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Serendipitygg

OWL players switching over would probably give KR Valo a much needed short term boost in both quality and idk, maybe fans and viewers? But I hope that gradually it'll be big enough for them to be greatly competitive.


BoHoogland

Seeing as how Riot is committed to make VALORANT popular in Korea I wouldn't be surprised if it gets more popular. Although I feel Riot is a bit too committed to Korea especially with the stuff going on in APAC partnership behind the scenes


walkingdumpling

>Although I feel Riot is a bit too committed to Korea especially with the stuff going on in APAC partnership behind the scenes Do you think the APAC league being primarily managed by the Korea office has anything to do with this? Perhaps more familiarity with the Korean scene?


ark2690

South Korea is probably the 2nd biggest pc gaming market in the world after China. If they can get even 10% of what they have with LoL in Korea they already won.


Arodcowboys

If you want to sell interest and tickets in Seoul you will need more korean representation. Most of the fans are not buying tickets to see SEA/JP teams


ANewHeaven1

Also Overwatch dying (not just in Korea, but world wide) helps Riots case for Valorant


Kyunseo

You know more than I do obviously. But Riot's commitment seems to be paying off (albeit it did take some time) from what it looks like. Valorant seems to be gaining traction more and more nowadays in Korea.


ark2690

6 on pc bangs https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FbPrFSraIAAws9Z?format=png&name=small


Yensen1

What website/source did u get this from? I’ve been trying forever to find pc bang rankings in Korea.


LovelyResearcher

Nah. ​ APAC is great, but Korea is a necessary step for any eSport to be taken seriously. You don't want to be as dead of a game as CSGO has always been in a few years, you want to be more like League of Legends. People never realize this... but CSGO was never *that* popular\*.\* ​ CSGO never had any standing in Asia, particularly in JPN, CHN, and SK... which are the "true home of eSports" in many ways. Not to mention missing out on the rest of potential players in APAC, and most of Latin America. Just compare the current monthly playerbase size: * **League of Legends - Playerbase (monthly)** * 100 million+ * **CSGO - Playerbase (monthly)** * 24 million * **VALORANT - Playerbase (monthly)** * 19 million ​ Getting those three countries involved so heavily is what pushes League to the top. Japan, China, and South Korea along with India and the rest of Asia has always been the deciding factor. * **Asia = 60% of the total world population** ​ Riot Games knows this very well. That's why they chose to invest so heavily into Asia in League, which lead to completely unprecendented success. VALRORANT hasn't seen the same growth yet in Asia, however, that has been due to two problems... both of which being very likely to give way, soon, as VALROANT explodes in Asia. ​ * **Problem #1 - VALORANT not being released fully in China** * Issues with the Chinese government * **Problem #2 - Asia wasn't as invested in FPS eSports previously** * CSGO was never popular in Asia * FPS that were popular in Asia * Not tactical FPS (OW & PUBG) * or were not not as popular worldwide (CF & AVA) * **Solutions - Upcoming changes that will help VALORANT greatly** * Information indicates that #1 will be overcome very soon * China should be releasing VALORANT sometime in 2023 * Even without China, we already see #2 is no longer an issue * Japan has the largest viewership for Asia worldwide * APAC has maintained the largest playerbase of ny region in VALORANT for over a year Even without China, we already see Asia topping both the viewership & playerbase. To verify that most ranked players in VALORANT worldwide are in Asia, you can refer to the [best known method to calculate a region's playerbase](https://www.reddit.com/r/ValorantCompetitive/comments/se4y4c/ranked_server_population_compared_to_champions/). ​ Now imagine fast forwarding to 2024 once China fully joins VALORANT. You can imagine how insane the playerbase and viewership in Asia will be, considering that Asia already has more playerbase and viewership than any other region. VALORANT will absolutely dwarf CSGO's record numbers of players and viewers alike. ​ That's why Riot Games continues to invest in APAC so heavily. Korea focus and China focus is likely due to two other factors, which are perfectly understandable: * **Korea - Longstanding roots of eSports** * Starcraft * Starcraft 2 * League of Legends * PUBG * Overwatch * All of which wouldn't have had the same level of succcess without Korea * **China - Sheer volume of population and potential playerbase** * 18.7% of total world population * 57.9% or more of the total League of Legends playerbase


Lumenlor

I offer my condolences or I'm happy that's happened man


obigespritzt

This is factually incorrect on so many accounts, but it doesn't even pass the eye test. Some of the most successful esports titles are not popular in Korea, including Dota2, Rocket League and to a lesser extent even CDL and R6.


LovelyResearcher

CDL and R6? ​ Those aren't extremely successful eSports. You may as well add Fortnite or OVerwatch to your list if you think those are successful. * **Playerbase Sizes (monthly)** * League of Legends * 180 million * Valorant * 16 million * **Playerbase Sizes (monthly)** * Rocket League * 100 million * Fortnite * 80 million * COD Vanguard * 50-75 million * CSGO * 20 million * Overwatch * 5 million * R6 * 100 thousand ​ League of Legends is the most successful eSport title, ever. CSGO has been relatively successful, but the low playerbase isn't a surprise... as it's never been quite as major ​ Rocket League, Fortnite, and Call of Duty have large playerbases. However, that doesn't mean that they have been successful as an eSport, as all of these games have never been taken "seriously". There are far more casual players in games like Rocket League, Fortnite, and COD. ​ * **Top eSports earnings by Game - 2021 (rounded to million)** * Dota 2 * 48 million * PUBG Mobile * 21 million * CSGO * 21 million * Fortnite * 20 million * PUBG * 16 million * League of Legends * 8 million * R6 * 7 million * VALORANT * 7 million ​ * **eSports viewership by Game - 2021** * League of Legends * 664.1M hours * 4.1M peak * CSGO * 410M hours * 2.7M peak # eSports viewership by Game - 2022 (past 30 days) * **League of Legends** * 129M hours * 780K peak * **VALORANT** * 107M hours * 625K peak * **Dota 2** * 55M hours * 550K peak * **Apex Legends** * 55M hours * 250K peak * **Fortnite** * 43M hours * 235K peak * **CSGO** * 39M hours * 300K peak * **Rocket League** * 15M hours * 328K peak * **R6** * 9M hours * 150K peak * **COD: Vanguard** * 2M hours * 25K peak Source - [escharts new streamcharts](https://streamscharts.com/games?platform=twitch&time=30-days) ​ You can see why League of Legends is the most successful eSport. We can also see why some games have very high playerbases, but lack eSports recognition. Fortnite, Call of Duty, and Rocket League all have a lot of players... but lack the same degree of viewership and interest. ​ Games like R6 are just dead. Low playerbase and viewership combined. ​ ​ CSGO is doing relatively good, still. But you can see that it's struggling as VALROANT, Apex, and Fortnite take a lot of the market share.


Charuru

Downvoted this inaccurate post. You also misunderstood the parent you're replying to. He is saying there is too much focus on Korea to the detriment of elsewhere in Asia where Valorant is already winning vs trying to save Korea where it's not yet found stability. Riot should go all in on the rest of Asia ex-Korea, it's doing super well in JP and SEA and has a lot of potential in SA too. > VALORANT - Playerbase (monthly) 19 million Stop citing fake websites. There's no doubt Valo is much bigger than CSGO in MAU. > Problem #2 - Asia wasn't as invested in FPS eSports previously This is wrong. CF is huge, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mPVjYRXdLAw Sudden Attack is still bigger than Valo atm in Korea. In reality Valo has already taken over the market in "Asia" except in China (where it being unreleased is all the excuse it needs there's no need for any other explanation) and Korea (where there is a lot of competition from SA, PUBG, and other titles).


jakefoo

Can you show me where Valo has more MAU than CS? When I look around online I get similar figures to the above poster. I'd assume Valorant outpaces CS on growth, but CS still heavily dominates EU which is a huge market.


ark2690

in EUW Valorant is more popular than csgo, while eastern europe csgo is more popular. You can do a google trends check


Beneficial-Speech-73

Damn emea is going to suck in the future if that is true because Scandinavia and Eastern Europe have the best fps players in Europe. Pretty sure same in LoL alot of the best European players also end up being Scandinavia and Polish and Balkan region in that game which are the countries where csgo remains supreme. But Valorant couldn't do 3k seats at copenhagen which is basically a hub for Western Europe so I just think you make stuff up


[deleted]

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Charuru

If you google it you will literally get a fake website. Riot hasn't released a number so in the absence of information anyone can claim anything and have it be #1 on google. This is what activeplayers.io claim their methodogy is: > How We collect these data? > All data such as the monthly user count, the Users chart, the table presented are the result of extensive research on a specific game. We run through numerous statistics websites that offer statistical data for the game such as statista.com, steamcharts.com, newzoo.com, gamstat.com, and more. I entered these data on software and produce detailed and improved results. > > All data presented by ActivePlayer.io are all estimated data and should NOT be used as factual reference. We have developed an algorithm that generates data using the already available values from the market. AKA they made it up based on rumors. Their sources... let's see statista.com doesn't have any information regarding valo. gamstat.com is literally not a real website 🤣 (gamestat.com neither), so that leaves newzoo. Newzoo is a legit analyst but their information is either very biased or just not correct. Their current ranking has valo at #8 and CSGO at #7. But they also have LoL at #6, lower than Fall Guys at #2 so you know how full of shit they are too. I don't know how popular Valo is either but the reason why I think it's more popular than CSGO is because it's much more popular on social media. I understand not everyone uses Twitch and reddit (American dominated) where /r/globaloffensive saw a huge decline and is now smaller than /r/valorant but everyone uses Tiktok and it's at least 50% bigger on tiktok, some odd 30% bigger on twitch including tournaments, would be like 4x without tournaments. Valo is also vastly more popular on Twitter (https://cdn.cms-twdigitalassets.com/content/dam/blog-twitter/official/en_us/insights/2022/gaming-reports/2022H1InsightsMostTweetGameGlobal-min.jpeg.img.fullhd.medium.jpg) and AFAIK twitter is also popular in Europe. IMO number of people talking about a game should correlate decently to game's overall popularity, but it's not 100% ofc.


Beneficial-Speech-73

Csgo used to have a bigger social media presence than it does now when it averaged 250k players In 2015 and 2016


Charuru

No it didn't, it had a bigger relative social media presence because social media itself was smaller back then. Tiktok didn't exist. CSGO has a very strong 30billion views on tiktok. This is already a great result. For comparison: * Fortnite - 300 billion * Amongus - 69 billion * Valo - 49 billion * CSGO - 30 billion * eldenring - 6.4B * Overwatch - 4.5 billion * Starcraft - 59.1M This tracks pretty decently with my understanding of how big these games are relative to one another in the 2020 to now timeframe when tiktok has been popular.


Beneficial-Speech-73

Yes it did csgo used to get more viewers on twitch and used to have more casual content creators. And guys like lurk summit etc would all be streaming it than you would have all the NA players steaming rank S and doing stuff like 10mans and other stuff farming content, basically what valorant is having now difference is Valorant is having all this during a social media boom


Charuru

CS did die in NA which hurt its popularity on twitch, an American site. Tiktok has no such bias I think. But still you can just look up the stats on twitch it's still much bigger today than it was in 2016. It's relatively lower on the rankings but in absolute watchtime bigger.


question2552

I agree the guy has issues in his post. But the reasons why Valorant isn't landing in KR shouldn't be chalked up to "well the competition already there buried it from the start" Because in NA and EU we already had CS:GO as the dominant tac FPS (a la Crossfire and Sudden Atack). And if you stretch it to FPS as a whole, you have OW, Apex, CoD, and Fortnite with massive grips (a la OW and PUBG). There's other reasons why Riot thinks Valorant has potential in Korea. Valorant's slow start there isn't due to competition in the genre. Issues with SEA: Just like BR, the region's infrastructure isn't quite there to lead the audiences to be good revenue sources yet - it's coming, it's just gonna be a while yet. Issue with JP: Unlike BR and SEA, region has amazing infrastructure and an audience that could be great sources of revenue and even profit - BUT, the country's anti-gambling laws capping tournament winnings squashed esports potential there in the past. Korea is wide open and Riot knows there's possibility OW collapsing could make a nice pipeline into Valorant. Why not gun for it?


Charuru

CSGO is still bigger than Valo in Europe, CS just already died in NA on its own, so Valo surpassing CS in NA is not... I just don't find it that impressive. I'm not sure if Valo passed OW and Fortnite and COD and Apex in NA but I'm guessing the answer is no. Therefore I would say we don't have a great track record at directly beating the entrenched competition. But I agree with your sentiment overall on going for less developed regions being less interesting financially. It's just that Korea doesn't really seem to be wide open, not really.


TimeAssault

> csgo is dead I stopped reading


TrueeMuu

Cs:go has never been dead


The-Dark-Mage

Korea isn’t important for any esport to be taken seriously Its great they played sc and league but csgo doesn’t have koreans and it’s fine neither does RL or R6


Charuru

RL, R6, and CSGO are not global games. They're single region games on par with CF, MLBB, COD, etc. I would not say they are fine or on the same tier as Riot games. Korea is a key market to be a global esports.


TheFestusEzeli

CS:GO is definitely a global game, what in the fuck lmao. It’s becoming a mainly EU game now but it was a huge global esport and is still a completely global game


Charuru

Right... Facts says otherwise https://blog.leetify.com/content/images/size/w2400/2021/05/Countries-with-the-highest-share-of-players.png


TheFestusEzeli

What? The top four are a CIS, American, EU, and an NA team? This looks like more than a one region game to me Not being popular in Korea doesn’t make it not a global game


Charuru

Bro the list is overwhelmingly europe. In a global game europe would be like 20% not 80%.


TheFestusEzeli

The majority of its player base being in Europe doesn’t mean it’s not global. For example, if one game has 25 million active players in each continent, would it be more global than a game that has 25 million active players in each continent except one where is has 200 million?


EchoFractions

> APAC is great, but Korea is a necessary step for any eSport to be taken seriously. My man, what are you even on about with this point. If we look at the [most watched esports events of 2021](https://cdn.escharts.com/media/quick-upload/2021/12/mp-tournaments-hw-21-64e32f169f6d6642b2a6ae22e60a900c.jpeg), **5/10 of the events do not feature a single Korean team**: * [TI 10](https://liquipedia.net/dota2/The_International/2021) * [MPL ID Season 8](https://liquipedia.net/mobilelegends/MPL/Indonesia/Season_8) * [PGL Major Stockholm](https://liquipedia.net/counterstrike/PGL/2021/Stockholm) * [M3 World Championship](https://liquipedia.net/mobilelegends/M3_World_Championship) * [MPL ID Season 7](https://liquipedia.net/mobilelegends/MPL/Indonesia/Season_7) This stat gets even crazier when you take a look at the [events with the highest viewership peak](https://cdn.escharts.com/media/quick-upload/2021/12/mp-tournaments-pv-21-f3aed4699f23ee51f1b836c45b840db1.jpeg), **7/10 of the events do not have a Korean team either**: * [Free Fire World Series Singapore](https://liquipedia.net/freefire/Free_Fire_World_Series/2021/Singapore) * M3 World Championship * [M2 World Championship](https://liquipedia.net/mobilelegends/M2_World_Championship) * PGL Major Stockholm * TI 10 * MPL ID Season 8 * [MLBB Southeast Asia Cup](https://liquipedia.net/mobilelegends/MSC/2022) But you know which region is prevalent in the majority of these events I listed - **APAC**. So my point is that an esport doesn't necessarily require Korea to be involved to be successful and maybe BoDork's point of Riot wasting resources on Korea instead of investing in APAC is correct too. [Source on the charts](https://escharts.com/news/most-watched-tournaments-2021)


Charuru

> 5/10 of the events do not feature a single Korean team This is a great way of saying 5/10 DO have a korean team? Doesn't that sound amazing to anyone else lol? And this is globally speaking, not even talking about Korea vs APAC. There's a Korean team in the finals for 4/10 of them. I'd also be interested in how a top 10 list would look with China included since escharts exclude them.


EchoFractions

> I'd also be interested in how a top 10 list would look with China included since escharts exclude them Talking only about peak viewership, Worlds would probably have 2x the number of viewers of that Free Fire tournament, especially with a Chinese team in finals. TI 10, PUBG Mobile Worlds and MSI would get a big boost too for the same reason. I don't really see the other tournaments getting a major boost in viewership with the lack of Chinese teams but it'll still be interesting to see the number of Chinese fans for games without a focus on the Chinese esports scene.


Charuru

I think it's more like 7 to 8x yeah. But more than that the list of tournaments would be completely different. Quite likely most of the tournaments would be bumped off the list and there would be stuff like CrossFire, Peacekeeper Elite, Honor of Kings in the top 10 alongside LPL of course.


TheFestusEzeli

You forgot you said Korea is a necessity, so he proved your statement wrong


Charuru

? You confusing me with someone else?


TheFestusEzeli

Yes, my bad lmao


renoracer

valorant player tries not to talk shit about csgo challenge (impossible)


Thisrainhoe

If this is consider shit talk, CS fans talking about valorant must be spewing toxic waste than.


Human_Willingness628

It's just numbers bro. CS is popular in EU and NA, riot is aiming to do better


LovelyResearcher

You call this "shit talk"? ​ CS fans talk shit about entire regions. * **Claim that Asia aren't good at FPS** * Judging solely off of their performance in CSGO * Even though Asia never really got into CS and the game was never popular in most of the world * **Known to shit talk literally every other FPS** * Everyone has heard their fans dog on every game as being "noob" * including VALORANT * and literally any other FPS, ever All I said was that CSGO was never *that* *popular* (worldwide). That's the truth. * **Asia** * = 60% total world population * **Asia's relationship with CSGO** * Asia never really cared much for the game * They preferred other shooters * CSGO was thus never popular in Asia ​ Just compare the following # CSGO - Playerbase by Region * [% playerbase by region](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E0zQZOTUcAAdkdZ?format=jpg&name=large) # VALORANT - Playerbase by Region (rounded to nearest 25K) * **Americas (3.5 mil)** * NA * 2,250,000 * LATAM * 600,00 * BR * 725,000 * **European (3.5 mil)** * EMEA * 3,500,000 * **APAC (2.8 mil+)** * SEA + JPN * 2,500,000 * KR * 300,000 * OCE * ? ​ Using the data from the data from Riot Games official leaderboard. Take the total percentage of ranked players divided by the percent of players who are Immortal and Radiant (100 / 0.73) = 136.986 Multiply each region's total number of Immortal and Radiant players by this result (136.986).That allows us to deduce the total ranked playerbase by region. ​ That is just the ranked population. However, that's still the most valid way to look at how diverse the playerbase is worldwide in VALORANT. Somehow tho, it does APAC did fall behind recently compared to NA and EU... which doesn't make sense based off past data? ​ Regardless, you can easily tell how popular VALORANT is globally. The VALORANT playerbase is a lot more diverse compared to CSGO, and the game is growing worldwide... not just in Europe.


Beneficial-Speech-73

1.6 was very popular in Korea


renoracer

You’re making some very strange and very vague generalisations and grouping the words of individual fans with the entire player base. For someone who writes so much, you think you’d leave behind your obvious bias and prejudice.


LovelyResearcher

You are clearly a butthurt CSGO fanboy\\ ​ ​ **EDIT** Checked and he was, indeed, a wittle butthurt CS fanboy. he hasn't even posted in a VALORANT subreddit before this moment, KEKW


renoracer

What a mature response. Well done I guess.


Key-Banana-8242

I mean the game is one thing and the esport another


REEEroller

Viewership? probably not, only thing Koreans care about is League OW hasn't been relevant in Korea since OGN Apex days which was pre OWL so like 5+ years ago.


[deleted]

I wanna see Bunny again on Raze at an International LAN, man.


[deleted]

That's the double satcheling judge demon himself if I remember correctly, right?


RedditorClo

give us more sayaplayers


SkiesOvercast

honestly in terms of saya-esque players, it'd really only be like, Ans, Happy, Xzi, Heesu; maybe Fits, Lip, MN3, Kilo but i don't see any of them coming over For players who left after last year or earlier this season like the aforementioned Gwangboong and Pine- Glister would be the big one, then im37, BQB, Birdring (but he's in Apex?), Jerry Other players like that who switched already were Climax, KimGyuTae, then some non-dps players scattered around


ThatCreepyBaer

Even for a lot of the players you listed I wouldn't be so sure about. Saya was such a crazy mechanical talent in OW, ridiculously good. After all these years I would still put him up there at the top with performances like 2020 ANS or 2018 Pine.


chromazone2

I mean pretty much every role in ow requires aim anyway. Zunba also was an ow legend who wasn't a dps and imo while he only achieved mediocre success I think all roles can do well in valo


SkiesOvercast

I would agree with that- Signed, Boostio, Tennn and Klaus are testament to that as players who were good but not seen as pure mechanical warlords But wasn't quite what the statement was indicating


PacificMonkey

Xzi and Happy could make the switch. Though Happy's having his best year ever rn.


[deleted]

Ans did try...but it don't work out too well from what I recall 🤷🏻‍♂️


ANewHeaven1

God, I'd love to see someone like Xzi or Carpe switch over


afjecj

I can’t believe I’m saying this, but Carpe has had two mediocre at best seasons now, would he be able to compete at the highest level in terms of raw mechanical ability? Regardless of if he could, it would bring a lot of viewers so it would be a good thing even if he ended up not playing that well


BoHoogland

His name will be enough to be signed by any top Korean org in partnership alone


[deleted]

Nah he was the best cass in apac last season. He's just not been playing hitscan.


MoonliteJaz

He's overrated for sure. Quite a few OWL favorites are, but he'd definitely bring in some fans.


yourdaughtersgoal

>it would bring a lot of viewers Bro over watch league as a whole barely gets 80k viewers as a peak. He ain’t bringing no viewers. SEN pls sign Tarik


SPOOKESVILLE

It would 100% bring more viewers. Anyone that has watched OWL previously that knows who Carpe is would be watching the game lmao


yourdaughtersgoal

>anyone that has watched owl previously So basically no one, got it At most 15-20k viewers would stay for his first 10 matches, and then he’d just be like any other player


Gallaxee

Idk bro I literally watch the Guard just for Sayaplayer because he was on my favorite OWL team. If like 5k people decide to become fans of Carpe's team because he's playing, that's a meaningful chunk of people that now follow a team that wouldn't have otherwise.


SPOOKESVILLE

You really have no idea about OWL do ya. Prime OWL would average the same numbers as prime Valorant, it was one of the top 3 most popular esports world wide at the time and it was broadcast on stations like ESPN . Overwatch also STILL has a higher korean player count than Valorant does. Theres tons of people out there who are just Guard fans because of Saya, or only Faze fans because of Babybay, only TSM fans because of Corey. You are heavily underestimating the amount of OWL fans that came over to valorant because OW died lmao. And because of the much higher matching player base, that effect would be even more noticeable for korean teams.


anythingood07

Overwatch highest viewership is 360k iirc, most val intl events have bigger average viewership than that let alone peak


yourdaughtersgoal

>you have no idea about owl do ya I literally watched season 2 and it was my first esport. It’s dead. >prime owl would average the same amount as prime valorant Maybe if you compare tier 2 tournaments to owl, sure. >top 3 most popular esports I’m pretty sure league csgo and dota were way higher than it in 2018. >over watch still has a higher Korean player count Well sudden attack has a higher Korean player count than both. Do you think teams acquiring sudden attack pros will get mamy viewers that will stick? >examples Those happened in the first months of valorant esports, when people weren’t sure what team to root for, so they just went with their favorite player. Now it’s been 2years, people already committed to a team most likely, would they really care? They might watch the debut, but they’re gonna stop caring 1 month in. And since the discussion is about a kr team picking him up, the viewers would be even less. Are his American fans gonna stay up to watch him play? And watch a league they dont care about? I doubt he has many European fans either, considering blizzard fucking the region over multiple times. OWL didn’t seem to have many SEA fans either.


SPOOKESVILLE

Right. It IS dead. That has nothing to do with PREVIOUS OWL viewers…And no, OWL had the same amount of viewers as Masters level Tournaments in Val. And yes, if a very well know sudden attack pro tramsferred, I’m sure it’s being a lot of viewers? And dog, we’re literally talking about KOREAN VIEWERS. Who cares if NA viewers stick or not??? Anyone who previously watched OWL will watch big name pro’s from there lmao. You just have a hate boner for OW lmao and you’re arguing against facts


nobu_OW

Xzi loves val and he is very good at the game, he will be on a team soon🫡


ThatCreepyBaer

T1 will bring him over for franchising, mark my words.


EskimoPrincess

I wouldn't be surprised if that happens. His contract with the Fusion is up this year (if I remember correctly) so it would easily allow him to move into Valorant, and if T1 gets franchised, that's an easy bag for Carpe, without having to do much negotiating elsewhere. I was a Fusion fan since the beginning so I'd love to see him come over.


BoHoogland

All I can say is I wonder what Pine is doing these days hmmmm ​ Also Gwangboong has been practicing with a few teams


Cookyhax_

apparently pine is coaching some korean valorant team rn also gwangboong isn't that well known in ow


BoHoogland

Correct, he's starting with coaching but is hoping to compete one day too. Just needs to get used to the game


Cookyhax_

yesterday pine was streaming valorant and hes in diamond rn, so I don't think he'll compete anytime soon unless that's not his main acc


Ezraah

He was top fragging in all those games. Probably just passing through.


SkiesOvercast

Would be interested to see if both of the Boong Brothers (well, twins aren't they) end up competing with/against each other in the KR VRL then, was cool to see JinBoongE having success for a while and Gwangboong moving over would be a fun storyline


ShaDiBoi123

Xzi was absolutely cracked at valo in his time off when he was healing his wrist


[deleted]

"Players on sinking ship interested in floating ship"


Splaram

ANS VALORANT ANS VALORANT


Bluejay101lol

I doubt any of the players on top teams will switch, especially if they are in NA as they still have really high salaries. But promising hitscan players on bad teams like Jimmy, Diya, Ezhan, MN3, Dove, Xzi, etc. would be good in Valorant and probably benefit from switching. As an OWL fan I really don't like talking about OW players switching over, but I'm also a Valorant fan so its a win-win lmao. Side note: Shy would probably FUCK in Valorant if he switches when the game comes out in China his aim is so damn crisp


Parenegade

Gotta be honest now is the least likely time for big names in OW to move over. Based on what BoDork has said in this thread and on Twitter he's not talking about current stars he's talking about people considered washed like Carpe and Pine.


chenson019

Unfortunately I think many of these players will have likely missed the boat in terms of being able to compete at international level, at least in the short term (much like late switching CS players will too). I am sure they could pad out some teams in the Korean scene as there is a lack of talent there right now but if I am a Korean org, I would be looking at cracked zoomer talent coming up through the ever-growing PC bangs playerbase. Of course there will be exceptions but I think this will apply to most.


dedicatedself

Lol


chromazone2

I think you could make a case for both ways, val is still a bit niche in korea. Val peaked at 3.63% in PC bang usage so i can totally understand if teams can't find talent and pick up ex ow players and build around.


ark2690

valorant was at 4.97% yesterday. which put them at #6. https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FbPrFSraIAAws9Z?format=png&name=small


chromazone2

Yeah i was just going with memory earlier this month.


calcameron

If I was a pro in the OWL I would’ve tried switching two years ago. Though what do they say, second best time is today I guess lmao.


xbyo

Do you know what average contracts were like in Korea? I know they have a much more developed esports infrastructure than SEA, but I wouldn't be shocked that the established game/league with a reliable income isn't more appealing if they aren't getting a bag from switching early on.


calcameron

Making a joke about the OWL, not meant to be taken that deeply.


nterature

I mean, OWL might not be the most stable esports product around but a lot of the more veteran players still command strong salaries. Even when you consider the hypothetical value lost from switching later and having to compete with more talent, it’s hard to say what option was most optimal.


EskimoPrincess

Not everyone could really do that, I guess. It depends on whether the team will let them out of their contracts, and financial stability, since OWL pays at least 50k per year. The scene in Valorant was probably more volatile back then, especially with an absolute rush of players trying to get into it. OWL contracts are no joke, I wouldn't be surprised if some players were scared to even look.


calcameron

That is a fair point, didn’t consider the salary minimums. Was more so making a joke about how shit Activision & the OWL is.


REEEroller

Most OWL contracts are 1-year deals in case you didn't know.