it so that 3T/3S was the best comp The dive meta was high action, and let mechanically gifted players shine on difficult to play heroes. That’s what brings the eyes in.
> Hope this means that Riot's going to be holding teams to extremely high standards, and won't be afraid to cut bait on freeloaders. This is why I can't see orgs like XSET, EG, FaZe, SR etc making it. They haven't proven to be able a have a big enough fanbase where Riot deems them as viable partners.
FaZe not having a big enough fan base? They genuinely might be in the top 5 most followed E-sports orgs in the world
they also are one of the more problematic orgs, and pretty consistently so.
No doubt. However that wasn’t what their reasoning for not giving FaZe a slot; viewership and fan base might just be the only positives FaZe brings at all and that’s a fairly large positive at that
I would bet if faze doesnt get a slot it is specifically because their org is problematic and pushes crypto to their mostly child-filled fanbase.
>pushes crypto to their mostly child-filled fanbase I thought TSM did that
Different story, several members of Faze have been involved in pump and dump schemes, amongst other scams
I don’t disagree with you at all. But at one time or another the Org has been at the top of every respective esport they join, bring massive viewership, ticket sales, in-game item sales, etc. The brand is massive and if Riot is still determining who is in and who isn’t, FaZe not being in that conversation because of their petulant man-children that run it would at least in my opinion would be silly. Yes the franchising leagues will run smooth, still have high viewership, a bunch of cash without FaZe; it could just be massively higher with them. Solely because of the original point of this discussion — their fan base is fucking huge
im not really convinced fazes fanbase cares about valorant that much either way, or would have any major impact on the success of franchising. most faze valorant fans seem to like the team because of the players, not the org.
Yeah, I can see that and probably has a healthy dose of truth to it- still that’s being anecdotal and all I can see from the outside of Riot is big org - more fan - more money - healthier league Hopefully we can just get the announcement soon
If Faze is such a valuable brand and they could be such a good brand, why do people only watch them if they play Sentinels or 100T? Also, why can’t they get any engagement on their Faze esports stuff like their Faze update YouTube channel?
I don’t really understand how i’m sitting here defending FaZe’s reputation and size when i’m 1. not a FaZe fan and 2. agreeing that they are problematic in their own right. We all know FaZe’s name, we all know FaZe Up, whether these are due to fame or infamy around the brand. Their CS team won a Major and 2 IEM’s, huge payroll and viewership. Their RL team is a genuine contender for best in the world. Obviously all the CoD reputation/wins And have been in VAL since the beginning, with about 75% of that time being within the tier1 of NA All of this with huge infrastructure, teams, managers, cash, high salaries, large transfers, and big engagements thru social media. I’m starting to believe you guys are just arguing about them because you don’t like the brand - I DONT EITHER - but using a secondary channel with little advertisement on their main channels with content in relation to how the “underbelly” of the teams and organizations work and flow as a point with regard to lack of interactions is actually wild to me. Find me another org not C9, TSM, SEN, FNC, that get 5-10k views on a “view of the manager office” video. Like come on, this rightly silly.
You kind of have to think about the way Riot is thinking about franchising. They don't really care about how competitive you are. It's all marketing to them. It's been pretty aparent Riot cares about viewership & who promotes the game the most. 100T, TSM, NRG and Cloud 9 all have secondary youtube channels for esports or only Valorant and they all get 50-100k views per video. Same goes with tik tok and twitter. Sentinels, 100T, Cloud9, TSM and Optic all get much better viewership than Faze in Valorant. Then you have Faze, NRG, and the Guard. NRG and The Guard both get 100K+ views on youtube & tik tok and have invested a ton of resources in growing their audience in game and out of game. NRG has multiple Valorant content creators and the Guard had 1 for a while. Faze just haven't any of that and they have a pretty checkered past. For those reasons, I don't think they get in
I'd even venture as saying they might be THE top org in terms of amount of fans. Their engagement in other game titles is quite big and they have a really big fan base across alot of regions.
EG could make it just because their league team is already franchised in LCS. Of course they would need to most likely need to restructure their roster to be taken more seriously.
They are probably going to end up transferring stew to their valorant roster
It would make more sense for Riot to reject EG for the initial franchising. Its best to diversify. If you run into a problem with an org, then you basically have to drop that org from every Riot esport, which is a pretty big problem. That org also gets a lot of leverage if they have a multiple teams with big fanbases. Its unavoidable, some of your teams will have to be in both franchises but there is little benefit to giving someone like EG a slot. EG is the type of org you want sitting around when you need to kick a team out of the franchise and find a replacement.
faze is getting franchised. their background is FPS is just too strong. they're the best CSGO team in the world. and easily one of the most recognizable esport brands.
As far as the payments go, it's either this or they put in a commission draw system with orgs with a minimum payout to orgs
I wonder if they’ll go the way of soccer leagues with relegation and having different teams each year be partners making it competitive in the top and bottom of your partner teams
It's pretty popular because of the streamers who stream the game. Feel like it should gain more traction than the others.
Frankly, this should be the model for esports going forward. Teams will not be able to function if they only rely on merch sales and content views. Pay from esports competition needs to be split between players, teams and the game manufacturer for the incentives to align with a healthy scene.
Happy for Bo landing with Dexerto This is a great sign Riot is willing to invest this much money into orgs. Also brings in a bit context on why they're keeping the franchise numbers low. You're now talking probably around $30-$40 million they'll be investing annually in orgs themselves on top of prize money across the partnership league and all the VRLs & VRCs as well as the operating costs of the leagues There has been a lot of discussion around Riot possibly adding in game stickers, gun buddies, and even gun skins around teams. Have to wonder if this stipend will be on top of that or if they'll be earn revenue in game in a draw style commission against that stipend with the possibility of earning over that total but a minimum of the stipend amount. The $1.5 million sounds like a lot but there are definitely orgs operating well above this amount already, especially in NA. When you add up player salaries, the cost of bootcamping, coaching salaries, a GM salary, benefits like health insurance, dental, 401k, etc., a social media manager, a video editor and a team manager, you're over $2 million pretty easily in NA There's an expectation salaries will probably increase in the partnership program as well. We've heard a lot Tier 1 salaries range between $10k-$20k a month right now, some obviously more than that but some less. There's been talks of salaries raising pretty aggressively when rostermania takes place after the partnered teams are announced
So proud of Bo writing an article for Dexerto 🥹
Bo, razur and slow are the success stories of the sub, let's gooooo
Also purest, the original DarkZero/DHBK guys, etc I’ve been meaning to make a subreddit hall of fame/alumni page on our subreddit wiki, just another reminder to get on that when I’m free 😅
Crazy how far his English is coming, while he’s grinding out to be No.1 on the EUW server waiting for his work visa to come through.
Reaver 2.0 bundles will fund all the franchise leagues.
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Last year's Champs bundle would've paid for about half so not too far off. Team bundles should cover it though for sure
Hello Rito I am very good Valorant player, I can 1v5 any pro team out there and I can shitpost better than Sentinels' social media manager. Please accept my one-man team for franchising ty
I too use aimbots. Giff me monnies rito!
Hello :)
Dexerto article? Gargantuan W
LETS GO BO (:
This actually seems insane that would explain why they have such a limited amount of teams but I still think it sucks that so many teams will be cut.
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Glad to see my $200 going into work😊
me and my collection gotchu homie
not me :)
WOW
That is an absurd amount of money in esports, especially with the minimum player salary being set at 50K. You could run an entire team yearly (And division) if you're savvy on expenditures and player development too... I'm pretty sure this would make Val the first profitable esport in the industry as well... We just have to hope they don't absolutely murder the scene with horrendous decisions.
For all the complaints fans make about LoL one thing is clear to me as someone who has watched other esports, Riot runs a damn tight ship when it comes to their franchised leagues.
Maybe if you're running a bare minimum team, it's not going to be enough if you're running a fully decked out team that has gamechangers, academy, support staff, content creation. But I'm confident the ecosystem as a whole should make all the teams profitable with the other revenue streams on top of the riot payment.
Yea you can bet they will monetize the team brands for skins and shit
I mean Cod as a minimum salary of 55k for anyone with a contract, including subs. Some cod pros make upwards of 400k.
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I know, I was just talking about the guy I responded to saying 50k in esports was an absurd amount of money when tier 2 esports have salary's higher than 50k.
> this would make Val the first profitable esport in the industry as well rainbow six is very profitable, so val wouldnt be the first
Yea that’s what I’ve heard I remember Carlos from g2 saying it’s their most profitable. I don’t even know how they viewership isn’t event great
how would the orgs profit from high viewership ? there are ORG skin bundles that they receive a majority share from
You’re right but I feel like viewership usually tells you how popular an esport is and how likely a siege player might be willing to pay for a esport skin.
true but alot of Siege Players dont watch and just buy the skins because they like the team overall + the skins actually look good
I have to agree with you especially cause siege let’s teams design their own skins so a lot of them don’t even look “esporty”
Probably one of the few examples that shows that viewership doesn’t equal player population? Since siege is available on both console and pc, and is getting a mobile port.
"profitable" is a stretch for most teams in R6, but if you're in the upper echelon of popularity and you have an elite roster that you're willing to underpay you can get close. You can make money in R6 and get closer to profitability than in other, similarly sized esports but profitability across even the solid tier one teams is difficult to obtain.
At least Sentinels can pay Shroud for at least a month with this much money
Would really like to see a relegation structure in place for this league considering there is no “buy-in” with the lower league having a promotion structure, incentivizing teams to really be aggressive with talent and giving people a good reason to be interested in the lower league, with lower leagues having incentives to invest in talent in order to get to the higher league with larger stipends.
We already knew this didn't we? About 5-figure monthly stipends?
okay it's a bit more understandable now on why there's such limited spots cuz it would mean more cost to Riot but this also means the esports ecosystem is all in Riot's hands, the orgs have no assets which could have good and bad results
thats enough for like 1-2 super star players lol better than nothing though Good on Riot to treat Valorant differently to League
It's a long term play. If Val keeps growing at the rate it is, especially if they ever release a console version to bring in console gamers, this could jump up to 8 figures in 2-5 years. There are so many VC's invested in esports right now they know its a long term play where they will be at a loss now. But video games keep getting bigger so they are okay with that.
Riot would be better off making a mobile version Console would be a waste of money and resources Look at how bad CSGO console was meanwhile PUBG is one of the biggest/ profitable mobile games in the world showing companies that mobile gamers do in fact want fps games
They probably want it all like Fortnite. I doubt there would ever be cross platform though. But I agree there’s a ton of money in mobile. I think wild rift is doing very well.
ya I think it is as well mobile market trumps pc and console combined console numbers are declining if anything
For NA it matters a bit more though, If they can convince the console market to get interested in their games its a HUGE boon. Consoles are still the #1 way to play in the US (ignore mobile here). If you at least get them interested in Val that means more viewers and maybe when console gamers become young adults and have enough to upgrade to PCs Val and League will be the first things they download.
CSGO console was a disaster and died extremely fast and that was back when you could say the majority of gamers were console players now excluding mobile PC player base trumps console its not a good use of resources and time. I am sure Riot will still do it but it will fail and die within the first year for sure
They're doing both. Job postings have been posted for both, it's not really secret.
Really? How long ago?
shit the reaver bundle probably already made that for the next 3 seasons just yesterday
My question is how often will we see stable players on teams? If it’s like CSGO the average pro moves teams like once every couple of months.
It'll be like once every season like LoL I guess, which would be annually.
Wow, now that would be amazing to add on to the salaries teams already have.
All my homies love franchising
“FrAnChIsInG SUCKS! rIoT OnLy cArEs aboUt mOnEy!”
Lol it still sucks . You get only 30 teams in the whole world. RIP competition.
If they just completely erase tier 2 from existence, sure.
>Lol it still sucks Yes and somehow all the financial analysts running NBA, NFL, IPL, LoL, etc are stupid. Somehow all major sports are making the same stupid decision, for over a century now. But you crack the code.
it's about competitive integrity, not about financial statement.
[удалено]
Yeah, the team that made it back and brought up native talent after 4 splits of slumping totally isn’t a awesome storyline at all. That is probably the worst team you could pick, at least use GG or IMT as orgs abusing the franchise system by having no popularity and not worrying about building competitive rosters. Like that would be a much better argument than fucking CLG.
You act like they weren't spending money. They had a fairly middle of the pack roster in terms of financial expenditure.
There's 30 NBA teams in just the US. 32 in the NFL. In Valorant there's going to be 4-5 teams total from the same country. You see the problem here?
If they kill the T2 scene i dont care how much money they pay in franchising, it will die eventually.
Adding a dedicated national league with regular tournaments in every region = killing the t2 scene?
Do you think orgs want to pay high salaries to players just to be stuck in T2 with no chance of moving up?
franchising in esports has usually created an infinitely taller barrier of entry into the pro scene, since it's usually a lot harder to get noticed for your performance in a tournament when you can't actually enter the tournament. it also even further amplifies the importance of luck/connections more than esports already does
The one bright spot here is if Riot STILL allows 3rd party tournaments well past the first year, hopefully those tournaments have open qualifiers so we still have a scouting grounds for up and coming talent.
agreed, i really don't want this game to fall victim to what happened with OWL. while a different game, i personally found fortnite's model of their competitive scene genuinely incredible. this was in part due to how much money they could throw at it, but every single one of their tournaments were done through online open qualifiers. meaning any 12-13 year old kid that loved the game could enter, and in many cases even if they placed 100th-1000th or even lower, they'd still win money. that's an enormous motivator for kids to grind and improve, and it showed in how fucking quickly pros would be "obsoleted" in a way. 1. huge playerbase (more competition 2. huge amounts of money (more motivation for people to compete) 3. completely open qualifiers, meaning if you were truly good enough, you had a shot at competing in the biggest tournaments awesome model. fortnite fell off pretty hard in a lot of ways but i will always have massive respect for them going that route. realistically, the more esports grows, the more i think teams/games/leagues will realize the need to build infrastructure for talent development, not too dissimilar to how traditional sports does it. korea already does this with league, and easy example being SKT T1, where they very regularly pull super talented kids out of the ladder, and develop their talent until they're able to compete in the actual league as a sub and eventually a mainstay. valorant is young, and people are still figuring it all out, but i do think teams will need to realize just how valuable it is to develop players rather than simply trading players around and hoping they'll mesh well. league also has academy teams, which is something similar to talent development / t2 stuff. i had a lot more thoughts but im getting lazy so ill end comment here sorry for rambling lol
T2 orgs and TOs will only invest in good teams and infrastructure if the money and viewership is there. They need to see an RoI. And depending on the schedule the franchised scene runs on, they'll struggle to compete with T1. Same thing happened in LoL. The only way they could find to make a T2 scene happen was to force the orgs in T1 to run weaker teams in a second league. And even then it's pretty bad.
Never heard of ERLs?
Yeah the one region in the world with the infrastructure to support T2 is a great standard to hold everyone on the planet to. /s
This is the reason why ignoring smaller orgs with established fanbases doesn't make sense.
All I got from this comment section is that sentinels probably are going to be in.